# Boats for crossing the Pacific



## killarney_sailor (May 4, 2006)

There seem to be an infinite number of discussions about boats suitable for extended bluewater cruising. Thought I would try something a bit different. I went through the database of boats on the Yahoo groups' Pacific Puddle Jumpers group for this year and next (obviously incomplete). We don't know if these boats actually went (or will go) but they are listed by owners who intend to go from somewhere on the western shore of the Americas (US to Peru) to French Polynesia. This destination involves a passage of at least 3000 nm (Galapagos to Marquesas) for almost all of the boats.

The complete list follows, but here are a few summary comments. There are 109 boats in the list with 98 monohulls and 11 multis (including one tri). The variety of models is remarkable with only one boat having more than 2 in the list (3 Valiant 40s). As well, there are only 10 others with 2 examples on the list. Most common builder is Hunter, but this still is only 4 boats. This means that there about 100 different models listed! 

Biggest is a Gulfstar 68 and the smallest is a Contessa 32. Among the monohulls there are 26 in the 30 to 39' range, with 60 in the 40 to 49' range, 11 in the 50 to 59' range and one in the 60+. I did not work out a median length but it would appear to be around 45'

Prices range from perhaps $25k Pearson 10m the cheapest) to considerably more than $1 million (Oyster 56).

Let the discussion commence.


MONOHULLS (98)
Alden 54
Alm.(?) 38
Atlantic 48
Baba 40
Beneteau 39.3, 46, 461
Bristol 45.5
Brolga 33 (Aussie boat?)
C & C 41
Cal 36, 39
Cape North 43
Catalina 42, Morgan 440
Choate 40
Chung Hwa Magellan 36
Contessa 32
Contest 48
Corbin 39
CSY 44
Cutter 46’ LWL
Dreadnought 32
Ericson 38, 39
Elliot 45
FD 12 (50’)
Flying Dutchman 37
Gozzard 36
Gulfstar Sailmaster 47, 68
Halberg Rassy 352
Hans Christian 33 (2)
Hunter 45cc, 466, 49 (2)
Hylas 47
Ingrid 38 (2)
Irwin 52
Island Trader 46
Islander 36
Island Packet 40
Joe Adams Naut 40
Jeanneau Sun Odyssey 45.2
Kelly-Peterson 44
Ketch 44’ (2)
Lafitte 44
Le Comte 45
Liberty 458
Lidgard 49
Lyman Morse 54
Magellan 36
Mason 33
Morgan 384, Out Island 41, Out Island 51
Ohlson 38
Outbound 44, 46
Oyster 485, 56
Pacific Seacraft 37, 40
Panda 40
Pan Oceanic 46
Passport 40, 47
Passport Peterson Custom 45
Pearson 10M (33’)
Saga 43 (2)
Santa Cruz 50
Selestra 50
Slocum 43
Sloop 32, 40, 45
Spencer 53
Sunbeam 53
Swan 41
Tartan 37, 412
Tayana 37, 42 (2)
Valiant 40 (3)
Van de Stadt 50
Warner Channel Cutter
Wauquiez Pretorien 35
Westsail 42

MULTIHULLS (11)
Catamaran 45
Catana 431
Horstman Tristar 40
Jaguarcat 36
Lagoon 380 (2), 440
Rainier 46
Seawind 1160 (38')
Shuttleworth 44
Switch 51


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## jackdale (Dec 1, 2008)

I am not sure what exactly you are looking for. I have sailed on 4 of the boats listed: the C&C 41,
the Hunter 45cc and the Beneteau 393 and 461.

The Beneteaus were charter versions with lineal galleys, of which I am not a big fan offshore.

The C&C 41, an older model, would be OK offshore with some modifications:

Bolt in the windows (the one I sailed has windows held in with silicone and leaked, and would not likely stand a big wave)
Some galley mods, including a harness.
Lee clothes for proper sea berths.

I would not take the Hunter into blue water. I was on one in June on atrip around the top of Vancouver Island. Problem areas:

No backstay - I just like additional mast support
No proper sea beths and hard to retrofir lee clothes. The aft cabin was useless.
An RV stove on which the oven handle prevented gimballing, the pot holders were on the cooking surface level and useless, and no lips on the oven racks.
Loose floorboards that become missiles underway.
Insufficient hand holds below.

I have sailed an Elite 37 and C&C 44 to the PNW from Haiwaii. The 37 was a bit small, the C&C was stripped out for racing. I helped deliver a Hylas 46 from RI to St Barths - the lack of sea berths was problematic.

How the boats are modified and prepped is a serious consideration. But you need to start with a decent platform.

You need to look at what you consider essential. Everything from the galley configuration to the location of heads becomes important.

Jack


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## blt2ski (May 5, 2005)

I know of three J boats that are in the process of doing the trip or equal. a J 109, 37c and 105. I a sure there are others too. A Jeanneau SO 49ip did a 2 yr from Seattle to Oz and back too. 

Reality is, MANY boats over 32-35' can do an ocean crossing, depending upon the how it is built, floorplan, tankage etc. Including some that have no engine, can not remember the couple that has a boat local here in Puget SOund, and another in New Zealand. Famous, but name escapes me........

Then again, a few rigs have gone from Ca to hawaii that most would not take at times. Weather and if you do it in the summer vs hurricane/storm time, be it fall or winter.........

Marty


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## jackdale (Dec 1, 2008)

blt2ski said:


> Including some that have no engine, can not remember the couple that has a boat local here in Puget SOund, and another in New Zealand. Famous, but name escapes me........
> 
> Marty


Lin and Larry Pardey. Sailing Blog | Nautical Book Authors | Lin & Larry Pardey


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## chall03 (Oct 14, 2002)

While I do love their philosophy and certainly put parts of it into practice, I think it is fair to say that the Pardeys are probably not the 'average' cruising couple....

This is an interesting thread, good food for thought.


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## blt2ski (May 5, 2005)

Thank you Jack!

I'm probably with Chall, not my first cup o tea for how to cross an ocean, ie engine less!

But then again, I would probably take my Jeannea Arcadia across a pond, needs a few things to make it safer if you will. but the design itself is fine, even if from 85, and barely not quite 30'! 

That is me. Others would say no way in hell! life goes on!

As I recall, a catalina 27 or two has circumnavigated, Robin lee Grahm almost got around in an IOR 1/4 ton style boat.........

marty


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## newhaul (Feb 19, 2010)

the boat robin graham made the trip in was a lapworth gladiator 24. so 24 is not to small just may not be the most comfortable. there have been smaller ones to make the circle.


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

There are a lot of boats that are capable of doing a Pacific crossing that aren't on that list.


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## puddinlegs (Jul 5, 2006)

sailingdog said:


> There are a lot of boats that are capable of doing a Pacific crossing that aren't on that list.


Yep... no Amel Super Maru's, Larger HR's, Cal 40's, Olson 40's, SC 52's, most S&S Swans, Baltics, etc.... the list of missing boats is very long.


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## SimonV (Jul 6, 2006)

Just about any thing that floats will do a pacific crossing east to west, in the other direction you need a seriously strong boat to take the hammering it will get from the trades and the swell that goes with them.


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## Ilenart (Jul 23, 2007)

Killarney,

I did a similar exercise a couple of years ago summarising yachts that registered for the Darwin to Indonesia rally, as this includes many Aussie cruising boats, plus lots of international yachts doing the rally as part of a circumnavigation. The sheer diversity of sizes and types of yachts was the thing that surprised me. Of the 557 yachts that registered between 2002 and 2008 the most common design represented only 33 boats (Roberts) and the 2nd most common design was 17 boats (Halberg Rassy). Sizes ranged from 23 ft to 80 ft. There is an almost endless range of yachts out there and it is very hard to draw conclusions on "typical" cruising yachts. Top yachts on the list were.

Design	- No
Most common length​ 1st	2nd	3rd​
Roberts - 33	44	43	38​Halberg Rassy - 17	40	42​Adams - 12	40​Amel - 11	52	53​Beneteau	- 10	38	45​Tayana -	9	37	42	48​Oyster -	7	53​Jeanneau -7 
Island Packet - 7	45	40​Herreshoff - 6	35​Najad	- 6	44​
Earlier this year I was right into planning a trans Pacific trip that would of entailed travelling around 7,000 NM to complete the trip, before ill health changed my plan. My selected vessel was a Tayana 37 for the trip. However it really is personal preference and there was easily a 100 other types and sizes of yachts that I could of picked for the trip.

Ilenart


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## chall03 (Oct 14, 2002)

Ilenart, I would be interested to see that whole list if you have it still.


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## Ilenart (Jul 23, 2007)

Chall,

it's a bit rough & the format is a bit crappy, but here goes!

Ilenart

Design	Length
Adams	40
Adams	40'
Adams	40ft
Adams	42'
Adams	52'
Adams	56'
Adams 40	40'
Adams 42	40 ft
Adams 45	45'
Adams 45 45'
Adams 66	66'
Adams A40	40'
Alajuela 38	44 ft
Alan Pape	37 ft
Alan Warwick	44'
Alden	50 ft
Allan Mason	41'
Allegro	26 ft
Amazon Sloop 37'
Amel	39 Feet
Amel	39 Feet
Amel	46'
Amel	53'
Amel 41'
Amel Mango 52'
Amel Maramu	52 ft
Amel Maramu 47'
Amel Maramu 52'
Amel Maramu 2000	53'
Amel Sharki 40'
Aphrodite	41 Feet
Atkinson	50
Atkinson 15M	49'
Avance 36	36'
Baba 30 33'
Barens	39'
Barnett Offshore 65'
Bavaria	42'
Bavaria 38 40'
Bavaria 42	42 ft
Bavarian	46ft
Beale	32
Benateau	38 Feet
Benateau	45 Feet
Beneteau	38'
Beneteau 375	37'
Beneteau 393	40'
Beneteau 435 44'
Beneteau F5	45 ft
Beneteau First 456 46'
Beneteau Oceanis 38'
Beneteau Oceanis 250	34 ft
Benford	36 Feet
Berret Racoupeau	49'
Birdsall	53'
Birdsall/Bakewell	70'
Blueseas 50	50'
Boden South Seas 40'
Bollard	49'
Bowman	47'
Breeon	36'
Brewer	37'
Brewer 43	44ft
Bristol 41	41'
Bruce Farr	56 ft
Bruce Farr 65'
Buhler	45'
Buizen 48	48'
Buizen 48 48'
Cabo Rico	46 Feet
Cairns Custom 65'
Cal	39'
Cal 2-29 29'
Cal 3-46	46'
Cal2/46	46'
Calypso 42 42'
Camelot	40 ft
Camper and Nicho..	54'
Cape Dory	40 ft
Carbineer	46 ft
Cartwright	44 Feet
Cascade 36	36'
Cascade 36	36'
Cassidy 55	55
Cassidy 55	55'
Cassidy 55	55 Feet
Catalina	40'
Catalina	47 ft
Catalina 42 37'
Catamaran	33'
Catamaran	38'
Catamaran	43'
Catamaran	50'
Catana 431	43 ft
Catana 471	47 ft
Cavalier 32 32'
Cavalier 395	39'
Cavalier 395 40'
Cavalier 45	45'
Celestial	48 ft
Centre Cockpit	34 ft
Centre Cockpit	51 Feet
Chamberlain	38'
Cherokee Catamaran 40'
Chincogan 520 52'
Chuck Paine	62 ft
Chuck Paine 45'
Columbia	45 ft
Columbie 451	45'
Contest 38 38'
Contest 43	43 ft
Contest 44 44'
Corbin	36'
Corbin	38 ft
Corbin 39	39'
Corsair 3600	36'
Cougar Catamaran 47'
Countess 37	37'
Crealock Pacific	36'
Cross Trimaran	36'
Crossbow 40	40 ft
Crowther	39 ft
Crowther	40'
Crowther	42;
Crowther	46 ft
Crowther	49'
Crowther	50'
Crowther	56'
Crowther 85	54'
Crowther 85 45'
Crowther Catamaran	48'
Crowther Eureka	33'
Crowther Windspeed	39'
Crowther Windspeed 40'
CT 34	33 ft
CT 49 49'
Cumulant	39 Feet
Davidson 37	37'
Dean	38'
Deerfoot	61
Deerfoot 62	62 ft
Deerfoot 74PH 74'
Dehler 41 40'
Dehler 41DS 41'
Design	Length
Devries	34
Dick Newick Native	38'
Diesel Duck 462 48'
Discovery	43'
Dix 38 38'
Don Brook	54 ft
Doug Pedersen	47 ft
Downeaster	45'
Dubois	80'
Dufor	54'
Dufour	35 ft
Dufour 395 40'
Easton	40 ft
Easton 43 43'
Easy	36'
Endurance	35 Feet
Endurance 35 37'
Engholm Boat	35 ft
Fantasi 44	44'
Farr	39'
Farr	40 Feet
Farr	46'
Farr 1104	36'
Farrier 41 41'
Farrrier	31'
Fastback 43	43'
Feltz	38'
Flint	51 ft
Fontaine Pajot	40'
Formosa 46 45'
Formosa 47	47 ft
Founaine Pajot	41 ft
Fountain Pijot 42'
Fountaine Pajot 56'
François Chevalier	46'
Frans Maas	48 Feet
Freres	38 ft
Frers	48'
Ganley	46 Feet
Ganley Pacemaker 40'
Ganley Tara 39 40'
Garcia Passoa 47	47'
Gib Sea 40'
Gib Sea 402	39'
Gibsea 126 42'
Grainger	46
Grainger	43'
Grainger	52'
Grainger 420 42'
Grainger 430	42'
Grainger 52	52'
Grainger MC420 42'
Grand Soleil	39ft
Granger	42'
GRP Sloop	43 ft
Gulf Star 50	50 Feet
Gulfstar	43'
Gulfstar 50	50 ft
Haag	48'
Hakker	44'
Hallberg Rassy	30
Hallberg Rassy 33
Hallberg Rassy	34

Hallberg Rassy 35 35
Hallberg Rassy 352	35

Hallberg Rassy	36
Hallberg Rassy 36	36
Hallberg Rassy	37
Hallberg Rassy	38
Halberg Rassy	39
Halberg Rassy 40
Hallberg Rassy 40
Hallberg Rassy 40
Hallberg Rassy 42
Hallberg Rassy 42
Hallberg Rassy 49
Hallberg Rassy	52
Hans Christian	50'
Hans Christian	51'
Hans Christian	52'
Hans Christian 48	48 ft
Hanse 371 DS 37'
Hartley	50 ft
Hereshoff	52'
Herreschoff	35 ft
Herrescoff	35 ft
Herreshoff	35'
Herreshoff	40 Feet
Herreshoff	47'
Hill	50
Hood	23
Hood	38 Feet
Hortsman	38'
Hunter	45'
Hutting	45'
Hylas	49'
Hylus	48 Feet
Hywel Price 36'
Island Packet	40'
Island Packet	40ft
Island Packet	45'
Island Packet	45 Feet
Island Packet 42'
Island Packet 45'
Island Packet 485	52 ft
Island Spirit 37'
Janneau	37'
Jarkan 10.5	34'
Jarkan 10.5 35'
Jarkin	41
Jeaneau Sunkiss	45 ft
Jeanneau	40'
Jeanneau	42 ft
Jeanneau	47 ft
Jeanneau 43DS 43'
Jeanneau Espace 36'
Jeanneau Sun Fizz	37'
Jeantot	43 ft
Jim Young	42'
Jim Young 41'
John Pugh 50'
Kahn Walker	28.8
Kalik	40'
Kappa San Yawl	34 ft
Kaufmann	50'
Kelly Peterson 44 44'
Kennex	42'
Ketch	49'
Ketch	50 ft
Ketch	53'
Ketch	56'
Kirk Amel 36'
Koopmans 43	43'
Kronos 45	45'
Ladd 48	48
Lagoon	47'
Lagoon 380 38'
Lagoon 410 40'
Laurance Gills	48 ft
Lauren	49 Feet
Laurent Giles 48'
Lavranos	43 ft
Lavranos	45 ft
Lavranos	50'
Lawrence Giles	50 ft
Leopard 42 41'
Liberty 49	54 ft
Lidgard	45'
Lidgard	45 ft
Lidgard 42	42'
Lidgard 44	44ft
Lightwave 38 38'
Magellan 36	36 ft
Magnum Baltic	42 ft
Malcom Tennant	40'
Maple Leaf 48	48 ft
Marco Polo	55 Feet
Marie Tanton 26'
Mason 48	47 ft
Maxi 108	35 ft
Mayotte	46 ft
Mon 391	38'
Monte Video	43 Feet
Montevideo 43 43'
Moody	40 ft
Moody	42'
Moody 376	37 ft
Moody 42	40 ft
Mooring 51 51'
Morgan	40 ft
Morgan	51'
Morgan	53'
Motor Sailer 46'
Motor Sailor	77 Feet
Mottle 33	33 ft
Mull 45	44 ft
Mummery Millenium	54'
Mutt	43'
Najad	32 ft
Najad	33'
Najad	39ft
Najad 440	44'
Najad 441	44 ft
Najad 650	34 ft
Nauticat 331 34'
Nauticat 43 43'
Niagra 35	35 ft
Noon Ocean	44 ft
Norlin 34 34'
Norseman 447	44 ft
Norseman 447	44 ft
Norseman 447	44 ft
Norseman 447 44'
Northshore 370 37'
Northshore 46	46 ft
Northwind 36 36'
Not Given	47 ft
OC 35	35 ft
Oceanic 46	46 ft
Oceanic 46 46'
Oceanis 45	41 ft
Oege Karbling	42 ft
O'Kell	52'
Olympic	40'
Oram	45'
Orams	52
Orion	48 ft
Ovni / Alubat 42'
Own Design	40'
Oyster	42 ft
Oyster	43'
Oyster 53 53'
Oyster 53 55'
Oyster 55 55'
Oyster 56	56'
Oyster 62	62 Feet
Pacific	38'
Pacific Seacraft	31 ft
Pacific Seacraft 40'
Panda 40 40'
Passport 42	40 ft
Paul Lucas	60
Pearson	36'
Pearson 386	38 Feet
Pearson 424	42'
Perry	42 Feet
Perry Passport	44 Feet
Perry/Tatoosh	42 ft
Pescott Whitehaven	37 ft
Pescott Whitehaven 42'
Peter Hatfield	41'
Petersen 46	44 ft
Peterson 44 44'
Phil Curran	47 ft
Pouvreau	38'
Privelege 47 Cat 37'
Prout	34'
Prout 45 45'
Pugh Fairwind 46'
Pugh Northern Star	42'
R J Salthouse	41
Radford 450 45'
Ray Richards	41 Feet
Reinke 13 46'
Reinke 16 52'
Rival 41	41'
Rival 41 41'
Robert Clark	50 Feet
Roberts	36'
Roberts	37'
Roberts	38'
Roberts	40'
Roberts	40'
Roberts	42'
Roberts	43 Feet
Roberts	43 ft
Roberts	44'
Roberts	44'
Roberts	44 Feet
Roberts	45'
Roberts	55'
Roberts 36'
Roberts 48'
Roberts Spray	36 ft
Roberts 345 34'
Roberts 370	39'
Roberts 39	41'
Roberts 434 43'
Roberts 44	44 ft
Roberts 53 53'
Roberts Mauritius	42'
Roberts Mauritius	45'
Roberts Mauritius 44'
Roberts Offshore	38'
Roberts Offshore	38'
Roberts Offshore	43 ft
Roberts Offshore	44'
Roberts Offshore 45'
Roberts Spray	37'
Roberts Spray 36'
Roberts Spray 40'
Roger Hill	48 Feet
Rogers Evolution 36'
Ron Holland 44'
Ron Holland 52'
Runn 37 37'
RW 41 43'
S&S	37 Feet
S&S	40'
S&S	43'
S&S	43 Feet
Sadler	34'
Salar 40	39 ft
Salthouse	49'
Savage 43	42 ft
Saxe 38	40 ft
Schionning	40'
Schionning	44'
Sciomachen	68 Feet
Scorpion 3 44'
Seawind 1160 38'
Serendipity	43 ft
Shawn Arber	38 ft
Shearwater 39	39'
Shearwater 39 39'
Simpson Cat	38'
Simpson Seadrive	35'
Slocum	43'
Sloop	35'
Sloop	36 Feet
Solaris 42 42'
South Coast 36 36'
Spencer 1330	43 Feet
Spencer 1330	44 ft
Spray	44'
Spray Carvel 43'
Sprited 380 38'
St Francis	43 ft
St Francis 44 44'
Stevens	50 ft
Stevens 47	47 ft
Stewart Ganley	52'
Stroud 44 44'
Sunbeam	42'
Suncat 40 40'
Sundeer	60'
Sundeer 60 60'
Super Maramu	51 ft
Super Maramu 52'
Super Maramu 53'
Swan 431	43ft
Swan 44	44 ft
Swanson	38'
Swanson	38'
Swanson	40'
Swanson	45'
Sweden Yachts	36 Feet
Tanton 44	44ft
Tartan 41	41 Feet
Taswel 43	43 Feet
Taswell	43 Feet
Tayana	37 Feet
Tayana 37 37'
Tayana CT37 40'
Tayana V 42 42'
Tayana 42	42 ft
Tayana 47/48 48'
Tayana 48 48'
Tayana	52 ft
Tayana	60'
Ted Brewer 44'
Townson	47 '
Transpac 49	49'
Trawler Yacht 52'
Trintella 38 38'
Twin Peak 45 45'
v.d. Stadt Caribean	40'
Vagabond	53 Feet
Vagabond 42 47'
Valiant	50'
Valiant 40	40 ft
Valiant 40	40 ft
Valiant 42 42'
Van De Stadt	35 ft
Van de Stadt	35 ft
Van de Stadt	37 ft
Van De Stadt	40'
Van De Stadt 40'
Vancouver 25	25'
VanDe Stadt Seal 40'
Vanguard 950 31'
Warick 50	54'
Warick 50 50'
Warrior	40 ft
Warrior	40 ft
Warrior 40	40'
Warwick	39 ft
Warwick 55	55
Wauquiez	31 ft
Westerly	31 Feet
Westerly Conway	35'
Westerly Oceanlord	40'
Westsail 32	32'
Westsail 32 39'
Wharam Tiki 38 38'
Wharram	41 ft
Wilf O'Kell	47'
William Garden	52 Feet
William Garden 40'
Yorktown 35'


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## chall03 (Oct 14, 2002)

Thankyou. Very Interesting....
A Hood 23? ummm Wow.


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## remetau (Jan 27, 2009)

Our long term goal is to take our Hans Christian 33 around the world.


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## killarney_sailor (May 4, 2006)

*Not meant to be a definitive list*



puddinlegs said:


> Yep... no Amel Super Maru's, Larger HR's, Cal 40's, Olson 40's, SC 52's, most S&S Swans, Baltics, etc.... the list of missing boats is very long.


I was not suggesting that this list is all of the boats that are capable of crossing the Pacific - rather that these are the boats that are/will be doing it and who happened to be part of this group. The remarkable thing is how many different boats there are (with dozens more possible - the 2011 list grows each week) and how little agreement there is on 'best' boat or even best type of boat for this sort of trip.


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

I notice that as years have gone by, the average size of the cruising boat is going up. That doesn't make the smaller ones that have historically been used any less seaworthy.... I think part of the problem is that the average skills of the sailors involved has decreased over time as the size of the boats has increased. IMHO, it is more difficult to make a long passage on a smaller boat, and it generally requires far more actual sailing skills. 

Just look at all the sailors who go out and pull the trigger on their EPIRB when it really isn't necessary.


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## bljones (Oct 13, 2008)

SD, I think part of the issue is that we cruisers demand more creature comforts today than we did 4 decades ago, and with more stuff you need more size. The same thing has happened with houses, RVs, etc. For example, in the 60s/ early 70s the motorhome of choice was a VW Westfalia- now, no manufacturer would dare to build an RV that small- where would you put the microwave and the A/C? Few of us are happy with a small boat.


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

That may be true as well, but I still think that a lowered level of seamanship is still an issue-look at all the GPS induced accidents that have occurred because the Nintendo generation of sailors couldn't use the Mark I eyeball and other, more traditional methods of navigation.



bljones said:


> SD, I think part of the issue is that we cruisers demand more creature comforts today than we did 4 decades ago, and with more stuff you need more size. The same thing has happened with houses, RVs, etc. For example, in the 60s/ early 70s the motorhome of choice was a VW Westfalia- now, no manufacturer would dare to build an RV that small- where would you put the microwave and the A/C? Few of us are happy with a small boat.


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## dhays (Jul 9, 2010)

sailingdog said:


> That may be true as well, but I still think that a lowered level of seamanship is still an issue-look at all the *GPS induced accidents* that have occurred because the Nintendo generation of sailors couldn't use the Mark I eyeball and other, more traditional methods of navigation.


Yeah, those GPS things are dangerous. Just like auxiliary power, AIS, VHF radio, and those darn newfangled radar things.


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

GPS units are a tool, and not a panacea to navigation issues. They're only as good as the charts they're based on. Too many people interpret the icon in the chartplotter as their actual position but it isn't. It is a calculated position in a mapmaker's interpretation of the world that may or may not be accurate.


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## dhays (Jul 9, 2010)

sailingdog said:


> GPS units are a tool, and not a panacea to navigation issues. They're only as good as the charts they're based on. Too many people interpret the icon in the chartplotter as their actual position but it isn't. It is a calculated position in a mapmaker's interpretation of the world that may or may not be accurate.


Oh, I get that. But how many sailors have been lost because they relied on "traditional" navigation techniques? Charts now, at least those that have been updated, are a lot more accurate than those used by our more traditional forebears. Even the 60 meters circle of uncertainty that you can get with a GPS is a lot more accurate than many of the traditional charts.

Sailors have always used the latest in technology to navigate. The need for accurate navigation has been the spur for development in optics, mathematics, and time pieces.

I agree though, that doesn't mean we don't have to keep our eyes open and use some common sense. Also it helps to have at our disposal a wide range of options so if that nifty bit of technology fails, we have alternatives.


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## jackdale (Dec 1, 2008)

Chartplotters with vector charts tend to be worse than the charts on which they are based. In the Gulf Islands I have seen many errors on the chartplotters on the boats I use for instruction and on my handheld GPS:


Military exercise area WK just south of Victoria is shown as a wreck.
The port hand bifurcation day deacon on Atkins reef is shown as a standard lateral daybeacon.

These are just two examples that come readily to mind.

Because the chartplotters often shown me on land when I am anchored stern-to or going through a narrow channel, I use SD's mark I eyeball in those situations.

I do use chartplotters, radar, VHF, etc.; but I also teach their limitations.

I just did a trip with one student who was staring at the chartplotter so much, I turned it off for the last day as we went from Bedwell Harbour to Sidney on a bright sunny day using paper charts.

Some time ago I started another thread on this topic http://www.sailnet.com/forums/seamanship/60925-trust-your-eyes-not-gps.html


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## killarney_sailor (May 4, 2006)

I think that there may be another reason why the size of cruising boats is increasing - the age of cruisers has increased quite a bit and people a) can often afford a more costly boat and b) want more comforts. My wife, who suggested that we do a circum, insisted that we needed a bigger boat than our Niagara 35.


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## T37Chef (Oct 9, 2006)

Could any of those boats cross the Atlantic too?


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

*Damn, that explains why I have trouble seeing occasionally. * I really wish you'd get your own damn Mark I eyeball and stop borrowing mine. 



jackdale said:


> Chartplotters with vector charts tend to be worse than the charts on which they are based. In the Gulf Islands I have seen many errors on the chartplotters on the boats I use for instruction and on my handheld GPS:
> 
> 
> Military exercise area WK just south of Victoria is shown as a wreck.
> ...


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## killarney_sailor (May 4, 2006)

*Could they cross the Atlantic?*



T37Chef said:


> Could any of those boats cross the Atlantic too?


Only in reverse since they are all facing westward


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## ffiill (Jul 15, 2010)

To return to the thread when I bought my boat I had no particular plans.
However when surveyed the surveyor gave it an RORC 500 mile offshore rating-the only reason it did not get an Ocean rating was its lack of Ocean life raft;Epirb and some other safety items. In the UK there are no laws relating to a vessels capability or equipment level.Neither does a boat have to be legally registered.
So is my boat blue water capable?
Because she hasnt got a wine glass profile and narrow sleek lines she can feel a bit buoyant in heavy weather-she very much rides over the waves which can make the ride a bit bouncy.
However she has a big volume such that storage is no problem
She carries 80 gallons of water and 80 of diesel.
Her raised bulwarks really make the deck feel secure and her trawler bow very much gets the water out of the way.
Her centre cockpit is great but her semi enclosed wheel house is too fragile for my liking-needs a stainless roll cage.
Below deck she is well equiped for heavy weater sailing other than loose seat lockers;cabin sole boards;batteries and engine hatch in self draining cockpit.
Engine compartment is big enough to stand straddling the engine!
It would be very easy to create a rain water collection system.
Tools on board capable of completely dismantling engine if necessary.
Usual complement of navigation equipment including two GPS and two radios.
Would add HF and AIS receiver and laptop.
Currently enough charts and pilots to cover west coast of UK and get me as far as Caribbean.
Most of this list was with the boat which has I believe done at least two trips across the Bay of Biscay and wandered extensively through the Med.


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## casioqv (Jun 15, 2009)

I'm leaving Los Angeles for Hawaii in my trusty Caravelle today:









I probably should have got the tougher "Super Caravelle" model, but it was outside my budget for this trip. Still, I think I'll be pretty safe since it has a "safety chamber" and is "NMMA certified."

I should have plenty of food and water, since I have my fishing rod and inflatable PVC solar still 

I have a good GPS but can't use it too much, because I only have room for 2 extra AA batteries, since my GlobalFix PRO™ Category I EPIRB with Automatic Release takes up half my cargo space.

Whomever said a bluewater cruiser has to cost more than $200+EPIRB rental was wrong. If it gets too windy or *thirsty* I can always flip on the EPIRB and get a free ride home.


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