# Spinnaker for Macgregor 26X



## theWindchime (Jan 12, 2007)

We read lots of great advice from everyone on this sailnet site, so we are turning to you all to help us determine what spinnaker equipment we should or should not use on our light rigged 2000 Macgregor 26X. 

The LOA is 26' and she has a 28' mast that is fractionally rigged 4' from the top. Other rig specs are: I=24.8, J=10.1, P=24.8, E=10.4. 

Asymmetrical:
- MacGregor sells their factory Asymmetrical Cruising Spinnaker with a 27' Luff, 24.5' Leach, and a 17.5' Foot. Is this the best size to use?

Symmetrical:
-What is the best size of Symmetrical Spinnaker to use?
-What is the correct length and diameter of Spinnaker Pole?

Thanks for any help, and we welcome all your good advice!


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## theWindchime (Jan 12, 2007)

Yes, yes, I know ... 

The salty's will advise; "if we want to fly a spinnaker, then buy a real sailboat not a Macgregor" etc. etc. etc. If this is what you meant 

We currently accept the trade-offs that our Mac gives us in the way of; sail & motor performance versatility, cabin space, and docking in our driveway.

We just want to have the option to use a cruising spinnaker for our local light winds and fly kite now and again, but do it safe!

Thanks, bring it on


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## TrueBlue (Oct 11, 2004)

If you wait around long enough, denr is sure to chime in with his sage advice regarding Macgregors.


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## Denr (Feb 7, 2001)

any piece of cloth larger than a pillow case might overpower this "shower stall with a keel" in 10 knots of wind but then again sending it to it's briny death wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing, the fish love them as habitats. Do me a favor and let the Coast Guard know of your foolhardy adventure so that they can save your south end. Butt seriously, why waste the time, money and effort? Have a nice day.


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## SailorMitch (Nov 18, 2005)

Denr is being kind. Back on the meds, are we????

To answer the question, for those pesky light air days in your Mac, why not invest in a bigger outboard?


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## T34C (Sep 14, 2006)

I thought thats why people bought those "m" things. So when the wind is light you can start the engine and water ski!


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## theWindchime (Jan 12, 2007)

Yup, you were right jones2r. 

I should have known better than to ask for serious advice from this crew, although I thought the way I worded my original post would have got through to some of the old thick skinned salt dogs and made them put aside make and model and just talk "wind and water". 

I have not given up hope that someone will post a serious reply to my serious question, because I know we all share the same love for life, the outdoors and being on the water and enjoying friends and family. 

Please continue as I am still appreciative of all thoughts!
By-the-by we have a Suzuki 50hp.


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

I don't see why you couldn't use an Asym and an ATN Tacker on your boat. There's not bow sprit, so you need to have something like the ATN Tacker...and I doubt that you want to use a pole and traditional Symetrical spinnaker on a Mac...they're a lot more work, and i don't believe the mast has the gear for mounting or working a spinnaker pole.


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## theWindchime (Jan 12, 2007)

Thanks SailingDog,

I appreciate your comments, and all the other posts you make on other threads. I've read most of them and you know whats-up, and don't mind to share and care!

Yes, I was thinking an Asym with the ATN would be as much as I dare. 

The Sym with pole would probably be more trouble than it's worth as I would need to add a mast ring or 3/4" t-track, and install and additional halyard for the topping-lift plus rig a fore-guy. And, I'm not sure if the 3.5" mast on this showerstall would take the pull of a full kite, but that is why I am asking you all

Thanks again!


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

Yes, you'd have to add a topping lift and a downhaul for the pole. UGH... and modifying the mast adds to the cost too. Besides flying a full Sym spinnaker can lead to some really ugly things... broaches, capsizes, etc... and flying an asym is much simpler and safer.


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## theWindchime (Jan 12, 2007)

Broach and knockdowns are a concern for us, as we are corky enough with the high 36" free-boards.

The reason for my questions are that last time we were out we saw a 30-somethin' Hunter with a huge colorful spinnaker flying high and wide, and my admiral thought it was pretty cool.

We are well aware of the differance between the 30+ Hunter and what's under us, but I am trying to see what is the most we can get away with, and still be safe.

If the Admirals happy, the Captain gets to sail more often


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

The only issue I can see with an Asym... is the loads it can put on the forestay. I don't know what the rig on the MacGregor is like. Does it have a backstay. If not...then that might be a problem. You should probably call MacGregor and ask them for some advice on it... 

Putting up an asym, only to have it pull the stick down is not such a good thing... and makes you look kind of foolish...


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## pigslo (Nov 22, 2004)

I believe with available info from Mc Gregor, I would use it so as not to push the envelope. Why reinvent the wheel when McGregor has done the work.
pigslo


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## T34C (Sep 14, 2006)

If their website is represntative of the company, they may recommend something involving Duct tape and bailin' wire.


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## trantor12020 (Mar 11, 2006)

I used to own a Mac26X and loved it till my family need something bigger and more stiff. That said, I used to fly a Symmetrical spin (from a Maxi77) like a big genny/assym. I don't like spin pole 'cos there isn't much room at the sloping foredeck of Mac26X to work on. Sailing is supposed to be enjoyable not work, so I don't fancy installing additional spin pole gears (up/down haul, pole ring...) as well.
In anycase, the oversize spin works just fine (big blind spot to the leeward side actually). So what if she doesn't sail downwind well, so long as you're having fun, that is good enough. Just be prepare to spill wind when you have to. Good luck.


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## theWindchime (Jan 12, 2007)

Thanks all,

We already have symmetrical 25'X18' that we have never flown becuase of no pole or rigging, but it sounds like trantor12020 flew it anyway like a jenny and it worked fine. 

I think we will try the same. We'll pick a calm day and lash one of the clews 12" or so off the pulpit, open the turtle bag, and hoist it out and see what happens. (and be prepared to release the sheet if all hell brakes loose). If it works well enough, we'll invest in an ATN-Tacker as sailingdog suggested and rig a line from the bow to the cockpit to adjust the tack and start looking for a true shaped Asym.

Thanks again folks, your time and typing is much appreciated. The Admiral will be very pleased this spring to have color is our sails! I value all of your help an opinions, everything with a grain of salt right, or is that salty


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## Giulietta (Nov 14, 2006)

theWindchime said:


> Thanks all,
> 
> We already have symmetrical 25'X18' that we have never flown because of no pole or rigging, but it sounds like trantor12020 flew it anyway like a jenny and it worked fine.
> 
> ...


OK, Windchime, I hope I can help you. I spoke with my friend, who's a sail maker, and here are your answers.

The Mac's Assimetric Spinnaker is called a cruising chute here, with an area of 32sq. meters, (which is 344,44 sq feet).

He (knows the boat) and you can have one all the way up to 40sq meters, 430sq feet, but the 344 seem s OK.

As far as symetric Spinnaker goes, the measurements should be:

Luff M/ Leech- 7,73mts (23')
Foot- 5,40mts (16,4')
Area 36m2 (344,4')

Now I figure the spinnaker pole should be (including the terminal pieces at mast and sail end) arpound 3,1 meters long (9.9').

Its diameter should be around 80mm, (3.2') but depends on what you have already made in the US (mine are normally made as per my specs.

Hope this is what you wanted!!


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

"I have not given up hope that someone will post a serious reply to my serious question, because I know we all share the same love for life, the outdoors and being on the water and enjoying friends and family." 

CONGRATULATIONS!! You really broke through! Reminds me of an old girl friend's motto: "Ya gotta kiss a lotta frogs...." I believe she'd only been married once when I knew her (at least, that was her story). 

Very generous of you both, SD and Giu.


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

Jones2r-

Who ya calling a frog??? Hey, it's bad enough that he's on a MacGregor... but I have to give him credit...he wants to sail it rather than use the iron genny.


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## Giulietta (Nov 14, 2006)

Remeber, it serves a purpose.

Any sailboat is better than no boat.


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## Denr (Feb 7, 2001)

two words:

fish habitat


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## Cruisingdad (Jul 21, 2006)

Denr,

You are sooooo bad! Poor guy. I take it that a MacGregor is not on your list of favorite boats?

I will admit, I about fell out of my chair lughing on that first post.


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

"Who ya calling a frog??? Hey, it's bad enough that he's on a MacGregor"

Sorry I'm late. Been advising some guy about his trawler. I didn't call you a frog; that was the old (really old these days) girlfriend. 

Speaking of frogs, has Kermie been around? I'm starting to get bored.


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## theWindchime (Jan 12, 2007)

Thanks Giulietta!

Thank you for answering my orignal post which was for specific sail sizes we should be using. And please thank your sailmaker friend. When the spring comes and we are on the water flyin the new spinnaker, I will think of all you guys and thank you again. Yes, even "uncle-salty" denr, for I think his grumpyness helps us all find our moral compass.

And I do agree with you Giulietta that any sailboat is better than no boat! Websters definition of a boat is; "A small vessel for travel on water", and it's definition of a Sailboat is; "A boat which uses the wind as its primary means of propulsion". Sorry denr but a Mac is a boat, and by definition ... a sailboat as well. 

And besides, I think most Mac'ers know what we have, and what we don't have. Hell I am looking at my driveway right now and it has a 26 foot sailboat in it, and that's just wierd. Not wrong ... just wierd. So we know we're not the fastest or even the prettiest ducks on the pond, but were stills ducks compared to the squirrels on land.


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## foxglove (Dec 27, 2002)

*Cruising Spinnaker*

I can't speak for the Max26x but have sailed the old type Mac 26 for the past 15 years from Maine to the Keys and find it can stand up to far more than anyone might expect.

I use a simple cruising spin because it's easier to handle, especially singlehanded. But when the wind pipes up over 10, I take it down.

I sometimes move one of the sheets to the tack and cast it off allowing the spin to fly free. It's more about the fun than the speed.

Don't listen to those 'big boat guys' with no Mac experience. They are jealous; they can't trailer their floating bathtubs.


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## Giulietta (Nov 14, 2006)

theWindchime said:


> Thanks Giulietta!
> 
> Thank you for answering my orignal post which was for specific sail sizes we should be using. And please thank your sailmaker friend. When the spring comes and we are on the water flyin the new spinnaker, I will think of all you guys and thank you again. Yes, even "uncle-salty" denr, for I think his grumpyness helps us all find our moral compass.
> 
> ...


No problem, Chime, have fun with your boat. That's what matters. They all serve a purpose, and yours does it for you.

Foxglove,   I actually helped Chime here. You should probably refrase your sentence.

"Don't listen to those 'big boat guys' with no Mac experience. They are jealous; they can't trailer their floating bathtubs"

How do you know I haven't trailed a sailboat before?? I raced 470's for almost 8 years, and sailed a **** load of other boats that were trailerd, how do you think they get to the sea??? Fly???


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

Giulietta-

I seriously doubt that you drove a truck and trailer that you could put Giulietta on... she's an awfully big boat... with a pretty deep draft...


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## Giulietta (Nov 14, 2006)

sailingdog said:


> Giulietta-
> 
> I seriously doubt that you drove a truck and trailer that you could put Giulietta on... she's an awfully big boat... with a pretty deep draft...


Yes, and specially here, where the roads are small. In fact I can't even transport her by truck without police escort and blocked roads as she is 1.5 meters wide than the law allows.

Now, please go back and read... I said I trailered the 470!!!


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## T34C (Sep 14, 2006)

foxglove said:


> Don't listen to those 'big boat guys' with no Mac experience. They are jealous; they can't trailer their floating bathtubs.


Not likely.


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## TrueBlue (Oct 11, 2004)

I resemble that comment.


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## CaptKermie (Nov 24, 2006)

Windchime:
You are on the wrong site, try here:
http://macgregorsailors.com/
The folks at macgregorsailors are very helpful and have more knowledge about macs as owners. There is not a site that has more to offer mac owners than that one. You will only endure insults here. The Mac factory spinnaker is your best bet, hope to see you at the other Mac site.


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## Giulietta (Nov 14, 2006)

CaptKermie said:


> Windchime:
> You are on the wrong site, try here:
> http://macgregorsailors.com/
> The folks at macgregorsailors are very helpful and have more knowledge about macs as owners. There is not a site that has more to offer mac owners than that one. You will only endure insults here. The Mac factory spinnaker is your best bet, hope to see you at the other Mac site.


Thanks for the remark....note to self...DO NOT HELP MAC OWNERS ANYMORE....


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## CaptKermie (Nov 24, 2006)

Giulietta:
My post was not directed at you or those who were helpful, but rather, those who were not. There are insults posted on this thread and I have had a few my way for owning a Mac on other threads. My intent was only to direct Windchime to a more brand specific site. There is still a lot here to learn which is why I drop by from time to time. Please do not take offense, I do not wish to offend you as you seem to be one of the more caring here.


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

HIYA KERMIE

How's it hanging? We've missed your, green slimy self. Been over on the Mac site? Good. It's where you belong. STAY THERE.

'Chime -- he's unhappy because you've accomplished what he wasn't able to do. You're welcome here.

*HEY KERMIE:* WHAT'S GREEN AND SMELLS LIKE SH!T!!!

YO, Giu -- Like that??


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## TrueBlue (Oct 11, 2004)

jones2r said:


> HIYA KERMIE
> 
> How's it hanging? We've missed your, green slimy self. Been over on the Mac site? Good. It's where you belong. STAY THERE.
> 
> ...


jones2r,
Don't you think your remarks are a bit over the top . . . especially from a guy who doesn't even own a boat? At least CaptKermie can say he has a boat to sail in, one in which he's obviously proud of. First rule of the sea my boy, is to never insult another man's boat.


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## CaptKermie (Nov 24, 2006)

Yes, Mrs. Jones, I knew you missed me, that's why I dropped by.



jones2r said:


> "Who ya calling a frog??? Hey, it's bad enough that he's on a MacGregor"
> 
> Sorry I'm late. Been advising some guy about his trawler. I didn't call you a frog; that was the old (really old these days) girlfriend.
> 
> ...


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

"The answer to your riddle is your envy Jones."

*OH NO!!! I'VE BEEN FOUND OUT!!* THE SHAME OF IT ALL.

WHEN YOU CALL SOMEONE *MR., DON'T MISSPELL IT!!*

Thanks for my quotes. I enjoyed re-reading them.

TB -- I didn't insult his boat. I insulted _him_. Let's not confuse the two.

I believe I have a new name, _Envy Jones_, as in, "Shouldn't everyone?" I like it.


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## CaptKermie (Nov 24, 2006)

TrueBlue said:


> jones2r,
> Don't you think your remarks are a bit over the top . . . *especially from a guy who doesn't even own a boat?* At least CaptKermie can say he has a boat to sail in, one in which he's obviously proud of. First rule of the sea my boy, is to never insult another man's boat.


*"especially from a guy who doesn't even own a boat"*
Now why does that not surprise me?
I didn't mis-spell anything jones.


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

See what you've done, TB?


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## TrueBlue (Oct 11, 2004)

No jones, you made this bed, you sleep in it.


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## PBzeer (Nov 11, 2002)

jones isn't a nom de plume for surf is it?


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## camaraderie (May 22, 2002)

This thread gives "playing with your jones" new meaning!


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

What I don't understand is why Kermie didn't mention _flat feet_ and _4WD_? Hope he saw them. TB dragged up all that stuff about frogs -- somebody had played off of that line and reminded me of Kermie.

Hope he comes back. I've been having a great time. Probably stay away for awhile, though.


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## sailaway21 (Sep 4, 2006)

Hey Kermie!
That rueben sandwhich at Nifty's is on me, bud. Thanks for chiming in. I think I'll be bringing a crazy Portagee with me. No worries-he's got a wicked sense of humor and he's bringing the wine.


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

Sounds like a Portagee with Italian ancestry.


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## pigslo (Nov 22, 2004)

http://www.eskimo.com/~mighetto/murrelet.htm for you mac lovers that are delusional.
pigslo


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## T34C (Sep 14, 2006)

Pigslo- PLEASE don't make me look at that again. I'm not making any comments in an effort to be civil since there was a reasonable question that started all of this.


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## theWindchime (Jan 12, 2007)

Thanks T34c;

And thanks to the others that gave good advise to my question regarding Spinnaker size.

I read a lot of other threads before posting my question, so I kind of knew what I was getting into. I started this thread to get some serious answers from what I thought are seasoned sailors, about the size of spinnaker we should use. 

It seems that most people on this site have a strong sense of safety, as I have read many comments about not drinking a sailing. So I think it should not matter if we are talking about a Laser or a 40' S.V., because I think questions about safety can end up being a matter of someone's life or death if given the wrong/bad/no advice. My question was to ensure the safety of my wife and I while we are on the ocean, and I take this very seriously. That's why I turned to you people for help. 

A lot of you folks have so much great knowledge that you could share with all the rest of us on this site. It's just too bad that everyone has to read through so much of some of your B.S. crap and ass-rants just to find anything of value. I am no stick in the mud by any means, far from it. But in my humble opinion, even being a newbie to this site, think maybe you guys need to think just a bit before auto typing the first slag that comes to mind. Maybe think about what some of us are asking, and why, and the impact/consequence your replies may have. I enjoy a lot of your wit and humour (really) and all the rest that goes with it, just sometimes enough is enough.

Just my thoughts tonight, but I think the dozen or so of you could be leading this site by a much better example.

respectfully;
S.V. Windchime and crew


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## Giulietta (Nov 14, 2006)

Wind,

Forget the BS, each boat serves a purpose...
So are you going to make the Spi or not??

Hope you do, its cool. Let me know, ok??

G


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## sailaway21 (Sep 4, 2006)

Hang around WindChime. The vast majority of us ain't got no money, ain't got the boat we dream of, and don't sail nearly as much as we'd like. There are a few, actually very few, who piss in your boot no matter what the topic. In my humble opinion they are usually noveau riche and equate their boat with their pecker.

Macs take alot of unfair grief here, especially when you consider that about half the people dropping in on the site don't even have a boat. The mantra is, and will always be, any boat is better than no boat. Stick around, and if you really want to tell somebody off go over to "fight club" and let 'er fly-you wouldn't be the first.


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## Giulietta (Nov 14, 2006)

sailaway21 said:


> especially when you consider that about half the people dropping in on the site don't even have a boat.


Pffffff, from what I've read HERE, I'd say a lot more than half....and if they do have one...well THEN THEY SHOULD HAVE IT REMOVED, BECAUSE PEOPLE THAT WRITE WHAT THEY DO SHOULDN'T BE IN THE WATER SAILING!!!!!!!!!!

A Mac (*) serves its purpose. Simple.

*(*)Disclaimer: The mention of Macgreggor crafts, by the writer of this post, his family and associations, does not imply his dislike for such vessel. The poster hereby disclaims any possible remark arriving form the misinterpretation of this post, and reserves the right to dispute in an European Union court of law.
Furthermore, the use of the word Mac, was only used to imply a fast vessel on water, moved by internal combustion engine, or by kinetic application of cold moving masses of air.
Any possible verbal confrontations related to or applied by owners and or associations of owners of Macgreggor vessels will be ignored.*


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## CaptKermie (Nov 24, 2006)

sailaway21 said:


> Hey Kermie!
> That rueben sandwhich at Nifty's is on me, bud. Thanks for chiming in. I think I'll be bringing a crazy Portagee with me. No worries-he's got a wicked sense of humor and he's bringing the wine.


Sure whish I could take you up on that rueben as I actually had a mind to stop in there when in Seattle. Unfortunately spousal health issues are taking priority so I was not even available to meet Windchime the other night, too bad, I'll have to catch up with him later.
As for Mrs Jones I always thought he had a thing for me but I am not inclined that way. Funny how mouthy you can be when hiding behind a board like this jones, there is a 99.99% chance you would not talk like that to my face, I am no small dude! At least I have a boat.


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## camaraderie (May 22, 2002)

Kermie...for what it is worth I think Jones was trying to be funny as we've all been trading insults here. Obviously you didn't take it that way. I'll let Jones speak for himself but for now guys...let's take any further insults over to the fight club thread where I feel less need to push my magic button! 
K- Hope your wife is feeling better.


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## T34C (Sep 14, 2006)

Windchime- Understand what you are saying. Sometimes one thread kinda bleeds over into the others and can get way off topic. The flip side is that some of the topics can be... a little weak. Mostly there are a bunch of sailors bored with being on the hard for the winter and tend to screw around a bit. Hang around, occationally some real answers get slipped in.


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