# Off-shore internet connection?



## bardia (Mar 22, 2009)

Wandering how I could have access to the internet when sailing/cruising off-shore?


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## St Anna (Mar 15, 2003)

sailnet, winlink or iridium satphone etc, amongst others 
You need a HF and a pactor modem


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## bardia (Mar 22, 2009)

please explain!


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## St Anna (Mar 15, 2003)

Google sailmail or winlink or pactor 3 modem.

These are programs which allow you to email (not pics) from your HF set through the pactor modem. sailmail costs about $250 American pa. winlink is free. I am setting up winlink in order to use yotreps (google that as well)
Need a good HF - I have an icom 802 which has an email dedicated 'button'

You could also use an iridium satphone for more download amounts and also brunei bay radio has 'plans' for boaties who need more mb download than winlink/sailmail offers


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## bardia (Mar 22, 2009)

Geee! I'm googling all that right now! Its a whole and other world.
Thanks.


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## St Anna (Mar 15, 2003)

Its all good. Where are hoping to cruise/travel? And on what type of yacht?


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

What's your budget? What do you consider internet access to be??

If you're looking just to have basic e-mail capability, then yes, an SSB radio with a Pactor III modem will allow that...

However, if you're looking for web access, you're going to have to go with a satellite phone. The smaller handheld satellite phones can provide limited web access and a fairly low speed connection. If you want broadband type speeds, you're looking at getting a gyro-stabilized satellite dish antenna setup and that's some serious cash and requires a lot of electricity.

Be aware, unlike most terrestrial internet access plans, the satellite internet access requires you to pay per megabyte... so any serious usage is going to cost you a big chunk of change.

You can get "full internet" access off shore, but you're going to pay a lot for the equipment and the service.



bardia said:


> Wandering how I could have access to the internet when sailing/cruising off-shore?


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## badsanta (Oct 16, 2006)

St Anna said:


> I have an icom 802 which has an email dedicated 'button'


It is my understanding that all 802 have the button but there is a part or software upgrade that is quite expensive for the 802 to get the button to work. if you dont mind stating , what is the cost of the upgrade? or have they changet it. many thanks Al


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## imagine2frolic (Aug 7, 2008)

What about just getting grib files, and the such for weather?


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

This you can do via e-mail IIRC. 


imagine2frolic said:


> What about just getting grib files, and the such for weather?


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## SVAuspicious (Oct 31, 2006)

If you are using a Pactor modem from SCS (1000 - 1200 USD) the e-mail button doesn't mean much -- you do all your frequency control from Airmail on your computer.

If you want grib files you are stuck with something somehow that supports e-mail.

If you want weather, you can use a very cheap (<100 USD) interface between your radio and a computer to get synoptic charts and other weather fax products. Google JVCOMM for more information.


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## St Anna (Mar 15, 2003)

badsanta said:


> It is my understanding that all 802 have the button but there is a part or software upgrade that is quite expensive for the 802 to get the button to work. if you dont mind stating , what is the cost of the upgrade? or have they changet it. many thanks Al


When you buy the pactor modem, get them to install it as it can be a bit tricky for a 'non-tech' computer illiterate person like me. Then they will tweak' the radio / computer to work. I have the program on CD as a back up incase comp fails.


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## labatt (Jul 31, 2006)

Other than SSB, your two next most "cost effective" solutions are Iridium or Inmarsat BGAN. Right now, your primary solution on the Iridium side is the 9505A plus the data adapter. The brand new 9555 looks cool, but they've had a ton of issues with the drivers for the data side, so it's fairly useless for anything other than voice. You get about 2400 baud + compression through it. It's tolerable, primarily for sending/receiving e-mail and weather information, and you don't have to schedule anything like you do with the SSB. I paid about $2,300 for the phone, data adapter, USB adapter and 500 minutes of airtime. I wish I got the fixed antenna and cradle, but that would have added a few hundred dollars more. The Iridium gives you the ability to dump a worldwide communications tool into your ditch bag.

If you care less about phone capabilities and more about Internet, you can get the Inmarsat BGAN solution. It's the size of a laptop unit, portable and gives you 64k+ speeds. You pay about $7-$10 per megabyte, so if you are downloading web pages it's more cost effective than Iridium at the lower speeds.

OCENS is a very knowledgeable company you can talk to about the various options. Check out High-Speed & Broadband Satellite Services for some more info. I have no relation to them other than the fact that I bought my Iridium through them.


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## billyruffn (Sep 21, 2004)

badsanta said:


> It is my understanding that all 802 have the button but there is a part or software upgrade that is quite expensive for the 802 to get the button to work. if you dont mind stating , what is the cost of the upgrade? or have they changet it. many thanks Al


I have an IC 802 with an email button I've never used -- I think it will connect you to the email freq. you've programmed in. I've never heard of an upgrade for the 802. To get email you need a Pactor modem -- which is definitely an expensive "upgrade", but it's another box and not part of the HF radio.

When you think HF radio and Pactor modem -- think of the telephone modems of 15 or more years ago -- that's about how fast they are. For short messages they're great, but it's a no-no for your correspondents to hit the "reply" button (which adds / retransmits all the messages in a thread) or to attach large files.

If you want a "real" internet connection, SailingDog has put you on the right track in his post above and these higher bandwidth solutions are a lot more expensive than the Pactor modem, which if I remember correctly is just shy of $1K installed. Belay that, a quick check on the i-net indicates Pactors run $1000-1500 or so depending on the model + installation. Here's a link About Pactor Modems


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## labatt (Jul 31, 2006)

Just understand that you don't need gyro-stabilized dishes anymore to get forms of broadband - the Inmarsat BGAN solution is a semi-portable device to get 64k+, but at a per megabyte charge. As I mentioned, though, it's cheaper than the Iridium if you need to surf, as the Iridium has much slower connectivity so you'll be on it forever if you can even get to what you want. Call OCENS if you're looking for something beyond Pactor. I'm not affiliated with them, but they are very helpful and honest.


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## bardia (Mar 22, 2009)

... I'm looking at a freedom 40. Will probably just sit in it for a while and scratch my head. Then wonder how I'm going to nest in it, and which way the wind will blow me. I haven't done anything serious off-shore before, but was inspired by a site: S/Y 'KETURAH'. Micronesia feels good!
Does anyone know about freedom 40s?


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

Labatt—

You can't really use a BGAN terminal on a boat AFAIK. They have a flat plate antenna that really needs to be aimed at the satellites, unlike an Iridium or Globalstar phone... and to do that on a moving sailboat, you need a gyro stabilized antenna.

I did a lot of work with Inmarsat phones for about six years, as part of equipping reporters and photographers to go off to the middle of nowhere with them.


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## Zanshin (Aug 27, 2006)

I bought the new Iridium and have had issues with it, first of all the compression software doesn't work with Vista (they don't tell you that) and even with the compression running I get effective rates of under 1200 baud for pure data transmission.


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## labatt (Jul 31, 2006)

Zanshin - If you're talking about the 9555, they're working on it. They released new drivers a week or two ago, but apparently they are still unstable. Once they get them worked our, you'll have a heck of a phone (i.e. works anywhere, small enough to put in a ditch bag, and basic data capabilities without a thousand cables like I have on my 9505a), but until then you'll just have to hang tight...


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## bardia (Mar 22, 2009)

Thank you all for your input.


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## vega1860 (Dec 18, 2006)

Call me old fashioned but why is it so important to be connected to the internet at all times? Everyone (Except me) seems to agree that it is.

Personally, I take my laptop ashore when it is convenient and have a cup of joe or a beer while I catch up. If our sojourn will be longer, as now, I sign up for a wireless service if available.

I see no reason to maintain the frenetic pace of modern life while cruising and certainly not while actually at sea.

Yes, I already know I am eccentric but maybe someone could explain it to me.


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

Nope... not eccentric...very sensible... isn't the whole point of getting on the sailboat to get away from the rat race....


vega1860 said:


> Call me old fashioned but why is it so important to be connected to the internet at all times? Everyone (Except me) seems to agree that it is.
> 
> Personally, I take my laptop ashore when it is convenient and have a cup of joe or a beer while I catch up. If our sojourn will be longer, as now, I sign up for a wireless service if available.
> 
> ...


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

*coastal internet connections*

I more or less agree with Vega although I think there is a middle ground solution that has so far not been discussed. I am currently at anchor and using a cell phone as a modem (tethered to a laptop) - it is a newer 3G phone and I have added a data package similar to smartphone plans - it is pretty much an aircard (if you trial an aircard and the right phone you will find the speeds are similar).
My data plan costs me $20/month and I have it attached to a no contract t-mobile account versus $60 a month and a contract for an aircard. For now (while I am stateside) this arrangement works well and gives me access wherever I get cell signal.
I have met a few cruisers coming through the anchorage who have a 18" antenna mounted to their arches that pick up wifi...one guy had his at the top of his mast and said he often gets free connections 8 or 10 miles from shore.
I think the whole set-up runs $300 -500 and it can be all 12 volt. There are a few vendors out there - if anyone knows them they can chime in. Wifi in the Bahamas works pretty well -sometimes it costs (packing my laptop in the dink to an internet cafe isn't appealing to me) and sometimes you pick -up free signal - here is where the range of your system comes in - better range means more signal options. 
So far my plan will be the 12 volt long range wifi antenna for picking up broadband when inshore and a sat phone for texting, weather and ditch bag piece of mind when I'm out. I have watched Sailmail being used and it is painfully slow for me(my wife already grumbles about how much time I spend on the computer) , if the new Brunei Bay Radio has greater bandwidth I may consider it an option as things evolve.

Cheers,
Mark


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## EpicAdventure (May 18, 2006)

I think there are some good points here. Part of the sailing experience is getting away, yet there does need to be some middle ground.

For that reason, some of the HF radio options (HAM winlink, sailmail, etc.) are pretty good middle ground. They can be low cost if you are interested in tinkering with that sort of thing. They can provide emergency communication and basic reporting back to friends/family where you are and that you are ok.

Getting a HAM license isn't that hard these days. General class gets you most of the HF bands and no morse code requirements.

However, experimenting with antennas isn't everyone's cup of tea.

I'm looking forward to playing with the ham radio this summer while sailing Lake Superior. I'm curious to see if I can get some home made (very cheap -- made out of speaker wire!) antennas to work on the boat temporarily (w/o having to use expense tuners, backstay antennas, etc.) For me, its the tinkering that's fun.


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## bardia (Mar 22, 2009)

You are not old fashioned Vega!
I'm planning on the great escape through the pacific to get away from it all, and might not be anywhere with a wifi or mobile service for months. But I'd still like to update my website when I get that done.


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## celenoglu (Dec 13, 2008)

Although satellite internet access seems the final solution for connections, you need an auto directing disc to connect to the satellite. Although they manufacture discs for this purpose, they generally cannot connect due to excessive motion of the boat.


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## noreault (May 14, 2008)

It some jurisdictions it is considered illegal to connect to wifi networks without permission. This is true even if it is an open connection. So sitting in the Starbucks and using the wifi is OK with your coffee is ok, but standing outside would not be. While there has not been much prosecution, there has been some. Make sure you know the laws of the country you are in.

I am just stating a fact, not arguing it should be illegal so no flaming is necessary. Just something to consider.


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## seafrontiersman (Mar 2, 2009)

If anyone happens to cruise in the Western Gulf of Mexico, you can sometimes "piggyback" off WIFI systems on drilling rigs and (a few) oil/gas production platforms.

I'm currently out by the Flower Gardens National Marine Santuary delivering cargo to a drilling rig, this is about the only time I can access the internet while I'm on duty!

Hope this is helpful to someone!

Michael


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## bardia (Mar 22, 2009)

... so in a nutshell to be internet capable there are 2 options.
a) From your satellite connection anywhere (expensive to instal and costly, about $10+/Mb to run!!), and 
b) WiFi. Free to run assuming you wont get prosecuted for not having the coffee, with a good receiver whithin 8 miles of a transmitter.
Other options: satellite phones, pactor modems and SSB/HF radios are painfully slow and best as a tool for weather, and simple text only e'mailing!
Is this correct?


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

Cell phones are also an option when cruising in more civilized areas. Also, the range on WiFi is generally a lot less than 8 miles... max that is really feasible is more like two.



bardia said:


> ... so in a nutshell to be internet capable there are 2 options.
> a) From your satellite connection anywhere (expensive to instal and costly, about $10+/Mb to run!!), and
> b) WiFi. Free to run assuming you wont get prosecuted for not having the coffee, with a good receiver whithin 8 miles of a transmitter.
> Other options: satellite phones, pactor modems and SSB/HF radios are painfully slow and best as a tool for weather, and simple text only e'mailing!
> Is this correct?


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## bardia (Mar 22, 2009)

I don't mind spending the money to get prepared cause I can still earn it, but will need to keep running costs down once I'm off. Thanks.


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

*Internet connection*

I have a Yaseu Ft107 w/DMS Does anyone know if there is an adapter that I could use to access the Internet. I also need frequencies and any other information necessary. The Ft107 is an HF rig. I am a former Amateur radio operator general class. Thanks
Bill


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## EpicAdventure (May 18, 2006)

wkosciel said:


> I have a Yaseu Ft107 w/DMS Does anyone know if there is an adapter that I could use to access the Internet. I also need frequencies and any other information necessary. The Ft107 is an HF rig. I am a former Amateur radio operator general class. Thanks
> Bill


If you are a licensed amaetuer with HF privleges, which includes general class and advanced class, you can send/receive simple (text only emails). This does NOT include "internet access." You will not be surfing the internet...

If you want the HF email, you will need to look into Winlink. Most people buy a Pactor II or III modem to interface with their HF radio. These aren't cheap -- on the order of $1000 because of proprietary stuff. You can get a cheaper Pactor I modem and it would work but transfers much slower. The Winlink system limits you to so many minutes of connect time a day to send/receive emails.

There is a potential lower cost alternative call WINMOR in the works, which would eliminate the need for the expensive Pactor modem. It works by connecting the HF radio to the microphone/speaker of a computer sound card. It is quite a ways from being usable at the moment, but might be an option in the future.


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## marinegirl405 (Jun 7, 2007)

OK - we are talking off shore so that rules out WiFi, cell phones, and he usual suspects. Off shore (unless you have lots of $ and lots of patience) You are not going to be watching YouTube videos, or browsing around "for the fun of it".

There are only 2 real choices and NEITHER are anything like what you are used to getting at the dock
1) SSB setup with modem - I don't know enough about this to even start - but it is an option to send/receive email. 
2) Sat phone with data cable hookup.

I'll leave you the expertise of the others when looking at the SSB options.

We use an Iridium Sat phone. We can receive (but not send) text messages, and make/receive phone calls in an emergency. To receive a text message is free (if the sender does it from their online pages) - to receive phone calls is expensive either for the caller or for us, depending on how they connect). We've only used the sat phone as a traditional phone rarely (would use it in the event of a medical emergency, etc). When offshore we connect daily to the computer/internet to send position reports, progress updates and to receive GRIB files and any urgent emails from family.

EXPENSIVE and SLOW - We "budget" for 10 minutes a day for all this data movement and this allows for the occasional failure and retry. We pre-pay for our minutes, but the less you purchase, the quicker they expire (so if you don't use them you lose them). We have a watertight case and 2 batteries for the phone and charge via a 12V cigarette socket when offshore as necessary. We purchased our phone/data cable/minutes through RoadPost
* 75 minutes last for 1 month and is $175
* 1000 minutes lasts for 1 year and is $1245
(YOu can purchse a range of options in between and beyond. You can also purchase an extension so you don't lose your minutes... but the point is you need to PLAN your purchases.)

Rental may be a good option if you don't have too many off shore passages in mind, but we purchased our phone and setup.

I also spent quite some time getting everything working and understood (on and off for a week before the first major passage, and even now I test everything a week before we head off shore so I can fix any issues in time).

Many off shore critical web sites allow you to retrieve web pages by email - you send an email with your request, they return an email with the web page data - this is obviously NOTHING like browsing, but you are off shore - if you just need port information or weather information this can work.

Here is what we use (and we deliberately avoided any fee paying services, we needed to purchase a GRIB file viewer, but this is completely independant of the files received).

GRIB File downloads - we use Saildocs.com - you send an email in a predescribed format, and you can subscribe to a daily return email with an attached grib file. You need to spend some time to understand the format but once you get the hang of it - it works great. We generally get a 3 hourly forecast for the next 5-7 days so we can get an idea of what the weather you do - the less detail/data you want, the smaller the returned email

POSITION REPORTING - I would probably consider the SPOT beacon as a WAY cheaper option (it certainly covers Atlantic, not sure about full Pacific coverage as yet), but when we were looking this was not quite on the market. We use YOTREPS (http://www.pangolin.co.nz/yotreps/). We send an email in a predetermined format, and this allows family and friends at home to see our position and progress. This also allows "postcards" - a free text format that you can also send by email that shows on your position report web page. 3rd party web sites and software can also take that data ans show it in a more pretty format. e.g. To see our view YOTREPS Offshore Reports the latest postcard text shows at the top, and the current (and past if you zoom out) position reports are shown on the google map. The same data is used by SHIPTRACK for a different view of progress - ShipTrak v3.0

I do NONE of this from my "normal" email address, but I setup a separate GMAIL account that I only give to a couple of people. I don't want to be downloading the latest Jokes my friends think I need to see on my sat phone in the middle of the ocean. The thought of the cost of that (time spent on line) makes me ill. I also set my email software to NOT connect automatically when I launch, NOT send automatically once i've finished writing an email, and to AUTOMATICALLY disconnect as soon as I have sent/received all pending data. This helps keep time on line to a minimum. I've setup various signatures on my email software that are the right formats to present data to the various services, I've also got a spreadsheet where I can put in my current position report data and it converts it into text of the right format to submit to Yotreps (any mistake will mean a missed post and a lot of worried family). I did have my brother once send photos of his new baby to my "special" account - boy that took time and was painful, I had to setup my email system to NOT download messages larger than x-kb (I can't remember the number) but I wasted a LOT of minutes trying to work out why my email was taking so long to download. Once you know the size of your expected grib files for the trip/area/detail for any given passage you might want to consider doing the same thing.

BLOG updates from offshore. We use BLOGSPOT as our blog host, and they (and I assume others) don't need you to be online to write and post your blog entries and photos - they allow a blog entry (with attached photo if you want) to be emailed to the blog - in this way we can (if we want) have our blog updated while we are off shore too, with the minimum time spent on line (just enough to send an email).

I try and stress to my family that ANYTHING can happen to prevent regular updates from off shore - so they should not panic if they haven't heard from us UNLESS we have passed our due-by date at our destination. They worry anyway, but we try.

PORT information - Noonsite.com have really good port information and we do a lot of research here (and in various guide books etc) before we head out - but I notice that if we suddenly change plan - you can email (in a prescribed format) Noonsite and get back all that same information in an email returned - pretty cool. This will tell you about customs/immigration and navigation issues in any port/country of concern.

So before we head off shore we send an email to Saildocs to set up a subscription to receive an email each day for the area/detail we want. (I also post our cruise plan on a private web site for our family and the authorities "just in case"). Each day off shore, I prepare emails for our position reports, postcards and family emails - Once all is prepared I press the SEND/RECEIVE button on my email software, this goes "online" just for the duration of the SEND/RECEIVE. Once complete I'm off line and then I check out any returned emails and the grib file while off line at leisure.

Of course once I'm close to shore I go back to using my alternative options (Cell phone, WiFi, etc). ONce I've safely arrived at my destination I update my FLOAT plan to indicate that.

Good luck.


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## KC9SGV (Nov 21, 2010)

*Winmor rocks.*

*WINMOR rocks.*
It is FREE software, unless you want to pay a $39 donation.
Plays from your laptop via a Signalink Interface ($100) into your Ham HF SSB Radio (inexpensive from Ebay).
Works on the Winlink 2000 email system and is *FREE.*

Almost as fast as Pactor 3.

Download *RMS Express* (WINMOR) here:

WINMOR

Then download and read the Winmor Primer here: (takes a little while to download).
Winmor Primer

Have fun.
Bernard
KC9SGV


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## yzlian (Aug 3, 2002)

hello fellow sailors, does anyone know if the iridium 9555 has solved all its data transmission problems by now (Dec 2010...), and if so, how long does it take to download a weather webpage on high seas? 

anyone has experience with inmarsat phones?

also, i read different views here on the need to have a gyro-stabilizer for a broadband terminal. what is the verdict at this time? if needed, is it effective or still a hassle and not worth it? 

many thanks!

joseph


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