# Cruising: dumpin the boat for land travel



## MarkofSeaLife (Nov 7, 2010)

Often I'm asked how I keep going so long - its now 7 years! Too long for some to think they could survive a retirement cruise.
7 years on a boat with only a few weeks back home and the odd week touisting. So I have dumped the boat in a safe, affordable, place and gone off for 2 months land travel.

The first month I had my bicycle delivered to Omaha, Nebraska and cycled to Memphis Tennessee. 1,000 miles! 1,700 kms!
Gave me a great insight to rural USA and a perfect balance after 3 months in New York city.

Now I have flown to Africa and in Zimbabwe to go camping for a few weeks inside the game parks. NO! Not to shoot things, except with a camera!
I will be in Botswanna and then fly to Kenya for the Masi Mara and Serengeti.

So, yes, as you can imagine, a vacation off the boat is great. Waited on every meal, no dishes to clean, no maintenance: just Dial 9 and the man knocks on the door.

I think I have to do a month land travel each year... just gotta syreacg that same budget some more!

Mark


----------



## Don L (Aug 8, 2008)

I told my wife last night "You know that once we starts cruising it doesn't mean we have to stop going on vacation"


----------



## killarney_sailor (May 4, 2006)

During our cruising we have managed several land trips. We did a month of backpacking in Ecuador and Peru, flew to NZ from Oz for three weeks, took a camper van from Darwin to Uluru, went to game parks in eastern South Africa for a week and did a week's trip to Lesotho, also from Richards Bay (rented a car for the game parks trip and a 4x4 pickup for the the Lesotho trip). The secret is to have a secure place to leave the boat. Land travel generally is quite inexpensive too. Our feeling was that we might never be back in a particular part of the world so we should take advantage of the opportunities.


----------



## outbound (Dec 3, 2012)

K- How did you ascertain where it was safe to leave the boat? So far I haven't figured this out so have used a yacht management service even in my limited travels. When not on the boat I stress about the boat which is a distraction. We have left the boat briefly but have been fortunate that either cruisers we know and trust will keep an eye out on her or have been able to steer us to who may be reliable on the paid service side. Is it only word of mouth? Doesn't that mean it's a bit of a crap shoot?


----------



## MarkofSeaLife (Nov 7, 2010)

Just lost my post 

Yes finding the safe and affordable place for the boat is difficult.

But local knowledge and time on the ground makes it easier. But that makes it hard to book travel plans 3 months ahead for cheap flights.


----------



## chuck5499 (Aug 31, 2003)

We done something similar for quite a while. In the Med we wanted to bounce in and out of Schengen so did inland to Albania, Kosovo, Macedonia, Serbia, Romania, and Bulgaria. That does not include shorts trips of a few days to a week or more inland in various EU countries. This year we are wintering over in Turkey so will travel through out Turkey and maybe into Europe. 
We always find a place to keep the boat safe and secure, it is just a matter of looking and searching.


----------



## outbound (Dec 3, 2012)

Thanks all for the input. So far that's not been a trivial hassle, expense and stress. My insurance requires the boat not be left for more than a week alone. Curious if your insurance has similar restriction and what info you need to forward to them ( insurance ) to keep the policy up to snuff?


----------



## Don L (Aug 8, 2008)

I don't recall any such thing in my policy. Do they define "alone"?


----------



## MarkofSeaLife (Nov 7, 2010)

Insurance should not hinder your life.
Asses the risk yourself and if you think its viable to do what you want do so. Yes you will not be covered if its against your policy but why let them rule your life?

Mark


----------



## outbound (Dec 3, 2012)

I have Catlin now. Pretty much the same for Pantaenius. Thought fairly standard once boat out of home waters. Have taken to emailing details to broker. He/she then reviews with carrier. Then emails me back. That way if something happens in my absence have a "paper trail". Definition of unattended allows wiggle room in my eyes which is why I get carrier approval of plans before leaving. Same as getting approval for crew and time window for an ocean passage.


----------



## TQA (Apr 4, 2009)

I am a full time liveaboard in the eastern Carib.

I like to go skiing so that is my annual holiday off the boat.

Planning to hit the resorts around Salt Lake City next Feb. Alta Snowbird Solitude Brighton Canyons Park City and Snowbasin. 3/4 weeks.

The ideal solution for me is a boat sitter at anchor. 









Stops the cat going walkabout or having to be sent to cat hell.


----------



## outbound (Dec 3, 2012)

T- how pissed is your feline upon your return? Mine gives cuddles when we first return for <5m then avoids us both for 3-4d until she's sure we're sticking around.


----------



## killarney_sailor (May 4, 2006)

We have left the boat in a marina (Brisbane and Richards Bay) and on a tandem mooring setup in a river in Ecuador that is run by a former cruiser so he understands things. His crew are out checking the moorings and boat each day. It is a bit of a crap shoot but if you are averse to taking risk best not to cruise in the first place. The only time we have left the boat at anchor (for three nights) was in the Galapagos. Seemed perfectly safe as the boat was well-hooked and there is precious little wind thereabouts right on the Ecuador. The day after we returned from a terrific tour of other islands the tsunami from Japan arrived (the harbour was facing directly toward Japan) and all boats had to leave the harbour for several hours. My feeling is you could get killed driving to work on an expressway or have your car or house wrecked at home. Might as well take your chances in an interesting place. The experience you have (snorkelling with sea turtles, being surrounded (in the car) by 1000+ cape buffalo, and seeing the length of New Zealand) justify any risk in my mind.

I agree with Mark, local knowledge is critical. We get somewhere and, within the broad time constraints we have, figure out opportunities there might be.


----------



## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

When we head off for the long term, I have every expectation to return home for at least a week at a time. Holiday's, family events, etc. Possibly even routine doctor appointments. If that didn't fit in the budget, it would be a problem.

I've given some thought to these occasions being a good opportunity to have the boat hauled and work done. I would be more comfortable having the boat on the hard than in a slip, while gone for any length of time.


----------



## Don L (Aug 8, 2008)

Minnewaska said:


> When we head off for the long term, I have every expectation to return home for at least a week at a time.


You're going to have a home other than the boat? I hate you rich bastards :crying


----------



## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

Don0190 said:


> You're going to have a home other than the boat? I hate you rich bastards :crying


By home, I meant where I grew up and much of my family still lives. I would likely stay with one of them.

At that stage of my life, I do hope to have a condo somewhere too. Few more years to plan and save.

By rich bastard, I assume you mean you hate people who were the first in their family to go to college, work hard, took entrepreneurial and personal risk by moving away from family and friends to the best employment opportunities and saved along the way?


----------



## mbianka (Sep 19, 2014)

I think more cruisers do similar types of sabbaticals from the sea than we realize. I sometimes get torn at this time of year as I watch some local sailors head south with their boats. keep thinking I should be heading south too. Especially after last winter here in the northeast.  But, then my gal likes to charter catamarans in mid winter so I get a nice cruising fix in warm water locations. Then I get to look forward to the next sailing season when I get back. 
I also take comfort that I see many other sailors take a break and head back to land for a bit. Not just Mark. Young punks like the crew of Delos do it on occasion to refill the cruising kitty. Hell even Lin and Larry Pardy get off the boat between cruises. There are many ways to cruise you just have to find the way that works best for you.


----------



## Rocky Mountain Breeze (Mar 30, 2015)

It would help the perspective if you gents would state in round figures an approximate cost per year of your budget. It sounds to me that most of the participants in this posting probably aren't concerned with where their next muffin is coming from, if you know what I mean. It is probably a product of being raised by depression era parents but I just cannot imagine the travels spoken of here and I have a net worth in the arena of 7 figures but I also have 5 grandkids and 1 (soon to be 2) great-grandkids as well as a lot of extended family that I still wish to have a relationship with in land locked Iowa. Am I too greedy for the sailing life or do I care too much about family? I would be interested in the conditions (without getting personal) of those of you sailing and exploring the world.


----------



## MarkofSeaLife (Nov 7, 2010)

Rocky Mountain Breeze said:


> It would help the perspective if you gents would state in round figures an approximate cost per year of your budget. It sounds to me that most of the participants in this posting probably aren't concerned with where their next muffin is coming from, if you know what I mean. It is probably a product of being raised by depression era parents but I just cannot imagine the travels spoken of here and I have a net worth in the arena of 7 figures but I also have 5 grandkids and 1 (soon to be 2) great-grandkids as well as a lot of extended family that I still wish to have a relationship with in land locked Iowa. Am I too greedy for the sailing life or do I care too much about family? I would be interested in the conditions (without getting personal) of those of you sailing and exploring the world.


That's incredibly difficult to reply too.

All I can say is that you will be dead soon. Maybe next year, maybe a decade, maybe more. Who knows?
How you live your retirement is up to you and your wife.
You can sequester yourself away and pester your children or you can go live life of your own.

In doing so your available budget begins to work. Like magic.


----------



## chuck5499 (Aug 31, 2003)

outbound said:


> Thanks all for the input. So far that's not been a trivial hassle, expense and stress. My insurance requires the boat not be left for more than a week alone. Curious if your insurance has similar restriction and what info you need to forward to them ( insurance ) to keep the policy up to snuff?


Being out 8 years the only time we had a problem with our insurance was in Cartagena Colombia where they required us to take a marina. Then after a couple of weeks they changed their minds but we would not have gone inland (which we did not do) without putting the boat in a marina. 
The insurance company wants you to be a responsible boat owner and take good care of your boat is you are going to be away for an extended period of time and make sure your boat is secure and safe. I am not the smartest guy in the world and can only figure out how to do that if I take a marina so someone does periodic checks to make sure all is ok and there is security.

Our insurance never asks but assumes I am a responsible owner. We use IMIS.


----------



## chuck5499 (Aug 31, 2003)

Rocky Mountain Breeze said:


> It would help the perspective if you gents would state in round figures an approximate cost per year of your budget. It sounds to me that most of the participants in this posting probably aren't concerned with where their next muffin is coming from, if you know what I mean. It is probably a product of being raised by depression era parents but I just cannot imagine the travels spoken of here and I have a net worth in the arena of 7 figures but I also have 5 grandkids and 1 (soon to be 2) great-grandkids as well as a lot of extended family that I still wish to have a relationship with in land locked Iowa. Am I too greedy for the sailing life or do I care too much about family? I would be interested in the conditions (without getting personal) of those of you sailing and exploring the world.


Somewhere I posted our 6 years of cost data and I mean every penny we spend which includes what we spend when we travel to see the kids and what we spend while we are there.


----------



## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

Rocky Mountain Breeze said:


> It would help the perspective if you gents would state in round figures an approximate cost per year of your budget.....


Forget it. I don't even want to know. 

My number one financial plan for a cruising retirement is to be debt free. We'll see what that will take. Sell house, buy small condo, etc.

At that point, you live within your means, but I truly think that should be comfortable, without any debt. I expect boat maintenance will be our largest line item. A couple of plane tickets to go see the kids and family from time to time, isn't really all that expensive.

I don't criticize personal choices, but I think my wife and I are too restless or adventuresome to park ourselves next to our kids, just to watch them raise their families, while we lose the physical ability to do what we worked hard for.

I suppose we are presently under the illusion that we can throw the kids a couple of plane tickets from time to time and they'll come to us. They are magnets to the boat now and I don't see being in the Caribbean as lowering that attraction.  On the other hand, when I'm retired, their kids are still going to be home, needing to get to practice and school events, friends, etc. Could interfere. I plan to teach them all how to sail and see if I can recruit the grandkids to be the next magnets.


----------



## Don L (Aug 8, 2008)

Minnewaska said:


> By rich bastard, I assume you mean you hate people who were the first in their family to go to college, work hard, took entrepreneurial and personal risk by moving away from family and friends to the best employment opportunities and saved along the way?


Lighten up and try to go with the fun once in a while.


----------



## killarney_sailor (May 4, 2006)

Rocky Mountain Breeze said:


> It would help the perspective if you gents would state in round figures an approximate cost per year of your budget. It sounds to me that most of the participants in this posting probably aren't concerned with where their next muffin is coming from, if you know what I mean. It is probably a product of being raised by depression era parents but I just cannot imagine the travels spoken of here and I have a net worth in the arena of 7 figures but I also have 5 grandkids and 1 (soon to be 2) great-grandkids as well as a lot of extended family that I still wish to have a relationship with in land locked Iowa. Am I too greedy for the sailing life or do I care too much about family? I would be interested in the conditions (without getting personal) of those of you sailing and exploring the world.


We spent less than $25k a year (Canadian) including boat insurance and travel including trips home to Canada to visit family. We certainly are nowhere near a seven figure net worth. I have a good pension and we live and travel fairly frugally. We stay in hostels and local hotels rather than resorts and fancy hotels. In South America the most expensive hotel was less than $30 a night except at Machu Picchu where it was more - generally closer to $20. Almost always we had a double with bath - too old for the dorm thing. Bus travel in Ecuador is about $1 an hour, more in Peru but the buses are the nicest I have ever seen.

We have a townhouse outside Toronto that cost about 2/3 as much as the house we used to have. Nice thing is we can leave it when we want. Hurricane seasons do give you extended periods when you can travel - either to go home for a time or for more local travel.

Generally you choose the lifestyle you want and can afford. There is no one right answer.


----------



## outbound (Dec 3, 2012)

K- thank you for being open and concrete.
D- I think the number you are looking for is a moving target. Although I've been sailing and have owned one boat or another for over 35 yrs. I've learned more in the last two than all the prior. Although I had done multiple prior passages they were races. Then you blow a huge sum prepping the boat. You push the boat and yourself to the limit. Your crew does the same. But you usually do this once or twice a year. You expect more wear and expense then usual. It's very different when you are on passage. Your concerns are safety, comfort, wear on the boat in that order.
When you are cruising while working the cruises are brief, in your home country, with known resources and easily accessible support. You buy things at time of need as you don't have the time to shop them extensively. If it's a few bucks more-so what. When long term cruising you learn to be much more self contained. "If you didn't bring it you don't have it". Given this mind set you buy three sets of spares. You spend the time to get them from the cheapest source. Often the manufacturer instead of the vendor. You make use of Port Supply or like techniques. I hit the charter companies and have bought their new or near new castaways for a fraction of store cost. Instead of using tools from home you develop a full set of tools dedicated for the boat. Your initial outlay is high as you buy good tools but generally this is a one time expense. The longer you cruise the better you know how to provision, what the boat will need and how to do this wisely.
Also as you cruise you learn what's important and what's not. We spec'd our boat for microwave,washer/dryer and water maker but didn't put them in. Now I know the watermaker is worth it. Putting that in in a couple of weeks. Rest not. But that's a one time expense.
Similarly as my wife's confidence increases and she embraces the cruising life our time on moorings or in slips has decreased exponentially. We've learned how to hot drop or pick up visitors. They get a time or a place but not both. We've learned how to manage flights. We ve learn how to deal with phone service, mail Internet. K is an experienced cruiser. He has figured this stuff out years ago. His boat is all set for voyaging. You learn by doing so you're inefficient in the beginning but rapidly improve. I appreciate he has given me a goal. I know other than improvements like the watermaker our boat expenses have gradually fallen as we get smarter.
As regards insurance, I heard so many bad stories and so many with good conclusions I've come to think defensively about this issue. Have gotten friendly with several pros who have run boats for decades. They are much more experienced and knowledgeable then me so I mimic their behavior. I do not want the insurance carrier to have any wiggle room to deny a claim. Fortunately, in 35+ years ( knock on wood) I have no claims but want no issues if I ever do.


----------



## TQA (Apr 4, 2009)

outbound said:


> T- how pissed is your feline upon your return? Mine gives cuddles when we first return for <5m then avoids us both for 3-4d until she's sure we're sticking around.


If he is left at anchor with a boat sitter on my return he is demonstrative for a few minutes then it is business as usual. About the same as after a 3 hour period on his own.

However the one time I had to put him into kennels where he was the sole cat among 70+ dogs he did not get more than a foot from me for about a week when I got back. Mega guilt trip for the skipper.

This was in Antigua and he was well cared for with daily cuddles from the staff but as he came on board when he was 6 to 8 weeks old and has never been off the boat or met dogs it must have been pretty scary. The planned boat sitter turned out to be a nutcase and I was not prepared to leave either the boat or cat in her care.


----------



## guitarguy56 (Oct 10, 2012)

We plan on cruising for extended periods along the East coast and the Caribbean soon... but we will not give up the home... the kids come to the house to stay for a week or so when they come visit... son is in grad school so he comes during the summers and when he's off for extended weekends... so the home is a must... 

We also do extensive gardening and have so many fruit trees and vegetable gardens that we also don't want our hard earned labor to go to the next buyer (if we ever sold which we won't) so the home will be passed on to the kids for sure.

We live modestly considering what our business takes in... but in all we keep our cruising kitty well fed and hopefully my wife's health continues so we can take off for 3-6 months or more at a time each year. :2 boat:


----------



## MikeOReilly (Apr 12, 2010)

Not exactly the same situation, but we "dumped" the sailboat this season to go land cruising via small motorcycle. Our cruising life just got going last year with an initial five month journey down the Great Lakes. Family issues meant the boat had to stay on the hard this year, but plans were in motion, so we swapped simple liveaboard life for simple motorcycle/tent life. So far it's been great. 

We'll return to the boat in early Spring after exploring many Canadian provinces and US states. 


Why go fast, when you can go slow


----------



## killarney_sailor (May 4, 2006)

outbound said:


> Instead of using tools from home you develop a full set of tools dedicated for the boat. Your initial outlay is high as you buy good tools but generally this is a one time expense.
> 
> What about the wrenches you drop in the drink or that end up in the sump under the engine? My tools certainly are far from the best quality but do the trick. I don't want to spend time and energy constantly worrying and working to make sure tools don't rust.
> 
> ...


I wonder if any cruisers have figured it all about? We certainly have not.


----------



## outbound (Dec 3, 2012)

:laughOh well - need another hero role model. But still think I could learn a lot from you. Still find good tools makes the job go faster and actually get joy from them. My dad taught me to buy the best tools you can. I still use some of his tools I inherited. His hobby was restoring antique clocks and watches. Many are stainless so survive the boat.
Spent today messing with sail slides, the heating system and started on the winches. Having full sets of tools in the various systems given U.S.,British and metric sourcing saved knuckle skin and time


----------

