# HELP! Move to Live Aboard Sparks Custody Battle



## bonmot

Hi all,

I found this forum while searching for anecdotes about kids living on boats to help me make a case for retaining a 50-50 custody arrangement with my son. I realize that this forum is geared more toward cruising but I'm desperate!

Briefly, after 2 years separated/divorced, and having a court-sanctioned custody arrangement that is 50-50, my ex-wife is using my recent move to a live aboard lifestyle as "justification" of nearly eliminating my time with our 13 year old son. The boat is a 34 foot Silverton Convertable (300 sq ft). My son has the forward v-berth to himself. I am in the process of altering the layout of the boat to better suit it for living aboard. I've gutted and completely replaced the head. I am moving the galley to where the dinette was. I've removed the lower pilot station. Between the galley shift and the ex- lower station, there will be considerably more "hanging out" room in the saloon.

I don't take the boat out, it's only a residence. We're tied up at a very nice, small marina in Salem, Mass. with many historical and cultural ammenities readily at hand. The Friendship of Salem, a square-rigged replica of a China trade ship, is docked directly in front of us a couple hundred feet away. I've had to submit a "wintering" plan (I did ten pages!) to demonstrate my ability to keep my son safe and warm. There are somewhere on the order of ten other full-timers at this marina in the winter (half go out to the moorings for summer). I chose a power boat over a sail boat, and this pricey marina over many far more affordable ones to provide my son with the most optimal conditions I could manage within the context of living on a boat. He will go to his regular school. The only difference between this year and last is living on a boat instead of a not-so-fantastic apartment.

Can I please implore this forum to help me with their first-hand experiences? I'd be especially grateful to hear from kids (currently or now grown up) who have experienced this lifestyle and could share some insights. Also, anyone who has experienced life aboard in wintery climes. And if anyone would be willing to share their stories in the form of a "sworn affidavit" please let me know. But I'd be grateful for any postings or useful insights to help me retain the rich relationship I have with my son and to give him the opportunity to try out this unconventional way of life. I should add that my expressed attitude is to give him this opportunity but that I'll always maintain flexibility based on his needs and desires. If he doesn't like it, he doesn't have to continue. So far, he seems to like it well enough, though it is a difficult transition for him. His mom running to court to force him out hasn't helped either.

Thank You!


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## Minnewaska

You didn't say what your attorney's opinion was. You do have one.


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## bonmot

> You didn't say what your attorney's opinion was. You do have one.


My attorney doesn't see what the big deal is. She acknowledges it's not a common life choice but also understands it's a boat in a marina, not the space station. The key is to present enough information to the court to allow them to rule on an issue that they have no personal experience with. Anecdotes relating to kids on boats would go a long way in doing that.


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## KnottyGurl

you might want to consider having a lawyer for your kid instead of you.
This way the kid gets his say with a powerful voice, would carry more weight then your lawyer claiming this for your son on your behalf.
that's what I did and ended up with full custody.
And if your state allows live aboards as a full time residency, then it is no different then a high rise apartment.


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## bonmot

Thanks KnottyGurl. I think you're right on both counts. I'll try to get representation for my son.


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## Minnewaska

Seems a no brainer if it is clean and safe. There are plenty of kids living in dilapidated trailer parks with their biological parent. Good luck.


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## MikeinLA

Having suffered through the whole "kids & divorce" thing for many years, I have a few thoughts which may or may not help you.........

First, in hindsight, I think it would have been a better idea to sit down with your son and the ex and say, "So, I'm thinking of living on a boat, what do you both think about it?" Like it or not, you are in a partnership with your ex until your son reaches majority and her thoughts and opinions should be solicited and respected.

Second, do NOT be surprised if at the end, you find that your son has been going home and complaining to Mom that he really doesn't like being on the boat. He may not want to tell you directly as he doesn't want to disappoint Dad, but I would lay money that that's at least a part of the problem. Maybe a good talk with him is in order, and make sure you let him know that it's OK if he doesn't like it and that he should just tell you how he feels.

Third, if he's really all for it, most states allow a 13 year old to choose which parent he wants to be with. He should at least have an opportunity to speak with the judge and assure him that living on the boat while he's with you is just fine with him.

No matter what happens, it's a messy deal and I wish you good luck,

Mike


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## bonmot

MikeinLA said:


> Having suffered through the whole "kids & divorce" thing for many years, I have a few thoughts which may or may not help you.........
> 
> First, in hindsight, I think it would have been a better idea to sit down with your son and the ex and say, "So, I'm thinking of living on a boat, what do you both think about it?" Like it or not, you are in a partnership with your ex until your son reaches majority and her thoughts and opinions should be solicited and respected.
> 
> Second, do NOT be surprised if at the end, you find that your son has been going home and complaining to Mom that he really doesn't like being on the boat. He may not want to tell you directly as he doesn't want to disappoint Dad, but I would lay money that that's at least a part of the problem. Maybe a good talk with him is in order, and make sure you let him know that it's OK if he doesn't like it and that he should just tell you how he feels.
> 
> Third, if he's really all for it, most states allow a 13 year old to choose which parent he wants to be with. He should at least have an opportunity to speak with the judge and assure him that living on the boat while he's with you is just fine with him.
> 
> No matter what happens, it's a messy deal and I wish you good luck,
> 
> Mike


Mike, your response shows a lot of insight due to (unfortunately) experience and (fortunately) keen sensitivity to how kids think.

Time will tell.

Thanks for your good advice and your concern.


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## Christian Winkler

*Another suggestion*

Dear Bonmot,
kids like boats usually (moving or not) - we all know that. You say he likes the idea, and you do as well. Maybe you could add a supporting statement of a psychologist. This should impress the court, I think.
Best wishes
chris


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## hellosailor

Well, if you're never leaving the dock then I guess you can't impress the judge with the way that navigation puts mathematics to practical use. Trig and even spherical trig make sense when you're navigating, geometry becomes practical, and math skills (will we make port before the storm?) become a matter of "gee, I ought to know that".

OTOH mother's do worry about kids falling in the water and drowning, simply having water around with constant adult supervision seems to be a greater hazard than all the equally real dangers we ignore in homes.

Does her home have natural gas or propane? Couple of those blow up every year, but we all ignore it. Got an attic? Attracts bats, which carry rabies. Same thing for any critters under the porch. Or poison ivy invading corners of the garden.


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## ilikerust

There are lots of forums about living aboard, and I've seen some that specifically talk about living aboard with a family. There are tons of examples of families that even have gone on long, extended cruises (like months at a time, covering thousands of miles) with kids. A guy working on the boat next to mine in the boatyard about a month ago told me he and his wife took their two kids on a 28-foot sailboat from Canada all the way down to the southern tip of the Bahamas - they lived on the boat for six months. 

Google "living aboard" and you'll find the forums and some blogs as well.


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## bonmot

Christian Winkler said:


> Dear Bonmot,
> kids like boats usually (moving or not) - we all know that. You say he likes the idea, and you do as well. Maybe you could add a supporting statement of a psychologist. This should impress the court, I think.
> Best wishes
> chris


Thanks Christian. I agree. My son had a few sessions with a counselor back during the "main event". I'm going to request the doc to meet with him and try to gauge what precisely my son would prefer.


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## bonmot

hellosailor said:


> Well, if you're never leaving the dock then I guess you can't impress the judge with the way that navigation puts mathematics to practical use. Trig and even spherical trig make sense when you're navigating, geometry becomes practical, and math skills (will we make port before the storm?) become a matter of "gee, I ought to know that".
> 
> OTOH mother's do worry about kids falling in the water and drowning, simply having water around with constant adult supervision seems to be a greater hazard than all the equally real dangers we ignore in homes.
> 
> Does her home have natural gas or propane? Couple of those blow up every year, but we all ignore it. Got an attic? Attracts bats, which carry rabies. Same thing for any critters under the porch. Or poison ivy invading corners of the garden.


Good points Hellosailor. My ex recently switched from oil to nat'l gas and I have mentioned that in one of my written statements. There have also been rats and mice in the house on occasion. Not much danger of falling in the way we're situated to the dock, but of course an ex with an agenda can summon up all kinds of threats; real or imagined.


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## AdamLein

All I can think is, poor kid. Divorced parents is tough enough, and now he needs a lawyer and a psychologist? At least he gets to spend half his time on a boat!

I'm with hellosailor. Boats provide more opportunities for practical education than just about anything else you can do.

As for experience, don't have much of my own. However, this is one of my favorite blogs: two parents with two kids, one just a few months old, somewhere in the Chesapeake: Zach Aboard. They seem to live pretty comfortably, and the author tells boat-related and non-boat-related stories. Every couple of weeks I send my wife the link in the hopes that she will see the light


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## bonmot

ilikerust said:


> There are lots of forums about living aboard, and I've seen some that specifically talk about living aboard with a family. There are tons of examples of families that even have gone on long, extended cruises (like months at a time, covering thousands of miles) with kids. A guy working on the boat next to mine in the boatyard about a month ago told me he and his wife took their two kids on a 28-foot sailboat from Canada all the way down to the southern tip of the Bahamas - they lived on the boat for six months.
> 
> Google "living aboard" and you'll find the forums and some blogs as well.


Of course the key words here are "he _and his wife_". If a couple is in accord about any kind of lifestyle they want, they're free to pursue it. If one is seeking an advantage in the name of gaining more control over the child, almost any change in living situation can open the door to a battle over parental descretion. And let me tell you, there's not much worse in the world of parenting then having a court system micro-investigating and micro-managing one's paretning choices. It's both frustrating and humiliating. It's also stressful on the child to know that there is a battle raging over him and that more than anything else is why I detest my ex's decision to instigate this process.


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## bonmot

AdamLein said:


> All I can think is, poor kid. Divorced parents is tough enough, and now he needs a lawyer and a psychologist? At least he gets to spend half his time on a boat!
> 
> I'm with hellosailor. Boats provide more opportunities for practical education than just about anything else you can do.
> 
> As for experience, don't have much of my own. However, this is one of my favorite blogs: two parents with two kids, one just a few months old, somewhere in the Chesapeake: Zach Aboard. They seem to live pretty comfortably, and the author tells boat-related and non-boat-related stories. Every couple of weeks I send my wife the link in the hopes that she will see the light


Thanks for the link and words of support. I look forward to checking out that blog. It appears to be an extremely useful resource in making my case.

Best of luck in accomplishing your goal to move aboard. I guess it depends just "resistant" your wife is to the idea. If she could try it with an open mind she might come around. If not, at least she gave it a try. There are sacrifices to living on a boat to be sure, but there also rewards aplenty. Each person has to decide if the pluses outweigh the minuses. Even with all this incredible stress and nonsense, it still makes the most sense for me. Just wish I'd started 30 years ago!


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## bonmot

*Update*

I just received a communication from the court addressing our new "temporary" schedule. For the past year and a half or so, it's been 1 week with Dad and 1 week with Mom with a night swith on Thursdays just to break it up a little. This was great. My son pretty much designed this arrangement and it worked out well for a kid who really strives to maintain equity.

After my ex filed an emergency order for full custody (she claimed living on the boat had caused his very mild case of pneumonia even though he had only been on the boat a few times by then and despite his pediatrician flat out denying that living on the boat could have caused this illness), the judge had temporarily altered our arrangement to Dad on Tues, Wed and Thurs. During the summer months this wasn't too, too awful. But with school starting (yesterday) it would have been pretty bad.

As a temporary until a late October pre-trial (yes, trial, if you can believe it. We didn't even have a trial for the divorce), it's to be Dad Friday after school until Sunday evening. It didn't sound too good at first until I realized school days don't provide a lot of opportunity for hanging out anyway. Having every weekend is a real boon. So for now, it's ok. I'd still prefer the old schedule because I think that's what my son was looking for. We'll have to wait and see how this sorry mess unfolds over then next few weeks.

Thanks again to everyone who has responded. It has helped me feel encouraged and I hope this thread will continue to grow so as to be available for anyone else who has the misfortune of facing this kind of issue.


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## hellosailor

Bonmot, is there a school bus involved?

If so, it becomes a red tape nightmare to have your son in two different places during the week, the school authorities can't deal with changes in bus pickups and dropoffs.

(All part of why I'd ban school busses entirely, they've convinced me that those are way too dangerous to have anywhere near kids. Left behind, run over, hit by crossing traffic, seat belts, fights in aisles...they've made the point, the busses need to be banned outright.<G>)


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## WouldaShoulda

Being cooped up in a 34ft boat in Salem, Mass. in Winter may not be ideal.

Why not relenquish custody in the Winter for his benefit??


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## AdamLein

Shame about the pneumonia thing. The association between drafts and pneumonia is an old wives' tale and has no scientific support. The National Institute of Health does not list cold air, moist air, drafty rooms, or proximity to the sea as risk factors of pneumonia (Pneumonia - PubMed Health).

My parents divorced when I was 6 or so. My brother and I lived at my Mom's and had dinner with Dad every Wednesday and Friday, and on alternate weekends we stayed at Dad's until Sunday night. I feel like that schedule worked out well, but my relationships with the two parents definitely did not develop the same way. As I got older, visiting my father started to feel like a chore. Probably would have been different if he lived on a boat, though.


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## Christian Winkler

*Best wishes*



AdamLein said:


> Shame about the pneumonia thing. The association between drafts and pneumonia is an old wives' tale and has no scientific support. The National Institute of Health does not list cold air, moist air, drafty rooms, or proximity to the sea as risk factors of pneumonia (Pneumonia - PubMed Health).


That´s correct. Furthermore, iodine contained in the wind coming from sea will even help pneumonia problems.

But maybe it doesn´t make too much sense to bring forward arguments one after the other on a trial level. Say, bonmot, do you have a friend, who still is good friend with your Ex? Wouldn´t it be possible to arrange a dinner with him (or her) together with your Ex right there or the boat? (Without your son?)

Both you and your Ex want the best for your son. Maybe on this occasion you could - supported by this friend - install a new kind of relation between both parents, which would be based on acknowledgement of your shared responsibilty, which both of you still have in common. Having this dinner could maybe show your Ex that living aboard is nothing dangerous. The presence of a neutral acting common friend could maybe help to negotiate further arrangements without falling back into aggression.

Best wishes -


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## Jsmith

Hello,
I found this post looking for year round liveaboard options. What can you share about them. Salem would be a nice option. What was the resolution of your issue?
Thank you


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## Capt. Gary Randall

http://www.sailnet.com/forums/polit...r-boat-will-our-children-safe-dcf.html#913534 Dear Sir, I have done a lot of legal research including case law on this subject. Hopefully you'll find something useful also acknowledging that there are lots of opinions in this thread. CaptG


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