# Sailing the Hudson River NY



## bmjnyc (Jul 11, 2010)

Hello,

I will be picking and sailing my first sailboat home to NYC, a Contessa 26 from Lake Ontario via the Erie canal. I'm trying to figure out how long I should it expect it take me to sail from Waterford, NY to NYC? Waterford is just north of Albany. Any input would be greatly appreciated..

Thanks!


----------



## cruisingdream (Feb 7, 2007)

I would call that motoring your boat thru the canal


----------



## bmjnyc (Jul 11, 2010)

thanks for the tip


----------



## CrazyRu (May 10, 2007)

It is about 160 miles of pretty wide river. Last 100 miles it is wide tidal canyon.

Since it is a canyon, you will get either tailwinds or headwinds. With timing tides and good wind it can be done in two days. With no luck and with help of motor - 4-5 days.


----------



## tempest (Feb 12, 2007)

I'm going to say that it's about 125 miles or so. 

I think it's 150 to the troy locks..

So if you can average 4.5 knots for 8 hours a day..it will take you about 3.5 days...very rough guesstamating...

The river is tidal the whole way so you will have to take that into consideration. Wait for the tide....Around NYC the current can run 3-4 knots..or more..you can literally stand still if you can't make good 5 knots..

I don't know how strong it is 100 miles north.... I know I've seen ice flowing up river in Hyde Park. You'd have to look at an eldridge. 

I've give myself 4 to 5 days..minimum.....and more if you want to stop and see some sights. Depending on when you leave you might catch the clearwater festival...in croton


----------



## CalebD (Jan 11, 2008)

I probably don't need to say this but you are going to want a reliable engine for this delivery trip. What kind of engine is in your new Contessa 26?
The 4-5 day estimate sounds about right to me as well although I would like a day on either side for a buffer.
There is commercial barge and ship traffic on the Hudson up to Albany or Troy. The current also reverses every 6 hours or so so it is not the easiest place to anchor overnight without keeping an anchor watch and there are not that many natural anchorages along the way. 
Having said all of that it sounds like a fun and interesting trip. Wish I was doing it.


----------



## bmjnyc (Jul 11, 2010)

Thank you all for you input. it's super helpful and a great starting point as I start to plan this journey. My boat has an essentially new Kubota Diesel 6hp. Clearly it's going to take me a while and I'll have to play the tides, but luckily I'm in no rush for once.


----------



## joethecobbler (Apr 10, 2007)

where are you planning on stepping the mast? I've done his trip a few times in the lst couple years.


----------



## CalebD (Jan 11, 2008)

Glad to hear it is a new-ish Kubota in your boat. You will have plenty of time to get to know it well doing the canals. 6 HP does not sound like a lot of power but the original diesel installed in these boats was only a 7 HP.
CONTESSA 26 Sailboat details on sailboatdata.com

You actually can go against the current on the Hudson. The average current in most of the river is actually around 2 knots or less for most of it. Examine this link that shows the maximum expected currents for the Ebb and Flood currents all the way from NYC to Albany: Current Station Locations and Ranges
You can use this link to look up the expected current strengths for the dates of your trip (influenced by moon etc.).
I have found that sometimes when the main channel current is running up-river that along the edges it may be doing just the opposite. Even if you motor into the main current it will just result in you getting worse miles per gallon than if the current were with you. 
Joethecobbler brings up a good point. You will need to re-step your mast somewhere once you hit the Hudson. One place to do it is in Catskill and there is another place further north - someone will know the name - Hop o' Nose or something like that.
If it were me I'd re-step the mast as far north as possible so if you get any N or NW winds you can use some sails to get your southing done. Having a spinnaker might just help with this also.
Good luck. Yes, I am jealous! Always have wanted to do this trip.



bmjnyc said:


> Thank you all for you input. it's super helpful and a great starting point as I start to plan this journey. My boat has an essentially new Kubota Diesel 6hp. Clearly it's going to take me a while and I'll have to play the tides, but luckily I'm in no rush for once.


----------



## bmjnyc (Jul 11, 2010)

I'm new to these boards so I hope my thanks some how reaches everyone. I very excited for this trip. This is my first serious cruise. My end destination will be Orient Point, Long Island where I grew up and learned how to sail. I decided to buy myself a boat for my 40th birthday and to stop putting a dream.

Thanks for the information CalebD, thanks for the tidal info. I feel more reassured that my motor will be able to handle the river. Many Contessa 26's have more powerful Yanmar motors but my feeling is that the little Kubota will do me just fine and perhaps be less problematic. Also I think it will be easier to find parts if needed in the future.


----------



## bmjnyc (Jul 11, 2010)

I have Quick Anchor question. Currently the boat has 100’ anchor rode which I imagine is fine for Lake Ontario. I need to have more, I'm thinking I should have 300’ of rode, but I'm not sure how much chain I should have? 

Also she currently has a plow anchor, I believe that a Danforth would ideal?


----------



## tempest (Feb 12, 2007)

I don't know if there's a hard and fast rule. I have heard, and it's what I carry; a foot of chain for every foot of boat length.


----------



## CalebD (Jan 11, 2008)

Danforth anchors do well in the soft mud and even clay of the Hudson river, mostly. When the current changes it could dislodge fairly easily and not re-set. That is why I suggested doing an anchor watch if anchored in the river anywhere near the main channel.

Your home port is Orient Point? Now I am even more jealous! You'll get to do big lake sailing, canal motoring, Hudson river on into the Sound and out to Orient.

There is one pretty safe anchorage I know of on the lower Hudson. If you use google maps and look up 'Bowline Point' you will find a protected bay just south of Haverstraw. Folks also anchor near Croton Point on the east side of the river. It is about 30 nautical miles to The Battery (NYC) from there.

The Tides and Currents website of NOAA is very useful for guidelines of how fast the current *might* be running up and down the Hudson. Be aware though that heavy rains and strong, consistent winds can also effect the tides and currents on the Hudson. 
'Freshets' are small floods caused by either melting snow or heavy rains and cause a more then average down river flow. Winds can also slow the tides and mess with the currents. 
The website I linked for you only shows 'predictions'. If the weather is really bad from one direction or the other then all bets are off and you can throw the 'predictions' out the window. It all depends on when you go, what the weather Gods give you and how you accept their offerings.
Not long ago the Mohawk River valley got record rains that messed with the Erie Canal system. 
My experience tells me to expect that the 'norm' is mostly the case.
Have fun planning this trip.



bmjnyc said:


> I'm new to these boards so I hope my thanks some how reaches everyone. I very excited for this trip. This is my first serious cruise. My end destination will be Orient Point, Long Island where I grew up and learned how to sail. I decided to buy myself a boat for my 40th birthday and to stop putting a dream.
> 
> Thanks for the information CalebD, thanks for the tidal info. I feel more reassured that my motor will be able to handle the river. Many Contessa 26's have more powerful Yanmar motors but my feeling is that the little Kubota will do me just fine and perhaps be less problematic. Also I think it will be easier to find parts if needed in the future.


----------



## bmjnyc (Jul 11, 2010)

CalebD thanks for tips, I appreciate your advice. I've noted the anchorage spots. Should be and adventure, will start figuring out the NYC to Orient leg next week.


----------



## bmjnyc (Jul 11, 2010)

joethecobbler said:


> where are you planning on stepping the mast? I've done his trip a few times in the lst couple years.


I'm still looking into places to step my mast. The few places I've heard of on the Hudson side seem farther north then I'd like. I'm hoping to get the sail up ASAP. Also I need to find a place where I can get help as I've ever stepped a mast using a public crane... Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated


----------



## CaptFoolhardy (Sep 5, 2009)

bmjnyc said:


> I'm still looking into places to step my mast. The few places I've heard of on the Hudson side seem farther north then I'd like. I'm hoping to get the sail up ASAP. Also I need to find a place where I can get help as I've ever stepped a mast using a public crane... Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated


I have a friend who does this trip each year. He has used two places in Catskill, Riverview Marine Service and Hop-O-Nose Marine. He said that the cruisers that he spoke to raved about Hop-O-Nose but that he preferred Riverview. They did a very professional job and were less expensive.

Check out this thread on Cruisers Forum for a list of mast stepping/un-stepping places on the Erie Canal.


----------



## hellosailor (Apr 11, 2006)

bm-
When you mention anchoring, be aware that anchoring on the Hudson can be a fatal mistake if you are in an area that barge traffic sometimes swings through. Something like five years ago there was a ruckus over a fellow who had anchored, as I recall not in a marked anchorage area, who was hit and sunk by traffic at night.
So you very much want to be anchored in the shallowest most out-of-the-way place you can find, if you're not in a marina or boat club. And considering how many places there are to tie up, with good food available <G>, anchoring might not be necessary.


----------



## redhead78 (Dec 7, 2009)

Haverstraw marina is a great stop, fuel, docks, supplies, real easy approach and in.When you clear the canal there should be a couple of marinas that do mast step due to the demand there... Red


----------



## LessTacksing (Mar 17, 2009)

Depending when you are leaving the canal is closed mow due to flooding. There is also a huge amount of debris coming out of the canals and floating all over the place this morning.


----------



## bmjnyc (Jul 11, 2010)

I'm planning on leaving June 25, I imagine things will clear up by then. I've heard that one has to keep a careful eye out for debris both and the canal and the hudson. 

Thanks for the marina information.


----------



## bmjnyc (Jul 11, 2010)

I'm wondering if anyone has any recommendations on boat insurance? I'm going to ask the broker my family uses for home policy and see what he can do however I've heard good things about BoatUSA. Who do you use?

Thanks!


----------



## joethecobbler (Apr 10, 2007)

Boat US will require a haul out survey by one of their approved surveyors.
Progressive will offer liability w/out haul out but premiums are higher.
Boat US offers towing as does towboat , you'll want to check availbility of these services in the area's you will travel.
As to stepping mast,it is very simple and straight forward. You can do-it yourself at Castleton-on-the-hudson boat club for $50.00 there are usually plenty of people around that will help if you ask (other's doing the same,waiting for you !) Also it is a GREAT place to stop after leaving waterford (where you must stop for at least the evening) and the distance is right for making it to Castleton. At castleton you can dock for $1 a foot and they have rest.bar,showers,and laundry within walking,small stores for light provisioning etc. Also a moring ball for $5.00 if you prefer and dinghy in. It's a must stop IMO. 
This stop also sets you up for stopping along the way at anchorage spots south. I'd have to check my log book for the other anchorages I've used.
You would be wise to use the tides to your advantage,it goes better.
I often anchor just north of the bridge at Tarrytown and dinghy in to the park/ballfield if I need to go ashore. From there I usually stop West of the statute of liberty on the jersey side and anchor next to the state park,you can pull right up to the launch ramp if you want,but I wouldn't, I just anchor and dinghy in. If weather is poor it's a good spot to wait it out.there is a diner 1/2 block walk. 
I'll check the log for other spots I've anchored or docked for free.


----------



## bmjnyc (Jul 11, 2010)

*Thanks*

joethecobbler, thanks for this info, Castleton in on my list now..Sounds perfect


----------



## johnnyandjebus (Sep 15, 2009)

Beautiful pic BMJNYC

My own co26 was dropped into the water earlier this week and the mast goes up tomorrow morning. The season has started.

If you are traveling the Erie canal are you starting in Buffalo or Oswego?
If Oswego you might be interested to know that Kingston has several options that you might take advantage of, assuming a visit is part of your trip.
1) My understanding is that Confederation Basin harbour(downtown Kingston) has several slips available, for free, for transients.
2) Portsmouth Olympic harbour has a small crane suitable to drop the mast. I understand there is a small charge but much less than state side. This would mean motoring across the lake.

If you would like more details let me know, I can followup. I know nothing about the canal but have lived in and sailed Kingston for most of my live so I may be able to pass on some useful info.

Good luck perhaps you could followup with your experience once done? It is a trip that is in my future, some day when I walk away from my cubicle... 

John


----------



## bmjnyc (Jul 11, 2010)

*Using Google Maps to trace trip itinerary for blog*

Hi, As I mentioned in my earlier posts I'm planning to sail my new boat from Lake Ontario to Orient Point, NY via the Eire Canal.

I would like to keep an online blog of my trip as a active google map that shows my progress similar to this:

BlueJacket Trip Reports for 2006

Would anybody know what the best way to this is?

Thanks!


----------



## hellosailor (Apr 11, 2006)

Just to make sure you know: You will be _motoring _in the Erie Canal, unless you really like fast tacking and can drop your mast very quickly at each bridge.


----------



## CrazyRu (May 10, 2007)

bmjnyc said:


> Hi, As I mentioned in my earlier posts I'm planning to sail my new boat from Lake Ontario to Orient Point, NY via the Eire Canal.
> 
> I would like to keep an online blog of my trip as a active google map that shows my progress similar to this:
> 
> ...


I'm not sure if it is the best way, but, in my opinion, easiest. Invest in SPOT messenger and the device will keep a track of your movements. I believe you will get a page with a map which you can link to any blog.

http://www.findmespot.com/en/

Another way is uploading your gps track into one of many servers, or just entering coordinates manually.


----------



## bmjnyc (Jul 11, 2010)

*Spot*

Thanks for this, I've heard of SPOT, will look into it


----------



## jsnaulty (Jan 18, 2011)

*new york to orient point*

i gather you are planning to complete your trip by going from NYC to orient point. you will have two places to really watch the tides- hell gate in the east river (aptly named if you don't figure the tides right) and plum gut at the end of Long Island. Read one of the new england cruising guides to learn how to do these two spots.


----------



## bmjnyc (Jul 11, 2010)

Thanks, I live in Orient Point so very very familiar with Plum Gut, I can see it from my window. As far as Hells Gate, I plan to run with the tides..


----------



## CalebD (Jan 11, 2008)

... and the Eldridge "Tide and Pilot Manual" has intuitive current charts for both the East River and The Race and Gut for about $15 including tax. 
Yes, it can be a fun ride by Roosevelt Island into Hell Gate but the several times I've done it but the currents were no worse or stronger then my experiences going through the Plum Island Gut except there is usually less room to maneuver in the East River so extra vigilance is required.
The trip around Manhattan will be fun and your GPS just might hit 10 knots if you get a strong current near Hell Gate. The trip through the Erie Canal is something I've wanted to do. PM me if you stop in NYC (I'm in lower Manhattan, 1 mile north of The Battery).

I'm surprised I haven't plugged the club where we keep our boat yet as a stopover point on the Hudson. Our boat is at the Nyack Boat Club on a mooring and they have some guest moorings that are something like $25/night. The club has a launch and showers and the village has restaurants. It is about 25 nm. from the Battery in NYC. Since it is a sailing club there is no fuel dock per se and the local fuel and pump out is in Tarrytown but it is more of a motorboat club and is in tight quarters.


----------



## Spyder (Mar 24, 2011)

I sail frequently near the Tappan Zee Bridge (about 30 mi N of the Battery). Here the current runs north for 5 hrs, then south for 7 hrs (roughly). It's just the effect of river current against, or with, the tide.

If you need boat supplies or boat work in the Tappan Zee area I'd recommend Westerly Marina in Ossining (eastern shore). If you'd just like a nice meal the Tarrytown Yacht Cub is a good bet. It's right at the Tappan Zee. 

You'll want to be heading south at the Tappan Zee 4 1/2 hrs before Eldridge shows low tide at the Battery. Otherwise you won't make it north on the East River to Long Island Sound. I have a 23 ft Catboat and my wife has a photo of it's GPS showing 11.7 knots on that river.

Once past Execution Rocks the current begins to relax, so I'd leave the Tappan Zee early in the morning to make the North Shore of Long Island in time for a casual anchoring. Believe me, you won't be dallying around NY Harbor. It's fun but quite hectic: helicopters, Staten Island Ferries, Cruise ships, police boats, fire boats, and commuter ferries that run like waterbugs...not to mention a rare passenger aircraft in the Hudson (Capt. Shelly).

Feel free to contact me if you need more info about the area.
Cheers,
Dick Hare, Ossining, NY


----------



## waterbug (Oct 10, 2010)

How did it go? 
I brought my father's (now my) 30' O'Day from Lake Superior thru to Albany last fall, and planning to bring her home to moor in Boston this spring/summer.
I am a little green also, especially sailing in seawater, so would love any suggestions you have regarding navigating the Hudson/NY stretch.


----------



## hellosailor (Apr 11, 2006)

Waterbug-
If you buy a copy of Eldridge (from any chandlery) it will lead you NYC to Boston step by step. There's no better local guide for LI Sound and NYC.
Coming down the Hudson, mainly just watch out for commercial traffic and tows, tows also being a hazard for the entire route but on the Hudson they can be harder to duck.


----------



## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

Eldridge for sure!

I didn't find the Hudson commercial traffic to be much of a worry. They don't cross the river, so its easy enough to slide past them north or south bound (or let them pass you). Have a radio handy.

The white knuckle part of this trip is the East River, Hells Gate and Western LIS. 

Very doable, but read up.

If you're unfamiliar with seawater, I presume that means open water. Don't let LIS fool you, it can get treacherous in bad weather. The Eastern portion of LIS up to Buzzards Bay can get as churned as the deepest blue water passage in some cases. 

Just read up on weather prediction and get access to some sites like Sailflow or PassageWeather to keep an eye on things. It's done all the time. Have a great trip.


----------



## tempest (Feb 12, 2007)

Actually there's quite a bit of crossing that goes on around lower Manhattan. Not so much further North as Minne says where it's more north and south. The commuter ferries and the Statue/Ellis island ferries, and other tour boats zig-zag across all day long around lower manhattan from about Weehawken down. Still, it's not an issue. They are big enough to see and if you know where they're headed ( the terminals) you can keep clear. What I find around lower manhattan is that while watching and dodging the ferry traffic you can easily forget to look for the tug and barge that is slowly lumbering up or down the channel.


----------



## hellosailor (Apr 11, 2006)

Tempest, as a native I wouldn't call the Battery or the Upper Bay "the Hudson River". Not till you got past the Battery itself. The traffic south of the Battery can be real fun, we used to watch the Governor's Island ferry (property of the USCG and therefore at the right hand of God) duke it out with the Staten Island ferry, the commercial traffic, the recreational traffic, and the real fun, when the "new" high speed commuter ferries started up they figured THEY were at the right hand of God because they had to maintain their schedules. Ah, nope, a coupla folks got some nasty surprises from their "elders" on that.

But it still can get busy out there.

Problem on the Hudson proper is not off Manhattan but way further up. Think West Point and all the twisty places where the river is subject to shifting winds, tight curves, constrained drafts. Now add the barge tows, and when they come around a corner if someone is towing (not pushing) the tow is going to swing and you may not be aware of which way it is coming, or where other traffic is going to go to avoid it and keep in deeper water. 

Some years ago a sailboat made the mistake of anchoring overnight on the Hudson, not in a designated anchorage. IIRC they got run down and the owner killed. Of course there have been accidents from long tows in the Sound as well, but at least there's usually lots more manuevering room on the Sound.

And some of the stuff that sails upriver, like the Tropicana Banana freighter (literally) is bigger than you would expect, with a matching blind spot under the bow.

Then sometimes after heavy rains, you will find bits of houses and whole trees coming down, just like Mark Twain's tales on the Mississippi.

There IS plenty of room for all, but daylight and a radio and some planning ahead might all be useful. And a camera.(G)

I think technically, the Hudson River ends someplace surprisingly high up like Kingston. South of that it is technically the Hudson Estuary, a flooded river where seawater comes up twice a day, tidally. And you can often see the tidal bore.


----------



## tempest (Feb 12, 2007)

Hello...all true... I lived on the Hudson in Newburgh, went to school in Hyde park and worked in cold spring.. I used to sit in class and watch the ice flow up river with the tide.
I always thought it was tidal to Albany, but now understand that it's as far as troy..? 

I gave lessons out of Jersey City for two summers, one just after Irene. The river looked like chocolate milk for 2 weeks afterward and yes..I saw parts of houses and their contents float by..as well as whole trees.


----------



## peterconway (Sep 23, 2010)

I just traveled the Hudson back in Sept. you are in for a nice trip. Of course the key is to go with the flow, but it is a beautiful ride passing many historic sites. I was fortunate to be with locals who could point out what I was seeing and tell me much about it. We passed manhattan just after dusk and the city was well lighted. For your own sake, do som research just to enjoy the scenery. We anchored near sandy hook, and made our way out to the Atlantic the next morning. The water is deep, wide, and we had little company as far as other boats, a few ferries and a tanker. Enjoy


----------



## CalebD (Jan 11, 2008)

I think we are splitting hairs here on where the Hudson officially begins and ends. The entire Hudson up to Troy is a tidal estuary although the halocline or where the salt water reaches to, changes from year to year. Usually the salt water does not go above, say Beacon and is normally not higher than Haverstraw Bay. Salt water fish species are routinely found in the southern third of the Hudson but it is still the Hudson River, which is a tidal estuary.
NY Harbor begins at the Battery, or Liberty Landing Marina on the west. 
Does the East River also begin at the Battery or the Brooklyn Bridge or Buttermilk Channel? I am not sure I care.
The East River is not a river but a tidal straight but the Hudson is a river.
/end of nonsense


----------



## windycityxx (Jul 23, 2013)

I've gone from Albany (Waterford to be exact) up to Lake Champlain and then down to New York City and to New Jersey around Sandy Hook..

There were some marinas and a decent amount of free public walls so keep that in mind..

I don't think you'll be sailing at all or much as I never seen anyone except on Lake Champlain..

Not sure if this helps at all just figured I'd weigh in..

This was on 48' 100% solar powered trimaran electric powered boat, not a sailboat btw..


----------



## mbianka (Sep 19, 2014)

CaptFoolhardy said:


> I have a friend who does this trip each year. He has used two places in Catskill, Riverview Marine Service and Hop-O-Nose Marine. He said that the cruisers that he spoke to raved about Hop-O-Nose but that he preferred Riverview. They did a very professional job and were less expensive.
> 
> Check out this thread on Cruisers Forum for a list of mast stepping/un-stepping places on the Erie Canal.


When I took my boat up to Canada and back via the Erie Canal I used Riverview to step and un step my boats mast. I have no complaints and they are closest to the river.

One of my favorite anchorages is up by Hook Mountain just North of Nyack. I made the trip down the Hudson from there to Port Washington Long Island a few days before Hurricane Sandy hit. There was no wind so I motored the whole forty miles with my Electric Propulsion. I left Hook Mountain as the the current started ebbing south. Got to the Battery in time to catch the flood up the East River. Perfect timing. Here's a little video of that leg:




It was unusual to have an entire day like that with no wind. But, you can make it from the Tappan Zee bridge area into Long Island Sound using the currents and the info in the Eldridge Tide and Pilot book. Much nicer and faster to "go with the flow".


----------



## hpeer (May 14, 2005)

Seven year old thread. Oh what the hell!

We went north a couple of years ago. I stepped at Castelton on Hudson (or something like that.). It’s a DIY operation, you give then $50 and they leave and let you use the jib crane. My wife and I unstepped the mast on our 33’ boat ourselves. Kinda scary but went really well. Deck stepped mast helped. I would not want to do it on a holiday or weekend, too much wake from passing motor boats.


----------



## kaisersling (Sep 20, 2016)

Check out Sean and Julia sailing on youtube. They recently did a similiar trip.


----------

