# Steering Cable Replacement



## zoom555 (Jun 7, 2007)

My cable steering system needs a bit of work. Actually, it depends on who you ask. My surveyor wrote "The stainless steel cable run from the pedestal helm to the quadrant on the rudder post is starting to fail at the connection to the port side of the quadrant, with several strands broken. It is required that the cable be replaced as new at this time..." I asked my marina to look at the problem and they wrote "Steering ok ... There is only one section of cable that is frayed." Given the importance of the steering system, this doesn't give me a lot of confidence. 

So, since my marina doesn't think this is worth doing, I guess I'll do the job myself. The marina indicated that the existing cable is 1/4" galvanized. One of my books ("Spurr's Guide to Upgrading Your Cruising Sailboat") indicates that the cable is typically 7x19. So, onto my questions:

1. I assume that stainless cable would be preferable to galvanized? (I can order 1/4" 7x19 stainless aircraft cable for $2 (Canadian) a foot. The marina estimated that 20 feet was required.)

2. Spurr's indicates that I should attach the roller chain to the wire with a thimble and a Nicropress fitting (and then the wire to the quadrant using cable clamps to allow for later adjustment). As I don't expect to be doing this frequently and the professional tools from Nicropress are quite expensive, can anyone comment on the much cheaper Swage-It #3 tool (which relies on a wrench to tighten the connection, instead of a ratcheting mechanism)? 

3. Anyone have any other helpful tips about completing this job?


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## knothead (Apr 9, 2003)

I don't know if you have a West Marine in your area. If you do, they most always have a nico-press tool near the area where they sell the wire. They are happy to let you use it in the store and will usually help you if you need it. A better solution may be to seek out a local rigger to replace the cables for you. If there is no one in your area just pack them up and send them to a rigger and they will duplicate them and send them back.
You notice that I am using the plural. IMO you should replace both cables unless you have already replaced one. If there are signs of wear or broken strands on one and they are the same age then it would behoove you tackle the whole job at the same time.
While you are crawling around in the bilge you should probably lube any of the sheaves (rollers) the wire travels around and generally check out the whole system.
A good way of performing this task is to attach a messenger line to the old wire and pull it through while removing the worn out cable. It may make it easier to reinstall. 
Good luck


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## mazzy (Mar 11, 2006)

I just did this job yesterday. A local rigging shop made up the cables to duplicate what I brought him. He had the cables ready the next day. I also had one cable with a couple of "meat hooks" and one cable that was fine.


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

Only problem with DIY is the size and shape of the nicropress fittings used. If you buy from the manufacture (i.e. Edson) the fittings will be small, smooth, with nothing to hand up inside the pedestal. Only stainless wire should be used. I don't know why galvanized would have been fitted. Consider this: with a ferrous metal, like steel, every time you change the position of the wheel you have changed the magnetic field around the binnacle compass. No deviation card is going to fix this!


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## Giulietta (Nov 14, 2006)

Mine are all dyneema.


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## radcat (Apr 28, 2008)

Greetings. This is a very timely post. I just finished installing an engine control cable. Since I had the steering cables disconnected, I inspected them and found one with several broken strands. I plan to take the old cables to a local rigger and have duplicates made. My question is, how do you remove the old ones? Will they pull down through the bottom of the pedestal or do you have to pull everything up through the top like the engine control cables?


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## zoom555 (Jun 7, 2007)

Radcat,

I'm not sure if you can do remove the cables the way you're thinking, but I just got an email back from Edson customer service (I'm leaning toward getting them to fabricate the cables and also sell me a new chain at the same time) recommending this approach:

... unfasten the cables from the radial drive wheel or quadrant on the rudder post. Next, tie two messenger lines on the cables and bring the assembly up through the top of the pedestal.​
This is essentially what Knothead recommended earlier in this thread.


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## radcat (Apr 28, 2008)

Thanks for the quick response. From everything I have read, it is also a good idea to remove the sheaves to check the condition of the pins. Some of the older systems used bronze pins and they need to be checked for wear. If they are damaged, they can be replaced with SS clevis pins.


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## mazzy (Mar 11, 2006)

My rigger built the cables of stainless with nicopress fittings sized the same as the originals. No problems at all. The stainless that Edson uses is supposed to be non-magnetic, but my compass readings didn't change a whit with the new cables.

As far as hints for replacing the cables:
1 Stuff a rag into the pedestal so you don't lose any bits you're bound to drop as you disassemble things (don't ask how I know this one )

2 My cables were in cable conduit and I tried unsuccessfully to use a piece of thin line butted to the end of the cable with duct tape. Worked for one, but not the other. I decided to unbolt the pedestal to finish the job. This allowed me to replace the conduit end fittings, run the cables easily thru the conduit, and retrieve the various pieces dropped in the process. Getting to the bolts under the cockpit floor required a skinny kid and a deep socket wrench, but wasn't too big a deal.

Mike


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## Northeaster (Jan 13, 2007)

Have a good look at the cahin while you have it apart, and replace if necessary. Although mine passed a survey 2 years ago, I discovered a chain line broken on ome side, and some frayed wire. It would have certainly let go soon. It was 29 years old! I has a rigger nicopress new wires, and bought 10' of stainless #40 roller chain from an industrial supplier, as Edson only sells #50 now. I paid less for 10' than Edson wanted for 1 1/2'. Of course, I only needed the shorter amount. Igf anyone needs #40 chain, let me know!!! Size is marked on the sides of each link.

Easy job to take off compass, duct tape messenger wire on each end, pull up, and then reinstall.

Make sure you have rudder stops below on steering quadrant, as I have heard of one failure, as chain / wire end would contact gears on extreme turns, therefore slowly cutting into wire.


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

> 3. Anyone have any other helpful tips about completing this job?


My advice is don't let your marina make any of your maintenance decisions for you. If there is something wrong with your boat - fix it. Right away. If you don't it will become a bigger problem.

Good Luck


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## JiffyLube (Jan 25, 2008)

Sailormann said:


> My advice is don't let your marina make any of your maintenance decisions for you. If there is something wrong with your boat - fix it. Right away. If you don't it will become a bigger problem.
> 
> Good Luck


I totally agree with you! I might not want to use the people you went to, because I don't want them to tell me to not to do something that I know needs to be fixed...besides, since I'm willing to pay, what's with them not wanting to do it? They must have to much work, and they're cherry picking the work.


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## zoom555 (Jun 7, 2007)

My conclusion about my marina's service department was exactly as suggested above - replacing the steering cable is a frustrating job because of the need to crawl into confined spaces, so they'd rather not do it.


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## knothead (Apr 9, 2003)

A little trick for attaching a messenger line to wire is to unlay a strand or two for a few inches and then lay a small diameter messenger line against the wire. Then relay the strands around the messenger, thus trapping it. Use a little tape to keep the wire from unlaying as you pull it through all the twists and turns. 
I have replaced many halyards, steering cables and centerboard cables over the years with this method.
Trying to tape a messenger to a greasy piece of wire is just asking for trouble.


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## kushka (Jul 19, 2006)

Northeaster hit a real good point when he mentioned the rudder stops.

My cables and chain are all in good working condition but, I had a failure last summer where the cable jumped off one of the sheaves. 

The cause...turning the wheel too far with no stop.


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## zoom555 (Jun 7, 2007)

As an update, I finally had some dry weather to work on the boat this weekend. I took the old cable and chain assembly out. One snag I'll have to deal with on re-installation is that only one of my messenger lines survived the journey - the second got cut up in the conduit at the bottom of the pedestal and the cable pulled free. I think I'll be able to get the second line up to the top using fish tape or a coat hanger.

The steering cable was, in fact, in terrible shape. Of the seven strands of the 7x19 cable, only two were still holding. It was definitely an accident waiting to happen. I can't believe my marina told me it didn't need to be replaced. I can only guess that they shone a flashlight from the front and didn't actually crawl under to look at it.

The failure point was right where the wire was crimped (see picture). I don't see any rudder stops in place, so I think the problem is that the quadrant is being permitted to swing so far to each side that it bends the cable at too tight of an angle. I'll have to investigate what kind of stop I can install.


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## knothead (Apr 9, 2003)

I think you are correct. No wire should be allowed to bend at the terminal whether Swaged or Nico-pressed. 

That why the use of toggles on the standing rigging is so important.


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## Northeaster (Jan 13, 2007)

Zoom - I just replace mine a couple weeks ago - your steering quadrant looks very similar. When I installed adjusting "take-up" eye bolts, I had to tighten the nut most of the way, only leaving an inch, or so, of threads showing (for tightening). Otherwise, my cable clamps would have been bending around the corner of the quadrant - as in your picture!


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## radcat (Apr 28, 2008)

Thanks to the replies to this post, I am ready to install the parts. I ended up getting a rigger to make up the cables ($50 vs the $240 that Edson wanted). In my case, the cable was in good shape except for an isolated area on the starboard wire that had about half the strands broken. This did not point to a misaligned sheave since you would expect to see more generalized wear. A rigger thought that as some point, the cable became loose and jumped the sheave causing the damage. Something to remember if it ever happens. Another problem I noted was an abraded instrument wiring harness that someone had installed too close to the chain. Just like a car, one of the benefits of doing the work yourself is that you spot other problems in the process. I do have one other question. When I removed the cable, each eye bolt was secured with two nuts- one on each side of the radial housing making a secure fit. The Edson literature (not very comprehensive) indicates that both nuts should be on the same side. It seems to me that if that were the case, the eye would be free so float back and forth a bit and eventually damage the threads or, more probably, abrade the hole in the radial. Has anyone else encountered this? I remember reading somewhere that it is not always wise to reinstall parts on an old boat the way they came off. You don’t know who did the previous work.


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## knothead (Apr 9, 2003)

radcat said:


> The Edson literature (not very comprehensive) indicates that both nuts should be on the same side. It seems to me that if that were the case, the eye would be free so float back and forth a bit and eventually damage the threads or, more probably, abrade the hole in the radial. Has anyone else encountered this? I remember reading somewhere that it is not always wise to reinstall parts on an old boat the way they came off. You don't know who did the previous work.


Both nuts should be on the same side. The first one adjusts the eyebolt and the other locks the first. I don't think you will have a problem with the bolt floating back and forth if everything is adjusted properly but if you are worried about it, put a third nut on the other side. I can't see how that could hurt anything.

You're right about not always installing things the way they came off. You should install them the way they should be.


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## donradclife (May 19, 2007)

Don't forget to note whether and where the cables are crossed before you pull them off, or you will find to your embarrassment that the rudder moves the wrong way when you get it all back together again.


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## radcat (Apr 28, 2008)

Switching those cables up would be embarrassing and potentially quite expensive. We ran messenger lines for everything and tied off port and starboard accordingly. The suggestion of unlaying one of the strands to attach the messenger worked great. Speaking of lines, as previously mentioned it is a good idea to tie off anything you can with a lanyard before working over the pedestal. While we were fitting the wiring up, I did drop the chain and the lanyard saved me a good bit of work.


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## radcat (Apr 28, 2008)

I need some help understanding the application of steering wire clips. The wire on my Edson steering system is 3/16 “ SS. Most of the guidance I have seen for the installation of the wire clips calls for two wire clips with 3-3/4” turnback on the bitter end of the wire. The problem is that with this much turnback, the length of the wire is such that there are not going to be many threads available on the eye bolt to adjust for stretch in the future. I suspect the turnback requirement is a generic industry standard that allows for back and forth bending flex that this system will not see. It seems to me that two inches of turnback for this application should be acceptable. The wire was made up by a local rigger so Edson is not going to be much help. Thanks.


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## LifeWorthLivin (Aug 30, 2006)

*Edson...*

I would think having Edson do it would be the easiest and safest way. I have seen even really good yards (Hinkley) do a crummy job on steering cables. You take the old one off, take measurements, Edson will make you a new one to fit and send it to you. Keep the current as a spare.


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## radcat (Apr 28, 2008)

Thanks for the reply. The problem is that even if I bought cables from Edson, I would have the same issue. Replacement cables from them are the same as what I currently have- 3/16" wire with a swaged thimble on one end and thimbles/clips to install on the other end. The radial end can't be made up ahead of time because the thimbles won't fit through the bottom of the pedistal. Getting the operating length correct is no problem (I measured the old ones). The question is how much space do you really need between the two clips on each wire. According to some US Navy literature I found today, 6 cable diameters between clips should be OK. I think I can make that work.


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## knothead (Apr 9, 2003)

radcat said:


> I need some help understanding the application of steering wire clips. The wire on my Edson steering system is 3/16 " SS. Most of the guidance I have seen for the installation of the wire clips calls for two wire clips with 3-3/4" turnback on the bitter end of the wire. The problem is that with this much turnback, the length of the wire is such that there are not going to be many threads available on the eye bolt to adjust for stretch in the future. I suspect the turnback requirement is a generic industry standard that allows for back and forth bending flex that this system will not see. It seems to me that two inches of turnback for this application should be acceptable. The wire was made up by a local rigger so Edson is not going to be much help. Thanks.


Radcat, I don't know what a steering wire clip is. Could you be talking about a nico-press sleeve?
What is turnback? Are you talking about the wire you wrap around a thimble which holds a eye-bolt which fastens to the quadrant?


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## radcat (Apr 28, 2008)

Knothead,
Yes, this is the wire that connects to the eye-bolt with a thimble. The turnback is the length of the bitter end of the wire measured from the end of the thimble to the end of the wire. The clips are the u-bolt/saddle clamps that connect the bitter end to the standing part. Rigging.net/clips.html has a pretty good description ( I can't include the direct link yet- not enough posts).


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