# pacific seacraft



## puntadeleste (Jan 29, 2011)

Does anybody know of a charter company that has Pacific Seacraft sailboats in their fleet ?


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## dadio917 (Apr 4, 2011)

boy I'd be surprised. all charter fleets I've seen are mass production boats. If you just want to try one find their users forum and see if someone is close by. Pretty boats!


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## elliowb (Jun 8, 2015)

puntadeleste said:


> Does anybody know of a charter company that has Pacific Seacraft sailboats in their fleet ?


I don't know of any, however, depends on your needs, but if you just want to go for a sail and get a feel for the boat, I have one on the Great Lakes. Not for charter but always happy to help out a fellow sailor.


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## jephotog (Feb 25, 2002)

A Pacific Seacraft seems impractical for a charter boat. I love PSC but if I was to charter I would want more space per dollar. PSC are great world cruising boats but not your typical charter boat.


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## puntadeleste (Jan 29, 2011)

Thanks for your quick responses
I had until recently a Cape Dory 25 D. I would like to buy in the very near future a PSC. My goal was to "rent" one to try them out. 
I may take you up in your offer to sail with you on your PSC
Thanks


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## dadio917 (Apr 4, 2011)

out of curiosity….what do you plan to do with it? PSC37 was as on my list and then we found our Valiant 39. All Valiants are great boats but I especially like the Texas built era. Great build quality, layouts and hardly any wood topside. And like PSCs are sailing all over the world.


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## malloc (Jul 24, 2010)

I too was looking around last year. I even contacted PSC directly. Nada. There used to be a few 34/37s in charter on the great lakes, but they were retired/sold off.


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## hawgdawg (Oct 19, 2009)

Hi Bill of Belle Voile, Fellow Buckeye sailor who would love to pick your brain on your PSC 34.

Jeff


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## Interlude (Jun 16, 2016)

dadio917 said:


> boy I'd be surprised. all charter fleets I've seen are mass production boats. If you just want to try one find their users forum and see if someone is close by. Pretty boats!


Agreed, the PSC group is fairly active and sure someone will be glad to help ya out (we own one as well). Not sure your location. Also agreed that most folks interested in chartering are gunna want "more" creature comforts and space that PSC provide. In addition a person interested in a charter/purchase program would have to spend well over $700k for a new PSC 40 lets say vs $250k for a new Beneteau 40. Heck, most charter sailboats don't even raise their sails when going from point A to B. Another reason power CATs are becoming the choice for chartering. PSC's are purpose built boats for their seaworthy and sea kindly motions along with the construction and equipment to get you there safely. They are pricey even used. They do hold their value and are sill made.


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## chef2sail (Nov 27, 2007)

Yes I think that’s definitely one of the reasons however there are nice charters of boats other than benetaus jeaneus, and Catamarans. , which I would consider chartering before a PSC. Tartans, Calipers, HR, for instance.

I like the PSC as a good small ocean worth cruiser if you want a narrow, footprint. The are average speed wise with quality workmanship. Great for sea kindliness and easily singlehanded.

It definitely has a niche of owners like you who are loyal to their brand, just like any other brand. It’s isn’t really any more spendy than many other well made brands of similar length. I have never used price as a criterion for which boat is necessarily better. Besides it’s what you are looking for in a boat. Charters are more about volume. 

Understand I am not disparaging them , my good friend has a 37.


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## outbound (Dec 3, 2012)

Owned a 34. Loved it. Sold it to go cruising.
As Bob Perry said when he was on this site waterline means speed.
I also love Valiants. Still any canoe stern or double ended means.
Less cockpit space.
Less room for generators, watermakers etc.
No sugar scoop so much less convenience getting out of a dinghy, loading supplies or just going for a dip.
I’ve read a lot about these sterns supposed advantages in a following sea. Have come to the conclusion it’s bogus. In fact there’s a multiplicity of factors that determine this behavior. My current boat (a transomed sugar scooped Outbound) is better behaved than my prior Tayana 37 or PSC34. Even when surfing.
For the mono hull cruiser I think there are multiple important concerns 
Live ability ( adequate tankage with no need for jugs on deck, huge storage for spares, tools and provisions)
Days work. How many miles made good in 24h. That means in all conditions and at all points of sale. It also means how fast you’re willing to go. My current boat and in fact most monos or multis are usually throttled back. Mainly for comfort but also to not stress the boat. So a boat that’s pleasant near its hull speed will make faster passages than a theoretically faster boat that becomes unpleasant sooner.
Ease of servicing. Because of the basic design it’s usually more difficult and involves more boat yoga to service any of the subtypes of double enders. Even fantails until they get quite large.
Displacement. How much weight you can carry determines what you can bring. If you didn’t bring it you don’t have it. There isn’t Waste Marine outside the states.
Have been thinking of flipping to the dark side so looking closely at principle dimensions. A Norhavn 475 has the same or more effective living space, carrying capacity and creature comforts as a Artnautica 58. The Norhavn is 10’ feet smaller LOA/LWL and quite a bit heavier. Both are strong RTW boats. Both can tolerate storms not just gales. Both represent the peak of current thinking but are vastly different approaches. Similarly Creelock designed a true classic. A truly great boat but below 40/44 it’s narrow, has less usable space, particularly slow under power, hard to board, a PIA if you need to Med moor, and offers no particular advantages compared with a well executed transom sternned vessel. 
But until you get to the 44 or possibly the 40 I think due to beam, overhangs, displacement there’s just not enough room in any of the PSCs for long term voyaging liveaboards to be in real comfort.
Would I buy another PSC. You betcha. But not for long distance cruising except for the 64’ or a recent 44.


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## wsmurdoch (Jan 23, 2007)

puntadeleste said:


> Does anybody know of a charter company that has Pacific Seacraft sailboats in their fleet ?


Like most things, ask Google. The answer...
Anacortes Yacht Charters


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## Interlude (Jun 16, 2016)

chef2sail said:


> Yes I think that's definitely one of the reasons however there are nice charters of boats other than benetaus jeaneus, and Catamarans. , which I would consider chartering before a PSC. Tartans, Calipers, HR, for instance.
> 
> I like the PSC as a good small ocean worth cruiser if you want a narrow, footprint. The are average speed wise with quality workmanship. Great for sea kindliness and easily singlehanded.
> 
> ...


I have personally never know a charter company to offer Tartans, sure some maybe do but don't know of any. HR's maybe but only heard of them in Europe which makes sense given they are based there. Sure there are others but the bulk of the charter fleets are especially configured Bene's, Jeanneau, Hunter, etc. for the charter market so that they can accommodate many incarnations of charter parties. Even a new Tartan 395 is about $450k which is $250k less than the new PSC 40. Let's face it, no one is gunna pay more in a charter for a narrower, less goodie filled boat designed to circumnavigate the world so they can island hop for a week in the Caribbean. I wouldn't. The poor owner who is out $700k for the PSC can never begin to recoup costs. Ain't gunna happen, not that you are guaranteed to with a less expensive boat either.

PSC has chosen to keep the designs unchanged, for as we know, the demands of the sea remain unchanged. They are purpose built and if you are not inclined to appreciate that purpose, they are, in spite of looks, quality, whatever, the wrong boat. The major design shifts have been in response to creature comfort, such as more spacious cockpits, wider transoms for larger lockers for the extra "stuff" and more spacious aft staterooms, plumb bows for more LWL enhancing marketability and comfort but not necessarily better sea handling or worthiness. The real emerging dominant force for charters is the catamaran, and in particular power cats. Let's face it, no matter how you weigh in on it, Cats have better livability, comfort at anchor, space to luxuriate in the sun, shallower draft, private quarters, yada yada. I guarantee if we charter in the islands it's gunna be a Cat. You're only island hopping anyway cuz ya gotta stay within the reach of the charter company. Remember we have a 31 foot Pacific Seacraft. We clearly didn't get it because of her accommodations or price per pound of displacement. We could have owned a much newer, much larger boat for the same price. I didn't say better. It just fits our needs. I single hand much or just two of us and 31 is just fine by me! We actually looked at 34's and 37's and liked the layout better on the 31. Did look at a 40 as well...but we are mortal human beings! Plus we weren't really fans of the canoe stern on the larger models as it already limits space aft on already relatively short on space boats! Gotta love they way they look though.

....so hope the OP can find his way onto one, they do sail themselves (as any proper design should). If we have Interlude trimmed well she will hold course without a hand on the wheel or auto pilot engaged, though we do like having Ray aboard, uh Ray Marine!

oh... a final note about speed, little bits add up and clearly if you are hoping to make time on a passage even a 1 knot difference in speed adds up. If this is a consideration then speedier boats may be better suited for you than PSC's. However sometimes speed comes with the price of discomfort and stress on a rig. We are in no hurry. Rather finish rested than first! Many other boats fit this description as well. Good luck.


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## Interlude (Jun 16, 2016)

wsmurdoch said:


> Like most things, ask Google. The answer...
> Anacortes Yacht Charters


Yup and good one to have, though may be a little prejudiced! Out of the 14 sailboats they offer 10 were Beneteau, Jenneau, or Cats.

I rest my case!


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## chef2sail (Nov 27, 2007)

Interlude said:


> I have personally never know a charter company to offer Tartans, sure some maybe do but don't know of any. HR's maybe but only heard of them in Europe which makes sense given they are based there. Sure there are others but the bulk of the charter fleets are especially configured Bene's, Jeanneau, Hunter, etc. for the charter market so that they can accommodate many incarnations of charter parties. Even a new Tartan 395 is about $450k which is $250k less than the new PSC 40. Let's face it, no one is gunna pay more in a charter for a narrower, less goodie filled boat designed to circumnavigate the world so they can island hop for a week in the Caribbean. I wouldn't. The poor owner who is out $700k for the PSC can never begin to recoup costs. Ain't gunna happen, not that you are guaranteed to with a less expensive boat either.
> 
> PSC has chosen to keep the designs unchanged, for as we know, the demands of the sea remain unchanged. They are purpose built and if you are not inclined to appreciate that purpose, they are, in spite of looks, quality, whatever, the wrong boat. The major design shifts have been in response to creature comfort, such as more spacious cockpits, wider transoms for larger lockers for the extra "stuff" and more spacious aft staterooms, plumb bows for more LWL enhancing marketability and comfort but not necessarily better sea handling or worthiness. The real emerging dominant force for charters is the catamaran, and in particular power cats. Let's face it, no matter how you weigh in on it, Cats have better livability, comfort at anchor, space to luxuriate in the sun, shallower draft, private quarters, yada yada. I guarantee if we charter in the islands it's gunna be a Cat. You're only island hopping anyway cuz ya gotta stay within the reach of the charter company. Remember we have a 31 foot Pacific Seacraft. We clearly didn't get it because of her accommodations or price per pound of displacement. We could have owned a much newer, much larger boat for the same price. I didn't say better. It just fits our needs. I single hand much or just two of us and 31 is just fine by me! We actually looked at 34's and 37's and liked the layout better on the 31. Did look at a 40 as well...but we are mortal human beings! Plus we weren't really fans of the canoe stern on the larger models as it already limits space aft on already relatively short on space boats! Gotta love they way they look though.
> 
> ...


You are Probably only looking at large charter companies here. Which is fine if you want to sail with the herd and don't want to venture to places away from the crowds. We prefer chartering in WORLD areas where we will see more than a myriad of moorings off a touristy Carribean Island . No put down here just a different style and more adventuresome. If you want to sample other boats you have to get away from the big charter companies. 
It's an easy internet search and you can drill down. You can find many different sailboats here from Bavaria's to HR to Tartans, Sabre's and Hanse. You just have to look past the big boys.

There are a couple of easily found examples of Tartans. We have chartered all over the country and the world. Not everything to charter is a production boat. We chartered HR in Denmark and on the Mediterranean. We have chartered a Shannon and Hanse in the San Juan's.

https://www.happycharter.com/en/boats/hallberg-rassy

Bareboat Charters - Charleston Sailing School

https://www.clickandboat.com/en/boat-rental/naples/sailboat/hallberg-rassy-36-b91pv

https://www.theglobesailor.com/yacht-charter-2408-201.html

https://www.getmyboat.com/trips/RNRerWyK/

https://www.hartge.com/charter.htm

https://www.yacht-charter.co.uk/charter/charter-fleet/

Sail Yachts-sail yachts for charter in the San Juan Islands and the Pacific Northwest

If I was going to do serious cruising PSC would be on my list albeit further down after Some true world travelers. It would make the short list though because of its build quality. Negatives....volume and speed.


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## LizaPhilips (Jun 3, 2020)

My father looking for it too!


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## outbound (Dec 3, 2012)

People talk about speed without realizing at least on passage there’s a huge difference between calculated hull speed and a days work(distance travelled in 24 h). In reality the average days work is the important number 
The difference relates to several factors including.
How much attention you need to spend to get that speed.
How much skill in sail trim you have to have
How well you or AP or windvane steer. 
How much the ride deteriorates as you go faster
Does the vessel preform well at all wind speeds and angles or just in a small segment.
What happens to the above in various sea states. 

Because of this you see people drive some boats at 90% of their capabilities and other boats at 50% of their theoretical capabilities. 

Some people can tolerate high frequency boat motions without motion sickness. Others can’t but can tolerate low frequency motion. So even what makes crew sea sick varies and is dependent on hull form and number of hulls. Some can’t tolerate the whistles and high pitched noise of rigging nor the buzz in the tiller of high speed boats and find it fatiguing. 
The long distance amateur ocean races and the ocean rallies are informative. Different than the professional races you always see a significant mismatch between theoretical hull speed and actual transit times for a lot of boats.
So when thinking about cruising boats it make be helpful to think more about how fast this boat will go with me on it than just the numbers.


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