# Ideal SW Florida "pocket?" cruiser under 27'?????



## lans0012 (Jul 16, 2008)

Hi all,

I've never posted to the forum but have been reading up on here for a few months. I recently relocated here from Minnesota and I'm trying to get out on the water here. I've sailed on a bunch of smaller boats on lakes in MN including Lake Superior, but I still consider myself a novice especially to salt water. 

I'm looking for a small, but capable, suitable for beginner etc...sailboat. In order to afford the slip rental, which is pricey here, I can't have a payment for the boat so I'm looking in the 5-10k range. My home port will be St. Petersburg. I found a slip on Boca Ciega for $300/month as long as it is under 27 feet then it jumps to 450. I'm looking for something that I can take down to Sarasota or around the bay or maybe to Ft. Myers on Vacation or stuff like that. I'd also like to go offshore up to 10 miles or so for some fishing and scuba diving on some of these manmade reefs and wrecks outside of Tampa. 

Can anyone give me some ideas on which types of sailboats to go for? I've looked at a hunter 25, pearson 26, bristol 24. The hunter was the cheapest but I have doubts about what it can handle offshore. Having no offshore experience I really don't know what "offshore" really means. Not looking for a passage maker but might want to take some trips up to Crystal river and as far down as Sanibel. 

If I watch the weather carefully should I be really concerned about taking a hunter 25 or a J24 offshore? 

Any Ideas or personal experiences around Tampa in small boats greatly appreciated.


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## camaraderie (May 22, 2002)

Offshore into the Gulf of Mexico on day sails or point to point coastal cruises should be no concern whatsoever wih a good forcast. You can also use the ICW in rougher conditions. 
The only point where you'll want to have a good boat under you is if you really head offshore to key west or the tortugas or mexico. Check our Catalina 27's as well as the boats you are looking at.


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## lans0012 (Jul 16, 2008)

*thanks for the confidence*

Hey thanks for the suggestions. There are a couple of Catalina 27's around and I haven't checked on out yet. I've sailed on Catalina 25's before and they seemed alright.

On the fractional sailing thing. I know that that is a sensible solution for many people and I did a similar thing on Lake Lanier when I lived in Atlanta that was a lot cheaper, but on older boats. I've owned and restored/made usable fiberglass powerboats before and been burned in the pocket on all of them but I do enjoy the "ownership" aspect. Although sometimes it is not entirely clear who owns who I also want to be able use it whenever I want and not have to fill out a chart or plan way ahead.

I thought the catalina would be a smart choice, but all the C's that I've seen listed so far around here are fin keels with 4.5' draft and I was hoping to get under 4' and closer to 3'. The Bristol is 3'3" and the Hunter is 2'11". I may just be paranoid after reading too many posts on groundings in S.FL.


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## PBzeer (Nov 11, 2002)

Swing keel may be your best bet, particularly if you use the ICW much. I've been through the area with my 4'6" draft without problem, but I stayed offshore except going from Tampa to Maderia Beach.


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## Iflyka200s (Oct 3, 2007)

A Catalina 25 or 22 with a swing keel sounds like the ticket!


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## lans0012 (Jul 16, 2008)

*Catalina 22*

Funny you should mention a Catalina 22. I love those boats, fun, cheap, plentiful but would you take your 22 into the gulf? After reading some of your posts I wasn't sure if you were kidding or not.


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## souljour2000 (Jul 8, 2008)

I dont know why you wouldn't ..the gulf is not the Atlantic but it can be the Atlantic sometimes...If you have a good head on your shoulders I think you can go into the gulf with anything..I have taken a 12' rowboat through Longboat pass and I have taken an 18 foot buccaneer through Big pass and all the way up around Anna maria into Tampa bay..then up the river into Bradenton.Spent a night doing it .... came back to my beached 18 footer the next day to go around Anna maria and into Tampa bay.


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

*SW Florida pocket cruiser*

I agree with PBzeer: choose a swing keel sailboat. I first sailed a 24 ft. Laguna swing keel into the Strait of Juan de Fuca in the late 1970's without any problems or fear of the current and/or waves. It gives you the best of both worlds. Keep your depth finder on continuously if you fear shallow waters where you intend to sail. Know the tides around Tampa Bay.

Good luck in your hunt for a decent "pocket cruiser". There are many dependable, capable sailboats. Take an experienced sailor with you on your search for your sailboat. Then weigh their advice before you purchase it.
Have your prospective boat surveyed.


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

How small is too small? A Potter 19 or San Juan 21 would meet your needs and it in your budget and slip.


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## Iflyka200s (Oct 3, 2007)

lans0012 said:


> Funny you should mention a Catalina 22. I love those boats, fun, cheap, plentiful but would you take your 22 into the gulf? After reading some of your posts I wasn't sure if you were kidding or not.


Well I would, I guess I thought you were asking about a coastal cruiser.

I wanted a Catalina 25. I grew up sailing a Tartan 30 & 37 so a 25 was as small a I wanted to go.

I ended up with a Catalina 22. It fits in my driveway, and I end up actually sailing it. I'm not sure a bigger boat would work for me. (not that I don't want one!)

I think as a pilot, safety is 99% judgment & 1% equipment. People fly Cessna's around the world, it's not my idea of fun or smart, it has been done though. Knowing your limitations as in not putting yourself into a position that relies more on your boats strength vs. you ability to sail her.

So since you are getting back into things, a C-22 might be a good way to go. Certainly a Catalina 25 is a more capable boat than the 22 and I do not plan on leaving the waters of Biscayne Bay (unless I move)

Either way a 22 or 25 just be safe no matter which boat you choose!

Tim


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## lans0012 (Jul 16, 2008)

*Thanks for the advice*

Thanks to all that have responded. I drove down to Sarasota for the first time and saw some of the crusing grounds in Sarasota bay and some spots on the Manatee river. I was thinking maybe I should get a C22 or similar sized cheap swing keel and keep in at anchor around St. Pete. That would allow me to get into this cheap, get my sea legs for a year, find out what I really need vs what I think I might want, save another 4k in dockage for a nicer boat next year.

Which leads me to another series of dumb questions: I've seen a couple areas around St. Petersburg, and also when I was in Sarasota today, where it looks like people just anchor their boats full time Someone must have some input on this. What kind of anchors are they using? Do they need to file something with the city? Do they get hassled? Do their boats drag and get trashed in storms? Will insurance cover you if you drag and trash your boat or someone elses if you are not on the boat? Can you drop some weight and put in a mooring?

i was reading on here that the Sarasota mooring field might put an end to that in Sarasota. That's about all I know so far.


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## souljour2000 (Jul 8, 2008)

Right now the City of Sarasota is still trying to get their "new" mooring field idea thru local opposition and legal hurdles. I would guess it wont be untill 2009 that things get ironed out if at all...they have a legal challenge right now is all I know and last time there was a newpaper article(about two weeks ago) it sounded like the opposition to fees for nightly mooring was going to be an obstacle that is gonna take a while to work out for the City.will update on this thread if I hear anything. Morgan


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## Tortuga12 (May 10, 2008)

What about either a Com-Pac (Eclipse, 23, or 25), or a Precision 21 or 23? Man, I'd love to have any of those!!!! Especially the Eclipse....tasty.


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## JLBJR (Sep 16, 2006)

Pick up a copy of Daniel Spurr's book, "Your First Sailboat" it around $15 and has a nice section of Pocket Cruisers.

JLBJR


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## dennismenace111 (May 23, 2007)

Keep you eyes open for a Watkins 25 or 27....they generally sell cheap and are great Florida boats....shallow draft and sturdy enough to run aground and not hurt anything....theyre nice and roomy too! If you ve got a family on board you will appreciate that.. 

If you run across an Irwin 10/4 with rebuilt chain plates take a close look also....theyre big enough for a pool table down below and the cockpit can easily handle a hot tub.


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## lans0012 (Jul 16, 2008)

*seidelmann 25*

OK Ok thanks to all that have responded lately. I looked at a Seidelmann 25 and after reading the reviews on here I looked at it very carefully. It was tippy but the owner has replaced the rudder and stock and the outboard is brand new. The cabin was barebones, but the topside and stripe was just painted. The boat looked great. My girlfriend, of course, did not like the standing head room or the lack of stability at the dock. The electronics were great, chainplates were great, standing rigging was shiney and new looking. The price was right and it was at the closest marina to my house that you can only get in by waiting 3 years or buy a boat at the marina. It was the shoal 3.5 ft draft. Someone give me some advice here please.


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

I'd go with the C-25 rather than the C-22. More room, not that much more weight, more stowage space, readily available parts, and relatively easy trailering. I currently own a C-22, and will upgrade within the year, probably to a Compac 27: the 22's just too small for two people and two golden retrievers! However, I'd skip the swing keel and go for a wing keel.


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## lans0012 (Jul 16, 2008)

*Bought a Ranger 22*

Thanks to all that replied to my questions earlier. I thought I'd revitalize the thread to let you know that I bought a Ranger 22. Yes a Ranger 22. Small cabin, 4.5 foot draft, and a snapped jib halyard stuck in the mast. Oh well it's all about compromises right? Time ran out as the local marina is changing their policy on OCT 1st to not allow slip transfers. There is a three year wait! This one came up and it was usable and cheap so I bought it. My goal is to get my sea legs for a while, hone in the skills, maybe do a race or two, then move up. I can have up to a 28' in the slip and now I have a slip 5 blocks from my house.


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## cardiacpaul (Jun 20, 2006)

Good job, great starter boat, go forth and phosphor!, We need photos!


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## lans0012 (Jul 16, 2008)

*pictures*

Here she is. Rigging good except for the halyard that snapped much to the dismay of the former owner when he was showing me how to set up the furling. The furler was chaffing the line every time you take in or out the headsail. There is a rigger by the marina that I'll bring the boat to next week to get that done as well as a new topping lift. Chainplates are solid. Interior is very rough. The headliner is carpeted over the fiberglass and can be pulled down easily in spots leaving a nasty orange sticky mess. This must come out. not sure what to do after that though...paint, recarpet. Ideas???


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## CalebD (Jan 11, 2008)

Congrats on the new Ranger 22'. We have a 23' Ranger in our racing fleet that usually is quite competitive with us in our Tartan 27' (which I would have mentioned if I had caught your thread earlier). 
So you have the new boat and that is a good thing. If your marina has a crane you can put on a bosuns chair and go up to the top of the mast on it to retrieve the lost/broken halyard which is easier than getting hauled up by the mast and halyards. 
As to the nasty orange sticky mess left behind by the carpet headliner coming down you will need some solvents and scrubbing done on the sections you want to clean up and/or re-do.
Get out there while there are still phosphorescence in the water.
Enjoy.


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## relamb (Dec 25, 2008)

*Try looking at Com-pac Yachts*

You might try looking at Com-pac yachts, they are made in the Clearwater area and were designed for the type of sailing around Tampa. Shoal draft, but very seaworthy in a variety of sizes from 16' to 27' and prices from $2500 on up to over $30,000 depending on size and age. I have sailed a com-pac 16 from the Fort DeSoto park ramp all around the Tampa-St Pete area and out around Egmont Key. Pick your weather conditions right and you can go 5-7 miles offshore easily enough, I've sailed the compac 16 in 5' choppy seas at the mouth of the bay with the tide going out and the wind blowing in.
You just have to be careful of the cruise ships and freighters because you're sure not going to outrun them ! I just purchased a compac 23 and look forward to making some longer trips in it.


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## Allanbc (Apr 19, 2007)

I used to have a Montgomery 17. It was a great little boat and I'm sure it could handle more weather at sea than I.


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

Montgomery 17's are very seaworthy little boats. One was custom modified by the factory for a circumnavigation attempt.


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