# Sailboat Air Conditioning?



## 1970Columbia34 (Aug 24, 2006)

Has anyone used products from Ocean Breeze. We are looking at the 18500 btu model for our 34'. Any advice? 

Scott


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

I had a carryon that came with the boat.I gave it away. Unless I was living on the boat with dock power, I can see no need nor do I want to have to make that much power. Fans work fine for me. Not sure what your needs are thou. I have seen regular ole household window ACs rigged with a down draft used on livaborads at the dock.


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## wind_magic (Jun 6, 2006)

I agree with wildcard, sleeping directly in front of the fan works for me in any temperature I have encountered while travelling. Even in the tropics sleeping in a hot camper a fan was all I needed to sleep comfortably. I think I would be okay on the boat with a fan even without a wind scoop.


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## Cruisingdad (Jul 21, 2006)

Scott,

I noticed you have not gotten any replies on the Ocean Breeze so I thought I would chime in.

I have NOT used Ocean Breeze, so I cannot give you a specific rec there. However, I have used Cruisair on my last three boats and have been very pleased. Never had a problem heating or cooling with them. Period.

I would like to give you some thoughts:

1) 18500 is a big unit. You might be better served with a 16k or two 12s. My reasoning: The power you get on the docks is usually horrid. You might find yourself tripping the breaker in some marinas. We tripped them in the heat of the summer when our 16 and 8 (I think it was an 8) kicked on about the same time. Our way around it was to boot up the 16 first, then the other (sorry, I cannot remember if it was an 8 or not now). But, you get the picture. 

2) The tendancy is to wire in to the existing dock power coming into the boat, and that may be a mistake for the reasons listed above. Put the A/C on its own shore in. Most marinas have two 110s out for that purpose. Worst case scenario, we would carry a pig tail with us. It costs a little more, but you will come to thank me.

3) Plumbing. When you plumb for the water, do NOT use the pice of crap strainer that comes with it. GO buy a large bronze strainer (the bigger the better, to a point). THe small strainers trash up so quickly (especially in the warmer waters) you won't believe it. You will be down there cleaning the strainer three - four times a week if you don't use a large strainer.

4) T-Fitting. Obviously you will put in a strainer on the outside, but we also plumbed a "t" above the T-Hull with an on/off valve above it. That way when you sick up a palm leaf or plastic bag (which you will do) you don't have to dive the T-Hull. Just open the valve above and plunge a coat hanger through it which will clear the strainer. This is also very useful for hooking up a water hose to flush the unit with clean water and priming.

5) T-Hull location. THis is very important: DO NOT put your t-hull in the stern. Put it in the lowest part of the boat. AC's lose their prime very easy and every time a sports fisher goes by you will lose your air conditioner if you do not put the suction low. This will also minimize the junk you pick up in the tropics and elsewhere.

6) Accesibility. THe T-Hull should be very accesible for clean out, or you will come to hate your air conditioner.

Hope this helps. Best of luck to you. Sorry I could not give you a rec on the Ocean Breeze, but maybe a little helpful information otherwise. Cruisair is a good product.

- CD


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## 1970Columbia34 (Aug 24, 2006)

Thanks CD. Were are trying to cool our 34' Columbia. We are located in Lake Huron in the Great Lakes. We sail out of Bay City Michigan so we are not sailing in the tropics. You think the smaller 16k unit will do the job? I have a perfect place in the bottom of a hanging locker for the unit. What about the T-Hull Strainer being about mid ship. Does the Unit lose its prime during sailing? or are you just worried about it losing its prime while its operating. thanks.

Scott


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## Cruisingdad (Jul 21, 2006)

Well, I have not lived in Michigan, but I can say that we had a 16k unit on our 320 in Texas and it did fine (where the temps will often go over well over 100 in the summer). The trick is that if it gets too hot, you can put a cover over the cabin top. I think a 16k would be more than fine in Michigan. Use a reverse cycle and you can heat the boat too. Will your generator push it, or do you have a generator? Startup on those are high. Heating will draw more than cooling, i fI am not mistaken.


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## 1970Columbia34 (Aug 24, 2006)

Yeah if we hit 100 hear in Michigan its rare, but its not uncommon to be in the mid 80's. The deck is white with a light...light gray non-skid. If it were up to me i would say we don't need it but my wife on the other hand like the idea of cool sleeping conditions and even heat so we can extend our sailing season here in michigan. We just plan to use it on shore power here at the Yacht Club. You think i thin to run a seperate shore power cord just for the 16k unit though. I am looking at the 115v model. 

Scott


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## camaraderie (May 22, 2002)

Scott..Can't help you on Ocean Breeze either but CruiseAir and MarineAir are 2 good brands I've worked with. I think cruise air may have swallowed marine air. 
Just replaced a 16K unit with this one this past year and am quite pleased with it:
http://www.cruisair.com/sheets/L-0734.pdf
CD gives excellent advice on what to look out for and I too think a 16k would work fine on a boat your size and in your location. 
The loss of prime is very common during sailing even if your through hull is low. The solution requires removing the pump hose at the pump and "bleeding" which means some salt water in the boat...SO...be sure to locate the pump in an area where this will not matter and where you can do this routine job easily in a couple of minutes. With through hulls close to the center line, I've never lost prime while running or at anchor for extented periods...but I am always SURPRISED when I have NOT lost prime after sailing! The big strainer idea is excellent and given your water temps CD's suggestion #4 is a must. I had to dive 4 times this summer to clear debris from my intake. Thankfully the water was 75 degrees...but sometimes it took quite a while to get everything out. I would hate to have to do that in 60 degrees!


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## Cruisingdad (Jul 21, 2006)

Scott,

I always have run a second. It will cost you a bit more... but who knows, maybe you don't need to??? Your decision. Easier to do it up front then pull it back apart, though. I will say that most of my experience with dock power is in a salt water environment so it is corosive on the wiring - thus, poor electrical feeds from shoreside. 

80's in the summer?? Phew!! You will be FINE with 16k!!! Shoot, when it is in the 80's here (Texas) and S Florida, I am pulling on a coat and shutting down the hatches (just kidding, a little). And with the reverse-cycle function, you can heat and really extend your cruising range.

Best of luck.

- CD


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## 1970Columbia34 (Aug 24, 2006)

We are not in salt water so that should not be a issue. I will have to think about what I want to do. Its not a big deal to run another shore power hookup but your right its a added cost and the need to having to haul another power cord around to other marinas. I assume you still run the new shore power cord to the electrical panel with a breaker right?

Scott


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## ebs001 (May 8, 2006)

If you are adding a new shore power inlet, run your power through a dedicated breaker just for your A/C. You'll also have the added benefit if you don't need heat or cool you won't have to run the second power cord.


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## Cruisingdad (Jul 21, 2006)

If you mean running the shorepower to a seperate breaker on the marina power, yes. But remember, you have at best a 30amp breaker on most marinas (though some use 50's and it would not be a problem). Add up microwave, charger, and other items, and you could be getting close to that 30amps. Throw in a AC system, and you might go over it. Also, how old is the wiring in your boat and how strong are the connections? Any corrosion? Power loss?

Again, I set mine up for maybe a little seperate purpose than you do. Still, I guess the new shore would cost you 2-3 hundred bucks (including the cord). You can also try putting in the second shore and just pig tailing to see if you trip the breaker. It is the cord that is the expense. That way you already have the box in if you start tripping tripping the breaker but don't have to worry about buying the cord unless you need it. A compromise... like hedging your bets.

http://www.marinco.com/scpt/ProdPage.php?loadItem=153AY_Marinco Shore Power

http://www.marinco.com/scpt/ProdPage.php?loadItem=303SSEL-B_Marinco Shore Power


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## Cruisingdad (Jul 21, 2006)

If you are talking about a breaker coming into the boat... absolutely, always, without question put it in. That would be poor seamanship not to.


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## 1970Columbia34 (Aug 24, 2006)

I guess I am thinking to much with everyone recomendation of the 16k over the 18.5k thats more than enough savings to run a new shore power cord. As you mentioned we do have a microwave, battery charger, laptop and a hot water heater. on our current power.

Scott


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## Cruisingdad (Jul 21, 2006)

Well, just try putting the supply box and go to (err, hmm, West Marine) and buy a pigtail and see if it trips it. If it does trip the breaker, return the product to West and order a shore cord online (save tax, cheaper, etc). Like I said, hedge your bets. The real power useage wont come from the cooling, it will be the heating... in my experience. Still, you never know - you might even trip with cooling.

Best of luck Scott. Write back if you have any questions.

- CD


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## camaraderie (May 22, 2002)

Scott...Our new 16K btu unit runs at about 16 amps A/C115V. At startup she pops up to about 22. So... if you don't use the A/C along with the microwave or while the battery is on bulk charge...your existing circuit should be OK. 
I've found that a lot of marinas don't have DUAL 30 amp plugs available when they are crowded so if you can keep everything off a single cord, that is better for those situations. Another way to go is with 2-30 amp inlets running from a split 50AMP cord but that will run you around 700 bucks for the cords and splitter. Probably not worth worrying about as you can always choose one 30 amp feed instead of the other but at least you have the options.


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## 1970Columbia34 (Aug 24, 2006)

Yeah I checked and the "Y" splitter from 1-30amp to 2-30amp is like $200 on defenders website. The 50' cord is only $90 i will have to check at our new marina what we get for dock power outlets and that may influnce my decesion. how much does a normal microwave draw?

Scott


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## Cruisingdad (Jul 21, 2006)

$200 for a splitter??? You kidding me? THat is freaking rediculous.

I wonder if you could just wire a crossover internally. That would be cheaper. Or just forget it and go buy the cord. Easy for me to say, it is not my money. But the questions is: How much do you love your wife. Better yet, the question is: how comfortable is your cockpit?


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## Cruisingdad (Jul 21, 2006)

Microwave... around 8amps-9amps. I think that is right.


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## michaelzuzu (Feb 24, 2006)

A positive vote for Ocean Breeze. I purchased a split 12,500 btu system from them for installation in my 30'r. To minimize noise in the saloon the compressor sits in a cockpit locker, with the remote air handler in the cabin interior. It was competitively priced, and has been dependable. Michael


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## michaelzuzu (Feb 24, 2006)

Positive vote for Ocean Breeze: I purchased a 12,500 btu split system from them for installation in my 30'r. To reduce cabin noise I've located the air compressor in a cockpit locker, with the air handler remote in the saloon. Competitive and dependable. Michael


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## camaraderie (May 22, 2002)

CD...yeah 8-9 amps is typical for a microwave on AC circuit. As to splitters...it is absolutely amazing the prices that are charged but there is no getting around it. Checkout the difference between a 30Amp power cord at $50 bucks and the same in 50 AMP...about $500!! That's why I love big boats...so I don't have to decide how much $$ to leave to my kids!


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## Artwerke (Nov 25, 2005)

Cant say about Ocean Breeze, but I've a 16K King Marine and it keeps my 38ft. cool all summer, & toasty all winter here on Corpus Christi Bay. Art.


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

Another contribution for a manufacturer other than you asked for  We installed a Mermaid 16.5K R/C unit two summers ago. The unit is under the settee amidships and ducts into the saloon, aft cabin and forward cabin. Works great. Ditto in the strainer fouling. One of the best warranties in the biz and good customer service. Only down side... they take the units back to FL to do any work. 
Regards, Red


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## S/VNirvana (Jan 2, 2004)

I brought back the carry on a/c from Boat/US. Did not cool off the interior. I went to an R/V dealer and picked up a Carrier a/c unit and placed it into the galley hatch of my Pearson 36. The hull is dark blue and gets very hot in the summer, no shade. It just drops into the hatch and I keep it in all of the time. Works of the dock 110V via and extension cord.


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## 1970Columbia34 (Aug 24, 2006)

Ok we are looking and leaning towards the mermaid 16.5k with reverse cycle heat. How does the reverse cycle heat work and should I worry about the water temp? We are sailing in lake Huron and I have no idea what the water temps get down to during the sailing season.


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## k1vsk (Jul 16, 2001)

1970Columbia34 said:


> Ok we are looking and leaning towards the mermaid 16.5k with reverse cycle heat. How does the reverse cycle heat work and should I worry about the water temp? We are sailing in lake Huron and I have no idea what the water temps get down to during the sailing season.


The unit will produce heat, albeit at a lower level, down to around 40 deg F water temp. Below that, the heat transfer is very limited.
As an aside, some of the Mermaid units do not have a stainless drip pan.


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## CaptDaveB (May 28, 2006)

Mermaid Marine air is the only manufacturer to offer a 5 year warranty and prettty decent prices. The pumps they offer are pretty slack, but otherwise they have good units. Their 16.500 with a proper installation would be more than enough for you 34.


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## essman (Jun 29, 2002)

*Air Conditioner Wiring*

Read through this thread and have a question.
If I wire the Air Conditioner to a separate AC service, with it's own breaker, how do I wire it so that it then runs from the generator? The gen only feeds one service.


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## Cruisingdad (Jul 21, 2006)

You need to wire in a SHore/Gen/Off Switch. You switch between the two power sources.

Here is an example (and the one I use):

http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wc...54/0/0/switch/All_2/mode matchallpartial/15/0

- CD

PS Essman, I am suprised you do not have one already.


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## Cruisingdad (Jul 21, 2006)

1970 Columbia,

The heat function is really nothing more than the same concept as a heat pump on your house. It really works well, but is not quite as efficent as the Air Conditioning. Water temperature will play a factor, but I cannot comment what will happen when it gets really cold because the coldest I have used it is probably in the upper 40s (water temperature, not outside temp. Have used in the 20s outside).

You will like it. I have heard conflicting comments on the Mermaid, but most of the negatives were on their small models they sold several years ago. I have no info for you on a 16k so would take the comments posted above as true.

Another suggestion for you: Put a collection pan for condensation to pump overboard versus dumping it in your bilge (like most people do). This keeps the bilge dry (in theory, I guess). You also get a lot of algae buildup otherwise. Don't forget to really oversize the strainer and make it very accesible.

Take care. Hope it works out. 

- CD


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## tommyt (Sep 21, 2002)

1970 Columbia,

As you are sailing in Lake Huron you will might want the heat more than the air. Season is relative to the sailor. Water temps will be low to mid 40's in April (really want that heater at night), warming to mid to high 60's in July, staying in the 60's most of the way through September, and then back to the high 40's by the end of October or early November. Good Luck.


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## Valiente (Jun 16, 2006)

CaptDaveB said:


> Mermaid Marine air is the only manufacturer to offer a 5 year warranty and prettty decent prices. The pumps they offer are pretty slack, but otherwise they have good units. Their 16.500 with a proper installation would be more than enough for you 34.


We have a Mermaid Marine Air heat pump-style AC/forced air unit in our steel 41 footer. It came with the boat. I suspect it is the 16.5 model, but the instruction manual is aboard the hauled boat some miles from here.

What can I tell you? First off, if it hadn't come with the boat, I wouldn't have bought one...but that's just me. It seems strictly for dockside use, although I just acquired a Xantrex RS 2000 inverter that could probably handle it offshore at the cost of beating up even an expanded battery bank. It eats up a good portion of the starboard pilothouse locker, and while I would have preferred the stowage, I suspect I will just leave it in there for the odd tropical dock we choose to pay for. I don't have A/C at home (very old hot-water heated rad system) and I don't work in an office, so heat doesn't bother me as much as some.

Our layout is as follows: we have an aft cabin, a forward saloon and a pilothouse. There are proper vents and returns in all three. With the boat's stern facing south in a Toronto summer (32 C or 90 F) and with all hatches closed, I got the saloon and the aft cabin to about 23 C/76 F in about an hour. The pilothouse (aka "the greenhouse") was a broiling 37 C/99 F. No dice there. I ended up cracking the pilothouse hatches just to let the hot air rise.

The water filter/strainer is accessible and I can winterize from a central standpipe. I only used the heat option once because the boat is usually warm enough due to insulation to the water line and candles/lamps/body heat. I have also heard of the 40 F water limitation, along the previous owner (who lived aboard in a Toronto winter...a real one, not this tropical '06-'07..with bubblers) made provision for a second 30 amp shore power line (total: 60 amps). While I got the impression that he needed this extra to run the Marine Air unit in times of cold, maybe he just needed to run three ceramic heater cubes or a heat fan...I'll have to check.

A friend put a small Mermaid A/C in the wet locker of a Viking 33, which is a smaller boat than yours, I believe, and he loves it.

Or rather, he could care less, but his wife and daughters demanded it.


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## Brent Friedenberg (Mar 13, 2006)

*Cover for a Carry-On air conditioner*

Hi, I bought a second hand carry-on Air Conditioner for my sailboat. Unfortunately it did not come with the cover that goes over it when it 
is placed in the hatch. Does anyone know if there are companies making 
these covers or where one can buy the pattern. They can be bought at 
West Marine but the cost is around $250 which seems way out of line for 
a canvas cover. Thanks


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