# Sail Repair- sewing machines



## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

Hello-

We are preparing for a cruising life and are in the market for a sewing machine to make sail repairs, cushions, etc. Any suggestions folks have as to simple, portable machines that have served you well, we''d be most appreciative to hear. Thanks!

Ellen Landrum and John Broussard
Alberg 30 ''Rubicon''


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## mcain (Jun 13, 2003)

We got the Sailrite machine. It takes some getting used to. But once figured out, it seems to do all right. And factory support is very good. But it is not cheap.


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## pirateofcapeann (Aug 27, 2002)

Husqvarna Viking! Bet you can find one cheep on e-bay or something.


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

I own a sewing shop and also collect sewing machines. my advice is to use any machine that will sew what you want to sew. Don''t spend money on an expensive "sailors" sewing machine.
Go to a yard sale and get a $10 older home type sewing machine. pre- electronic era. These were real workhouses. Adapt a heavy flywheel
or a bolt a heavy round slab of steel to the current flywheel. Add a hand crank. Do not consider not having a hand crank.
A heavy spinning flywheel turned by hand sews smooth and beautiful. You can also put the belt back on and use the motor if you like.
If you''re going cruising NOTHING is more important than dollars. I''m sure there are numerous places the money for a sewing machine can be better spent on items for your boat.
I''ve made a couple of these for cruisers.
They work well and the cost is free with scrounged parts.


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## sailingbob (Jul 22, 2003)

This seems like very good advice after spending $1500 on sailrite products and having the thread bleed and stain my mainsail and deck (sailrite''s response was tough luck). Nothing is more important to sailrite than getting your cruising dollars!

Another alternative is to find a reasonable canvas shop or find a sewing machine repair shop and look for an old machine. I would suggest trying the machine on at least 6 layers of canvas/sunbrella. Happy Cruising.


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

A lot of people feel that a home type machine is adequate, and maybe it is for them. 

My experience has been that the home type machines need a heavier flywheel to give them the inertia to push the needle through several layers of fabric. Converting to a heavier flywheel was mentioned earlier, but finding one may be elusive unless you are in the business. The other problem I''ve experienced with home type machines is the feed dog(the part that pushes the material through the machine), just isn''t up to pushing heavy/slippery material through the machine in a nice even manner that will give you neat stitching. You must help the machine feed the material (not too fast/not too slow, or you''ll break a needle!) It can be very discouraging! 

Just imagine trying to feed your mainsail (rolled up tight so you can get it under the machine arm) keep the stitching going in a straight line, and being careful to help the machine feed the material at just the right speed so you don''t break a needle...it ain''t easy!! In fact it can be downright discouraging!

Home type machines that have been converted to handle heavier materials are well worth the extra cost if you really want to sew properly. If price is a major issue, keep your eyes open for a used one... the''re out there. 

After giving up on my wife''s machine, I bought a well used Pffaf that had been converted. Bought it for $325.00. Used it for several years until I bought a new, better machine. Sold the old one for what I paid for it so it really didn''t cost me anything! The new owner was delighted to find it as he had gone the same route I had with home type machines.

Just my experience.

Jim


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

A lot of people feel that a home type machine is adequate, and maybe it is for them. 

My experience has been that the home type machines need a heavier flywheel to give them the inertia to push the needle through several layers of fabric. Converting to a heavier flywheel was mentioned earlier, but finding one may be elusive unless you are in the business. The other problem I''ve experienced with home type machines is the feed dog(the part that pushes the material through the machine), just isn''t up to pushing heavy/slippery material through the machine in a nice even manner that will give you neat stitching. You must help the machine feed the material (not too fast/not too slow, or you''ll break a needle!) It can be very discouraging! 

Just imagine trying to feed your mainsail (rolled up tight so you can get it under the machine arm) keep the stitching going in a straight line, and being careful to help the machine feed the material at just the right speed so you don''t break a needle...it ain''t easy!! In fact it can be downright discouraging!

Home type machines that have been converted to handle heavier materials are well worth the extra cost if you really want to sew properly. If price is a major issue, keep your eyes open for a used one... the''re out there. 

After giving up on my wife''s machine, I bought a well used Pffaf that had been converted. Bought it for $325.00. Used it for several years until I bought a new, better machine. Sold the old one for what I paid for it so it really didn''t cost me anything! The new owner was delighted to find it as he had gone the same route I had with home type machines.

Just my experience.

Jim


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## sadie14 (Feb 5, 2003)

sailingbob is carrying a grudge and it may be that it should be against himself and not Sailrite. I have used them extensively for many projects for 10 years.

My first (ever) sewing was canvas on the boat and I bought a used Pfaff from a reputable dealer and had good experience with it. As I improved and my projects became more sophisticated (and I had more money) I purchased the Sailrite Sailmaker and have been very happy with it. I have a friend who has the blue walking foot straight/zig zag machine and she is extremely satisfied.

Sailrite is always there to help you with the machine.


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

Please believe what I''m telling you here.
ALL SEWING MACHINES ARE BASICLY THE SAME
They all sew the same stitches.
these are facts
Older singer home machines are often the same as commercial machines
Phaff machines are great but parts and attachments are expensive and harder to locate. Some interchange.
Feed problems- needles breaking. Operator problems. learn to sew. Don''t expect a machine to do what you can''t.
Singer machines have very inexpensive feed dogs, needle plates and attachments that can sew anything and can be located almost anywhere in the world.
For the other than arm chair cruiser that''s a big issue.
Ya you can probably get a feed og for a singer machine in Borneo
New machines- less corrosion problem since the gears are plastic instead of bronze. (sarcasm intended)
Who cares if they''re expensive, don''t last and strip faster than a hurried hooker.
sail cloth???? You''re afraid of sail cloth?
A light weight, very easy to sew material.
Come on people. That''s the least of your sewing problems.

Major fact
Feed is a matter of friction. The right amount to sew ANYTHING can be easlly regulated with feed dogs, feet, teflon gadgets. . All easy to find singer parts. Also stuff you can get at Wal Mart. But go to the dealer if you feel 10 times the price makes it better. A simple piece of paper can solve a feed problem a lot better than spending $1000 on a machine. Ask anybody in a sewing message board if you have a problem. Lack of knowledge not machinery is the only problem you''re likely to have.
Remember this. COMMERCIAL- INDUSTRIAL STRENGTH etc. Is often a marketing scheme.
Everything you need to know about sewing and machines is easy to get from a simple sewing group just like the one we''re reading now.
Any problems you feel I might be able to help with.
Please e-mail me. Sailing people have been so great to me with all the information I can handle. I''d be more than happy to be as helpful as they were to me.
After thought.
Do you really want a NO NAME machine?
Sail rite means nothing to anybody in the sewing business- 
Singer- juki- brother ok that''s a machine
The sewing industry in the US collapsed. It''s gone. All the machines we sew on are manual machines. They''re obsolete. So is sewing. Sewing is now an unskilled trade done by anybody on automated machines.
Interesting point.
Commercial sewing machine dealers, a few are still here, most went bankrupt, have warehouses of used industrial machines just
collecting dust. I added a few to my shop for pennies on the dollar.
If you have a serious interest in doing a lot of boat realted sewing keep in mind that loads of great machinery are actually being trucked to the dump. It''s not hard to find a good machine.


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## kokopelli9 (Aug 16, 2002)

I have three sewing machines...an expensive Singer machine that breaks down alot, a less expensive Sears Kenmore machine that has needed repairs twice in 24 years...and a six dollar very old no name treadle machine that I bought at a yard sale 30 years ago. It has never needed repairing... just cleaning and oiling. When I am making sail repairs or sewing canvas tarps, I use that $6.00 machine everytime.
Sometimes expense and brand do not necessarily mean your needs will be met.

However with fabric it is often better to go with the best quality, which sometimes means more cost. Often it is a cheaper dye that is used to cut cost which means there may be bleeding or rapid fading. I have access to all grades of canvas and I choose the best quality everytime for that reason.

Kokopuff


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## scuppers (Feb 20, 2000)

So...here''s a sewing question for you. As I was modifying my headsail for roller furling (took off the hanks and put on new luff tape), the reinforced patches at the head and tack were nearly impossible to sew through. The mutiple layers (maybe 8?) of sailcloth and stiffening materials wouldn''t allow the needle through. It was like trying to sew through a plastic board. Even hand cranking the machine was difficult.

So..what was I doing wrong? Incorrect needle?Just operator error? I was using a standard houshold machine, by the way. Thanks for any advice you can give me.


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## RichH (Jul 10, 2000)

Home machines typically dont have a massive enough flywheel to store the energy necessary to punch through multiple layers of sail cloth. Sometimes changing from a ball-point needle to a sharp point and soaking the material (and sewing thread) with a teflon based lubricant will help. You can ''pre-punch'' the reinforcement patches by carefully measuring and pushing through a sharp hand awl - then sew the thread into the ''holes''. 
If the modification inclues a foam luff, its not all that important to affix the luff tape at the area of the reinforcement patch area. Leaving the luff tape off at the head and tack of the sail will affect a better/tighter roll on the foil... as the middle of the luff will roll-up ''tighter''.


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## ARCA (Aug 10, 2003)

I would really want to reinforce the previous contribution on the need for a heavy flywheel. I have an old Reeds Sailmaker which is great, but think about the weight on board as it is considerable and where you will stow it. If you stow it away you will find that the size and weight make it hard to handle and you are reluctant to struggle to get it out!

Robin.


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## sadie14 (Feb 5, 2003)

Robin,
Weight is an issue, but I don''t know how you get around it. A good heavy machine is necessary to sew heavy, thick fabric. I have a sailmaker from sailrite, which weighs 70 pounds. We store it center line, on the floor, under the table with plenty of hold downs.

It is very hard to lift it up to the sewing table, so I gather projects and do them all at once when possible.

The heavy flywheel does make a difference, as does the proper needle.


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

Hello scuppers
Sewing a thick piece like mentioned is the rare sewing situation most of us are likely to encounter.
It makes little sense to buy a heavy duty industrial machine for something were likely to encounter only on rare occasions.
A different needle can be a big help and there are many different types you can get but in small amounts they are hard to find.
I''ve used needles made for sewing leather
and they worked very well for thick layers of other materials.
It''s not hard to modify the flywheel by adding a heavy plate. 
The combination of additional weight and a 
specialty needly can get a home machine to sew just about anything but the needle alone should do the trick.
Do a search for sewing machine needles.
You''ll easily fine a list of the styles made.
Look at the drawings and you''ll see why some penetrate so well and the kind for general sewing don''t. Look at the common ball point then look at a wedge shaped leather needle.
Once you have a basic idea of the needle types you''ll be able to quickly put the right needle to the right job.
Try a sewing group where readers will be willing to send you a couple needles.
A lot of good needles are only to be found in lots of 100 and they''re not cheap.
It''a also possible to adjust the needle bar of a home machine to use different needles.
It''s probably not in the skill level of the average person and the cost of working it out with a machine repair man might be worth loking into.
Sorry for the delay answering. I lost my modem and took months to get around to getting back online. Hope you''re still reading.
I can give you more detailed information on sewing problems. e-mail me at [email protected]
Tom


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## j-manta (May 13, 2017)

Hi Twilk,
I have an old Singer Zig Zag 457. What is the largest needle/thread i can use? I have been told 100/16, but would like to be able to use a heavier thread
Thanks
j-manta


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## Aimlessness (Apr 22, 2017)

Here's my 2 cents...

I wanted a sewing machine so that I could barter with other cruisers for canvas and cushion work. I looked at SailRite's $800+ machines and some older Singer machines that have "metal gears" that I was told by someone else who does canvas work was "mandatory". Then, I watched them try to sew their dodger to make a repair but their metal geared vintage Singer $400 machine couldn't get through TWO (that's 2) layers of Sunbrella. I kept looking. I found the following reviews on Youtube for the Singer 4411 machine which I bought on Jet.com for $92 free shipping NO TAX (that's NINETY-TWO). I have sewn through 8 (that's EIGHT) layers of canvas joining two edges that were themselves hemmed. Yada, Yada, Yada...

I recommend this machine. I've done canvas and cushions with piping, etc. VERY RELIABLE. Has all the basic stitches. You need to get BIG needles 110 or 120 AND V69 or V92 thread for canvas work. I use a 110 needle and V92 UV resistant Poly thread I bought on EBay (1000 yards for $20 - I don't remember really, but it was something like $20).

Anyway, there you go two cents worth.


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## JimsCAL (May 23, 2007)

twilk has not posted here since 2003. I doubt you will get a response. Please note dates of threads when asking for a reply.


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## DonScribner (Jan 9, 2011)

erl18 said:


> Hello-
> 
> We are preparing for a cruising life and are in the market for a sewing machine to make sail repairs, cushions, etc. Any suggestions folks have as to simple, portable machines that have served you well, we''d be most appreciative to hear. Thanks!
> 
> ...


Hi guys! I'm not going to read the other posts. I'll be most tell you to drop $800 on a Sailrite machine. If you have the money, go ahead. Be sure to get the Z model to do zig-zags. But . . . I made a mainsail a couple of years ago using my lovely bride's graduation present from her mom, a circa 1980 Kenmore sewing machine. The metal gizzards of the older machines give them the chutzpah to punch thru up to 10 layers of dacron and adhesive with few complaints. So, if I were spending the money, I'd pick up an older model machine with a carrying case.

I've also sewn a number of other projects using Sinbrella (that's Sunbrella clone from Walmart). It's even easier to sew than Dacron.


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## j-manta (May 13, 2017)

Thanks all,
I will keep an eye out for a cheap 4411


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## chef2sail (Nov 27, 2007)

We have owned our sailtite machine for over 10 years. In that time my wife has repaired our sails, made 2 dodgers, 2 Bimini, helm cover, all 26 interior cushions, dinghy custom cover and more.

There are other good machines however this one is tested to go through lots of projects and thick material. It has a nice carrying case, and can be used manually without electricity.


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## oldlaxer1 (Mar 27, 2008)

DonScribner said:


> I made a mainsail a couple of years ago using my lovely bride's graduation present from her mom, a circa 1980 Kenmore sewing machine. The metal gizzards of the older machines give them the chutzpah to punch thru up to 10 layers of dacron and adhesive with few complaints. So, if I were spending the money, I'd pick up an older model machine with a carrying case.


I second this. Having never sewn anything I figured I'd start with the recommended Kenmore and step up to a Sailrite after learning how to sew. I've done a few projects with the Kenmore (added zippers in my mainsail cover for my Dutchman lines, new tiller cover, and a winter cover) and at this point don't see the need to upgrade. The winter cover was the biggest project size wise but the zippers were the most intricate. I'm still perfecting my sewing skills but I don't think the machine is a limiting factor. YMMV

Cheers,
OL


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## RichF28 (Jun 17, 2015)

I would like to try this.... The original thread used in our jib cover seems to be the only failure point. It keeps breaking, coming loose from the zipper. What thread should I buy to make sure it holds up to UV damage.


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## oldlaxer1 (Mar 27, 2008)

Check with Sailrite. They have a less expensive UV protected thread and then Tenara (sp?) that is apparently the gold standard but much more pricey.


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## chef2sail (Nov 27, 2007)

Sailrite V92 is what we use on all our dodger and Bimini and covers


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## RegisteredUser (Aug 16, 2010)

For those people who are not sewing machine mechanics or very experienced, a reliable 'package' can be important when away from modernville.
If you're at the dock with amazon prime and granny's quilt/saddle shop nearby, it's a different view.


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