# BVI chart/nav app



## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

I checked Charts&Tides and could not find a coverage area that applied to the BVIs. On my East Coast edition, all the Active Captain icons show up when I move the location there, but no navigation or chart data.

Is there an app that covers BVI?


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## CLucas (Feb 10, 2007)

I have iNautical's Waterproof Chart app on my iPad with a BVI chart and used it this summer while chartering. Pretty no-frills, but it's a decent chart with adequate detail.


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## fallard (Nov 30, 2009)

2 years ago I bought a waterproof Garmin Oregon handheld chartplotter along with a chart chip for the eastern Caribbean. This was in preparation for a bareboat charter that included the Spanish Virgins. I also bought waterproof charts and a Seaworthy guide to all of the Virgin Islands so I could lay my hands on the navigation data and just in case the electronics crapped out.

An app might be nice, but if you want something you can rely on under wet conditions a small handheld is the way to go when you are the skipper on someone else's boat. You can set up waypoints and routes ahead of time and familiarize yourself with electronics that you'll be able to use when/if panic sets in. If your charter boat has a chartplotter, at least you'll have a backup that may be more user friendly (if you've done the drill). One advantage of the Oregon--and similar sized Garmin units--is that they fit into a drink holder by the helm. 

The higher end Garmin handhelds are not cheap, but they have more pixels (higher resolution) than the cheaper Garmin handheld chart plotters and they obviously are a lot more rugged than a cell phone or tablet. Think of it as insurance--as part of a layered approach to assuring your safety. The only drawback is that they don't float. 

I rationalized the purchase as a backup for my own boat's installed chartplotter/GPS which would fail in the next lightning strike. (After losing all my electronics twice to lightning, this is more than a hypothetical situation for me.) The advantage of handheld electronics is that you can protect them by putting them in your oven or wrapping them in aluminum foil when lightning threatens.

That said, I am trying to figure out what charting and weather apps to acquire for my iPhone (and maybe an iPad in the future) and hope to get some suggestions from this blog.


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## sunnybraerick (Nov 22, 2012)

*did not require much nav aids*

We were in the bvi's for 2 weeks and found that everything was on board our charter that we needed. Doyles guide is all you really need. Line of sight sailing down there


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## rockDAWG (Sep 6, 2006)

Minnewaska said:


> I checked Charts&Tides and could not find a coverage area that applied to the BVIs. On my East Coast edition, all the Active Captain icons show up when I move the location there, but no navigation or chart data.
> 
> Is there an app that covers BVI?


AC only have the free NOAA charts. Any other commercial chart product has to be purchased on your own running on your own lap top or ipad like Polar Navy etc.

You an get from here
ChartWorld Digital Products and Services

Make sure you have your own account from Chartworld, or you can't download charts from them.


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## fallard (Nov 30, 2009)

"Line of sight" sailing generally applies in the BVI, but not if you are going to Anegada. Coming back from Anegada is a different matter. 

I've also been caught in the Drake Channel in an intense rain event where the visibility was down to a quarter mile. These events don't last long, thankfully, so we recovered visual landmarks after a while. I didn't have GPS then, but it would have been nice.

The GPS allows you to navigate precisely to a harbor entrance that otherwise blends into the background. It's true that visual navigation will usually keep you out of trouble, but GPS can be a convenience. 

Then there are those of us who are used to dead reckoning in areas that have tidal currents and are quite capable of navigating with a compass and a paper chart, but still want to know precisely where we and the waypoint are at all times.


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

*Re: did not require much nav aids*



sunnybraerick said:


> We were in the bvi's for 2 weeks and found that everything was on board our charter that we needed. Doyles guide is all you really need. Line of sight sailing down there


Thanks, but, I'm quite familiar. We've done this before and I don't have a concern for finding my way around.

However, I have been aboard where the bareboat's charts were missing or managed to get lost. I would rather not pack my own, as we'll be strictly carrying on. I will have my iPad, so it would be the best option.


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

I downloaded the Imray app and bought the Eastern Caribbean charts. Good vacation toy, but looks a bit more cumbersome than it should be. It seems you need to continually reselect the chart you want, rather than it just knitting them all together.


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## JSL3 (Jun 6, 2007)

I use a Garmin GPSMAP 478 as my primary on my own boat and backup on chartered boats. It's small enought to fit in my carry on luggage and very reliable. Every charter boat I've used in the past 10 years has had a GPS chart plotter built in but it is nice to set up potential routes on my computer at home before I get there. I then run my Garmin along side the charter boats GPS (which will have a bigger screen). It is great to have both maps (2 sets of data on 2 different GPS devices) to refer to and to compare.
That said, since you have an iPad, I really like the iSailor app.
You can download it for free from the iTunes store. It comes with one free map so you can get a feel to see if you like it. Then, IIRC, you can download the entire caribbean set of maps for $25. Pretty good deal.


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## Liquorice (Nov 28, 2007)

I've been to the BVI's for the last 4 years and will be there again mid Jan.
I use iNavX and their Carribean and Ct America chart. In fact it's the reason I bought the iPad in the first place. Great app with more features than you need.
I've also got iSailor, but I don't think it's as good.

The guy I sail with takes a handheld Garmin ( not sure which one)

Both these are not cheep. iNavX is $50 and the chart was $30 I think.
But peace of mind has got to be worth something.
sam


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## TakeFive (Oct 22, 2009)

I'm not sure if OP has headed out yet, but I have a couple minor things to add, if it's not too late. I'm heading down to BVI starting Jan. 5, so I've been checking a few of these things out myself.

I have the Garmin Oregon 400c, and plan to take it down to BVI in January. I have a $10 bicycle handlebar mount which can attach to the binnacle with a couple plastic tie straps. It's easily removed when done.

The 400c has charts already built in for the Caribbean, but they are very inaccurate (I'll demonstrate this below). I've debated buying a microSD upgrade from Garmin, but I have no idea whether it's any more accurate than what I already have. The inaccuracy is far worse than could be accounted for by the 3-year age of their chart. Why would Garmin intentionally put a grossly inaccurate survey into this device if they had better charts to provide on the chip? It just does not make sense, and as a result I'm not gonna buy a chip to find out. (I've heard that Garmin are absolute [email protected]%&$ about refunds.)

Here's how I did an informal test of the chart accuracy in the BVI:

Last December we went down for a land-based vacation on St. John USVI, and chartered boats a couple of days. One day we had a 23' powercat to go over to the Baths in BVI. Due to large swell and heavy chop, the captain hugged the coastline for much of the trip. We kept the Oregon 400c in my wife's purse to capture the track the whole day. His shoreline-hugging course gave me an outstanding opportunity to test the accuracy of the GPS and its embedded charts. I found many instances where the recorded track showed us significantly inland, and others where stopping points at shore were significantly off the shore.

For example, upon entering English waters, we had to check in at Jost Van Dyke's Great Harbour. I have exported this track to different charts to get an idea of the accuracy of the underlying charts.

First, the Oregon's embedded chart was off by almost a half nautical mile! The government dock where we stopped is about where the "D" in "Dyke" is located on the Oregon's chart, but you can see that our stopping point below is about 0.5 nm away from that point:








I exported this track and overlaid it on NOAA chart #25641, a 1:100,000 representation of the area (soundings in fathoms). Obviously the scale is not conducive to great accuracy, and I have overzoomed the chart for my screenshot. But you can see here that in this chart, the chart's government dock is located about 0.2 nm to the northwest of where we actually stopped:








A significant reason for the chart's inaccuracy is shown here:








As you can see above, the BVI part of that chart was based on a pre-1900 survey (back when BVI were still owned by Denmark)! Clearly the surveyors of that era did not have modern technology to assist their location. So these charts are not to be trusted for navigation.

Finally, I found much more modern (but still somewhat dated) NGA charts (soundings in meters), which NOAA allows you to browse free of charge but does not make available for download. Here is a screen shot or our track overlaid on NGA #25609, which appears to be much more accurate based on our stopping point and shore-hugging track:








This chart's survey was done in 1986, so it's much more recent, though still old enough to be cause of some caution.

FYI, NGA does publish periodic notice to mariners for critical changes to their charts, but they are relevant to ocean going vessels only, so you won't find important cruising information like Foxy's phone number there. :laugher

NGA 25609 gives a wide view of all the islands out to Anegada. But for closer-in cruising in Drake Channel, Chart 25611 gives a much better view at 1:30,000 and an inset of Road Harbour at 1:15,000 (but does not include Jost Van Dyke, which is why I did not use it here). [EDIT: A couple weeks after I posted this, NOAA removed these NGA charts from their website. I'm lucky I got them while I could! Unfortunately, this makes the instructions below somewhat moot.]

Now here's the trick for computer geeks: Although the NGA charts are not available for download (you can only view them with the Zoomify routines on the NGA site), there is a Python routine out there called DeZoomify that will download all the "tiles" that make up the chart, and stitch the whole thing back together into one large .png file. You need to have Python installed on your computer (it took me a couple tries to get a version of Python 3 that worked on my machine - hint: you need to run 32-bit Python even if you have a 64-bit OS). The Python routine takes several hours to run, but in the end you get a nice, high-resolution chart. Those not inclined to do this can do a Google search for the NGA chart, and you might get lucky and find someone else who uploaded theirs.

The next step to get the NGA chart to work in a chartplotter is to calibrate it and (preferably) convert it into a BSB/KAP file. I have struggled with this, because it seems the best tools are in Linux, which I don't have time to install. I have managed to get the .png files to load into SeaClear (that's how I took the screenshots), but these .png files cause it to be very buggy and it does unfriendly things to my computer's menus, so I don't recommend it.

Long story short, if I take the Garmin Oregon 400c on vacation with me, I'll only use it as an emergency backup for an on-board chartplotter (which I hope Sunsail provides), and will manually plot lon/lat onto their paper charts if I need to.


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## fallard (Nov 30, 2009)

TakeFive, I bought an Oregon 450 2 yrs ago in preparation for a trip out of the USVI to the SVI. The 450 didn't have built-in detailed charts so I bought the US and Southeast Caribbean BlueChart g2 chips. The SE Caribbean chip is # HXUS030R.

I found the accuracy to be as good as the paper charts for the area. We threaded some reefs at Culebrita and elsewhere using paper charts and eyeball navigation, including reading the depths, until we established trust in the Garmin system. We ranged from St Thomas to Culebrita, Culebra, and Vieques and back by way of St. John with no issues. Actually, it was rather impressive.

BTW, I took a look at Great Harbour using my SE Caribbean chip and it provides a little more detail than your map views. I don't know if this microSD chip works in your 400c, but I would think so. 

Your 400c has the same dimensions as my 450, which fit nicely in a drink holder on the boat we chartered.


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## TakeFive (Oct 22, 2009)

fallard said:


> TakeFive, I bought an Oregon 450 2 yrs ago in preparation for a trip out of the USVI to the SVI. The 450 didn't have built-in detailed charts so I bought the US and Southeast Caribbean BlueChart g2 chips. The SE Caribbean chip is # HXUS030R.
> 
> I found the accuracy to be as good as the paper charts for the area. We threaded some reefs at Culebrita and elsewhere using paper charts and eyeball navigation, including reading the depths, until we established trust in the Garmin system. We ranged from St Thomas to Culebrita, Culebra, and Vieques and back by way of St. John with no issues. Actually, it was rather impressive.
> 
> ...


Thanks, that's the kind of input that I was looking for. Now I need to figure whether Garmin could ship fast enough for me.


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## fallard (Nov 30, 2009)

If you use the Imray-Iolare charts, note that they are not only not to NGA standards, but they are on a different datum than the US charts and your chartplotter, which is undoubtedly on WGS84. Read the fine print on the chart if you want to be precise, although there is only a very slight correction if you want to transfer a waypoint from the chart to your GPS.


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

Thanks. We're not going until Feb.

So far, my fav is the iSailor app. I'm thinking of springing for iNavX.

I'm not really worried about GPS nav capability, as much as redundant chart display and a planning tool. But things like ETA are nice to have.


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## gtod25 (Aug 5, 2000)

BlueChart® Mobile app for iPad etc.

https://buy.garmin.com/shop/shop.do?pID=114005&ra=true

Links in very well with Active Captain.

Gerry


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## RobGallagher (Aug 22, 2001)

TakeFive said:


> Here's how I did an informal test of the chart accuracy in the BVI:
> 
> Last December we went down for a land-based vacation on St. John USVI, and chartered boats a couple of days. One day we had a 23' powercat to go over to the Baths in BVI. Due to large swell and heavy chop, the captain hugged the coastline for much of the trip. We kept the Oregon 400c in my wife's purse to capture the track the whole day. His shoreline-hugging course gave me an outstanding opportunity to test the accuracy of the GPS and its embedded charts. I found many instances where the recorded track showed us significantly inland, and others where stopping points at shore were significantly off the shore.


Although I appreciate your effort to warn others, I have to wonder about the scientific method you applied by stuffing it in the wife's purse. :laugher

I'm gonna ass-u-me that your wife's purse may have been down below, or stowed somewhere, or that there could have been other things in the purse that may have effected the GPS antenna like getting lodged under a cell phone, etc. That antenna needs a line of sight to the sky to work properly.

I would say this is not a very scientific method of judging a GPS unit. Again, I think you had the best intentions.

Respectfully.


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## TakeFive (Oct 22, 2009)

RobGallagher said:


> Although I appreciate your effort to warn others, I have to wonder about the scientific method you applied by stuffing it in the wife's purse. :laugher
> 
> I'm gonna ass-u-me that your wife's purse may have been down below, or stowed somewhere, or that there could have been other things in the purse that may have effected the GPS antenna like getting lodged under a cell phone, etc. That antenna needs a line of sight to the sky to work properly.
> 
> ...


Like many assumptions, it is a little off the mark. It wasn't actually a purse (I was trying to keep my wording simple) - it was her canvas beach bag that held hats, sunscreen, snorkels, etc., and was sitting in the cockpit the whole time. The GPS signal was perfectly fine - 8 or more satellites at all times. This GPS is extremely sensitive, and even gets a reliable signal in the middle of my house. I have no reason to doubt the reliability of the tracks.

Even if the track was a little off, it was exactly the same track on all three examples that I showed above, which means that the disagreement between the three charts can only be attributed to the charts. If you look at the track from the whole day trip, where we passed close by Cooper, Norman, Peter Islands, etc., it is clear that the NGA chart was significantly more accurate. The Garmin and NOAA charts showed us going over ground on numerous occasions, and the NGA chart agreed completely with our DR positions.

I believe that NGA makes the intelligence maps that guide our Navy vessels and cruise missiles, so I'm betting on them to have the best chart.


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## TakeFive (Oct 22, 2009)

fallard said:


> If you use the Imray-Iolare charts, note that they are not only not to NGA standards, but they are on a different datum than the US charts and your chartplotter, which is undoubtedly on WGS84. Read the fine print on the chart if you want to be precise, although there is only a very slight correction if you want to transfer a waypoint from the chart to your GPS.


In my tests with the chartplotter programs, I was concerned about both datum and projection (though the latter not such a big issue close to the equator), so I carefully verified both. The NGA chart header says it is WGS datum, and the NOAA chart is as well.

I will heed your warning to watch out for the datum on any charts that are on the charter vessel. Are there simple offsets available?


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## TakeFive (Oct 22, 2009)

gtod25 said:


> BlueChart® Mobile app for iPad etc.
> 
> https://buy.garmin.com/shop/shop.do?pID=114005&ra=true
> 
> ...


...and almost useless unless you have a Garmin chartplotter with WiFi networking capabilities. I was disappointed to see that this is not a freestanding chart plotter app that uses the internal GPS, but merely a repeater that takes the GPS coordinates though WiFi from a Garmin chartplotter - with purchase of a Garmin WiFi adapter.

I'll download the free app and see if it can make a wireless link with my Oregon 400c (which is touted as being capable of wireless sharing), but I'm not willing to buy the Garmin WiFi adapter to run the experiment. Leave it to Garmin to require a dongle add-on to override the iPad's built-in WiFi capability.


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## TakeFive (Oct 22, 2009)

Minnewaska said:


> Thanks. We're not going until Feb.
> 
> So far, my fav is the iSailor app. I'm thinking of springing for iNavX.
> 
> I'm not really worried about GPS nav capability, as much as redundant chart display and a planning tool.  But things like ETA are nice to have.


I keep forgetting that my son bought us an iPad, and got us the wireless version just to get the built-in GPS. (We don't use the wireless capability - just WiFi and occasional tethering to my Android phone if we need mobile connectivity.)

The reason I keep forgetting is my wife uses it so much I don't get much chance to try it out.

So I'm going to spend a little time looking into iNavx, iSailor, and Navionics. However, they're of little interest to me on my own boat until they're upgraded to accept NMEA sentences via Bluetooth. I want real-time AIS targets on my chartplotter display like I have on my Netbook - anything less is a downgrade. But for a charter, one of these apps might do the trick if they're not too costly.


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

TakeFive said:


> ......one of these apps might do the trick if they're not too costly.


So far, I've not spent more than about $25 for an app and its charts. I really like Charts and Tides, as it integrates the Active Captain database offline, for reviews, phone numbers, etc.

The iPad is not the perfect charplotter, but what an incredibly superior backup to a standalone GPS. Not to mention all else it can do aboard, from email to rented movies to Internet access.

Ironically, I needed it as a GPS backup on the very first passage I had it along. The internal compass for my charplotter went bad, while I was tucked way inside an unmarked cove in Maine. Very glad I had it along.


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## gtod25 (Aug 5, 2000)

TakeFive said:


> ...and almost useless unless you have a Garmin chartplotter with WiFi networking capabilities. I was disappointed to see that this is not a freestanding chart plotter app that uses the internal GPS, but merely a repeater that takes the GPS coordinates though WiFi from a Garmin chartplotter.
> 
> I'll download the free app and see if it can make a wireless link with my Oregon 400c (which is touted as being capable of wireless sharing), but I'm not willing to buy the Garmin WiFi adapter to run the experiment. Leave it to Garmin to require a dongle add-on to override the iPad's built-in WiFi capability.


That's interesting as I have just used it on two separate boat trips on the East coast and West coast of Florida where it tracked perfectly using the internal GPS on an iPad 2. It does not appear to provide a "go to" routing system like standalone plotters but it is perfectly acceptable for casual use. The interface with Active Captain is excellent.

Still what do I know, annoyed opinion always trumps experience.


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## Donna_F (Nov 7, 2005)

TakeFive said:


> I keep forgetting that my son bought us an iPad, and got us the wireless version just to get the built-in GPS. ...


Wow. You really aren't into gadgets, are you? How do you *forget* that you have an iPad? 

I just downloaded onto mine some of the apps mentioned in this thread. I keep getting a message saying "There are no charts to download. Try again later." on the Garmin app.


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## gtod25 (Aug 5, 2000)

DRFerron said:


> Wow. You really aren't into gadgets, are you? How do you *forget* that you have an iPad?
> 
> I just downloaded onto mine some of the apps mentioned in this thread. I keep getting a message saying "There are no charts to download. Try again later." on the Garmin app.


Hi Donna

Saw this as well. I downloaded all my charts a few weeks ago and it worked flawlessly. Give Garmin a day of so to wake up their server.

Gerry


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## Donna_F (Nov 7, 2005)

gtod25 said:


> Hi Donna
> 
> Saw this as well. I downloaded all my charts a few weeks ago and it worked flawlessly. Give Garmin a day of so to wake up their server.
> 
> Gerry


Thanks Gerry. Will do. Garmin isn't off to a good start here with me. All of the others had charts readily available.


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## TakeFive (Oct 22, 2009)

gtod25 said:


> That's interesting as I have just used it on two separate boat trips on the East coast and West coast of Florida where it tracked perfectly using the internal GPS on an iPad 2. It does not appear to provide a "go to" routing system like standalone plotters but it is perfectly acceptable for casual use. The interface with Active Captain is excellent.
> 
> Still what do I know, annoyed opinion always trumps experience.


Sorry, I couldn't tell from your post that you had actually purchased and used the Garmin software. My (incorrect) conclusion that it did not use the internal GPS was based on disappointed reviews in the App Store that claimed it didn't use the internal GPS. Also, this statement on Garmin's site seemed to agree:



> Once underway, the Garmin Marine Wi-Fi Adapter will allow your iPad to be used to "follow the boat" along its route by wirelessly sharing the GPS location from the Garmin marine network.


But your actual experience is much more valuable to me than any of this. I don't need "go to" routing. As long as I can plot a course and see where my boat is relative to that course, I'll have more than I need. (In my busy home waters I also want AIS targets on the chart.)


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## TakeFive (Oct 22, 2009)

DRFerron said:


> Wow. You really aren't into gadgets, are you? How do you *forget* that you have an iPad?


The issue is gadget overload, not gadget phobia. In the last 2 weeks, we've added 2 new Windows 8 PCs, a new Windows 7 laptop from work, and two Nexus 4 Android phones, 2 new gigabit ethernet switches and a gigabit wireless access point. Of course, my whole family wants this stuff to "just work," so as the _de facto_ IT guy I've been up to my ears in configuring everything. This has been a challenge because all the old computers were XP, so there's a lot of new stuff for me to learn.

That, plus my wife's domination of "our" iPad, and I haven't had any chance to even think of using it, and it's therefore easily forgotten.


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## fallard (Nov 30, 2009)

Getting back to GPS tracks overlaid on paper charts: You need to know how position is indexed on your paper charts (the "datum"). All of the GPS units I've used are indexed by default to WGS 84 datum, although I had at least one device that would allow you to reset to use other datums.

My Imray-Iolare Virgin Islands chart was "corrected" as of 2000, but it was not on WGS 84. Rather, if you read the "fine print" on the chart, you needed to adjust your GPS position by 0.12 minutes North and 0.01 minutes West. Basically you need to know that your GPS latitude offset is 246 ft, whereas the longitude offset is small enough to ignore. Actually, there aren't many areas where the 246 ft offset matters--maybe on the approach to the Salt Pond Bay moorings on St. John.


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## TakeFive (Oct 22, 2009)

TakeFive said:


> Like many assumptions, it is a little off the mark. It wasn't actually a purse (I was trying to keep my wording simple) - it was her canvas beach bag that held hats, sunscreen, snorkels, etc., and was sitting in the cockpit the whole time. The GPS signal was perfectly fine - 8 or more satellites at all times. This GPS is extremely sensitive, and even gets a reliable signal in the middle of my house. I have no reason to doubt the reliability of the tracks.
> 
> Even if the track was a little off, it was exactly the same track on all three examples that I showed above, which means that the disagreement between the three charts can only be attributed to the charts. If you look at the track from the whole day trip, where we passed close by Cooper, Norman, Peter Islands, etc., it is clear that the NGA chart was significantly more accurate. The Garmin and NOAA charts showed us going over ground on numerous occasions, and the NGA chart agreed completely with our DR positions.
> 
> I believe that NGA makes the intelligence maps that guide our Navy vessels and cruise missiles, so I'm betting on them to have the best chart.


I'm not sure why I didn't think of this last night, but by overlaying my track onto Google Earth I can provide conclusive proof that the track is accurate and that the NGA chart's representation of the shoreline is by far the best of the three (Garmin, NOAA, NGA):


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## TakeFive (Oct 22, 2009)

OK, I finally pried the iPad from my wife's clenched fingers. :laugher Here area few questions for those of you who may have used it in BVI:


I've downloaded the free Garmin Bluechart Mobile software and the ActiveCaptain database, which has several useful entries for BVI. As Gerry pointed out above, it does pick up the internal GPS if I turn off the external GPS option in settings. As I look over Garmin's chart purchase options, I see some of the same issues that scared me off from buying their microSD cards for my Oregon. For $30 I can get US Coastal which appears to include the same range as my Oregon 400c. It's hard to tell from the little coverage chart, but it looks like it just barely makes it over to BVI (just like my Oregon), and it's less costly than the total North America coverage at $45. But then there's the concern about accuracy in BVI, as I illustrated with my Oregon above. Does anyone have experience with Garmin's US coastal accuracy in the BVI region for these downloadable charts? Is the $45 North America coverage any more accurate in BVI?

Charts&Tides, which Minnewaska recommended, looks interesting and much lower cost for the charts. But I do not see any coverage in the Caribbean. Is there something I'm missing? And if there is coverage, how is its accuracy?

I also downloaded Transas iSailor, recommended by Minnewaska. The instruction manual is very limited, and doesn't mention features like Import and Export. I'd like to import some GPX waypoints and tracks, but how do I "Add files to the iSailor Documents list"? Where is this list located? (I tried a File Manager program, but can't find any folder where this list might be located.) Also, how is the accuracy of their charts compared to Garmin and the others?

The whole chart accuracy thing is a real issue for me, given the discrepancies that I demonstrated above. So any help you guys can provide would be greatly appreciated.


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

I use Charts and Tide in New England for the Active Captain database, float planning and as a backup GPS. It works great and is very accurate. It does not cover BVI, which is why I started the thread.

iSailor was a recommendation I picked up here and have only recently downloaded it. I like it's presentation compared to some of the other recommendations, but have not used it on the water.


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## TakeFive (Oct 22, 2009)

Minnewaska said:


> I use Charts and Tide in New England for the Active Captain database, float planning and as a backup GPS. It works great and is very accurate. It does not cover BVI, which is why I started the thread...


Sorry! Funny how after 30+ messages I forgot your original question.


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## gtod25 (Aug 5, 2000)

Hi Take 5

The US Coastal does not cover the BVI's, you will need to buy the North America coverage. Your question about the Coastal chart accuracy is therefore moot.

As for overall accuracy, here goes (I know you know all this, but for the benefit of the peanut gallery);

1. With all electronic charts you have three potential errors, chart errors, GPS errors and the relationship between both. Without all three being 100% you are getting incorrect information. You have to assume that for pilotage, plotter info is not accurate.

2. I have used Navionics, Garmin Bluechart and Jeppesen C-Map in the BVI's and Caribbean. Which is most accurate? It depends. They all take turns and all claim to be the best. I tend to like Garmin because I drive on the white, slow down on the blue and stay off the yellow and green.

3. My favorite electronic instrument is a depth sounder. My favorite non electronic tool is a long boat-hook marked in one foot increments which I use to sound around my grounded boat in order to find the direction to kedge/get towed off.

4. These electronic charts are now relatively cheap. Buy as many as you can afford and have fun with them. If you really want to understand chart accuracy in the Caribbean you should have listened/read the discussions between Don Street and Chris Doyle about the accuracy of their relative chartlets.

If you have lots of spare time check this out;

Street's Cruising Guide to the Eastern Caribbean: Puerto Rico, Spanish, U.S. & British Virgin Islands - Donald M. Street Jr.

Fair Winds

Gerry


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

In RI, I turn on my Ipad at the marina and it shows me in the correct slip! 

I will probably do the same experiment in Tortola, before casting off.


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## fallard (Nov 30, 2009)

For the peanut gallery:

The Garmin BlueChart for the US is fantastic in the Oregon or similar Garmin handheld chartplotter range (higher resolution/pixel count than the lower end Garmins, but you pay for that, of course.) However the US coverage extends to the BVI, but without the same resolution as in the continental US.

The BlueChart for the Southeast Caribbean fixes that. It provides detail in the Virgins that is comparable to that of the US chip in the continental US. Once again, you pay for that.

The small screen is a challenge after using the larger built-ins or tablets/iPads, but a device like the Oregon that is small, rugged, and waterproof and can be retained in a drink holder at the helm in bad weather has its advantages, like when you are threading a reef during a sudden tropical downpour in 100 yd visibility and can't read the bottom visually. That might be an infrequent occurrence, but it's nice be prepared for it.


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## TakeFive (Oct 22, 2009)

fallard said:


> For the peanut gallery:
> 
> The Garmin BlueChart for the US is fantastic in the Oregon or similar Garmin handheld chartplotter range (higher resolution/pixel count than the lower end Garmins, but you pay for that, of course.) However the US coverage extends to the BVI, but without the same resolution as in the continental US.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the excellent clarification. I look forward to trying the SE Caribbean bluechart chip.

Because of my overall distrust of any single chart supplier, I have really gotten to like plotting routes on my computer using the most reliable chart I can find (usually NOAA when in US waters), then transferring the routes to the Garmin Oregon. This gives me the opportunity to view the exact same route plan overlaid over two charts from different suppliers, and I believe that redundancy leads to better safety.

When we chartered last summer this became our normal MO - I would plot out the next day's planned rout in the evening, export the route to the Oregon, and we'd head out the next day. I liked it better than the boat's chartplotter because it was my own gear that I use on my own boat.

With this in mind, I put in a major effort today to convert the NGA charts (which I believe to be far more accurate than NOAA's charts in the BVI/USVI region) to a calibrated chart that can be imported to a chartplotter on my Netbook or an Android tablet (iOS devices are a lot more difficult to "sideload" content - charts, routes, waypoints - than the others, which I think over time will become a big negative for Apple). So far I have succeeded in getting the charts into a .WCI format that can be read by SeaClear II (without the menu corruption that I was having before), and I am 80% of the way there to converting them to BSB/KAP format that will allow using them in OpenCPN, which is by far my favorite free/low cost PC chart plotting program. The conversion is churning away as we speak. It's been a real learning experience installing VirtualBox on my computer, and Ubuntu Linux inside the virtual machine. I know more about this stuff than I want to know. But it also has given me a good view into how all these things work.

In the end, BVI is mostly line of sight sailing, so this level of redundancy is not really necessary, but I wanted to see whether I can do this myself.


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## TakeFive (Oct 22, 2009)

As I mentioned last night, I have successfully managed to convert the nice NGA images of BVI into reliable electronic raster charts. This is the exact same format that NOAA uses for their freely distributed charts of the US waters. So far I have gotten them to work flawlessly with SeaClear and OpenCPN on my PC, and with the Marine Navigator Android app on my Nexus4 cell phone and Nook Color tablet.

I have yet to find any iPad app that will import the NOAA KAP files (or these new KAP files that I have created). If anyone knows of an iPad app (even a paid one) that has this capability, please let me know.


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## TakeFive (Oct 22, 2009)

Having just returned from my BVI charter (and not wanting to fully let go of the memories), here's a brief summary of my navigational experience down there.

As I previously mentioned, I installed the newly released Garmin Bluechart app (free) and ActiveCaptain database (also free, but registration required) into the iPad. Just prior to going I decided to spring for the $45 North America Garmin Bluecharts. This was not required, since the ActiveCaptain data was still fully useful without the marine chart, but for $45 I was willing to give it a try.

The Garmin charts are useful, but since I did not have the Garmin WiFi network on the charter vessel (nor do I want to install one on my own boat), there appears to be no way to offload routes, waypoints, and tracks onto other devices. This will limit the functionality going forward.

Prior to leaving, I also borrowed a Bluechart SD card for the area and loaded into my Oregon 400c (thanks Frank!), which proved to be extremely useful. I quickly fell into my normal routine of plotting the next day's planned route on my laptop in the cabin (using OpenCPN with the NGA charts that I had calibrated for digital use), then using MapSource to transfer the routes to my Oregon for use in the cockpit. I installed the Oregon handlebar mount at the starboard wheel so I had the route available in the cockpit at all times.

I need to say that I consider the availability of pre-plotted routes to be a critical safety item when navigating unfamiliar waters. No matter how good your ded recking skills may be, when you look out along the hazy horizon in a place like BVI, it is impossible to tell whether a certain feature in the distance is a cove, a bay, or a cut between islands. There were numerous times when I would have missed a critical turn if I did not have the little purple line telling me it was time to turn. For example, when I left Marina Cay toward Guana Bay, the Camanoe passage came up much faster than I expected, and I just know that I would have wandered into the rocks between Beef Island airport and Little Camanoe (which were on Sunsail's prohibited list, and we had been explicitly warned to stay away from). Things just don't look the same as you expect them to from the chart, and that little purple line is what saved me there.








The Garmin iPad app may find some eventual use in my normal route planning, but for now OpenCPN is much more powerful. I prefer the precision of clicking a mouse on a screen, and not sure I will get to like tapping on a screen with my finger. Also, the more robust sailing in BVI caused more water in the cockpit than I was comfortable with the iPad. On my own boat on our protected river, my cockpit stays much drier, so I have a bracket to mount a netbook, which allows display of AIS targets onscreen using OpenCPN. Until there is an iPad app that displays real-time AIS targets from my boat's NMEA data, the iPad will be of secondary use.


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## fallard (Nov 30, 2009)

TakeFive said:


> Prior to leaving, I also borrowed a Bluechart SD card for the area and loaded into my Oregon 400c (thanks Frank!), which proved to be extremely useful. I quickly fell into my normal routine of plotting the next day's planned route on my laptop in the cabin (using OpenCPN with the NGA charts that I had calibrated for digital use), then using MapSource to transfer the routes to my Oregon for use in the cockpit. I installed the Oregon handlebar mount at the starboard wheel so I had the route available in the cockpit at all times.
> 
> I need to say that I consider the availability of pre-plotted routes to be a critical safety item when navigating unfamiliar waters. No matter how good your ded recking skills may be, when you look out along the hazy horizon in a place like BVI, it is impossible to tell whether a certain feature in the distance is a cove, a bay, or a cut between islands.
> 
> Also, the more robust sailing in BVI caused more water in the cockpit than I was comfortable with the iPad.


The last statement of the quote (which I've condensed) is why I would not consider a non-marinized chartplotter for my helm. Anything will work when the seas are calm and it's not raining. But when that squall comes along while you are in tight quarters, you want something in the cockpit that is rugged and waterproof.

When you are going on a charter, you don't necessarily end up with the installed equipment you'd like to have. Bringing your own portable equipment with preplanned routes will surely add to your peace of mind when you are away from home waters, but you want something that can stay with you at the helm when the going gets tough.

I also have a Garmin Oregon and have used it in the Virgins as my primary piece of navigation gear. However, I programmed the routes (primary and alternates) directly on the Oregon before leaving home, after consulting the guides and my own waterproof charts. Programming your routes on the device you'll have at the helm will minimize confusion when it matters. The only other electronics I bring on a charter is a cell phone.

BTW, I bring my own waterproof charts--typically Imray-Iolare--on Caribbean charters and rely on them to keep the small Garmin screen in context. They are also a familiar backup for dead reckoning, should the batteries run out or the electronics fail. I also bring detailed chartlets for certain areas, like the approach to Anegada or Christiansted (St. Croix) to augment the larger charts when necessary.


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

For those worried about getting their Ipad wet, these are very inexpensive and you retain fully capabilities of the Ipad touch screen. It doesn't even seem to know it is inside the thing.

There is even a lanyard, if you want to hang it around your neck, but I think its better for securing it to the cockpit table. I have one of these:

Amazon.com: New Version TrendyDigital WaterGuard Waterproof Case, Waterproof Cover for Apple iPad, iPad 2 and New iPad (iPad 3), Blue: Computers & [email protected]@[email protected]@http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/[email protected]@[email protected]@41r8XXcDLcL


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## Robes (May 24, 2012)

TakeFive said:


> OK, I finally pried the iPad from my wife's clenched fingers. :laugher Here area few questions for those of you who may have used it in BVI:
> 
> 
> there's the concern about accuracy in BVI, as I illustrated with my Oregon above. Does anyone have experience with Garmin's US coastal accuracy in the BVI region for these downloadable charts? Is the $45 North America coverage any more accurate in BVI?
> ...


_*From Fallaed: "For the peanut gallery:

The Garmin BlueChart for the US is fantastic in the Oregon or similar Garmin handheld chartplotter range (higher resolution/pixel count than the lower end Garmins, but you pay for that, of course.) However the US coverage extends to the BVI, but without the same resolution as in the continental US.

The BlueChart for the Southeast Caribbean fixes that. It provides detail in the Virgins that is comparable to that of the US chip in the continental US. Once again, you pay for that."*_

I'm confused, I'm headed for BVI 1st of April & looking to buy a 78SC (loaded with HUSO39R,U.S. Coastal BlueChart g2).Garmins website shows the coastal maps extending to BVI- but your saying this is actually wrong or that, specifically the detail is lost just in the BVI on this g2 map?
Also, I don't see any North American BlueChart g2 offered, let alone for $45, where is this coming from? I see the Bluechart HUSO30R SE Caribbean offered for a small $160 fee.

So, I found a 78SC (pre loaded u.s.coastal) for $349 and the SE Caribbean BlueChart g2 used for $46. If the coastal actually don't cover BVI, think this is my option?
Any problem buying a used microSD? Need any codes? can I update it?

Thanks for any info on this-
Robes


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## TakeFive (Oct 22, 2009)

Robes said:


> _*From Fallaed: "For the peanut gallery:
> 
> The Garmin BlueChart for the US is fantastic in the Oregon or similar Garmin handheld chartplotter range (higher resolution/pixel count than the lower end Garmins, but you pay for that, of course.) However the US coverage extends to the BVI, but without the same resolution as in the continental US.
> 
> ...


There are multiple Garmin products that you are referencing.

My comment about the $45 North America chart was referring to the Garmin product that I downloaded into the Garmin's Bluechart software for the iPad. If you already have an iPad available, that's a pretty good price for all of North America!

Fallaed's comment was referring to Garmin's microSD card for the SE Caribbean, which appears to be the same product you are considering purchasing used for $46.

My Oregon 400c came pre-loaded with US coastal charts. Although it displays charts for USVI and BVI, I discovered in prior visits to USVI that they (and NOAA's chart #25641) are very inaccurate in that region, and may cause you to run aground. I suspect that the pre-loaded US Coastal charts in the 78SC will suffer the same flaw. So you really should purchase the SE Caribbean card, which in my experience (last week, and comparing tracks from prior trips) is very accurate.

I think I saw the same $46 card you did on Amazon marketplace and got cold feet because some buyers' comments questioned the authenticity of some of the seller's products. Although the cards are $160 direct from Garmin, I believe that I also saw the new cards direct from Amazon (not a markeplace seller) for $100. That may be a fair price for a product that Amazon guarantees to be genuine.

Garmin uses a very clever encryption method that will prevent you (or an unscrupulous seller on ebay or Amazon marketplace) from successfully using a copied product. The real danger is that you might not get any warning that it's not genuine - your GPS might just show the embedded chart without warning.

In my case I was leaving in less than a week and did not have time to experiment with a $46 card that might not be genuine. If you're not leaving until April, you might have time to give it a try. If so, please let us know, since I might want to buy the same $46 card for myself if it is genuine.


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## Robes (May 24, 2012)

Thanks for the reply TakeFive-

Well, I'm not too sure what to do here. I'm new to the GPS and all the electronic nav software/hardware & accessories. I have only used paper charts to date in the Chesapeake Bay. It's mind blowing all the devises, software etc to try and sift through it all. I thought I had come to the best decision, the 78SC until I learned the preloaded maps for the BVI are not to par with the remaining chart.

I plan to buy a boat in the next couple years and want something that can be used as backup on that, hate to make a poor choice here. Also, my wife has the new iPad but I don't use it (she lives in it!), I don't see it as being a fitting devise to use in the cockpit, I did look into some aspects of it but always seem to think the 78 series is a safer better choice for now....

Anyway, I don't know enough about all this let alone test the Amazon Caribbean SD card myself, I would have to leave that to someone else. I reviewed the sellers feedback and can't honestly find a single comment not praising the cards. Although, I assume they can't be updated if they are indeed copies, then again they say they are the most current version.

What is your opinion:
I go with the preloaded 78SC map, I also have the Imray-IoIaire A23 chart for USVI & St. Croix "Eastern Caribbean" includes BVI & Anagada. I also have the BVIPirate.com Anagada Approach chart which is excellent from what I read & hear. I have passage granted to Anagada by Conch Charters.

I'm tempted to think I have enough nav aids, need to use the eyes and brain too. Yet, I'm very tempted to buy the Amazon SE Caribbean card for the price but maybe safest to use the preloaded coastal charts for now?.....

Thanks again for any comments suggestions
Robes


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## TakeFive (Oct 22, 2009)

Before I give you a recommendation, do you have a smartphone? There may be some other smartphone options that could get you going for very little money, especially on an Android phone.


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## Robes (May 24, 2012)

TakeFive said:


> Before I give you a recommendation, do you have a smartphone? There may be some other smartphone options that could get you going for very little money, especially on an Android phone.


Yes, my wife & I each have an iPhone 5. But, from what I've read it seems the problem there is the expense of using the phone in that location as well as area of connectivity. I read at least 1 horror story of a person coming back from BVI to find an astronomical phone bill which at the time he had no idea how he was being charged. ?


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## TakeFive (Oct 22, 2009)

Robes said:


> Yes, my wife & I each have an iPhone 5. But, from what I've read it seems the problem there is the expense of using the phone in that location as well as area of connectivity. I read at least 1 horror story of a person coming back from BVI to find an astronomical phone bill which at the time he had no idea how he was being charged. ?


The Garmin iPhone/iPad apps can all save charts and ActiveCaptain data locally, so you can use them offline with no mobile data access. Just be sure to turn off the appropriate settings on your device to prevent roaming charges - or just remove the SIM chip. However, you would need to pay for the charts for the Garmin app.

There are other free/almost free options for Android (Marine Navigator app with free RNC charts), but since you don't have that it's not available to you.

I like the touchpad Garmin devices (Oregon and similar) a lot better than the 76/78 series. That's my personal opinion.

I suggest that you download the free Garmin Bluechart app into both your iPhone and iPad, then download the free ActiveCaptain data. If you like what you see, your most economical option would be to buy the $45 North America charts, and find a way to waterproof your device for use in the cockpit. $45 is pretty reasonable for a handheld/tablet GPS with full North American coverage.

If you have your heart set on the Garmin 78, you might consider buying the plain 78 version without embedded charts for $210 less than the 78SC, and adding regional chips as you need them. The nice thing about the Garmin devices is that you can plot routes on a large-screen computer (using OpenCPN, PolarNavy, MapTech, etc.) and easily transfer the routes and tracks between the computer and the device. That fits the way I work, but YMMV.


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## Robes (May 24, 2012)

Thanks TakeFive-

I will try those downloads for the iPhone & iPad, but don't I need a gps devise? Can I set waypoints and chart courses without some handheld marine gps?

It seems you do what I thought I'd do, plot things out ahead of time on my iMac and load to the gps(78). So, does the gps system in the iPhone (guess there is one in the iPad too) do what a handheld will do? sensitive enough, WAAS?

Guess I'm under the impression that the phone/iPad can't work alone or you can make changes en route. Time to do those downloads and see what it's all about, thanks- 
Robes


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## TakeFive (Oct 22, 2009)

TakeFive said:


> ...The 400c has charts already built in for the Caribbean, but they are very inaccurate (I'll demonstrate this below). I've debated buying a microSD upgrade from Garmin, but I have no idea whether it's any more accurate than what I already have. The inaccuracy is far worse than could be accounted for by the 3-year age of their chart. Why would Garmin intentionally put a grossly inaccurate survey into this device if they had better charts to provide on the chip? It just does not make sense, and as a result I'm not gonna buy a chip to find out. (I've heard that Garmin are absolute [email protected]%&$ about refunds.)
> 
> Here's how I did an informal test of the chart accuracy in the BVI:
> 
> ...





TakeFive said:


> I'm not sure why I didn't think of this last night, but by overlaying my track onto Google Earth I can provide conclusive proof that the track is accurate and that the NGA chart's representation of the shoreline is by far the best of the three (Garmin, NOAA, NGA):
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I forgot to update this thread after returning from BVI, but while there I made constant use of the 400c handheld with a borrowed Garmin chip for the Eastern Carribean. It was spot on - equal in accuracy to the NGA charts. Here's the example track shown above, but laid over top of the chart from the Garmin chip:








The good agreement between the NGA chart and the Garmin add-on card make the two a great combination. I plotted routes on my computer using the NGA chart, and transferred them to the 400c for use in the cockpit.


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

I've unwittingly downloaded a ridiculous collection of iPad nav apps, based on all the references above. 

From my living room, it looks like Garmin has the edge so far. I will report back, as I can.

Flights look on time so far this morning, we leave in an hour. Hoping to get out ahead of this storm. Cheers!!


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## seaojoe (May 4, 2002)

good luck and please let us know the outcome.
smilin for ya!


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

Delayed at connection. Ugh.


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## capecodda (Oct 6, 2009)

Navionics Caribbean. Last trip in the BVI's it worked fine on both iPad and iPhone. 

Wish I was going there right now rather than sitting out snowmaggeddon.


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

Made it. Aboard right now. No idea what is going on in New England and don't tell me.


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

Nav App wrap up..... (I will start another thread on the trip itself, we are currently in St Thomas waiting for our flight home today)

I downloaded Garmin Bluechart, iSailor, Imray and iNautical. Some are only charts with no nav abilities.

The clear winner was Garmin. Showed us in our correct slip prior departure and was very accurate along the way. However, it did show us over the shoal at the entrance to Nanny Cay, despite being well within the channel markers. If we corrected to avoid what it thought was the shoal, we would still have been fine.

I didn't really need or want sophisticated nav ability, but it is nice to quickly determine distance to destination and I found tapping a route on the screen to take a second or two. Once I had the distance, I would immediately delete the route to get the clutter off the screen. I used the Ipad in its waterproof case only once. As it turned out, for just getting distances, it was perfectly useful on my iPhone, which I just kept in my pocket. It was a bit nerve wracking that I might fumble it and watch it go overboard, but thankfully it didn't happen.

I also wanted an app with the Active Captain database, but found the reviews and postings for BVI to be fairly limited. When I get a chance, I'm going to add several of my own.


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## Robes (May 24, 2012)

Thanks for the update Minnewaska.
I just purchased the Garmin BluChart g2 HXUS030R SE Caribbean for my new Oregon 450 GPS. Also bringing my Imray A23, A233(A231 & A232 back to back) and my BVIPirate.com Anagada Approach Chart. I have the Garmin HomePort marine planning software too, so i should be more then ready for my early April trip.

Let us know on this thread where you start your new thread.....


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## TakeFive (Oct 22, 2009)

Robes said:


> Thanks for the update Minnewaska.
> I just purchased the Garmin BluChart g2 HXUS030R SE Caribbean for my new Oregon 450 GPS....I have the Garmin HomePort marine planning software too, so i should be more then ready for my early April trip.


I currently have Garmin's obsolete MapSource software, and am considering getting HomePort. Can HomePort display the charts off your BlueChart SD card? (MapSource cannot.) That would be a huge plus for the HomePort software if it could.

If so (and Garmin's website claims it can do this), how it it done? Do you have to pull the microSD card out of the Oregon and put it into a reader on your computer? Or can you hook the Oregon to your computer by a USB cable instead?

IIRC, MapSource is supposed to be able to do this too, but apparently it only works for BlueChart cards in full chartplotters, not in handhelds like the Oregon. So I'm curious whether the HomePort software has this same flaw, or whether it actually works with handhelds.


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## fallard (Nov 30, 2009)

Minnewaska said:


> Nav App wrap up.....
> It was a bit nerve wracking that I might fumble it and watch it go overboard, but thankfully it didn't happen.


Robes' Oregon 450 is waterproof, but I bet it will sink like a rock if it goes overboard (I've got one.) I was comfortable parking mine in a drink holder, but TakeFive suggested a handlebar clamp that Garmin offers if you are concerned about losing it. If your charter boat has one of these open transoms, you might consider a clamp or tether as cheap insurance.


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## TakeFive (Oct 22, 2009)

fallard said:


> Robes' Oregon 450 is waterproof, but I bet it will sink like a rock if it goes overboard (I've got one.) I was comfortable parking mine in a drink holder, but TakeFive suggested a handlebar clamp that Garmin offers if you are concerned about losing it. If your charter boat has one of these open transoms, you might consider a clamp or tether as cheap insurance.


The handlebar mount can be found for $8-10 and is cheap insurance that puts the handheld in clear view. A drink holder might work like Frank mentioned, but you just won't know that until you get down there.

Believe it or not, my Oregon became my primary nav device at the helm during my BVI charter. The boat had a big Raymarine chartplotter, but I had no way to transfer routes or waypoints into it from my computer. I turned the boat's chartplotter on and set it to "course up" mode and keep the "own ship" icon in the middle of the screen, and from that point on I merely used it to get a broad view of the area. Any critical decisions about where to change course or cut between islands was done by following the purple line on the Oregon (using routes that I had pre-planned on my computer using OpenCPN and the NGA charts that I had calibrated for use with OpenCPN).

Based on Robes' comment about HomePort, I looked up some detailed specs for the software, as well as user support messages, and it looks like even though the Oregon is not listed on Garmin's webpage as a compatible device, a recent software update allows HomePort to pull the preloaded charts out of my Oregon 400c. Since I therefore already have the charts to make it work, I sprung the $27 for the software from Amazon. I'm looking forward to trying it out.


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## Robes (May 24, 2012)

TakeFive said:


> I currently have Garmin's obsolete MapSource software, and am considering getting HomePort. Can HomePort display the charts off your BlueChart SD card? (MapSource cannot.) That would be a huge plus for the HomePort software if it could.
> 
> If so (and Garmin's website claims it can do this), how it it done? Do you have to pull the microSD card out of the Oregon and put it into a reader on your computer? Or can you hook the Oregon to your computer by a USB cable instead?


 Hello TakeFive. Sorry, but I'm not able to help you with those questions yet. I just got the batteries charged for the Oregon and don't believe I'll be able to load the new software etc. for another week to play with it, got to finish some remodeling first but will get back-


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

Robes said:


> ... Let us know on this thread where you start your new thread.....


Here you go.

http://www.sailnet.com/forums/general-discussion-sailing-related/96718-bvi-recap.html


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

fallard said:


> .....I was comfortable parking mine in a drink holder......


Can you believe the Bavaria 36 had no cup holders of any kind. I laughed at myself that I found that difficult, but I did !!


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## TakeFive (Oct 22, 2009)

TakeFive said:


> ...Based on Robes' comment about HomePort, I looked up some detailed specs for the software, as well as user support messages, and it looks like even though the Oregon is not listed on Garmin's webpage as a compatible device, a recent software update allows HomePort to pull the preloaded charts out of my Oregon 400c. Since I therefore already have the charts to make it work, I sprung the $27 for the software from Amazon. I'm looking forward to trying it out.


The HomePort software arrived tonight. I spent some time trying it out. I'm not sure it will ever replace OpenCPN as my favorite software to plan routes (since I prefer seeing NOAA charts on my computer screen), it has some definitely useful features as well as some of those odd quirks that remind you that it's Garmin software. The best feature is to be able to see the exact same Garmin cartography that you have on your chartplotter/handheld GPS on your computer screen. It did pull the charts through USB off my Oregon 400c, which took a LONG time. When I disconnect the Oregon the charts disappear, but upon reconnecting the Oregon they reappear instantaneously, so clearly the software is caching the images locally and using the required hardware connection as "copy protection."

I'll post some more detailed comments when I get a chance, including some comments on how you can run the software at home without bringing the handheld/chartplotter home from your boat.


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## chef2sail (Nov 27, 2007)

TakeFive said:


> The HomePort software arrived tonight. I spent some time trying it out. I'm not sure it will ever replace OpenCPN as my favorite software to plan routes (since I prefer seeing NOAA charts on my computer screen), it has some definitely useful features as well as some of those odd quirks that remind you that it's Garmin software. The best feature is to be able to see the exact same Garmin cartography that you have on your chartplotter/handheld GPS on your computer screen. It did pull the charts through USB off my Oregon 400c, which took a LONG time. When I disconnect the Oregon the charts disappear, but upon reconnecting the Oregon they reappear instantaneously, so clearly the software is caching the images locally and using the required hardware connection as "copy protection."
> 
> I'll post some more detailed comments when I get a chance, including some comments on how you can run the software at home without bringing the handheld/chartplotter home from your boat.


Is there some advantage to the Open CPN technology or way of doing things vs say and I pad and an E7 chatrtplotter.

I am totally ignorant about what you guys are talking about. Should I be looking into this or is this something to do if you dont have a chartplotter

Can you help educate me.


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## fallard (Nov 30, 2009)

The typical dinghy on charters is a hard bottom inflatable, which weighs about 150 lbs. Add a 2-stroke, 8 hp motor and gas and you are pushing 250 lbs. You'd need a winch to haul this aboard and then you'd risk cosmetic damage to the foredeck. 

It isn't worth the hassle and, besides, you aren't sailing that far. Best advice is to relax and tow it.


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

chef2sail said:


> Is there some advantage to the Open CPN technology or way of doing things vs say and I pad and an E7 chatrtplotter......


I've tried OpenCPN and found it very cumbersome. In my experience, it seems to be more attractive to technically interested users. You can play with all sorts of techie things. I assume there is some satisfaction in getting to work. I'm in the point and shoot crowd and highly prefer the Ipad apps. OpenCPN is free, of course.


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## TakeFive (Oct 22, 2009)

chef2sail said:


> Is there some advantage to the Open CPN technology or way of doing things vs say and I pad and an E7 chatrtplotter.
> 
> I am totally ignorant about what you guys are talking about. Should I be looking into this or is this something to do if you dont have a chartplotter
> 
> Can you help educate me.


Dave,

For a guy like you who has been sailing for 40+ years, you probably have all the routes you need already in your E7 and don't need to do anything more. You might not even need routes because of your wealth of local knowledge.

For those of us who are still going places for the first time, and who may have to deal with significant tidal currents, computer planning tools can be useful. Just as Raymarine software is useful for moving routes and tracks back and forth between a computer and Raymarine chartplotter, Garmin software is useful for doing that with Garmin devices.

OpenCPN is very compatible with Garmin devices (less so with Raymarine). I hear these complaints about it being cumbersome, and I just don't get it. Judging by posts to the OpenCPN forum on CruisersForum, many of the complaints are from people who can't seem to figure out how to get the charts to load (not sure if this applies to Minniewaska, or if he had a different complaint). If you go in knowing that you're going to have a folder that contains all your (freely downloadable) NOAA charts, and that you're going to have to tell the program (whether it's OpenCPN, SeaClear, or something else) where those charts are located, then the concept is very simple - especially since you only need to do this once when you first set up the program. In fact, it's a good thing, because you can have one folder that has all your updated charts, and multiple programs (OpenCPN, SeaClear, PolarNavy, etc.) accessing the same charts. It actually makes maintenance and updating of the charts easier.

I find the OpenCPN user interface to be very simple and intuitive. Others may not. But it has amazing capabilities for a free program, and I can use the best, most up to date charts all the time by simply downloading them from the NOAA website.

I've tried a couple of paid programs before, and I found them to be more cumbersome than OpenCPN. They may have some greater capabilities than OpenCPN, but it comes at the cost of greater complexity, and some of them require you to buy their proprietary charts.

YMMV

Also, I have the Garmin Bluechart app on the iPad, and although it has some potential, it can only send/receive routes to Garmin chartplotters via the Garmin network device. Since I don't have a Garmin chartplotter (just the Oregon handheld GPS), this is a pretty severe limitation. For me, the iPad app can only work as a standalone device, and I don't really want the iPad to be in the cockpit with me at this point. Maybe someday I'll change my mind.


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

Setting up the chart download was one of the things that was cumbersome. I got it done, but it wasn't a snap. I had to read some tips and instructions, as it didn't just work the first time. The second was getting the GPS dongle that I added to my tablet computer to interface. I may have given up on that. It been a while. I bought the iPad in the spring of 2011 and never looked back. I was actually a very reluctant iPad purchaser, but felt it was a better back up than a standalone GPS. I was immediately blown away by the functionality and ease of use.

iPad apps like Charts and Tides and the Garmin app just work out the box or actually prompt you for chart input. Didn't have to figure a single thing out. For $25-$50, I would rather have the hour or two of my life back.

I occasionally set up a route on my charplotter, mostly if there is a danger side of the route and I want to be able to glance at my relative position. More often, I just drop a destination waypoint on the fly to calc my remaining distance for some mental arrival math.

In the aircraft, we always load a flight plan and follow it to the letter. No choice. It seems much less an issue when tacking and jibing take you off the route anyway. Since I don't often set them up at all, interfacing isn't a consideration for me.


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## TakeFive (Oct 22, 2009)

I had only a few minutes last night to try things out again. I actually spent most of the time using Garmin's iPad app to try to remember why I did not really get to like it when we were in BVI. I already mentioned that the routes and tracks can't be shared with any other devices unless you buy one of the Garmin chartplotters and their Garmin Network device. But I was also very unhappy with the poor accuracy of using a finger to plot routes. Their waypoint circle icons were way too big and were the width of the whole Delaware River! If I zoom in enough to see whether the waypoint is in the channel or on shore  , then I can't see enough length of the river to do much of a route.

Obviously most of my plotting is going to be in more open waters, but I used this as an example of the problems with the program. I just prefer to use a mouse to plot routes because it is much more precise (down to the pixel) and using OpenCPN (or even HomePort) it is very easy to adjust the location of a waypoint if you're not happy with where you clicked.

If I had not purchased a Garmin Oregon 400c three years ago, I might be tempted to use the iPad instead (although the Oregon is fully waterproof, a big advantage in the cockpit). The Oregon is even worse than iPad for plotting routes because of its small screen and low resolution of tapping with your finger (same problem as iPad). But I don't even try to create routes on the Oregon - I just create routes on my computer and transfer them to the Oregon. Unfortunately that option is not possible with the iPad using the Garmin software. Maybe it is possible with other programs.

I can understand the attractiveness of using the iPad's touch features, and its intuitive ease of use. I just want the greater precision of using a mouse to create routes. Hopefully some better software will appear on Android tablets, since they give you the choice of tapping with your finger or plugging a mouse into the USB port. There you can have the best of both worlds. (Very dumb of Apple to leave a USB port off their iPads.)


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## chef2sail (Nov 27, 2007)

TakeFive said:


> Dave,
> 
> For a guy like you who has been sailing for 40+ years, you probably have all the routes you need already in your E7 and don't need to do anything more. You might not even need routes because of your wealth of local knowledge.
> 
> ...


Despie the many uyears I alwasy use my charts and love the simplicity of the elctronic advantages brought into the new millenium

Easier to find currents and tides on the Iapd or ploteer than looking through Eldridge although I keep it too

I always keep Jons caveats in my forebrain about being to hooked into electronic nirvana.


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## chef2sail (Nov 27, 2007)

Minnewaska said:


> Setting up the chart download was one of the things that was cumbersome. I got it done, but it wasn't a snap. I had to read some tips and instructions, as it didn't just work the first time. The second was getting the GPS dongle that I added to my tablet computer to interface. I may have given up on that. It been a while. I bought the iPad in the spring of 2011 and never looked back. I was actually a very reluctant iPad purchaser, but felt it was a better back up than a standalone GPS. I was immediately blown away by the functionality and ease of use.
> 
> iPad apps like Charts and Tides and the Garmin app just work out the box or actually prompt you for chart input. Didn't have to figure a single thing out. For $25-$50, I would rather have the hour or two of my life back.
> 
> ...


Sounds like how I use my IPad and Chartplotter, Plotting routes to me is easier on the IPad.


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

TakeFive,

I had the same initial experience with the Garmin app waypoint icon. The ability to tap on Charts and Tides seemed much more granular. Then I realized that I should just get in the area of my desired waypoint and zoom in before setting the waypoint. Worked much better. However, I was only looking for distance to the entrance of a harbor than really trying to create a real route.


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## TakeFive (Oct 22, 2009)

Minnewaska said:


> TakeFive,
> 
> I had the same initial experience with the Garmin app waypoint icon. The ability to tap on Charts and Tides seemed much more granular. Then I realized that I should just get in the area of my desired waypoint and zoom in before setting the waypoint. Worked much better. However, I was only looking for distance to the entrance of a harbor than really trying to create a real route.


I can see how if you are just setting a single waypoint, zooming way in to get better precision is no problem. But for a route consisting of 20-40 waypoints (as you often have to do on a river), that is hopelessly cumbersome.

Just goes to show you that how you use these things can make all the difference in which one you prefer.


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## TakeFive (Oct 22, 2009)

fallard said:


> Robes' Oregon 450 is waterproof, but I bet it will sink like a rock if it goes overboard (I've got one.) I was comfortable parking mine in a drink holder, but TakeFive suggested a handlebar clamp that Garmin offers if you are concerned about losing it. If your charter boat has one of these open transoms, you might consider a clamp or tether as cheap insurance.


The $9 handlebar clamp keeps prevents falling overboard by keeping the handheld firmly attached.

When it's out of the holder, I keep it in this clunkly cell phone holder from Home Depot. It just happens to be a perfect fit for the clunky GPS (click the pic for a link to Home Depot's listing):

​I attach a couple floats (and my waste tank opener key) to the carabiner, so if it falls overboard it won't sink.

So the only time there's true risk of it sinking is when transferring it from the pouch to the handlebar mount. And that only happens in the slip, where the water's always calm.


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## Robes (May 24, 2012)

Hi Everyone-

So, I have my new Oregon loaded with the most up to date SE Caribbean BlueChart g2 HXUS030R (from Landfall). I will make my preliminary route on my home computer using HomePort and download that to the Oregon.

I have the new iPad, with GPS, and plan to download the BlueChart Mobile App and Active Captain.

I don't want to buy the Garmin Wi-Fi Adaptor kit (Don't think it would work with the Oregon anyhow). Therefore, it is my understanding that I will not be able to use my g2 HXUS030R micr SD chip in any way to get those maps into the iPad & that I will have to buy the Garmin North American BlueChart map (not U.S. Coastal because it doesn't include Caribbean) through the app "settings" once downloaded. Is this correct?

I don't know if the North American iPad BlueChart is as detailed in the Caribbean as the HXUS030R chip (I assume not) but when I talked with Garmin reps they told me the HXUS030R was the only detailed coverage (more detailed then preloaded or other BlueChart sd cards that included the Caribbean) to include the Virgins, Leewards etc. At the time when I talked to Garmin we never talked iPad.

My intention is to use the iPad in the cabin for the crew to follow and for that reason don't need more detail there. Yet, I guess I could (using the more inaccurate method of touch screen selection) roughly chart the same route on the iPad so people know where we are traveling. And, to be sure and turn off any roaming settings.

TIA
Robes


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## TakeFive (Oct 22, 2009)

Robes said:


> Hi Everyone-
> 
> So, I have my new Oregon loaded with the most up to date SE Caribbean BlueChart g2 HXUS030R (from Landfall). I will make my preliminary route on my home computer using HomePort and download that to the Oregon.
> 
> ...


That is correct, as I understand it, and based on my experience.

When you plug in your Oregon to your computer for the first time, the HomePort software will take a LONG time to read the charts. But in my experience, this delay will only be the first time. It seems to cache most of the charts onto your hard drive, in a very large folder called "Tiles." After that, you'll see the charts almost instantaneously as soon as you plug in the Oregon. But you will have to plug in the Oregon (or something else - see next paragraph) as validation. Note that I said "charts." If you have the SE Caribbean g2 chip in your Oregon, you should get a drop-down box in the upper left corner that allows you to select either the Oregon's embedded chart or the HXUS030R chart. If you draw a few shoreline-hugging routes in the BVI and switch between the two charts, you will see how inaccurate the embedded charts are for that area. What's even more shocking is the embedded charts are also very inaccurate for St. Thomas and St. John. I figured that since they are part of the US, that the NOAA surveys (upon which Garmin's charts are based, IMO) would be more recent and accurate. Not true. But the HXUS030R chip does appear to be much more accurate there.

Now for the "or something else" part: You can view the HXUS030R microSD chop by inserting the SD adapter into a card reader without the Oregon. If you would like to view the charts at home while the Oregon and HXUS030R are on your boat, you can actually copy the .img files onto another microSD card. If you copy both the embedded chart and the HXUS030R chart onto the microSD card and insert the card into your computer, you will once again get a dropdown menu in HomePort that will have both charts.

One interesting thing I noticed is that if you copy the Oregon's entire directory structure onto the microSD card, the program actually thinks that you have the Oregon plugged into the computer, even though you're just working with a microSD image of the Oregon. I suggest that you not do this, because the program will continuously nag you to update your "Oregon."

Note that Garmin uses a pretty sophisticated encryption scheme to make sure copied microSD cards do not work in the Oregon (or any other devices). Only the original chip will work in any Garmin devices. But HomePort does not appear to check the lock codes, so the copied microSD card (and embedded charts from the Oregon) will work with the software, even though it does not work in a device.



Robes said:


> ...I don't know if the North American iPad BlueChart is as detailed in the Caribbean as the HXUS030R chip (I assume not) but when I talked with Garmin reps they told me the HXUS030R was the only detailed coverage (more detailed then preloaded or other BlueChart sd cards that included the Caribbean) to include the Virgins, Leewards etc. At the time when I talked to Garmin we never talked iPad....


I think the iPad downloaded charts are pretty detailed. But I did not get a chance to really test it out thoroughly. And I've returned the borrowed HXUS030R chip, so I can't do a side-by-side comparison. Maybe you could, and report back here so we can all benefit.


Robes said:


> ...And, to be sure and turn off any roaming settings.


One way to make sure not to incur charges might be to remove the SIM card from the iPad. You might also consider buying a BVI-capable Lime card for while you are down there. Mr. Simcard sells them online. I have no experience with them to indicate whether their service is good.


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## Robes (May 24, 2012)

Hello-

I think I'm confusing myself....

When I plot a route on HomePort do I want to set HomePorts preference 's for "HEADING" as Automatic Magnetic Variation rather then True?

With HomePort set to Auto. Mag. Var., and a route plotted then downloaded to my Oregon 450 (which its "HEADING"- North Reference, is set to Magnetic) won't the compass Heading & Bearing be correct as seen in the dashboard data fields of the 450?
I'm thinking the above is the correct set-up?

If I set the HomePort "Heading" to True North and the GPS Heading to True I would then have to know the bearing in Magnetic to use the GPS or boats compass to correctly head to the destination correct?

After my waypoints, routes are set-up in HomePort I don't see that a magnetic bearing is saved anywhere to access on the 450...

Actually, I thought Lat/Lon coordinates were independent of True/Mag variation. If so, then any setting in HomePort would suffice if using the Oregon set to Magnetic? 

I'm assuming that setting the Oregon to True, then the compass points to True North(internally corrects). Setting it to Magnetic then the Oregon points to magnetic North as a real compass?

Thanks-


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## fallard (Nov 30, 2009)

Robes said:


> I'm assuming that setting the Oregon to True, then the compass points to True North(internally corrects). Setting it to Magnetic then the Oregon points to magnetic North as a real compass?


I'va also got an Oregon 450. You select "true up" or "track up" for your Map under the "Map" category in the "Setup" menu. You select "True", "Magnetic", "Grid", or "Other" under the "Heading category in the "Setup " menu. In other words, the setup for your 450 compass is separate from the setup for your 450 map display (which does not have a "Magnetic up" option).

Quite a few years ago, I set up my installed chartplotter to "magnetic up" to keep it oriented in a manner consistent with my lliquid-filled pedestal compass. I thought it would be more intuitive that way. However, the chart display in magnetic mode tilted the legends in a staircase fashion, making the legends harder to read. After a while, i went back to the chartplotter being true north up and have kept it there ever since. I use this same system on my Oregon 450. The map is true north up and the compass is magnetic.

One reason I keep the chartplotter and the Oregon maps in true north up mode is that they are easier to relate to my paper charts. I keep the 450 compass in magnetic mode because it is easier to relate to my pedestal compass. One thought is that I don't want to confuse myself if I lose my electronics and fall back to old fashioned paper charts and old fashioned compass mode.


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## TakeFive (Oct 22, 2009)

Robes said:


> ...With HomePort set to Auto. Mag. Var., and a route plotted then downloaded to my Oregon 450 (which its "HEADING"- North Reference, is set to Magnetic) won't the compass Heading & Bearing be correct as seen in the dashboard data fields of the 450?..


How did you download routes from the iPad to the Oregon? I wasn't able to figure that out, and assumed that function was not supported unless you had a Garmin marine network interfaced with a full-fledged Garmin chartplotter.


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## Robes (May 24, 2012)

fallard said:


> In other words, the setup for your 450 compass is separate from the setup for your 450 map display (which does not have a "Magnetic up" option).


 Thanks, the map & compass separate-that's what had me confused, I didn't realize what I was setting here. Then I held the GPS very still and changed between True & Magnetic and sure enough two different readings, had it in my head the compass don't read True, but this reads both.

I don't believe setting HomePort to either True or Mag makes a difference once the waypoints are loaded to the Oregon correct?


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## Robes (May 24, 2012)

TakeFive said:


> How did you download routes from the iPad to the Oregon? I wasn't able to figure that out, and assumed that function was not supported unless you had a Garmin marine network interfaced with a full-fledged Garmin chartplotter.


 I'm using my iMac not an iPad. I'm going to download the BC g2 Mobile, Active Captain & North American charts for the iPad tonight and play with that. Sure with I could somehow load my SE Caribbean micro SD chart I bought for the Oregon into the iPad but don't believe that's possible.


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## TakeFive (Oct 22, 2009)

Robes said:


> I'm using my iMac not an iPad. I'm going to download the BC g2 Mobile, Active Captain & North American charts for the iPad tonight and play with that. Sure with I could somehow load my SE Caribbean micro SD chart I bought for the Oregon into the iPad but don't believe that's possible.


Oh, sloppy reading on my part. You said HomePort, which makde it obvious that you were not talking about an iPad.


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## Robes (May 24, 2012)

Hey People, I'm leaving this Sunday for Tortolla...!

My first real charter, not counting my Chesapeake Bay charter. I got the GPS "Oregon" all loaded with daily routes and multiple alternative routes and anchorages for each of the 10 days. Got my Imray & BVIPirate Anagada approach charts.

Some final questions:
1) When we leave Anegada we will immediately head to the North Drop to fish, troll, while heading to JVD-Green Cay. I'm accounting for the current on the passage to Anegada from the North Sound near the horse shoe reef. Question, is there any appreciable current when sailing the North Drop from the western tip of Anegada to JVD?

2) I know I'll be briefed on this but want to be prepared. I found that Yacht Club Costa Smeralda claims to have a "first" pump out station in the BVI. This place is new? How do you return the boat if there is no place to pump out? Do you really pump out into those local waters? No 6 mile rule here?uke The boats have macerators etc? 

3) My Conch boat claims to have an inverter, in it's description. Yet I see elsewhere in the Conch website that you can rent inverters, so who knows what I got till I get there. Anyway, if I do have an inverter (I'll ask Conch specifics) I never used one, do you only use it while the engine is running to charge the boat batteries? Have to turn it on or just plug personal electronics chargers into outlets in boat when engine is running?

TIA
Robes


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

Robes said:


> ....all loaded with daily routes and multiple alternative routes and anchorages for each of the 10 days.


I hope you have a great time and I'm sure you will. As some of us have already said, you may be over planning this trip. You just can't bake in a fixed plan. Weather, sea condition, boat condition, your condition, all factor into what you will do from day to day. Go with it. Enjoy. Don't set an expectation for yourself that you will do everything you plan. It's a different pace down there. Forcing your entire itinerary could ruin your vacation. You may not get it all in. You'll love it anyway!



> ....Question, is there any appreciable current when sailing the North Drop from the western tip of Anegada to JVD?


Other than a few short cuts between islands, I've never found ocean current to be all that significant in BVI. Even at a short peak down SFDC, I think its barely a knot.



> .....How do you return the boat if there is no place to pump out? Do you really pump out into those local waters?


You are not supposed to dump in the harbors, but everyone dumps in all water outside the harbor. For all the rhetoric on how crowded it is there, its really very relative, there aren't many boats compared to popular US sailing grounds. Its just looks like there are in this remote place and there are many more than a decade ago.

Compared to the size of the ocean and its complete flushing by ocean current, there is no way that effluent dropped even 1/10th of a mile offshore, is polluting anything. There is more sealife putting waste into the water and carcasses dying and rotting, that you'll ever put in it.

I'm sure that will offend someone and I have no interest in the debate. The boats do have holding tanks that are usually gravity discharged, so you can sail as far off shore as you like. Return the boat with anything in the tank at all and you'll pay a fine for them to empty it, as they can't do so in the harbor.



> 3) .....if I do have an inverter (I'll ask Conch specifics) I never used one, do you only use it while the engine is running to charge the boat batteries? Have to turn it on or just plug personal electronics chargers into outlets in boat when engine is running?


If there is an invertor, it is likely to be one that runs a single 110v outlet and has its own on/off switch. When you flip the switch, it will convert 12v DC in your house bank to 110v AC at that outlet. For very minor draws, like charging a cell phone, you don't have to run the engine. But for anything of significance, like a toaster or hair dryer, you will be instructed to have the motor running so its alternator can replace charge to the house bank, as the invertor is draining it.

You will need to run your motor approx 3 hours per day anyway to keep the banks charged. Motor sailing counts, otherwise, 60 to 90 mins each morning and night are a ritual. You'll find it just as easy to use the invertor during those periods, if you have a use for it.

Have a great trip !!!!!!!


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## hallucination (Jan 11, 2013)

Inverters on Conch can be all over the place. there are the CIG-lighter-12v versions....all the way up to 3000+ inverters. some can charge a phone, some can dry your girls hair and toast bread mix margaritas in the blender!

remember that when not used, inverters have VERY high parasitic loads, turn off when not needed. 

running the engine, making sure the ALT is excited, will not cause you distress with the INV on. Leaving the INV on, and the engine OFF can cause all sorts of interesting discoveries.

Like...if you set an offset on your depth gauge...and it is "protected" by a 10 year old cr2013 battery, and your battery drop below 12v...bye bye offset...hello keel"

yes...lessonlearned....phuque!


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## Robes (May 24, 2012)

I have an Oregon 450 usage question.

Say I have a 5 point route for day 1. Lets say I want to jump into the route midway at point 3, skipping the 1st two waypoints of the route. Do I have to delete the 1st two waypoints, or when I get close to the 3rd point will the Oregon simply sense it's location and then resume to follow the remainder of the route?

I guess similarly, eg. a 7 point route. I start & complete the 1st two waypoints of the route but decide to skip a loop around an island (points 3 & 4), I want to go to point #5(and follow the route to completion) after reaching point #2. Can I start heading toward point #5 (would the Oregon see #5 when in close range to it & take you from there?) or do I have to delete points #3 & 4?

TIA


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## kellysails (Nov 1, 2008)

A couple of quick BVI factoids. I have been there numerous times, what an awesome place!

1. If you are going to do Anegada you should pick up Walker's Anegada chart. Very nice and extremely reliable.
http://shop.bvipirate.com/anegchart.html

2. Here is my trip report from 2010, that might help some:
BVIPirate - View topic - BVI trip report May 2010

So very incredibly envious, have a great time. It really is all line of sight nav. Don't fret, it is as easy as they come. Dang, I wish I was going. 

Freezing my ass in the PNW is getting quite old.


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## SteveInMD (May 11, 2007)

Robes said:


> Hey People, I'm leaving this Sunday for Tortolla...!
> 
> My first real charter, not counting my Chesapeake Bay charter. I got the GPS "Oregon" all loaded with daily routes and multiple alternative routes and anchorages for each of the 10 days. Got my Imray & BVIPirate Anagada approach charts.
> 
> ...


I was just there two weeks ago, on a boat from Conch.

Most places you stop will have shore facilities. Try to plan ahead and use them. Some boats have gravity drain waste tanks. The heads on those boats always pump through the tanks and out. You can close the dump seacocks when you are in a harbour, and then open them the next day when you are sailing once you are 1/2 mile from shore. (the rule there is 1/2 mile not 6) Not all boats are set up this way but they should be. Ask Conch about your boat.

I left my inverter and fridge on all week. The fridge was frosty and cell phones were charged. I ran the motor charging batteries 2 hours a day and we never dropped below 12 volts on the house batteries.

If you need a cab call Sebastians. Call ahead of your arrival and they will be waiting for you. They were much less than the other guys and very reliable.

Sent from my ADR6350 using Tapatalk 2


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## kellysails (Nov 1, 2008)

To be very straight on this topic:

The BVI is maybe the easiest (by far) place to sail. Anywhere in the US is far more challenging. Maybe, just maybe, the Adriadic side of Greece "might" be easier, but it is close. Certainly a sailors paradise. Really don't fret, simply enjoy and explore. Line of sight is standard nav method here. Someone very high up had sailors in mind when the BVI was created. And the good natured BVI government had the initiative to improved upon that. Hard to go wrong here. Anegada is slightly challenging but any overnight sail, say in the Puget Sound, is far more difficult. 

For God's sake, they even put 6 foot painters on all their mooring balls rather than the idiotic 2 inch diameter eye standard on all PNW balls. The Moore Secure company even tests/inspects each mooring ball every year in the BVI, yes, they do that. In the PNW I would never stay on a ball above 20kts. 

Enjoy, and don't fret. Too often too many people over think their adventure in the BVI. It is brain dead simple. I wish someone told me that on my first trip there long ago.


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## Robes (May 24, 2012)

Thank you all-

Great advise from everyone. 

And KELLYSAILS, awesome trip report, so close to what I have planned.., great read!

Thanks everyone, I maybe over planned but for that reason I'll be able to kick back, knowing all bases covered. I really appreciated all the feedback-

BVI... minus 1 day!!


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## kellysails (Nov 1, 2008)

Have fun! Sooooooooo envious. 

BTW - I always bring my own roll of duct tape, amazing what you can fix with duct tape. The idea here is to not involve the charter company on small fixes. It takes a lot of time for them to come out and meet you. I usually call them first to let them know what I am fixing. A cell phone will come with the boat.


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

Robes said:


> BVI... minus 1 day!!


How was the trip?.


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## Robes (May 24, 2012)

Minnewaska said:


> How was the trip?.


 I can't believe I never got back to comment on the trip... I put together a web page to tell the story, so if you'd like see: 2013 BRITISH VIRGIN ISLANDS


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## S/V BOB (Dec 28, 2014)

Pretty funny that folks consider $30 not cheap. Anyone remember else recall the days of buying $600 worth of paper charts?


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