# Are sailing schools worth it?



## rishi851 (Dec 29, 2013)

Hi everyone,
Tomorrow I have a beginner's discover sailing course which I decided to take after much consideration. Not the learning bit....I WANT to do it. But the cost.
The discover sailing for 1.5 hrs is costing me 60$. If I take the whole course it is around 2000$ after which I will also get a certificate.

My question is....Is it the right way to spend so much(almost any school is around this range) for a week? Or is there other way


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## capta (Jun 27, 2011)

As a former instructor with one of the major sailing schools, we parted ways because I felt the curriculum was too centered. I thought it was a sort of "our way or the highway" situation, with no flexibility.
Most of it was excellent, and I cannot fault any of the instructors; they did a wonderful job within the very strict curriculum, but I just wasn't comfortable repeatedly stressing that this was the only "right and proper" way to do some things.
I would rather see folks purchase a small, inexpensive sailboat and a couple of books, like Royce's Sailing Illustrated, and go out and have some fun learning to sail. Banging into docks, tipping over and not getting hit on the head by the boom in a gybe.
My sailing companion has over 5k offshore and inter island miles under sail on a 50 footer and has a very good understanding of what to do with the sails, strings and things, but until I can get her into something like a Sunfish or Laser, she will not really understand why.


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## Group9 (Oct 3, 2010)

I learned how to sail, with formal instruction, at 14 in a week long course (and my daughter learned the same way). But, the course I took, was just about how to sail. Nothing else about rules of the road, anchoring, storm tactics. Just how to make a boat move under wind power.

After the basics, it was easy to learn everything else by myself, from books, talking to other sailors, and personal experience.


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## benesailor (Dec 27, 2012)

Yes, it is worth it. You can buy the ASA books and learn quite a bit. 

What you really need is to get on the open water and put that knowledge to the test.


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## kd3pc (Oct 19, 2006)

I went to a county sponsored saturday lesson on a Helms 24 and had the time of my life. I told the capt/owner that I was available any weekend and most evenings, if he knew anyone who wanted novice crew/rail meat/etc.

I sailed the rest of that year on other people's boats and continued to have a ball. The next year I sprung for a Venture 21 of my own and went out as often as I could.

That was almost 40 years ago, and I still did more sailing then, than now. By far!!

My wife and I did take the ASA basic 3 class course, which helped.

But doing it on a small boat, of your own, making your own mistakes/decisions was the key. For what the whole course now, you can buy a used "wet" sail boat or a small dry daysailer and learn more, more often and when you want. IF you want more instruction hire a mentor to come to you and your boat.

All the best, no matter what you decide!! Get out there and sail.


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## Daydreamer22 (Oct 16, 2008)

I would have to say yes.

Sure you could buy a boat for 2 grand and get a buddy to show you how to sail it. I did.

Then, I got the bug and wanted to do more, learn more, get a bigger boat, and do bigger sailing.

I had been considering an eight day course for a while and last April my wife signed us up for class in Santa Cruz, Ca. We stayed on and sailed a Catalina 320 for the duration of the course. 

I had done no coastal sailing whatsoever. I did not know if I would get seasick or how bad if I did. Turns out I was a bit queasy for a couple of days and then settled in.

We sailed in moderate conditions, 4-6 foot swell and 20 kts, which was quite a bump up from lake sailing.

Having been reading and sailing for a few years prior to this I picked up the curriculum quickly and learned a lot. For my wife it was a struggle. She mostly wanted a vacation.

Looking back, would I do it again? I believe so.

Do i think it was a good value? Yes. When compared with the cost of chartering, (which requires some form of accreditation), or slip fees, or the purchase and maintenance of a boat, and then realizing the romantic notion of sailing doesn't compare with the reality of it. Priceless.

For two grand I spent eight days living on,learning on, and sailing with an instructor. At the end of it all if this had turned out to be something I wasn't as interested in as I thought, I could just walk away and not be stuck with a boat that cost money just sitting there.

I'm still sailing our 22 footer and dreaming of something bigger. I am now certified to ASA 104 and my wife to 103, so we could charter most anywhere and I have improved my skill level.

I am glad I did it.


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## nolatom (Jun 29, 2005)

I don't know about schools. But if you live near a club or facility that gives sailing lessons, take a couple. If that doesn't get you far enough along, then probably a school is what you are looking for.

I teach part-time giving weekend lessons to locals, or others who are visiting New Orleans. A couple of basic keelboat lessons in a decent, responsive boat may do the trick for some learners, especially if you have a way to get out with friends on their boats too (easy here, just hang on the docks on Wednesday race nights for a ride).

Power Squadrons or Coast Guard Auxiliary classes can teach you the chart and piloting work, and most of the practical and regulatory dos and don'ts. Then it's a matter of how to plan for a cruise. Get invited on a couple of short coastal trips or deliveries if you have a winning personality and know the basics. Or crew on some coastal/offshore races.

I think once you can handle a boat in a breeze on all points of sail, run an engine, and get from A to B on a chart with a compass and a GPS,, then you just need to add some "camping writ large, or writ wet" skills to your repertoire, meaning provisioning and weather awareness.

Now what I think I've just described is what a school will do for you all at once. I learned it basically as described in the "non-school" method back in the '60s. Did some racing, some deliveries, and picked up a captain's license along the way.

Now I get to teach. Is this a great country, or what? ;-)

But what I'm getting at is that it's easy to learn to sail if you live where sailing is going on, and you are determined, personable, and helpful.

But if you live where boats are not, or don't want to cobble together a do-it-yourself program over time, then maybe the resident schools are the way to go. Most who have gone to them speak highly of the experience.

Different horses for different courses, I guess..


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## caberg (Jul 26, 2012)

No offense to the instructors here, but the ones I've come across over the years have not really been that knowledgeable or experienced beyond very focused attention to some basics that are easily learned on your own.


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## rgscpat (Aug 1, 2010)

Whether it's worth it depends on you. 

Someone on a tight budget with limited goals might not find it so worthwhile.

Someone who's about to spend big bucks on a boat and wants to get up the learning curve fast and avoid making expensive mistakes with an expensive boat purchase, and doesn't have good local mentors, could find it a very worthwhile bargain.

There are lots of ways to learn, and lots of different kinds of learning and learning styles. One size does not fit all. 

One thing I am a bit leery of is the compressed "instant hero" or "zero to hero" classes; I'd prefer to space out the learning more, with more chances for practice, getting into and out of situations, and coming up with questions, and refining skills. 

I'd like it if the sailing schools would encourage you to talk with your instructor before hand and try to work out how you learn best and get an idea of what skills, background, strengths, or limits you bring to the learning situation.


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## socal c25 (Nov 1, 2013)

As an Instructor (not sailing) I still should say yes BUT, I learned by "seat of the pants" and many of the available books. And now there are cd's and youtube to help you learn, I am not discounting classes as they will have much to teach, you'll still have to make that solo flight and you will do just fine. Every time you go out you learn something new and you will be putting all your experiences in your own book "LOG" and one last thing HAVE FUN...


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## Don L (Aug 8, 2008)

My wife and I took ASA lessons and 7 days later were sailing by ourselves on 33' boats.of it

PS - do your reading ahead of time and know what you need to do in order to get the most out


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## miatapaul (Dec 15, 2006)

A lot depends on the way you learn. But for $2000 you could get an inexpensive boat and go at it and you can sell it for what you paid for it when ready to move up. Don't head out into the ocean, but hang out in lakes and bays till you are comfortable. Check with the local Coast Guard and Power Squadron as they have basic courses to cover things like the rules of the road and safety that are free or inexpensive. The thing with the certificate is that all it will help you with is if you want to charter a boat. If that is not in your plans then perhaps a less formal path may be more productive. 

Others though likely need a more structured environment. If you feel you need something structured go for it. Another option is to join a sailing club. They maintain the boats, take care of insurance, upgrading, and you get to take out different types as your skills improve. Some of them have training courses as well, that you take to qualify to use the bigger boats. Normally much less expensive than maintaining your own boat. You have to fit your schedule around theirs. For instance you may not get a boat on the 4th of July but can on the 5th. This works out for a lot of people, especially if you have a flexible schedule. 

Where you live may also determine what is available to you. IE lots of options in Annapolis, not so many in Podunk.


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## nolatom (Jun 29, 2005)

caberg said:


> No offense to the instructors here, but the ones I've come across over the years have not really been that knowledgeable or experienced beyond very focused attention to some basics that are easily learned on your own.


What, in particular, didn't you get that you wanted? What was the type of knowledge they lacked?

I'm interested. Might learn something...

okay, I've got you for 3 hours in a 10-knot breeze on a nice day. 24' fin-keel sloop, main, jib, assym spinny with a retractable bowsprit. What do you want me to cover? I have 2 or 3 other students with you.


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## caberg (Jul 26, 2012)

nolatom said:


> What, in particular, didn't you get that you wanted? What was the type of knowledge they lacked?
> 
> I'm interested. Might learn something...
> 
> okay, I've got you for 3 hours in a 10-knot breeze on a nice day. 24' fin-keel sloop, main, jib, assym spinny with a retractable bowsprit. What do you want me to cover? I have 2 or 3 other students with you.


Sorry, I got interrupted in my post and meant to qualify that. I've never taken a lesson in my life but have been around some instructors and schools. I just meant to warn the OP not to expect to learn calculus if the teacher is only really good at addition and subtraction--which can be learned on your own. That's just my observations, and they are limited.


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

Learning the correct way to do something in the first place is always easier and less expensive than trying to unlearn the wrong way later.


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## tempest (Feb 12, 2007)

Do you own a sailboat? planning to purchase one soon? 

Generally speaking, I think it's good to take a beginner's course ( ASA 101 here) basic keelboat. Then either go out on your boat, a rental, or crew on op's boats and practice what you've learned, get proficient at the basics: tacking, gybing, sailing all points of sail, heaving-to etc. Then go on to the next level when you know more..about what you don't know. 

I'm not sure I'd spend $2000. learning and then have no boat to practice on, on a regular basis.


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## Sailormon6 (May 9, 2002)

I don't think you need 5 days to learn how to sail. I learned to sail in a weekend sailing course. IIRC, it was two days, and a 2 day course should, of course, be considerably less expensive than 5 days. There were 4 students and an instructor on each boat. We spent until noon the first day in class, learning terminology and theory, and we sailed all afternoon. The second day, we spent a short time in class, and the rest of the day on the boat. I learned enough in the course to be able to charter a 26' sailboat, and sail the gulf coast of Florida. It took a little common sense and studying of a nautical chart to find my way around. You won't become a highly skilled sailor in two days, but, truthfully, you won't in five days either. You just need to learn enough to get you started. After that, you'll have a lifetime to learn the rest.


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## christian.hess (Sep 18, 2013)

id much rather have a 1 on 1 with an old salt...picking one is tough just like picking a mentor is

that is not to say schools are bad...

some suffer from poor hands on teaching, others excell in theory etc...

most all are quite expensive in my humble opinion.

what is of utmost importance is to vary your training and learning experiences...

and your boat if you have one...

for example using the 2k figure...I can buy a nice old boat for around 1k...get into a marina...have my own slip for 100 a month and then fix the boat a bit

now you have your home away from home, a platform, a learning center(free)

now all you need to do is walk the docks, ask around, get a couple of people to teach you the ropes, for a beer or a meal, then when you get the guts and theory down you go and SAIL

thats the best way...repetition...in out in out of marina, raise lower sails, etc...etc...

the more you do the better you get...then foucs on specifics...

but thats my biased opinion

if you dont want the hassle of ownership then use these schools...

in any case hope you learn and have fun, what it should be about!

peace


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## christian.hess (Sep 18, 2013)

Sailormon6 said:


> I don't think you need 5 days to learn how to sail. I learned to sail in a weekend sailing course. IIRC, it was two days, and a 2 day course should, of course, be considerably less expensive than 5 days. There were 4 students and an instructor on each boat. We spent until noon the first day in class, learning terminology and theory, and we sailed all afternoon. The second day, we spent a short time in class, and the rest of the day on the boat. I learned enough in the course to be able to charter a 26' sailboat, and sail the gulf coast of Florida. It took a little common sense and studying of a nautical chart to find my way around. You won't become a highly skilled sailor in two days, but, truthfully, you won't in five days either. You just need to learn enough to get you started. After that, you'll have a lifetime to learn the rest.


just a question please take no offence

how the hell did you charter a boat fresh from learning how to sail?

I couldnt even with a captains license in boat centric san francisco bay

they wanted so damn much info, $$$ tests, blah blah blah I said screw it and started looking at boats to buy
such a hassle

bought a folkboat in berkeley and had a blast


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

christian.hess said:


> .....how the hell did you charter a boat fresh from learning how to sail?


If you take the Offshore Sailing School liveaboard course, you start on day 1 with zero sailing experience. You live with an instructor aboard for 6 days. You have class over breakfast everyday and take both written and practical tests until dinner. On day 7, your final practical exam is to take the boat to another island (min 5 miles, stay the night and bring the boat back in the morning), with no instructor aboard! My wife did so with two others on a 43ft benetaeu and the whole crew sailed for the first time in their lives 6 days earlier!

Once you've passed that course, any charter company there will bareboat a similar size vessel to you.


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## Sailormon6 (May 9, 2002)

christian.hess said:


> just a question please take no offence
> 
> how the hell did you charter a boat fresh from learning how to sail?
> 
> ...


I chartered the boat a year after taking the course. I chartered it from the same sailing school where I took the course. If they didn't have enough confidence to charter the boat to me, it didn't speak well of their instruction. In short, I put them on the spot. 

Back in the day, it was shockingly easy to charter a boat. I have never had a charter company ask me to raise the sails when checking me out for a charter. They never seemed to care whether I could actually sail. Their main concern was whether I could maneuver the boat around the docks under power, and, oh yeah, whether I had a valid credit card.


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## christian.hess (Sep 18, 2013)

well that makes perfect sense! nowadays its hard...


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## azguy (Jul 17, 2012)

Maybe if you told us what you get for the $2,000 we can better answer the question....Is it a week long vacation where you get to sail and you are getting lessons, foods, overnight accommodations, etc. Is it ASA courses, etc.

You could take ASA 101-104 and learn tons for about $1,200. However, they do suggest 5-60 hours of tiller time between 101 and 103 and I'm not sure what you would get out of 103 have just taken 101 a day before.


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## Cruisingdad (Jul 21, 2006)

rishi851 said:


> Hi everyone,
> 
> Tomorrow I have a beginner's discover sailing course which I decided to take after much consideration. Not the learning bit....I WANT to do it. But the cost.
> 
> ...


No. Sailing is easy and a hands-on sport. Just read a basic book on it.


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## caberg (Jul 26, 2012)

Minnewaska said:


> If you take the Offshore Sailing School liveaboard course, you start on day 1 with zero sailing experience. You live with an instructor aboard for 6 days. You have class over breakfast everyday and take both written and practical tests until dinner. On day 7, your final practical exam is to take the boat to another island (min 5 miles, stay the night and bring the boat back in the morning), with no instructor aboard! My wife did so with two others on a 43ft benetaeu and the whole crew sailed for the first time in their lives 6 days earlier!
> 
> Once you've passed that course, any charter company there will bareboat a similar size vessel to you.


You own a nice big boat, I just don't get the point of this? I guess if you need someone to help you learn your own boat, then ok, but otherwise? I guess if folks like going to "camp" for a week. I'd rather spend the week on my boat. If I [email protected]#$ stuff up, that's how I learn.


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

caberg said:


> You own a nice big boat, I just don't get the point of this? I guess if you need someone to help you learn your own boat, then ok, but otherwise? I guess if folks like going to "camp" for a week. I'd rather spend the week on my boat. If I [email protected]#$ stuff up, that's how I learn.


I was responding in that post (quoted in fact) to a poster that asks how you bareboat coming fresh from training and I explained how its done.

Certainly, I have no issue with bareboating in the Caribbean, but how did you get this was about me or you?

For what it's worth, the liveaboard course is not camping, it's work. They will tell you not to bother bringing your mask and snorkel.


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## christian.hess (Sep 18, 2013)

this is something I did come across...if you did everything the bareboat charters or for example the shcools needed you do then you could take out a boat

but I guess what I found weird was how few places would rent out boats to skilled sailors as is...

they all wanted something, a certificate some sort of membership somewhere or courses taken etc...

and I even showed these guys my master ticket and they were like ok cool but yeah you need to do this first, take this course, etc...etc...

I just felt werid

maybe in the carribean its different?

dunno


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## capta (Jun 27, 2011)

christian.hess said:


> this is something I did come across...if you did everything the bareboat charters or for example the shcools needed you do then you could take out a boat
> 
> but I guess what I found weird was how few places would rent out boats to skilled sailors as is...
> 
> ...


You actually showed a bareboat company a ticket and they wouldn't let you rent a boat?
Down here, the bareboat companies are so desperate for customers they give boats to people with absolutely no experience at all.
At least when I was working down here 30 years ago, they had to show that they could operate the boat, or the companies put a "guide" aboard to safeguard the boat.
How things have changed.


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## christian.hess (Sep 18, 2013)

this was in san fran...it wasnt a bareboat charter group it was more of a community type sailing school and rental...

dont know what the deal was, maybe I was not into it either but they said yeah we need more stuff you need to take these tests and enroll and be with us some time before you can take out boats yourself...

I think I had to crew on boats with other people for like 20 hours or so something like that, then take a test, and then only then be able to take out a boat

in the end I said screw it and saved up for a folkboat...jajajaja


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## Dave_E (Aug 7, 2013)

This is one of those questions that for every sailor, there is a different opinion. Mine is this: If you're one of those folks (like I was) who can read a manual and then with minimal instruction, go do it... then I suggest do it that way... but you have to have a boat. With lessons at a school, you're paying for use of the boat, the maintenance, the insurance, the business overhead, the instructor's fees... A person today without access to a boat has limited choices. 

Dave


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## Yorksailor (Oct 11, 2009)

It amazes me that people who insist that their doctor, dentist, lawyer, airline pilot and cruise ship captain have ten years of training and experience when faced with developing their own skills that allow them to function at the same level as professionals are unwilling to put in the time and money.

My wife has a US Coast Guard 100 ton Masters, she can handle a 55 ft boat alone in a gale and negotiate a close passing with a couple of 600 ft freighters ...That level of competency does not come from a two day course!!!

Of course learning from professionals is worth the time, effort and money.


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## Donna_F (Nov 7, 2005)

My first thought was perhaps a community sailing school has less assets should they get sued so they may want to CTA more than a large, international charter company that can absorb the consequences of letting a freshly minted sailor operate one of their boats. Just a thought. For some, suing people is a source of income.



christian.hess said:


> this was in san fran...it wasnt a bareboat charter group it was more of a community type sailing school and rental...
> 
> ...


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## Rhapsody-NS27 (Apr 8, 2012)

I took an ASA101 course and enjoyed it very much. I wanted to be able to practice the skills without having to ask permission from someone else to rent so I bought my own boat. I thought the course was a good introduction. Having someone who knew more than I did to show the right way to do something and share experience was helpful.


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## northoceanbeach (Mar 23, 2008)

Realizing the romantic notion of sailing doesn't compare with the reality of it? Isn't it better?

No. I vote against classes. My first boat was bought knowing nothing. Only having sailed one day, the day before. It was a cal 20. Bought for $1500 plus $500 for a used engine and $200 a month for slip fees in Hawaii for eight months. 

So you're saying for about that price I could have taken two week long classes? And that it supposed to be worth about the same as owning your own boat in Hawaii? All the people you meet that help you get going, all the memories I have of that time. It can't compare. 

But it doesn't have to. Different circumstances lead to different options being worth more.

I still don't think of sailing as a paid lessons type of sport. Way too many ways to learn yourself. Way too many people that will take you out just to make a new friend.


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## rgscpat (Aug 1, 2010)

Different sailors have very different needs and goals. For those who will only be taking simple boats out in generally benign conditions in protected waters, basic sailing skills and safety knowledge will likely suffice. That's hugely different from the preparation needed to be safe in areas with heavy traffic, harsh weather, or to cruise long distances far from shelter. Many who see sailing as a simple recreational escape don't have the desire or need to sail at a professional level, but can still be safe, competent sailors if they keep their sailing within the limits of their ability.


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## christian.hess (Sep 18, 2013)

Yorksailor said:


> It amazes me that people who insist that their doctor, dentist, lawyer, airline pilot and cruise ship captain have ten years of training and experience when faced with developing their own skills that allow them to function at the same level as professionals are unwilling to put in the time and money.
> 
> My wife has a US Coast Guard 100 ton Masters, she can handle a 55 ft boat alone in a gale and negotiate a close passing with a couple of 600 ft freighters ...That level of competency does not come from a two day course!!!
> 
> Of course learning from professionals is worth the time, effort and money.


I have the same restricted to 50 tons

my point at least was this was useless info or certification to take a simple keel boat out for the afternoon according to these guys

what they wanted was $$$ and courses and time into their system in order to take said boat out


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## christian.hess (Sep 18, 2013)

DRFerron said:


> My first thought was perhaps a community sailing school has less assets should they get sued so they may want to CTA more than a large, international charter company that can absorb the consequences of letting a freshly minted sailor operate one of their boats. Just a thought. For some, suing people is a source of income.


what is cta? and yes I agree...completely think it had less to do with my skills or not than whatever it was they needed me to do in order to buy into their program



hijack over


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## Donna_F (Nov 7, 2005)

christian.hess said:


> what is cta? and yes I agree...completely think it had less to do with my skills or not than whatever it was they needed me to do in order to buy into their program
> 
> 
> 
> hijack over


I had to change "CYA" to *their* in order to make the sentence sound correct.


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## poopdeckpappy (Jul 25, 2006)

rishi851 said:


> Hi everyone,
> Tomorrow I have a beginner's discover sailing course which I decided to take after much consideration. Not the learning bit....I WANT to do it. But the cost.
> The discover sailing for 1.5 hrs is costing me 60$. If I take the whole course it is around 2000$ after which I will also get a certificate.
> 
> My question is....Is it the right way to spend so much(almost any school is around this range) for a week? Or is there other way


we offer a 2 hr. intro @ $75.00, a 20hr ( two weekends ) ASA 101/103 @ $595.00 ( $495.00 if you become a member) a 5 day 101-104 @ $1295.00. plus some other cool packages

These are group classes limited to no less than two, no more than 5

edit
I hope that didn't violate rules, if it did, I/we can erase it


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## jackdale (Dec 1, 2008)

In my experience as an instructor I have found that many self taught sailors have some of the worst habits.

I would rather start with a "blank slate." (BTW - "blank slate" is a sailing term. I think it would be a great name for a boat.)

It is also essential that folks get a bunch of experience between various sailing standards. 

Personally - I got my feet wet on a Tartan 10 racing on Galveston Bay, then took some lessons and went sailing for almost a decade, then got some additional certification before becoming an instructor.


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## rishi851 (Dec 29, 2013)

poopdeckpappy said:


> we offer a 2 hr. intro @ $75.00, a 20hr ( two weekends ) ASA 101/103 @ $595.00 ( $495.00 if you become a member) a 5 day 101-104 @ $1295.00. plus some other cool packages
> 
> These are group classes limited to no less than two, no more than 5
> 
> ...


Hey,
Do you have a website or link I can look into?
I like your package and it helps that you are a regular here.


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## capecodda (Oct 6, 2009)

I think you can divide the skills into 2 categories: Sailing and everything else.

IMHO there's no better way to learn to sail than on small boats. When you trim the sails right, and balance the boat, they reward you immediately with increased performance. Big boats not so much. I've done some instruction in this category, and find that a little talking, and a lot of doing is the key.

On the other hand, there's all the other stuff. Weather, navigation, safety, COLREGS, anchoring, close quarter maneuvering of bigger boats, etc. I've had experience teaching this as well, and IMHO quite a bit of talking works here, and can help you not learn stuff the hard way, which is often expensive, and sometimes dangerous.

Cutting to the case, if I had $2K to spend, and just wanted to learn to sail, I'd probably buy a small boat and find a buddy with experience. If on the other hand my plan was to immediately start cruising distances, not just dipping my toe in the water, in a decent sized yacht, I'd recommend some instruction. For this lifestyle, you also need a budget for the next step beyond schooling, buying/maintaining a cruising boat, or at least regular chartering.

Good luck, but whatever you, give it a try. Most on this board would say that sailing is one of the best things that every happened to us.


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

Docking a bigger boat takes some experience too and that can be very limited in beginner courses. Not uncommon for larger boats to be longer than the fairway is wide, limiting maneuver choices. There is more windage, impossible to muscle off or onto the dock, etc. 

Even using bow thrusters, which are more common on larger boats, would help with some basic instruction, such as: for most boats when you thrust the bow in one direction, the stern goes in the opposite. Holding a thruster down for an extended period can burn it out, even potentially start a fire (I've seen one on a buddy's boat that did this). When backing in, the thruster can act like a rudder of sorts.


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## Shockwave (Feb 4, 2014)

If you are going the schooling route the best bet is the larger more established schools like OCCS or Offshore. If you want personal training people like John Kretchmer or others who have done it for a few years will be good. Really though, there is no replacement for time on the water sailing or repairing boats. Bleed a diesel once, you know how, bleed it a few dozen times you become proficient. Reef once you know how, reef hundreds of times it's just a part of sailing. Nothing replaces "doing".


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## csalatti (Jul 26, 2011)

2 thousand seems a bit steep for a keel boat course/certification. I teach basic keelboat (US Sailing) in the summer and I think it is closer to $800. Also the one advantage of taking a course at a good sailing center is the support/opportunities they can offer once you have finished the class. The sailing center I work at offers programs where new sailors can get "sea time" with other more experience sailors (e.g. Race Night, New Sailor Night). It seems like the newly certified sailors find these experiences helpful until they completely develop their skills.


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## Dave_E (Aug 7, 2013)

There are lots of good reasons posted here why schools are a good reason. However it still comes down to this: We're all different. Some folks just "get it", others don't. Some take longer, some are shy, some can't afford it.

"Are Sailing Schools Worth It?" cannot best be answered until you've been there and done that and then looked back upon your experiences. Better question might be "What are your experiences and thoughts about sailing schools"?


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## poopdeckpappy (Jul 25, 2006)

rishi851 said:


> Hey,
> Do you have a website or link I can look into?
> I like your package and it helps that you are a regular here.


The web address is marinasailing.com I'll be in tomorrow - Thursday at the SD office if you want to talk in person or we can communicate by PM here.

Also, one of the more fun packages is the 104 &, 106 course which is done during and in the Newport to Ensenada race

In SD all class time is on the water

We've been around since 1962


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## Jak (Sep 7, 2012)

I suppose it depends on how you learn. I would spend the $2k on a boat. A 20ish ft boat is easy enough to teach yourself on (I did). I read some books, bought a 23' boat and never looked back. in reality sailing is pretty intuitive and not hard to get the basics once your out on the water (especially when you are the only person you can rely on). I have never had a lesson, nor had anyone to show me the ropes. Jut get out on the water. you will figure it out.


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## James757 (Nov 2, 2012)

I found sailing classes very helpful and was I very fortunate to have taken courses at the Navy base in Norfolk, VA because the cost for training was easy on the budget. However, I see formal training as a part of the larger scheme to become a competent sailor. Again, I lucked out since I have met a fair amount of people who sail and are willing to share their knowledge. Likewise, this forum has been very helpful. People have been very patient with their advice since I still confuse port the side of the boat with port the drink!

For me, classes worked and I anticipate taking more courses in the future.


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## jephotog (Feb 25, 2002)

I think it really depends on a number of factors.


Where do you live?
How much free time do you have?
How good are you at learning from books?

If you live near the water with an active boating community you can find many opportunities to sail, provided you have the free time to be near the water. If you can learn from reading you can teach most of what you need to know by reading and making mistakes. While I have taken two sailing classes in my 20 years of sailing I would say I am mostly self taught.

Unless you have another way to learn or get on a boat I would suggest taking the ASA 101 as a minimum. That way you could be at least rent small boats or be helpful on other peoples boats. I don't think taking 101-103 and 104 all at once is a good idea. There is so much info to squeeze in a short period, that you'd be better taking 101 learning to sail a smaller keel boat and all things sailing related first then rent the small boats for 10 times before moving onto the big boat classes. Here are some books you should own to start learning.

Royce's Sailing Illustrated: Patrick M. Royce: 9780894716966: Amazon.com: [email protected]@[email protected]@http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/[email protected]@[email protected]@51p767EXOgL

Amazon.com: The Annapolis Book of Seamanship: Fourth Edition eBook: John Rousmaniere, Mark Smith: [email protected]@[email protected]@http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/[email protected]@[email protected]@512eHEVD20L


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## VI Sailing School (Mar 8, 2014)

Sailing Schools (like any other school &/or teacher) varies. I will say right up front that I am an ASA instructor working in California and the Caribbean. I've sailed for 40 years, starting with lessons at 13. I sailed sabots a lot, bought a 32 boat when I was 40, took a couple of advanced ASA classes, then spent 10 years racing my brains out. Got my 50 ton near coastal USCG License 5 years ago, then certification as an ASA instructor 4 years ago. ASA has a very high standard (I passed my USCG navigation test first time, but the ASA instructors navigation test took two tries!).

Now, what do you need to know?

Nothing beats sailing a little boat (< 24'-26') a lot. This gives you immediate feedback and the all important "feel" for what is happening in and outside the boat and quick results of actions you do or do not take. Learn from friends and crew on a few boats. If you crew with quality people that like to talk about what they know great; but formal training will let you see gaps in other's knowledge. I think all cruisers should join a race team and all racers should take a cruising class no matter how long they have been sailing. But just Go Sailing!!! There is NO Limit to the level you can take it....


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## lakesnbays (Oct 15, 2008)

Well if I had a 40+ foot late model sailboat and two people came to me to charter it, one with a mature (albeit cautious) attitude and a folder containing his sailing resume and his ASA 101-104 certificates; the other an old salt telling me how he’s got 50 years of sailing experience and always sails with the rail in the water otherwise “it’s just not sailing!” Guess who I’m going to let charter my boat….


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## TakeFive (Oct 22, 2009)

lakesnbays said:


> Well if I had a 40+ foot late model sailboat and two people came to me to charter it, one with a mature (albeit cautious) attitude and a folder containing his sailing resume and his ASA 101-104 certificates; the other an old salt telling me how he's got 50 years of sailing experience and always sails with the rail in the water otherwise "it's just not sailing!" Guess who I'm going to let charter my boat&#8230;.


Is the demand for charters strong enough that you even have such a choice?


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## Uricanejack (Nov 17, 2012)

Yes.

A simple statement of fact.

Lots of people muddle by just fine without. Doesn't change the simple fact.

Old salts do not necessarily make good instructors.
Some of the best instructors are not necessarily the most experienced sailors. 

Good instructors enjoy the subject they are instructing and enjoy passing the knowledge on. In addition to this they are patient while some student does not understand the topic right away. Willing to explain it again in a way the student can understand. To do this the instructor needs a thorough understanding of what they are teaching. And a clear understanding of what needs to be taught to explain the whole process. Which requires a carefully planned thorough lesson based on a well though out curriculum. 
A good instructor will encourage you to ask questions, answer your questions clearly, fully, without making you feel foolish. And above all honestly. Especially if they don’t know the answer.

This applies to a lot more than just sailing. 

The course is often only as good as the instructor.


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## rgscpat (Aug 1, 2010)

lakesnbays said:


> ...an old salt telling me how he's got 50 years of sailing experience and always sails with the rail in the water otherwise "it's just not sailing!" Guess who I'm going to let charter my boat&#8230;.


Well, duh, the old salt isn't that good a sailor since he's obviously not sailing the boat to her maximum speed potential and one day the excess leeway may put him in a bad place.


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## engineer_sailor (Aug 27, 2011)

Sailing is a hands-on sport. Books and classes are great but you need the time on the water to fully understand the information and develop skills. If you plan on day sailing and coastal cruising, take the ASA 101-104 sequence. Use the remaining funds to obtain regular access to a sailboat. Smaller boats are better for learning sailing. Local sailing non-profits are a great way to learn if one is in your area. Also read every sailing book you can find. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## blutoyz (Oct 28, 2012)

Lots of opinions...here's mine

For $2K you can buy cheap boat to learn on so buy a boat, put the white things up, and go. When you want to stop drop those white things...pretty simple. Everything in between can be learned from a book or youtube and some time on the water (light breeze days first).

One note...If you have NO experience on the water at all then a safety course is warranted, you don't want to hurt yourself of others.


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## Rhys05 (Aug 22, 2012)

Just got back from doing a sailing school with my wife. We already had the "sailing" part down pretty well, as we have a 26' boat on a small lake, but what we really wanted (and received in spades) was a boost in confidence for handling larger boats and/or larger water. My biggest goal for the class was for my wife to gain confidence steering the boat, as she had up until the class pretty much refused to take the tiller of our boat, she now is saying that she feels confident enough to take it [our boat] out by herself on the lake..I call that a win. Other than a few pointers on sailing technique, the main things we learned/gained confidence in were anchoring, navigation, crew overboard recovery, picking up mooring balls, dealing with clearing in/out (we were in the Virgin Islands), busy harbors, etc. 100% worth it to us. Plus it was just plain good old fashioned fun cruising around in the the islands.

If what you really want to do though is sail a small boat on a small lake or inlet, then you would probably be better served to buy a small boat and sail it, but if you want to go to more far flung places and "cruise" a larger boat, then do the courses [and buy the smallish boat to practice on]. IMO


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## solarwindsailor (Aug 28, 2014)

I think I am going to buy a good dinghy first and have fun as well as read books on sailing. Simultaneously I will join a sailing club to perhaps get on a boat and observe/help.

I agree shelling out couple a grand $$$$ for lessons is pricey and you may not get the correct teachings. I can't afford it anyway. I feel the classes are more expensive than a college class and we are paying for their charter/expenses beyond the cost of the class.



caberg said:


> No offense to the instructors here, but the ones I've come across over the years have not really been that knowledgeable or experienced beyond very focused attention to some basics that are easily learned on your own.


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## SVAuspicious (Oct 31, 2006)

solarwindsailor said:


> I agree shelling out couple a grand $$$$ for lessons is pricey and you may not get the correct teachings. I can't afford it anyway. I feel the classes are more expensive than a college class and we are paying for their charter/expenses beyond the cost of the class.


Go racing. At worst it's free. Some skippers will buy beer and feed you.


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## solarwindsailor (Aug 28, 2014)

I don't own anything yet though to race and I am still trying to figure out whats in my area (e.g., sailingclubs, yacht clubs, schools etc...).



SVAuspicious said:


> Go racing. At worst it's free. Some skippers will buy beer and feed you.


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## Donna_F (Nov 7, 2005)

solarwindsailor said:


> I don't own anything yet though to race and I am still trying to figure out whats in my area (e.g., sailingclubs, yacht clubs, schools etc...).


SVA probably means crew on other people's race boats.


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## tomandchris (Nov 11, 2009)

solarwindsailor said:


> I think I am going to buy a good dinghy first and have fun as well as read books on sailing. Simultaneously I will join a sailing club to perhaps get on a boat and observe/help.
> 
> I agree shelling out couple a grand $$$$ for lessons is pricey and you may not get the correct teachings. I can't afford it anyway. I feel the classes are more expensive than a college class and we are paying for their charter/expenses beyond the cost of the class.


No problem with your idea to buy a boat and go sailing. Dependent on your goal you do what is best for you.
As to your statement on the cost of classes and paying for the charter/expenses beyond that......do you think the boat and its expenses are free? Of course you pay for the boat as part of the package. However, it is probably still cheaper than chartering the same boat alone.


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## Donna_F (Nov 7, 2005)

solarwindsailor said:


> ...
> I agree shelling out couple a grand $$$$ for lessons is pricey and you may not get the correct teachings. I can't afford it anyway. I feel the classes are more expensive than a college class and we are paying for their charter/expenses beyond the cost of the class.


It doesn't have to be pricey. When I was looking for sailing clubs near you there were a number of ASA sailing schools in your area. When I first started sailing I took a weekend ASA course for under $400.

If I couldn't afford that, I couldn't afford to own a sailboat and my first boat was 22 feet.


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## solarwindsailor (Aug 28, 2014)

Thanks for everyone's help. I will figure out my own way. Sailing isn't expensive; people just love to tack on extra costs, shiny material, brown mahogany wood, sails that have funny cartoons on them, charge bizarre rates for basic instructions that are more expensive than a 4 year college class etc... I want to sail, not show off how rich or poor I am.

Again, thanks for everyone's help.


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## TakeFive (Oct 22, 2009)

DRFerron said:


> When I first started sailing I took a weekend ASA course for under $400.
> 
> If I couldn't afford that, I couldn't afford to own a sailboat and my first boat was 22 feet.


That's a heck of a dinghy!

The guy's strategy is a good one. You can get a used dinghy for as little as 400 dollars. It is a great way to learn, and a viable alternative to lessons.


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## solarwindsailor (Aug 28, 2014)

Thank you. I will definitely be looking to join some sort of a racing club as I read many learn from it inexpensively.



SVAuspicious said:


> Go racing. At worst it's free. Some skippers will buy beer and feed you.


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## SVAuspicious (Oct 31, 2006)

solarwindsailor said:


> I don't own anything yet though to race and I am still trying to figure out whats in my area (e.g., sailingclubs, yacht clubs, schools etc...).


You'll learn more racing other people's boats (OPBs). Check yacht clubs and racing associations. Google is your friend. If you can't find anything come back and ask. Someone here will help you. Racers are always looking for crew. I have to beat those guys back with a stick. *grin*



DRFerron said:


> SVA probably means crew on other people's race boats.


Exactly.


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