# solo across the Atlantic



## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

I have a couple of life goals regarding sailing, the Drake Passage, and sailing across the Atlantic. The latter brings me to the question that I want to ask...

Not that I am experienced enough to do this yet, but what boat would people here suggest to sail across the Atlantic solo? I know this is dangerous and don''t want to get into a safety lecture, but if you were to do this, what boat would you choose and why? I am thinking of something between about 35'' and 50'' and I am up in the air as to whether I would want a sloop or a ketch. Any suggestions on a particular boat?


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## paulk (Jun 2, 2000)

Instead of getting a 50'' monster - a size that would give professional guys some pause- why not try something more managable ? The French are really into solo sailing. Besides the Vendee Globe, they also have a Mini-Transat singlehanded race (annually?) that goes from France to the Carribean in 21 foot one-design singllehanded boats. The engineering''s been done, the systems work, and run-of-the-mill French sailors do it to the tune of dozens of entrants each time. There are likely used boats available at reasonable prices. It might be worth finding out about these boats, instead of having to adjust a "standard" design to be handled by a single person.


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

wow... mini transat boats are a handfull ... I wouldnt do it. Just to old and out of shape...lol 

mmuch slower but proven. WHy not a 32 foot Contessa. 

Thor


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

Just looked at the boats you suggested. While I could cross the atlantic in one of them, I was thinking of something a little more substantial. I''m not trying to beat a certain time getting across the pond, and I''m not trying to beat myself up doing it. I guess I dont want to be THAT exposed to the elements. 

Would anyone suggest a Beneteau, or an Island Packet for crossing the Atlantic? Anything wrong with either of these for the trip? Asking about these two because my father is looking at purchasing one or the other and if I take full possession of it in 10 years or so, I might use it to go across the ocean. On the other hand, if either of these two brands is notorious for problems in heavy blue water sailing, what would you suggest?


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## paulk (Jun 2, 2000)

IP''s have a reputation for being solidly built. They also tend to have huge interior spaces that are lovely for dockside living in Florida along the protected bays and waterways. The big interior doesn''t give you much to hold onto as you''re launched across the cabin by a wave. I would also not want to see the bowsprit buried (and ripped off ) in the back of a swell as the big, flat transom gets pushed from behind. Some people think IP''s are best left In Place. 

Beneteau has built boats that have crossed oceans. Saint Brendan apparently made it across the Atlantic in a coracle, too. Most Beneteaux (like the mini-transats) would not be my first choice for such a trip. They often have ports, hatches and cockpits much too big for safety at sea. Beneteaux are generally very lightly built, and are more suitable for coastal sailing. Grab a rail and REALLY heave on it. It will bend enough to make you worry - at anchor - if it doesn''t actually break. Push against the furniture and fittings. Thin. Light. Hmmm. 

Like cars, some boats after 10 years will be thoroughly worn out, used up, and ready for the scrap heap. Others will still be in fine shape when they''re ten years old. It depends on the builder. It also depends upon the design. Mercedes makes fine cars that last a long time. You wouldn''t pick one of their sports convertibles to go skiing ''back country'' in the ''rockies, however. You''d go with one of their SUV''s with 4 wheel drive. An ocean voyage is a lot like taking a car across a desert. Your life can depend upon the choices you make before you set out. Making the right choices beforehand can avoid much unpleasantness. 

Overall, you''re asking the right questions, but there is a lot to learn. Some you can get from reading more. Books by Dashew, Gerr and Knox-Johnson would be good sources to start with. For other things, you need experience. 
I had about 10 years experience sailing before I went transatlantic. Looks like you have time for some of that too.


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## PCP (Dec 1, 2004)

paulk said:

"IP''s have a reputation for being solidly built. They also tend to have huge interior spaces that are lovely for dockside living in Florida along the protected bays and waterways. The big interior doesn''t give you much to hold onto as you''re launched across the cabin by a wave. I would also not want to see the bowsprit buried (and ripped off ) in the back of a swell as the big, flat transom gets pushed from behind. Some people think IP''s are best left In Place."
............................................


Do you mean that in your opinion the Island Packets are not seaworthy ocean going boats?

I am curious, your opinion goes against all opinions I have heard or read in the press.

take a look at some examples of opposite opinions taken from tests published on line, from well known sailing magazines: 


From Bluewater sailing magazine on the IP 42:

Island Packets are pure cruising boats, so the design of the deck and accommodations plan is aimed at safety and ease of handling foremost, and comfort a close second. The cockpit is deep and the seat backs high enough to provide both good back support and protection from deck wash. In the Stream, we took breaking waves on the foredeck regularly and occasionally got caught by a sneaky broadside number that covered us in spray. But our seats remained dry, and under the large canvas dodger it was possible to remain on deck without full foul-weather gear. The side decks are wide and unobstructed. With low bulwarks at the hull-deck joint, security on deck is enhanced while dropped tools and clevis pins stay on the boat instead of bouncing directly into the drink.

The IP 420 is strong in the straight-on cruising realm of sailing: large tanks, comfortable motion, easy to sail alone or as a couple, durable, forgiving in rough seas, a great galley and a trustworthy design concept. ...

In the performance realm, it is worth noting that this boat has the ability to undertake offshore passages at relatively high average speeds.
...
We’ve seen IPs all over the world, from the Eastern Med to the South Pacific and Indian Oceans. With their full keels, attached rudders and protected propeller apertures, the boats are suited to real self-sufficiency. Ample tankage gives these boats range, while simple sailing systems make them safe and convenient for couples sailing on their own. 
After 650 miles, among the only items on our list of recommendations for the boat, aside from additional light-air canvas, was the unobtrusive "chart table needs fiddles."

From Sail Magasine on the IP370:

"As with other Island Packets, the 370 will surely be right at home offshore in a good breeze and will be well suited to reaching through the trades. When the wind kicks up on a coastal passage, a boat this solid will feel mighty good."

... Here''s where a buyer makes the big decision: Do I need to go as fast as a racer/cruiser, or am I happy to poke along in comfort and safety? If you prefer to sail aboard a beautiful offshore-capable vessel, this is your style of boat."


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## paulk (Jun 2, 2000)

And no article written in a magazine has anything to do with the three color advertising on the inside cover. How come there never seem to be any articles on boats that aren''t advertised by big outfits? Yachting used to do a piece each month on a custom design being built somewhere. Do they still? Reading between the lines can be fun too, since they''re not permitted to say anything negative. From the Sail article: " When the wind kicks up ... a boat this solid will feel mighty good. " So until the wind picks up to 30, perhaps it doesn''t feel so good? And so on. Accounts written by people with an axe to grind (or mouths to feed) need to be taken with a grain (or two) of salt. 

I have not been aboard every boat in the IP line. The ones I have seen have seemed well put together. They also seemed to have cavernous interior spaces with long streches between something solid to hold on to. This is a problem in a seaway, and I don''t like it, as a feature. Shannons are much "tighter" down below, and perhaps safer to be aboard because of it. The IP freeboard and cabin profiles seem to be pretty high in general, making me wonder about windage. I''ve run at 8 knots under bare poles in what the anemometer said was 50 knots of wind, so windage concerns me, especially if there''s a lee shore involved. The masts seemed relatively stubby, making me question their ability to sail in light air, trying to push all the heavily-constructed hull, equipment and supplies. Perhaps not all of them are like this, but a "sea-going" yacht, as mentioned in the Bluewater article above, without fiddles on the chart table tells me something about the use the factory expects their boats to get. 

As is mentioned above, St. Brendan sailed from Ireland to Newfoundland in an open boat made of leather stretched over a wood frame in the 6th Century. His would not be my preferred craft, though he apparently made it across and back. A Beneteau would not be my preferred craft either. An IP might be better than either of these, but IMHO there are still better options out there. Halberg-Rassey comes to mind. Shannons. Some of Bob Perry''s designs (Passports, I believe?) Nautor/Swans. Hinckleys. There are books on this topic -- that would be a good place for DrItalia (sp?) to start checking this out, and forming his own opinions.


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

I want to thank everybody for giving me some advice. I just came upon this message board a couple of weeks ago after my father and I made the decision to get back into sailing. 

While I do have many years of sailing experience, the vast majority of those years took place when I was a child and a teenager, sailing on Galveston Bay almost every weekend on a 36'' Heritage West Indies. 

While I have done a few weeks of heavy blue water sailing on a 50'' sloop in the leewards, I simply dont know enough about all the boats out there just yet. I do know that my favorite sailing is in fact bluewater long distance, and that is one of the main reasons for for my initial question.

I''m glad that I found this online community. You will probably see many more questions from me in the future.

Not trying to end the discussion of the solo across the Atlantic post however, any more info would be great.


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## Davidwarner (Mar 2, 2005)

I too dream of crossing the Atlantic solo (east to west) and would like to do it within the next 5 years in a boat less than 20''. My experience is very limited and I know it would be a great risk and a bit fool hardy. But it can be and has been done many times by people with little experience and useing small boats. Robert Manry in his 13.5'' clinker built sloop is one that comes to mind. www.famousmallboats has a list of just some of the more notorised examples. Other than Manry it seems that many of the people (mostly record breaking attempts) use small craft that have been specialy built. I would prefer to find a well built production boat for my attempt.


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## dman (Dec 25, 2004)

OK... no someone else takeover!Why do we have to push things,everything to where the point is killing oneself.I can drive to town with one eye closed now someone wants the challenge of driving blindfolded to see if it can be done.Just an observation.


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

why not look at Amel. lots of room "A" rated CE for any ocean and a dream to sail. no problem to sail this 50 footer solo.
fair winds,
eric


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## katytoo (May 30, 2005)

*Why do it??*

dman,
Your observation could have been made by my wife who I love and, after 30 years and four kids, I owe everything to. But, I still disagree with her. You're asking why people do strange things like try to sail a smaller boat across a big ocean singlehanded. The answer is that doing something that takes fortitude and skill, that is dangerous, and that requires effort out of the ordinary fulfills a need in many people to stand out, to be that little bit special, to be different. I think it's great that people do try to climb mountains, walk across continents, sail alone across oceans, or whatever their thing is. The need for people to do these sorts of things is the reason we have "reality TV". The true "reality", though, is Ellen MacArthur on her boat in the middle of the Atlantic, 200 miles from anywhere, at the top of her mast for a couple of hours fixing whatever it was that went wrong up there. Or, the two women who walked across Antarctica a couple of years ago. Or note the two blind sailors are currently circumnavigating the world in their sloop, or the man with two artificial legs who was walking DOWN Ayers Rock in Central Australia in 100 degree heat while I was struggling past him to walk up the mountain. Those are the sorts of people I admire. 
Once we stop dreaming and stop trying to fulfill our dreams we might as well chuck it in as far as I'm concerned. Perhaps next summer I'll be able to get off my butt and actually accomplish one or two of my ambitions. I hope so, I'm getting older every day.  
Fair winds!!


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## Giulietta (Nov 14, 2006)

*Halberg Rassy*

These are the choice. The sturdiest boat, in my opinion, for what you want.

In fact they hold the record (as they state) for the being the Boat builder with most Atlantic crossings.

And everytime I see one,there is allways an old couple sailing it, they don't look stressed and I have seen them all over the World, from all over the World.

Note: I DO NOT own one. Too slow.


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

If you want to cross the Atlantic, it doesn't have to be in a monstrously expensive 40+ boat. It can be done relatively inexpensively, using a boat of much more modest size. There are a lot of boats in the 28–35' range that are more than capable of crossing the Atlantic. The amount of comfort on a passage will have more to do with your skills, familiarity with the boat, and weather planning rather than the size of the boat. 

Larger boats can be much harder to handle in that the sails, equipment, ground tackle are much heavier than on a smaller boat. If you've ever tried to reef the main sail on a 45' boat by yourself, versus doing the same thing on a 32' boat, you'd see that in rough conditions, it is generally far simpler to do on the smaller boat. 

Also, the gear on many larger boats is more complicated....in-mast or in-boom mainsail reefing can present problems that you won't get with simpler slab reefing. Power winches and windlasses can fail. 

The Contessa 26/32, Alberg 30, Nauticat 32, Hallberg Rassy 312, Southern Cross 31, and Westsail 32, among others are all possibilities over a wide price range. None of them is perfect for an ocean crossing, but all are capable of doing it...

All of them are small enough to be easily single-handed. The gear and equipment on them is simple enough to be maintained by anyone with a modicum of skill and knowledge. 

DavidWarner—

Doing an ocean crossing in something less than 20' long is a bit more ambitious than I would be willing to do... but if you really want a production boat that is capable of doing it... A Flicka is 20' LOA or so...and capable of making such a passage. 

A Drascombe Lugger has made it most of the way around the world, but wouldn't be my choice of a craft for such a voyage... and would probably take some one with considerably better skills that you sound like you have.


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## Giulietta (Nov 14, 2006)

Before you think about the boat, you have to think about yourself first.

Can you actually do it?? Mentally and physically??

Sailing skills to handle the boat, are easy to achieve in 2 months or less, if you practice, however mental skills, (and I mean mind control), are much, much harder, believe me.

Remember you must be prepared to spend at least 30 or more days at sea, alone, day and night, rain or shine.

I have a friend, that sailed solo from NY to Lisbon, in Europe, on a Swedish made 24' boat. (one of those designs whose cabin is also the deck, real ugly boat whose name I can't remember).

He sailed all his life and has sailed several times from Southern Europe to the North Sea prior to that, and cruised many many years.

He told me that he spent 28 days at sea, all the time with the wind from behind, and assured me that it was not easy.

From being sick several days non stop, (try to sail downwind for 8 hours and you will understand), to getting scared by tankers, whales, waves, half sunken containers, you name it.

What really made me write now, was what he told me, few days after he told me his adventure, and that struck me, as being impossible that something like that would have been said by a guy like him.

He actually contemplated jumping off the boat, on more than one occasion, always during the day, and couldn’t figure out why... he would just be looking at the sea, and suddenly feel the urge to jump, and that always seemed like a good thing then !!!!

He said his mind and spirit were abandoning him. What kept him on the boat was the photos of his family he hung on his tether and the fact that he would tie himself when he “felt funny” as he put it.

If you knew this guy, you would never believed his story.

So think about what you are getting into, then think about the boat….humans, by nature are not lonely animals.


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## PONTY (Oct 6, 2010)

*solo Atlantic xssing*

Good morning.    

I was not experienced particulary but did my first atlantic xssing from Capoverde to Barbados singlesailing, leaving Italy on last november, with no big problems. (Rome-Baleares-Gibraltair-Canary is. - Capoverde - Barbados-Trinidad))

If u like any more ideas tell me with a message to my mail-adresse. Shamrock @ mclink.it [no spaces]

one only suggestion: go on the biggest u may afford AND handle safely !! A 49 Hallberg Rassy like my PONTY is a perfect balance and easy to stear also with a not too big windvane, strong and confortable.

Ill go on december back to Trinidad to move her on the Carabbean...

federico


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## PONTY (Oct 6, 2010)

... and .. like u may understand from many suggestions above, the caracter factor is much more important then the tecnical one ...... so about that I can give u some help if u wish..... 

good wind

federico


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## tdw (Oct 2, 2006)

Ponty...old thread mate....previous post 2006...no big deal but I doubt Op is still reading.

Hey..whats a Ponty ? Or did you mean that Ponty is an HR49 ? Great boats.

Edit...just noticed your post count...welcome to the forum.


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## rockDAWG (Sep 6, 2006)

Welcome to SN, PONTY.

Damn where the hell did find this thread? It is old.

I don't believe you can singlehanded to sail a 49 Hallberg Rassy . Let me join you in Trinidad this December. I need to see this in person :laugher :laugher :laugher


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## TQA (Apr 4, 2009)

A case can be made for almost anything between a Folkboat and a Macgregor 65 but something around 35 to 40 feet is manageable.

Checkout this blog of a singlehanded crossing this year back to the UK in a steel Ebbtide 33. Sailing in conachair

BTW where do plan to land in Europe. The last bit of the W-E transatlantic can be high risk if it involves the traffic lanes around Northern France and the English Channel.


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## PONTY (Oct 6, 2010)

rockDAWG said:


> Welcome to SN, PONTY.
> 
> Damn where the hell did find this thread? It is old.
> 
> I don't believe you can singlehanded to sail a 49 Hallberg Rassy . Let me join you in Trinidad this December. I need to see this in person :laugher :laugher :laugher


       

Now....... i will tell u quickly: i own my PONTY since 6 years . Went around Italy in the Tyrrenian see, in Greece around Peloponnesus with family and friends, summer and winter. Started some little trip alone Rome to Giglio island or Ponza. Just docking in the river Tevere , alongside another boat alone with 2 kn current , day and night is quite a good school !!!

2 years of preparation for the Atlantic. 40% adjusting rig and adding items on the boat ( she is an HR 49 1 mast ; previus name Giglio III ); 30% studing general experiences about all matters involved ( a lot of books from boat rigging to world routes or "Sydney Hobard's story > Tempesta " includin 2 books about singlehand sailing); 30 % specific planning of trip, from maps, Giblaltair courrents timing, document needs, simulation on PC with pilots charts etc .

Lefty Italy during a week off from my job and with a profy friend and in 4 days reached sail and engine Moreira marina in Spain non stop. Broken inversor clutch , arrive with force 8 near marina, tied with a dingy inside the arbour, boat quickly ashore and 20 days to repear the damnage. This has been the most risky episode because the rubber cup around engine shaft went broken and spilling water in.

Real trip started on 20 november with 3 more people and going slowly alongside the spanish coast till Gibraltair. Then 2 left and wit 1 friend in 5 days arrived at night in ISLA Graciosa ( Canary) . This is been the most strong time about wind and wawes of all route. Experienced new windvane ( red Hydrovane with an old stile double poled front sails: 2nd boat of this size using such a small wv) with a big satisfaction also downwind with the ship surfing a little.

Then my friend left from Gran Canaria and...
if u like ill continue next time.....    

federico

PS: forget to tell u I am 58 and been a professional rider with 3 Olimpics in my career still riding all the time I am home ( That helps a lot !!!    ),.


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## killarney_sailor (May 4, 2006)

Island Packets certainly good sail across the Atlantic and so have many Beneteaus. We have a friend who is an experienced mini-Transat sailor from NZ and he chose a Beneteau Oceanis to go cruising with his wife and two very young daughters.On the other hand, most of the Beneteaus you see at the boat show are not all suited for offshore passages since they lack sea berths, proper tankage, and the rigs seem marginal - but great for coastal cruising and hanging out at the marina. Cost comes into the equation and cannot be avoided. I think you need to do a lot more research before you can even start to talk about particular brands of boats. Let your father choose the boat that meets his needs and you can worry about crossing oceans later. BTW, a boat that would be fine for a typical Atlantic crossing might well not be up to the Drake Passage - note that it is not just transitting the Passage but getting there and back safely.

For the person wanting to cross the Atlantic in a smaller boat. There is nothing to be gained by going too small. Find a solid, small boat and go for it. boats that come to mind are Vega 27, Contessa 26, even an Alberg 22. These will not cost too much, and will be fairly safe if not very comfy or fast.


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## PCP (Dec 1, 2004)

PONTY said:


> Then my friend left from Gran Canaria and...
> if u like ill continue next time.....
> 
> federico
> ,.


Sure, we are always interested in hearing a good story.

Even if I never solo sailed anything bigger than 43ft I don't think it is difficult to solo sail a 50ft boat if it is rigged the right way. You have to know what you are doing and to know very well your boat, but a bigger boat provides a much more stable working platform than, for instance a 30ft boat, and that helps a lot. The Halberg Rassy, with its moderated rig and considerable displacement seems a good boat to solo sail.

The problem with solo sailed big boat is the maneuvering in the Marina. Getting in and out alone is many times impossible. I have given up to have something bigger than 40ft because I could not single handed in and out of a regular med marina without help, specially with any considerable wind, not to mention the bigger maintenance and marina costs.

Can you explain better this episode:



PONTY said:


> ...
> ... reached sail and engine Moreira marina in Spain non stop. Broken inversor clutch , arrive with force 8 near marina, tied with a dingy inside the arbour, boat quickly ashore and 20 days to repear the damnage. This has been the most risky episode because the rubber cup around engine shaft went broken and spilling water in.
> .....


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

Sounds like the stuffing box went...


PONTY said:


> Lefty Italy during a week off from my job and with a profy friend and in 4 days reached sail and engine Moreira marina in Spain non stop. Broken inversor clutch , arrive with force 8 near marina, tied with a dingy inside the arbour, boat quickly ashore and 20 days to repear the damnage. This has been the most risky episode because the rubber cup around engine shaft went broken and spilling water in.


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## QuickMick (Oct 15, 2009)

you might glean some guidance from reading about how boats held up in adverse conditions?

Amazon.com: Rescue in the Pacific: A True Story of Disaster and Survival in a Force 12 Storm (9780070486195): Tony Farrington: Books

Amazon.com: Fastnet, Force 10: The Deadliest Storm in the History of Modern Sailing, New Edition (9780393308655): John Rousmaniere: Books

Amazon.com: A Voyage for Madmen (9780732275921): Peter Nichols: Books

and while older, the perennial classic:

Amazon.com: Sailing Alone Around the World (Great Classic Series) (9788132030690): Captain Joshua Slocum: Books

all exceptional reads.


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## PONTY (Oct 6, 2010)

STUFFING BOX RISK ON PONTY  

to people who asked more details ( srry my tecnical words may sound quite inprecise): 

1) During the trip Rome-Bocche di Bonifacio-South of Baleares-Costa Blanca 1 and then 2 silent bloks of auxiliar engine went broken probably because the heavy see and some age. We 2 were going sail and engine because the little time.  
2) i felt like a slightly different sound but confident on my companion experience (he was a griek profi skipper and after a check He said all was normal ) I keept going.   
3) in realty the alignament of engine with the propeller shaft went wrong just a little that u could not noticede at all..  
4) on morning of 4th day wind stopped and 40 miles from the spanish coast, when i engaged the throttle i thaught like we had lost the propeller: no movement at all. In realty thr inversor mechanism between engine and propeller did broke and inspecting the engine room i found all black oil spillt and splashed around by shaft rotation and some golden powder coming from the wear of bronze bush (bearing ?). Some water was spilling from back stuffing box, in moderate amount    
5) we decided to change plan and reach the closest marina possible that was DENIA, but after a swift of wind raising to force 8 we had to make sail for Marina Moreira.  
6) with some fatigue, not to drift too mutch south, we reached Moreira's bay where , just around the cape we found no waves and no wind.:laugher 
7) A local dingy tied us unside and I fixed with 2 metal clamps and some marine sealant the STUFFING BOX that was spilling more then before.:laugher 
8) On the morning after a quick check , the local very good mechanic decided to put the boat ashore because a quite risky situation.   
9) Luckily we were in a small marina with a good and bossy mechanic and in little time the 20 tons boat was outside water. When i removed the provisional  sealing I found that the  rubber stuffing cap ( original volvo) was in part like a rigid bachelite piece because the propeller shaft did workd for some time in a not correct direction and it could be possible to have a quite bigger damnage.   >>> a broken cup will say a lot of water coming in from the propeller shaft hole. 

SO: a) check silent block regulary and change them more often that it seems necessary !! It is expensive but mutch less then changing the gear-box that has been a 0 cost compared with a sunken boat. 
b) on the boat You know quite well do not follow all the suggestions or ideas of more experienced people without a proper analisis .:laugher 

good wind


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