# Gulf Coast cruising...Need some advice



## skrap1r0n (Mar 6, 2007)

OK so I have a Catalina 25 swing keel. with an outboard. I currently have it in a lake in central Texas, but I would like to put it in the Gulf and hop the coast.

Now for several question all of which may be dumb, but I am going to ask anyway.

First, if one is considering coastal cruising, what is the general procedure for planning the trip. I am assuming we will be stopping during the night, catching some sleep and getting under way the next day. What is the best way to plan this? How far should one get in a day and how do you plan where your stops are?

Second, what are the differences between outfitting a boat for lake weekend trips and weekend trip and a couple of weeks on the Gulf coast from an equipment point of view? 

Third, I understand that an inboard is a better option for this type of sailing, bu my boat just doesn't have one. How ignorant is it to hit the gulf with just an outboard?

And finally, experience... What experience level should one have before attempting this? Any specific ASA ratings you would recommend? I am new to sailing, however, I would like to try this trip in about a year or so.


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## camaraderie (May 22, 2002)

Skrap...others can more readily advise you on the cruising conditions, but it sounds like what you will be doing is near-coastal day hops and probably a lot of ICW motoring. In terms of a C25 and extra equipment for such a trip I would suggest that a very stable dinghy with small motor that you can tow would be a good thing...doubling as a temporary life raft should something go wrong with the boat and also providing a second means of (slow) propulsion for your boat. A permanent and portable VHF should be standard and you will need a larger battery system and a way to charge it underway...pehaps a little Honda generator or solar or wind generator. An Epirb should be mandatory if you 're heading offshore. 
You will be doing well if you can make 50 miles a day progress. 
I don't think an ASA rating is needed at all but you have to be comfortable with handling your boat when it is blowing 25kts. and comfortable with navigation and safety procedures. 
You'll obviouslyneed a GPS and the appropriate paper charts for the trip.


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## skrap1r0n (Mar 6, 2007)

the dinghy is a good idea. I had only thought of them in terms of a tender and not a life raft. EPIRB and VHF are on the list. 

Now about the ICW, why would I motor through there when I can sail the gulf? Is the ICW the only way to get to a safe mooring at night?


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## camaraderie (May 22, 2002)

Gulf Intracoastal Waterway (west)
Will give you some info. Again...I've never done this stretch of water but if you plan on coming in each night you need to have an inlet to do so...they generally are not spaced your convenience! So...while you may be able to do a good deal of near coastal hopping...weather and inlet availability would dictate that some considerable portion of your time will be spent inside the ICW. If PBeezer does not jump on this thread, you may want to PM him as he is more familiar with the territory. 
Just as an example...on a day like tomorrow in a C25 you might rather be inside than outside:
*THURSDAY*
NORTHEAST WINDS 15 TO 20 KNOTS. SEAS 5 TO 7 FEET.


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

I have a 33 ft full keel boat and sail galveston on a weekly basis. On a pretty day I might not worry too much about exploring outside the jetties in a boat like yours. There are lots of great places on the bay side that would be very suited to your boat and the bay will probably be very exciting for you as well. But between Galveston and Surfside is a lot of water and a lee shore. Try leaving from Kemah and sail out for a stay at double bayou...it is a lot of fun and a lot of water to explore.


mike


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## skrap1r0n (Mar 6, 2007)

Well, like I said, my boat is slipped on lake Travis here in central Texas. Since it is trailerable, I would like to put it in the gulf and maybe sail down to Padre or maybe over to Lake Pontchartrain.


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## PBzeer (Nov 11, 2002)

Number one problem is oil rigs and other obstructions. Number two problem is commercial fishing boats and rig crew boats. Number three problem, particularly going east, there are few places to hide in bad weather. I have also been told, but can't verify, that shrimpers like to mess with anchored boats by netting their anchors.


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## Boasun (Feb 10, 2007)

Beg to differ, but the ICW isn't always the safest place for mooring. Unless you are well lite and can have someone up all night long. But there are gunk holes along the ICW where you may be able to tuck away for the night.
But a friend who had a Catalina 25, when I lived in San Diego. We would go offshore and sail to various places of Southern Calif. And the Pacific Ocean is different in temperment than the Gulf. Wouldn't try it with a Catalina 22 but each to his own there and on how skilled you are.
Get your charts of the areas you want to visit and of the areas you will be transiting to get there. A Coast Pilot and a Light List. Figure the max time you want to be sailing each day and use that to determine the distances you may want to travel... figuring on the short side due to that a sailing vessel may sail 20 miles tacking, in order to go those ten/fifteen miles in a straight line. Have a VHF on board to have a way of saying "Here I am" to anyone around you that may not see you at first, by having a friendly chat with them. Make sure you have a Vessel station license for the VHF and a operator's license for yourself.
And all of the required safety equipage is up to date. 
Oh! Have Fun building your and your family's experiences on this series of adventures.
And read anything that talks about offshore/coastal sailing. Other people experiences help in various ways.
Oh one other thing: Seas 5 to 7 feet in the Gulf is totally different from Seas in the Pacific. They are shorter and choppier vise the long rollers of the Pacific.


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

Skrap-

One advantage of having a swing keel is that you can anchor in water that is too shallow for most boats to get into. That gives you a lot more options in terms of where you can stop for the night.


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## Sailormon6 (May 9, 2002)

If I'm on a purely pleasure cruise in a smaller boat, I like to plan on about making about 20 miles per day. If the wind is light and/or on the nose, it might take awhile to get there. If the wind is more favorable, I'll go out in the Gulf, and I might go an extra 10-15 miles. If the wind and seas are rough, I prefer to stay in the ICW. Plan on about 3 places, at different distances, where you might stop for the night. Chart your progress during the day. Sometimes you'll make good progress until the afternoon, and then the wind might become unfavorable. If so, you might decide to start the motor and get to your next inlet instead of beating to windward at 45 deg. angles against choppy seas. In short, be flexible. 

Twenty miles might not sound like much, but, if it takes about 4-5 miles to get from your anchorage or marina to the Gulf in the morning, and another 4-5 miles to get in from the Gulf to your next stop at the end of the day, you'll actually cover about 30 miles to make 20 miles of progress. Suppose you average 5 knots on a fairly good day. That means you'll sail for about 6 hours to cover the distance. If you start at about 9:00 a.m., you'll get in by about 3:00 p.m. That'll leave a little time to relax, freshen up, enjoy the area and have a nice dinner. 

If you're taking the boat from Florida to the Chesapeake, you'll want to press harder and cover more distance each day, but on a pure pleasure cruise, it's nice to take some time to smell the roses.


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## skrap1r0n (Mar 6, 2007)

OK so I am going to ask this...and I know it has been asked a bajillion times. I am guessing the coastal hopping in the 25 it probably not the best idea, but could probably be managed.

Now all that said, what makes a good offshore/bluewater boat? What I mean, is what should one look for in one? Long Keel? Skeg hung Rudder? what? The reason I am asking is because I have seen some write ups on the web about blue water capable 28-32 footers and others about how a certain 32-40 footers aren't made for open water.

What gives with these opinions? Obviously it's not the size, but something else?

If one wanted a mid sized boat for blue water sailing at a decent price, what model(s) would one consider and more importantly, why.


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

Skrap-

The question of a good small bluewater capable boat has been addressed about a billion times here on Sailnet. 

Good bluewater capable boats in the range 28-32 feet include:

Cape Dory 28, 30
Alberg 30
Contessa 32
Southern Cross 28 or 31
Bristol 29, 30, 31
Elizabethan 31
Hallberg Rassy Monsun 31
Allied Seawind
Baba 30
Bristol Channel Cutter 30
Pacific Seacraft 31, 
Pearson Triton 28
Pearson Vanguard,
Vancouver 32
Wauquiez Centurion
Westsail 32

Some of these boats would be capable as they are, some would require a bit of modification. Many of these are full-keel designs that aren't going to be speedy, but will get you there.... others are fin keel, and a bit faster, more modern designs. 

Of these, my personal favorite is probably the Alberg 30. It has a strong owners association, and is still a very popular boat. Carl Alberg designed quite a few of the boats I have on this short list.


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## Boasun (Feb 10, 2007)

One problem with The ICW along the Gulf coast is that it has a lot of barge traffic. And in areas near oil field ports you will be having those work boats also. 
I used twenty miles as an example. Lets say you want to average ten hours of sailing a day more or less and your average boat spd is 5 kts. Then you can figure fifty Nautical miles more or less a day, pending on your own williness to sail or motor. Learning what you can do with your boat is part of the fun. The Catalina 25 should be able to handle the gulf with ease.
Voyage planning: But look at the charts and Coast Pilot to start planning on where you want to be offshore and where you may want to be on the ICW, pending on the scenery and available facilities to reprovision/refuel your vessel.
Camera? Note books for comments along the way. Making your own traveler's guide for the Gulf ICW/GIWW to pass on to others who may want to make the trip!?
Remember Getting from point A to point B is half the fun.


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## tenuki (Feb 11, 2007)

sailingdog said:


> Skrap-
> 
> One advantage of having a swing keel is that you can anchor in water that is too shallow for most boats to get into. That gives you a lot more options in terms of where you can stop for the night.


What?!?! no mention of how your cat has such a shallow draft?!?!?!


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

tenuki said:


> What?!?! no mention of how your cat has such a shallow draft?!?!?!


You buffoon... How dare you say I sail a cat... I sail a trimaran. And no need to mention it..


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## Boasun (Feb 10, 2007)

Sailingdog
Is she self righting? The Trimaran I mean... I know they are faster then light.
Wasn't the Starship Enterprize a tri?
Skrap1r0n
Voyage planning allows you to dream about your voyaging even before you cast off the lines.
HAVE FUN...


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

I don't know of any trimarans, outside of a few apochryphal experimental beasties, that are self righting. Nor any catamarans that are self-righting.


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

double bayou is a great place to spend a night or the weekend.


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## seabreeze_97 (Apr 30, 2006)

The Enterprise was a deep-V.


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## AboardIndigo (Aug 23, 2007)

Although the question of what boats people recommend as bluewater capable has been addressed a million times, I'm with skrap in that the reasons why they make good bluewater boats has not really been addressed (in much detail anyway).

I've seen some off-hand references to tankage, but this particular reason doesn't do much to convince me that many other boats couldn't be re-classed as bluewater capable with the installation of a couple of hundred dollars worth of additional water/fuel tanks.

Also, there's the argument that some coastal cruisers have too much open space. Is this really so important if you know what you have and have handholds to make traversing the ship easier? Is this another case of the reality not necessarily matching the theory as closely as everyone makes out that it would?

So experts, in the interest of more fully answering one of the poster's questions, what are the details? Is there a list that can be started?

I only ask so bluntly so that I can learn more too.


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## nolatom (Jun 29, 2005)

Don't try western or central Louisiana til you have more experience. It's all commercial, barges don't always see you, and with some exceptions not too scenic; some good fishing, but not really sailboat country. Most cruisers go "outside" between the Miss. Delta and Texas coast, which is another set of challenges, as you've read above.


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## ccriders (Jul 8, 2006)

Get a cruising guide and a set of charts and you can plan a really nice trip between Houston/Galveston and South Padre using inside and outside legs. Some of the bays are very sailable and let you get away from the barge traffic. Do inside legs there. Galveston to Freeport are probably best done outside, but the ICW is mostly sailable. Rockport has a nice city marina with easy access, as does Port Aransas and Corpus Christi. Ride a northerly to down the ICW to Port Isabel. In CC Bay there are only a few anchorages other than the marinas. Have fun planning and have a safe trip.
John


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## ccriders (Jul 8, 2006)

Also, be sure you can reef your mainsail. I've seen lake boats without reefing. You can quickly be over canvassed along the coast. You will be surprised how much more wind we have than you get on the lake.
John


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## Slipkiller2 (Aug 24, 2007)

First I would recommend that you get a copy of Campbell's Guide to Cruising Texas http://www.waltereden.com/CGCT.html and charts of the areas you plan to cruise. I would also suggest that you check out USPS' Boating Guide to America http://www.boatingguidetoamerica.com/.

If you're looking to put in at Clear Lake, you could spend a night at Red Fish Island and then on to Galveston. BTW, the Houston ship Channel is vey busy with tankers and Tows. While you are east of the Galveston Causeway Bridge besides monitoring CH16, you need to talk to the Tows on CH13. Once you are west of the bridge, the Tows are on CH16. The intersection of the Houston Ship Channel the ICW and the Texas City Ship Channel is one of the busiest in the US, so keep a good look out.

If you are planning to go offshore, be aware that for the 300 miles along the Texas Coast, there are only 6 entrances from the Gulf - Sabine River, Galveston, Freeport, Port O'Conner, Port Aransas, Port Mansfield, and Brownsville. Many of the river entrances are either shallow of very prone to shoaling.

Galveston to Freeport can be travelled either offshore approximately 46nm (it's 5nm to go out the Galveston Jetties which are taking you east) or the ICW which is about 37nm. Either way it's a good days motor or sail. I'm guessing that you are looking to do this during the summer so you will have plenty of daylight. When we had our C25 we did both and it's not a problem with the right weather.

Freeport to Port O'Conner is 62nm offshore and in a C25 it would be difficult to do during daylight and I definitely do not recommend doing the Matagorda channel at night. The current can be +3kts and depending on the wind you can have 6ft breaking seas. I've done it in a 40ft sailboat and don't want to do it again. My suggestion would be to go the ICW - Freeport to Matagorda, Matagorda to Port O'Conner.

Check your tides and wind when entering or heading out of any of the inlets along the Texas coast. With an outgoing current of 2-3 kts and a south wind of +15kts, some pretty rough seas can be experienced. And if you have not had any experience offshore do not try to come in after sunset. It's a whole different world doing this in the dark. Even being familiar with the area, the background lights on shore make it very difficult to see the NAVAIDS.

You also don't want to be travelling or anchoring in the ICW in the dark. Along the ICW, you will see many NAVAIDS taken out by the Tows.

Communicating with the Tows is a different experience and you can find an example at http://www.tmca.nu/links.and.features/vhf.htm.

We did it when we had our C25 and had a great time, but it takes planning.


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## smackdaddy (Aug 13, 2008)

Skrap - I sail on Lake Travis as well (Catalina 27) and am interested in the same basic trip (maybe Galveston to SPI). Have you taken yours yet?


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