# Bene 31 vs Hunter 33



## bacampbe (Mar 17, 2009)

I took a look at a beneteau 31 and a hunter 33 over the weekend. We're looking for something late model for Dallas area lake use, thus the production boats. Due to some crazy wind (I imagine the same front that caught our friends on Matagorda Bay) there was no actual sailing involved.

I've found very little in the way of reviews on the Beneteau 31, other than the speak-no-evil big magazine reviews. Does anyone own or have experience with one?

I know I'm comparing a 31 to a 33, but from an asking price perspective, they aren't that far apart.

Fit and finish was just fair on both, but probably good enough for our purposes.

From what I could tell sitting still, the Hunter was more liveable below decks (of course it's a bit bigger but I think there's more to it than that.), but the Bene seemed more "sailable". The Hunter had lots more storage below. I'm not sure you could store a standard sized dinner plate on the Bene. I really liked how the Hunter has all the through-hulls under a single panel in the cabin sole. It also had little things like extra 12V outlets in the cabins. I was surprise to find this particular instance had a fixed cooktop, microwave, but no regular oven.

OTOH, the Bene had _lots_ of cockpit storage, and lots of clever features from the companion way on out. The hull shape and more conventional rig would probably make for better sailing--although the beneteau's spreaders sweep back more than I have seen on any non B&R rig.


----------



## k1vsk (Jul 16, 2001)

This is largely a matter of personal preference as the differences are not that great. Also, don't knock the B&R rig as it has many advantages and only one drawback when sailing DDW which is neither efficient or safe.


----------



## bacampbe (Mar 17, 2009)

k1vsk said:


> This is largely a matter of personal preference as the differences are not that great. Also, don't knock the B&R rig as it has many advantages and only one drawback when sailing DDW which is neither efficient or safe.


I guess it's all guessing unless someone with experience with the Bene 31 chimes in, but do you think the Hunter, with it's smaller headsail, with point as well as the Bene? Will it handle light air (common on area lakes, although the last couple of days make it hard to believe) as well? I notice that the Hunter hull is wider towards the bottom--probably a good bit of what makes it so roomy. Will that make the motion underway more or less comfortable?

If the two really have comparable performance, then the better creature comforts of the Hunter may matter more.


----------



## bacampbe (Mar 17, 2009)

Oops, I just realized I posted this in general discussion, rather than the new boat section where I intended to put it. I'd appreciate it if a moderator would move it, if it is appropriate to do so.


----------



## scottyt (Jul 19, 2008)

what years on the boats?


----------



## bacampbe (Mar 17, 2009)

scottyt said:


> what years on the boats?


The one's I looked at were both new (2009). The current Hunter 33 has been around a few years, but I gather the Beneteau 31 is a new model.


----------



## bacampbe (Mar 17, 2009)

bacampbe said:


> Oops, I just realized I posted this in general discussion, rather than the new boat section where I intended to put it. I'd appreciate it if a moderator would move it, if it is appropriate to do so.


And, of course, by "new boat", I meant "buying a boat".


----------



## k1vsk (Jul 16, 2001)

bacampbe said:


> I guess it's all guessing unless someone with experience with the Bene 31 chimes in, but do you think the Hunter, with it's smaller headsail, with point as well as the Bene? Will it handle light air (common on area lakes, although the last couple of days make it hard to believe) as well? I notice that the Hunter hull is wider towards the bottom--probably a good bit of what makes it so roomy. Will that make the motion underway more or less comfortable?
> 
> If the two really have comparable performance, then the better creature comforts of the Hunter may matter more.


Regarding pointing, the main driving force on any boat comes from the mainsail which is typically larger on a B&R rigged boat which is one of it's advantages both in light air and in overall handling. You will find yourself sailing on just the main as the headsail serves only to aide when you want the slot to help. 
There has been much written on the various comparisons of the traditionally rigged vs. B&R which you may want to research or just look at most of the high-end racing boats to see what these designers have concluded in going with B&R rigs. 
Neither is ideal as either are a compromise but in your situation when you have no compelling need to go DDW for prolonged periods, the decision is largely one of convenience.
Neither hull shape will create any significantly disparate handling issues and the only noticeable difference may be some pounding with the relatively flat Bene hull.


----------



## bacampbe (Mar 17, 2009)

Doing a few calculations, I find the Hunter, with the classic mast, has a pretty good SA/D ration (20.99) which surprisingly beats the Beneteau (18.99). The Hunter with the furling mast comes in at 18.2. Unfortunately, Beneteau does not publish sail area for the furling mast, but I assume it is lower.

Both dealers are pushing furling mains pretty hard. I have mixed emotions on them, but can see some real advantages for short-handed sailing. (My wife knows how to sail, but lacks the strength to raise a heavy main by herself.) Given that one of the big B&R rig advantages is to make it easier to carry fully roached mainsails, do you think it would be more impacted by mast-furling than a standard rig?


----------



## trantor12020 (Mar 11, 2006)

One of the things I like about Hunter is the smart way they made use of locker spaces and ease for DIY installation of AC, cold-plate(fridge/freezer) and other electronics. The H33 comes with Owner's Manual that shows everything you need know about the boat and even the electrical diagram and plumbings etc....


----------



## Melrna (Apr 6, 2004)

Having sailed the 2004 Hunter 33 for 3 years and now own a 2006 Hunter 36 I can speak for them. First of all I dont like the new 2008-2009 Hunters. They don't compare in fit and finish with the early models. They went El-Cheapo again (pre-Henderson days era pre 2000) to cut cost to keep the models at a certain price break-point. The wood finish is no longer teak, they went with a different lighting system, they use a concrete-iron keel and went with a lower quality running gear, blocks and traveller. So if you can find a nice 2003-2007 model I would get that one vs a new one. 
Having said all that though, I like the way the Hunter sails. The sailplan is soo easy to sail, all lines lead to the helmsman, easy to balance out, points into the wind within 20 degrees. The Hunter doesn't like to go DDW like others have said. So, get a Asymmetrical sail for your inventory and that area is covered nicely. With an ATN sock I set and douse mine alone. 
The cockpit in the Hunter 33 one can entertain up to 6 guest very comfortably and up to 10 guest spread throughout the boat. Not sure the Benne can do that. Also the fold-up helm wheel is another plus. Down below Hunter hands down wins here over the benne. More room, more storage space, more comfortable and for the me no puke Benne green.


----------



## bacampbe (Mar 17, 2009)

What changed with the deck hardware? The 33 I looked at had Lewmar 30 winches, harken blocks, and spinlock clutches. I _think_ it and the Beneteau 31 had exactly the same choices in hardware. The 33 did not have the arch installed, so I didn't get to look at the traveler.

Oddly, the Beneteau 31 seemed to have a larger cockpit, even though it's a smaller boat. At least, it was easier to move around, and that's comparing it to the Hunter that did not have the wheel installed. Glen Henderson commented (on sailboatowners.com) that the 33 had a reduced cockpit size to increase the space in the aft cabin. I am, though, a little disappointed that Beneteau dropped the rotating wheel from the 323.

I'm rather surprised not to see anyone weighing in on the side of the Bene. Are there no Beneteau supporters out there?


----------



## bacampbe (Mar 17, 2009)

I meant to say that I agree that the Hunter wins hands-down south of the companion way. About the only thing I found below decks that I liked better on the Bene was the way the gas-strut supported companionway steps for engine access. I could send my wife below to check the oil on the bene and get no complaints, but I don't think she would be comfortable moving the heavy companionway steps on the Hunter.

It's really too bad the dealer didn't have an H31 for more of an apples-apples comparison. (Or maybe it's too bad that Bene doesn't have anything between the 31 and the considerably more expensive 34 anymore). OTOH, the 33 would force me to go to a larger slip in our marina at an incremental cost of $50-$75 a month.


----------



## k1vsk (Jul 16, 2001)

There are certainly Beneteau supporters here; I am one. I'm simply trying to be objective in responding to your questions regardless of personal preference or bias.

The hardware on the new Hunters is equivalent to any other prod boat in terms of quality.

None of these boats, B, H or their clones, have real teak anymore or even teak veneer making them all look artificial. That too can be a positive to some as these finishes require less or no maintenance so this again is a personal choice.

Some Hunters are now sporting iron keels which is a cost-cutting move but Beneteau has historically used iron so that too is a moot point when comparing them.

Boat selection is all about what you perceive is the better choice for you - there are no startling fundamental distinctions here.


----------



## Melrna (Apr 6, 2004)

bacampbe said:


> What changed with the deck hardware? The 33 I looked at had Lewmar 30 winches, harken blocks, and spinlock clutches. I _think_ it and the Beneteau 31 had exactly the same choices in hardware. The 33 did not have the arch installed, so I didn't get to look at the traveler.
> 
> The boats I saw at the 2008 Annapolis Boat show is where I saw the El Cheapo reduction in hardware. They are using a lower line Harken gear now and was confirmed by the sales reps I talked to about this. If the model boat you are looking has the upgraded hardware that is great to hear. What concerns me is the fact the arch was not installed. I thought the factory installed this. BTW I love the arch. Great invention. Some people hate the way it looks. But having the traveller sheets at the helm station is a major plus. Also it holds the Bimini to keep that hot Texas sun out of the cockpit.


----------



## bacampbe (Mar 17, 2009)

Which keel and mast did you have on your H33?


----------



## bacampbe (Mar 17, 2009)

Melrna said:


> bacampbe said:
> 
> 
> > What changed with the deck hardware? The 33 I looked at had Lewmar 30 winches, harken blocks, and spinlock clutches. I _think_ it and the Beneteau 31 had exactly the same choices in hardware. The 33 did not have the arch installed, so I didn't get to look at the traveler.
> ...


----------



## Melrna (Apr 6, 2004)

bacampbe said:


> Which keel and mast did you have on your H33?


I had/have a lead bolt-on keel (standard) and in-mast furling mainsail. Took awhile to learn how to trim the mainsail vs full batten mainsail. Lose about 1/2-1 knot of boat speed in light winds. This is due to no battens in the mainsail. When sailing upwind once the mainsheet is set, it is all traveller including tacking..Why I love the arch. Also end-sheeting on the boom vs mid-sheeting on other production boats.
If you have any questions email me at Melrna2001 at yahoo dot com


----------



## tonybinTX (Feb 22, 2008)

I've only been on the Hunter at the Annapolis boat show, but there's a new Bene 31 on our dock.

I've sailed on the Bene 31 in some really strong (20-30kt) winds and I can tell you she really likes the hard stuff. Sailing done on an inland lake in TX. The owner installed a double ended mainsheet making it easy to singlehand. The boat has a 100% jib and a stack pack - again - easy to handle. Steering is a bit tight, but that should loosen up in time - just a very slight weather helm and it steered itself in 15 kts breeze. My only sailing complaint is the traveler seems a bit short.

Fit and quality - you have that info and I agree. I've also rafted up next to her on two different weekends and it seems to be just right (tankage/storage) for two couples or a family for a long weekend. The boat has AC installed, but no genset (post production). So there is room for AC. One small thing that I noticed - Bene did something simple that really opens up the kitchen - they moved the sink to the end of the island, facing port instead of forward.

My opinion : the Bene is a better looking boat under sail.

_Disclaimer - The boat belongs to a friend of mine who is the Beneteau dealer for Austin - but I own an old Hunter.  I've no vested interest._


----------



## bacampbe (Mar 17, 2009)

tonybinTX said:


> I've only been on the Hunter at the Annapolis boat show, but there's a new Bene 31 on our dock.
> 
> I've sailed on the Bene 31 in some really strong (20-30kt) winds and I can tell you she really likes the hard stuff. Sailing done on an inland lake in TX. The owner installed a double ended mainsheet making it easy to singlehand. The boat has a 100% jib and a stack pack - again - easy to handle. Steering is a bit tight, but that should loosen up in time - just a very slight weather helm and it steered itself in 15 kts breeze. My only sailing complaint is the traveler seems a bit short.
> 
> ...


Have you sailed it in light air? I'm on a north Texas lake myself. We get the occasional blow, but have more days of light air than heavy, particularly in late summer. The double ended mainsheet sounds interesting--if I go the Bene route I might be in touch about that.

The one I looked at had the AC installed under the forward-port settee. It didn't seem to impinge on space too much, although the ducts did take some space in the cabin lockers. It had no genset (which I would not expect on a boat that size), but the dealer pointed out that the life-boat storage area would be a great place to store a portable generator. Since we're never out of an easy swim to shore, I doubt we will carry a life-boat much ;-)

Does your friend store cups, dishes and cookware for the galley? Was he able to find space for things? We (a couple) will rarely spend more than a weekend on it, but it would be nice to be set up for entertaining.


----------



## bacampbe (Mar 17, 2009)

Melrna said:


> I had/have a lead bolt-on keel (standard) and in-mast furling mainsail.


Do I understand correctly that the standard keel on the H33 is the shoal-draft, and the deep keel is an option? (That is, contrary to how it's done by many other boatbuilders?)


----------



## scottbr (Aug 14, 2007)

Shoal- draft may be standard as most prefer the shoal-draft for cruising.

We've had our 2005 H33 for 2 years now, previous owner rarely used it so essentially was brand new.

It will easily do 6 -6 1/2 knots in 15 knots wind. I've been up to 8.5 SOG or 9.2 on the knotmeter, DDW with only the jib out and surfing on the waves( no current). I usually start reefing (furling) at 15 knots and can maintain my speed. I've had it out in up to 25 knots wind and was easily handled. For the most part I do all the line-handling. The jib sheets on the winches right beside the helm make it easy to tack, just hit the auto-tack on the autohelm and switch sheets as it coms around. Traveller lines are right within reach. Unfurling and furling the main is quick and very easy from the cockpit and makes it also very easy to start bringing in sail as the wind picks up. In our area, we have a 1/2 hour to 1 hour DDW run to get back to the bay where our marina is located. Although, I will get smoked by boats without the B&R sometimes, it handles well and does a resonable speed. We bought the boat for cruising and comfort, not for racing.

We cruise out overnight most weekends and have comfortably handled 4 adults on baord for 4 days/nights. My wife and I have also done a few 1-week cruises around Georgian Bay and 1 1/2 week up to the North Channel and back.

Lots of good info from Glenn Henderson on Sailboatowners. It was good to get his perspective on the design, B&R rig and sailing capabilities of the boat. ( it was my question on the cockpit )


----------



## tonybinTX (Feb 22, 2008)

bacampbe said:


> Have you sailed it in light air? I'm on a north Texas lake myself. We get the occasional blow, but have more days of light air than heavy, particularly in late summer. The double ended mainsheet sounds interesting--if I go the Bene route I might be in touch about that.
> 
> The one I looked at had the AC installed under the forward-port settee. It didn't seem to impinge on space too much, although the ducts did take some space in the cabin lockers. It had no genset (which I would not expect on a boat that size), but the dealer pointed out that the life-boat storage area would be a great place to store a portable generator. Since we're never out of an easy swim to shore, I doubt we will carry a life-boat much ;-)
> 
> Does your friend store cups, dishes and cookware for the galley? Was he able to find space for things? We (a couple) will rarely spend more than a weekend on it, but it would be nice to be set up for entertaining.


I've been on her in light (6-8kts) winds as well - she does OK, but you really suffer with that jib in light air. - a tradeoff for the easy handling. We've been lucky so far this year and had great wind - haven't had the late summer doldrum conditions yet. If you expect sailing in a lot of light air and don't like to run the engine, I'd get a reacher/code zero and/or a main with a huge roach and full battens. (my reference boat has a spin halyard/clutch/winch as a factory option).

They put the AC in the same spot with same results on storage and use the life boat storage for fender storage. We also discussed putting a small drink cooler in that space. They store all the gear necessary for a long weekend on the boat (pots/pans/plates/cups/sliverware/booze). Most in the galley cabinets, a few items under the settee's. Hootch in the nav station. The boat comes with three skinny, small, worthless 'euro drink glasses' and the cup holder on the binnacle is cut to fit them. That was replaced immediately with a custom fab'd drink holder to fit coozy covered beer cans. 

They also put a small bimini on it to escape the TX sun. The double-ended setup was post-factory. Just need a triple becket with cam and a bit longer mainsheet.


----------



## tonybinTX (Feb 22, 2008)

Another upgrade to mention - Batteries upgraded to AGM.


----------



## Bene323hfxns (Feb 2, 2009)

*Re. Hunter 33 vs. Bene 31*

If you go to Sailboatowners.com you can get detailed reviews from owners. Very useful, straight from the owners mouth - rather than marketing spin. I have sailed the Hunter 33, and I don't think it sailed as well as our Bene 323. I have also heard complaints about their speed upwind. I think you are going to get more comfort on the Hunter, and the Bene 31 v-berth is substandard size. Fine if you have kids, but you are limited to maybe a weekend with four adults (unless you go with the settee conversion.

The Bene's have great cockpits, and I think the Bene 31 is no execption. Our cockpit on our Bene 323 is fantastic, and I think the setup is even better on the 31, with the winches beside the wheel. The only downside is that if you plan to race, the access isn't great if you have some big fellas grinding for you.

Both rigs are a little on the small side, but I guess that is what cruisers want. I do like that the Bene 31 has an open pulpit, which sets up well for a a-symmetric kite.


----------



## Bene323hfxns (Feb 2, 2009)

*Shoal Draft*

That was the case on our Bene 323. On the US East Coast / and Canada, it was sold as Shoal Draft standard, but in Europe the deep draft was standard. You would certainly get better pointing and upwind performance with a deep keel. We couldn't go there though, because our dock is 5 feet at low tide.


----------



## Bene323hfxns (Feb 2, 2009)

*Bene 323*

You may want to consider a Bene 323, which is between the Bene 31 and the Bene 34. You get a larger aft cabin, slightly smaller main cabin and slightly larger v-berth. I think performance is similar. The Bene 323 last sold new in 2008, so there may still be some new ones in stock at some of the dealers, or you could get one 1-3 years old.

We are very happy with ours.


----------



## bacampbe (Mar 17, 2009)

tonybinTX said:


> I've been on her in light (6-8kts) The boat comes with three skinny, small, worthless 'euro drink glasses' and the cup holder on the binnacle is cut to fit them. That was replaced immediately with a custom fab'd drink holder to fit coozy covered beer cans.


I was boggled at the juice cups. Why three? Why include those with _no_ other dishes? Then it occurred to me that some french designer may have intended those as a place to store silverware vertically, since there were no utensil drawers.


----------



## blt2ski (May 5, 2005)

If how fast you can go, and PHRF ratings have anything to do with your choice, the Bene appears to be 10-20 secs a mile faster than the hunter, despite being the shorter deck length. Altho the water line may be longer on the Bene. I do not have those specs in front of me to compare. 

Personally, I prefere the Bene's over the Hunters. Altho for my use, the 34.7 or 36.7 Bene's would be the shortest bene's I would look at. From being on the new 31 at last falls boat show, IIRC along with a 33 or 34' version, nice boats. Altho I did not like the faux pas teak/holley flooring. I am not able to tell what yrs you are looking at either.

Marty


----------



## bacampbe (Mar 17, 2009)

blt2ski said:


> If how fast you can go, and PHRF ratings have anything to do with your choice, the Bene appears to be 10-20 secs a mile faster than the hunter, despite being the shorter deck length. Altho the water line may be longer on the Bene. I do not have those specs in front of me to compare.
> Marty


Thanks! Where did you find PHRF ratings for the new B31? I gather not many clubs have encountered it yet.

The bene has an exceptionally long water line for a 31, but I don't think it's longer than the H33.


----------



## scottbr (Aug 14, 2007)

blt2ski said:


> If how fast you can go, and PHRF ratings have anything to do with your choice, the Bene appears to be 10-20 secs a mile faster than the hunter, despite being the shorter deck length. Altho the water line may be longer on the Bene. I do not have those specs in front of me to compare.
> 
> Personally, I prefere the Bene's over the Hunters. Altho for my use, the 34.7 or 36.7 Bene's would be the shortest bene's I would look at. From being on the new 31 at last falls boat show, IIRC along with a 33 or 34' version, nice boats. Altho I did not like the faux pas teak/holley flooring. I am not able to tell what yrs you are looking at either.
> 
> Marty


Are you comparing in-mast numbers vs. regular set-up or both in-mast or? Speed is a relative thing if you are only cruising and someone that knows how to set up a boat will beat someone in a faster rated boat that doesn't.

Beneteau 31 LWL 28'-6"
Hunter 33 LWL 29'-5"

The 323 is aslo another consideration, and is a little more roomy down below than the 31. I don't think you will go wrong with either boat ( Hunter vs. Bene) and it will all come down to personal preference, ease of handling ( if that's more importrant to you which it seems to be and comfort down below )


----------



## blt2ski (May 5, 2005)

I was not able to find a NEW B31 number, but using ratings from past 31' Oceanus models vs hunter 33's, the Bene's are generally speaking 10-20 secs faster than the Hunter. If you go here you can get a list of rated boats from last Oct 08.

I would also agree with Scott, in that a person with a slower rated boat CAN and will beat a person in a faster rated boat that does not know what they're doing, not optimized the faster boat, new sails on the slower boat vs 20 yr old dacrons on the older boat etc.

I'm pointing out the ratings as an example. In mast furling will lose one 6-12 secs a mile vs a std mast. A rig with a 155 vs a 110 or smaller is rated 6 secs faster etc too. Fixed props vs folders are 6-12 secs slower in rating, but more like 20-30 secs slower in real life!

Use PHRF ratings as a guideline, not the end all be all!

marty


----------



## Bene323hfxns (Feb 2, 2009)

*Re. Ease of Handling*

I would suggest that with the Bene 31, you will need to add a second coach-roof winch to improve ease of handling. This may also be the case for Hunter. We found that otherwise it was just too many lines and not enough jammers. It was an extra $1000, but well worth it. Our second reefing line on our Bene 323 had no jammer, so I don't know how you were supposed to secure it. Having to coachroof winches makes the boat much easier to sail.

Performance isn't everything, but I can say that our Bene 323 downwind performance is very strong. I got her up over 8 knots last summer on a broad reach.


----------



## Bene323hfxns (Feb 2, 2009)

*Furling Main*

When we were looking at the B31 and B323, the dealer said you lose about 15% sail area when you go with a furling main.


----------



## bacampbe (Mar 17, 2009)

Bene323hfxns said:


> When we were looking at the B31 and B323, the dealer said you lose about 15% sail area when you go with a furling main.


Do I understand right that you looked at both and chose the 323? What influenced your choice? You mentioned the slightly larger cabin spaces earlier--anything else?


----------



## Bene323hfxns (Feb 2, 2009)

Bacampbe - How much cruising are you going to do? Certainly both galleys are quite nice, but I would definitely give the advantage to the Hunter, and its got more storage space. I like the layout, very similar to the Bene 331 galley layout - which is a really nice design.


----------



## bacampbe (Mar 17, 2009)

Bene323hfxns said:


> Bacampbe - How much cruising are you going to do? Certainly both galleys are quite nice, but I would definitely give the advantage to the Hunter, and its got more storage space. I like the layout, very similar to the Bene 331 galley layout - which is a really nice design.


I gather you are talking about the H33 being similar to the B331? I haven't seen the inside of a B331, but I did like the galley in the H33--although the one we looked at had a microwave but no oven, and the cooktop was not gimbaled. We will have the boat on a Texas lake for the time being, so being able to cook away from the dock is not that big of a deal--but it would be nice to have a proper oven for the occasional biscuits or cookies.

OTOH, the B31 does a really good job using the smaller galley space. I like the way they've put the sinks out on the end of the bar. It gives more useable counter space, and makes it easier for two people to work together.

Do you have any thoughts on the B31 compared to the B323?


----------



## Bene323hfxns (Feb 2, 2009)

No it wasn't really like that. We considered the B31, B323, Hunter 33 and the Catalina 309. We thought the Catalina 309 was just too expensive, it was an extra $25-30 grand (the B323 was a year old dealer demo - so it came at a bit of a discount). We are interested in mostly day sailing, some weekend coastal cruising but racing maybe 5-6 times a year. we thought the B323 had better performance, and a more race-oriented cockpit. 

We never got on the B31 (althouhg I have since been on one), and would have had to wait 6 months for delivery - so that took it out of competition. Certainly if you are looking at pure cruising, especially week or multi-week cruisng, I think the Hunter is the better choice. It also came down to dealer choice for us, we had bought a new C&C 30MKII from the Beneteau dealer 20 years before, and he is my neighbour. Its not a clear choice, and our dealer friend was very balanced in his analysis between Catalina, Beneteau and Hunter. 

If your focus is cruising and comfort, I think you go with the Hunter, if performance is more of a focus and racing is part of your future, you may want to go with the Beneteau. As for the trade-offs between the B31 and B323, they are pretty similar boats. The B31 has a slightly smaller rig, but its just as fast. The B31 has a bigger salon (more beam - the B323 salon feels a little small), but smaller aft cabin(the B323 aft-cabin berth is between a queen and a king) and v-berth(althougth the B323's v-berth is still smaller than the H33).. Ventilation is excellent on the B323(at least two opening ports/hatches in every part of the boat (head, salon, aft cabin, v-berth). Ventilation was pointed out as a weakness in one of the reviews of the B31. You do get a utensil drawer on the B323, but not the B31. 

As I mentioned before storage is weakness of both the Bene's.


----------



## Bene323hfxns (Feb 2, 2009)

*No oven*

No oven, that is odd. I grew up doing a lot of coastal cruising with my family and we always made casseroles and heated them up in the oven. It was a real staple. In the winter we used the same casseroles for our skiing vacations. I still make the same casseroles. That is odd, but I guess you can photoblast them in the microwave. It does mean no toast for breakfast, we always did toast in the oven for breakfast with eggs and bacon. Not to get too into the food, that is my other passion.

I would be happy to answer any specific questions regarding the B31 vs. the B323.


----------



## Bene323hfxns (Feb 2, 2009)

*Re. H33 Galley*

Yeah, the H33 galley is definitely superior space wise to the B323. Much more counter space, I like the u-shape - good for cooking during passages. Maybe you can find another one with a oven if that is a big issue. We have only had our B323 for a season, but we actually never got any cruising in. We certainly intend to, but we used it a ton for day-sailing. I did sleep on it a few times when the family cottage got crowded. The aft cabin is very comfy, and you can sleep either a-beam or a-bow.

Certainly if you mostly BBQ while cruising, which is common for just weekend trips - then the oven shouldn't be a deal breaker. What does your gut say about the dealers involved.


----------



## Bene323hfxns (Feb 2, 2009)

Another consideration is if you plan to do a lot of two couple cruising. The B31 v-berth is marginal for two couple cruising. I couldn't do a week in that v-berth, maybe a weekend. Also, how big are you and your wife. I am 6' 1.5" and over 200 pounds, so berth size is somewhat of an issue. I share our boat with my Dad and my brother in law, who are also relatively big guys.


----------



## Bene323hfxns (Feb 2, 2009)

*B323 Rig*

For SA/D comparison, the B323 is 20.8. I didn't realize the H33's was that high. It may be better to look at the theoretical wind strength / velocity charts for the boats, as a better indicator of speeds. I know that the Beneteau website has this information in its model specific websites. I have never seen a similar document for the H33. Sailing our B323, we have found the theoretical velocity charts to be spot on, and we have sailed very close to the max velocities mentioned at different points. These charts will also tell you how bad the H33 is really off the wind or DDW.


----------



## bacampbe (Mar 17, 2009)

*Take aways*

This has been a very informative thread--many thanks to everyone.

Here's a summary of what I am taking away from it--if anyone feels I am misinterpreting anything, please jump in:

The H33 is a clear win as a cruiser, base on space, storage, tankage, convenience below, etc--but the B31 is not bad. The B31 is probably a better performer when comparably equipped and with equally skilled sailors--but not by much. The B31 cockpit seems to be a little better setup for performance sailing.

I do have to admit that I like the Beneteau look better. I was trying to avoid that as a factor, but with everything else coming in so close, it may become one. Another factor is the H33 will require a next size up slip in my preferred marina.

It very much may come down to dealer preference, final price, etc. Does anyone have experience with the dealers in the Dallas area?


----------



## Bene323hfxns (Feb 2, 2009)

*Good Summary*

Good summary, so it comes back to what you want to use the boat for. Don't discount looks, every boat is a bit of a love affair and looks are important. The B31 is a great looking boat, I love the newest line of Beneteaus from a looks point of view. The B34 and B37 are also great looking.


----------



## Bene323hfxns (Feb 2, 2009)

*Usage*

So what again iss your mix of use -

- Daysailing
- Cruising - weekend versus week
- Racing

I would say that mine is current 90-5 & 5, but I would like it to be 70, 15 & 15. I would make the decision based on what your mix is.

Also as for the cruising, is it a couple, a couple with 1 or 2 kids, or two couples?


----------



## Bene323hfxns (Feb 2, 2009)

Some stuff you haven't mentioned is how well equipped they are. I never thought I would need a chart plotter or a autopilot, or that they were nice to haves, but now that I have them I can't imagine living without them.

If you are looking to save money, and want performance, I would go with the stack pack versus the self furling. The stack pack is very easy to handle, and makes dousing and flaking the main very easy.


----------



## bacampbe (Mar 17, 2009)

Bene323hfxns said:


> So what again iss your mix of use -
> 
> - Daysailing
> - Cruising - weekend versus week
> ...


We're a couple, no kids. We will commonly sail with friends, anywhere from another couple to 5-6 total. People will usually spend most of their time on deck, so cockpit size, etc, may be more important than accommodations.

Right now, we're 90-95% daysailing, with an occasional weekend. We have the misfortune of living in an inland city without any really big lakes close enough for impromptu sailing--so long cruising just won't happen. We have hopes of moving to a coastal city someday, but that could just as easily involve a new boat as moving this one.

I'm not a racer, but have always wanted to give it a try. A new boat may encourage that.


----------



## Bene323hfxns (Feb 2, 2009)

My dad did a ton of racing as a teen and in his early 20's, but he wasn't into it as a kid. I have realized that the way to become a better sailor is through racing, and it has caused me to do a lot more reading and really get more out of my boat. I race on a regular basis in the summer with my friend the yacht broker, but I would also like to race our boat. I think it just gives you more opportunities to learn, and more opportunities to sail. If cockpit is a real big consideration, I think that the B323 should be a consideration, because its cockpit (I believe) is better than the other two. Certainly bigger. It also has the swivelling wheel which is nice for making space when at anchor.


----------



## Bene323hfxns (Feb 2, 2009)

The negative would be that you don't get the attention of buying one brand new, but you might find a demo or older in stock boat available. You could also buy a used 2007 or 2008.


----------



## bacampbe (Mar 17, 2009)

Bene323hfxns said:


> Some stuff you haven't mentioned is how well equipped they are. I never thought I would need a chart plotter or a autopilot, or that they were nice to haves, but now that I have them I can't imagine living without them.
> 
> If you are looking to save money, and want performance, I would go with the stack pack versus the self furling. The stack pack is very easy to handle, and makes dousing and flaking the main very easy.


The hunter is sightly better equipped (autopilot, windlass, and an extra winch.) It's also a bit higher priced--but I suspect this will come out pretty close after adding equivalent dealer options and price negotiation. Neither has wind instruments, which I definitely want. Neither currently has a chart plotter, which I would like to have but it's not a big deal to do without on a lake this size.

Both in-stock boats have furling mains, which I am conflicted on--more so on the Hunter where putting mast furler seems to me to take away the main benefit of the B&R rig. I _think_ the H33 has the shoal keel, and the B31 has the deep keel. They've both got advantages in my area.


----------



## Bene323hfxns (Feb 2, 2009)

*Coastal Cruising on Gulf of Mexico*

I think if you were to make a move to the coast (I believe that you said you live in Texas), that any of the above mentioned boats would be suitable for ocean daysailing, coastal cruising and short to medium sized passages in weather windows.


----------



## nemier (Jul 9, 2005)

Your heart is telling you to go with the B. ...what you going to do??


----------



## k1vsk (Jul 16, 2001)

You have a point in that the shape and cut of the mainsail, being on a furler, is necessarily smaller than it should be for a B&R rig but that, like everything else, is a compromise. Personally, I find putting a furling main on a B&R rig to be a dubious choice given how simple it is to reef a full main. About the only aesthetic difference between Hunter and Bene is the interior design and dark interior simulated wood appearance of the Bene which turns some people off - another personal choice.


----------



## Sanduskysailor (Aug 1, 2008)

Interesting thread. Some things to consider. If the B's 5'10" draft is doable in your area, that is a big plus. Nothing like draft to help a boat be more stable and go to weather better.The Hunter shoal drafts are coupled with an enormous main. On puffy days that big main will steer your shoal draft into a quick round-up. The other disadvantage of the Hunter B&R rig is that you can't extend the main out very far on broad reaches and runs. That just sucks. The roller furling main is a compromise, more so on the Beneteau because it is a bit under canvassed anyway. To my eye the Beneteau is a prettier boat although Glen Henderson has upgraded the inverted bath tub look of the Hunter decks. Another consideration is hull construction. Beneteaus are solid glass, the Hunter I'm not sure about.

Bottom line, if you were racing these boats against each, the Beneteau would clean the Hunter's clock in anything but a 12-15 knot beam reach which would be pretty equal. In less than hull speed conditions, it is more about sail area to wetted surface and keel efficiency than anything else. The Beneteau easily wins here. The Hunter definitely looks more spacious and comfortable at anchor. I guess you will have to decide if you want more sailing pleasure or do you want a floating cabin tethered by a yellow cord to a dock.


----------



## PalmettoSailor (Mar 7, 2006)

Just curious why if you are shopping brand new 30-something foot production boats you wouldn't even mention the Catalina 309/320?


----------



## bacampbe (Mar 17, 2009)

midlifesailor said:


> Just curious why if you are shopping brand new 30-something foot production boats you wouldn't even mention the Catalina 309/320?


I don't have anything against the Catalinas. But they're quite a bit heavier than the the other two. The area I sail in has more light air days than heavy air days, so the lighter boats seem more appropriate. If I lived in a place with better winds, I would look harder at the Catalinas.


----------



## Bene323hfxns (Feb 2, 2009)

*Deep Draft*

I second that suggestion of going with the deeper draft. 5'10" isn't that deep, but it will make a major difference going up wind, and will help if you want to do some casual racing. A bigger Genny would also be a consideration(150) if you want to race.


----------



## blt2ski (May 5, 2005)

You may want to expand you search with the help of local dealer. Granted they want to sell you the two boats they have. BUT, like locally for me, Seattle, Signature yachts has both a B31, and 323, altho I will swag the latter is a shoal with a 4'9" draft, no specs on the B31, along with a used H33 and new one. Shipping probably 5-6000 including prep on both ends.

OR, order a B31 or H33 the way YOU want them to come. Assuming you can get a decent deal as compared to what is in stock right now. You're spending a BUNCH of money, no reason NOT to get what you really want! If you do not want inmast furling, don't get it!

Marty


----------



## Cruisingdad (Jul 21, 2006)

Moved to Boat Buyers Forum. I hope that it will get you more response.

- CD


----------



## PalmettoSailor (Mar 7, 2006)

bacampbe said:


> I don't have anything against the Catalinas. But they're quite a bit heavier than the the other two. The area I sail in has more light air days than heavy air days, so the lighter boats seem more appropriate. If I lived in a place with better winds, I would look harder at the Catalinas.


Be that as it may, looking at the base PHRF numbers the Catalina 320 should be a bit faster than the H33. No base rating for the B31 yet. If the B31 had in mast furling and the C320 didn't would even the score a good bit I expect.

Different people weigh the many factors of boat design differently, but for me, I wouldn't want a B&R rig, in mast furling or an iron keel. Since you are buying new, the iron keel might not be a concern for you, but it will be a problem for someone down the line.


----------



## Bene323hfxns (Feb 2, 2009)

*Catalina 320*

Catalina 309 and 320 are definitely options, but I am willing to bet you will pay 20-30 grand premium. Now having said that, Sailboatowners.com just did a big survey of boat owners and the feedback on the Catalina 320 was very positive. I am sure there would be very little difference in performance between the Catalina 320 and the B31. Its probably faster than the H33.

I second the idea of avoiding the furling main (not an option on the Catalinas I believe - it was standard on the Catalina 309 we looked at), especially if you have never used a stack pack. They are dead easy to use, reefing is dead easy. Not as easy as furling, but you also get the added SA, performance, and likely added life of your sail.

So did you sail both the boats, or just look at them?


----------

