# What class is my PHRF boat? A,B,C



## ltgoshen (Jan 5, 2009)

What PHRF class is my 
C&C30 MK1
Specifications
LOA 30 ft. 
LWL 24 ft. 11 in. 
Beam 10 ft. 
Draft 5 ft. 
Disp. 8,000 lbs. 
Ballast 3,450 lbs. lead 
Sail area 459 sq. ft. 
Thanks, Curt.


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## Jeff_H (Feb 26, 2000)

The cut off ratings for PHRF Classes are established regionally and change from year to year, and even within some clubs or events vs regional authority. You need to find the rating for your boat, and then search for the rating cut offs for the races you wish to do. 

Jeff


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## jsaronson (Dec 13, 2011)

Ratings vary by region. The New England ratings are:
C+C 30	174
C+C 30-2	144

174 would be class C most places


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## ltgoshen (Jan 5, 2009)

Thanks, I am reading up on the net.
Not even close to ready to get a team together. But would love to learn the ropes. Maybe by the fall? Who knows. I got a good boat, who know maybe I can find an experianced leader that needs a boat.


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## Stumble (Feb 2, 2012)

Itgo,

Your class will be dependent on the regatta. But with a 170ish don't expect to be above C very often. On the other hand if you were to go to KWRW you would be in start 11. So it really depends.


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## Tweegs (Jun 25, 2010)

For boats without an official, measured rating, our club uses this to assign a temporary rating.

http://offshore.ussailing.org/Assets/Offshore/PHRF/Hi+Lo+Mean+Report+September+19+2011.pdf

Yours would be a class E boat in our race series. As stated, the class you would race in depends on how the sponsoring club splits out the handicaps.


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## sailingfool (Apr 17, 2000)

Curt, 

You should find that boat a very rewarding race machine. I always felt my C&C 30 Mark I performed a cut above all the other 30 footers with he same rating, allowing us to often do dumb things and still come out up front.

You should give it a try in a cruising class, as soon as you feel comfortable handling the boat in tight quarters, you are likely to find doing surprisingly well...surprisingly easy.


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## ltgoshen (Jan 5, 2009)

sailingfool said:


> Curt,
> 
> You should find that boat a very rewarding race machine. I always felt my C&C 30 Mark I performed a cut above all the other 30 footers with he same rating, allowing us to often do dumb things and still come out up front.
> 
> You should give it a try in a cruising class, as soon as you feel comfortable handling the boat in tight quarters, you are likely to find doing surprisingly well...surprisingly easy.


I went out a few Saturday's back with a guy that has some experiance racing. He pushed my boat just a little and said it was a very fast boat and ask me if I intended to do any local club racing. He saild it would do very nice in a race. If fact, when he gets back form Afgahanistain he said he would love to spend time teaching me and would help me put a team togeter. Sounds like fun to me. He was very impressed with the ascceleration from a ded stop to top speed. Any I am reading up on the stuff. trying to learn all I can. I just love this sailing stuff. this sailnet site has been a great help. Most everybody is helpful.
I wiill spend all summer getting use to the C&C30. How well she does in light air, How close she will pont on her own, Her weather helm and so on. I gues 5 man team? somone up front for the jib and spin work? Someone at the mast? Some to trim the jib/spinaker. someone to trim the main, a driver and a mainsheet trimer?


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## puddinlegs (Jul 5, 2006)

Class breaks are usually determined when the organizer of the event gets an idea of who's coming out to play. 

Crew... Ideally for short buoy racing, foredeck, mast, main trimmer, 2 jib/spin trimmers, pit, driver. 4-6 you can get around if everyone knows how to jump in when something needs to be done and depending on how your boat is rigged. 

For beer cans, we'll have between 5 and 9 (usually 6 or 7) on a 34' boat. Most on the boat can do any position, so we can get away with being one or two people short. We also do phrf double handed racing which is a blast! 30' is a good length for dbl handing if you have any events in your area.


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## ltgoshen (Jan 5, 2009)

puddinlegs said:


> Class breaks are usually determined when the organizer of the event gets an idea of who's coming out to play.
> 
> Crew... Ideally for short buoy racing, foredeck, mast, main trimmer, 2 jib/spin trimmers, pit, driver. 4-6 you can get around if everyone knows how to jump in when something needs to be done and depending on how your boat is rigged.
> 
> For beer cans, we'll have between 5 and 9 (usually 6 or 7) on a 34' boat. Most on the boat can do any position, so we can get away with being one or two people short. We also do phrf double handed racing which is a blast! 30' is a good length for dbl handing if you have any events in your area.


You mean just 2 people? double handed


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## CalebD (Jan 11, 2008)

We frequently race with just 2 of us on our 27 footer - not spinnaker division though. I consider 3 to be all we really need but 4 is ok too.


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## Jeff_H (Feb 26, 2000)

Its funny but the size of the crew required to race any boat is often driven by what you are used to. I used to race my 38 footer single-handed in single-handed races and these races included using my symmetrical spinnaker (which I also use single and double handed cruising). 

The funny part is that my boat always seemed under crewed when I only had 5 aboard in a normal fully crewed race. In a crewed spinnaker class race I tried to have 7 on board. The amazing part was the raises and drops were no slower in the single-handed races, but the prep time meant that I might be on a non-favored tack longer so that I had time to set up for the raise. Jibes were a little slower, and needed a little more searoom since I needed to be almost dead down wind while I walked to the foredeck and jibed the pole. 

Jeff


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## sailingfool (Apr 17, 2000)

ltgoshen said:


> .....
> I wiill spend all summer getting use to the C&C30. How well she does in light air, How close she will pont on her own, Her weather helm and so on. I guess 5 man team? ...


You can race in cruising class (no spinnaker) with just two people on the boat, a good way to get some experience. Four knowledgeable people is all that's needed to spinnaker class, although 5-6 can make it easier on all.

The C&C 30 Mark I is not a light air boat, although it can be sailed to its rating in light air, it is just not in its element in less than 10 knots of breeze. As the breeze grows the boat goes to level I considered quite exceptional...its very apparent why the 30 is considered the stiffest boat every made by C&C. She just rocks in stronger winds, the challenge in winds over 15 is not to beat our class, that's a given, the challenge is to see how many of the "faster" boats in the class that started 10 minutes earlier, you can beat boat-for-boat. In these circumstances, with enough breeze and distance, we would occasionally beat them all.

The boat can balance very well in any breeze, as the wind gets over 20 just be sure to go with a 100% jib, trimmed inboard (all jibs need to trim inboard).


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## puddinlegs (Jul 5, 2006)

ltgoshen said:


> You mean just 2 people? double handed


Yes. Two people. We always do the spinnaker class as it's just too much fun and much faster. If you really want to learn what makes your boat tick, double and single handing, racing or cruising, is great!

Crewed racing is fun as well, but a different sport in many ways. Good ways, to be clear, just different.


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## ltgoshen (Jan 5, 2009)

sailingfool said:


> You can race in cruising class (no spinnaker) with just two people on the boat, a good way to get some experience. Four knowledgeable people is all that's needed to spinnaker class, although 5-6 can make it easier on all.
> 
> The C&C 30 Mark I is not a light air boat, although it can be sailed to its rating in light air, it is just not in its element in less than 10 knots of breeze. As the breeze grows the boat goes to level I considered quite exceptional...its very apparent why the 30 is considered the stiffest boat every made by C&C. She just rocks in stronger winds, the challenge in winds over 15 is not to beat our class, that's a given, the challenge is to see how many of the "faster" boats in the class that started 10 minutes earlier, you can beat boat-for-boat. In these circumstances, with enough breeze and distance, we would occasionally beat them all.
> 
> The boat can balance very well in any breeze, as the wind gets over 20 just be sure to go with a 100% jib, trimmed inboard (all jibs need to trim inboard).


Inside the safety lines? I have been letting it go over the safety line near the bow? Humm not sure what you mean on this.


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## sailingfool (Apr 17, 2000)

ltgoshen said:


> Inside the safety lines? I have been letting it go over the safety line near the bow? Humm not sure what you mean on this.


If you boat has been raced, there should genoa tracks located inside of the toerail, fairly close to the cabin sides, running from behind the chainplates to the front of the cockpit, so that jibs from small (100%) to large (150%) can be trimmed to a close angle. Yes, fully inside the lifelines. If the jib is over the liflines, you are not sailing the boat as close to the wind as it is happy to go, and with speed.


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## ltgoshen (Jan 5, 2009)

Yes, there is a track on both sides just before the wenches. They are like 30" or so long. there is an adjustable slider that can be locked down were ever you want to lock it. I will try to find a photo. Seams like the standing rigging and the safetylines will cause a restriction in the movement. 
I will look for a photo.


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## sailingfool (Apr 17, 2000)

That track is far aft, maybe the former owner only raced in light air, that short track may only fit a large jib, maybe a 170% or a 150% with a high clew. If the 150% is your primary use sail, hopefully it'll trim OK to that track.

When you want to start improving higher wind performance, you need to install a similar track aft the chain plates for a smaller jib, someone on the C&C list should have the factory location diagram for that track (I had it 30 years ago, but stuff wasnt digital then...). until then, whenever you use a small jib you will be pointing some 10 degrees or so less than optimum.


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## ltgoshen (Jan 5, 2009)

I have been looking into the running rigging. I ran across this on the inrternet. Do you think I could use this to run my boat? In generial tearms of course? http://www.usna.edu/sailing/Lectures/navy44/sailconfig/sailconfig.pdf


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## sailingfool (Apr 17, 2000)

ltgoshen said:


> I have been looking into the running rigging. I ran across this on the inrternet. Do you think I could use this to run my boat? In generial tearms of course? http://www.usna.edu/sailing/Lectures/navy44/sailconfig/sailconfig.pdf


Yes, although you dont have the forward genoa track show in the diagram, and your aft track may service, I assume it would although its is hard to say from the picture.

Note the diagram for a high clew #2 would seem a reaching configuration, pretty sketchy as a closehauled plan, as you would use your 150% to 18 or so, most beercan racers dont have a #2. I would think you would delay your reefs 3-4 knots versus this schedule.


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## ltgoshen (Jan 5, 2009)

I have 1 Main Halyard, 1 Spin, Haylard, 1 Jib haylard. I also have a internal short Haylard? What is it for. Is that for the Wisker pole??


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## jsaronson (Dec 13, 2011)

Whisker pole is for the jib when running downwind. Is short internal halyard on the front of the mast? That is the topping lift for the spinnaker/whisker pole.


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## ltgoshen (Jan 5, 2009)

jsaronson said:


> Whisker pole is for the jib when running downwind. Is short internal halyard on the front of the mast? That is the topping lift for the spinnaker/whisker pole.


Thanks for the reply. Yes it is on the front between the spreader and the mast foward light. here is a photo to help you see it. I'm sorry for the quality of the photo. How does this halyard put into play? If I run wing on wing in light air? Is it attached the the vertical traveler and the clue of the sail and kept horizinal? Sory to ask a dumb question. I, still learning all this stuff.
Thanks for your help. Heres the photo.


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## jsaronson (Dec 13, 2011)

If I run wing on wing in light air? YES
Is it attached the the vertical traveler and the clue of the sail and kept horizinal?

Mast (should be an eye), topping lift (its not a halyard) and CLEW, not clue. Yes, horizontal.


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## ltgoshen (Jan 5, 2009)

Is it attached the eye on the vertical track attached to the front on my mast and the clew of the sail and kept horizontal? This system looks like it’s designed to allow you to adjust "horizontally" the Whisker pole on both ends. The mast end with a adjustable track and the Jib end with a topping lift.
Right?


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## SchockT (May 21, 2012)

Yes, that is the standard setup for a symetrical spinnaker. With spinnakers the desired tack height varies greatly depending on point of sail etc. Being able to keep the pole level maximizes projected area. Of course it could be used for a whisker pole as well.


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