# Info - Live Aboard in US Virgin Islands



## KPerry (Jul 28, 2015)

I am looking to move to the USVI and would like to know if anyone who is currently living there can help answer a tons of my questions.

Such as marinas for Live Aboards in either St. Croix or St Thomas, their costs, what amenities they have, which ones are close to eateries and shops, etc.

Also questions on taxes - best to be a resident or non-resident? Do you have to pay both Federal and USVI taxes. 

Those are my top two and more to follow.

Thanks for any and all help


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## FarCry (Apr 21, 2007)

Welcome to Sailnet.

A quick Google search will pop this and some other threads up here on Sailnet http://www.sailnet.com/forums/theres-place/104371-long-term-live-aboard-st-tomas-vi-us.html

If you have specific questions that aren't covered in your search here of previous threads, I would be glad to try and help.


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## Galo (Jun 8, 2015)

Perry:
As a long-time boating family for many years based in Puerto Rico, I've little to add to the posts above except you would be wise to consider Puerto Rico as a place to take the boat to for some of your extended 'away from vessel' time.

Villa Marina and Puerto Del Rey in Fajardo will provide excellent 'transient/temporary' dockage for your boat at much more reasonable $$$ rates vs. St Thomas and several good vessel management outfits are available to tide for you boat while u are gone. It's only 50 miles from Fajardo to St Thomas, so....an easy day's sail. 

For resupplying, food will be cheaper in PR than St Thomas and you will also have excellent accessibility to marine supplies, spares and gear cheaper than in St Thomas. Plus, you will have many more choices for air travel out of SJU than STT -and likely cheaper as well.

If you are in need of a hurricane hole, Ensenada Honda in Culebra is as good as anything you will find in the VIs or BVIs. Also, Culebrita is...well....we think it puts Magens to shame....easily worth a stop while en route to Fajardo. 

PM me if you have any questions as the East Coast of PR was one of my old stomping grounds....be happy to help.


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## KPerry (Jul 28, 2015)

Thanks Galo for suggesting PR- I am not married to the USVI so yes I would be interested in learning more about live aboard in PR

FL is just getting to crowded with these weekend power boats


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## Galo (Jun 8, 2015)

KPerry said:


> FL is just getting to crowded with these *weekend power boats*


Hey, easy....I still 'resemble' that -at least for now.......LOL!!!

Pm to follow late tonight


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## Galo (Jun 8, 2015)

Okay.....no PM since I don't have the required number of posts yet...need 15

Puerto Del Rey:
- man made marina, formed by building a long rock wall jetty to protect a natural -but fairly open- 'cove'. Concrete piers and ramps, it was expensive. Big. Can accommodate vessels >100 ft and carries 15ft of water well into its outermost slips. 
- It's located north of what used to be the Roosevelt Roads Navy base, about 6 miles south of Fajardo. The local area is known as Medio Mundo. 
- Tricky to get into and out of. Several reefs (a few that don't break) around the area and some skinny water close to shore just north of the marina. Of the reefs, Cayo Largo runs several miles north and south just three miles off the marina's entrance and in only a few places does it break, so....study charts well before u attempt to approach the marine from dead East. I've had not one but two friends ground their boats in Cayo Largo and neither was pretty. 
- Very busy and good quality maintenance shops and businesses support the marina....from sails to watermakers to hauling and painting, almost anything you might need can be sourced there.
- Not the place to be in a blow/hurricane as the seawall is about 10 feet high at high tide which means it will (and has been) overtopped in a hurricane, hence, not my preferred place to leave a boat in a slip and leave for weeks during the peak of hurricane season: mid-August to end of September.

Villa Marina in Fajardo
- another man-made marina, created by digging out a whole bunch of sand and rock, building the piers and slips and then cutting a channel out.
- Will probably be cheaper than Puerto Del Rey...I have not compared rates in a long time...
- many maintenance services also available. Not as fully found as Puerto Del Rey but a lot will be available there -almost anything you will need in a haul-out
- Villa Marina is far better than Puerto Del Rey for in-water 'storage' during hurricane season. The entrance to the marina is narrow as it's man-made and the marina sits in a natural 'bowl' within some small hills, so it's much more protected than Puerto Del Rey. That was proven during Georges....there was far more damage at Puerto Del Rey than Villa Marina.

Neither of these marinas are walking distance close to any supermarket. Villa Marina is closer to 'town', with a good supermarket about 2 miles away.

good luck and feel free to ask me anything u might think of...


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## FarCry (Apr 21, 2007)

Galo what are your thoughts on the economy of PR? From speaking to a friend who is currently hauled out in Puerto Del Rey, they have just turned the water off to the boatyard. The sales tax is now 11 percent. Obviously if just leaving a boat for storage the lack of water shouldn't be a major concern but the sales tax will affect every fee and purchase. Teetering on what is in essence bankruptcy, and understanding that massive cuts to all public services will need to be made, would give me concern for security and general stability when the changes really hit the local population. Make no mistake, I really like the SVI and move boats in and out or Puerto Del Ray every year for a charter company to lay them up for hurricane season. I used to find costs much lower in PR than in St Thomas but that is gradually changing. I also must agree that Tortuga on Culebrita is fantastic starting about 4PM when all the power boats run back to Puerto Del Rey leaving it quiet for us to enjoy....


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## Galo (Jun 8, 2015)

Hola Far!
Great question and I'm glad to see that u are up to speed on what's happening on the island...

The economy of PR is in the tank and the government bankrupt. Not officially but practically speaking as they cannot -no way, no how- pay the $73b debt they have amassed from decades of largesse, implementing 'vote chasing' social programs and funding recurring expenses (ala, salaries) with bonds. Now that their borrowing capabilities have been essentially shut off (the very speculative credit ratings from the major credit classification agencies make borrowing impossible at 10%+ interest rates) PR is now faced with having to reduce the size of their government spending by 15-20% and at the same time, come up with enough cash to start servicing the debt.

There's no gumption from the government to reduce that much and the few people who do work (participation rate = 40%) cannot take any more taxes, so PR is in a major death spiral, and *it will get worse before it gets better.
*
My take on the future:
- PR will default
- The PR government will be placed on such tight reins that 10-15% of the folks that work for the government will be laid off and many current 'social welfare' programs will be trimmed or eliminated so that we start a path towards more sustainable spending habits.
- the default will of course, allow the opportunity for the debt to be re-structured
- the combination of those three will eventually allow the economy to start to improve -after 250k more people leave the island.

Personally, we still have a house there -a condo in Palmas Del Mar- which we have just recently put up for sale. Palmas is still nice and it will sell. Our hope is that it sells quick because I'm sure we will have the opportunity to buy something in Palmas again in a few years -something a bit smaller and without a doubt, cheaper. For now, we too are 'leaving PR', if you will.

The shutting off of the water is because of the drought....PR is in the middle of the worst drought in 27 years. It's so bad that basically all of San Juan's water is being rationed: two days without water, one day with. Many other townships in PR are in the same 'two off/one on' schema. The situation should revert to normal with the first good tropical wave/storm, which as u know, should probably be soon -I hope.

I agree the cost of living or doing business in PR has gone up a lot -and probably more quickly than it has in the VIs. In the last two years, exactly 78 new taxes/revenue increase measures have been implemented, including the sales tax increase. I can't say after all this how PR compares to the VIs but certainly, it would be less favorably.

That said, to understand the impact to the boating community, one has to dive deeper into the economics of said boating community, and the fact is that a lot of 'boating money' in PR is 'underground'. Example: a dentist I know does not report any of his 'cash income' to the local IRS -Hacienda. Well, that becomes his 'boat' money -and it must be a lot cuz he has a Beneteau 45. I know the owner of a very fancy restaurant in Hato Rey, recently retired who reported only about 30% of his cash income, the rest becoming his 'play' money. He did the dentist one better, he had a Viking 53.

That under-reporting is rampant in PR and Hacienda can't (or maybe does not want to) catch it, so....even if the economy 'tanks', a lot of this 'hidden money' will still be around to support the boating economy. Sure, maybe it will slow somewhat but....nobody can really kill the underground economy (including drugs, unfortunately) and 'creative income reporting' which together provide a lot if not most of the $$$ to the boating business.

All that said, I do think Villa Marina in particular would be a better place to leave the boat unattended for many weeks than any of the marinas in St Thomas if that time period is during hurricane season....it truly is an excellent -outstanding- 'hurricane hole' marina. Georges hit it with 118 mph winds and there was almost zero vessel damage, so...yeah, it will work.

Thanks for your insightful questions and comments & rgds
Galo


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## FarCry (Apr 21, 2007)

Galo,
Thanks for your view of the situation on PR. Recently PDR was given a cease and desist order for power washing boats. Despite the fact that they can't legally use water for that purpose because of the drought (we are just as dry here), they also had been warned too that they were in violation of environmental laws because they don't have a proper catchment system in place to capture toxic bottom paint at the haulout slip. Even if PR had water, that boatyard has some serious challenges to overcome before it can get back to work....

Assuming that much income is unreported and then used for boating, clearly even the powerboaters are hurting. As you know typically the month of July used to see dozens and dozens, perhaps a hundred or more, sportfish boats in the BVI. This year was dead even over the 4th of July week. There were very few PR registered boats to be seen and no big raftups like we've seen the previous 10 years. The weather was great and seas were calm. My concern would be as the economy continues to implode in PR, crime and desperation by those who, unlike yourself, can't leave will become more commonplace. A comment I heard from a friend who just moved here from PR was, "The only business that is booming now are the moving companies." Many with the financial means to do so, are leaving. On the flipside a fearless speculator may see some potential real estate opportunities. 

I'm struggling to follow your logic of suggesting that one leave their boat and base it out of a place that many residents are fleeing from and the economy is in a death spiral. An %11 sales tax on everything is still astounding to me!

PDM is a beautiful place. I had the opportunity to race in a Heineken regatta based there after they moved it from Culebra. Selling your real estate now and buying back later seems like a very prudent idea. Good luck.


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## Galo (Jun 8, 2015)

Far:
Agree on all counts....I was there for the week of the 4th (7/3 thru 7/10) chartering out of The Moorings and I too noticed that the 'Puerto Rican Navy' was very sorely under-represented compared to years past. In fact, our whole family commented on it...

The logic on leaving the boat in Fajardo if u have to leave the boat unattended _over the late summer is simple_: Villa Marina is one heck of a good hurricane hole, and depending on what is available to you in ST, that alone may be a good reason to consider that option.

Yeah...11.75%....that's just....well, ludicrous.

Have you been to Palmas after they finished the new marina, out in that little protected harbor inside the old breakwater? Just beautiful....and cheap, cuz now they need to 'fill it' more...


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## FarCry (Apr 21, 2007)

Yes I have been to Palmas since the new marina was finished. It is beautiful.


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## stormrider27 (Nov 11, 2011)

A lot of great info in this thread. PR is on my short list of places to retire to in 5 to 10 years. I will be watching the economics of the island.

Thanks
Storm


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