# Anyone dive to clean their own bottom?



## RichF28 (Jun 17, 2015)

As a big DIY type, I'd rather learn how its done than just pay someone to do it. I have most of the equipment needed and was thinking about diving in to scrub the bottom. My concern is stray voltage in the marina. It is a salt water marina, with no leakage problems that I am aware of. Is stray voltage even something to worry about? Any suggestions for reading how to, or safety precautions are appreciated.


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

Stray current can be a problem. Some dock side divers are whacked every year. However, it's not very common either. If it's your own boat, why not just do it at anchor somewhere. Likely to be better water quality too. Check with your marina first. Ours doesn't permit dockside diving at all. It's a negotiated accommodation to the environmental agency that doesn't like excessive antifoulant heavy metals to be sloughed off in confined harbors.

Some thoughts........

Be sure to use the absolute softest media to scrub, or you're just removing too much antifoulant. 

It can be an extremely exhausting process, where you'll quickly learn that paying a pro is worth every penny.

All but impossible to use only a snorkel. Scuba gear is most common (but get properly certified, as it can kill you). Hookah systems are usually used by the pros and some DIYers (still requires scuba training).

A cheat method (only works if all you have is slime) is to snorkel around the waterline and use a long handled, soft bristled brush to clean as far as you can reach. Dive only to do the remainder, which may only be the keel or bottom of rudder, depending on the size of your boat.


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## SkywalkerII (Feb 20, 2008)

Minnewaska nailed it. Especially the "cheat" method which is my standard method. And it is exhausting but worth it for me. 

Good luck.

Skywalker


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## JimsCAL (May 23, 2007)

I've been cleaning my boats bottom for for over 30 years. I'm on a mooring and use mask, fins and snorkle. I don't find it that exhausting and i will turn 70 next year.


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## Chainplate (Aug 18, 2014)

We invested in a hookah for our boat and I know it's paid for itself many times over. Since we have been cruising full time for about the last 5 years, we often find ourselves in remote places where there's no one to clean the bottom but me. It's not a chore that I look forward to but it only usually takes a couple of hours every six to eight weeks. However, when we're at home in a slip, I hire a professional to do the job.


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## BarryL (Aug 21, 2003)

Hey,

I clean my own bottom (no jokes!). My boat is on a mooring. The harbor water is pretty clean so I am not too worried about being in the water. I first go around the boat in my dinghy and I scrub the water line and as far down as I can reach. Then it's mast, snorkel, fins time and I go at it. It takes me about an hour to my 36' boat. I admit that I do a poor job on the keel. Its 6' deep and I just can't stay down there like I used to (I'm 51). I get most of the slime off and I never have barnacles or hard growth.

I admit that I do hire a diver before I do an important race. He does a better job and also cleans the water intakes and does the bottom of the keel too. I pay him $95 and it's worth it. 

Barry


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## TQA (Apr 4, 2009)

I clean my own bottom. I use standard snorkel gear and work from the surface. NO DIVING REQUIRED!

The secret is I have an 8 inch wide flexible stainless steel scraper mounted on an 8 foot pole. It takes me about 1/2 an hour per side to do my 44 ft monohull. If you use a brush or a green scrubber pad you will remove lots of ablative antifouling as evidenced by the colored clouds in the water. With a scraper you don't get the cloud effect.

The next point I make may not apply to all areas. Where I sail you get quantities of tiny shrimp and larvae coating the hull. These will migrate to your person as you scrape them off the hull. It is essential that you have a real good wash down afterwards paying particular attention to any creases and important little places. 

BTW I am 68 years young.


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## Silvio (Nov 10, 2010)

I dive mine myself. Usually we grab a mooring at our marina, as others have posted we also have a no bottom cleaning at the dock policy. Usually me and one of my sons will suit up in SCUBA gear and take our time cleaning and inspecting. If it is mostly slime we are cleaning we find a piece of old carpet is gentle enough to leave most of the anti fouling paint while still sturdy enough to clean. Our 31 foot boat takes the two of us 30/45 minutes working at a leisurely pace. In Florida I frequently find a sandy spot with good vid and a foot or two of water under the keel. I anchor fore and aft and do the job with snorkel and fins.


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## aloof (Dec 21, 2014)

Yes. Twice a month because the antifoul is gone. Use a hookah. I anchor out somewhere clean, calm, clear and warm....between the tropics. Takes about an hour and a full 80 cf bottle. It's good exercise. It is spotless. Wayyyyy easier to do it regularly rather than let it languish. Use a soft plastic scrub pad when there is no real paint left. Use a soft bath towel rag when there is still paint (micron 66). If a scraper is needed you have not been a good parent.


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## Hudsonian (Apr 3, 2008)

Find a shallow spot and do it at slack before low. I find I use a lot less energy I can plant my feet on the bottom.


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## eherlihy (Jan 2, 2007)

I do my own...

I grab a mooring in a clear-er part of Narragansett Bay (usually Potter's Cove), grab my mask, snorkle, fins, scrub brush, and a suction cup and go at it. It takes me about an hour to clean my O'day 35 (including the keel).

Stray current is less of a danger in salt water than it is in fresh. Better to grab a mooring, or drop anchor, somewhere and not worry about it at all.


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## gamayun (Aug 20, 2009)

I'm a diver so there was never a question about whether I'd clean my boat bottom and change the zincs. That said, it's not easy and anyone who can do a 36' boat in an hour on snorkel seems a bit out of the norm. It takes me 35-45 min to scrub my 38-footer, but I am also typically upside down the whole time and in cold water with about 6 inches of viz, which would be pretty disorienting for some. If you have clear, warm water, then scrubbing the bottom on snorkel is the best advice, and it would build up aerobic capacity, which is otherwise hard to do on a boat. Whether you scrub your boat on scuba/hookah or snorkel, get a large suction cup to help keep you in place. This will reduce the overall amount of effort resulting in less air consumption.


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## capta (Jun 27, 2011)

Of course we have to clean our bottom! We were stupid enough to put Sea Hawk antifouling paint on our boat!
Unfortunately, or actually fortunately for us since we do at anchor, we need not worry about electricity in the water, so I can't be of any help on that front. We use a Deck Snorkel and that makes it pretty easy.
Sorry, just took the opportunity to try to save others from making the same mistake.


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## MedSailor (Mar 30, 2008)

Do I dive to clean my own bottom? No! I use TP and if that doesn't do the trick a shower usually does nicely.

:-D somebody had to go there...:-D

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I537 using Tapatalk


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## CLOSECALL (Dec 11, 2012)

What's a deck snorkel?


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## capta (Jun 27, 2011)

CLOSECALL said:


> What's a deck snorkel?


Deck Snorkel | Powerdive


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## capta (Jun 27, 2011)

MedSailor said:


> Do I dive to clean my own bottom? No! I use TP and if that doesn't do the trick a shower usually does nicely.
> 
> :-D somebody had to go there...:-D
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I537 using Tapatalk


Oh boy. You're going to owe the black box a bunch for that one!


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

MedSailor said:


> Do I dive to clean my own bottom? No! I use TP and if that doesn't do the trick a shower usually does nicely.
> 
> :-D somebody had to go there...:-D


Failure to clean your own well enough, is the leading cause of aspergers.


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## Fstbttms (Feb 25, 2003)

RichF28 said:


> As a big DIY type, I'd rather learn how its done than just pay someone to do it.














RichF28 said:


> My concern is stray voltage in the marina. It is a salt water marina, with no leakage problems that I am aware of. Is stray voltage even something to worry about? Any suggestions for reading how to, or safety precautions are appreciated.


Electric Shock Drowning (ESD) is pretty much unheard of in saltwater. I have been cleaning boat bottoms in saltwater marinas for 21 years here in the Bay Area and in that time, well over 1,000,000 in-water hull cleaning events have taken place here. To my certain knowledge, not one of those events has resulted in a hull cleaner being killed or injured due to electric shock. I'd say that's a pretty good indication that in-water hull cleaning is not inherently dangerous.

That said, it's never a bad idea to unplug the boat you're working under from the shorepower. You only have to get electrocuted once to ruin your day.


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## Fstbttms (Feb 25, 2003)

TQA said:


> The secret is I have an 8 inch wide flexible stainless steel scraper mounted on an 8 foot pole.


Otherwise known as a "Worst Management Practice." Not only is it bad for the paint, it doesn't actually "clean" the bottom. Remove 3-dimensional growth? Maybe. Leave a clean paint surface? No.



TQA said:


> If you use a brush or a green scrubber pad you will remove lots of ablative antifouling as evidenced by the colored clouds in the water.


Then don't use a brush or green scrubber. Use a white scrubber or a piece of carpet. And if you can't clean your hull with anything less abrasive than a scraper or a brush, you have waited too long to clean it. It ain't rocket science.


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## Fstbttms (Feb 25, 2003)




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## TQA (Apr 4, 2009)

Fstbttms said:


>


None of the above will shift hard coral growth, barnacles or mangrove oysters once they are established except maybe the bottom item.

Where I hang out for hurricane season is exceptionally fertile due to the proximity of a rum factory which cleans out it's tanks straight into the bay. Also the water temp is 80+f year round. Things like coral, barnacles and oysters grow FAST.

If you try to use a typical fibre pad you quickly find that it is torn to shreds by the barnacles which are mostly untouched and you produce clouds of colored stuff which I assume is AF.


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## asdf38 (Jul 7, 2010)

TQA said:


> I clean my own bottom. I use standard snorkel gear and work from the surface. NO DIVING REQUIRED!
> 
> The secret is I have an 8 inch wide flexible stainless steel scraper mounted on an 8 foot pole. It takes me about 1/2 an hour per side to do my 44 ft monohull. If you use a brush or a green scrubber pad you will remove lots of ablative antifouling as evidenced by the colored clouds in the water. With a scraper you don't get the cloud effect.
> 
> ...


Heh I've dived on my bottom.

The first time I came up, stood up straight in the cockpit, looked down at myself and almost had a heart attack when I saw 1 million small brown squirming things covering me. I stiped naked right there in broad daylight in Boston harbor and jumped down below.

I quickly assessed that the mystery creatures were harmless small shrimp but that was pretty fun. Now I start from the stern and keep my body towards the bow such that prevailing current should take them away (which applies to the clouds of paint as well) and don't freak out when I do see them.

I find that diving is pretty effective on my boat where with its narrow beam it's not hard to get under to the keel with a brush on a handle. The prop is also far enough aft that I can reach it with one hand with my head above water.

With the prop in particular its incredibly important to keep it clean.


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## Fstbttms (Feb 25, 2003)

TQA said:


> Where I hang out for hurricane season is exceptionally fertile due to the proximity of a rum factory which cleans out it's tanks straight into the bay. Also the water temp is 80+f year round. Things like coral, barnacles and oysters grow FAST.


OK, allow me to blow your mind a little bit.

When you use a scraper on your bottom, you are leaving a layer of silt or slime behind, The scraper (unless you are willing to actually get down into the paint) does not leave a clean paint surface. This means two things:

1.- The slime or silt layer inhibits the ability of the anti fouling paint's biocide to get into the water. The leaching copper or zinc remains trapped behind the fouling layer. Even a very thin fouling layer.

2.- By leaving a layer of silt behind, you are providing barnacle larvae with a good surface to begin colonization.

So while you may think you are helping yourself by scraping (as opposed to relatively frequent, gently wiping), in reality you are probably hastening the hard fouling you say occurs so rapidly. :eek


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## Fstbttms (Feb 25, 2003)

asdf38 said:


> The first time I came up, stood up straight in the cockpit, looked down at myself and almost had a heart attack when I saw 1 million small brown squirming things covering me.


Welcome to the club.


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## capta (Jun 27, 2011)

Fstbttms said:


> OK, allow me to blow your mind a little bit.
> 
> When you use a scraper on your bottom, you are leaving a layer of silt or slime behind, The scraper (unless you are willing to actually get down into the paint) does not leave a clean paint surface. This means two things:
> 
> ...


You just don't understand tropical growth. Barnacles and coral are hard from the get go and unless we want to be in the water cleaning our bottoms 3 times a week, we are not dealing with a slime, but shell and a grass like growth (which also takes a hard scraper) for the most part. These things can and do grow on an ocean crossing; one need not be at anchor or in a slip to get a foul bottom in the tropics.
For most of us, cleaning our bottoms is not our profession and gets done when we can get to it or just before voyaging.
No way in the world a soft scrub pad is going to handle the growth we get down here. After a good scraping, one can go back and 'polish' the hull, if one wishes.
Since not one of the antfouling paints on the market actually antifouls, I believe we are each experts at this by now and though your advice may be of value in temperate waters, it isn't a lot of help to us tropical sailors.
As for adding a beer to the mix, rum is cheaper than water down here, so you'll probably find rum in our bottom cleaning kit, rather than beer.


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

No doubt that tropical waters are a different beast. I'm wondering how the charter companies deal with it. Clean as a whistle this past winter and, when we returned a week later, it was as clean as when we departed. Not all that bad.


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## travlin-easy (Dec 24, 2010)

There was a guy in Boot Key Harbor that used a variety of scrapers with various curves. He cleaned the boat for just $2 a foot. He did a fantastic job and the bottom looked like it had just been painted.

The next best thing I've found, at least for do it yourselfers, is a sanding screen used to sand dry wall. Really does an incredible job and removes everything with very little effort. They are available from Home Depot, Lowes, etc... 3M 9089NA Drywall Sanding Screen, 4 3/16in x 11 1/4 in, 2-Sheet Fine-Grit - Sandpaper Sheets - [email protected]@[email protected]@http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/[email protected]@[email protected]@41IPL7gPXAL

The best technique was to attach the sanding screen to a padded pole, which those in the drywall business use all the time.

Another discovery while in the keys was how effective transducer paint was for keeping the prop completely clean for 7 months. Yep, after 7 months that prop looked like it had just been painted the same day. Nothing, absolutely nothing, attached to that prop. I purchased a spray can of this at West Marine for about $30 and applied three coats to the prop before leaving for the keys. That was three years ago. I guess I'll put on another coat this winter - just to be on the safe side. PETTIT PAINTS Transducer Paint | West Marine

Gary


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## Fstbttms (Feb 25, 2003)

capta said:


> Barnacles and coral are hard from the get go...


That is simply not true. These animals do not magically appear on your hull, fully grown with a hard shell. They start as larvae. While I understand that it may not be convenient or feasible for you to clean your hull frequently enough to keep them at bay, the reality is as I've explained. A dirty hull provides not only a fertile settlement area for these animals, but actually reduces your anti fouling paint's ability to retard their growth. That's just the nature of the beast, regardless of where you do your boating.


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## Fstbttms (Feb 25, 2003)

travlineasy said:


> The next best thing I've found, at least for do it yourselfers, is a sanding screen used to sand dry wall. Really does an incredible job and removes everything with very little effort.


Yes, including your anti fouling paint.


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## TQA (Apr 4, 2009)

Minnewaska said:


> No doubt that tropical waters are a different beast. I'm wondering how the charter companies deal with it. Clean as a whistle this past winter and, when we returned a week later, it was as clean as when we departed. Not all that bad.


If it was Antigua a diver with an 8 in flexible stainless steel scraper scrapes it clean usually using a hookah.


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## aloof (Dec 21, 2014)

As much as it pains me to agree with Fstbttms...heh...he is right on this one. If you have hard growth, like barnacles, you have been slacking. I've been equatorial for 5 years. These hard things do not appear in a week or two. I have never ever used a scraper even when the ablative was gone. Using a scraper is what you do when your are months behind...as is very common with cruisers.


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## Friend of Ned (Sep 8, 2015)

Good for you BarryL. Nice looking boat.


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## Fstbttms (Feb 25, 2003)

aloof said:


> As much as it pains me to agree with Fstbttms...heh...he is right on this one.


Of course I am. 21 years in the hull cleaning biz with about 25,000 hull cleanings under my belt. Forgive me if I sound arrogant, but I know what the hell I am talking about. And while the fouling progression may be faster and more robust in tropical waters than here in California, the basic tenets remain the same- to maximize your anti fouling paint's lifespan (and therefore your boat's performance) you must clean it gently. Which means cleaning it *before* it gets even moderately foul. The only difference between here and there is how quickly the bottom reaches a "moderately foul" condition.


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## FarCry (Apr 21, 2007)

Minnewaska said:


> No doubt that tropical waters are a different beast. I'm wondering how the charter companies deal with it. Clean as a whistle this past winter and, when we returned a week later, it was as clean as when we departed. Not all that bad.


Years of experimentation with various bottom paints, nearly continual use of boats and annual haulouts with a little scrubbing around the waterline as needed. Those are the basic keys used by one of the charter companies that I'm familiar with.


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## Charly_A (Sep 13, 2015)

RichF28 - I didn't see any info about where you are. Here in Maine the ocean temp reaches a max of approx 64 degrees in late August. My experience in clearing lobster pot lines from my prop convinced me that anything more than 1/2 hour in the water was no fun. There are local divers with scuba gear and I consider their rates a bargain, I also get them to change a prop zinc at same time. If I was in the Bahamas or further south, I would consider doing it myself.


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## RichH (Jul 10, 2000)

I clean my hull but I dont usually dive to do it. 

I have along telescoping painters pole to which fits either squeegee for knocking off slime, a plastic scrubby pad for when the slime is thick, or a large putty knife blade to attack barnacles. The pole near the head has a large float, whose buoyancy holds the 'tool' end to the hull. All work is done from a dink which also transports the needed beer consumed during the job. 
All I do is 'jiggle' the pole and its working part along the hull in a pattern. The bottom paint is (trowel) applied as smooth as a babies arse, so any attachment is easily removed because of the lack of 'roughness' to the paint - usually only a wiping needed with the squeegee . 1 hour is typical for a 37ft hull. 
You cant drink good beer while diving.


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## Bradhamlet (Nov 8, 2002)

I also use a deck unit/hooka set up. In the longer days of the summer in about 4-5 weeks it needs to be cleaned, winter months it's more like 6-8 weeks. But to tell you the truth, no bottom paint has impressed me. I have seen many paint tests done but in my limited experance there is always slime down there. Also how could you scrub the keel with a snorkle? My draft is over 6 feet, just can't hold my breath that long. The whole prosess takes 2 hours from set up to put back, shower too. 
Brad 
Lancer 36

side note: there are all kinds of critters down there, it's kinda fun to look at them.


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## Fstbttms (Feb 25, 2003)

Bradhamlet said:


> But to tell you the truth, no bottom paint has impressed me. I have seen many paint tests done but in my limited experance there is always slime down there.


I don't understand where people get the idea that anti fouling paint should eliminate fouling completely. In regions of moderate to high fouling, that is an unrealistic expectation and has been since tin-based paints went by the wayside.


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

Just one more reason that New England is the best sailing grounds in the world........  

I've never seen anything but slime on our bottom paint, ever. Pettit Vivid, if anyone is interested. Unprotected prop and shaft get some hard growth, but that's it.


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

FarCry said:


> Years of experimentation with various bottom paints, nearly continual use of boats and annual haulouts with a little scrubbing around the waterline as needed. Those are the basic keys used by one of the charter companies that I'm familiar with.


I had a feeling those guys didn't need to dive and scrub hard growth off the hull every few weeks down there.


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## Fstbttms (Feb 25, 2003)

Minnewaska said:


> Just one more reason that New England is the best sailing grounds in the world........


Yeah, you guys must be just about done sailing on the best sailing grounds in the world, until next spring, huh? :wink


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

Fstbttms said:


> Yeah, you guys must be just about done sailing on the best sailing grounds in the world, until next spring, huh?


Out Nov 1, back in Apr 1.

I was just saying to my wife yesterday, while I would love a longer season, I'm actually glad it isn't year round. For our 7 months in the water, we are fully committed the entire time, then take a break. Every one needs a break from time to time and there is no doubt my wife and I would be out of synch if available year round. I would like 9 months in the water.


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## travlin-easy (Dec 24, 2010)

Fstbttms said:


> Yes, including your anti fouling paint.


Actually, just a very thin film, which provides you with improved protection because you have also removed the slime, crud and sludge that provides the media for the larvae to thrive upon.

All the best,

Gary :2 boat:


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## jfdubu (Jul 18, 2002)

Minnewaska said:


> Out Nov 1, back in Apr 1.
> 
> I was just saying to my wife yesterday, while I would love a longer season, I'm actually glad it isn't year round. For our 7 months in the water, we are fully committed the entire time, then take a break. Every one needs a break from time to time and there is no doubt my wife and I would be out of synch if available year round. I would like 9 months in the water.


Fast, I have to agree with Minne here except I go in May 1. (close to it). Nothing better than sailing around Narragansett bay on a brisk October Sunday. Nice cool air steady breeze and the colors. and your beer doesn't get warm.

BTW, I use a mask, fins, snorkel and white scotchbrite.

John


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## jfdubu (Jul 18, 2002)

Minnewaska said:


> Out Nov 1, back in Apr 1.
> 
> I was just saying to my wife yesterday, while I would love a longer season, I'm actually glad it isn't year round. For our 7 months in the water, we are fully committed the entire time, then take a break. Every one needs a break from time to time and there is no doubt my wife and I would be out of synch if available year round. I would like 9 months in the water.


Fast, I have to agree with Minne here except I go in May 1. (close to it). Nothing better than sailing around Narragansett bay on a brisk October Sunday. Nice cool air, steady breeze and the colors, and your beer doesn't get warm.

BTW, I use a mask, fins, snorkel and white scotchbrite.

John


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## Fstbttms (Feb 25, 2003)

travlineasy said:


> Actually, just a very thin film, which provides you with improved protection because you have also removed the slime, crud and sludge that provides the media for the larvae to thrive upon.


Oh brother.

Cleaning your bottom with a drywall sanding screen can be considered a Worst Management Practice. But hey, it's your boat and your dime.


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## dhays (Jul 9, 2010)

I am very happy to NOT clean my own bottom. I pay a dive service to do 4 times a year. Much like Fstbttm, we have cold water with poor visibility. Out in the main parts of Puget Sound, the water temps range from a low of 48 to a high of about 51 degrees. In my harbor the surface temps might range from 32 to 60, but 1 foot down and it is still right around that 50 degrees. The divers clean the bottom, the intakes, the speedo impeller, and check the zincs. When they need changing, they get changed. If the condition of the bottom paint is starting to look bad, they tell me. This is money very well spent for me.

Now, I keep my boat in a slip in water that is cold. I don't know the issues for you warm water sailors. Even so, if someone leaves a dink in the water for several weeks with no anti-fouling paint, it is covered with grass and barnacles.

What I pay a diver is money very spent.


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## Fstbttms (Feb 25, 2003)

dhays said:


> Much like Fstbttm, we have cold water with poor visibility.


Water temp in the Estuary is 70° now and has been for a couple of months. Visibilty is typically fairly good as well.



dhays said:


> What I pay a diver is money very (well) spent.


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## dhays (Jul 9, 2010)

Fstbttms said:


> Water temp in the Estuary is 70° now and has been for a couple of months. Visibilty is typically fairly good as well.


I had no idea. I figured it would be cold like the Bay.

I did get a chance to swim from the boat this summer. Record hot days, shallow bay, and a 15 foot tide change. I was able to stay in the water for almost 20 minutes!

Dave


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## Fstbttms (Feb 25, 2003)

dhays said:


> I had no idea. I figured it would be cold like the Bay.


The Bay isn't much cooler right now either. Mid-high 60s. Not sure where you're getting your info.


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## dhays (Jul 9, 2010)

Fstbttms said:


> The Bay isn't much cooler right now either. Mid-high 60s. Not sure where you're getting your info.


No info, just WAGs. I just always assumed SF Bay to be generally cold water. Must be the stories my Mom would tell me of sailing with the Berkely women back in the day.

Just out of curiosity, I did check the temperatures at the buoys up here. Unusually warm with the record breaking heat we had this summer. Mid channel temps about 53 degrees and as high as upper 50's in Commencement bay in Tacoma where the Nisqually River enters the Sound.

Dave


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## gamayun (Aug 20, 2009)

Fstbttms said:


> The Bay isn't much cooler right now either. Mid-high 60s. Not sure where you're getting your info.


Mid 60s...hmmm, maybe, but it's certainly not in the high 60s. It's always chilly with 6 inches of viz (at best!) in Clipper Cove.

Water temperatures posted here: NDBC - Station PXSC1, show low 60s to 65. The estuary is a much clearer and warmer place to dive 

When I was in San Diego a couple years ago, there was a presentation on the use of the different varieties of environmentally friendly paints. One guy said to take a piece of carpet (as has been suggested) and lightly brush away the slime layer every 4 weeks, which could help extend the paint job to 5 years -- maybe more! To heck with that, everyone said, after nearly passing out from the very thought of having someone dive their boat every few weeks. This might not have been a good sales pitch, but I would guess that if one were to do this, it would extend a bottom job for a long time. Once hard growth happens, too much time has passed between cleanings.


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## mbianka (Sep 19, 2014)

I use an electric hookah unit powered by my Honda 2000i generator. Though I am an open water certified diver andbthe water temperature in my local waters is in the 70's. Here is an example of what an unprotected prop might look like after a month sitting on the mooring:
THE BIANKA LOG BLOG: PROP TALK

Here's a look at what it looks like after covering the prop with a plastic bag: THE BIANKA LOG BLOG: WHAT WORKS: Plastic bag on the prop. It worked pretty good.

But, recently my boatyard put a coat of some type of prop protection when they painted the bottom. That seems to have worked very well. We'll see how it does after the second year.

FYI Here's a look at the bottom of a sailboat that sat at a dock for three years:
http://biankablog.blogspot.com/2013/03/barnacles-and-beneteaus.html 
Boatyard guys must have scrapped over a hundred pounds of mussels off of the bottom.


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## Fstbttms (Feb 25, 2003)

gamayun said:


> Mid 60s...hmmm, maybe, but it's certainly not in the high 60s. It's always chilly with 6 inches of viz (at best!) in Clipper Cove.


You're right, 'cause what do I know? I only make my living, diving in the Bay











gamayun said:


> When I was in San Diego a couple years ago, there was a presentation on the use of the different varieties of environmentally friendly paints. One guy said to take a piece of carpet (as has been suggested) and lightly brush away the slime layer every 4 weeks, which could help extend the paint job to 5 years -- maybe more! To heck with that, everyone said, after nearly passing out from the very thought of having someone dive their boat every few weeks.


I very much doubt that San Diego sailors groaned at the thought of cleaning their hulls monthly, considering the typical cleaning regimen there is every 3 weeks in the summer and every 4 weeks in the winter, for a total of 15 cleanings per year.



gamayun said:


> This might not have been a good sales pitch, but I would guess that if one were to do this, it would extend a bottom job for a long time.


Yeah, why would you want to extend the life of your anti fouling paint? But maybe spending $2800 every 2 years as opposed to every 5 years sounds like good economics to you.


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## RichF28 (Jun 17, 2015)

OP here, Thanks for all the replies so far. I dove on the boat today at the marina. My marina doesn't object. The bottom paint was done in April of this year, and was for the most part perfectly clean. There was a little slime near the waterline at the bow, and a little deep on the keel, other than that clean as a whistle. The prop and shaft however, did need a good scrape. The previous owner told me he replaced one of the two zincs on the shaft every six months. But both zincs looked new to me, no activity at all. Is it necessary to replace those zincs that often? Or can you wait until you see the beginning of deterioration?


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## Fstbttms (Feb 25, 2003)

Replace any anode when it is 50% depleted.


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## gptyk (Mar 20, 2013)

I have no qualms at all paying a diver to clean my hull. I'd rather sail than dive it. And it's amazingly inexpensive. Last time I watched it was all done with a white pad. 

I get cleaned monthly. We use the boat 2-5 times a week. Water currently over 70 at Dana Point. Likely time for paint this fall (been 4 years or so). No idea what paint is on it.


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## miatapaul (Dec 15, 2006)

RichF28 said:


> OP here, Thanks for all the replies so far. I dove on the boat today at the marina. My marina doesn't object. The bottom paint was done in April of this year, and was for the most part perfectly clean. There was a little slime near the waterline at the bow, and a little deep on the keel, other than that clean as a whistle. The prop and shaft however, did need a good scrape. The previous owner told me he replaced one of the two zincs on the shaft every six months. But both zincs looked new to me, no activity at all. Is it necessary to replace those zincs that often? Or can you wait until you see the beginning of deterioration?


Are you in the same marina as the previous owner? Do you keep your boat plugged in all the time? Different marinas will have different levels of electrical leakage so the old marina may have been a bit dirty electrically. Even different sections can be different, as some may have newer or better wiring. It is generally a good idea to unplug your boat if you don't have refrigeration when not there, but many leave there boats plugged in all the time.

Also a Zinc lasting longer than it should could indicate that it is not installed properly. It needs to be tight and have a good contact to the metal it is protecting. I have seen zincs you could twist with your hands easily, not doing much.


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## RichF28 (Jun 17, 2015)

Yes, same slip even. I thought everyone kept their boat plugged in all the time, charging batteries, bilge pumps, etc. Previous owner was extremely, obsessed almost with maintenance. A fact that I will appreciate for years. :laugh I intend to keep things up, without going overboard. No pun intended.......



miatapaul said:


> Are you in the same marina as the previous owner? Do you keep your boat plugged in all the time? Different marinas will have different levels of electrical leakage so the old marina may have been a bit dirty electrically. Even different sections can be different, as some may have newer or better wiring. It is generally a good idea to unplug your boat if you don't have refrigeration when not there, but many leave there boats plugged in all the time.
> QUOTE]


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

Yes, almost everyone I know, with a boat that has more than a start battery, will leave her plugged in all the time. Galvanic isolators are a good idea. Unlike the one I bought years ago and is still sitting in a box in the locker and on my to do list.

Your sudden lack of activity on your zincs caught my attention too. Are you sure they still look new? Being the first time you saw them underwater, may have distorted your perception. Although, I'm sure if they were highly corroded and pock marked, that would have been obvious. If they are truly brand new looking after being in the water for six months (the previous change interval), you will want to troubleshoot that. You want to see your zincs corroding, otherwise, it may be something else doing so.


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## miatapaul (Dec 15, 2006)

RichF28 said:


> Yes, same slip even. I thought everyone kept their boat plugged in all the time, charging batteries, bilge pumps, etc. Previous owner was extremely, obsessed almost with maintenance. A fact that I will appreciate for years. :laugh I intend to keep things up, without going overboard. No pun intended.......
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## catnipper (Sep 16, 2015)

The advantage of a cat, lol sail to a beech let her settle on a couple of 2x8s tide goes out , walk around and clean her, tide comes in sail her away. catnipper


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## FarCry (Apr 21, 2007)

Minnewaska said:


> I had a feeling those guys didn't need to dive and scrub hard growth off the hull every few weeks down there.


No time for that. The waterlines get attention when one of the dock staff has all the important stuff done. I don't know exactly how often it is per boat. I know it isn't every few weeks, that is for sure. It's more of a, "and when you are done with that, jump in and clean up the water line on those boats and make sure the zincs look good."


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## capttb (Dec 13, 2003)

My boat was last painted February 10, 2011 so next Feb. will be 5 years, 69% copper Petit Trinidad, diver cleans once a month year round using towels or carpet. I'm 60 miles north of San Diego, water is so warm we got hammerhead sharks in the harbor. People on other boats have remarked on my bottom looking "polished" when the paint is showing. I will need to paint again this winter, I don't think I can get the high copper paint anymore.


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

capttb said:


> My boat was last painted February 10, 2011 so next Feb. will be 5 years, 69% copper Petit Trinidad, diver cleans once a month year round using towels or carpet. I'm 60 miles north of San Diego, water is so warm we got hammerhead sharks in the harbor. People on other boats have remarked on my bottom looking "polished" when the paint is showing. I will need to paint again this winter, I don't think I can get the high copper paint anymore.


California has laws against it, IIRC, but I believe you can get copper to add to bottom paint.


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## Fstbttms (Feb 25, 2003)

Minnewaska said:


> California has laws against it...


Umm... no it doesn't.


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## rbh1515 (Jul 7, 2000)

Anyone ever use Clean Shave. Home - Clean ShaveClean Shave
Rob


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

Fstbttms said:


> Umm... no it doesn't.


Proposed? Maybe memory isn't what it used to be.

If copper is all you can eat in CA, then add the heck out of it!!


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## Fstbttms (Feb 25, 2003)

Minnewaska said:


> Proposed? Maybe memory isn't what it used to be.


Several years ago there was copper-ban bill that never made it out of the state legislature. There is currently no legislation in place or pending that regulates copper in anti fouling paints in California.


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## AdamLein (Nov 6, 2007)

rbh1515 said:


> Anyone ever use Clean Shave. Home - Clean ShaveClean Shave
> Rob


I've seen plenty of boats with a DIY version of this thing. Personally, I'm looking forward to diving on my own boat


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## Fstbttms (Feb 25, 2003)

AdamLein said:


> I've seen plenty of boats with a DIY version of this thing.


Hey, it's a $300 squeegee! Something no sailor should be without!


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

Fstbttms said:


> Several years ago there was copper-ban bill that never made it out of the state legislature. There is currently no legislation in place or pending that regulates copper in anti fouling paints in California.


Great. Atomized copper powder is pretty easy to get. Do you think it would help to add more?


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## Fstbttms (Feb 25, 2003)

Minnewaska said:


> Great. Atomized copper powder is pretty easy to get. Do you think it would help to add more?


No, I don't think you can just add ingredients to anti fouling paint and expect improved results. If that were the case, people would just by the cheapest crap they could find and soup it up. But they don't.


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

Fstbttms said:


> No, I don't think you can just add ingredients to anti fouling paint and expect improved results. If that were the case, people would just by the cheapest crap they could find and soup it up. But they don't.


Looking in to it a little further, I think it's actually cost prohibitive. To increase a gallon of bottom paint copper content by just 10%, I think it would cost over $100 in copper powder.

Bottom paints already come in high and low copper formulas, and their prices reflect it, but the manufacturers can buy the copper much more cost effectively. One should just buy the more expensive or more effective paint.


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## miatapaul (Dec 15, 2006)

Minnewaska said:


> Looking in to it a little further, I think it's actually cost prohibitive. To increase a gallon of bottom paint copper content by just 10%, I think it would cost over $100 in copper powder.
> 
> Bottom paints already come in high and low copper formulas, and their prices reflect it, but the manufacturers can buy the copper much more cost effectively. One should just buy the more expensive or more effective paint.


Yea they are not so expensive just because they are for boats, copper is expensive! I have heard of folks adding cyan pepper though. Not sure if it does anything, but might make you sneeze when you scrape it off!


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

Cayenne sounds like nonsense to me. I know some have tried it.


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## Fstbttms (Feb 25, 2003)

Minnewaska said:


> Cayenne sounds like nonsense to me.


It's a wive's tale.


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## outbound (Dec 3, 2012)

On Wednesday before leaving to Block went to SDR seminar. Gentleman from Sea Hawk gave one session.
From what I understand with adding things is it may just screw up things.For instance, adding copper is great but the copper needs to be on the surface of the paint to act as an anti fouling agent. With ablatives or self polishing paints or hard paints different chemistries and prep of copper are used. Unless you have extensive paint chemistry knowledge and know how your entertained additive will work and have an additive that will work in that specific paint you may just be wasting money or even decreasing the effectiveness of your paint.


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## svsolaris (Sep 22, 2015)

Hi,

I just cleaned the bottom of my boat with snorkel gear only. It's a 22 so obviously a lot easier than bigger boats. It was moored in a bay all summer until I purchased it. If I waited another year or two I would have had a mussel feast! Had quite a few growing off the keel. I just used a soft rubber scraper for the small barnacles built up near the rudder and a car wash brush to remove slime and the rest. It looks way better than it did and didn't take much time. I took the boat out to a nice clear area, anchored, suited up and jumped in. Didn't take long.


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## AdamLein (Nov 6, 2007)

Just cleaned Laelia's hull for the first time, freediving only. What a blast! I haven't been in a wetsuit in ten years or so, the smell of salt+neoprene+shampoo brought back lots of good memories from BC. With six pounds of ballast I was still a bit buoyant, but I did it in our slip and was able do most of the shallow work by going supine with my feet on the side of the dock. Scrape scrape scrape with a bamboo spatula, then push off to get the deeper bits, the surface and repeat. To hang out near the keel I could just hold on (again upside-down, so I'm essentially pulling myself down). In other areas I found I could sort of go on all foursThe hull was mostly free of hard growth with the exception of the bottom of the keel, the paddlewheel, and the raw water intake (eek). There was a thin layer of slime and lots of .... I dunno, something that looked like shrubbery but was very loose and easy to remove (even swishing with water would take it off). The process took about an hour with plenty of surface time to exchange bad air for good. Can't wait to go again... probably a month from now.

However the prop and shaft were pretty heavily fouled -- I'll have to bring a steel scraper next time -- and the zinc is noticeably eroded. I'd like to replace it on my next dive but I'm concerned about getting a good electrical connection with the shaft. Can I wire brush the shaft where I plan to install the zinc? I'd also appreciate any hints or tricks on zinc replacement when freediving.


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## aloof (Dec 21, 2014)

Some zincs have captive screws, some don't. Captive screws make the job a bit easier.

If the zinc is noticeable eroded after a month or two then you have good electrical contact. I expect mine to be half gone, replaceable, in 6 months time. Yes, you can wire brush the prop and shaft. I use fine waterproof sandpaper.

Dive often and the job is much easier. Twice as often might take a quarter the time.


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## Fstbttms (Feb 25, 2003)

AdamLein said:


> Can I wire brush the shaft where I plan to install the zinc?


Yes but 80 grit sandpaper is better.



AdamLein said:


> I'd also appreciate any hints or tricks on zinc replacement when freediving.


Use an air supply. :wink


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## mainsailman (May 17, 2009)

What pad are you using on that trowel? I started using 'astro turf' remnants and they work pretty good. Is that floor buffer pad? or?


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## Fstbttms (Feb 25, 2003)

mainsailman said:


> What pad are you using on that trowel? I started using 'astro turf' remnants and they work pretty good. Is that floor buffer pad? or?


It's a 3M Doodlebug pad mounted on a custom holder:


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## Waltthesalt (Sep 22, 2009)

stray currents are an issue for fresh water not so much for salt. I can get most of my bottom with a pressure washer, extension, and a gutter tool at the end


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