# need buccaneer 210 help



## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

first. please dont bother with the whole buccaneers are garbage,. i dont care. i like it


ok now for the fun stuff. i got a buccaneer 240 yesterday. with trailer. solid but striped inside. it was free. i want to redo the interior but need pics and layout ideas as i cant find any. 

things i know i want. rv styly stove/oven. sink. toilet. witch it still has sink and toilet in it. also just any info on restoring one in general


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## tschmidty (Sep 25, 2008)

Well, obviously they are hideous boats, but they also do have a ton of room inside. THe google will give you a lot of ideas and pics.

https://www.google.com/search?q=bucaneer+240&oq=bucaneer+240&aqs=chrome..69i57j0l5.2663j0j7&sourceid=chrome&es_sm=93&ie=UTF-8

A good source of parts and such are rvs if you really want to hack some stuff out.

Here is a little blog about someone restoring one.

http://saveitforparts.wordpress.com/projects/pagoo/


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

well the is nothing inside! nothing! lol. just a pile of parts. but hull and deck is solid. other then a couple dimples from years on a trailer not ment for it. i want the berth up front. walled in with a door. a rv style fold out couch along the starboard side would be nice. as i have one, lol. accross from that the stove and sink. between that and the birth i was thinking the toilet. as i said the boat is just bare fiberglass inside. so i want to recover it but i want it bright inside. here is a pic of what mine looks like. other then mine is a beautiful blue.


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## newhaul (Feb 19, 2010)

Here's some specs on the boat BUCCANEER 240 sailboat specifications and details on sailboatdata.com 
Also don't listen to the naysayers the boats are good and considering they have a good pedigree the hull iss derived from the Columbia 23 Columbia T-23 Specifications people just don't get the cabin structure on it that's all I like it gives standing head room throughout


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## Faster (Sep 13, 2005)

Well if it's truly bare glass everywhere, then you've got a clean slate to start with.. generate some drawings and start playing around with various layouts.

One thing.. when working with a plan view don't forget that nothing's vertical or square. Things that look like they may fit/work from that perspective will be quite different when you're actually working with the 3D shape of the boat, esp up forward where the hull flare is maximum and things narrow up quickly. A full set of lines would be ideal but may be very hard to come by.

I'd also mock things up with cardboard or, better yet, doorskin prior to building the final version.


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

i intended to use hd plastic type cardboard like for signs for all the mock up. does anyone know were i can get a door for the front birth? then i can build a frame around it. also i was thinking i should build the walls in as a structural support? i could fiberglass brackets onto the inside to tie it all together for added strength as i do intend for it to be a coastal hopper. also what about wwater makers? is the a way to make one that is solar powered? i cant go spending 5k plus on a free boat. not for one part. lol


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

and i need a good cheap bottom paint. flat black. and aslo red for the water line area as the bottom is ugly and faded. i want it all to look good


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

i also intend to use a brand new fuse panel and wiring.


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## Faster (Sep 13, 2005)

Chase down some Utube videos on fiberglass 'tabbing' for bulkheads.. I think it's time for some serious research before you start this project. If you're able to reconstruct the interior a door should not be a challenge to build yourself.. leaving aside for the moment whether or not you really 'need' a door of any kind. Privacy is an illusion on any boat smaller than 60 feet or so.

Watermakers are expensive, power hungry generally though there are manual models intended for survivors in liferafts - they won't produce much water and require much effort. I reckon you'd be the first non-offshore 24 footer that installed one. Thinking about a watermaker at this stage is a pretty big red flag....

Good luck with this, and understand that I mean this kindly, but I think you don't know yet what you don't know about this sort of thing...


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

i have done several boats before. from small jobs to full redoes inside. its my job. lol. a water maker isnt a must just a nice luxury.


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

or to make life easier is there an adhesive that can be used? instead of fiber glassing in brackets?


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## Capt Len (Oct 9, 2011)

Good advice from Faster. Glue gun door skins in 3 inch strips to test stuff before deciding what's what. Even experts can screw up. Bill Garden once gave a shipyard interior plans based on deck plan. Several rebuilds before we all twigged on what's what. ( Hindinlopen ,,big Dutch botter refit) Edit.. In the time it took me to type that much happened.. All I can add now is 'Oops'


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## Faster (Sep 13, 2005)

concorde01 said:


> i have done several boats before. from small jobs to full redoes inside. its my job. lol. a water maker isnt a must just a nice luxury.


Alright then....

This:



> i was thinking i should build the walls in as a structural support? i could fiberglass brackets onto the inside to tie it all together for added strength


and this:



> or to make life easier is there an adhesive that can be used? instead of fiber glassing in brackets?


...made me think otherwise.. Carry on...


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

its ok. i have done cabnets and such but never walls. so thats why i ask, i rather ask questions first then plan. then more questions. then build.


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## newhaul (Feb 19, 2010)

Boat repair/ rebuild is what I used to do for a living some of your ideas bother me a little so here's my advise study study and then find a shipwright in your area that is willing to check your work as you do it here is a file that explains tabbing http://www.kp44.org/ftp/TabbingBulkheads_to_the_Hull_and_Deck.pdf


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

ty i just printed it so i can read it


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

i intend to finish the out side first to protect it


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

ok. my intended paints.

for the red line between the upper blue and lower black
Shop Rust-Oleum Marine 1-Quart Exterior Gloss Marine Bright Red Oil-Base Paint at Lowes.com

and for below that
Shop Rust-Oleum Marine 1-Quart Exterior Flat Marine Black Oil-Base Paint at Lowes.com


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## Faster (Sep 13, 2005)

Suggest you try buffing the original finish before you put any kind of paint on it. There are lots of fiberglass/gelcoat restoring compounds/methods that get good results.

Non marine paints like those listed will not resist dock and fender rub for long.


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

correct but those are marine paints. also the blue on upper side is good. but they reay messed up the rest thats why i need to redo it. and asap so i can get it off its lousy home made trailer before it gets real damage


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

my intended fuse panel replacement

https://www.bluesea.com/products/5026/ST_Blade_Fuse_Block_-_12_Circuits_with_Negative_Bus_and_Cover

only $60 and from a company i trust


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

or i found this i believe it is ment for fiberglass?

https://www.bluesea.com/products/5026/ST_Blade_Fuse_Block_-_12_Circuits_with_Negative_Bus_and_Cover


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## tschmidty (Sep 25, 2008)

I think on the dinette plan the bucaneer has the head at the back with a door which is kind of nice. And that would be the only door I would put, since putting a wall will just make things look smaller. 

And yours is one of the better looking models, the ones with 6 windows per side are just wacky looking.


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

yes i agree. lol. but my toilet is in the midle on the port side? also i have no paper work on it at all. how can i identify it as for year. model and such


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

sorry not middle. its right by the foward birth


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

concorde01 said:


> yes i agree. lol. but my toilet is in the midle on the port side? also i have no paper work on it at all. how can i identify it as for year. model and such


It should have a HIN (Hull Identification Number) moulded into the fiberglass - usually on the top right side of the transom.


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## newhaul (Feb 19, 2010)

Should state year on the title as well


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

like i said. no tittle no nothin. but im a dealer so that wont be a real problem.


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## newhaul (Feb 19, 2010)

This keeps getting better and better as a dealer you should know how to check the hin and all the other stuff you have been asking here I'm not usually one to say it but I need my chest waders


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

hey im new to the searcing up numbers thing. i usally dont get things without paperwork.


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

anyway what about the bottom paints i found? any opinions


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## newhaul (Feb 19, 2010)

Ablative or non ablative? And cost


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

i was looking at this

https://www.bluesea.com/products/5026/ST_Blade_Fuse_Block_-_12_Circuits_with_Negative_Bus_and_Cover


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

ment this. stupid computer.

INTERLUX Fiberglass Bottomcoat ACT Bottom Paint | West Marine


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## newhaul (Feb 19, 2010)

Its a good paint and the price is good


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

Ok ty. How much should I need and how many coats?


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

newhaul said:


> This keeps getting better and better as a dealer you should know how to check the hin and all the other stuff you have been asking here I'm not usually one to say it but I need my chest waders


I agree - claims to have restored boats but calls a bulkhead a "wall", doesn't know about tabbing glass, boat dealer but doesn't know about HIN's?

And to cap it all off, is restoring what is generally regarded as the worst sailboat ever made.

Something seems funny here and "We are not amused".


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

If you read it I never said boat dealer. We just do boats from time to time. I have done a bayliner Capri. 3 party barges and am currently doing a bayliner ciera. And I say wall because it is faster to type on a phone


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

Also if you read back. The hull and deck are in solid shape. Also It was free....this is a personal project for gettin stated in sailing. I haven't sailed since I was 8


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

Ok but like I said it was free. And I like it


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## newhaul (Feb 19, 2010)

Wondering what engine does it have in it


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

It's a sail boat. No motor. I wish it had a sail drive but I believe that was in the 245


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## newhaul (Feb 19, 2010)

I was hoping for you it was the 245 same boat but with a $1200 engine in it


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

i wish. and its more then that. i found the yanmar saildrives used and un tested at 1350 each with out the motor


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## miatapaul (Dec 15, 2006)

joethecobbler said:


> it's your money. but for what you'll spend fooling w/ that 240 you could find alot better, also for little or nothing. I've had a 240 and they're ok,but it's like putting rims on a Yugo,when your done you'll have $5000 and 1000 hrs into a $100 boat.


As a former owner Joe knows what he speaks of. Once completed you will never get more than a couple of hundred dollars for it. If you really want to "learn to sail" then I would put sails on it, and take it out and sail. No way would I do more than put in some plywood on the sole of the boat, and build up some basic structure to support the rigging. If you want some place to sit, throw a couple of bean bags in there. If you want water bring some jugs and a Coleman cooler and if you want real luxury grab a porta-potty. It is not just that it is not the most attractive, boat, but does not sail all that well. If all you want to do is get from point a to point b then OK. After sailing as I described for a season or two you may want to get something bigger, or smaller and you will not have wasted much money on it.


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

Listen to Miatapaul - one of the more significant signs of maturity is the ability to recognize and take good advice.

All too many people never get there.


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## billsull (Jul 8, 2007)

Here's someone else that took on a similar project and got her sailing:

Pagoo | Saveitforparts

If you scroll to the comments at the bottom of the page you'll see posts by two more kindred spirits that are also attempting to restore Buccaneer 240s. If a few more Bucc 24 owners show up, perhaps SN will set up a Buccaneer sub-forum! 

Full disclosure: I used to go out on a buddy's Buccaneer 240 (the extra classy 12 port version!) His slip was out at the end of a dock in a very nice marina where I had to run a gauntlet of Hinckleys, Shannons, etc. before I got to his boat. I usually kept my dark glasses on until we were underway and out of the harbor, but we had a blast on that boat! I think he was one of the luckier Buccaneer owners because he was able to sell it and pick up a Catalina 30 with an Atomic 4 for almost even money by being at the right place at the right time.


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

see that all i wanna do. and as most of what i will do to it will be stuff i get for free then its even better. i got a new ice box for free. sink and stove. i will be putting in a rv stove oven combo as well as a smaller rv fridge that is 12v 110v or propane


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

o and i did find the hin on the left stamped into the rub rail.


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## Faster (Sep 13, 2005)

concorde01 said:


> ..... i will be putting in a rv stove oven combo as well as a smaller rv fridge that is 12v 110v or propane


Safe to assume you have no intention of trying to get any insurance???


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

billsull said:


> Here's someone else that took on a similar project and got her sailing:
> 
> Pagoo | Saveitforparts


Fenders dangling and sails sheeted in while the oversize pirate flag indicates a DDW course.

All seems very appropriate somehow.


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

well i would like to but i dont really intend to have people onboard much or to be around other boats so i am not sure


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## Marcaiche (Aug 30, 2014)

Generally don't like to lob rounds at anyone or anything, but sometimes honesty can save another... I'm not making the following statements out of cussedness, and most folks with any time on the water would likely concur with them. Just trying to save you grief.

Here are a few reasons why "free" is NO bargain relative to you and your current boat:

1) Build quality on that boat is awful...so you're starting with something that is a problem to begin with.
2) Sailing characteristics when compared to almost everything out there are pretty awful too.
3) The boat is underpowered aloft...which is likely a good thing because her stability is pretty miserable...where I grew up they were referred to as "roll-over queens..."

I could continue but won't.

OK, so that's that...good points?....she has a HUGE amount of room below decks for a 24. If you were planning to spend a lot of time sitting at the dock, vis-a-vie a floating waterfront cabin, or needed a cheap place to live for awhile, or perhaps planned to throw a 10-15 hp Johnson on the stern and just putt-put around locally with the main up for shade, then hey...sounds like a winner. Make it comfortable and functional below for CHEAP and bully.

BUT....that's not what you stated your plans were.... You want to learn to sail, to not be around other boats, to use it as a coastal cruiser. Your Bucc 24 IS NOT the boat to do that! (I know--not what you want to hear) Free is not always a good deal. Spending more than a hundred bucks on this thing is throwing good money right down the proverbial crapper amigo. There are PLENTY of under 25' older fiberglass boats out there that do sail reasonably well and are much safer than this boat, and I see them for free all the time, or nearly free. Boats that would be worth spending a few dollars and hours on, that sail well enough to learn something from and enjoy, and if the time comes for you to "move up" you could pass her along to another person as their first boat under sail and feel good about it instead of just relieved to be done with her.

I've had a great time on a Bucc 24, but it didn't have anything to do with my friend's boat, it was more in spite of it. Hey...after all, it is a sailing vessel of sorts, and it beats not having one. But according to what you stated your wishes are, well, gotta wish you luck.

How about this for an option... Before you start putting money and effort into this boat, spend a week or so considering other options. Read up a bit more about different boats and their sailing characteristics...investigate the quality of their builds... Then poke around and see if you can find one that will work for you that's cheap or free--not talking about a "dreamboat" here...but something in the same shape the bucc is, a blank or almost blank slate, but that is at least a better foundation for your efforts.

Please take the above in the spirit it was tossed out with...not being critical, just don't want someone to make an effort and end up with a bad experience...


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

Ok. Ty for the way you did criticize it. You were polite and afterward said what good thing you could about.

As stated I found the him and ran it threw the marine board. It is a 1977 bayliner. However according to the title it is NOT a 240. As it is a 21ft so much for what I was told


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## TQA (Apr 4, 2009)

If the interior bulkheads have been removed you have a MAJOR problem.

The boat will have lost it's original shape. I guess you may be able to reglass any new bulkheads if they break free the first time it is launched. 

It would pay you to find another similar boat and copy the bulkheads. Then you will need a couple of jacks inside the boat to get it back into the right sort of shape.


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## Marcaiche (Aug 30, 2014)

...lot of room for a 21 footer then...but most of my comments are still applicable.

When Bayliner had production of US Yachts they made a 22' (220) and a 25', and I think one larger as well that sometimes were called buccaneers too...completely different boat though. Gary Mull designs...the 22' was a lot like a SanJuan 24 with two feet lopped off her stern and a transom-mounted rudder. Built light but sailed really well and could claw upwind surprisingly. Great for places like Puget Sound under moderate conditions and the 22' was even roomy below. STILL NOT what I would consider a "coastal cruiser" by any stretch. But still a good boat to learn on and even race a bit...and worth an effort to clean up. 

The 210, 240, and larger bayliner fiberglass "Spanish galleons" be what they be... Still in my opinion (which is worth what ya pay for it...diddley squat ;-) ), with minimal effort you could find a different freebee that is more worth your time and affection. Heck....it wouldn't cost anything to at least poke around for a week eh?


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

i have all the old bulkheads and parts they were just removed. i was thinking of painting the hull. then dock it at a marina. after its in the water i could do the bulkheads as they were when it was make. but all new. i hot a new stove, icebox and plywood for the bulkheads for free. but launching it should fix the problem when i put in the new bulkheads


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## miatapaul (Dec 15, 2006)

Keep in mind if the RV stove you are planning on using is propane it will be hard to get insurance with it installed, and if they don't do a survey it likely would invalidated your insurance in case of a claim. I understand you will likely not need hull coverage, but if you want to put it into a marina then you will need at least liability. And if the refrigerator is propane, don't bother with trying to install it. A mono hull heels over even in a slip too much for a propane refrigerator to function. They work to a point on catamarans, but not mono hulls.


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## Faster (Sep 13, 2005)

SloopJonB said:


> Listen to Miatapaul - one of the more significant signs of maturity is the ability to recognize and take good advice.
> 
> All too many people never get there.


Felt we needed to 'bump' this.....


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## bljones (Oct 13, 2008)

Look, I am all about low-buck adventures and quixotic quests to transmogrophy sows ears into silk purses, and I've been there, done that. So,here's what I would do in your shoes:
Strip the boat: the hardware and gear and spars, and most importantly the ballast are actually worth something when they are not attached to a worthless boat. Sell the parts- you'll net a thousand or so bucks. then, turn that cash in to a better boat that you can sail.

You'll be cash, and, more importantly, time ahead. 
Place an ad on all of the craigslists within 100 miles, looking for an old sailboat- you'll get people coming to YOU looking for you to take their boat off their hands, and you'll have the ability to set the price, because the sellers are coming to you.


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## TQA (Apr 4, 2009)

concorde01 said:


> i have all the old bulkheads and parts they were just removed. i was thinking of painting the hull. then dock it at a marina. after its in the water i could do the bulkheads as they were when it was make. but all new. i hot a new stove, icebox and plywood for the bulkheads for free. but launching it should fix the problem when i put in the new bulkheads


Having all the bulkheads and interior joinery is a huge plus. In my view this makes it a doable rebuild.

This may help you WEST SYSTEM | Projects | Fiberglass Boat Repair and Restoration - Replacing damaged bulkheads

Replace the interior in the water makes sense as you should have minimal distortion although you may need ratchet straps around the whole boat at the keel to get the right shape.


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

ok and if i do it on the trailer what can happen


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## CatMan22 (Apr 16, 2012)

As stated I found the him and ran it threw the marine board. It is a 1977 bayliner. However according to the title it is NOT a 240. As it is a 21ft so much for what I was told[/QUOTE]

What you have a is a B210, ask me how I know.

SailNet Community - CatMan22's Album: Blue Heron

Let me start with my experiences, there is a great amount of headroom, large cabin for a 21, sink, ice box, porta potty, lots and lots of storage, fantastic at the dock to hang out on, anchoring up in a cove, or taking a leisurely sail on an inland lake.

Some of the not so good, the great headroom leads to high a center of gravity which leads to excessive heel and allows a greater chance of knockdown in excessive winds, again ask me how I know. While fun to be on their sailing ability is limited (think of piloting an RV on the water) and close haul is virtually nonexistent.

The real good about the boat is it made me a better sailor by focusing on the wind, trim and all other aspects that I took for granted with my first Catalina 22 which was much easier and simpler to sail.


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## Mr. Bubs (Aug 21, 2013)

concorde01 said:


> i have all the old bulkheads and parts they were just removed. i was thinking of painting the hull. then dock it at a marina. *after* its in the water i could do the bulkheads as they were when it was make. but all new...


Nope. Bulkheads and compression post need to be in place prior to putting it in the water (assuming that you are stepping the mast and rigging the boat prior to splashing, which would only make sense).


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

Mr. Bubs said:


> Nope. Bulkheads and compression post need to be in place prior to putting it in the water (assuming that you are stepping the mast and rigging the boat prior to splashing, which would only make sense).


ok. ty. that makes it easier. i will be putting in a ice box like it had. no stove just a coleman. and a sink like before. i found a catalina 27 for about 1000


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## Faster (Sep 13, 2005)

concorde01 said:


> ..... i found a catalina 27 for about 1000


GRAB IT!!!!!


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

just looked. its gone. i found a guy selling a buccaneer like mine but together inside for 2800


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## bljones (Oct 13, 2008)

concorde01 said:


> just looked. its gone. i found a guy selling a buccaneer like mine but together inside for 2800


In a world where a Catalina 27 sells for $1000, anybody asking $2800 for a Buccaneer 210 is dreaming.
Yours is worth what you paid for it as it sits.
It is worth at least $1500 as parts and scrap
Think about how much better a boat you could buy for the parts off the boat you already have.

if you persist in putting any more time and effort into attempting to refit the boat you already have, then you understand the politics of the economics of the USA today. Work smarter, not harder.

I sold a 23 foot boat with wheel steering, standing headroom, roller furling, enclosed head, davits, chartplotter, diesel inboard, dodger, bimini, autopilot, cradle, etc., etc., in the water, ready to sail, in July of this year for $3000... and was happy to get it.

There are too many good cheap boats out there to waste time and money on a boat that will cost more in time and effort to repair than a better ready-to-sail boat is now.


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

what should parts sell for? the sails are usable just stained. mast and spar in good shape. good rudder. porti poti. cusions. and more i believe


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

also all cables and rigging are good and rust free


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## Marcaiche (Aug 30, 2014)

Here's an ad just posted on Craigslist (boat is in Port Angeles, WA) BAYLINER BUCCANEER 21' SLOOP ....a Bucc 210...guy is asking $9500 for it...HOLY CRAP BATMAN!!! I was going to send him an e-mail offering some kind but realistic advice, but what the heck...non of my affair...mebbe some Microsoft twinkie from Seattle will buy it.

CONCORDE---Do not look at this ad and decide your boat must actually be a diamond in the rough...if you are going to continue with your project (please don't) the ad had some pictures below deck, etc. that may be of help to you so I posted the link above.

........question for you though...where in the country are you located? If you are in the Pacific Northwest I might know (not sure yet though) of a Jay Benford Friendship Sloop that could be had for FREE...has a Honda 10hp, beautiful tanbark sails and a nice spruce spar, even has a great little woodstove. Needs a going over, paint, etc., but I think it is basically sound. Only issue is it has a ferrocement hull---but that's not a problem if it was laid-up properly to begin with, just different. Verrrry traditional boat...tight below but bunks for two...essentially the practical, traditional and moral opposite of what you are working on.

Just mentioning the above to illustrate that there are generic glass boats out there for free, and even some very cool and unique boats out there for free....and the betting man's odds are that it's almost a sure thing most of the aforementioned free boats will be better on the water than the B210 or her bigger sisters.

If you're in the PNW I will poke around a bit or put the word out and see what else is available if you'd like...no problem.

Relative to your bulkheads, etc. That chopper-gun hull NEEDS it's bulkheads and every other structural assist possible. If she's been on the hard/trailer for awhile without them her shape is likely not what it was already and may or may not come back with new bulkheads when she re-launches. Scrapping begins to look like a reasonable option, as much as I hate to do that to any vessel with a smattering of life left in her...


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## Bill-Rangatira (Dec 17, 2006)

Marcaiche said:


> Here's an ad just posted on Craigslist (boat is in Port Angeles, WA) BAYLINER BUCCANEER 21' SLOOP ....a Bucc 210...guy is asking $9500 for it...HOLY CRAP BATMAN!!!


maybe a typo meant $950


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## Marcaiche (Aug 30, 2014)

But hey...what the heck...I was glad to hear you have a 210. Aside from being a little smaller, they are more pleasing than their larger "faux-galleon" sisters in virtually every way...

The stick, rigging, etc. etc. all worthy of posting on CL...as stated in early postings by other esteemed members, her worth in itty-bits far surpasses her worth whole... Definitely worth your efforts to pull apart, clean up a bit, and market.


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## Marcaiche (Aug 30, 2014)

...I thought so too, but take a look at the ad...sounds like he's selling a Swan 52. Seller states she's sailed the islands with two aboard for weeks, daysailed comfortably with seven aboard, and that...ahem...she "truely sails well..."

Well-equipped for a Bucc 210 though...everything but the kitchen sink.



white74 said:


> maybe a typo meant $950


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

I am in Portland oregon but it would have to be fairly close as I have to pay someone to tow it. I posted mine aswell for parts or whole. That guy is nuts. I was only gonna ask 2500 max but now I know better.


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## newhaul (Feb 19, 2010)

Here's a much better boat in hood river 22' Santana sailboat and here's another good one in Vancouver WA 1973 Southcoast Sail boat 23 Ft


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## newhaul (Feb 19, 2010)

But if you are hooked on bucs here's a good one Buccaneer 220 Sailboat based off the ranger 22


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

Nope. 1500 I gotta wait till I get money outa the 210 but 1500? That's 27ft price range more if it needs some work and a 27 would truly make me happy


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## newhaul (Feb 19, 2010)

Here this is the best I can do for ya but 27 for 1500 not gonna work http://www.sailboatlistings.com/cgi...ate=Oregon&view_records=+Show+Matching+Boats+


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

I can find one though. Just gotta be patient. What would someone wanna buy the ballast for?


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## Faster (Sep 13, 2005)

Just because you saw an ad for a Cat 27 for $1K certainly doesn't make that the 'norm'. That boat would have needed some/a lot of TLC but presumably it would still have it's original bulkheads in place!

A GOOD Cat 27 could be had for perhaps somewhere between 5 and 10K depending on condition, age, equipment, region, and desperation of the seller. That would be more realistic. This would be for a boat with minimal issues and ready to go.

btw, not sure I'd bet the farm on the ballast in the 210 actually being all lead if you're now planning to part it out....


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

Ok what about the sails? No rips or patches just stained. I don't even know what the parts may be worth


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## newhaul (Feb 19, 2010)

concorde01 said:


> Ok what about the sails? No rips or patches just stained. I don't even know what the parts may be worth


If in good shape should bring about a c note each

However keep in mind the cost of proper disposal of the glass hull cut and sent to a landfill here are last months prices looks like clean cast lead was about .80 cents a pound http://www.scrapregister.com/scrap-prices/united-states/260


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

Ok the specs for the boat say 900lb ballast. Is cutting it off the only way to know if it is all lead? If it is then at .80 a lb 800lb would be 640. Not bad for a free boat


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## newhaul (Feb 19, 2010)

concorde01 said:


> Ok the specs for the boat say 900lb ballast. Is cutting it off the only way to know if it is all lead? If it is then at .80 a lb 800lb would be 640. Not bad for a free boat


Minus a couple hundred for disposal fees


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

Specs say boat is 3000lb with a 900lb ballast dump is 93 a ton


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## Marcaiche (Aug 30, 2014)

The old Santana 22's (like Newhaul mentioned) are solid, good boats that sail nicely...I've seen that very boat on the water actually.

The Bucc 220 (US yachts) is a pretty decent boat too...sailed one quite a bit...built light and not "my" kind of boat but I really enjoyed the way she sailed. It was the deee-luxe version below, nice settee, little galley, for protected waters fast and a sweetheart.

Saw your CL ad Concorde... So, a question for you--put a wee bit of thought into the answer--exactly what are you looking for? Do you want something cheap but functional to learn on safely in the 21-25 foot range? Do you want a trailer boat, vis-a-vie a swing-keel? By forsaking your 210 I assume your leaning away from the "floating RV" direction...

If you get a 21-23 footer with a swing keel and a trailer you can tinker and learn to sail, avoid the absolute requirement of paying moorage, and put some time in on the river, which in turn will shape what you look for in your next, more capable boat. If you get it for next to nothing when you're done with her you might even make a few bucks (I've made money on the last four small sailboats I've had, and enjoyed them while refurbishing).

Or do you want to throw your hat in the ring and go larger right off the bat. That means moorage bills in all likelihood. Not so bad for you, there's some pretty reasonable moorage available in your neck of the woods compared to up on Puget Sound.

If you want folks to "bird dog" a boat for ya, well we know kind of what you want...now what do you NEED?


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

Around 24 or a little more. Shallow keel like the buccaneer. Wheel steering if possible. Comfy for 2 people. I figure 200 for the sales. Same for mast and rigging. 200 for the trailer. 400 if there is 800lb of lead in the keel. Figure 100 for misc junk. Then minus 100 for dumping the hull


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## bljones (Oct 13, 2008)

the winches, blocks, genoa tracks, etc are worth $3-500. standing rig pieces, like the turnbuckles, are $10-20 each. hit up the "boat parts" group on facebook. https://www.facebook.com/groups/boatparts/


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

wow and i was thinking justt 200 for the mast and spar plus all the cables and basically everything atached to the deck


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## bljones (Oct 13, 2008)

it's the little stuff that has more value than you think. when that hull goes in the dumpster there better not be a single piece of hardware still attached- otherwise you are throwing away money.









btdt. Dock Six Chronicles: DonorBoat is Done Like Dinner


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

wow. i mean even the little stuff is almost perfect on it. no rust at all. clean looks great. as far as parts go. what is the best way to get the balast out? and is it lead?


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

i want

Liveaboard Sailboat! Catalina 27

it iant 1500 but close enough!


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## TakeFive (Oct 22, 2009)

concorde01 said:


> i want
> 
> Liveaboard Sailboat! Catalina 27
> 
> it iant 1500 but close enough!


I'm sure that mainsail is in fine shape, despite the fact that half of it is uncovered.


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## Marcaiche (Aug 30, 2014)

Concorde, There's a Cal 25 on Portland CL...free...just went up a little bit ago. Not the greatest boat on the water, but far from the worst and the price is right.....would definitely get you around on the river comfortably! Roomy below, and I've been out on one on Puget Sound a couple of times--sail pretty decent. Wouldn't be a bad boat to clean up if she's OK structure-wise, and for your first foray into sail you could do a lot worse. Here's the link:

Free 25ft sailboat

Good luck


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

Just messages them. Hope I can nab it


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## newhaul (Feb 19, 2010)

And the race is on


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

If I can pay to Moore it there or find a way to move it to my lot. It would be a nice boat


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

Those old raised deck Cals are great boats. - no comparison to a Buc.

Years ago a guy beefed one up and took his family all over the world on one.


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

well if i get it idk how ill get it to my lot. i will for sure want to paint it if its a keeper. thinking navy blue.


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

There must be boat movers and/or sailboat style "pole" trailers in the Portland area. A Cal 25 only weighs a couple of tons so it can go on any decent sized trailer and be towed by a pickup or SUV.

Obviously the mast has to come down first but they are deck stepped so that's pretty easy - don't need a crane anyway.

P.S. dark blue, especially with gold coves & waterlines, looks great. "Flag Blue" is rapidly becoming the new white. I prefer Navy Blue - Flag Blue is too dark for my taste - it looks black most of the time, only looking blue in sunlight.


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

thunking navy blue hull. black bottom paint with a red divider


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## TakeFive (Oct 22, 2009)

If you're taking a boat that someone is giving away, you may have A LOT of stuff to do that's higher priority than painting the hull above the waterline.

Just saying'....


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

First. Pole trailer?

Second yes there will be other things but paint is important also


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

Ok that is what my buccaneer is on but it's a single axel


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

The Cal is 4000 Lbs - 1/2 ton more than the Buc. I don't know towing but I think I'd want 4 wheels to haul a Cal 25.


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

We'll I emailed them twice but have yet to hear back


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## TakeFive (Oct 22, 2009)

concorde01 said:


> ...Second yes there will be other things but paint is important also


Have you even seen this boat yet? The list of things that need to be done first is likely to be so long that you won't get to "decorative paint" for several years.


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

True just saying no point in fixing it and leaving it ugly


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

TakeFive said:


> Have you even seen this boat yet? The list of things that need to be done first is likely to be so long that you won't get to "decorative paint" for several years.


It's a Cal 25 - how much can need to be done? They are well down into "As simple as they get" territory.


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

well that is what i want. but who knows. still waiting to hear from them. i wish more people posted phone numbers damn yahoo sends everything to spam


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

hell id buy a boat if i could do payments but no luck yet


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

almost called but decided not to. great price. atleast to me

30' Sailboat Project


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## Faster (Sep 13, 2005)

concorde01 said:


> almost called but decided not to. great price. atleast to me
> 
> 30' Sailboat Project


That's another 'LOOONG way from ready to sail' project.. and would cost you a small fortune (likely a large fortune to you) to properly 'finish'..


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

very true, but very unique aswell. but i want a project i can finish. not a overgrown piece of yard art that gets the county on my ass. lol


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

concorde01 said:


> almost called but decided not to.
> 
> 30' Sailboat Project


Good decision.


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

yea. i decided way to much cost involved. and to big for 1 person


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

While it may be a bit big to learn on, a 30' is not too big for one person - in fact it is probably near ideal for cruising with one aboard. Big enough to take some weather, usually has standing headroom, enough space & displacement for living in some comfort, room to carry stores etc. etc.

Just not THAT 30'.


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

concorde01 said:


> We'll I emailed them twice but have yet to hear back


I find the most reliable way to get through on a CL reply is to take the "cut & paste" return address option at the bottom of the reply menu. I've never had a failure with that option but lots with the other ones.


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

i was thinking 25ft min


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## Faster (Sep 13, 2005)

Well, if we've truly dissuaded you from continuing to 'improve' the B210, then I'd chalked that up to 'one for the good guys'.

You're on a much better course looking at neglected, 'free or free-ish' mainstream reputable boats like the Cal and others.

Check out this older thread from another SNer for inspiration:

http://www.sailnet.com/forums/general-discussion-sailing-related/107681-free-sailboat.html


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

yes but now i need a boat


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## miatapaul (Dec 15, 2006)

SloopJonB said:


> I find the most reliable way to get through on a CL reply is to take the "cut & paste" return address option at the bottom of the reply menu. I've never had a failure with that option but lots with the other ones.


I find the phone to be the only way to reliably get ahold of CL sellers. If they list a phone number.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

yep. problem is most people dont. hell id even offer a little cash if the boat was worth it! but seems no body ever to emails anymore


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## Marcaiche (Aug 30, 2014)

Well, don't give up hope. Lots of folks post on a Friday and then take off for the weekend. Keep looking for alternatives though.

If she doesn't have any glaring issues I'd try to at least keep her moored for a month or two...go out and sail her a bit to "break things" so to speak...a few trips out will identify things that need to be addressed when she's on the hard, sometimes things you wouldn't be aware of without taking her out. 

Hopefully they will get back to you. Pretty decent solid boat the Cal...


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

well hopefully tomorrow


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

have a guy may give me a columbia 22ft with honda motor free. no trailer. needs work. nearly sunk once due to thrue hull fiting broke. was repaired. says these boats have crossed both oceans? used it in puget sound up into canadia


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## Marcaiche (Aug 30, 2014)

Ummmm...some of the larger old Columbias have gone trans-ocean, but I can't think of any 22s doing it. If it's the Columbia 22 I'm familiar with, it's not something I would take, even for free...that being said other folks like them. The Honda is worth something. They sail OK...just was a cheap, not terribly attractive (IMHO of course) small boat designed for the cheap smaller sailboat "boom." Even not considering the extra 3 feet that Cal 25 is infinitely better. Better than the bucc, but you can do better than the Columbia 22 as well, just use a little patience.

Try to refrain from jumping on the free-boat bandwagon...they come up all the time, free or cheap, needing elbow grease. Jump on the first bone that's tossed and a steak will be thrown your way a week later. Harass the Cal25 guy with another email, it hadn't been removed from CL as of last night anyway.


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

honestly thats wat i thought when he said it. 22ft across the ocean seems rather dangerous


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## Marcaiche (Aug 30, 2014)

Not so much the size...more the design and build quality...

Actually the Columbia 22 build quality is probably better than many of her class and era, but offshore??? Not me anyway.

Her design and sailing qualities aren't ideal for it either...

But size? Remember John Guzzwell's "Trekka" was only a 21, and he took her all the way around with no mishaps. Then again he is one heckuva single-hander too.

Size doesn't always matter...at least when it comes to seaworthiness and quality.


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

The Columbia 22 was a trailerable, swing keel daysailer/weekender, not a liveaboard or ocean cruiser - lets get back to reality here people.

They're a pretty good looking little boat as well IMO - part of the "bubble top" series.

They seem to frequently be available for free or nearly so.


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## newhaul (Feb 19, 2010)

SloopJonB said:


> The Columbia 22 was a trailerable, swing keel daysailer/weekender, not a liveaboard or ocean cruiser - lets get back to reality here people.
> 
> They're a pretty good looking little boat as well IMO - part of the "bubble top" series.
> 
> They seem to frequently be available for free or nearly so.


Well that is not entirely accurate they made a fin keel version and a single person could live on it not in great comfort but it has the requisites a head a galley and a berth I live on an islander 24 not much different in cabin layout 
http://sailboatdata.com/viewrecord.asp?class_id=261i wouldn't recommend offshore but ppl have sailed all over in a San Juan 24


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## Marcaiche (Aug 30, 2014)

I knew a guy who lived on one at Everett Marina....if you could call it "living..." ;-)

They built quite a few of them with fixed keels too...but yup pretty much a daysailer/hardscrabble weekender for all but a dedicated "minimalist." OK for Puget Sound or the Columbia unless things really turn to crap.

Always seemed to look a little "out of proportion" to me. Some of the older, larger Columbias look and are nice boats and very capable with a few improvements structurally.

I don't think Concorde will be very satisfied with a Columbia 22, even at the price of free...


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## Marcaiche (Aug 30, 2014)

Oooops...made my post just as Newhaul made his...looks like we concur. I've only seen one or two of them with swing keels... That's why they're cheap/free so often. Not many people want to pay moorage for an old 22 of her ilk and build.

For what it's worth Newhaul, you could find the nicest Columbia 22 in existence and I'd still say even a mediocre Islander 24 is the better boat ten times over and then some in every possibly respect. The 24 is a pretty darn good old boat in her class...

Too bad the timing is off...there was a cosmetically-challenged Islander 24 pretty much for free down near Bremerton somewhere a couple of months ago. A sistership to yours would be an ideal foundation for Concorde to start with, IMHO anyway...hard to find something in her size as solid, roomy and reliable, and generally pretty reasonable if not in bristol condition.


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## newhaul (Feb 19, 2010)

Thanks and you are correct it is far above the Columbia I was just making comparison as to cabin size my boat has been to Hawaii and obviously back to the pnw. The free one was actually close to bfn in the Salish area near Friday harbor


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## Marcaiche (Aug 30, 2014)

Haven't been around a Col 22 in a long time. Always thought the Islander had a heckuva lot more usable room below...but my memory ain't what it used to be, ha.

Oh yeah...I remember the one up north now...seen two this summer that were more or less being given away. Thought one was in the central Sound...one was tied up and one was on a mooring. Sure hope they found good homes. Fella I know from Mukilteo fixed his up truly bristol a couple years ago...did the hull emerald green...had a little cod woodstove in her...surely did her proud--I should've taken a picture.


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

the col 22 looks way to cramped. to much cockpit not enough cabin


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

i gave up on the 25ft jensen. 9 emails and nothing back


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## newhaul (Feb 19, 2010)

Another free Columbia 22 in Winslow on Bainbridge island **FREE Sailboat - 22ft Columbia C22 FREE**. here are the specs COLUMBIA 22 sailboat specifications and details on sailboatdata.com


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

i think i need to hold out for atleast a 25ft


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

i got the 25ft jensen!


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## Faster (Sep 13, 2005)

concorde01 said:


> i got the 25ft jensen!


Wahoo!! much better platform for improvements.. and fewer required to boot, no doubt.

Well done.


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

yep i pay for the moorage on friday. told it needs sails and a outboard. unknown other then that


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

i need info on these boats if anyone has it


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## newhaul (Feb 19, 2010)

Jus got email on the cal 25 for you 
Here's the reply
Thank you for your interest in the boat.* I am now living in a different state and am not able to show my boat myself.* The Port of St Helens marina has agreed to let people into the dock to see the boat during business hours: Monday through Friday between 7am and 4pm.* Please call Randy at (503)369-0856 to set up an appointment.


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## newhaul (Feb 19, 2010)

Cal 25 Overview and I'm sure there is a lot more to find


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

I got that same message. Call the guy and told him I'd take it then made the arrangements with the marina


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## TakeFive (Oct 22, 2009)

concorde01 said:


> i got the 25ft jensen!





concorde01 said:


> I got that same message. Call the guy and told him I'd take it then made the arrangements with the marina


How many worthless boats are you planning to accumulate? And you're agreeing to take all these sight unseen?


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## newhaul (Feb 19, 2010)

concorde01 said:


> I got that same message. Call the guy and told him I'd take it then made the arrangements with the marina


That's great news glad you finally got a boat worth fixing and saving from the breakers.


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

The Jensen is a lot better boat. And I only got this one un seen as I didn't want to miss it and regret it plus if I don't like it I already have a buyer


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## TakeFive (Oct 22, 2009)

concorde01 said:


> The Jensen is a lot better boat. And I only got this one un seen as I didn't want to miss it and regret it plus if I don't like it I already have a buyer


Many boats - especially the free ones - are worth far less than asking price. You could be taking on a lot of liability.


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

Lol my buddy wants the buccaneer hull to turn into a custom hot tub. Can't wait to see this if he does it


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

A Cal 25 that has its rig and is floating is not worthless - hull, deck, rig, ballast and a little woodwork - they are so simple that it's worth saving.

Here's some more info;

CAL 25 sailboat specifications and details on sailboatdata.com

Good score.


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

And thank you new haul for your efforts on my behalf


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## Faster (Sep 13, 2005)

concorde01 said:


> Lol my buddy wants the buccaneer hull to turn into a custom hot tub. Can't wait to see this if he does it


And a good use for it, too ! 

Take 5.. I don't entirely disagree but you have to admit that moving from a bulkhead-less empty Buccaneer with no rig to a complete Cal 25 no matter how bad it's at least a step in the right direction...


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

Complete except for sails! Lol


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## newhaul (Feb 19, 2010)

concorde01 said:


> And thank you new haul for your efforts on my behalf


No problem I'm just glad I could move you in the right direction


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## miatapaul (Dec 15, 2006)

TakeFive said:


> How many worthless boats are you planning to accumulate? And you're agreeing to take all these sight unseen?


Well he could just get a bunch and then put them together to make one good boat!


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## Capt Len (Oct 9, 2011)

Well he could just get a bunch and then put them together to make one good boat!Ha!! Tried that with women, didn't work out as planed.


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

just cut the keel off the bucc. wonder what ill get for it.


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

concorde01 said:


> just cut the keel off the bucc. wonder what ill get for it.


If it's lead and clean you should get somewhere around $0.70 Lb. If it's iron more like $0.05 Lb.


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## Faster (Sep 13, 2005)

SloopJonB said:


> If it's lead and clean you should get somewhere around $0.70 Lb. If it's iron more like $0.05 Lb.


and if it's lead shot or steel punchings, concrete and resin????


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

its lead and was quoted at 50 a pound


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

Sounds low - I'd check around - there must be numerous scrap metal dealers in the Portland area.


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

si i am having trouble finding some one to transport the new boat to my lot. i am considering reinforcing my trailer and putting on hd tires that can hold the weight, i need to move it 60 miles from where it is at. and using my trailer would save me from having to get a crane to lift it off of someone elses trailer. 


the specs say the displacement is 4000 and 1700 balast. does that mean it weights 5700 or 4000lbs?


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## Faster (Sep 13, 2005)

concorde01 said:


> the specs say the displacement is 4000 and 1700 balast. does that mean it weights 5700 or 4000lbs?


No.. that means it weighs 4000 pounds, 1700 of which is ballast. But most boats weigh more than stated if any tanks are full, any gear is stashed etc. and some even come out of the factory above the designer's stats.

If this boat is truly 'empty' and has been on the hard it shouldn't be much heavier, maybe estimate another 500 lbs just to be safe - so 4500.


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

ok cool. ty for that info. 

newhaul...what kind of boat is in your picture?


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## Faster (Sep 13, 2005)

concorde01 said:


> ok cool. ty for that info.
> 
> newhaul...what kind of boat is in your picture?


It's beside the picture: Islander Bahama 24. Similar but not, to a Cal 25


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## concorde01 (Sep 28, 2014)

aww. the bow and deck are alot alike. nice boat


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## dirtbagsailor (Apr 2, 2018)

Just read this thread from OP to last, and you all have inspired me to make an offer on a Buc 210. The very first boat I have contemplated buying. Will let you know how it goes...


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

Where did we go wrong?


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## dirtbagsailor (Apr 2, 2018)

It's not you. It's me.


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## miatapaul (Dec 15, 2006)

dirtbagsailor said:


> Just read this thread from OP to last, and you all have inspired me to make an offer on a Buc 210. The very first boat I have contemplated buying. Will let you know how it goes...


Are you going to make a hot tub out of it too?

Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk


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