# Sink on San Juan 21?



## leland515 (Sep 26, 2009)

I'm planning on doing a good bit of cruising this summer, and I'd like to have a sink with a manual pump, and legal draining system.. for <$200.. Is this reasonable?
It doesn't have to be very big, I just need something legal and relatively nice looking.
Ideas?


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## bobmcgov (Jul 19, 2007)

My word. Not sure it's ever been done. This is a boat without sitting headroom!  Some people have set a removable sink basin in the various liner bulges, but I've never seen a seacock or thru hull or holding tank on one. Why bother? You're roughly 3' away from a roomy cockpit, which itself is 14" above the lake/sea/ocean. We wash dishes by holding them over the side.

I'd recommend one of those collapsible sinks used for rafting: When it's not on sink duty, ours acts as a spinnaker turtle! About $15. A heavy-duty rubber feed bucket is another option. These work as bailers, and in a pinch you can tie your kedge to it and huck it off the stern as a storm drogue.

Never seen a fixed head on a SJ21, either. It's a PortaPotti-with-knees-under-your-chin kind of boat.


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## tommays (Sep 9, 2008)

I have a sink on the J24 with the hand pump and 5 gallon tank that has and above waterline drain 

Its built into the boat pretty nice with a molded to fit tank and its a nice place to brush the teeth and was your hands after using the head

Of course your doing that on your knees


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## catamount (Sep 8, 2002)

The cockpit footwell already has a drain into the keel trunk. What more do you need?

I don't think there's anything about sink drains on boats that makes them legal or illegal, although that may depend on where you're cruising.

The legalities really come into play when you start talking about toilets on boats. For an SJ21, a "porta-potty" is gonna be your best bet. I have one of these on my SJ21...


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## tager (Nov 21, 2008)

In Washington it is legal to discharge grey water, just not things that come out of your body. So a sink can be run out of a normal thru hull. I am pretty sure that there is a cockpit drain on a SJ21 so just tap into that if available. I wouldn't worry about having hand pumped water, the hand pumps are dumb because you can't use your hand while pumping. Go for a foot pump, or just stuff the whole thing and put one of those camping water bags so that it drains into the sink. You can install a sink pretty cheap if you are handy, a deep plastic container works great. The most expensive part is the sink drain hardware with a plug and strainer.


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## tager (Nov 21, 2008)

Two buckets can't be beat for simplicity... just use good judgment.


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## leland515 (Sep 26, 2009)

I was thinking of using a medium sized stainless steel bowl as the basin, drilling a hole in the center for a drain, and mounting a pump to flow into it. I would mount all this on the raised fiberglass box in the cabin, most likely. I found an automatic pump for pretty cheap, would probably want to use that; it would actually be simpler to use than to consume more space with a footpump.

I'm going to use this boat as a cruiser for me alone, will not be having guests on it overnight, I take friends out for sails but they will probably never spend the night. Most of my friends have their own boat anyways.

I'll be using a porta-potti like you've suggested, also- just wanted an easy to use sink/way to get water from my tanks I plan on installing (10-15gal)


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## leland515 (Sep 26, 2009)

tager said:


> In Washington it is legal to discharge grey water, just not things that come out of your body. So a sink can be run out of a normal thru hull. I am pretty sure that there is a cockpit drain on a SJ21 so just tap into that if available. I wouldn't worry about having hand pumped water, the hand pumps are dumb because you can't use your hand while pumping. Go for a foot pump, or just stuff the whole thing and put one of those camping water bags so that it drains into the sink. You can install a sink pretty cheap if you are handy, a deep plastic container works great. The most expensive part is the sink drain hardware with a plug and strainer.


Plug and strainer??
Why not just a tub plug, $1 at the dollar store, and a mesh plug to catch debris?


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## mitiempo (Sep 19, 2008)

leland
Here's a pic of a sink cabinet mounted on a bit larger boat (26') but its location allows standing in the companionway to use it. This boat has a flush deck so probably not much more headroom than yours. Might be an idea.


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## leland515 (Sep 26, 2009)

I like it...
What parts did you use in it?


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## bobmcgov (Jul 19, 2007)

As for tankage ... again, _why_? Not much stowage on this boat to start with, unless you want to saw into the quarterberths (which I have). Fixed tanks will require some sort of deckplate. This boat has no bilge pump, because it has no bilge. And if you are going to dinghy water out to the boat, you'll need to stow your jerry cans; why not stow them full of water and save about 3 steps?

We use 5 and 7 gallon square jerries. The 5-gallon Coleman jugs slide *perfectly* alongside the SJ21 keel trunk, placing them low and inboard, where they should be. Cost: $15 each, and they do not leak. You need water, yank em out and set them on a seat. Voila. Set em on a cockpit seat, you got a faucet with floor drain. Set em on the cabin top, you got a shower. What could be easier?


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## mitiempo (Sep 19, 2008)

leland
It's not my boat but a picture I found on this link.http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/Listing.aspx?id=264353835
But i agree with bob. Keep it simple.


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## tager (Nov 21, 2008)

I'm with Bobmcgov on this one, jerry cans will be better. Also, a stainless bowl would work, but wouldn't be very deep, and would cost a bit of money. The part I was referring to that would cost the most in the entire setup is the hardware that goes in the hole, it is easier to use this than trying to mount the hose directly to the bowl. Usually the strainer is built in and the plug is included.

American Standard 2411.015 Grid Drain
Like that.

I still have to suggest a plastic bowl. Any money you put into this boat isn't coming back out, and I don't see why a bristol finish is necessary here. Also if you want the whole thing to be removable, you could build it all in a plywood box.


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## CoastalEddie (Dec 15, 2009)

Here's your sink. It will also double as a bilge pump, a laundry, a temporary spot to stow some gear, and (if you flip it upside-down) an extra seat when you have everyone on the boat to swap sailing stories. All that for only $2.34.


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## tager (Nov 21, 2008)

It does say all purpose. For an extra $2.34 you can even avoid washing dishes in your toilet! Wow! What a deal, I've paid more to use a toilet in Europe!


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## leland515 (Sep 26, 2009)

I was just trying to make it look a bit more streamlined than a bucket, and to have a nice running tap, into a draining sink.

I don't want to have to see my water all the time, that's why I was going to put it in the quarter berths, as it would also use some of the (otherwise unused) space.


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## catamount (Sep 8, 2002)

Just be aware that if you cut into the berths to place your tanks, or that raised box on the starboard for your sink, those are supposedly "sealed" containers that are part of your self-rescue system -- in other words they supposedly supply flotation that will keep the boat awash if it were to be swamped and water filled the cabin. If you cut into them so that they are no longer "sealed," you'll loose that and the boat will more likely sink if you get it swamped. Of course it is debatable just how effective these "flotation tanks" really are, so maybe you wouldn't be missing anything.

BTW, for all things San Juan 21, you should visit: Jim Hubbard's San Juan 21 Sailing Page


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## leland515 (Sep 26, 2009)

catamount said:


> Just be aware that if you cut into the berths to place your tanks, or that raised box on the starboard for your sink, those are supposedly "sealed" containers that are part of your self-rescue system -- in other words they supposedly supply flotation that will keep the boat awash if it were to be swamped and water filled the cabin. If you cut into them so that they are no longer "sealed," you'll loose that and the boat will more likely sink if you get it swamped. Of course it is debatable just how effective these "flotation tanks" really are, so maybe you wouldn't be missing anything.
> 
> BTW, for all things San Juan 21, you should visit: Jim Hubbard's San Juan 21 Sailing Page


Hey man, thanks for the advice.
The buddy I bought it from told me that the containers were no longer sealed, and if I flooded her, she'd let me die just like that.
So, if I'm a doomed man anyway, I might as well get my darned sink..


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## tommays (Sep 9, 2008)

Leland

We spent many years camping on the J24 and a real sink was well worth having 

I will try and get under the winter cover this weekend and take a picture for you


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## COOL (Dec 1, 2009)

I second the idea of going with the bucket theory.
Small boat cruising is all about minimalism. There
is no such thing as unused space on a 21' cruising
boat. As described above a bucket is multi-purpose.
A small sink will prove useless for washing dishes.
Some Olson 30's came equipped with a small 
stainless bowl, with one jug for a water 'tank'
and one for a catchment tank. No through holes.
More often than not such sinks end up being 
catch alls for small gear.


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## bobmcgov (Jul 19, 2007)

catamount said:


> Just be aware that if you cut into the berths to place your tanks, or that raised box on the starboard for your sink, those are supposedly "sealed" containers that are part of your self-rescue system -- in other words they supposedly supply flotation that will keep the boat awash if it were to be swamped and water filled the cabin. If you cut into them so that they are no longer "sealed," you'll loose that and the boat will more likely sink if you get it swamped. Of course it is debatable just how effective these "flotation tanks" really are, so maybe you wouldn't be missing anything.


On some versions of the Mk1 cabin liner, such as ours and the one pictured in my first post, the larboard Q-berth communicates with the open fiddle at nearly floor level. Depending on arrangement, the starboard Q-berth and the liner volume in the forepeak communicates with the starboard liner "bulge". As you say -- not sure they're keeping water out, comes trouble. If they do float, they will do so with the hull upside down, which probably counts for something. I cut into the Q-berths but installed latched hatches in the cutouts, to maintain some dream of floatation. But thanks for the prod -- I need to seal the various liner compartments from each other this Spring.

BTW, there's not as much room inside the quarterberths as it looks: the curve of the hull steals most of it; there are also two fat stiffening ribs glassed to the hull that get in the way. We store small lanterns, the dinghy pump, and other light-but-awkward gear in there, but it's not what you'd call spacious.

We lived on our SJ21 for 11 straight days last summer; its interior is very small even by the standards of 21' keelboats, but we made it work by incorporating minimalist backpacking rules: Nothing you don't need, choose stuff that serves two or more purposes, use what your environment gives you (as long as it doesn't cause harm). The water jerries balance the house battery on either side of the keel box. Dinghy oars also row the San Juan. Boat hook is a closet rod. Soft bags with spare clothes serve for pillows.

It's a small boat whose simplicity is one of its greatest features. Homey touches are excellent, but our strategy is to spend money on things that make the boat safer (like new rigging, top-notch ground tackle, good PFDs that are comfortable so we wear them) or sail better (new sails, new rudder assembly, backstay adjuster, maybe a mainsheet traveler this year). Indoor running water on a 1500lb boat with zero provision for a kitchenette .... that's going to be difficult to arrange. Good luck, leland -- it'll be cool to see the results.


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## CoastalEddie (Dec 15, 2009)

COOL said:


> I second the idea of going with the bucket theory.
> Small boat cruising is all about minimalism. There
> is no such thing as unused space on a 21' cruising
> boat. As described above a bucket is multi-purpose.
> ...


The sink on my Cal 2-27 isn't completely useless, but COOL is right, one can't really wash dishes in it. My SOP is to use a Rubbermaid dishpan, like this:








to do the actual washing. I just fill it about halfway with cold water, add some soap and a kettle-full of boiling water, and bingo! The little SS sink does get used for rinsing the dishes, as a convenient drain for the used wash water, hand-washing, and as a spill-proof place for dish-soap, etc. The dishpan also takes up almost zero space, since when not in use I stow most of my cookware (two pots and a small wok) in it.

I first suggested the bucket, because that is exactly what I use when car-camping. I have an ancient set of nesting cookware (one of the large "base-camp" type sets) that just fits in a 5-gal plastic bucket. In that case I use the bucket as the wash sink and the largest pot as the rinse sink. For you boat, you can get two buckets (or two dishpans, or whatever) and you've basically got yourself a pretty good sized double sink, with 1001 other uses, that can be nested together and stowed just about anywhere. AND you'll save yourself the hassle (and $$$) of installing a "real" sink, a freshwater tank, plumbing from the tank to the sink, a pump, and plumbing from the sink overboard (including a dreaded thru-hull).


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## leland515 (Sep 26, 2009)

tommays said:


> Leland
> 
> We spent many years camping on the J24 and a real sink was well worth having
> 
> I will try and get under the winter cover this weekend and take a picture for you


Thank you, a parts list would help the process along very much also.
I have no problem going without a shower or other things that must be sacrificed to cruise on a pocket cruiser, but even prisoners get a sink.


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## leland515 (Sep 26, 2009)

Also to the people thinking I'm installing it solely to wash dishes- I don't plan on bringing cookware on to the boat, I will probably live off of canned foods heated in the can for the majority of the time, and fresh foods in a cooler for snacks.


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## tommays (Sep 9, 2008)

For showers we allways used the solar shower bags held up by the backstay

Two tied to the mast base laying flat allways got hot enough to do a good clean up and never got washed overboard


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## mitiempo (Sep 19, 2008)

If/when you do buy a sink go to a RV supplier and not a marine store as it will cost less, often for the same thing.


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

Why do you need a sink with a drain, especially on a boat the size of yours. Why not use a dishpan instead and bottled water.

BTW, heating foods in the can is a bad idea nowadays, since many cans are actually lined with plastic, and heating them is probably unwise.


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## leland515 (Sep 26, 2009)

Thanks for all the help guys, due to the mixed feedback, and most suggesting a firm no towards having a sink.. I'm going to have to rethink my plans.
It's just easy to get carried away I guess, and she's small but cozy when it's just me.


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## bobmcgov (Jul 19, 2007)

One thing we found helpful -- since the refit on a boat of this vintage can seem overwheming -- was to make a disordered list of all the things we NEED to do, all the things we SHOULD do, and things we'd LIKE to do. The first list included replacing the foredeck hatch and replacing the keel pivot plates. These things need to be addressed to keep the boat safe and sailable.

The other items on the list we prioritized according to time, money, impact they would have on the boat's sailing qualities or our comfort. We made sure to mix a few "like to dos", like new window curtains, just cuz they are fun and easy. For every task, we'd ask "What is this going to cost, how much time will it take, and is there a better use for our time and money?" A new mainsheet arrangement would be great -- but a serious anchor and 300' of good rode had to take priority. We'd LIKE new cushions below, but a new mainsail was more pressing. And so on.

You got the old _Schatzie_, right? What kind of shape are her anchors, sails, and deck in?


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## leland515 (Sep 26, 2009)

bobmcgov said:


> One thing we found helpful -- since the refit on a boat of this vintage can seem overwheming -- was to make a disordered list of all the things we NEED to do, all the things we SHOULD do, and things we'd LIKE to do. The first list included replacing the foredeck hatch and replacing the keel pivot plates. These things need to be addressed to keep the boat safe and sailable.
> 
> The other items on the list we prioritized according to time, money, impact they would have on the boat's sailing qualities or our comfort. We made sure to mix a few "like to dos", like new window curtains, just cuz they are fun and easy. For every task, we'd ask "What is this going to cost, how much time will it take, and is there a better use for our time and money?" A new mainsheet arrangement would be great -- but a serious anchor and 300' of good rode had to take priority. We'd LIKE new cushions below, but a new mainsail was more pressing. And so on.
> 
> You got the old _Schatzie_, right? What kind of shape are her anchors, sails, and deck in?


*How'd you hear about her?*
Her main is stained, but otherwise both sails are in good shape, standing rigging is brand new, a lot of the running rigging is from walmart line though, relatively cheap replacement.
The hull has some delamination, it will be replaced after next season.
The hull is otherwise very sound.
She's sailable, needs a new trailer but it should last for this season.
The deck is firm, was recored a few years back. Anchors are usable.

I have a few lists like that going, and have decided that an outboard is currently the most pressing issue. I am buying one in mid-February. 
Next- Bottom paint for the season, and she's going in. The rest of the repairs will wait.. most are just cosmetic anyways.


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## scottyt (Jul 19, 2008)

i have an idea that might work but i need to write it up

for now here is this

Wash 'N Go Compact Sink Organizer (Camping & Outdoor Equipment / Water Bottles, Washing, Purification and Storage / Reliance Hydration)


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## leland515 (Sep 26, 2009)

Hmmm I like it, might have to look into it


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## scottyt (Jul 19, 2008)

okay my idea is pretty simple

first you need to picture a folding sink like the officer quarters on a sub has ( my be surface ships too). here are two pics of them



















they basicly fold up in to the wall, now picture one on the aft bulkhead of the cabin. this would stick out about 6 inches or so into the cabin when folded up. it would be high enough to drain out the side of the boat... i think. a sink could also be put on drawer sliders so it slides into the berth, but you loose height. and would need a drain line that flops around, or lines up above a drain like a catilina 22 has ( what to drain in to below )

if it is too low you could section a small ( 2 or 3 gallon ) part of the berth sealed area and put a drain line out using a bilge pump to pump it out when needed. now you need to be able to access it to clean it out and completely dry it, as well as clean the pump... or it would stink after a while. i would bet you could get a weekend out of it watching what you dump in ( no food )

now if you want a small pressure water supply on the cheap get a 3 to 5 gallon stainless tank that can hold air pressure ( pic below just for looks it would not work ) then put a sealable fill with an air pressure fitting for a bike tire pump. then just fill with water and pump up about 10 to 15 lbs of pressure. you might need to repump every so often as you use water but it will work and draw no power.

tank ( similar but made of stainless ) maybe look at home brew beer stuff, and use one of the kegs ( second pic )









heck this one does not even need a pump


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## Mark F (Mar 7, 2006)

I did exactly what you are talking about doing on a 1968 Ericson 23. I used a stainless mixing bowl as the sink, ran the drain to a cockpit drain, built a cabinet, added a hand pump and installed the holding tank for water in the back of one of the quarter berths. Worked great you are on the right track. 

I tried to attach a photo with no success.


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## bobmcgov (Jul 19, 2007)

leland515 said:


> *How'd you hear about her?*


 The SJ21 world is a very small world indeed. I read about _Schatzie_ finding a good home on Carlos' blog. What a lovely sailing boat it is.

Definitely score new running rigging if you can. I buy all ours thru this guy on eBay: the 1/4" polyester is a bit stretchy & spaghetti-prone, but it has 101 uses on a SJ21. We use it for a topping lift, roller furling line, reefing lines, etc. & we're real happy with the NovaTech 5/16" and 3/8" for sheets: it's medium stiff, but kind to the hands.

Since you plan on singlehanding or short-handing a lot, either roller furling or a positive jib downhaul is crucial. That boat won't heave to or stay luffed up while you dash onto the foredeck. Jackline(s) you can rig quickly are important, too, given your squally weather. Nothing fancy -- for emergencies, you can use your docklines for the purpose.

Our next projects are a cockpit lazarette to stow the Danforth -- I'm coming to Sailingdog's opinion that an anchor is an important piece of safety gear, the only thing like 'brakes' on a sailboat; rebedding portlights; and some version of mid-boom sheeting, perhaps with traveler. I keep avoiding the deck recore and bottom job, for some reason. Also, the stern cleats are tiny and I do not trust the bow pulpit -- nothing like 3/8" diameter washers for backing plates! Bloody Clark Brothers.


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## leland515 (Sep 26, 2009)

I'm going to have to set aside some cash to give to that guy for some rigging, he seems reasonably priced. My uncle gave me an anchor mount that will hold an anchor safely wherever I secure the mount, that will come in handy.

I would really like to have a furling jib, but that would probably end up being out of my budget at the moment.

How would I go about installing the jib downhaul, and how does it pull down the sail? I've always thought of a downhaul as being used to tighten up a sail from the foot?



> I did exactly what you are talking about doing on a 1968 Ericson 23. I used a stainless mixing bowl as the sink, ran the drain to a cockpit drain, built a cabinet, added a hand pump and installed the holding tank for water in the back of one of the quarter berths. Worked great you are on the right track.
> 
> I tried to attach a photo with no success


Thanks for trying, I'm still undecided what will happen with my sink dream.. :/



> scottyt
> Senior Member
> 
> Join Date: Jul 2008
> ...


But wouldn't that end up spending more money than just having a $30 water pump, and require more upkeep?


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## mitiempo (Sep 19, 2008)

leland
A jib downhaul is a light line led through a small block at the bow then up through the jib hanks to the top of the sail. When you release the halyard pull on this to drop the sail. Of course run both downhaul and halyard to the cockpit. If the jib is sheeted in it should fall nicely on deck.


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## scottyt (Jul 19, 2008)

leland515 said:


> But wouldn't that end up spending more money than just having a $30 water pump, and require more upkeep?


yes it does cost more, but it is a water jug and tank in one. you could hook a pump to a jug as well, but getting it water tight would be the hard part. i was not saying it was THE answer, just another answer.

if you get a jug and mod a cap to hae a pick up line thru it to a normal pump it would work as well. but then you need to figure out if it is electric how to control it. i have tried a foot pump and i dont like them, as boats rock and standing on one foot while using both hands for dishes is not fun.


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## bobmcgov (Jul 19, 2007)

Jib downhaul HERE. The Fleet1 website has all kinds of rigging tips. Most people affix the small-diameter (1/8" or 3/16") downhaul to the hank *below* the jib's head, so it doesn't bind when pulling down. Properly rigged and cleated, the downhaul will pin your jib to the deck in seconds, and the pulpit helps keep the sail on your foredeck. It's not perfect, but it beats running forward in a hard blow. Safety in a small boat begins with _staying in the cockpit_. Since the SJ21 sails beautifully on main (or reefed main) only, shedding the jib is the best way to control the boat in high winds. We've been caught out in 50 knots, and _Diarmuid_ was just dandy once we got the jib put away.

We use a CDI Flexible Furler, which is a low-cost entree to furling, though it offers no real ability to tension the luff. Came with the boat. A simple downhaul w/ hanks works as well & makes sail changes easier.


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

I think bob's been hitting the rum again...  He's probably posted this in the wrong place. 



bobmcgov said:


> Jib downhaul HERE. The Fleet1 website has all kinds of rigging tips. Most people affix the small-diameter (1/8" or 3/16") downhaul to the hank *below* the jib's head, so it doesn't bind when pulling down. Properly rigged and cleated, the downhaul will pin your jib to the deck in seconds, and the pulpit helps keep the sail on your foredeck. It's not perfect, but it beats running forward in a hard blow. Safety in a small boat begins with _staying in the cockpit_. Since the SJ21 sails beautifully on main (or reefed main) only, shedding the jib is the best way to control the boat in high winds. We've been caught out in 50 knots, and _Diarmuid_ was just dandy once we got the jib put away.
> 
> We use a CDI Flexible Furler, which is a low-cost entree to furling, though it offers no real ability to tension the luff. Came with the boat. A simple downhaul w/ hanks works as well & makes sail changes easier.


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## bobmcgov (Jul 19, 2007)

sailingdog said:


> I think bob's been hitting the rum again...  He's probably posted this in the wrong place.


Sheesh ... throw Dog a bone with the anchor compliment & what do I get? Abuse.  (One doesn't 'hit' the rum. It hits back.)

Nah. Just helping Leland sort thru priorities for his wonderful new boat.  $15 gets you the ability to douse the headsail from the cockpit. "Make the jib go away, please ... like, *now*" is often heard on our SJ21, usually seconds before a wall of wind and spray lays us on our side.

BTW, that Wash'N'Go portsink looks nifty. Good find, Scottyt!


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## leland515 (Sep 26, 2009)

Does the jib flop around once it's on the foredeck?
That sounds a lot cheaper than a furler, I like.

I'm using walmart line for sheets right now, the triage atm is:
Outboard->Bottompaint->Sheets&Downhaul->Rest of cosmetics.

When I have excess money.. one day.. I'll replace the bungee cord with autopilot, xD

The outboard will just be so handy xD


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## mitiempo (Sep 19, 2008)

leland
If the jib is sheeted in when you lower it there should be no problem with it flopping around and it will stay aboard.


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## leland515 (Sep 26, 2009)

That's awesome, I'll have to install one before summer..
Thanks for the advice


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## SCatts (Apr 22, 2010)

Leland, I just joined Sailnet so I know I am late joining this thread, but don't bother with the sink idea. I did exactly what you are thinking of on my San Juan 21 back when I was a younger man. I stole a mixing bowl from the kitchen late one night and made myself a sink. I bought a hand pump from a RV supply store and ran the drain hose through the keel housing. It worked great but I never really used it. The 5 gal. jug of water and a plastic dishpan in the cockpit actually works much better. Save your money for the more important stuff. Just my thoughts from an old guy who did it.


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## johnnyandjebus (Sep 15, 2009)

leland515 said:


> Does the jib flop around once it's on the foredeck?
> That sounds a lot cheaper than a furler, I like.
> 
> I'm using walmart line for sheets right now, the triage atm is:
> ...


leland

No advice for your sink delema but I agree that the jib sheet downhaul is a cheap and invaluable addition to your rigging, particularly if you sail alone. I can't speak to your boat but on my Contessa 26 the jib will sit quite nicely on the fore deck so long as the both the jib downhaul and halyard are cleated off after you lower the sail.
If you install one I would include SS rings slide down over your front stay and jib downhaul. The idea is to clip the ss rings into every third or fourth piston snap as you connect it to the stay. It keeps the downhaul from flapping in the wind. 
I've done a poor job of explaining this perhaps someone can do a better job, regardless two thumbs up on the downhaul.

John


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## WIUPgamer (Jun 23, 2010)

Looking at a SJ21 and just read this thread. 3 things it brings to mind.

1. Remote holding tanks are nice. But they will need to be purged-cleaned from time to time or ..well you know what will happen.

2. Pressurized systems are easier to use, but harder to maintain. Don't forget Murphy's Law.

3. If the floatation compartments don't float they are useless. IMHO this is not something to ignore. It potentially makes the difference between your craft being a boat or a coffin. A guy in my club adds positive floatation to his racing dinghy’s by inserting those foam "pool noodles" anywhere they'll fit under the deck and in bilge areas etc. They don't take on water, allow air flow, are pretty cheap, and they float! Pretty cheap fix. Much easier then trying to seal a compartment. Boats are a lot more fun then coffins.


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## leland515 (Sep 26, 2009)

I might have to take your advice on the positive flotation, because I realized the awhile ago sailing that those compartments aren't very reliable.. It'd take a lot to keep this boat up if it starts sinking though. I am currently remodeling the entire cabin, but can't do much glass work when it's 50 degrees :/
thanks for the advice


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## sailguy40 (Feb 6, 2010)

This could be a good option for just a sink to brush your teeth, shave or wash your hands. Very small but simple and cheap for a quick solution...

Reliance Wash 'n' Go Sink, Showers, Toilets, & Accessories, Camp Essentials, Camping : Cabelas.com


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## asturi88 (Apr 15, 2017)

Hello there have a 1983 san juan 21 lokking for the deck plug located on deck in cockpit near companion way door anyone have any san juan prts store that might carry this part


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