# 1980 Cherubini Hunter 36 questions



## bmacfarquhar (Jan 12, 2010)

I have become interested in a 1980 Hunter 36 sloop. It actually looks pretty good - cockpit not too big - looks to be quite fast - not too heavy and elegant design. I am having trouble finding information on the boat and have a couple of questions:

1) I seem to read that this particular boat was better built than most Hunters at the time. Can anyone comment on how seaworthy they feel this boat is?

2) Is the hull solid or cored? If cored should I pass as its 30 years old? Does this boat have a reputation for hull deck joint issues?

3) Engine is down needs an expensive rebuild - can a 13,500 pound boat be repowered with a small economical outboard just for docking operations and sailed the rest of the time? What about sculling it?

4) Is this boat worthy of some cruising say to the Bahamas or is it a dock queen by nature? I understand a lot is the actual specimen itself and that properly equipped and outfitted most boats can do anything.

5) Is this boat reasonable for singlehanding? Again I understand the subjective nature of this question but am looking for peoples opinions...


----------



## eMKay (Aug 18, 2007)

1) All Cherubini Hunters were built basically the same, which is to say they were solidly built but also built to a price. The consensus is that the Cherubini Hunters were the best built Hunters. What I have noticed with my 27 is, there is a lot of decently put together stuff, and some areas that need improvement.

2) The hull is solid glass. The hull to deck joint is an L shaped aluminum toe rail, a layer of butyl tape, deck, another layer of butyl tape, and an inward turned flange, bolted every 4". It's likely the same in the 36 but not positive. I have not noticed leaks from mine, everything else leaks, but not the hull-deck joint.

3) No way can this boat be powered by a small outboard, you need 10hp at least to be able to control a boat that size unless you motor around in calm conditions. Sculling it? Maybe with 3 people on each side.

4) absolutely, if it's sound, it's perfectly capable of going to the Bahamas.

5) absolutely, if it's setup for it. They came from the factory that way, stuff may need to be updated of course.

Here is a better place for info on Cherubini Hunters...

The Cherubini Hunters - SailboatOwners.com


----------



## mitiempo (Sep 19, 2008)

The Cherubini Hunters have a good reputation and are good sailers. The outboard is not worth thinking about on a boat that size, prop wouldn't be in the water some of the time and if it was mounted low enough chances are in rough stuff it might be underwater. So best to budget for a new inboard diesel and allow por that in your offer (9-12k).


----------



## bmacfarquhar (Jan 12, 2010)

I am pretty serious about not having an inboard motor - I can't stand the smell of gas or diesel and I dont want to be sleeping in the same space as an engine. If I was to put an outboard on it it would only be to take it in tight spots out to sea - I love the idea of removing the propeller for more hull speed. I could probably stow away the outboard in some sort of vented lockerbox on deck so as to not have any fumes below. Strictly for maneuvering about the docks what would be the smallest outboard I could get away with? I absolutely detest engines and the burning of oil. I intend to sail and if theres no wind to just enjoy the moment - I dont have the time pressures of schedules. I want to have a minimalist cruiser eliminating as many systems as possible. I am wondering if I should perhaps go for a smaller boat to facilitate my desire to be almost engineless however I find them claustraphobic and cramped. I dont intend to spend much time in a slip at all - anchorages and moores and lots of ferrying supplies by dinghy.


----------



## mitiempo (Sep 19, 2008)

Besides charging batteries the engine is useful for a bit more than getting in or out of harbor. As well some harbors do not allow sailing. There is a thread on here where the owner tries to put an outboard on a 32' Irwin and after a lot of work gave up. There's a very good reason you seldom see an outboard on a boat over 25' or so. They just don't work well. An inboard is a lot less hassle in every way I can think of.


----------



## bmacfarquhar (Jan 12, 2010)

Well I have a couple of ideas about those rules. First I have the small outboard stowed away for marinas, canals and harbours that don't allow sailing (I also avoid said areas like the plague if possible). The second is I tell the Coast Guard that my engine just broke down and I can't start it for the life of me so I had no choice but to sail. I am a bit of an alternative energy fanatic so I will be having solar panels for the batteries and possible windpower also though I want to avoid noise and hear that wind vanes can make quite a racket. I dont want to put any holes in the boat to mount an outboard there must be some way to put a bracket on without drilling the hull. Wasn't Slocum's spray about this size and didn't he scull it? I dont care if it goes 2 knots or less in the marina and am looking to avoid marinas and spend as much time as possible in remote anchorages.

I am not completely confident I can handle a boat this big with no engine but I am inspired to try - has anyone tried cruising a 13,000 pound boat engineless and mostly singlehanded? I bet a hundred years ago this wouldn't have seemed odd at all.


----------



## eMKay (Aug 18, 2007)

bmacfarquhar said:


> I am pretty serious about not having an inboard motor - I can't stand the smell of gas or diesel and I dont want to be sleeping in the same space as an engine. If I was to put an outboard on it it would only be to take it in tight spots out to sea - I love the idea of removing the propeller for more hull speed. I could probably stow away the outboard in some sort of vented lockerbox on deck so as to not have any fumes below. Strictly for maneuvering about the docks what would be the smallest outboard I could get away with? I absolutely detest engines and the burning of oil. I intend to sail and if theres no wind to just enjoy the moment - I dont have the time pressures of schedules. I want to have a minimalist cruiser eliminating as many systems as possible. I am wondering if I should perhaps go for a smaller boat to facilitate my desire to be almost engineless however I find them claustraphobic and cramped. I dont intend to spend much time in a slip at all - anchorages and moores and lots of ferrying supplies by dinghy.


Like I said, smallest you could get away with is probably a 10hp, with the smallest pitch prop you can find for it. That size boat needs at least 30hp for hull speed, and they came with an underpowered 20hp from the factory. You will have to add a motor mount bracket, and reinforce the transom. The transom on the boat has a very significant slope from the rail to the water so lifting, starting, moving, touching, mounting an outboard is going to be a pain. Maybe you would be better off with a much smaller boat? A boat that size NEEDS an engine, you cannot move it by yourself without one.


----------



## mitiempo (Sep 19, 2008)

And your excuses wouldn't work in the harbour I am in either - you would be turned away at the entrance by a patrol boat.


----------



## RTB (Mar 5, 2009)

We've had ours for a year. This model was built from 1980-1982, and I've been told by some that they were overbuilt somewhat. I don't know how true it is, but it does seem pretty solid. It's got a hull speed of 7.3 I believe, and seems pretty quick to me. Everything is lead aft, so could be singlehanded. I prefer another person myself, but that's just me. 

It has a Yanmar 3GMD diesel, with a whopping 20 HP. I doubt you'd want less, I'd definitely consider going with a 30 HP in the future if the need to rebuild or replace arises. 

I might add that the deck is cored, so check it out especially around the chainplates. I have a small area that will need to be repaired on mine. 

Overall, I'd recommend it for what you are considering. We plan on doing the caribbean in the near future on ours. 

Ralph


----------



## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

I'd point out that you will lose a lot of resale value on the boat if you don't have a working in-board. Also, while you own the boat, not having a working in-board will be a major disadvantage for many reasons, including:

No engine-based charging of batteries
No engine-driven systems like hot water or refrigeration
No effective propulsion should you have problems with the sails or rigging, especially in heavy weather
Limits to where you can take your boat, especially since many crowded harbors and marinas don't allow boats to dock or leave under sail.


----------



## imagine2frolic (Aug 7, 2008)

bmac,

I don't understand why you are even asking? It seems you already have the answers. Everybody gets through life differently. Some successfully, and some not.........*i2f*


----------



## bmacfarquhar (Jan 12, 2010)

Don't mean to sound like I have all the answers - this will be my first big boat. I've been to keelboat sailing school in Newport, grew up sailing dinghies and kayaks and have spent a lot of time on the water and in the field for work. I am on here to absorb opinions and I appreciate the gut reaction that a large boat without an inboard is going to have some problems. 

That said it comes down to money. The boat in question has already taken a huge hit on resale due to its toasted inboard and has come within my grasp. I could buy a smaller boat with a functional inboard for the same price but I am very claustraphobic and would really like something a little bigger. 13,500 pounds seems quite light many 32 footers seem about this weight. Perhaps one day I'll have an extra 10k to rebuild the inboard but for now jerry rigging a small outboard for docking and learning to sail well is the only option I can afford.

As to systems like refrigeration I am trying to eliminate as many systems as possible perhaps only those legally required. A spray bottle for a shower and a five gallon bucket for a head are being considered here... I am in my twenties and see this as an adventure focused on the sailing itself more than anything else. I want to spend as much time in silence under sail as possible everything else is a means to that end.


----------



## mitiempo (Sep 19, 2008)

You will destroy resale, looks, and usability of the boat all at once. Most will listen to reason and do the right thing. Some will spend a lot on a "better" idea which has been proven not to work in the past. I think putting an outboard on this stern to try and push a 13,500 pound boat at any controllable speed won't work and I think others will agree. A vertical transom would be more workable but still a bad idea. Smaller outboards aren't really designed to push this weight either. A better choice would be to either fix the inboard or swap it for a rebuilt inboard. If you do this work yourself it probably won't cost much more than what you plan and it will work. But it's your money so it's your bad choice to make.


----------



## bmacfarquhar (Jan 12, 2010)

If I went down to a smaller more minimal inboard that could be an affordable option. Say a 12 hp yanmar? The boat will be underpowered but I'm in no hurry. 

From what I've seen to work on inboards one must crawl back into dark cramped areas in contortionist positions - it all looks quite gross. How much do you reckon some sort of workable small diesel could be had for? I really hate spending money on engines and investing energy and time into planet destroying monstrosities... I also am not sure I can lift inboards and will be doing all the work myself. The boat is currently in the water and aside from hauling it for survey I wasn't planning to keep it on the hard but rather to buy it and start sailing right away.

I read through the thread and have been contemplating what a monstrosity a transom mount might be - its ugly, it adds holes (leaks) where there needn't be any and it will only work in calm water and work poorly in that the boat will be very slow. I could probably do the outboard for some $1500 maybe less if I find a steal on the motor. I haven't figured out how to reinforce the transom. The good thing is the mount could be on a quick release bracket and the whole monstrosity taken off as soon as I get to sailing grounds. The prop and shaft can be removed for a faster hull - the space of the inboard converted to sail lockers etc and A couple hundred pounds less weight.

I suppose the advantage of doing an engine swap myself is I will learn all about my new boat. It seems the 3GMD is obsolete I will have to change to a different motor anyway and I lean toward smaller and simpler and most of all cheapest.


----------



## kredit (Sep 4, 2008)

I have an inboard and an outboard on my 25' .Previous owner installed the mount on the vertical transom for reasons I dont know,really. The inboard runs great and I bought a small outbd. for emergency/dinghy.I single handle sail and the engine is very important for setting sails ,etc...Theres many things that happen when you will need instant propulsion. especially as you will be learning. peace of mind is sailings mantra!

The time you take to slap on an outboard and all its controls you might as well get the inboard done. It sounds like you should try a smaller boat with the complete package cuz you want to sail and not spend time getting the boat ready. my first boat was a 24' with a rigged outboard that was a pain in the ass to use. It sounds simple but the reality,and for a 36' hunter,is grossly misunderstood.good luck!!


----------



## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

I'd point out that rebuilding a diesel can be far more cost-effective than going through the trouble and expense of getting an outboard and setting up a mounting system for it and all that. A decent 9.9 HP outboard is a couple grand... and underpowered for the boat at that.


----------



## RTB (Mar 5, 2009)

bmac,

You seem pretty interested in this particular boat. It's got alot of room inside, and you like the cockpit. Do you like the boat for what it is, or just the price? 

What problems do you know about other than the engine? There could be many, or it could be a really nice boat with a blown motor. What exactly is wrong with the Yanmar? 

You haven't mentioned the price. IMO, if you can't buy the boat and repair/replace the engine for 20K, look for another boat. If that is more than your budget, look for another boat. If this is possible, I'd go for it. It's a nice boat for that kind of money....if you keep the inboard (and nothing smaller than the original engine). 

Ralph


----------



## bmacfarquhar (Jan 12, 2010)

I could do it for 20k (owners asking 14k at the moment) but it might be wiser for me to go with something smaller for 10k. I looked at a nice Tartan 30 today that looked ready to go. I will agonize over the two boats - lots of space and a bit more speed vs cheap and will get the job done. Am going to start another thread about the Tartan 30 though these two are my short list and I want to compare them.


----------



## sailingfool (Apr 17, 2000)

sailingdog said:


> I'd point out that rebuilding a diesel can be far more cost-effective than going through the trouble and expense of getting an outboard and setting up a mounting system for it and all that. A decent 9.9 HP outboard is a couple grand... and underpowered for the boat at that.


SD,

And even then a 9.9 would be far too heavy to lift off a stern unless the OP installed a lifting hoist, then it would be too heavy and awkward to move around down below...overall the whole thing is a pretty ungly idea.


----------



## bmacfarquhar (Jan 12, 2010)

I agree its ugly and I dont want to start building things my purpose is to go sailing not to get bogged down in projects. What is the cheapest inboard replacement for the Yanmar 3GMD (can be any brand, can be used or rebuilt)? Does anyone know of 'a guy' who rebuilds marine diesels and sells 'em for a song? If I try putting it in myself how much could I pull off an engine swap for and is this going to be a huge PITA? I used to enjoy working on cars (note used to I am over it) so I'm not mechanically inept. Is it basically a matter of pulling out the old, dropping in the new and hooking up some hoses and bolting it down? Are their engine cranes for boats? I've seen people hanging them from booms and such.


----------



## mitiempo (Sep 19, 2008)

With a bit of ingenuity you can hoist the old out and drop a new one in - a beam and block & tackle and/or using the boom. A used rebuilt 3 cylinder Yanmar or similar probably 3 to 5k but I'm only guessing at that. 
As far as the outboard goes I doubt you'd be very mobile with only 10 hp on a 36' 13,500 lb boat.


----------



## bmacfarquhar (Jan 12, 2010)

The plot thickens I just got wind of a Kubota 28hp for $1500!

That would be the same price as my outboard monstrosity...

Are these engines similar enough to pull one and drop in another or will many systems need to be modified to make the swap from a yanmar 3GMD to a Kubota 28hp?


----------



## bljones (Oct 13, 2008)

No offense, bmac, but if you are "over" working on engines, if you don't like contorting yourself to fit around an engine, if the smell of gas or diesel makes you ill, if you want a rebuilt engine "for a song"... then maybe you should consider joining a sailing club, and sailing daysailers.
If you are going to cruise, you are going to have to get dirty.
If you are going to sail cheap, you are going to have to work on engines, and you are going to have to get dirty.
If you don't want to get bogged down in projects, you are going to have to buy a brand new boat.

A solid Tartan 30 with a decent running powerplant is a much netter deal than a bigger Hunter with a dead heart.

Or, here's a compromise for you. Smaller than the 36, bigger than the Tartan. This one could probably go home with somebody for about $16-17K US:
Pat Sturgeon Yachts Search Details


----------



## bljones (Oct 13, 2008)

The kubota will require, at the least...
new engine mounts, possibly new beds.
New shaft flange, possible the shaft will have to be modified.
New cabling, wiring, and controls.
Does it come with a transmission? If not, a transmission will be required.
Is it marinized? if not, then the list gets longer.


----------



## bmacfarquhar (Jan 12, 2010)

Then seeing as the yanmar 3GMD is no longer in production is there a bolt up replacement option or is it down to rebuild the existing motor or face an extensive transplant?


----------



## eMKay (Aug 18, 2007)

I would take the Kubota and pay to have it installed. You will be far ahead then, even if the cost to install it is what the engine itself costs.


----------



## ny1t (May 20, 2010)

sailingfool said:


> SD,
> 
> And even then a 9.9 would be far too heavy to lift off a stern unless the OP installed a lifting hoist, then it would be too heavy and awkward to move around down below...overall the whole thing is a pretty ungly idea.


And then the smell of gas everytime you disconned the fuel tank. And if you are into reducing manmade global warming in competition with natural global warming, Have you looked at electric drives?

Galen
S/V NoSerfing
1981 Hunter 36


----------



## YARDPRO (Aug 3, 2009)

spend the $3500.00 and install an electric motor... 
this way you can satisfy your radical environut ideals and have the bigger boat also...

seem like a pretty simple o brainer....


----------



## sailingfool (Apr 17, 2000)

bmacfarquhar said:


> ....
> 3) Engine is down needs an expensive rebuild - can a 13,500 pound boat be repowered with a small economical outboard just for docking operations and sailed the rest of the time? What about sculling it?
> ...


Allow at least $12,000 in any offer for rebuilding the negine.. If you don't want to stick with what's in it, repalce with more HP not less...


----------



## jimmyp (Jul 10, 2010)

Another idea would be to check your local community colleges for a diesel school. Sometimes they will take on projects and you just pay for the parts. It is also customarily to tip the students when they are through if they do a good job.

JimmyP


----------

