# Lake Ontario to St. Lawrence to Atlantic



## labatt (Jul 31, 2006)

At the end of June of 2009 we're looking to start a 1.5 year cruise.
I have to admit to not really knowing ANYTHING about this route to the Atlantic. Originally we were thinking of starting in Cape Cod, working our way north through Maine and then heading south in September and not reaching the more hurricane prone areas until the end of October.

Instead of going north and then doubling back, we're thinking of starting in Lake Ontario (pre-positioning by going up the Erie Canal) and then heading up the St. Lawrence and out to the Atlantic, then south.

A few questions:

1) Where can I get info about this route?
2) Is this a feasible route or am I smoking something?
3) Am I going to have any mast clearance issues (once on Lake Ontario) or draft issues going up the St. Lawrence? Does anyone know the height of the lowest non-raising bridge and the shallowest navigable channel?
4) Is it interesting?
5) What kind of weather can I expect at this time of year?
6) Is it reasonable to sail up large portions of the St. Lawrence?
7) How long is this route?

I wish the Canadians would put their charts online so I could plan!!

Thanks!


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## maestro (May 3, 2002)

where are you starting from?? Are you going up teh Hudson and erie Canal to Ontario then across the St. Lawrence or is yout boat in Lk. Ontario now?? I'm a bit confused


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## Valiente (Jun 16, 2006)

It makes a really big difference, as you must take the stick down in the Erie/Hudson Canal, but not in the Welland Canal from Erie.

Where is your trans-Atlantic destination? As I said before, if it's Ireland, you can consider going to Newfoundland for a shorter leg on the northern rhumb line. If you are going to France or south, just leave from New England/New York.

Tell me your boat, your location and your destination, and perhaps I can help.


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## labatt (Jul 31, 2006)

Valiente - Ireland was a different person in a different thread. I started a new thread so I didn't hijack his... 

Assume our boat would be in Utica, NY on Lake Ontario. We live near Albany, NY so it's easy enough for us to "stage" a boat out of Lake Ontario. If we did this, we'd probably have her there the prior Fall to prep for our trip. Assume the mast will be up.

I'm just wondering if a Lake Ontario to St. Lawrence to Atlantic, around Newfoundland and down through Maine, then along the east coast of the US and farther south, would be a feasible trip for a sailboat, or if it's more of a trawler type of journey.

I now know that I shouldn't have to worry about bridges and draft... Great Lakes St. Lawrence Seaway System : Seaway Map has info on the trip.

But what about the other questions?


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## sailortjk1 (Dec 20, 2005)

It sounds like a pretty trip if you have lots of time and want to explore.
But if your trying to get South, I would think that you would want to go the Canal Route to the Hudson.
Its a long way around the trip you have planned, but if that is your desire, than why not.


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

Sailing the St. Lawrence, then proceeding down the Atlantic coast of the US will definitely be an interesting trip, and you'll be sailing along some of the most beautiful coastline in the world doing so.

AFAIK, the route is feasible, and shouldn't pose too many problems, although I don't know how much sailing you'll be able to do on the St. Lawrence to the northern Atlantic.

I don't believe draft-either air or water will be a major concern. However, at the mouth of the St. Lawrence, tidal currents and tide levels will be. If they're anything like the nearby Bay of Fundy, the tidal changes will be relatively massive compared to further south-on the order of 20-30' IIRC. However, I don't have any personal experience with sailing the St. Lawrence, so I could be wrong.  _(For full disclosure, I haven't sailed the Bay of Fundy either, but I've been there and seen the tide change...very impressive, and damned dangerous if you're not careful). _

I'd imagine that June would be rather nice, if a bit cool on the St. Lawrence, and fog will be a factor along the coast of New Brunswick, Nova Scotia and Maine. Nights can be pretty cold that far north as well. Might be worth packing the fleece... Since you'll be sailing on those waters, it might also be wise to pack either drysuits or "gumby" survival suits, in case of an emergency.

If you want, I can run this through VPP and see what it says for distance, time, and time spent motoring and such.


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## labatt (Jul 31, 2006)

sailingdog said:


> _(For full disclosure, I haven't sailed the Bay of Fundy either, but I've been there and seen the tide change...very impressive, and damned dangerous if you're not careful). _


_

_Ummmm... Wow!!!! I can't even imagine 20' to 30' tide changes. I'm assuming they must use some sort of floating dock? I think having to use the bosuns chair to get on the boat might be interesting with a bag of groceries! 


sailingdog said:


> If you want, I can run this through VPP and see what it says for distance, time, and time spent motoring and such.


I'm not sure what VPP is - I'm assuming it's nav software? Regardless, I'd love to hear what you have! This route sounds a lot more interesting than staging out of Cape Cod, heading north, and then heading south again (covering the same ground).


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## labatt (Jul 31, 2006)

sailortjk1 said:


> It sounds like a pretty trip if you have lots of time and want to explore. But if your trying to get South, I would think that you would want to go the Canal Route to the Hudson. Its a long way around the trip you have planned, but if that is your desire, than why not.


We're not trying to get anywhere in particular... I'm just trying to plan the route for our 1.5 year cruise. We wouldn't stage out of Lake Ontario if we didn't go this route (St. Lawrence) - we'd stage out of Cape Cod and then go north, and then south.


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## sailortjk1 (Dec 20, 2005)

It actually sounds like a very nice route.
Dog gave you good advise on what to be aware of.
I would also be aware of freighter traffic on and in the vicinity of the St. Lawrence. I don't have any personal experince, but that would seem to be a bottleneck for the large ships in the area.

The Great Lakes are a great place to sail. Might be a lot of fun for you.
Thousand Islands area is supposed to be a premier crusing area.
Good luck with your planning.


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

VPP- Virtual Passage Planner...  And, yes, doing the St. Lawrence river sounds like a lot more fun than doing the NE coastline twice... however, I love the NE coast line, so I'd probably do that twice... rather than the St. Lawrence river...


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## Valiente (Jun 16, 2006)

OK, I'll do my best:

1) Where can I get info about this route?

Canadian Sailing Directions They cost a bit, but they are worth it and feature a lot of local knowledge.
Cruising Guide St. Lawrence River & Quebec Waterways
A Cruising Guide to Nova Scotia

2) Is this a feasible route or am I smoking something?

No, people do it all the time. It's a big river, but with current charts, you're fine. Just keep clear of commercial traffic and file a sail plan with the Coast Guard if you are going through a sparsely inhabited part. The Cape Breton/New Brunswick area is a terrific cruising ground in summer.

3) Am I going to have any mast clearance issues (once on Lake Ontario) or draft issues going up the St. Lawrence? Does anyone know the height of the lowest non-raising bridge and the shallowest navigable channel?

No, and no...

4) Is it interesting?

Read the books of Silver Donald Cameron and you tell me...

5) What kind of weather can I expect at this time of year?

Cooler than Lake Ontario, but if you're in Utica, just expect May 1 conditions until June 10. By end of July, it's warm everywhere. Between the current and the prevailing winds, until you get into tidal waters, it's a pretty fast run.

6) Is it reasonable to sail up large portions of the St. Lawrence?

Yes.

7) How long is this route?

I believe it's about 1,500 NM to get from Toronto to say Halifax "going round the outside", but it may be a bit less.

I wish the Canadians would put their charts online so I could plan!!

Yeah, so do I. They are good charts and the CG here is excellent, but I think the price of them pays for a fresh coat of paint on the buoys every spring!


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## camaraderie (May 22, 2002)

I think we should ban Canadian access to Noaa charts until we can have access to theirs...whatever happened to FAIR TRADE!! Charts just want to be free!! (G)


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

now that cam isn't a mod...he doesn't have to filter his posts....and it shows


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

We Canucks don't need no friggin' charts !  And the 30 foot tides only happen in the Bay of Fundy - which runs between New Brunswick and Nova Scotia...so you don't need to worry about it unless you want to go in there - which is not a good idea 

Actually - you are heading toward some of the greatest cruising areas in the world. You've probably heard about the Thousand Islands - Gananoque and Kingston are great ports and marinas are fairly easy to find.

Sailing out towards the Atlantic on the St. Lawrence is not a big problem - but coming back in can be tricky as the currents can get fairly strong in certain areas. There is a LOT of commercial traffic once you get to Montreal. You need to stay out of the shipping lanes (which are quite clearly marked). There used to be a great marina in Ste. Anne de Bellevue - not sure if it's still there...

If you have the chance - it is well worth stopping in Montreal - good marina at Ile des Soeurs (Nun's Island) with subway connection to the rest of the city. This place was built originally as Expo 67 - there is still an amusement park there - La Ronde - lots of rides, etc. Montreal has amazing restaurants. If you like smoked meat check out Schwartz's on Rue St. Laurent .. it's the best.

I haven't sailed in Quecbec city at all - but it's another beautiful place - nowhere like it in North America - it really does have a very European flavour in the older downtown area.

Once you get up to the mouth of the river you're in the Gaspe region (on the south shore). Not a lot of marinas - but quite a few fishing wharves - some of which are owned by the Canadian Government and "open to the public". Winds will start to pick up here, and fog is heavy and frequent. You'll find the people quite friendly - very French - but this is a very popular area for cruising and they are happy to have your business. (The northern shore is pretty uninhabited here).

You should try to get over to Prince Edward Island. This is Canada's smallest province, located in the Gulf Stream. Water is warm(ish) there, beaches are pink and the Island lives on tourism. They will take very good care of you. Lots of marinas, gov't wharves, fishing docks. Great people.

I am not sure that I would recommend sailing over to Newfoundland. It is a fair distance, and the western shore is sparsely populated and very rocky. There are still a few fishing outports there, but don't count on being able to stock up on groceries and supplies. Contrary to all of the advertising - the people are not all warmth and laughter, and you would do well to stay with your boat.

The other side of Newfoundland - the Avalon Peninsula - is where the bulk of the population is concentrated. St. John's is the oldest port in North America - has a very well-protected, but small harbour. They see some cruisers here, and you'll be able to get anything you need. People are a bit friendlier here, when they're sober. They speak a dialect of English that can be difficult to understand at times (most times actually  ).

Just a little south of Newfoundland, there are two islands - St. Pierre and Miquelon - that are owned by France. I've never been there but apparently they speak a dialect of French there that can be difficult to understand at times  ...

The seas around here are rough and cold. Winds are steady. Fog is a big issue. It rains here for a week at a time. Can you tell I'm not a big fan ? Off the south coast of Newfoundland there are a lot of oil rigs. 

So - I would head from PEI right down to Nova Scotia. Pull in to the Bras d'Or Lakes in Cape Breton, which are actually an inlet of the Atlantic. This is known world-wide as a cruiser's paradise, and you will really be impressed - may never leave actually ...

From there, head down the coast to Ship Harbour or Ecum Secum or any one of those little places. Spend a night and then head into Halifax. There is a government wharf in Halifax Harbour, or if you want something a little more comfortable - head up the Northwest Arm to one of the Yacht Clubs there - radio ahead to make sure they have room...

When you are finished in Halifax - you really have to go to Chester. This is Canada's version of Martha's Vineyard...a really picturesque little resort town with summer houses and hot and cold running servants all over the place. Not at all pretentious though, and they will make you very welcome.

Leaving Chester - not that you are going to want to - Lunenberg is just a couple of hours ( well maybe 6 or so down the coast). This is a Unesco heritage site, a town with a long heritage of shipbuilding. The Bluenose was built here. 

Fingers are getting tired - I'll post more tomorrow if you want...


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

excellent post Sailormann...


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## Valiente (Jun 16, 2006)

camaraderie said:


> I think we should ban Canadian access to Noaa charts until we can have access to theirs...whatever happened to FAIR TRADE!! Charts just want to be free!! (G)


I _could _mention our softwood lumber here, but I'll just state that while I oppose protectionism and subsidies, I can't see that NOAA making its charts free online equals us giving them away for free also.

I would LOVE to have the option of printing off five-dollar B&W high-res Canadian charts from a PDF, but that isn't yet an option. On the other hand, most people in recreational sailing seem to ignore our Notices to Mariners, and not enough have even OLD paper charts, so maybe the point is moot.


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## camaraderie (May 22, 2002)

It was a joke Val...targeted at the Canadian gov't which has for years screwed both Canadian citizens and your southern brethren by granting a sweetheart chart deal to a private company rather than letting the marketplace decide the value of the charts. Talk about protectionism!! 
Before the US charts were made free...there were dozens of private US companies engaged in using the data to print (or computerize) the data in forms that would be saleable in a COMPETITIVE marketplace. (Some citizens wondered why if our taxes paid for the data...why it wasn't reasonable to get to use it.) 
By creating a private monopoly on chart publishing the Canadian government effectively limited choice and artificially inflated the prices we all pay. 
I just thought that since you guys use our charts for free...it would be nice if you returned the favor!! (G)
I understand some of this has changed recently.


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## labatt (Jul 31, 2006)

Sailormann - do you work for the Canadian Dept. of Tourism?? It definitely sounds wonderful. I have a friend who will be cruising the Bras d'Or Lakes this summer and I may go up to spend a couple of weeks with him. We do love Montreal, and it's especially fun to go to Rue St. Catherine with friends... (we only live 3 hours from Montreal). Overall, the info you posted was extremely helpful and this sounds more and more like a direction we want to go. We used to trailer-sail on Lake Ontario but never got up to the Thousand Islands.

Valiente - also wonderful information. I'm going to go look up the books you mentioned.

Chris


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## ebs001 (May 8, 2006)

Cam, the Canadian Charts are produced by Canadian Hydrographic Services, part of the federal government. We have to pay for our helath care some how and we do appreciate your contribution. You can check out their web site at Canadian Hydrographic Service - Home


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## Johnrb (Sep 21, 2002)

Labatt:

Here is a web site from Tony Wright (with lots of photos) who has sailed his Aloha 32 down the St. Lawrence to Newfoundland, Labrador and later Greenland. He should be good source of information regarding weather, tides, ports etc.

Travel Photos, Bali, Thailand, Vietnam, China, Greece, Turkey, Sailing Guide and Photos, Newfoundland, Labrador and Greenland
Meriah 0
Flotilla 0
Travel Photos, Bali, Thailand, Vietnam, China, Greece, Turkey, Sailing Guide and Photos, Newfoundland, Labrador and Greenland


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## Valiente (Jun 16, 2006)

camaraderie said:


> It was a joke Val...targeted at the Canadian gov't which has for years screwed both Canadian citizens and your southern brethren by granting a sweetheart chart deal to a private company rather than letting the marketplace decide the value of the charts..


Damn it, we agree _again._

I don't like "sweetheart deals" as there are far too many of them in the first place. And something as critical as nautical charts and NtMs are (gulp!) probably best handled and distributed by a government agency that, after all, is paid via everyone's taxes.

I downloaded the entire set of U.S. Pilots...great reading. I will still likely buy Admiralty pilots, but I think they complement each other, as the British pilots retain a somewhat more "sailboat-friendly" presentation, in my opinion, whereas the U.S. ones have a lot of juicy data for specific locales.

I hadn't heard our feds were thinking of changing. I hope they do. I really don't object to paying $20 per chart, but I would love to replicate certain charts for planning purposes, and I would love to make parts of other charts reproducible for my private use.

I can see that the people who wouldn't like this development are the people who make "chartbooks not for navigation", like Richardson's, using old charts and recycled sailing directions, because if I have the sailing directions and newer charts I can print on demand, I sure as hell wouldn't spend $100 on Richardson's, although I don't mind drawing LOPs and fixes on those pages as opposed to a pristine twenty buck chart.


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

> granting a sweetheart chart deal to a private company rather than letting the marketplace decide the value of the charts. Talk about protectionism!!


That's why everyone in Canada can go to a hospital and not worry about mortgaging their house to pay for it !


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## camaraderie (May 22, 2002)

Sailormann...I thought that was because we provide for your defense. I must be confused! (G)
How did we get from the St. Lawrence seaway to Canadian health care in 22 posts?? (LOL)


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

> I thought that was because we provide for your defense.


We figured out a long time ago that if you don't run around all over the world pissing everyone off you don't make too many enemies - hence no need for a huge defence force  (_just kidding - sorta_)

Not sure how we ended up here - another thread hijacked ... oh well - it's obviously the fault of the new moderator ....


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## Valiente (Jun 16, 2006)

camaraderie said:


> Sailormann...I thought that was because we provide for your defense. I must be confused! (G)


_
Au contraire_, my American friend. Our troops are fighting the Taliban in Afghanistan at the moment so you don't have to...


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## Waymar83 (Jun 5, 2006)

Looks like I missed all the fun:

On the issue of the St-Lawrence route...It's a no brainer. Lots to see and do but as stated earlier not for beginners. (commercial traffic, fog, currents, cold water). I hear great things about sailing to Newfoundland. (On another Post, AtlanticBryan sailed his 32ft Attalia for several weeks there)

When Canada-based, we sail out of Kingston (Lake Ontario). Great sailing and sights (Thousand Islands, etc). Our Marina (Collins Bay) has excellent facilities and friendly and knowledgeable staff (although a little out of Kingston proper). There are other marinas closer to town including Confederation Basin right downtown. In Kingston (a university town), you can chech out the historical sights including Fort Henry (War of 1812....burning down the Whitehouse....). Our teenage kids always insists on icecream at White Mountain (downtown Kingston). Home made, whacky flavours...

Prince Edward County (just West of Kingston) is really pretty. If you have time you can check out the vineyard at "Waupous Estates" and sample some of their wines ( I say sample. I'm not sure I would stock up on their wines). They have a very picturesque estate overlooking the Lake. They have a dock but I think its too shallow for sailboats. You can dinghy over. Great restaurant but you need reservations.

Leaving Kingston further down river, in the Thousand Islands, you will have lots of choices to either anchor or dock. (e.g. Gananoque, Rockport...)

Montreal...Needs no introduction. I grew up in Montreal. You were rightly pointed to Schwartz's for smokedmeat (semi-lean with mustard, fries, a pickle and a cherry coke). You've experienced St-Catherine... You can also check out Old Montreal (day or night) ... (maybe worth docking the boat nearby),.Off of St-Catherine Street downtown you can also check out cross streets like St-Laurent, St Denis, Crescent and Bishop (going east to west).

Depending on when you go you can catch the Formula Grand Prix (June), Just for Laughs, Jazz Festival etc.....

Quebec City, again beautiful, gotta check out the old town. Staying in the old town is not as expensive as one might think. Lots of European charm and good food.

Leaving Quebec a few miles further up this is no longer fresh water. You are in the Gulf of St-Laurence. Ditto on the earlier recommendation of sticking to the East/South side. Just more inhabited spots.

I have not been yet but if you have time on the "north shore" you may wish to go up the Saguenay River for a few days. This is a "Fjord". Very deep with steep mountains. various whale species etc.. One of the International "Open Ocean" races also starts up the Saguenay (The Quebec-St-Malo, every 4 years (next one is 2008).

I wont get into the benefits of our "socialist welfare sytem" at this time. I'll save it for another thread .


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## roadtotheisles (May 31, 2007)

*New Canadian Maritime Cruising Guide available*

Hello there,

If you are still planning to sailing down the St. Lawrence to the Maritimes I know of two cruising guides that you must get which were not listed by others who replied to your request for information.

The first is the "Down East Circle Route" by Yacht Pilot Publishing. This guide gives great detail on sailing the river with its currents and other complications and it has good reference to ports and harbours along the way.

Yacht Pilot has just released their new cruising guide which is called
Cruising Guide to the Canadian Maritimes. I just ordered a copy as I plan on sailing to Cape Breton and Newfoundland this summer.
This guide has re-issued the Bras d'Or Lakes and also includes all the coastal ports around Cape Breton Island, the east coast of PEI, the Magdalen Islands and the south coast of Newfoundland.

check out the website for more info on these guides at Welcome to Yacht Pilot Publishing
and have a great trip

Don


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## labatt (Jul 31, 2006)

Mark, Don, others - great information and greatly appreciated! I think we're really leaning towards this route for our year (or more) cruise in 2009.


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## labatt (Jul 31, 2006)

Valiente - Are the "Canadian Sailing Directions" useful without having the associated charts? I just saw a comment on a website - "_Sailing Directions_ are intended to be read in conjunction with the charts quoted in the text."

All - I'm about to place a large order and I'm trying to figure out how helpful they are. In addition to all of the "Canadian Sailing Directions" covering the St. Lawrence through the Atlantic Coast, I was also planning on purchasing:

Cruising Guide St. Lawrence River & Quebec Waterways 
A Cruising Guide to the Gulf of Saint Lawrence
Skipper Bob: Cruising the Rideau & Richelieu Canals
Down East Circle Route
Cruising Guide to the Canadian Maritimes

"A Cruising Guide to Nova Scotia" is out of print but I'll keep an eye out for it on eBay.

Any other suggestions?


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## Valiente (Jun 16, 2006)

labatt said:


> Valiente - Are the "Canadian Sailing Directions" useful without having the associated charts? I just saw a comment on a website - "_Sailing Directions_ are intended to be read in conjunction with the charts quoted in the text."


I have only ever read the Sailing Directions to Lake Ontario, so I can only comment on that publication, but I assume the logic and the layout are similar for all the Sailing Direction publications.

Yes, I've found it damned useful. I know the north shore of Lake Ontario fairly well, and so I don't refer often to the charts (there's not a lot of pilotage necessary in the middle of the lake), so for fair-weather cruising I use the Sailing Directions with a Richardson's (a chart book of older maps useful for plotting courses) and with a copy of "Ports", which is a touristy sort of cruising guide that provides useful aerial shots of port approaches, and then a load of addresses and phone numbers for every port on the lake for chandleries, marinas, yacht clubs, decent restaurants, repair services, etc.

Certainly in a busy, heavily commercial stretch of water like the St. Lawrence Seaway with its locks, I think it would be even more valuable to have the Sailing Directions than on Lake Ontario. The Directions gives you ranges between waypoints, nav aid information, a bit of local history, and basically is a word version of the sort of thing you'd see on the main chart. It's a supplement only: it's sometimes years out of date regarding daymarks and is no substitute for Notice to Mariners, but I have found it very useful indeed when approaching places to which I haven't been before. I suppose if you downloaded the Notice to Mariners and printed out the relevant passages, you could tape them into the Directions and use this to perfectly supplement a non-current chart. I got caught once with this, though, when a highly visible buoy off a reef went from 21 feet high to "regular" height, and I hadn't updated my directions and was looking for the wrong thing. I used coastal pilotage to determine I was far enough off to make my turn and eventually I spotted the new, far shorter buoy where it should have been. That is exactly one of those situations in which I don't immediately go to the GPS which had last year's waypoint...I didn't know if the end of the reef had broken off, or the buoy had been destroyed in a storm, or was out of position, and as the wind was blowing 30, I wanted plenty of leeway.


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

Sailing the coast of Newfoundland sounds good, too, if you read about in Suzanne Geismann's book "Living the dream." She and her husband are both retired U S Navy officers- Check them out on her web site Libertysails.com - She writes very well both on the web and in her books. My dream is to retire from the 9 to 5 and spend summers on the great lakes, eventually going out the mouth of the St Lawrence.


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## labatt (Jul 31, 2006)

By the way... when I ask if the Canadian Sailing Directions are useful without charts, I just mean for planning purposes. When we actually start our cruise we'll be procuring all the necessary and most up to date charts we can get. Are they similar to cruising guides? Coast Pilots? It will cost me a couple of hundred dollars to buy all of them so I want to see if it's worth it so we can see what good cruising spots exist.


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## Valiente (Jun 16, 2006)

Why don't you just buy one and see? As I said, I've only seen the one for Lake Ontario, but I think if I sat down with the "master" Lake Ontario chart for reference, I could well use the Sailing Directions to plan my trips. It's not like a pilot in the sense of "wind roses" or that sort of thing, but it gives in words and often pictures all the ports of interest, land marks visible from some miles off, descriptions of some nav hazards, local histories, etc.

http://www.fedpubs.com/subject/boat/atl100.htm
http://www.fedpubs.com/subject/boat/atl105.htm
http://www.fedpubs.com/subject/boat/atl104.htm
http://www.fedpubs.com/subject/boat/atl106.htm
http://www.fedpubs.com/subject/boat/cen301.htm
http://www.fedpubs.com/subject/boat/atl112.htm
http://www.fedpubs.com/subject/boat/atl110.htm
http://www.fedpubs.com/subject/boat/atl111.htm


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## killarney_sailor (May 4, 2006)

I have done the trip from Nova Scotia to Lake Ontario (upstream which is slow). The sailing directions are ok at best. Cruising guides are better where they are available. There now is a cruising guide for the St Lawrence River that was not out when we did the trip - we made do with sailing directions that only briefly mention marinas do not cover anchorages for smaller craft. The Cruising Club of America have guides for Newfoundland and Nova Scotia (between them the also cover areas like the Magdalen Islands. I am not aware that there is another guide for Newfoundland and the CCA guide is certainly very helpful. There are other guides for Nova Scotia. I have Loveridge's and it is very good and I think he is now self-publishing it after it was out-of-print for some years. There are other guides as well but I have not used them. Loveridge was much more useful than the CCA guide or the sailing directions.

It is a great trip - I would heartily recommend the Magdalens and Newfoundland. In the Magadlens the southern harbour (forget the name) is really nice and not commercial like the main harbour, although there is no provisioning there. We did the south coast of Newfoundland from Port aux Basques to St. Pierre - fabulous cruising ground; spectacular scenery, lonely, interesting outports to visit. Let me know if you have any questions.


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## labatt (Jul 31, 2006)

Valiente said:


> Why don't you just buy one and see?


Cuz my wife is already sick of the "buy one and see" pile I already have at home and has instructed me to only buy stuff we KNOW is useful or she'll.. well.. never mind


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## Capstan (Apr 30, 2004)

We, too, are planning a trip out the St Lawrence in June 2009. The tides in the Gulf are not nearly as bad as the bay of Fundy. They are more like northern Maine (12-15 Ft) and in some places only a few feet. I am Looking for used paper charts of the st lawrence if anyone knows of some for sale or trade. Also I have been unable to get Garmin Blue Charts for the river . I am upgrading to v8.5, perhaps they will be there.


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

labatt said:


> Cuz my wife is already sick of the "buy one and see" pile I already have at home and has instructed me to only buy stuff we KNOW is useful or she'll.. well.. never mind


If she's not happy, you won't be happy....  And a sailboat, just isn't big enough for her not to be happy on... You can't run and you can't hide on one... and there's usually no doghouse for you to get stuck in...


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## Waymar83 (Jun 5, 2006)

I actually drove to Gaspé from Montreal a few weeks ago. (My wife worked in a place called Grande Vallée for two months and I went to pick her up). SO here is some recent anecdotal impressions...

Best Lobster I ever had (I think I may have mentioned it on another thread, once or twice)! : 









Lots to see and do up the coast (you'll get tired of the whales...). Rimouski (the sinking of the Princess of Ireland, the second most tragic event after the Titanic - in terms of number of deaths), Matane, Gaspé, Roché Percé







and all the fisihng villages in between. You can actually go to the fishing processing plants (they tend to be quite small) and buy direct!

I have to admit, not much in terms of infrastructure for boaters (although there are fishing docks all over the place, I saw few marina's: After Quebec City, Rimouski, Matane, Gaspé. The wind seemed to be always constant mornings and evenings, nice strong breeze, no gusts. (again just anecdotal).
Definitely on my to do list to sail up from Kingston/Thousand Islands one of the coming summers.As mentioned earlier the tides were only a few feet. Nothing major.

PS. does anybody know how to reduce the size of the images...


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## camaraderie (May 22, 2002)

Mark...download the FREE Irfan View (google it) and it will let you re-size and do all sorts of other neat stuff.


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## Waymar83 (Jun 5, 2006)

Thanks Cam, I'll go check it now.

I also noticed on Photobucket that you can resize the photos as you upload them to Photobucket. That's what I did on a subsequent post and it worked. The downside is the the photobucket photo will remain the downloaded size.


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## camaraderie (May 22, 2002)

Mark..in IrfanView...save as a different file name as you reduce it and you'll keep your original. Another thing you can do there to use on line is reduce the color depth to 256 colors to reduce file size.


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## Capstan (Apr 30, 2004)

My wife and I are planning to leave the Great Lakes on June 15th of 2009 via the St. Lawrence Seaway. The tentative route takes us Through the Welland Canal, Across the NY side of Ontario with stops in Rochester and Sodus Bay and Dexter NY.

From there we will follow the river to Quebec City (stopping for several days in Montreal) and continue by following the southern shore of the gulf around Gaspe, Ooutside Miscou Island, under PEI and through the Canso Canal to the Atlantic. We hope to be to Castine, Maine on the Penobscot river by August 15th.

We have many concerns about this route and we would like to hear from people who have made the trip or sail in those waters to be sure we are prepared in advance. The following is an overview of our experience level and present level of preparedness.
At the end of this section, I pose a number questions that I hope readers can help me resolve. 

Thanks for helping us out.


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

camaraderie said:


> Mark...download the FREE Irfan View (google it) and it will let you re-size and do all sorts of other neat stuff.


I'd second IrfanV-View, and add Picasa to the list of photo utilities that are free and excellent. www.irfanview.com picasa.google.com


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## Talisman66 (Jul 18, 2007)

From there we will follow the river to Quebec City (stopping for several days in Montreal) and continue by following the southern shore of the gulf around Gaspe, Ooutside Miscou Island, under PEI and through the Canso Canal to the Atlantic. We hope to be to Castine, Maine on the Penobscot river by August 15th.

We have many concerns about this route and we would like to hear from people who have made the trip or sail in those waters to be sure we are prepared in advance. The following is an overview of our experience level and present level of preparedness.
At the end of this section, I pose a number questions that I hope readers can help me resolve. 

Thanks for helping us out.[/QUOTE]

Does anyone know if the mast has to be dropped to pass through the Canso Canal? Thanks for the great info in this thread. My plan is for 2012 or sooner to shove off and head out the SLSW.


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## SailMonkey (Feb 6, 2006)

I wanted to let LaBatt know that _Cruising World_ has an article on sailing the St. Law. and Maritimes this month! There is an especially useful section on 'timing' the trip...where to be by when, etc. We were delighted to see it, since we are also planning a trip out that way. We will leave Lake Michigan early June 2008 (This year!!).

Here's some weblogs and other links for that trip...
http://www.morganscloud.com/
http://webhome.idirect.com/~blueeden/Personal/newspersonal/shipslog.htm
http://www.sailblogs.com/member/madcap/?show=fulltoc
http://yachtpals.com/cruising/northumberland


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## killarney_sailor (May 4, 2006)

Talisman66 said:


> Does anyone know if the mast has to be dropped to pass through the Canso Canal? Thanks for the great info in this thread. My plan is for 2012 or sooner to shove off and head out the SLSW.




No, you do not need to drop your mast there. I notice that many of the people who are heading down the St Lawrence are planning to miss two of the real highlights - Magadalen Islands and south coast of Newfoundland. There places were great to visit.


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## labatt (Jul 31, 2006)

We saw that article and were excited to read it. It was short but had a lot of interesting info. Thanks for the blogs!


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## theartfuldodger (Sep 4, 2006)

If your still interested in more on the St Lawrence route, this was my route in 2005 to Nova Scotia, we left September 1, from Kingston. I was told by Gene the manger of the Neapen sailing club in Ottawa, that if I sailed out the this route and met all of its tasks and still was enjoying myself then I had met most of what I would experience once I headed off from Canadian shores, being I just now had been sailing only one year. My comment is that it was a good school room.


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## jamelia (Apr 27, 2008)

You need to look at the Great Circle Loop (greatcircleloop.com).
We start our 15 month cruise next month (June 1).
An incredible trip, should be an incredible adventure.
feel free to email me
Joe


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