# Warning: Scopolamine (a motion sickness patch) Side Effect



## labatt

Well, this isn't really a side effect, but you should know about this if you use Scopolamine. Here's an excerpt from our blog (located at s/v Pelican - Following A Dream):



> Just a side story. We met George and Kim from _s/v/ Indecent_, a Super Maramu, while here at the Megadock. They are heading to the Keys and then to the Bahamas, and were planning on leaving this morning. As a matter of fact, I went over to their slip this morning to wish them well, and they were just about to leave. This afternoon I saw that they were still in their slip, so I wandered by to see why they didn't leave. Like us, they've been here in Charleston for over two weeks, and while they love it they are also ready to head south. They were especially interested in leaving before the snow tomorrow. I was very curious as to why they were still here.​They weren't on their boat, but their neighbor was out and shared with me that, as they were untying their docklines, Kim was having problems seeing and that one of her eyes was far more dilated than the other. She also felt a bit strange - off balance I believe. Worried, they called their physician who told them to go immediately to the Emergency Room. Upon arriving at the Emergency Room, Kim suffered through a series of tests before they told her that they had no idea what was going on. Since everything seemed to be related to her eyes, they had her see an ophthalmologist. The ophthalmologist spoke with her for a couple of minutes, and then asked her if she had used scopolamine at all. Scopolamine is a prescription drug that is used to minimize motion sickness and is commonly used by sailors to ward off seasickness. It is usually provided in a "patch" form which is stuck behind your ear and lasts for three days. Kim had just put on a patch that morning. One of the side effects of Scopolamine is that it will dilate your pupils. Kim must have touched the patch with her fingers and then rubbed her eyes, causing stroke-like symptoms and initiating panicked-husband syndrome. Anyway, she's doing fine now and they also plan to head out on Wednesday. True story!​


By the way, the stuff is actually used by eye doctors to cause pupil dilation during testing. More info on it can be found at Scopolamine - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I will say that it has been our most effective choice for combating seasickness. We've been in some nasty stuff and felt fine. Our only side effects have been migraine like symptoms if you take the patch off and then immediately go to sleep.


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## Faster

I was always warned not to touch the eyes after applying the patch until you've washed your hands. 

Good to get this out there again!


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## Giulietta

Thank you Labatt..excellent post.

(now...we don't want anyone with their eyes open to look at a Maramu, do we??? (VBG))


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## xort

EXCELLENT post; great idea to share it here.


BTW, your link is wrong, forgot the 'blog'


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## btrayfors

The warning to wash your hands is clearly marked on the labels which accompany TransScop. Still, many of us forget, or don't do a thorough job.

I've used scop.. for years on offshore passages. Works well for me. But, I have occasionally had the damned patch fall off, particularly if it were somehow rubbed inadvertently or in rainy weather. 

So, I've found a workaround for that which works very well for me: after applying the little scopalamine patch, I put a healthy-sized waterproof bandaid over it. This holds it in place nicely, even if the area gets "bumped" or scratched.

Bill


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## c40eb

If this does happen to you (your pupils dilate), and you're out in the daylight...make sure you keep your sunglasses on. Your pupil won't contract with the brighter light...bad for your retinas.


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## bubb2

good post, thanks for sharing the info!


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## sailortjk1

Thanks.


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## WouldaShoulda

I thought the "side effect" was going to be an uncontrollable urge not to lie!!


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## Cruisingdad

Good post.

Scope is my favorite seasickness drug too. It works well. It does require putting it on BEFORE leaving... generally 24 hours prior, though you can push that up some.

Some other difficulties you will find with this drug is looking through binocs and focusing on maps/words. Large type you can make out with some effort, small type... forget it. The drug intentionally screws up the signals between brain and eyes. As such, navigating via maps become much more laborous. 

- CD


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## painkiller

I've used Transderm Scop with no side effects and found it effective. However, one of the side effects is some sort of craziness, so we all kept an eye on each other. I did have trouble keeping it on in wet weather, though.


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## Cruisingdad

painkiller said:


> I've used Transderm Scop with no side effects and found it effective. However, one of the side effects is some sort of craziness, so we all kept an eye on each other. I did have trouble keeping it on in wet weather, though.


The craziness your crew showed and lack of side effects might be attributed to the fact that it is not a suppository. Try letting them put it behind their ears next time.

- CD


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## hellosailor

'Scope' is serious meds. Anyone who pops prescription medication without reading the warnings and contraindications, is setting themselves up for problems.

FWIW most or all of the meds that are available as transdermal patches (i.e. fentanyl, nicotine, scopalamine) contain the same warnings that you must not CUT the patch, must not handle the patch any more than needed, and must wash thoroughly after handling it.

Scopalamine is also available as Scopace, in pill form. Which doesn't have same "wear" and handling problems that a patch has. I prefer the pill form, I've got more control over the dosage.

The side effects of the drug itself can include heart arhythmia, halucinations, psychotic reactions, and yes, potential blindness because of eye pressure problems in glaucoma patients IIRC. SERIOUS MEDS. But then again, seasickness can kill you too. 

Up through the 80's scope was available OTC without an rx, and then it was pulled from the US market because allegedly it was being used in combination with other pills as a date rape drug. Then the patches went off the market because all the patch machinery was being used to sell highly profitable nicotine patches to smokers.

Bottom line--you've got to read up on drugs before you use them, the doc and the pharmacist just aren't going to spend a whole lot of time with you these days.


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## sailingdog

Good post. Reading the fine print is especially important on transdermal drug patches. Many will contain enough medication after their use to be dangerous.


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## eherlihy

Thanks for the post. Good info.

A nit, however: the correct URL is; s/v Pelican - Following A Dream and the story begins on Monday, January 19, 2009.


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## AE28

labatt...
Thanks for this thread.
This drug was referenced in the move _Guns of Navarone _as a truth serum.
I've tried to look it up but never got quite close enough with the spelling.
Paul


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## Valiente

Pupil dilation? I'm too lazy to google this, but it sounds like it's related to atropine (aka belladonna) and that's part of a whole family of serious and occasionally deadly drugs.

Atropine was in the drops used to dilate pupils when I was a kid...a kid who always seemed to have an eye exam in the brightest months of summer...


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## painkiller

Cruisingdad said:


> The craziness your crew showed and lack of side effects might be attributed to the fact that it is not a suppository. Try letting them put it behind their ears next time.
> 
> - CD


Well that just takes all of the fun out of it. Besides, that's where I keep my half-chewed gum for safe-keeping (behind my ear).


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## sailingdog

A nit, as it is currently January 27, 2009, should that not be BEGAN, not begins.  :laugher:laugher


eherlihy said:


> Thanks for the post. Good info.
> 
> A nit, however: the correct URL is; s/v Pelican - Following A Dream and the story begins on Monday, January 19, 2009.


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## tigerregis

How come it took 13 posts before the active ingredient was spelled correctly? All those brilliant repostes and commentary should be judged accordingly.


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## Boasun

I used the patch once and found that it gave me a personality shift, from normal to a zombie state... Needless to say, I never used it again.


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## CalebD

Why not try ginger in all or any of its forms (dried, fresh, Ginger Ale, Ginger Beer)? Ginger Beer with a little rum may not get you drunk but will likely calm down your brain which is where the sea sickness originates. In my limited offshore experience ginger has worked for me.
Of course, in a really nasty sea way all bets are off.


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## padean

Boasun said:


> I used the patch once and found that it gave me a personality shift, from normal to a zombie state... Needless to say, I never used it again.


We sometimes slap a patch on the skipper during one of the Mackinaw races - he stops demanding so many damm sail changes in the middle of the night.

Actually, one of the most common side effects is a felling of fogginess or a mild "zombie" state, which is important in racers since they tend to react a little slower. It makes me a little worried when I hear people drive with the patch on....

By the way, I haven't seen this much of a response to side effect threads even on medical blog sites (Doc by day, sailor by weekend). I should see if I can get CME credit for this thread. It is nice to see that sailors are paying attention.


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## labatt

Well, for all of the negative effects that have been mentioned, the only effect we've seen (ourselves) to date is drymouth and migraine like symptoms if you take it off and go right to sleep. Outside of that - no personality changes or anything. We'll keep an eye out though... the longest we've worn it for was four days (using two patches since they only last 3 days each).


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## hellosailor

Zombie state, slow state, cottonmouth, dilated eyes and the need for dark dark glasses...All beat the hell out of being seasick!

Ginger is great, ginger beer is great--but adding anything with alcohol is generally a good way to induce seasickness. Ginger beer being non-alcoholic, just like "Ginger Ale".


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## CalebD

HS,
I guess it is just me then and I have not been in any really snotty weather on the ocean. 
Yes, Ginger Beer is non-alcoholic but I found that even a regular beer or two was enough alcohol to take away some of the mental stress that I just felt better with the boat in constant motion. 
OTOH, I have been able to keep my cookies in my stomach while in the cabin by looking out the ports at the horizon even while the 50' boat was banging into 5 - 6' seas. At night the horizon can be pretty hard to spot though so clipping in to to a harness is a good idea even for the unsteady of gait. 
Perhaps I read too much Patrick O'Brian and believe in the British theory of grog for sailors (mixed with lemon or lime juice of course). 
I am no MD but on land I like a little C2H5OH (alcohol) and I also like it on the water. I am pretty sure that not one solution works 100 per cent for everyone. Some weather conditions can make most of the crew of even the most stable of merchant marine ships ill.
That said, it is nice to know that Scopalamine exists and that one should take care from getting any of it in ones eyes.


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## sailingdog

One nausea remedy I keep on my boat, mainly cause I like snacking on them, are ginger snap cookies. These help settle the stomach and absorb the acid that can make being nauseous worse. The ginger also helps reduce/eliminate the nausea. My favorites are the Trader Joe's Triple Ginger Ginger Snaps.


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## xort

I wanted to keep Ginger aboard, but "Maryann" objected to it.


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## PalmettoSailor

The latest PS has an article on Sea sickness drugs. Of course the one most folks found effective (Stugeron) and having the most acceptable side effects is not available in the US, but can be had over the counter in Canada, UK and Mexico. 

The studies found transderm scopolamine very effective but the majority of those reporting experienced unacceptable side effects. They did say it is effective for stopping vomiting even after seasickness set in, so for that reason it might be worth having on board. Given the fairly severe side effects, I don't think I'd be willing to use transderm scop as a preventative measure.


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## WouldaShoulda

AE28 said:


> labatt...
> Thanks for this thread.
> This drug was referenced in the move _Guns of Navarone _as a truth serum.
> I've tried to look it up but never got quite close enough with the spelling.
> Paul


If just one person gets the joke, it's worth it!!


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## mccary

sailingdog said:


> A nit, as it is currently January 27, 2009, should that not be BEGAN, not begins.  :laugher:laugher
> 
> Originally Posted by *eherlihy*
> _Thanks for the post. Good info.
> 
> A nit, however: the correct URL is; s/v Pelican - Following A Dream and the story begins on Monday, January 19, 2009._




Interesting... my wife the English teacher, says that both can be correct. But, I never liked having my pastimes "corrected". So have it your way.


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## eherlihy

sailingdog said:


> One nausea remedy I keep on my boat, mainly cause I like snacking on them, are ginger snap cookies. These help settle the stomach and absorb the acid that can make being nauseous worse. The ginger also helps reduce/eliminate the nausea. My favorites are the Trader Joe's Triple Ginger Ginger Snaps.


I will second 'Dog's suggestion about Ginger Snaps. However, I find that eating too many will _cause_ the acid mentioned. (I love Ginger Snaps.) For that reason, when the admiral and I have set off, I always bring some of the Japanese pickled ginger (Gari) with us. I have never had a upset stomach from it, and find that it settles my stomach quickly without side effects. You can pick it up in the Fish/Sushi section of many supermarkets (over the counter, no prescription necessary!), where it is sold as a condiment for about $1-










Also, Mccary. I agree with your wife, and SD. It all depends upon your interpretation, and my intent. I'll take another stab at it; The correct URL is; s/v Pelican - Following A Dream and the entry beginning on Monday, January 19, 2009.

- Ed


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## infonote

Do motion sickness bracelets actually work?
I have seen them a few times. I do not suffer motion sickness, however if it really works I wouldn't mind having one.

Thanks in advance.


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## AE28

infonote said:


> Do motion sickness bracelets actually work?
> I have seen them a few times. I do not suffer motion sickness, however if it really works I wouldn't mind having one.
> 
> Thanks in advance.


I think there are two styles, one working on pressure points and the other utilizing an electric stimulus.

My Wife suffers from mal de mer and has had very good luck with the pressure point version.

I think they're about $10.00/pair.

Paul


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## sailingdog

Yes, they do work for nausea, as my wife used them when going through chemo. Should work on a boat just as well.


infonote said:


> Do motion sickness bracelets actually work?
> I have seen them a few times. I do not suffer motion sickness, however if it really works I wouldn't mind having one.
> 
> Thanks in advance.


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## camaraderie

They did not work on my kid or wife when we tried them.


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## Valiente

The whole anti-seasickness idea seems hit and miss. One method will work in one person, another won't help at all. I've been on crews where one person had the patch, another the bracelet, a third smelled like gingerbread and the fourth was naked to the elements, seasickness-wise.

(I wonder what proportion of sailors are born immune. It's been said that there are seas that will make anyone sick, but some claim that they've never experienced it. Both times I've been ill have involved smacks to the top of my head...other than that, nothing.)


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## jackdale

My wife is a pharmacist; she does not advise using Transderm-V Scopolamine. Your skin must be absolutely dry and clean, and free of sunscreen. If you do touch the patch, you have to wash your hands thoroughly in soap and water. It does not always work. The two worst case of seasickness I have witnessed were with users of Scopolamine. One was sick all the way from Bermuda to St. Barthes. The

I use dimenhydrinate, a generic form of Gravol and Dramamine. I get a little drowsy on a full dose, so I take just one. It takes me about 8 hours to get my sealegs, so the one is generally all I need.


I had heard great things about Stugeron, but it can also have side effects. One tablet put one of my crew to sleep for 12 hours.

The sea bands have no proven benefit for motion sickness. They have been tested for nausea among pregnant women.

Regardless of what you are using, check it out the side-effects at home before going offshore. The dry mouth side effect of Scopolamine was too much for me.

I carry candied ginger for those who do get sick, but mainly because I eat it like candy .

Jack


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## hellosailor

infonote, pretty much EVERY seasickness remedy works for no more than 1/3 of the general public.

The wrist bands work that well IF you place the "button" on the accupressure point aqnd keep it there, which means the band has to fit snuggly. Move the button 1/4" to 1/2", and it is out of position and CANNOT work.

The ReliefBand (electronic) device works for more people and of course is adjustable for fit like a watch strap. It has the advantage of adjustable power settings, but again it must be kept in position or it CANNOT work.

Nothing works for everyone, everything works a bit better or worse than the next cure--for you. For me ginger or bands will keep the edge off. A reliefband will do a yeomanlike job. But when the wx calls for living in foulies and boots, I need the scop. (Then I get to make fun of all the green faces around me.[g] )


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## billyruffn

Adding one more point to many...

It's not a good idea to replace the Scop patch when it wears out in about 3 days. I did that once and when the new dose of meds hit my bloodstream it really did me in -- worst headache of my life. One is enough! If you're still sick after three days try something else.


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## labatt

BTW... I just read the PS article... they only interviewed 38 people + a couple of other "experts". There is no way you can draw any sort of statistical conclusion from surveying 38 people. I know they said they compared it to other reports, but make sure you take their report for what it is... an opinion piece. I'm sticking with Scopalamine for now... But to each their own.


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## therapy23

The original post is informative but the real message to be gleaned is........

READ THE DIRECTIONS!


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## AjariBonten

I had great luck with Scope last summer. My only problem is that in the working environment I was in the patches kept rubbing off. I gonna look for an oral version before my next major deployment.


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## AjariBonten

Also, a product called "Kwells" worked very well for me the one time scopolamine failed.


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## MattyG

*Scopolamine Messed Me Up Big Time...*

I took it for 7 days (patch) and 24 hours after removal I had severe anxiety, no appitite, extreme fatigue; then 2 days in to this I passed out and required 7 stiches in my forehead. After a week I thought I was better but then had bouts of clautrophobia, anxiety, depression lasting from a few minutes to a several days for 18 months. I am warning you... yes if it works for you great, but be aware that for a LOT of people the side effects are SEVERE and IMHO its not worth the risk. I feel like I lost a year of my life to this stuff- it was that bad.


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## labatt

Interesting and thanks for sharing. You're the first person I've heard who has had side effects after removal, but I know it happens. We knew quite a few people using it while we were out cruising and it was usually either considered a miracle drug, or not (for those that had some side effects while wearing it). The only person I know of who had side effects, and that was from an accident, was the person I mentioned at the beginning of this thread. 

I can say that my doctor did warn us that there may be (but in most cases won't be) side effects after removal with prolonged use, but he said prolonged use was 2-3 weeks. I wonder if they overdosed you? I just looked around and it says that the experiences you had happen rarely - I'm just curious when you say "a lot of people" where you got that from. 

BTW - don't take this post negatively. I have no doubt that you had issues and others have issues too. I just want to be careful with you saying this is a common occurrence vs. what I found as it being an uncommon, but real, occurrence.

It's an extremely helpful drug in many circumstances and I'd hate to scare people away from it. My family and friends who used it had side effects limited to dry mouth and some emotional amplification (kind of like a "truth serum"). No other side effects. But... your mileage may vary.


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## travlin-easy

Fortunately, I stopped getting seasick when I got out of the U.S. Navy in 1960. My limited memories of Scopolamine date back to the mid 1960s when I worked in medicine. We used the drug to help induce labor in women who were in an overdue state of pregnancy, while at the same time providing them some relief from the pains of labor. It worked quite well. My daughter, who gets seasick while looking at boats from the dock, used the Scop patch on an offshore fishing trip. Shortly after putting the patch in place, she fell asleep and didn't wake up until an hour after we reached the dock. The only time she was awake was when she was reeling in fish.

Scopolamine is a very, very powerful antihistamine, and as such it has all of the ordinary side effects associated with nearly every form of antihistamine. The actual dosage supplied from the patch is very minute--just 330 micrograms. While there have been some nasty side effects associated with the patch, in reality, the percentage of individuals affected adversely is quite small. I suspect, the adverse effects of seasickness are far worse, particularly when the weather is horrendous for several days on end. Dehydration and death from seasickness is probably a much greater threat to offshore sailors than the adverse effects of any seasickness preventative drug.

Cheers,

Gary


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## rockDAWG

Scopolamine withdraw side effect has been well documented since the mid 90's. It is the extension of its pharmacological effect as the body starts to down-regulate its receptors. A small percent of patients can be more sensitive than others. Every xenobiotic has side effect, scopolamine is no difference. Even it is a very old drug, it will never be sold as an OTC drug for this very reason. If you are experiencing the redraw symptom, consult your physician. 

There are many remedy to control this side effect. Ask your doc to prescribe a few day supply of oral meclizine will do the trick. Reducing the dose of scopolamine over a period of time is another way.

Scopolamine patch is a wonderful drug/device, it helps many sailors during the rough seas. I certainly do not want others afraid of using it. Just like sailing, it is fun but it can kill too.


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## rockDAWG

travlineasy said:


> Fortunately, I stopped getting seasick when I got out of the U.S. Navy in 1960. My limited memories of Scopolamine date back to the mid 1960s when I worked in medicine. We used the drug to help induce labor in women who were in an overdue state of pregnancy, while at the same time providing them some relief from the pains of labor. It worked quite well. My daughter, who gets seasick while looking at boats from the dock, used the Scop patch on an offshore fishing trip. Shortly after putting the patch in place, she fell asleep and didn't wake up until an hour after we reached the dock. The only time she was awake was when she was reeling in fish.
> 
> Scopolamine is a very, very powerful antihistamine, and as such it has all of the ordinary side effects associated with nearly every form of antihistamine. The actual dosage supplied from the patch is very minute--just 330 micrograms. While there have been some nasty side effects associated with the patch, in reality, the percentage of individuals affected adversely is quite small. I suspect, the adverse effects of seasickness are far worse, particularly when the weather is horrendous for several days on end. Dehydration and death from seasickness is probably a much greater threat to offshore sailors than the adverse effects of any seasickness preventative drug.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Gary


I agree everything you said except if I recall correctly scopolamine is not considered in a class of antihistamine. It is an anticholinergic.


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## hellosailor

There are reasons for the many pages of fine print that are distributed with scop. And like the dawg, I'm certain scop is NOT an antihistamine.

On dosage, no one seems to understand it. At least, neither the doctor nor pharmacist could figure that one out for me. Apparently the dose is "per person" not by body weight or any other obvious criteria. Vague mumbles about "all brains weigh about the same thing, the dose is per brain not per body" which is another reason I prefer the pill (Scopace) so you can just take the next one a little sooner, or not so soon, and adjust the dose based on how good or bad you are responding to it.

Scop can kill you. So can seasickness.

For a remedy that has no drug effects, try the Chewing Rat, aka the electronic relief band. FDA approved especially for pregnant woman, and if you've ever worn one for a couple of hours set on "high" you'll understand why it is very much like having a rat chewing at your wrist. Which, like mad scop psychosis, can be a good thing compared to the alternatives.


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## eherlihy

I was looking for another post, when I cam across this thread again.

I recently saw a documentary on Scopolamine, - aka Columbian Devil's Breath, that will scare it the hell off your boat...

Look here:http://www.vice.com/vice-news/colombian-devil-s-breath-1-of-2#ooid=V1Z3hjMzp3hhFheNkU60QUnOPu2gfQdy


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## hellosailor

Scare the hell...Oh, you mean like Reefer Madness?

Scop is serious meds. And if you've ever spent 24 hours puking up green bile, you may quickly convert and worship in the House of Scop.

If those web folks really just wanted to explore scop, they could have simply gotten an rx and tried it under supervision in the US. But that's not glitzy and wouldn't help them sell ad space for beer. Oooh, BEER! Apparently they never heard of the Temperance Movement, either. Another banned substance!


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## eherlihy

Ya, I guess that they are working the excitement angle. Also, I doubt that anyone is going to grind up a patch and blow it in your face.. 

Regardless, it is serious meds, and I will stick to ginger - gari.


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## Jeff_H

Do any of you have any experience with stugeron? I keep hearing it touted by serious sailors who have had seasickness issues. My wife tends to have her moments and so we have been looking for something more effective than Bonine.


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## justflie

Thanks for sharing.


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## jackdale

Jeff_H said:


> Do any of you have any experience with stugeron? I keep hearing it touted by serious sailors who have had seasickness issues. My wife tends to have her moments and so we have been looking for something more effective than Bonine.


Do not believe the stories that it has no side-effects; all drugs have side-effects. One crew member was out for 12 hours after using stugeron.

My wife, a pharmacist, recommends generic Gravol; she cautions gainst scopolamine because it can effect cognitive abilities. Test out drugs *before* you go sailing; they effect different folks in different ways.


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## SimonV

Jeff_H said:


> Do any of you have any experience with stugeron? I keep hearing it touted by serious sailors who have had seasickness issues. My wife tends to have her moments and so we have been looking for something more effective than Bonine.


Yes I carry it on board and it is the best the only side effect I and those I know to use it is a bit of cotton mouth. I got my supply from England via the net, as it has not been passed by the AMA here in Oz. Customs check it each time and it gets passed on to me no problems.


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## SlowButSteady

There may be a good reason stugeron (=cinnarizine) isn't available in the US (from Wikipedia):

"...cinnarizine is also known to cause acute and chronic parkinsonism [citation needed] probably due to its affinity for D2 receptors...]

BTW, several years ago a colleague of mine had an experience with a Transderm Scop patch similar to that described in the opening post of this thread. In his case, he was on an oceanographic research vessel about a thousand miles from nowhere when one eye dilated. Fortunately, the crew of the ship had seen that sort of thing a couple of times before, so the panic was pretty short-lived.


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## Minnewaska

At a Safety at Sea seminar, there was a story told of a very experienced crew member trying to get off the boat to walk home. It took several of them to restrain him and secure him below. He was on one of the neurological seasick meds. Very, very important that you try them several times at home prior to being offshore.

For me, I don't use them. I will very occasionally use Bonine, which I'm told is an antihistamine, and find that after about 12 to 18 hours, long after its worn off, I am almost incapable of remaining awake. That's all the trouble I need. 

Keeping well hydrated, a constant small amount of bland food in my stomach, good nights rest, no booze and I can take most of what is dished out without medicating. Thank goodness.


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## copacabana

JeffH, I keep stugeron on board for the few times that we think the sea state is going to lead to quisiness. It works very well and has presented no side effects so far on my boat. Here it comes in 2 doses and we use the minimum dosage (one third of a regular dosage). Take it an hour before you board and again, if necessary, 8 to 12 hours later. It's always a good idea to try any seasickness medication at home before you use it on a boat. That way, if there is any side effect or you don't feel well, you are near medical help (or can suffer in the comfort of your home until it wears off). I believe Stugeron is widely used among cruising sailors because it doesn't make you sleepy or have side effects for most people. I have used it (once) for 3 days running and didn't feel any side effects whatsoever. Usually 3 days is the maximum time one needs to get over sea sickness anyway, so it's hard to imagine people taking the medication for days or weeks on end. Stugeron is available in Brazil over the counter.


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## Jeff_H

Thank you everyone for your imput. Barbara has tried the 15 mg dose of stugeron and had no obvious side effects so we were considering graduating to that as her preventative med but wanted to see if any one knew of serious issues with it. At this point, we will try it and see how it goes. 

Jeff


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## hellosailor

Jeff-
Sturgeron is one of the many drugs that are OTC in one country, but totally illegal in the next.
I had only one problem when I tried Sturgeron: It didn't do _anything _for me. No side effects, but no effects at all.

Which comes back to: With any seasickness med, take it at home on a weekend or somet other time you'll have company and comfort. See if it knocks you out or sends you to the ER. If it has no adverse effects, then you move on to phase 2, take it a couple of hours before sailing and see if it actually DOES anything for you on the boat.

Like all the other meds, apparently it works 100% for some 30% of the people who take it.


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## nolatom

This has been informative for me. I don't take the stuff, but as a part-time sailing instructor it helps to be aware of the effects and side-effects since some of my students tell (or don't tell) me they're using a patch.

That said, in many years the only concern I've had with students (besides minor first aid stuff) has been funny-tummy and seasickness, not a med reaction (I think). Opinions may vary, but I've found heading for the harbor helps a lot, putting them on the tiller usually helps, and some sprite or something fizzy may help. And not making them feel bad about having to head in early also helps, they already feel bad enough. I call it 'extra harbor/docking practice, it'll be fun..' and sometimes we head back out with the rest of us if student is feeling better ashore with a comfortable place to wait.

Any other tips about other preventitive meds, such as good ole dramamine, etc?


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## jackdale

I would suggest that folks check out the sites that cover the drugs such as:

STUGERON® TABLETS

The web site itself is

South African Electronic Package Inserts

And check with your pharmacist.

EDIT - another site http://www.webmd.com/drugs/index-drugs.aspx


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## jackdale

nolatom said:


> Any other tips about other preventitive meds, such as good ole dramamine, etc?


try Dramamine Oral : Uses, Side Effects, Interactions, Pictures, Warnings & Dosing - WebMD


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## hellosailor

Tom,
You might want to consider discretely asking about meds and illnesses before any trip out. Someone might look pale and pass out--because they're on blood pressure meds, or other meds that affect blood pressure. Or they might be on scop, and suffer blurred vision indicating a dangerous change in pressure in the eye, something that needs treatment ASAP to prevent damage. One just never knows, so it is simpler to ask. And to remind them, there's no handy ambulance service on a boat, always let the captain know if there's ANY chance to anything to look out for.

On a more mundane basis...Carry ginger ale instead of Sprite. Ginger is one of the oldest and most effective remedies for minor seasickness. It is a rubificient, that is, something which makes your skin "red" because it opens up the capillaries. When this happens you get higher capillary bllod flow, higher oxygenation, and the extra oxygen apparently is the mechanism that alleves seasickness for many folks.

Ginger candy, ginger beer, ginger ale...all good and the only side effect may be the hiccups.<G> Ginger ale used to be a standard treatment for gippy tummy. Not as effective as the hard meds, but a gentle way to start.


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## jackdale

HS - good advise.

We ask our students to fill in a medical information form which is keep in the chart table. We ask about maladies and medications. I also ask them to share with the others. I have / had a issue with neuromediated syncope. When I faint I may be unconscious for up to three hours. There is no treatment, I do try to prevent it with electrolyte drinks. They need to know that. 

BTW - get ginger ale with real ginger, Canada Dry. It also rpovides some sustenance. Canaded ginger is great - I just like the taste and will eat it without having any symptoms.


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## therapy23

SlowButSteady said:


> BTW, several years ago a colleague of mine had an experience with a Transderm Scop patch similar to that described in the opening post of this thread. In his case, he was on an oceanographic research vessel about a thousand miles from nowhere when one eye dilated. Fortunately, the crew of the ship had seen that sort of thing a couple of times before, so the panic was pretty short-lived.


Another classic example of "you can't help stupid".  All instructions with scope patches are explicit about washing your hands after handling. Big letters and all. 

Too bad he missed that part.

You can go blind you know.


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## nolatom

Thanks HS. I do ask the general "any medical conditions or meds I should be aware of so I'll have a clue if anything should happen, you can tell me privately" question when we do the safety briefing. Usually met with silence so who knows what they choose not to tell you.

I'll add ginger ale to the Coke or juice box I bring for that heat-exhaustion look (Louisiana in summer) or diabetic who goes into a cold sweat (the former has happened, latter has not). Fortunately, we're usually the prototypical "three hour tour" within a couple miles of home so help is not far away by portable VHF or cell phone. Not unusual to have a nurse or doctor on board either through the luck of the draw.


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## Noelex

Scop does sometimes effect vision. The most pronounced side effects occur if the drug gets directly in the eye, but there can be effects from just the systemic absorption.
The visual effects are making the pupil larger and reducing the eyes focusing ability. The greatest effect will be an inability to read, particularly in poor light. Using reading glasses can restore some of this ability and it may be advisable for people using this drug on a yacht to have these available. +2.00 is a sensible power for emergencies.



hellosailor said:


> Or they might be on scop, and suffer blurred vision indicating a dangerous change in pressure in the eye, something that needs treatment ASAP to prevent damage.


Blurred vision is a common side effect and very rarely indicates a dangerous pressure. There are some cases of a dangerous pressure developing, but the risk is remote. 
Unfortunatly those cases where a dangerous pressure occurs are very difficult to differentiate from symptoms alone. Concerning signs are coloured halos around lights ( like a small circular rainbow), pain in the eye and nausea, but high pressure can occur without these or even any symptoms.
High pressure needs treatment ASAP, but to diagnose these cases and to differentiate them for the much more common simple blurred vision on a boat is very difficult.


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## travlin-easy

Sturgeron, like nearly all seasick remedies is a fairly potent antihistamine, and as such it has some nasty side effects, particularly with women who are pregnant or nursing, but not limited to those conditions. For mild seasickness, gingerale seems to work OK, but it's marginal at best when the person cannot keep anything down for more than a few minutes.

When I was a young man and working in the field of medicine, Scopolamine was often used to induce labor for women that were overdue--it worked very well in that regard. The Scopolamine patch was introduced sometime in the 1970s, and at the time it was available by prescription ONLY. It did a great job, but most relatively young, lightweight ladies had the tendency to fall asleep throughout the entire voyage or until the patch fell off.

Cheers,

Gary


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## SlowButSteady

therapy23 said:


> Another classic example of "you can't help stupid".  All instructions with scope patches are explicit about washing your hands after handling. Big letters and all.
> 
> Too bad he missed that part.
> 
> You can go blind you know.


Well, I wasn't there; and the incident was something like 25 or 30 years ago. So I don't know exactly how the drug was transferred. But, everyone makes mistakes from time to time. That doesn't mean anyone was "stupid". A little careless, perhaps.


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## travlin-easy

Some folks never read the label or the dosage instructions. The label clearly states Scopolamine Transdermal Patch.

"To apply the patch, follow the directions provided by the manufacturer and these steps:

After washing the area behind the ear, wipe the area with a clean, dry tissue to ensure that the area is dry.

Remove the patch from its protective pouch. To expose the adhesive surface of the patch, the clear plastic protective strip should be peeled off and discarded.* Contact with the exposed adhesive layer should be avoided to prevent contamination of fingers with scopolamine.* *Temporary blurred vision and dilation of the pupils may result if scopolamine comes into contact with your eyes.*

1. Place the adhesive side against the skin.

2. Press the patch firmly for 10-20 seconds. Be sure that the edges adhere to your skin.

3. After you have placed the patch behind your ear, *wash your hands thoroughly*.

At the end of 3 days, or when the scopolamine patch is no longer needed, remove the patch and throw it away. Wrap the patch in tissue or paper to avoid exposing anyone else to the remaining medication. *Wash your hands and the area behind your ear thoroughly to remove any traces of scopolamine from the area.* If a new patch needs to be applied, place a fresh patch on the hairless area behind your other ear.

Gary


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## jrd22

I remember one tuna fishing trip in 20+' seas where I was pushing on the patch behind my ear, hard, to try and get an extra dose)


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## therapy23

jrd22 said:


> I remember one tuna fishing trip in 20+' seas where I was pushing on the patch behind my ear, hard, to try and get an extra dose)


Accupressure eh?


> It is used to treat many conditions, most famously nausea. It works for any type of nausea: morning sickness, car sickness, and sea sickness. In fact, this point is the reason those magnetic wristbands work while you are on a cruise


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## zeehag

scopolomine also causes hallucinations in some folks. use with care. ye dont need elephants walking in your sailing path.......


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## hellosailor

Elephants?!

You'll find most aquatic elephants respond well when hailed "STARBOARD!".

When I take scop I make a point to let everyone on the boat know that I _may _become a psychopathic axe murderer, but other than that, I'll be fully functional. No one seems to mind, although I haven't seen the damage control axe in it's usual place for a while now, come to think of it. <G>

After all, you've worked the ER. Which would you rather have, a psycho? Or someone rolfing on the floor for hours on end?


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## Cruisingdad

We carry pepermint which helps. It was good to have things beside ginger for us because once you puke ginger, the smell of it will make you nauseaus. Don't ask me how I know! Perpermint is a very mild remedy and very cheap. If you are severly seasick, probably won't work.

We will often get real ginger ginger ale. You can often buy this from nutritional stores. We have carried (and do carry) Canada Dry, but it does not seem to have nearly the ginger content of some of the other ones you buy. We carry it because we like it outside of its ginger uses.

Ginger snaps are very high in ginger. That is the best sources for us. Ginger gives me terrible burps so I don't take it unless via a can, but I am not real receptive to getting sick either until seas exceed about 10' for over 24 hours.

Scope is my drug of choice. Depending on when/where we are going, it is not unusual for me to put it on ahead of time. I canot read details on a map and reading details via binocs are very difficult. This is a very common side effect. 

We also carry phenegren. This can be administered to kids. This is our second round choice if scope does not work. We do not give scope to the kids, but ginger and pepermint (pepermint being their favorite). To date, we have never had to give the kids phenegren.

I think the best remedy is staying outside, even sleeping in the cockpit, and letting someont drive. Make sure there is good ventilation. Diesel fumes are a killer for me. Hand steering the boat helps. 

We also carry a puke bucket(s). I think this is one of our most vital pieces of equipment. There is nothing more dangerous than someone tha is already sick, in a sea/storm, trying to puke over the side of the boat. We line it several times with bags and put tp in the bottom so that after an episode, you can "remove" it somewhere quick so the smell and sight does not effect anyone else. We personally throw it in the tender.

There you go. THere's all my remedies and what we do for kiddos, etc.

Brian


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## zeehag

psychos cause major health damage in others when they blow and attack. btdt--had it happen within feet of me. i would much rather put up with a puker--there are much better meds to give in er than scop, and is done with great results.
we would give phenergan then whatever worked after that didnt--we had many choices to give iv. same in post anes care units...

i like to keep ginger cookies on board--those work well--ginger snaps, ginger ale, many ways to make stuff for pukers work when they cant get the seasick thing gone. 

had one crew who got seasick, he will sail with me again---but i will soooo try to have ginger snaps for him, and ginger tea and ginger ale.....whatever it takes.


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