# The Politics of Anchoring; Where to Anchor



## JaimesBeam (Jul 18, 2009)

In thinking about living aboard a sailboat, or even taking a long trip,
I often think about anchoring in out of the way places.

I live on the Maine coast.... There are several small harbors near me,
but there's always a waiting list to get a mooring in the harbors.
They are also expensive, up to $1000 for a season. I've thought about
anchoring or mooring my boat nearby, outside of one of these harbors.
Of course it has to be someplace where you have access to the water.

I've heard two different schools of thought. One is that you can anchor
anywhere you wish, outside of an established harbor. In a harbor, you
should use an already installed mooring if available. There are plenty of
places outside of designated harbors where it is safe to anchor, or moor.

The other line of thinking is that you have to clear any anchoring/mooring
anywhere with the town or nearby harbor, or whatever.

I believe legally, you can anchor anywhere. Some people say you can
do that for a couple of days, then you should move on.

What makes a good mooring? I have a small 17 ft daysailer. I'm 
thinking of making a mooring weight of casting some concrete into a 
auto wheel rim. You want it to be heavy enough to hold your boat, but
perhaps the weight could be in several pieces to make it easy to put into
the water, and take out and move.

Jim Baranski


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## kwaltersmi (Aug 14, 2006)

Anchoring is one thing, creating a permanent mooring is another. It sounds like you're creating a mooring, in which case you had better check with the local muncipalities.


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## CaptainForce (Jan 1, 2006)

Expectations differ in different areas of the country, but legally you may anchor anwhere outside of channels, established mooring fields, and restricted areas designated by military use and port authorities or protected enviroments such as coral reefs and some sea grass beds. We frequently anchor from Maine to the Bahamas on the East Coast. Mooring fields are far less common in the south where they is more mud and sand holding in shallow water. If you plan to establish a permanant mooring, then you will need to check local regulation. Take care and joy, Aythya crew


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## JaimesBeam (Jul 18, 2009)

*Semi-Permanent Mooring .vs Anchoring?*

Well, what I'm thinking of is anchoring / mooring my boat out there for a
week or a month. Does it really make a difference if it's an anchor, or a heavier mooring at the end of the chain? In theory, the heavier mooring
would be more secure.

How heavy of a mooring should I have for a 17' daysailer?

Thanks, Jim.


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## CaptainForce (Jan 1, 2006)

A private mooring would remain as your property and be at an established location even when your boat is not there. An anchor departs with the boat. The appropriate mooring or anchor for your boat would depend on the substrate and the fetch, but a 20lb mushroom would likely be more than adequate for a 17' boat. Take care and joy, Aythya crew


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## SVAuspicious (Oct 31, 2006)

JaimesBeam said:


> Does it really make a difference if it's an anchor, or a heavier mooring at the end of the chain?


IANAL, but I believe the answer is yes it does make a difference. An anchor is part of the ship's gear and assumed to be raised and taken with you when you go. A mooring is "installed" and something the ship/boat ties up to. A mooring is presumed to be de facto (more) permanent.

In most states you need a permit to install a mooring. Some places that is harder than others.


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## Craig Smith (Jun 21, 2006)

If you're using an anchor you can say it's an anchor.

So, use an over-sized anchor which you can retrieve.

An auto rim filled with concrete - not sure about that. Most auto rims weigh between 15 and 20 kg (30 - 45 lb), and the concrete won't do much (underwater you need a lot of it to weigh much). It'd probably be okay for the most part but I wouldn't trust it long term. I also don't agree that a 20 lb mushroom would be adequate, probably wants to be a lot bigger than that.

On the other hand a 15 kg / 35 lb anchor of a sensible type with adequate scope and you'll be both secure and able to say it's not a mooring (and able to retrieve by hand, with a bit of effort).


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## mtboat (Oct 14, 2007)

*the politics of anchoring*

One thing caught my attention here. You mentioned a car rim filled with concrete, as a possible mooring block. Don't do it. I seriously doubt it will hold in a blow. I tried this one year with two 5 gallon buckets of concrete with two pieces of rebar crisscrossed and sticking out of/through each one. No holding at all. Almost lost the boat. I went back to anchoring and have never had a problem. Concrete is actually not that heavy.


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## sck5 (Aug 20, 2007)

concrete can be useful as a sort of kellet - I anchor my swim raft off my house like that - it has two actual anchors which attach to a washbasin full of concrete. The chain from the raft goes down to the concrete washbasin. What this does is ensure that the pull on the anchors is always horizontal. Works pretty well if you make sure that there is an anchor out in the direction of any potential big wind.


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## CaptainForce (Jan 1, 2006)

Craig Smith said:


> .......... I also don't agree that a 20 lb mushroom would be adequate, probably wants to be a lot bigger than that.........


You're probably right, but the OP hasn't said more tha the Maine coast and outside the harbor. We don't know the depth of the proposed location or the nature of the bottom or the protection from surrounding land or the density of lobster traps or the number and density of other anchored or moored boats. With the best case scenario the 20lb mushroom would be ideal, but with a host of negatives, the location could be risky with a huge anchor or mooring. There's just no answer without more info, Take care and joy, Aythya crew


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## denverd0n (Jun 20, 2008)

JaimesBeam said:


> I believe legally, you can anchor anywhere.


Maybe in Maine. Not necessarily anywhere else. Each state has their own laws and they vary from state to state. There is most certainly no federal level law that covers this.


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## Craig Smith (Jun 21, 2006)

CaptainForce said:


> You're probably right, but the OP hasn't said more tha the Maine coast and outside the harbor. We don't know the depth of the proposed location or the nature of the bottom or the protection from surrounding land or the density of lobster traps or the number and density of other anchored or moored boats. With the best case scenario the 20lb mushroom would be ideal, but with a host of negatives, the location could be risky with a huge anchor or mooring. There's just no answer without more info, Take care and joy, Aythya crew


I wouldn't put a small dinghy on a 20 lb mushroom anchor in any circumstances if I cared about it, it's just not going to be reliable enough to leave unattended for long time periods. The rest of your points are all on the money though.



sck5 said:


> The chain from the raft goes down to the concrete washbasin. What this does is ensure that the pull on the anchors is always horizontal. Works pretty well if you make sure that there is an anchor out in the direction of any potential big wind.


A kellet, particularly one made from concrete, won't do a thing in any circumstances that are likely to trouble the anchor(s). It might keep your swim platform in one place rather than drifting around in nil wind though, but then so would chain which is what you say you're using.


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## lydanynom (May 26, 2010)

denverd0n said:


> Each state has their own laws and they vary from state to state. There is most certainly no federal level law that covers this.


Has anyone ever found a resource that summarizes this info for all US states, coastlines and the great lakes?


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## JaimesBeam (Jul 18, 2009)

Well, the boat would be in a very sheltered area, Frenchmen's Bay near Sullivan / Sorrento / Hancock. I believe most of the area is mud; lots of clam flats, and the water would be quite shallow. The boat has a swing keel, so it doesn't matter if it grounds...

Around here the preferred mooring is a granite block. I was think more on the 100-200 lb range for a mooring. I like the multiple concrete bucket idea,
especially if you can lift one bucket at a time.

Thanks, Jim


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## JaimesBeam (Jul 18, 2009)

*Wheel hub mooring design*

Actually I was thinking of one of more concrete filled rims with a hole in the
middle. I imagine they would weight at least 50lb each. thread the anchor
line & chain up through the middle, and run another line between them, with
30-50 ft between them to haul them up. Throw rim #1 over the side with the 
anchor line & chain secured to it. Slide the extra rims down the anchor line if 
you need more weight, untill you feel secure. When it's time to leave, just haul 
the rims up one at a time with the auxillary line.

The only thing is to make sure rims are lying flat on the bottom, instead of
on edge or stacked up. That way they will hold onto the bottom plenty well,
at least in mud.

Jim


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## MoontideC30 (Jun 1, 2006)

Regarding the mooring, In California the standard mooring is a railroad wheel or axle with 50 ft of 3/4 inch chain attached to 50 ft of 1/2 inch chain attached to 3/8 chain with a mooring ball. I would be concerned with creating a mooring which may give someone a false sense of security. What if someone with a 40 ft boat decided to borrow your mooring for the night. It would not be pretty.


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## TNDiver (Jul 14, 2010)

Some information to keep in mind. Concrete weighs about 94 pounds per cubic foot. Sea water weighs about 64 pounds per cubic foot so a cubic foot of concrete is buoyed up by a force of 64 pounds of displacement which means the cubic foot of concrete only weighs about 30 pounds when submerged. Wave action on a 17' boat would certainly exert more than 30 pounds on the anchor.


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## SVAuspicious (Oct 31, 2006)

TNDiver is spot on. That's why more and more municipal mooring fields are transitioning to screws.


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## CaptainForce (Jan 1, 2006)

Craig Smith said:


> I wouldn't put a small dinghy on a 20 lb mushroom anchor in any circumstances if I cared about it, it's just not going to be reliable enough to leave unattended for long time periods..........


I can't resist debating this point! You are listed as the "anchorsmith", but could your opinions be influenced by your undisclosed location? If you put a dinghy on a 20lb mushroom with a fair amount of chain before a nylon rode on a 6' bottom with the mud that is common in the SE US in a secluded cove with no more than 200 yards of fetch; then, you would be set for a class I hurricane. The risk would be that the torrential rains could swamp the dinghy, but the mushroom, designed to burow in the mud, would hold. I believe that you are overlooking the point that I was citing "idea"l conditions. Take care and joy, Aythya crew


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## Craig Smith (Jun 21, 2006)

The point of a "mooring" precludes any wishful thinking of ideal conditions, is all. Mushroom anchors don't achieve their proper holding power for some time after deployment, as they need to work their way into the seabed at which point the mushroom itself provides a nice suction that's hard to move. Secondly, most "moorings" want low scope, and can handle it unlike conventional normally sized anchors but only if there's enough dead weight involved. If you use a "fair amount of chain", why not put that weight into the mooring instead? Etc. So, if you want a "mooring", for just about anything and anywhere, chucking down a small mushroom and abandoning the boat is not going to be a wise choice.


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## southwindphoto (Sep 4, 2009)

You mentioned traveling, and anchoring along the way... Florida has passed some new interesting laws, regarding such.

http://staugustine.com/news/local-news/2010-02-09/boaters-angry-about-removal-mooring-balls

is a link to my local community, efforts to install an "official" mooring ball system.

In short, Cities in Florida are now allowed to regulate the waters that are within their city. Some county's are getting in the act, with swift new regulations.. Florida's Key's Monroe County has a new rule that any boat with passenger spending the night must have a black water storage system or one of those sewage discharge cleaning system. And when I was last there three weeks ago, in Key Largo they are already ticking those who do not.


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## hellosailor (Apr 11, 2006)

Jim-
"Actually I was thinking of one of more concrete filled rims with a hole in the
middle. I imagine they would weight at least 50lb each."
WEIGHT DOESN'T MATTER. Ever been to a planetarium and seen one of those displays, where you weight 150# on Earth but only 20# on the moon? And maybe 800 on Jupiter? Weight is a subjective concept. For an anchor to work, it needs to have more density than the water it is submerged in, and concrete, no matter how much you use, is basically the same density as water. It provides next to nothing in terms of anchoring power, unless you get so much of it that the ship can't drag it, because of friction against the bottom.
A fifty pound anchor will more than outperform a 100# block of concrete. Buy an anchor that you can barely lift, whatever that is, that's the best you can do.

If you are anchoring in "navigable waters" you are subject to federal law and the anchoring restrictions are published in the Coast Pilot(s). In a designated anchorage area you have various rights and regulations, depending on the type. If the area is designated on charts as a channel or seaplane taxi area, anchoring is totally illegal.
And in the northeast, you also have state and local anchorage regulations, because there are property rights and titles to the bottom lands that sometimes predate the "United States" and go back to Crown Patents, as well as private bottom lands that the US _sold _during WW2 to raise money.
So you'll need the charts and Coast Pilot(s), available free online courtesy of your tax dollars, and to check with the state of Maine and the local jurisdictions as well.
But forget the concrete, it is useless for anything except cement shoes.


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## sailingbud (Nov 5, 2009)

Mooring blocks. I just saw some granit mooring blocks in Lubec Maine and they were close to 5' long and probably 3'x3' in width and ht. They would not be 100 or 200 lbs. I bet they are pushing more than 1000lbs and if you think how much force a boat is pulling when your anchor rode is stretched close to breaking point, sounding like a guitar string, you might want more.

My first anchor was made from a pot filled with concrete and three window weights poking out in different directions. In hand it gave you a work out but dropped in river sand it was drug by a 19' dinghy in 10 kts of wind. A small danforth on the same boat has never budged and is much easier to raise and stow.

I have to admit the cement pot was more exciting when chasing the boat at a swimming hole.


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## CaptainForce (Jan 1, 2006)

Anchoring is widespread and available without much restriction on the East US Coast from Maine to Florida. Since we bought our first live aboard cruier in 1971 we've frequently anchored and at some times as long a three months at a single location. During these thrity nine years we have never been approached by any authority with any question about our anchoring practice. We tend to anchor in traditionally accepted areas and never in chanels or restricted zones. This, of course, is an annecdotal account and variables and chance could cause others to have different results; however, anchoring in the navigatable waters of the US is supported by federal law. Take care and joy, Aythya crew


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## casioqv (Jun 15, 2009)

If you're going to leave it unattended, you want to go way-overkill on the anchor/mooring. For a mooring, I probably wouldn't consider anything less than a 200-300lb engine block with heavy chain through a cylinder bore. For an anchor, something like a 22# delta at minimum with at least 10:1 scope.

To set a heavy enough mooring, you'll probably need to bring it out with a different type of boat. I don't see any safe way to deploy several hundred pounds of weight from a small daysailor.

Anchoring/mooring isn't the time to see what little you can get away with!


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## JaimesBeam (Jul 18, 2009)

denverd0n said:


> Maybe in Maine. Not necessarily anywhere else. Each state has their own laws and they vary from state to state. There is most certainly no federal level law that covers this.


Is there any place to look up anchoring regulations?

Thanks, Jim


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## JaimesBeam (Jul 18, 2009)

So, my latest mooring fiasco is this...

After having been told concrete is not dense enough, I decided to go the opposite route!

I happened to come across a literal ton of lead. So I melted it down, and cast it in a truck
Rim with a galvanized eyebolt in the center. I haven't been able to weigh it, but I'm guessing 
it must weigh on the order of 500 lbs! I'm thinking it should hold pretty well no matter what ground.
It will naturally lie flat, and resist being moved sideways quite well. Plus being round it makes it easy
to move around, and up and down a ramp if necessary.

Unfortunately my Harbormaster isn't keen on me throwing my lead weight into the water for some reason!?!?
:-/. I suppose I will have to cast it in concrete or weld a casing around it to satisfy him!

Best laid plans...


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## denverd0n (Jun 20, 2008)

JaimesBeam said:


> Is there any place to look up anchoring regulations?


Most states have these things online. To get authoritative information you have to look up the laws for each state separately.



JaimesBeam said:


> Unfortunately my Harbormaster isn't keen on me throwing my lead weight into the water for some reason!?!?


Probably because lead is toxic. Seems to me like a pretty good reason.


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## SHNOOL (Jun 7, 2007)

I'm not sure what fascinates me more... the fact that this is a 6 year old thread that was dredged up (pun intended) or the fact that the OP replied to the 6yo thread with basically a similarly disastrous idea (still).

It was said, not once but several times in the thread. Anchor your 17 foot boat, don't moor it without a permit. Get one of those permits and we'll all be impressed, until then use an anchor... and as others have said, a mushroom anchor is a great lunch hook maybe for a 17 footer, but it's not a week long (month long, or my bigger suspicion is it'll be a seasons long) anchoring device (pronounced temporary mooring).

Also this 17 footer have a proper set of scuppers? How about a bilge pump? Can't tell you the number of small boats I've seen that were day sailors, that someone decided to moor, or dock for lengthy periods, that wound up underwater because either A) the scuppers plugged (or didn't exist) or B) rainwater filled/overfilled the boat until the surrounding water overcame the boat in a chop.


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## MarkofSeaLife (Nov 7, 2010)

JaimesBeam said:


> So, my latest mooring fiasco is this...
> 
> After having been told concrete is not dense enough, I decided to go the opposite route!
> 
> ...


Because, as you fully well know, 500 pounds is not an anchor. It is a mooring.

You know it.

So why try to ******** us or the harbourmaster?

Mark


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## RobGallagher (Aug 22, 2001)

Happy Easter!


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