# water, every where, Nor any drop to drink



## PaThomas123 (Mar 29, 2011)

other than a watermaker what do people do for drinking water? i have 120 gal of fresh water but if we plan not docking for a long time that will go quickly. jerrycans? catch water? Thanks for the help


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## wrwakefield (Nov 18, 2015)

PaThomas123 said:


> other than a watermaker what do people do for drinking water? i have 120 gal of fresh water but if we plan not docking for a long time that will go quickly. jerrycans? catch water? Thanks for the help


We find that if it is necessary to conserve water, we can readily get by in the winter on ~1.5 gallons/day/adult. It goes up to 2.5 in warmer weather. That includes brief showers every other day.

These days we have a water maker and 220 gallons of potable water tankage, so if the water maker could not be used for some reason [e.g., bad raw water or break down...] we can stretch one of our tanks out a little over 3 weeks without trying too hard...

Regarding where else to acquire potable water- it will depend upon where you intend to cruise... Rain catchment is viable in some areas/seasons, but is rarely a sustainable supply. In Alaska I used to winter over in Prince William Sound and was forced to go ashore to obtain water from flowing streams. [When it wasn't too cold...]

Everyone's mileage will vary... but this comes from decades of living aboard.

You will have other consumables to consider as well. Here is one of our blog posts on 'How much water, etc. do we use...?'

In hopes this is helpful.

Cheers!

Bill


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## wrwakefield (Nov 18, 2015)

I meant to include a section on monitoring water consumption in my previous post.

Monitoring water consumption: [Live monitoring vs. how much did it take to fill the tanks since last time...]

Our water tanks would need a new hole to accommodate a dip stick, so that won't happen... They came with a SCAD monitor with internal sensors in the metal tanks. It is OK but I don't trust the accuracy... Therefore it is destined to be replaced with one of these gauges from CruzPro. [They also makes a fuel gauge that can be calibrated that monitors tank levels also accurately estimates the hourly fuel consumption rate...]

To really monitor water consumption, I've been considering a flow meter. The proof-of-concept could be done for ~$20 with a cheap meter [Which could also be used on the hose side when filling- especially handy in places that charge for water...] Then I found the JAKmeter and that looks looks like a good way to go; measure the water as you use it...

Of course, we would still need to monitor tank level even with a meter so we would be aware of a leak that occurred before the meter...

In case this is of interest.

Cheers!

Bill


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## MarkofSeaLife (Nov 7, 2010)

PaThomas123 said:


> other than a watermaker what do people do for drinking water? i have 120 gal of fresh water but if we plan not docking for a long time that will go quickly. jerrycans? catch water? Thanks for the help


I have spray bottles at every faucet filled with fresh water. The water pump is always off unless I am refilling the spray bottles.
It saves a huge amount of water. Hand washing is simple dish washing in salt water then a fresh water spray.

Try it.


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## ChristinaM (Aug 18, 2011)

We visit a fuel dock or lug some jugs every week or so on 66 gals for 2 people and a dog. Hasn't been a problem in 2 years in the Caribbean/Bahamas/US East Cost/Canada. It seldom rains hard and long enough to catch enough water to be worth the effort.


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## MarkofSeaLife (Nov 7, 2010)

I refuse to Jerry Jug, prefering to go to a fuel dock and fill. But in a very few places Jerry Jugging is fine... Georgetown, Exuhmas, Bahamas. There's a water tap on the dinghy dock. FREE! Its the most convenient water in the world I have seen.


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## Omatako (Sep 14, 2003)

My water maker now lies in a box at the back of the workshop. Too much trouble.

We have 1000 litres in three tanks. I recently made a rain catcher that spreads in a large triangle between the forestay and the front shrouds. It has garden hose fittings on a hose that connects directly to the tank fillers on deck. It catches a surprising amount of water when it is raining. We're going to Tonga next month so will see how it works in real life.

We have trigger nozzles in the showers, a salt pump in the galley and so far we have never run out of water. Interestingly in all my sailing, I have never paid for water. Wherever we have topped up, the most it ever cost me was a bottle of wine but mostly it's free.


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## Skipper Jer (Aug 26, 2008)

Finished a "mini-loop", Annapolis to Knoxville, 3 months. Biggest water consumption=shower. At Labelle, Fl, I purchased a plastic pump up garden sprayer, 1.5 gallon. With that I can shower using about 1.5 quarts instead of 3 gallons or more. Whenever I topped the fuel tank, the water tanks were filled.


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## Zanshin (Aug 27, 2006)

I did enough backwoods travel and tenting in years past to realize that I don't need to do it anymore. Investing in a watermaker was worth every penny for me. It produces about 16 gallons an hour (~1 liter per minute for SI people) which means it only runs for a bit every couple of days and the solar panels / generator produces the energy needed. But it means that I can shower as often as I want and that I don't have to lug heavy canisters around. I don't touch a dock for months at a time while aboard because of my watermaker (I mainly sail, so I don't need to fuel up more than every 6 months).


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## outbound (Dec 3, 2012)

Post this so others can correct or add to list. Tried to do due diligence before deciding if we needed a watermaker and if so which one and limitations.
1. If you live on the boat fresh water showers are key to health and comfort. Salt crystals abraid the skin leading to rashes and skin infection. Salt laden clothes the same thing. Modern synthetic clothes are much better but still require periodic fresh water cleaning. Beyond oral consumption fresh water for flushing toilets, washing boat fittings, wipe downs of interior are luxuries but also greatly improve quality of life and integrity of the vessel. 
2. A shower is the easiest and fastest way to cool someone down or warm them up.
3. Water budgets make sense on passage (we record at change of watch) but are grossly inaccurate when local cruising or at rest. You will use what you have and can never have too much.
4. In most cruising grounds rain catch systems are worthless. You go places in the seasons it doesn't rain. You avoid passages that might incur storm and rain. It's unreliable but your obligate need isn't. Rain is often dirty. Be it sand dust from Sahara winds in the carribean or acid/industrial pollution on the east coast. 
5." Potable" water can be suspect in many areas with waterborne disease still quite prevaillant in much of the world. Even U.S. marina water although not dangerous can be foul tasting and smelly.
6. Watermakers should not be used throughout much of the U.S.east coast. Pretty much never in harbor due to risk of contamination from hydrocarbons injuring the membrane and particulate in the water clogging filters when near coastal. Although the Cheasepeake maybe worse for particulate this is even true off the rocky shores of Maine possibly due to microscopic sea life. If a watermaker is to be used coastal carry at lot of pre filters.
7. Watermakers are energy hogs. Some think about it as turning diesel into water. If this is your attitude then you will be off the grid depending on your fuel tankage not just your water. Only way around this is to accept you will make less water, will still need large tankage and when alternative energy abounds watermaking takes precedence over other activities such as music, movies, computer time etc. When offshore do it during the day and turn off radar, autopilot or anything you don't absolutely need. Realize you may need to leave those things off quite awhile to bring your batteries back up.
8. Watermakers come three basic favors- A.C., D.C. and off a PTO from engine or genset. All have their problems. For most a DC unit makes best sense. It's the most likely to be runnable off alt.energy systems alone. Sized small enough as to not lose too much space. Adequate for basic needs.
9. Get or build simplest system possible. Avoid unnecessary electronics but get system where pickling is unnecessary or required rarely or at least is easy to do.
10. Cruising without a watermaker becomes a major determinant in where you cruise, how you cruise once there and quality of life.

Again please correct or add to list. Thanks.

BTW- installed a spectra Cape Horn extreme. Critiques of that device appreciated as well. Thanks again.


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## capta (Jun 27, 2011)

I did one transAt with only 60 gallons of water for two adults and a child. Talk about water conservation!
I've tried catching rain water at sea but there are two problems with it. First, if one leaves their catchment device rigged at all times, the squalls don't often last long enough to wash the device well enough to use the water for drinking. Secondly, if one doesn't have it rigged the squalls often don't last long enough to get it up and working. That's not to say that either way you don't get any water, but at best it's not a reliable source of water at sea.
I'm with those above who have watermakers. At 40gph, we have water for showers, anytime, even at sea. That is such a luxury after 40 years of water conservation that I still can't get beyond the guilt I feel when I take a shower just to cool off or because I feel like it.
We did live without ANY skin problems or ill effects for many, many years, both bathing and washing clothes (even our sheets) in salt water. It only took a few days to acclimate to the feeling and the plus is that if one bathes in sea water without a fresh water rinse, one does not get body odor! Go figure. No wonder those old tars could sail in close quarters for years without wearing clothes pins on their noses.
Lastly, if you have a well maintained watermaker, you can be certain that you have good, safe, potable water aboard to drink.


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## MarkofSeaLife (Nov 7, 2010)

I would love a DC powered watermaker. Most boats cruising these days have excess solar/wind each day.


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## outbound (Dec 3, 2012)

Good to know Capta. Thank you. Have had both crew and myself suffer with "passage pimples" ( staph on butt skin). Seems to occur in chronically wet and cold environs. Would note hi tech synthetics would seem to dramatically decrease risk. Agree a dip off the back of the boat in the tropics is a delight and enough to keep clean and healthy. Wife finds still doesn't clean hair that well. Interesting we seem to have read different accounts from naval surgeons as the lancing of boils and such I believe was quite common. 
Insensible water loss ( from sweat, and respiration ) is another concern particularly in the tropics or when working the boat as is a small degree of osmotic loss with prolonged swimming so should be in your equations. 
At the end of the day even noting desert dwellers can keep clean with a sand rub down and sailors with a dip in the ocean clean fresh water is best. Can use soap not detergent. Fits our biology.


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## capta (Jun 27, 2011)

MarkofSeaLife said:


> I would love a DC powered watermaker. Most boats cruising these days have excess solar/wind each day.


I do believe there are 12 volt RO units on the market, though they have a very low output for the energy they consume.
If I were you Mark, I'd look into an engine powered unit. You could build a 40 gph system so you'd only have to run the engine a few hours a week to keep up with your needs, until you find a new sailing companion, anyway. 
You can PM me for specs etc. and just belt drive the high pressure pump instead of using an A/C electric motor.


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## outbound (Dec 3, 2012)

Capta you're right pto driven is most efficient but if you went to the spectra site you maybe surprised about efficiency of DC. Big plus for many is can run often enough to allow power from wind/solar alone without turning on the engine. Just making the dump resistors hot with much of that energy now.


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

MarkofSeaLife said:


> I refuse to Jerry Jug, prefering to go to a fuel dock and fill. But in a very few places Jerry Jugging is fine... Georgetown, Exuhmas, Bahamas. There's a water tap on the dinghy dock. FREE! Its the most convenient water in the world I have seen.


Actually, the most convenient water in the world is the water dock in Edgartown Harbor. It's approx a 30'x30' floating dock, anchored in the middle of the harbor, with underwater pipes supplying fresh water to two boats at a time, one tied up to each side. Water is free. It's so convenient, it makes no sense not to top up.

The only downside is the yo yo that decides to wash his boat, while there is a line of cruisers waiting to get underway.


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## colemj (Jul 10, 2003)

I don't understand why you think that a water maker should not be operated on the US east coast. We operate ours almost everywhere there with no problems. Yes, the filters load faster than in clear Caribbean waters, but they are inexpensive and can be cleaned a couple of times. Oil spills in industrial harbors have not been an issue since it is pretty rare that we would be living in one of these harbors, and these types of harbors are rare anyway. If the water intake is a couple of feet below the surface, oil is almost a non-issue anyhow.

We rarely give a second thought to where we run ours. If in a marina with oil floating around, we just use the dock water. Water makers can be run in sewage ponds with little concern (a slight bit of hyperbole for illustration).

Which areas of the US east coast do you think are bad for water makers? Perhaps we haven't been there.

Mark


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

Perhaps the caution against using a water maker in a closed harbor is more of an issue for those that spend most of their time in one. Let's face it, unless one cruises full time, that is where the boat will be most of the time. We don't bother installing one right now, for essentially that reason. Of course, I would not use it frequently enough to avoid other issues related to low usage as well. I don't even really need one for a Bermuda crossing, so until we're ready to really take off for months at a time, having dock water in multiple tanks, for redundancy, is more than sufficient.


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## outbound (Dec 3, 2012)

C you make a good point and your experience will inform my behavior. Thank you. We are taking off for good in November and things will change dramatically. For the last few years unfortunately due to family and work( now gone) cruising as meant mostly Narragansett Bay in summer and virgins in winter with much time most unfortunately in marinas sitting due to work constraints. 
I relayed the info I was told by the firm I bought the WM from which was endorsed by the limited circle of cruisers I know and trust. One of the great things about SN is the expansion of sources of real life experience.
Too my shame admit to paying 20- 25 cents/gal for water more than once. Ease of getting water when getting fuel predicts that behavior. We run a whole boat filtration system but have also deferred filling up several times both in the US and well as Virgins due to concern about aesethic quality. Filters take out particulates but we don't have carbon nor ionizing filters so dissolved contaminates are not removed. Look forward to following in your footsteps and the freedom of a watermaker. 
Curious about your experience and technique for washing filters. Curious about which one needs replacing first. Was told to go with two filters in line on supply. What micron do you use? What is replacement interval for each?
Will take the answers off line .


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## pdqaltair (Nov 14, 2008)

I wouldn't be too embarassed about paying 24c/gallon. Think of how may people buy bottled water all the time, even at home.


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## robert sailor (Jun 22, 2015)

The filters commonly used for watermakers are 20 micron and 5 micron. If it's a smaller output then often just the 5 micron. Filters can be re cleaned quite a few times depending how dirty you let them get. I like to leave mine in the sun after cleaning, the UV does a nice final touch.


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## neoxaero (Feb 18, 2010)

The water in the area I live is never up to the standards set by the Texas Comission on Enviromental Quality. Something to do with organics in the water and the chlorine they use to clean it. It tastes HORRIBLE but it's good enough for all other uses. We drink bottled water that we're paying about a dollar a gallon for. I'll pay for good quality water for my wife and I to drink (especially since shes pregnant) 

We would have installed a whole house filtration system if we weren't planning on selling the house before we'd even have the filtration system paid off. 

I think the quality of water from a water maker is going to be way better than what we're living with now.


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## Skipper Jer (Aug 26, 2008)

neoxaero said:


> The water in the area I live is never up to the standards set by the Texas Comission on Enviromental Quality. Something to do with organics in the water and the chlorine they use to clean it. It tastes HORRIBLE but it's good enough for all other uses. We drink bottled water that we're paying about a dollar a gallon for. I'll pay for good quality water for my wife and I to drink (especially since shes pregnant)
> 
> We would have installed a whole house filtration system if we weren't planning on selling the house before we'd even have the filtration system paid off.
> 
> I think the quality of water from a water maker is going to be way better than what we're living with now.


<<<<<<WARNING WILL ROBINSON WARNING THREAD DRIFT>>>>>>>
We installed an under the kitchen sink RO unit from a big box store. Its what we use for drinking water.


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