# New Beneteau 49?



## danielgoldberg (Feb 9, 2008)

Anyone know anything about this boat (that's constructive), either good or bad?

It's gotten very good reviews, but I have a hard time putting a lot of faith in those, as I've yet to read a review that pans a boat.

Thanks,


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## Faster (Sep 13, 2005)

We spent some time on one at a boat show recently...

Liked:
Low profile house, great sight lines from the cockpit.
Nice looking boat despite somewhat high freeboard
Living space below (but see dislikes later)
Cockpit, large comfortable, easy stern access
Rig seemed good sized, hopefully available without furling main.

Disliked:
Lack of accessible, below decks storage (function of large volume living space)
Potential for long falls across all that space at a 30 degree heel (minimal handholds; open layout)
Coachouse is low but wide, side decks were half the width of our 34 footer.
"Ikea" condo styling, squared off doorways, very non-nautical to my mind.

Probably a great liveaboard and priced similar to a Vancouver condo with approx same square footage of living space! (which says more about the condo market here than the boat itself....)

These are, of course, quick impressions at the dock so may be worthless, but there you are.


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## johnshasteen (Aug 9, 2002)

What are you planning to do with the boat? Yacht Club condo and occassional day sailing, coastal cruising or circumnavigation? If you are going to do much serious blue water sailing, I would stay away from any fin keel, spade rudder boats. The last time I had Paloma out of the water up in Seabrook, off of Galveston Bay(the Houston area, over 10.000 boats are moored in the general area), most of the boats that were on the hard for repairs were fin keel/spade rudder boats with damaged rudder posts, a few with keels jacked slightly askew from groundings - a manority of them were Beneteau's - a very popular and well-represented boat in the Galveston Bay area. Also look at the fate of Cynthia Woods (not a Beneteau) on another thread.


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## danielgoldberg (Feb 9, 2008)

Mostly coastal cruising in the northeast, with jumps to Bermuda periodically (probably every other year).

I understand the parameters of production boats, and my question pertains more to whether anyone has knowledge or experience with this particular boat, as opposed to whether a production boat is suitable to what we plan to do with her. We're considering it mostly because my wife really wants a "new" boat, which limits the universe from an economic perspective. We haven't made any decisions yet, either in terms of whether we actually change boats at all, get a new boat, a used boat, a catamaran, etc. We're in the investigation phase, and are considering a production boat from one of the "Big 3" because we could afford a new one. I don't like the Hunters, the Catalinas seem kind of bland to me, and I actually like the aesthetic of the Beneteaus (and my sense is that the fit and finish on them is a little better than the other two).

So, there you have it. All comments and thoughts welcome and appreciated.


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## donradclife (May 19, 2007)

If you like it, buy it. Remember that a Beneteau just won the Bermuda race overall by several hours. I wouldn't take a Beneteau around Cape Horn, but its plenty strong enough to go to Bermuda.


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## camaraderie (May 22, 2002)

Daniel...how did the rally go? Read Wind Runner's log but they didn't have much to say beyond their own voyage which seemed to go pretty well.
Sorry I don't have any specifc input on the Bene47 but I don't see any reason not to get it given your plans and budget.


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## Vitesse473 (Mar 16, 2008)

I can only speak to my 2002 473, which is very similar to the 49. As has been noted, this is not a boat to take around Cape Horn. Since you've noted that isn't in the plans, this boat should definitely be on your short list. My 473 was designed by Groupe Finot, who are world renowned for building 'round the world' go fast racing yachts. You should do a little research on Berret/Racoupeau to get a feel for their success and reputation.

I've been very happy with how strong and fast they are. For example; 20 knots of wind with full main and 110% and she sails along extremely well balanced. So much so that you can literally let go of the helm. In good size seas, even as a medium displacement boat, her LOA makes for a solid and comfortable ride. Banging off waves doesn't make her vibrate like some boats I've sailed on. It has that solid feel that builds confidence in what's under the hood (so to speak).

A couple of things I'd personally steer clear of. The shoal draft keel and furling main will greatly hamper performance. I also think the shorter keel is a safety factor, as that will have an affect on the boats righting moment. The furling main has become very popular, but since I'm a racer gone (performance) cruiser, I prefer the full main for the extra sail area, and infinitely more tuning options. I also don't like the thought of the extra gear inside the mast, which adds weight aloft. All lead to performance degradation.

As for comfort, my wife and 3 (small) kids use the boat for long summer weekends, so she becomes a condo. So far we've been very comfortable with no complaints. The cockpit is fantastic with the split helms and tons of room to sail with 7 or 8 on board. The 49 has an even better cockpit layout.

I would prefer to have more access to the engine compartment. Also would prefer a larger lazarette, but opting for the 3 cabin layout blew that up. I've since added radar and cockpit mounted display, which wasn't cheap. If you buy the boat new, save yourself the time, money and hassle and have it delivered with the boat.

Good luck and good sailing. Feel free to PM me with any specific questions.


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## skyellab (Aug 7, 2006)

I have a 46 foot Beneteau (2007) which is exactly the same boat as the 49. It is comfortable, stable, fuel efficient, fast, turns quickly and with a bow thruster a almost single handed boat. I am very happy with every aspect of it and very glad that I bought it. Sails GREAT!!!!!!

It lives in the Seattle area and sails in the waters of the sound and straits of Georgia. Does very well in many conditions.

I got a three bedroom set up as that is what works for us. Even if you don't need it that is definitely the way to go if given a choice. The two bedroom model has sat at the Beneteau dealer's dock for two years.

With 8 people all sitting in the back while under sail there is still room to get around and handle lines. That is nice not to trip over people.

Very comfortable, nice, and responsive!


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## danielgoldberg (Feb 9, 2008)

*Bene*



Vitesse473 said:


> A couple of things I'd personally steer clear of. The shoal draft keel and furling main will greatly hamper performance. I also think the shorter keel is a safety factor, as that will have an affect on the boats righting moment. The furling main has become very popular, but since I'm a racer gone (performance) cruiser, I prefer the full main for the extra sail area, and infinitely more tuning options. I also don't like the thought of the extra gear inside the mast, which adds weight aloft. All lead to performance degradation.


There's a Left Coast sailor for ya! I can't go with the deep draft on the east coast. Just not practical, and particularly not with the Bahamas in mind. The standard boat has a 5'9" fin, and we're just going to have to deal with that, if we choose this boat.

I am struggling much more with the mast furling issue. My gut reaction is to go with a traditional battened main, but my wife thinks I'm nuts. We don't race, or at least not seriously, so the performance degradation is not all that much of a concern to me (and this boat already is likely to be much faster than anything else we've owned). Likewise, most of the time I'm single handing with three other people on the boat (as my wife tends to our tots). The bigger issue is what to do if the sail jams halfway out? Can't furl it, can't drop it. That's my bigger concern. I've been doing research and asking questions, including of the folks at CW who reviewed the boat and gave it their BOTY award. The sense I'm getting is that furling mains have come a long way and it's not unlike furling jibs - initially, no one wanted them because they were viewed as unreliable, but now they are much better and no one really sails without them (Pardey-types aside). I'm being told by just about everyone who's using them that they work just fine, even in heavy air. Frankly, in Bermuda, there were many many boats with furling mains (not the racers of course, but perhaps even a majority of the cruisers who were there). Our current boat has a furling boom, and I actually love it, but of course, I still get to have a fully battened main with roach, and if in trouble I still can just blow the halyard and drop the sail to the deck.

Surprisingly, to me anyway, a traditional main now is more expensive than the in-mast furling unit. Still more research to do, but it's looking like if we buy just about any new boat, we'll need to address this issue, as they all come with furling mains and they charge you extra to go the other way.


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## Faster (Sep 13, 2005)

danielgoldberg said:


> ....I am struggling much more with the mast furling issue. My gut reaction is to go with a traditional battened main, .... Frankly, in Bermuda, there were many many boats with furling mains (not the racers of course, but perhaps even a majority of the cruisers who were there).......Surprisingly, to me anyway, a traditional main now is more expensive than the in-mast furling unit. Still more research to do, but it's looking like if we buy just about any new boat, we'll need to address this issue, as they all come with furling mains and they charge you extra to go the other way.


This last is surprising to me as well... a few years back a furling main was at least a $10K extra cost item.

I think you're probably right about the reliability of furling mains having come a long way, but you're right about all the other issues too.

If you're going to be Caribbean island hopping, or otherwise mostly tradewind reaching, the performance disadvantages associated with furling mains will likely be minimal. But (another left coast sailor here) if you spend a fair bit of time trying to get to weather (we seem totally out of sync with the weather patterns this year - the kite's only been out once) I'd be much more concerned about having a regular, battened roachy main.

I'm a bit bothered by the fact than many manufacturers are essentially taking that decision away from buyers by providing in-mast mains as the standard package. - esp if they start charging a premium for the once-standard hoisting main.


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## skyellab (Aug 7, 2006)

I can only comment being a actual user and owner of the boat style you are looking at.

I have the bigger keel but see no reason why the smaller keel would effect the performance. It is still ballisted the same, just shorter. The boat is sleek in the water with suprisingly to me very little resistance. It does cruise at a strong fast clip. The sail area is fine for the boat with the furling main. It is a pleasure to put the sails out and bring them in. I would not have any other type of set up now that I used it. Furling jib and main. Reefing is a pleasure and the boat takes a lot before it wants to walk. I have sailed comfortably with just the main in 12 knot winds and covered lots of ground. 

I find no reason to question the set up. It just works much better than I would have expected. It is a big boat that travels WELL!!

I just have one word to describe this new Beneteau design. GREAT!!!!!!!

But then I own one and would not own anything else now that I have my Beneteau.


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## camaraderie (May 22, 2002)

Dan... I'd feel more comfortable with a boom furler than in-mast but you can figure that out. The shoal draft thing at 5'9" will be fine for the Bahamas. How deep is the rudder compared to the keel. This has been a problem with some past Bene's as you certainly want to be grounding on your keel and not hobby-horsing on your rudder. 
Have you looked at the Jeanneau 50ds or does a DS not appeal? I like the aft stateroom better for extended living and without the 45 degree offset.


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## Cruisingdad (Jul 21, 2006)

danielgoldberg said:


> There's a Left Coast sailor for ya! I can't go with the deep draft on the east coast. Just not practical, and particularly not with the Bahamas in mind. The standard boat has a 5'9" fin, and we're just going to have to deal with that, if we choose this boat.
> 
> I am struggling much more with the mast furling issue. My gut reaction is to go with a traditional battened main, but my wife thinks I'm nuts. We don't race, or at least not seriously, so the performance degradation is not all that much of a concern to me (and this boat already is likely to be much faster than anything else we've owned). Likewise, most of the time I'm single handing with three other people on the boat (as my wife tends to our tots). The bigger issue is what to do if the sail jams halfway out? Can't furl it, can't drop it. That's my bigger concern. I've been doing research and asking questions, including of the folks at CW who reviewed the boat and gave it their BOTY award. The sense I'm getting is that furling mains have come a long way and it's not unlike furling jibs - initially, no one wanted them because they were viewed as unreliable, but now they are much better and no one really sails without them (Pardey-types aside). I'm being told by just about everyone who's using them that they work just fine, even in heavy air. Frankly, in Bermuda, there were many many boats with furling mains (not the racers of course, but perhaps even a majority of the cruisers who were there). Our current boat has a furling boom, and I actually love it, but of course, I still get to have a fully battened main with roach, and if in trouble I still can just blow the halyard and drop the sail to the deck.
> 
> Surprisingly, to me anyway, a traditional main now is more expensive than the in-mast furling unit. Still more research to do, but it's looking like if we buy just about any new boat, we'll need to address this issue, as they all come with furling mains and they charge you extra to go the other way.


You and I are in the same boat - figuratively that is.

I cannot comment on the original question of the Bene - but I can give some thoughts on the inmast versus traditional on a production boat.

My wife is generally with the kids down below too. That means singlhanding most of the time. I think you are in a very similar position.

On our other boat, (a Catalina 380) we had a traditional main. We enjoy getting out and sailing, but I ran the jib significantly more than the main because it was a bear to raise it and depending on the sea state, generally took two people. However, I really like the performance of the main. On the other hand, I ALWAYS had to go to the mast to drop in a reef. That verged on dangerous depending on the conditions.

My wife REALLY wanted the inmast but I was not convinced - but that is what we have on the 400. You really will lose some power with the in mast. For those used to batteneted mains, it will really be noticed. HOWEVER - I can pull out the main in 20+ effortlessly. I have an electric winch that basically NEVER gets used. When sailing, I am more likely to pull out the main over the jib since it requires less attention when tacking. When I see a storm rolling in, I (by myself) can pull in the main (with no electric winch and 99% of the time with no winch at all).

If you are the type of sailor that does a lot of long distance, I can definitely see where a inmast would be a big negative. Why? Because you often raise it once, set your sails, then off you go for a relatively long time. If you are the type of sailor that will go out for sails by yourself, lots of weekending and singlehanding, I think an inmast will really appeal to you.

I have heard many people say that offshore captains don't like them because they could jam, etc.... but mine has never jammed. HOWEVER - there are tricks to pulling it in that are a bit different from a battened main. Screw it up - and you might jam it. I wonder how many of those captains were REALLY familiar with inmast? My guess is that they treated inmast like a standard main and it is a bit different in how you reef it.

Bottom line - I bet if you get an inmast you will use the main much more becuase "raising it/lowering it" it close to effortless. I went out on mom and pops Tayana 42 and helped them raise the main again. After my arms fell off and being fed a lot of oxygen, it reminded me how much I enjoy the inmast. But it does have its compromises.

- CD


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## sailortjk1 (Dec 20, 2005)

We just could not get past the aesthetics of the new line of Benies.
We have been on board at couple of different shows and we did not find them to be particularly appealing. I know, beauty is in the mind of the beholder. Some find them to be good looking boats, but they are not for my taste.

The curvy "Cats Eye" ports I just cant get past and the interior is to modern and cold for me. Just an opinion on the looks of the boats nothing more.


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

TJK really wants an Amel SuperMaramu.


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## danielgoldberg (Feb 9, 2008)

skyellab said:


> I can only comment being a actual user and owner of the boat style you are looking at.


Thanks so much for your thoughts. Always good to hear from folks who own the boat. Here's a question for you: does the boat pound in a head sea? We had a Bayfield 36 that we loved, but one problem was that she pounded mercilessly because the hull was so flat forward of the keel. The Bene 49 does not have as flat a hull section as the Bayfield, but it certainly isn't a deep forefoot. What's been your experience in this area? Thanks again.


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## danielgoldberg (Feb 9, 2008)

camaraderie said:


> How deep is the rudder compared to the keel. This has been a problem with some past Bene's as you certainly want to be grounding on your keel and not hobby-horsing on your rudder.
> Have you looked at the Jeanneau 50ds or does a DS not appeal? I like the aft stateroom better for extended living and without the 45 degree offset.


1. Rudder is a fair bit shorter than the keel. I think Beneteau learned their lesson on this one.

2. I would look at the DS's, but the Admiral doesn't like the aesthetic at all. Plus, she's a bit vertically challenged, and I think she would have no chance at all to see what's going on at the bow when she's at the helm, and I could just see her running me down if I fall off the bow while anchoring . . .

As I'm sure every poster on this board knows, these things tend to take on a life of their own. I have a dealer preparing a quote for me now, including one for taking our Freedom in on a trade. We'll see what happens, but I suspect that if the deal is right, and if we like her after a sea trial, we may just do this (yikes!).


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## skyellab (Aug 7, 2006)

It is not a flat bottomed boat.
I never really thought about it but from thinking back it just knifes through any big waves I have been in. No pounding. I don't think you would want to take on waves from the side.


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## Vitesse473 (Mar 16, 2008)

Dan - I understand the reservations on the shoal draft. I know the Bene's sold in Texas are all shoal draft. I didn't realize you had that same issue in the Atlantic and Bahamas. As was mentioned, given the relatively deep rudders, I would ask the builder about the hobby horsing probability.

I wouldn't budge on the main. Instead, I'd take that as a negotiation tactic to the salesman. There's no way a standard mast/main should cost more than a furling main. They are just selling what the masses are ordering, and don't want to be bothered by having to shift into a different order and rigging process. Nonsense. Just tell the salesman you'll walk if you don't get it for atleast the same price. I'll bet big bucks he'll cave!

I had Quantum build me a stack pack, which allows you to literally blow off the halyard. The main (assuming in irons) will simply drop right into the bag. It's a great system. Don't worry about hoisting it. That's why you have electric winches  

Lastly, again I am not sure of all the differences between the 473 and 49, so i can only comment that mine does not bash. Skyellab would be a better judge of that, as his 46 is likely much more similar than my 473. In any case, here's a pic of my bottom before her last bottom job. (I had the ablative all taken off so I could start anew).


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## paulk (Jun 2, 2000)

Rather than focus on the results of the B36.7 that did well in their class in one of the calmest Newport-Bermuda Races I've been on, I would suggest carefully following up on what happened to the rudder of the Beneteau 40-something from Annapolis that didn't make it to Newport for the start. IMHO, scantlings on Beneteaux have never been their strong suit.


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

*How are the bilges?*



skyellab said:


> It is not a flat bottomed boat.
> I never really thought about it but from thinking back it just knifes through any big waves I have been in. No pounding. I don't think you would want to take on waves from the side.


I have a Farr designed Beneteau Oceanis 461, which has deep bilges under the salon and cabin floorboards except where those spaces are used for water tanks. I have a compartment just aft of the keel in the centerline in which I can place two scuba tanks, a perfect placement. There are other places between stringers where I could put basketballs and then put the floorboards down flush again.

The Finot designed Beneteau 411, which was contemporary to my 461, has only a few inches of space under the floorboards between the grid stringers. Just incredibly different.

I've chartered Berret-Racapeau designed Beneteau Cyclades 50.4s (relabelled as Moorings 51.5), and they have caverns under the floorboards. Multiple cases of wine were fit below floorboards even in the forward cabins on a Cyclades 50.4, and under at least one salon floorboard, there was enough space for a small crewmember to hide as a practical joke.

skyellab, how are the spaces under the floorboards in the 46/49 (not sure which one you have)? Are there any long and deep enough for a scuba tank? Any deep enough for a case of wine? Any spacious enough for a few cases of beer? (just trying to use common objects for a size reference).


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## skyellab (Aug 7, 2006)

In the very back of the boat is an area for a life raft and it has doors. Some racks could be mounted there without too much problem to hold your tanks. I have the new 46 but it is not too different from the 49. There is also a few lockers in the cockpit area under the seats that tanks could be stored no problem. The floor boards down below are inches high.


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