# Ways to earn money??



## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

I''m new to idea of liveaboard/cruising. Trying to decide if we want to take that lifestyle leap.

My question is...how do people pay for this?
Are most people generaly wealthy? 
What are the ways people are recieving income, or are most people using their retirement funds?

Also...what are some ways to suppliment income while crusing? Charters..that type of thing?

Just curious. I have a passionate heart that''s often cooled by a realistic brain. 
:O)

-D-


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## Dougs/vDancesw/Wind (Oct 15, 2004)

No, most people who do long term / long range cruising & living aboard are not wealthy. Liveabord cruising, particularly on medium sized (or small) cruising sailboats doesn''t seem to very often attract the really well off.

Quiet a few, probably a majority, are what you could call some sort of upper middle class, however. Certainly not all.

Most long distance of long time cruising sailors have gotten a bit of capital together, however. Most are the type that have managed to save some money, whatever their age, compared to many others their same age. (I.e. a philosophy of using money for freedom and experiences as opposed to display or keeping up with someone else.)

A good many are retired, or semi retired. Often early retired, perhaps with a though of possibly going back to work after a while, for a while.

Certainly not all however.

There are a whole lot of younger people, including some in their twenties, who decide to take a year or so off from work. Often they have smaller and older boats that didn''t cost all that much. Still, compared to many their age, they have obviously managed to save more than most.

There are a relatively few people who manage to make a significant amont of money while on the go, usually by writting, often about sailing and traveling. 

There are more who decide they want to extend that year or whatever they had saved to be able to take off, by staying put someplace, living on the boat, and making some money, often by some boating industry related work, or perhaps something related to what they did before. Web site and other computer programing etc. work seems to have more of a labor market in lots of places than there are local people able to fill it. 

Of course there are also people who park themselves on the waterfront of a city. In many places that is actually not all that expensive compared to other ways of living in that city. Yeah, if it''s a second home that is one thing, but if its the only home it''s another. There are even people who don suits each morning and head to "the" office, as they work on paying off their boat loan or whatever.

Best of luck!


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

Thank You for that response. I know i have a lot more reading to do on the subject. 

My wife and i were vacationing in Maui, and after struggeling at the airport to leave, we looked at each other and though "Why not? Why can''t we just sail off and leave the corporate world behind?"
:O)

And the dreamseeds were planted, slowly taking roots. :O)

We''re not that well off, nor are we struggeling. So i wasnt sure if this was something that was a near-future thing, or a far far future thing.

It does depend on your situation...but it''s good to know that lifestyle isn''t just for the rich.
:O)

Thanks again.


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## Paisan (Oct 19, 2004)

Well, I''m with you Oceanmaui. I went on a honeymoon a few yrs ago, and during a "booze cruise" on a 40'' catamaran, first got the idea I could cruise for a while... by the time we were headed back the guy at the helm said to me "you got the right attitude, obviously the skills, AND a good enough gift of gab... I''ll get you a job if you want it." I thought "WOW, he''s almost serious!" I couldn''t even conceive of it. Well, its been 6 yrs, a lot more sailing (including a long charter in the BVI), and a divorce, and I''m a lot closer than ever before.

I have to tell you, I''ve read a ton, watch these boards, and my questions are much the same as yours. I''ve saved more than most people my age, but I''m far from wealthy. People talk about the "big bad corporate world", the "rat race" like IT, in and of itself, is the problem. I think its like any other goal - to succeed in it, is a huge accomplishment, to be proud of. I''ve built a good career. Not a great one, but a good one. And I''m not 100% sure I''m ready to give it up forever. But I''m ready to try it out, and hopefully learn enough to make a better, longer term decision for me.

Guess my point here... why decide to give it all up? Why not take a self-granted sabbatical of say up to a year? If you don''t like it... go back on land and get back to work. Maybe its not as easy as that, but for what it''s worth... that''s kinda my plan.

Good luck!


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

I''ve been in the same job (different employers) for over twenty years. So has my wife. This has involved shift work that keeps us up evenings and nights and takes many weekends. It makes parties, holiday get-togthers and volunteer activities so difficult that we often can''t attend. I haven''t been able to take evening classes or commit to race crewing because of it.

We long for the day when we can set our own schedules and pursue our own interests at our own pace. Even now as we consider our future, we know that the sands, waters and the people (and a few mountains) of the world attract us. My wife says her ideal job would be doing the recount (too much pressure in the initial count) of the grains of sand on the beach. I look forward to having the time to play my sax, paint my pictures, and catch my daily fish and serve it with large quantities of vegetables from the local market.

A friend of mine who sailed the Molly Brown (bought it from Zantzinger) said, "After a couple months of snorkeling, you get kind of board with the same old thing". Not me. Every reef, every school of fish, every coastal community is different, and a couple of months doesn''t blunt my enthusiasm or curiousity. Cultures change perceptibly from town to town.

If you really love the boost that your career gives you and you feel purposeful and fulfilled by it, stay with it. Take your sabbaticals and cruise. (Unfortunately, if my wife or I leave our jobs for as little as a year it will become very difficult to impossible to return to our fields.) But if you''re living to work rather than working to live, there seem to be a few ways to go. Either (1) save up your money and leave (invest if you have to), (2) reschool yourself to a job that is in demand and static enough (such as a skilled trade) that you won''t become so obsolete after a year''s abscence that you will be able to return to it after each cruise, (3) live, to one level or another, on whatever money you can make so that you don''t ever have to return to the States and the nine-to-five.

I met a young American woman in a Central American restaurant who makes ends meet by taking baby-sitting jobs or waiting tables to pay her way. (She speakes fluent Spanish.) Others have taught English to well-off locals. With the right experience and connections, you may be able to make money delivering boats. It is common wisdom that those who are able to fix air-conditioners, marine diesel engines and electrical systems or repair sails can barter goods or earn money in yachting areas. But there are potential legal problems with this and I have seen people who have worked in restaurants or offered catering or sewing services fined by local governments for violating employment and licensing laws and ultimately forced to leave town or the flee the country.

I knew one guy who considered working as a construction foreman for an English-speaking company but this ultimately didn''t pan out. At least part of the problem was his legal work status.

If you can do professional work such as writing or programming you can communicate with land-based US compnaies via the web.

On the other hand, I understand that trying to charter your boat independantly requires quite an investment of time, to grow a reputation, and does not work well for the traveller. I knew one cruising couple who tried to auction off (for charity) a weekend on their boat, but they set their price so high I could see that they really didn''t want to trust their home to anyone else.

In the end, one cruising couple said, "If you really want to do it, you''ll find a way."

Chas.


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## jack_patricia (May 20, 2001)

It''s probably fair to say that one of the topics best illuminated by the reading/listening to the cruising stories of others, sooner or later, is how to earn money while also living aboard and cruising. There are no hard and fast rules that I''ve seen, and yet the quote Chas gave us at the end of his post is exactly what seems to happen, repeatedly, all over the world. In the spirt of sharing a few (additional) examples to build on the data base, here are a couple that pop into my mind and which I don''t see often:
-- if you want to cruise the Caribbean indefinitely, would like to stop and catch your breath in a First World country, enjoy crystal clear water, employer-paid work permits, a employer-contribution retirement plan that''s totally convertible and can be taken with you when you quit, and use your sailor skills to earn an excellent wage, consider sailing to Grand Cayman and seeking employment in/around Georgetown. Dock at the GCYC (really, just a marina...) at a reasonable price, seek work with one of the tour boats, dive boats, or in offices (they have LOTS of offices) that would benefit by your basic computer literacy, accounting, or even writing skills. When last there (2002), there were 6 times more jobs than registered applicants, the island held job fairs to attract workers, and its a delightful place to spend some time.
-- Altho'' it can be a problem to seek work in a poor country or island nation where jobs are scarce and the residents very protective of what employment opportunities do exist, you can find legal employment in some surprising locales. One example is where we''re currently wintering when on the boat: London, England. Supposedly, jobs are a bit scarce and of course the Brits are the World Professionals at rules, forms and barriers. And yet cruising sailors show up there and find both legitimate, above the table jobs (current examples: secretary, facility manager) and under the table jobs (rough carpentry, cash paid each day) at unbelievably high wages due to London''s high cost of living. Moreover, if you actually show up each day on time and really do work when asked to, you''re in the top 10% and bonuses and awards are handed out both monthly and annually. (The Brits are a really great people but, sad to say, their work ethic is generally, ahem...limited).
-- one Brit sailor I know parked his boat in a cruising watering hole (Luperon, DR), purchased a gas-driven generator, and began making CDs with his desk-top computer. His claim was that the DR had no copyright law; in fact, that may be true for a given set of circumstances. But cruising sailors were not too discriminating and nav software, music and other software were being generated daily. When he decided to sail down to Trinidad (another place where you''ll find vendors claiming there is no copyright protection mandated by national law), he just brought his generator with him and continued to generate income.

The only common thread I can see among the many people who end up making a living while cruising is that, by their nature and/or out of necessity, they establish it as a goal and then shape their route and adjust their efforts ashore to make it happen.

Jack


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

Wow!
These stories are really very encouraging!

We know we can''t just rush into something like this, but the thought of having to wait another 20-30 years to achieve it was kind of depressing. :O)

I''m glad there''s options available, and i agree: If you want it, you''ll find a way.

Thanks for all the info!
:O)


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

Here''s what I did in the early 70s to go cruising. Worked as a draftsman for three yrs and saved about $10k. Bought a 7 yr old H-28'' ketch in perfect condition, stocked it for cruising (total cash outlay approx $7k)and quit my job. My wife finished college at the same time and we took off for a year in the Bahamas. The only possession we kept was the car. When we returned I sold the boat for enough to recap the entire cost of boat and trip plus a little cash.

During the cruise I studied for a real estate license and flew back to Florida to take the test. When we returned from the cruise I sold real estate and wife worked as a teacher. I made a big commission selling an orange grove 6 months later and went cruising again...another boat and did another year in the islands. Sold it and paid for the whole trip again.

That was 30 yrs ago and now I''m a re-tread getting ready to do it again in 3-4 yrs. The only difference is I spent the last 20+ yrs in corp America saving 12% a pay period in a 401k. Now I have enough to go cruising on interest earned. I still plan on working enough to pad the existing cruising kitty a little more before taking the plunge again.

I''d say don''t confuse happy cruising with big bank accts and lots of gadets on the boat. We had no electricity or refridgeration and miniminal equipment. There were no reqrets then and none now. That was some of the best times (and poorest financially) of my life. I can''t f''ing wait to do it again without the return trip.


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## HermitScott (Jan 2, 2009)

A 4 year old post. I feel like I am writing to dead people. Any way I probably won't have enough money by the end of the year to run away on my sailboat. But I started daytrading and think that if I have 15k to 25k that I will be able to perpetuate living aboard. All you need is some money, a lap top, and internet. I should be wrapping up 3 years of inventing this spring and summer. Hopefully I won't have to rely on daytrading alone. I live in my shop and save every penny I can so I can live how I want while I am young. After college all my friends went and got jobs, then new cars, a house and ran up the debt. I started a business and started doing things that will pay me when I am not working. I simply can't stand having a job. And that is how laziness will make me financially free! (hopefully)


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## chall03 (Oct 14, 2002)

Best of luck Hermit....I hope you do make it work. I Guess the question is can YOU make money daytrading?? I know people do...but can you?? Your figure seems right....Hows that Catalina 30 of yours going??

BTW, BEWARE of posting to older threads, there are people here that will not approve


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## HermitScott (Jan 2, 2009)

Daytrading was begining to be a costly education, but a few weeks ago I learned some rules and got a little better disciplined. I have made 50% on my total bank over the last 2 weeks. I don't personally know anyone who does it so I am learning on my own, that makes it a little tougher. 

I am looking at getting her wet next month. I put her in the yard and planned on 2 weeks. That was like 5 months ago. lol

I haven't been educated on thread geriatrics yet. I'm sure my turn will come soon. On another site I was berated for constantly talking about drug use. Then someone told the guy that a hookah was a scuba diving device.


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## AjariBonten (Sep 7, 2007)

Indeed, an older thread. However; how about a revival/re-direct?

Let's start with a new premise:

"In this changing economy; what are the new opportunities available for supporting a cruising lifestyle?"

Conversely; "What sorts of things that people had been counting on to support their cruising lifestyle are no longer viable?"

I know, living off the earnings of your 401-k might no longer be an option for the forseeable future; but what else?


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## chall03 (Oct 14, 2002)

Hermit that is hilarious about the Hookah!!
I am personally all for revival of old threads if there relevance or a point....

Best of luck with the daytrading.


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## modul8 (Oct 26, 2008)

I think it's great to ressurect relevant threads, and maintain them. saves us from sifting through dozens of repetitive threads for a sliver of wisdom.


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## xort (Aug 4, 2006)

As long as it makes sense, I see no problem either.

I've been eating sawdust and sh!ttting 2X4's. Stockpiling for the inevitable recovery. I'll make a fortune.


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## mrwuffles (Sep 9, 2008)

xort said:


> As long as it makes sense, I see no problem either.
> 
> I've been eating sawdust and sh!ttting 2X4's. Stockpiling for the inevitable recovery. I'll make a fortune.


So thats what bene saw in NY harbor why didn't you tell us. It was all xort's fault that there are random "logs" roaming down the east river.....


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## xort (Aug 4, 2006)

mrwuffles said:


> So thats what bene saw in NY harbor why didn't you tell us. It was all xort's fault that there are random "logs" roaming down the east river.....


wasn't me, i keep close tabs on my inventory


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## modul8 (Oct 26, 2008)

I'll keep my eye out for log jams in the Detroit River.


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

i'll stick to the Forex


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## Omatako (Sep 14, 2003)

chall03 said:


> BTW, BEWARE of posting to older threads, there are people here that will not approve


It's the classic "rock and a hard place".

If you start a new thread that's been discussed before, you get berated for not doing a search.

If you do the search and then open an old thread you get berated for doing that.

Who cares? If it's interesting - read it, if it's not, don't. No theory of relativity here, it's a simple concept.


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## HermitScott (Jan 2, 2009)

My friend wants to get into forex. He is more of a gambler than me. We aren't starting out with alot of money. Friday he put his entire bank into sirius radio. And doubled his money. Then lost 25% waiting for it to triple. I put some in but considered it like playing the lottery. We won so that was nice.
I couldn't really make enough per trade to make it worth it until I had enough to get margin. Now I can gain(or lose) twice as much. How much cash is needed to get into forex? I can't wait to be chillin on my boat and making trades in the middle of the bay. Hopefully winning trades. I am going to give you guys a hot stock tip, don't tell anyone. My prediction is GBX will drop 4% in the first half of the day, then gain most of it back by the end. If it moves that way I am going to short them after open.
Also keep in mind I have been trading for 2 months, so don't put what's left of your 401k on this and then come looking for me with your facebook flash mob.


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## HermitScott (Jan 2, 2009)

OK GBX dropped over 8% at the begining of the day. I did short it and won a bit. One bit of caution about this stock though. It is so thinly traded that even my $5000 trades affect the price. And the spreads are huge because of that. It gained some back but at the end of the day fell to it's lowest all day. The chances of being able to long this stock tomorrow are good here, however it could keep going lower as it appears we have not seen the bottom to the DOW yet. 
I think that day trading would be a perfect 'job' for a cruising sailor. My trade lasted 10 minutes, then I cash out and jumped back in the bed.


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## Bene505 (Jul 31, 2008)

oceanmaui said:


> ...Also...what are some ways to suppliment income while crusing? ...


Diving services, things like retrieving stuck anchors. (And of course selling abandoned anchors that you find.)

One couple I've talked with sold ice. He was in the refrigerator business and had a monster icemaker on board. He would sell ice in the bahamas, probably in remote places. $3 a bag IIRC. I think it was an honor system when he wasn't there.

Of course, having a generator or a big wind generator and lots of solar would be necessary. It would make for a great dump load. Edit: He may have used the engine to drive a compressor.


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

Wouldn't he need a water maker to do this???



Bene505 said:


> Diving services, things like retrieving stuck anchors. (And of course selling abandoned anchors that you find.)
> 
> One couple I've talked with sold ice. He was in the refrigerator business and had a monster icemaker on board. He would sell ice in the bahamas, probably in remote places. $3 a bag IIRC. I think it was an honor system when he wasn't there.
> 
> Of course, having a generator or a big wind generator and lots of solar would be necessary. It would make for a great dump load. Edit: He may have used the engine to drive a compressor.


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## Bene505 (Jul 31, 2008)

sailingdog said:


> Wouldn't he need a water maker to do this???


Yes, I think that was part of the setup.

I can track them down if anyone's interested.


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## vega1860 (Dec 18, 2006)

I don't so much day-trade as manage my investments. Everyone I know who relies on a "Professional" to manage their money is going broke. Friends who thought they would retire this year have had to put their plans on hold indefinitely but we are doing fine.

It doesn't really take much money to cruise. Its sitting in a marina that eats up the cash.

But different strokes eh? Some people need a flashy yacht, stylish clothes and lots of social interaction. That means hanging around marinas in population centers where others can be suitably impressed with your boat and you can go to parties at the yacht club etc. and that takes lots of $$$

We prefer the challenges of a long voyage and the solitude of deserted anchorages which, by fortunate coincidence, are free but you can (We do) enjoy an occasional sojourn in a marina with all its benefits like internet and email access, employment etc. (hot showers, cold beer, laundry)...

Latest Video


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## Gryzio (Dec 13, 2007)

*I do what I can do*

There many ways a person can make money. I try to keep this short.

1. Stocks and FOREX. If the pros really knew anything they would not need my money.

I use a simple no greed approach. Buy low sell high and do not try to think you get rich in one day, it not happen. 

 But, with a no stress approach a person can slowly build up. Even $1 a day makes $30 in a month. 

I use Scottrade (Stocks) and Oanda (FOREX) both not require an arm and a leg to start.

2. Good 'ol hard work.  I can do carpentry and mechanics. Have the basic tools for both.

It easy to sit in a Bar and have a few drinks and meet new friends. It never fails that soon someone ask; what work you do? 

Last time someone ask that question? ................. I built a Deck for a lady. She already had the materials. Replaced a guy's Struts on his car. He did have to provide me with a jack. 

It easy to make money, if, a person want to work. Dang, I almost afraid to go into a Bar to relax ............ I may have to work for my Beer. :laugher

Well, I hope this helps. Just do what you can do.


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## vega1860 (Dec 18, 2006)

True story:

I was unemployed, drinking beer in a bar one afternoon, considering my options and had to take a leak. While visiting the facility I couldn't help notice how filthy it was so I mentioned it to the bartender, who turned out to be the owner, and asked what he was doing about keeping the place clean. Not much, obviously. To make a long story shorter, we struck a deal, I borrowed his mop, bucket and hose and $20 for chemicals and cleaned both restrooms. He was impressed and asked if I would do the whole bar after closing and we agreed on a price. That led to a monthly contract of daily cleaning. He added his other business, a retail shop, to the contract. Skills I had learned in the Army had put cash in my pocket. Who knew?  

By the end of the first week the bar's regulars started asking if I would clean their businesses and homes. A small business was born! I bought a truck, hired help. The business grew.

What had I done  

Thinking fast, I sold the business and bought a boat.

I feel so much better now


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

Gryzio said:


> I use Scottrade (Stocks) and Oanda (FOREX) both not require an arm and a leg to start.
> 
> .


Oanda.com is who I use and am doing great but I do not day trade you have to have nerves of steel or be brain dead to day trade the forex.

Learn a couple of stratigies and stick to them you do not have to know them all just know the ones you use verry well. even if it is as simple as a "gimmie" or a sma/wma cross measured aginst the cci, or even the Ichmoku Kinko Hyo.

all stratigies do not work on all pairs. What works on the pound euro will most likley cost you on a more volitle pair like the jap USD.

Dont try to trade to many pairs, pict 2 or 3 and watch them. There is enough action in a pair that you can make it well enough.

start small, sit down and figgure out what you want to sustain the groth you want to achieve. i want 50% groth a month, thats my goal and it is reachable. Thats only 2.5% of the total a day, with a 3000.00 starter account thats only 75. a day. I do fall short and there are days I dont even find a trade I like. but no biggie

find a free account and learn how before you loose your a%s, 95% of the people that trade the forex LOOSE. Its a fact that cannot be understated.

If you dont know the outcome, dont make the trade

Oanda has a exclent free game account it is for life and you can add more money if you need to.

there is a utility that is also free thats called MetaTrader4 it is usefull for backtesting stratigies if you think you have something that will work. But dont be dissapointed as no system works forever so read the results and find out why it failed.

I am not a fan of trading signal generators, your betting your money on someone's ability to read the market for you. regaurdless of past history they get expensive. but if you want to start out get a free trial and see what the predictors are and try to figgure out why they come up with the prediction they did. Thats how I started and it helps a lot.

Dont spend money you dont have to. I seen a system on tv a few years back and checked into it, the program was $4000.00 US. You can do everything with the forex for free. and if you pay attention to the news it is even easier.

ok I am out have fun all and happy trading.


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## okawbow (Feb 15, 2007)

There are small craft items, such as fishing lures, that can be hand made on a boat. Learn how to make and sell handmade items, and you can take that skill anywhere.


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## HermitScott (Jan 2, 2009)

My friend and I did some practice trades on forex. I used a technique I use for stocks and out practice with $500 turned$2000 that day. That makes me want to get into it. I was unaware that 95% of people lose! 
In stocks I am not greedy if I can scap $50 or $60 I am happy. If it runs smoothly, I wait until it turns against me to get out.


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