# Best Old 35-45 foot liveaboard boat for 2?



## Advocate777 (Sep 28, 2010)

I am researching boats. Can anyone give me some liveaboard boats for 2 that they could recommend? So, far I am making a list and i like liveaboard boats like the Morgan 38 and the Irwin Center Cockpit 41.
Its just for chesapeak, ICW, florida keys, bahamas - maybe caribbean - no ocean crossing.
I like ones that have a designated nav table/station. The ones with the bigger bed (like the Irwin Center Cockpit) are also two areas. I have been researhing most smaller 27-35 foot boats but this new range i am looking in I really dont have much of a clue of where to start looking and researching except for the Morgan and the Irwin and I like both.
Thanks for your boat recommendations!


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## Faster (Sep 13, 2005)

Budget? Age preferred? 'must haves'? 'must not haves'?


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## desert rat (Feb 14, 2013)

They are not pretty, they are not seaworthy, but lots of people live aboard, European canal barges.


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## mike dryver (May 13, 2006)

GulfStar 37 a/c


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## Markwesti (Jan 1, 2013)

Freeport Islander http://sailboatdata.com/viewrecord.asp?class_id=1911
Or Westsail 42 http://sailboatdata.com/viewrecord.asp?class_id=2257
Both of these are center cockpit and aft cabin . The Islander has awesome port lights in the transom .


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## krisscross (Feb 22, 2013)

Baba 35, if you can afford it. Kaiser Gale Force 34. Tartan 37, Alberg 37, Southern Cross 35. Bristol 35.5. All solid boats with reasonable draft that will keep you safe out there.


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## Advocate777 (Sep 28, 2010)

Faster said:


> Budget? Age preferred? 'must haves'? 'must not haves'?


Something from the 80's. Asking 65-70K that I may be able to get for around 60K. Nav station is a must have because it provides one desk to work on and my mate can use a table for her laptop. But i dont want a boat with just the salon table--definitely need the nav table-
a center cockpit would be nice so as to have the bigger rear berth.
But not a 'must have'. We prefer to sleep midship so if the salon pulls out to a double bed that would be good. 
I do prefer a heavier displacement boat.
Thanks


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## Advocate777 (Sep 28, 2010)

krisscross said:


> Baba 35, if you can afford it. Kaiser Gale Force 34. Tartan 37, Alberg 37, Southern Cross 35. Bristol 35.5. All solid boats with reasonable draft that will keep you safe out there.


Thankks so much for the list---i will check them out. The baba 35 is nice. The alberg is a bit narrow beam for extended at dock liveaboard but really safe at sea. I will go through them that strike me and add them to my list to go see. Thanks again-


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## Advocate777 (Sep 28, 2010)

Markwesti said:


> Freeport Islander ISLANDER FREEPORT 41 sailboat specifications and details on sailboatdata.com
> Or Westsail 42 WESTSAIL 42 sailboat specifications and details on sailboatdata.com
> Both of these are center cockpit and aft cabin . The Islander has awesome port lights in the transom .


Thanks -- I really like the Westsail 42. I need to see if I can find some that are in my range-
I will also research the Islander. 
Thanks for your input-


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## Advocate777 (Sep 28, 2010)

mike dryver said:


> GulfStar 37 a/c


Thanks - will check it out!


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## Advocate777 (Sep 28, 2010)

desert rat said:


> They are not pretty, they are not seaworthy, but lots of people live aboard, European canal barges.


Thanks for your contribution. But did i mention the bahamas and the carribean? I dont think anyone would want to make a passage across the Gulf Stream, or the Mona Passage, or the Anegada Passage in a European canal barge!


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## travlin-easy (Dec 24, 2010)

For me, it would be difficult to beat the Morgan 41 Out Island. Lots of room, shallow draft, easy to sail, rides like a dream. I have a friend that lives aboard a Morgan 38 sloop in Florida, just him and his wife, but it seems quite cramped in comparison to my 33 Out Island. He agrees.

Gary


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## JimsCAL (May 23, 2007)

While maybe not meeting all your criteria, I would at least consider the Catalina 36. Big advantage is that there are lots of them out there and you will have a number to pick from. You also have the choice of the Mk1 and Mk2 versions, several keels and a standard and tall rig.


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## TQA (Apr 4, 2009)

Advocate777 said:


> I am researching boats. Can anyone give me some liveaboard boats for 2 that they could recommend? So, far I am making a list and i like liveaboard boats like the Morgan 38 and the Irwin Center Cockpit 41.
> Its just for chesapeak, ICW, florida keys, bahamas - maybe caribbean - no ocean crossing.
> I like ones that have a designated nav table/station. The ones with the bigger bed (like the Irwin Center Cockpit) are also two areas. I have been researhing most smaller 27-35 foot boats but this new range i am looking in I really dont have much of a clue of where to start looking and researching except for the Morgan and the Irwin and I like both.
> Thanks for your boat recommendations!


New Bombay Trading Company Explorer 44 centerboard version ticks most/all of your boxes. Not many were built but they do come up from time to time. Excellent ventilation from 7 hatches. Biggest shower I have seen on a boat of this size.

In your position I would consider turning the small toilet into a workstation.

But the standard layout has a chart table.

Yes I have one and have been living very happily on it for some years cruising the Carib. It is not for sale.


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## Advocate777 (Sep 28, 2010)

Thanks, gentlemen- I will look into your suggestions-


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## SWFLman (Oct 8, 2014)

I'm in the process of restoring a 70's vintage Irwin 42 center cockpit. Lots of room in it. Two nice large cabins. 2 heads. My understanding is the quality varied a lot on these boats. But people who have cruised and lived full time on them are pretty happy with their choice.
Steve


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## seaner97 (May 15, 2011)

Maybe a little cramped, but Cheoy Lee 37 (Perry) or Cheoy Lee 36 (Luders)


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## vtsailguy (Aug 4, 2010)

Tartan 41, great boat. 


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## Corto Maltese (Mar 3, 2012)

Have look the Tayana 37


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## capncook (Jun 24, 2010)

I have an Irwin 41 Ketch and love it. Lots of room, great layout and sails beautifully.


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## BCSAILOR (Feb 15, 2015)

Why Not try a Morgan Out Island 41? there cheap and have lots of room

Sam


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## FDR14127 (Apr 14, 2010)

If you can find it, read the reviews of the C&C Landfall 38. In your price range, comfortable, fast, seaworthy and pretty....


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## miatapaul (Dec 15, 2006)

Given your sailing location I think just about any modern production boat in the 36-42 should work. I know you had a you tube video about financing, if you are really thinking about that you will want to look newer, as many banks will not loan on boats over a certain age, the banks I spoke to say 12 years is there cut off. If you are a vet I understand they have some good financing options. I think a Catalina/Hunter/Beneteau with a shallow keel will suit your needs perfectly. If all you are going to do is island hop/coastal US then I think you would enjoy the extra speed the newer boat will have and the larger space below. Look at Smack's posts about his Hunter 40. Will sail circles around just about everything listed above. I really like the Catalina 34/36 and was on a very nice Beneteau 39 recently. The modern fat boats will give tons more space below. 

Are you going to be actually cruising, or at a marina working a job for a while?


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## Scotty C-M (Aug 14, 2013)

The Catalina 440 has some very nice features for a livabord. The "pilot house" type main cabin gives great views from the main saloon. It sails well and has lots of storage.


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## sailpower (Jun 28, 2008)

Pearson 424.

Aft cockpit and aft cabin.

Nice nav station near the cockpit.

Excellent separate stall shower.

Pearson 424


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## Windward Star (Jul 26, 2015)

+1 for the Pearson. We purchased a 424 in July, moved on to it in August and love it. One can divide the cabin into 3 separate "rooms" for privacy, direct the air conditioning, or just to block noise while someone is sleeping. The cockpit is huge as compared to other boats of it's size and vintage, and there is plenty of storage throughout. Pearson did make a center cockpit version(422) with the same hull design but I can not comment on the interior space ect.. as we never looked at one. Originally we were looking for a center cockpit design for similar reasons as you, but once we stepped on the 424 we knew we found the right design for us.


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## UnionPacific (Dec 31, 2013)

Gemini cat.


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## dianaofburlington (Aug 13, 2015)

My favorite is the Halberg-Rassy 37/38. Can't believe no one's mentioned it.

Excellent sailing characteristics, seaworthy, safe & secure behind fixed windshield that lends itself to unobtrusive dodger. Tidy design with high, center cockpit without looking bulky and without high center of gravity. Practical mainsheet traveler located in the right place-- at the end of the boom. Pleasant-looking sheer without excessive freeboard.

Very high quality build quality (unlike Morgan OI product).

Cozy after cabin with double, no head. Dedicated chart desk with comfortable bench. Excellent engine access (typically bulletproof Volvo/Perkins diesel). Good usable galley. Very cool (almost unique) solution for storing/refilling LPG bottles! 'Guest room' in forepeak, common head in the usual place. Really, really nice main cabin (without dinette!).

Subtle step-transom design (not like ugly arrangement of most cruising boats).

And there are always used ones available.

Were I in the market as you are, I would have this boat in an instant.

Google them-- halberg-rassy.com


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## eherlihy (Jan 2, 2007)

I'm late to this party but; given the wide open criteria and the assumptions that I have made from reading Advocate777's posts, I would throw the Pearson 36 Pilot House (if you can find one of the 20 produced) into the mix. It draws 4.5' and has a separate shower WITH A TUB!








credit - Sailboat Data.com

EDIT - there is one on Yachtworld right now for <$30K


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## paragondoug (Oct 5, 2015)

I chartered an Irwin 41 once and found it to be a flimsy craft. I would go older, to get a more solid boat. Some nice boats being mentioned here.


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

The Out Island 41 was designed & built pretty much for the purposes you described.


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## Delta-T (Oct 8, 2013)

Bristol 40, I have a friend selling his. "As much as I regret having to do this, I am listing my B40 (pictured here) for sale. Asking $59K in sail away condition from Hempstead Harbor, LI, NY. Mostly Brewer maintained last 14 years. Third owner, second in Marion Harbor and he was an electrician. First owner in Boston."

Screenshot by Lightshot

Bristol 39/40 | Bristol sailboats

Let me know if you are interested.


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## capt13 (Jul 20, 2007)

If you have the Money Hans Christian is the way to go! Safe and nice!


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## TQA (Apr 4, 2009)

An early Hunter Passage would be worth a look.

Best aft cabin center line queen setup on a boat of that age IMHO.

Yes it is a Hunter but it will do the job just fine. The early ones had backstays!


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## Bleemus (Oct 13, 2015)

dianaofburlington said:


> My favorite is the Halberg-Rassy 37/38. Can't believe no one's mentioned it.
> 
> Excellent sailing characteristics, seaworthy, safe & secure behind fixed windshield that lends itself to unobtrusive dodger. Tidy design with high, center cockpit without looking bulky and without high center of gravity. Practical mainsheet traveler located in the right place-- at the end of the boom. Pleasant-looking sheer without excessive freeboard.
> 
> ...


Where can you find one of these for 60k?

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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

You could try here. :wink


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## Shockwave (Feb 4, 2014)

What is your sailing background/resume?


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## Bleemus (Oct 13, 2015)

SloopJonB said:


> You could try here. :wink


Hey I think I see one in the third row!

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## krisscross (Feb 22, 2013)

Bleemus, there is a good looking HR 352 here: 1985 Hallberg Rassy 352 sailboat for sale in North Carolina
Very good boat and you might be able to negotiate the price down to your target range.


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## Bleemus (Oct 13, 2015)

Thanks Kriss. Fantastic boat. 


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## net_junky (Nov 14, 2015)

I am new to the forum, but I was wondering what the opinions are of the 1989 Irwin 43 MK III. The wife and I al looking at one for sailing the Caribbean. Looks like a nice size for two people. Any input would be great with good experiences or bad ones. Thanks


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## travlin-easy (Dec 24, 2010)

I looked at this boat during one of my boat searching trips to the sunny south, it has a lot of interior space, loads of nice creatures, but it has a relatively small keel, which, IMO, is not conducive to offshore sailing. I settled on the Morgan Out Island, which also has a huge interior, loads of storage spaces, lots of great features, and a full keel, which makes offshore sailing a bit more comfortable. 

Just my .02 cents worth,

Gary


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## Hannibal (Dec 15, 2015)

Hc 38


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## net_junky (Nov 14, 2015)

travlineasy, thanks for the informative input. I will do some more research on the Morgan's. I have been focused on the creature comforts due to the wife. I already have the biggest battle in sailing won, the wife wants to do it with me, just not sure how our dog is going to deal with it. I have been researching boats that will give her what she needs to be comfortable at sea and she fell in love with the layout of the kitchen and she likes the centerline queen in the aft stateroom. I will also look into the Morgan's to see what they offer in a similar layout. Thanks again for your input.


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## travlin-easy (Dec 24, 2010)

Take a close look at the Morgan 41 Out Island. 1980 Morgan Out Island 41 Sail Boat For Sale - www.yachtworld.com. There are lots of them for sale at good prices and they offer a lot of the things your spouse may like. And, it sails like a dream, even in rough weather.

Gary


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## sidney777 (Jul 14, 2001)

Look at reviews of sailing characteristics of Morgan IO. I thought the Irwin 43 center cockpit was great for space, amenities. When you are "out there" and a storm hits, what type boat do you want to protect your wife ?
A floating condo, or the most seaworthy sail or power boat you can find. I have met too many people who will not sail again after one storm ( either male or female). Which big boat will you have the easiest physical way to raise & lower sails, anchor. **How about a pilothouse motorsailor with inside steering & air conditioning...and Diesel generator


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## net_junky (Nov 14, 2015)

Sidney777, I understand where you are coming from. I would never want to put myself or my wife in danger being in the wrong boat when the bad weather hits like the one that just hit the Bering Sea here is Alaska, 924 millibars. The questions I have are, is it as important today with the advances in technology, weather forecasting and with instant access to current weather for it to be absolutely necessary to have a long keel sailboat. I know there are people out there that thrive on the unknown and will sail in anything and go anywhere at anytime. I know there will be squalls that come on in an instant, so with smart planning, if you have the time to anchor for days or more to wait for the weather to pass, is it a must to have such a utilitarian sailboat designed to take on the possibility of 20ft seas. I am asking to gain the knowledge from experienced sailors. I have looked at the Nauticat's. I like the 38 and the 42 footers. One that my cousin and I inspected was set up very nicely. Set up for solo sailing. It was a Ketch rigged 38 but the Mizzen boom was removed with only the mast in place. That would be my first choice no doubt, I am just looking at other options and possibilities. Thanks


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## Bleemus (Oct 13, 2015)

You don't need a long keel to cruise. Unless you plan extended offshore passages any well found quality boat that is maintained properly will do just fine. You don't even need a keel as I crossed the Atlantic in '94 on a 15 year old at the time Newick trimaran and the first week of the race about half the fleet of monos and multis dropped out due to damage suffered in the nasty conditions. We finished first in class that year in the Doublehanded Transatlantic Race and we finished ahead of all the boats in the class above us. 

Find a boat you like, make sure your wife loves it as this is most important, make sure you maintain it, sail during the right seasons and pick the weather you are comfortable with and have fun. 

Any boat I buy I would replace the chainplates and standing rigging unless the owner had receipts showing it had been done recently. I always felt that as long as I have a mast I can get out of trouble. No mast and a Lee shore is bad bad bad. 

Enjoy the search and make sure you buy a boat your wife will smile at when you are riding the dinghy to shore for painkillers. 


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## travlin-easy (Dec 24, 2010)

Sidney, the worst seas I've been in while sailing my Morgan 33 OI topped 12 feet, which were produced by 55 MPH winds. The boat handled it just fine, my wife was amazed at how well the boat handled those seas and winds, and her biggest concern at the time was sheet lightning that was hitting all around us. 

That said, most mono-hull sailors that cruise offshore and coastal waters prefer a full keeled boat for a variety of reasons. Fin keeled boats apparently do not track nearly as well as full keeled monos, and in a following sea, it has been my experience that the full keeled boat handled the conditions far better than my old fin keel boat. 

If conditions get really bad, full keeled boats, from what I've read, heave too far more efficiently than fin keel boats and provide safer conditions by pretty much eliminating forward motion. I've only done this once, and it was just so I can take a lunch break in 30 MPH winds in the open expanses of Chesapeake Bay south of Point Lookout. I followed instructions in Lynn and Larry Pardy's book and everything worked perfectly. I was amazed.

I have a friend that has sailed to Bermuda on his 51 Morgan several times and said the boat handled the worst conditions better than any boat he has been aboard in more than 50 years of sailing. I have another friend that lives aboard a 50-foot catamaran that says his boat sails well, but it hobby horses in rough weather. We sailed side by side on a marginal weather day and his wife said if there was a way she could have come aboard my boat, she would have done so that day.

Bottom line, a full keel, mono-hull boat makes a great cruiser, even though they may not be as fast as some other hulls.

All the best,

Gary


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## net_junky (Nov 14, 2015)

Thanks for the info travlineasy. The standing rigging and chain plates were/are the first on the list for inspection/replacements on any sailboat I get. 

Thanks for your input as well Bleemus, not sure I get the painkiller reference though. 

Thanks,

Don


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## Bleemus (Oct 13, 2015)

A twist on the Piña Colada, the Painkiller cocktail is a rich and fruity tropical drink that's a specialty of the British Virgin Islands. Coconut cream, orange juice and pineapple juice join rum in this drink that brings the tropics right to your glass.


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## net_junky (Nov 14, 2015)

Any opinions on the Wauquiez Amphitrite MS 45?


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## travlin-easy (Dec 24, 2010)

+1 on the Painkiller. Great drink when properly made.

Bottom's up,

Gary


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## RHoodJr (Jan 10, 2003)

Did not see the CSY 44 mentioned. Would have to be a walk over model at that budget and as long as you are sailing in moderate to warm climates it is a wonderful live-a-board. 400 gal water, 100 gal fuel, large aft state room, very sea kindly motion and over built. Our hull is over 1 inch solid FRP. Great owners group forum that you can do a lot of research.


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## Bleemus (Oct 13, 2015)

Looked at a CSY 33 a couple of weeks ago. Hull is indeed robust. Remember seeing one on a reef in the islands and to took two weeks for the charter company to pull it off. Had it back in service in ten days. 


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

I always liked those CSY 33's but I'd want about 6' more mast on one - Sa/D is down in motorsailer territory.


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## Bleemus (Oct 13, 2015)

SloopJonB said:


> I always liked those CSY 33's but I'd want about 6' more mast on one - Sa/D is down in motorsailer territory.


I agree. The one I looked at was on the hard but the rig was still in and it looked a bit under canvassed. Having spent much time on race boats all cruisers look that way to me I think! 

I think the low SA was a purpose built design as these were headed from the charter biz and most of the people didn't need more sail area. They could get in trouble just as easy flying half a jib. Solid boats and we have considered one but the 33 is a wee bit small for us and the 44, while well built with a solid reputation, just doesn't suit my wife's eye. She said I would need an eye patch and a wooden leg.

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## TQA (Apr 4, 2009)

Painkiller

2 oz Pusser's Rum
4 oz Pineapple juice
1 oz Orange Juice
1 oz Cream of coconut

Imbibe till all pain is gone.


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

Bleemus said:


> just doesn't suit my wife's eye. She said I would need an eye patch and a wooden leg.
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


What's your point? :wink


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## Bleemus (Oct 13, 2015)

Arggghhhh matey!


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