# Where should we retire with our boat?



## Gregrosine (Feb 10, 2013)

This winter has done us in. In a couple of years we will be ready to retire and as much as I love Lake Michigan, it is now frozen and that doesn't work for sailing. Where in a warm would anyone suggest we retire with our 35 foot cruiser to be able to sail most of the year? South Florida?


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## paulk (Jun 2, 2000)

Sounds like you need to take your boat and go looking.


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## night0wl (Mar 20, 2006)

I recommend SW Florida. Good weather, not TOO crowded, good services...and still relatively affordable.


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## sandy stone (Jan 14, 2014)

Just about anywhere on the northern Gulf coast from New Orleans to, say, Panama City is nice. The closer to New Orleans the better the food is ;-) 
On an 'out of the frying pan into the fire' note, you need to think seriously about hurricanes down here where it's warm.


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## travlin-easy (Dec 24, 2010)

Anyplace where the average temperature is higher than your age - at least that's my dream. I hate this winter more than any I've experienced in my 73 years on this planet. Next winter, Marathon Key, Florida for January through March, then back again with the boat in October through March. The older I get the colder I get.

Gary


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## SailingJackson (Jan 1, 2011)

Gregrosine said:


> This winter has done us in. In a couple of years we will be ready to retire and as much as I love Lake Michigan, it is now frozen and that doesn't work for sailing. Where in a warm would anyone suggest we retire with our 35 foot cruiser to be able to sail most of the year? South Florida?


I've been thinking the same thing, with my boat on the hard in Milwaukee for 6 months. I've looked closely at SW Florida. The waters are interesting but there are so many many miles of 3' water. Intercoastal is just a narrow string of markers. Outside might be nice, but my favorite areas of Lake Michigan are beyond 15 miles from shore, where the depth exceeds 400' and the fishing boats are all out of sight. I'm not sure that happens much around Florida.

One thing I've found helpful is to cruise the coastline with Google Earth or satellite view on Google Maps. Not only can you see where the marinas are, you can see the channel cuts and the population areas. When working up and down the coastline you can see which marinas are all power boats and which ones have a lot of sailboats. If there is nothing but power boats in a marina then you can guess that there will be very shoal water about, probably a bridge or two, and not a lot of sailors to hang out with in the local bar. Sailboat dominate marinas are pretty rare but there are a few. Also, if your boat is not shoal draft then you're going to need a different boat.

GTJ


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## night0wl (Mar 20, 2006)

SailingJackson said:


> I've been thinking the same thing, with my boat on the hard in Milwaukee for 6 months. I've looked closely at SW Florida. The waters are interesting but there are so many many miles of 3' water. Intercoastal is just a narrow string of markers. Outside might be nice, but my favorite areas of Lake Michigan are beyond 15 miles from shore, where the depth exceeds 400' and the fishing boats are all out of sight. I'm not sure that happens much around Florida.
> 
> One thing I've found helpful is to cruise the coastline with Google Earth or satellite view on Google Maps. Not only can you see where the marinas are, you can see the channel cuts and the population areas. When working up and down the coastline you can see which marinas are all power boats and which ones have a lot of sailboats. If there is nothing but power boats in a marina then you can guess that there will be very shoal water about, probably a bridge or two, and not a lot of sailors to hang out with in the local bar. Sailboat dominate marinas are pretty rare but there are a few. Also, if your boat is not shoal draft then you're going to need a different boat.
> 
> GTJ


I live in SE Florida. Plenty of 400' of water around here. But know this, ocean deep water is *VERY* different than Lake Michigan or Great Lakes. Yes, the Great Lakes can get snotty, but there is just *NOTHING* that compares with ocean swell, Gulfstream Currents, and a NE winds pattern.

I'm all about protected bay sailing when I can get it. In Florida, that means Biscayne Bay, Tampa, and Charlotte Harbor. Great sailing and plenty of space to do it.


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

My idea of retirement is an easy condo in the north (New England) to spend summers and live aboard down south in the winter. This way, I don't have to pick just one southern location and I still get home to see family and friends.

While I never really enjoy putting the boat on the hard for the winter, I'm usually starting to wear out from the constant chores. Then, by now, I'm dying to get her back in the water. It would be nice, if that break was only 2 - 3 months, instead of 5. I'm sure, if I had access year round, that I would bore of it from time to time. However, I wouldn't mind finding out.


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## Yorksailor (Oct 11, 2009)

The best location for sailing is Biscayne Bay and the Keys. Lovely sailing, clear water and easy access to the Bahamas.

However, you have to understand that for 5 months of the year you have to be on hurricane alert and constantly be available to secure the boat for hurricane conditions.

Coconut Grove Sailing Club, Coconut Grove Sailing Club is a great place to keep the boat but if you fail to evacuate the boat for a hurricane you loose your mooring rights.

Without a good hurricane plan you have a significant risk of loosing the boat. CGSC had 50 boat destroyed or badly damaged in the 2005 hurricane season.


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## Sal Paradise (Sep 14, 2012)

Minnewaska said:


> My idea of retirement is an easy condo in the north (New England) to spend summers and live aboard down south in the winter. This way, I don't have to pick just one southern location and I still get home to see family and friends.
> 
> While I never really enjoy putting the boat on the hard for the winter, I'm usually starting to wear out from the constant chores. Then, by now, I'm dying to get her back in the water. It would be nice, if that break was only 2 - 3 months, instead of 5. I'm sure, if I had access year round, that I would bore of it from time to time. However, I wouldn't mind finding out.


I have thought about something like this too. Seems like the best compromise, but a long slog back for most boats, maybe not yours.

Greg-

I love the water access, especially in the keys but I get a sort of claustrophobia if I am in Florida for too long. Mountains, lakes and big rivers start calling me. Hard to trade those for views of concrete overpasses and strip malls.

This is a terrible winter. For me, it's life changing. It seems like with the jet stream curving around so much we in the North East are now vulnerable to polar vortexes in winter and Hurricanes in summer.

If you figure out the perfect answer let me know.


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## caberg (Jul 26, 2012)

I can't imagine someone who loves cruising on Lake Michigan would find Florida to be all that great in the long run. Talk about worlds apart. I've sailed and been on the water in Tampa Bay and Sarasota Bay and don't find it all that interesting, on the water and shoreside. Too congested, boring landscapes, condos everywhere, the opposite of pristine. I couldn't give up the northeast permanently for that.


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## nolesailor (Oct 29, 2009)

caberg said:


> I can't imagine someone who loves cruising on Lake Michigan would find Florida to be all that great in the long run. Talk about worlds apart. I've sailed and been on the water in Tampa Bay and Sarasota Bay and don't find it all that interesting, on the water and shoreside. Too congested, boring landscapes, condos everywhere, the opposite of pristine. I couldn't give up the northeast permanently for that.


Seeing as the main reason for relocating is a warmer climate, that might be something the OP is willing to accept. Being in the FL panhandle, and having sailed in the St. Pete/Clearwater area, I think that area would be a decent choice. It doesn't look as if the water is as skinny as the Ft. Myers area...but you are still close enough to the Keys to get down there relatively easily. It is nice being able to sail year-round...although we've had some cold spells here as well...


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## Group9 (Oct 3, 2010)

night0wl said:


> I recommend SW Florida. Good weather, not TOO crowded, good services...and still relatively affordable.


Yeah, I have a couple of places on the west coast of Florida kind of staked out.

Bradenton is one of them. But, that would just be for summers. For winters, there are better places farther south. 

Just skip what I call the spoiled rich coast from Ft. Myers to Marco Island.


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## Hudsonian (Apr 3, 2008)

I'm with Minnewaska on this one. A base in Narragansett Bay, Buzzards Bay, or Eastern CT provides good sailing and access to interesting communities and occasional trip east to ME. My wife and I met a British couple in CT who had been cruising the Long Island Sound for eight summers. They appreciated the warmth, relatively low cost, diverse ports, and good access to shoreside transportation when guest flew in.

The weather in these areas is pleasant more the year than further south. For example, Washington, DC has 23 more days per year over 90F than NYC and NYC has four more days less than 32F. Aside from the heat and humidity, many southern locations have significantly more exposure to hurricanes and tornadoes.

About 10% of the retirees with cruising boats in my local club go south for the winter. Some winter in the Bahamas. Some in the Keys. Some go outside. Some go inside. It seems a bit of a grind to me but some continue into their eighties.


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## bshock (Dec 11, 2012)

I'm (unfortunately) many years away from retirement, but an idea I've been kicking around is to have two boats, one in the north for summers, and one in the south for winters. My northern boat would I think be in Grand Traverse Bay, and the southern boat anywhere warm, likely Florida and close to the Bahamas. The southern boat would be the "big" boat that we'd live on, but for Grand Traverse Bay, I'm thinking perhaps a Catalina 30 or equivalent with a condo or apartment to actually live in.

Perhaps I'm pipe dreaming or not considering all the ramifications, but I love that part of Michigan and would love to have that as my summer sailing venue.


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## MarcHall (Jun 13, 2006)

Ventura/Oxnard in southern California.

Good sailing weather year-round - plenty of wind
No hurricanes
Not in Los Angeles.
Plenty of slips/marinas
Good selection of marine trades/yards.
Excellent destinations - Santa Cruz Island and the rest of the nothern channel islands.

Marc Hall
Crazy Fish - Maintaining, Upgrading and Sailing a Crealock 37


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## SecondWindNC (Dec 29, 2008)

Is this where we all expound on the virtues of our home waters? 

I'll recommend North Carolina. Great protected cruising grounds with interesting towns to visit and countless quiet anchorages. Friendly people, southern home cooking, and good seafood. Four seasons but with a mild winter - bundle up and sail all year. Easy to head a little farther south for a month or two during the coldest part of winter (which you'd consider balmy anyway if you're from the Great Lakes) and/or a little farther north during the heat of summer or hurricane season.


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## ebs001 (May 8, 2006)

The O/P it seems to me is looking to move his land base from near Lake Michigan to a warmer climate which will allow him to sail 12 months a year. I think if he wanted a summer venue and a winter venue, his summer venue would be Lake Michigan but that's not what he's asking. 

There is plenty of good sailing around Florida but where depends on the type of sailing he wants to do - day sailing only, day sailing with an occasional overnighter, short cruises of a week or so duration a couple of times a year or long cruises of a few months. 

Then there is the cost of the land base dwelling and marina costs.

Weather is always a factor. Lowest temperatures in winter and highest in summer. What are you going to do in the event of a hurricane threat?

There is also the cost of relocating the boat and its suitability for the location chosen. Deep draft boats while fine in Lake Michigan are not so suited for Florida waters.


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## Faster (Sep 13, 2005)

If you've lived through winters and might still enjoy the odd winter activity like skiiing, then the PNW makes sense..

Incredible summer cruising grounds, off season sailing possible, winter sport accessible without really 'living' in winter conditions, in fact one might ski in the morning, go for quick sail and finish up with a short round of golf on some days in Jan - March.


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## Don L (Aug 8, 2008)

I would think if the question is where warm to retire on boat verse where warm to cruise on a boat, then the answer becomes just where best to retire to that has access to the water. It becomes more about taxes, health care access, and quality and cost of life.


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

Sal Paradise said:


> I have thought about something like this too. Seems like the best compromise, but a long slog back for most boats, maybe not yours......


Yea, but this is retirement. Nothing but time, right? We can only hope.

I would envision a 30 day trip in both directions, with several ports of opportunity along the way to break up the trip.

I will do everything in my power to avoid owning a fleet, ie a north and south boat. I have enough trouble keeping up with one.

The other issue is nexus for taxes. All New England State are killers, its just how they get ya. Property vs. Income tax or both. The home run would be to establish a 6 month plus one day residency in FL and less in New England, so you pay FL income taxes (which are zero  ). I know you can establish the mail service in FL, but I don't know as that creates tax nexus unless you can actually prove you were there for 6 months plus a day. With the idea of actually cruising all winter, I don't really want to stay that long, but consider the Bahamas and Leeward islands during the winter window.

I have a few more years to fine tune this plan. We have to remind ourselves that these are the kind of problems most people would prefer to have. Where to keep your boat. I never take it for granted.


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## miatapaul (Dec 15, 2006)

Minnewaska said:


> Yea, but this is retirement. Nothing but time, right? We can only hope.
> 
> I would envision a 30 day trip in both directions, with several ports of opportunity along the way to break up the trip.
> 
> ...


I grew up in the Mid West (Southern Ohio) and have fallen in love with the North East. I could not see giving it up for Florida. The only thing that would chaise me away is taxes, in New York at least if you live-aboard you don't have property tax. I am a long way from retiring if I ever get to. Heck my father is in his mid 80's and still working full time. I have visited Florida several times, but have not been to the Keys yet. More than anything it is the open minded north east that I like. Some people find it to be cold, but for me it is more live and let live. People don't care who you are or who you are with. I can't take the Florida politics and racism, and I am not being political at all, it is just my experience. I have a mixed race family and I know the attitudes I faced in Florida it is like you are still in the 1950s. Then you put the cruising grounds and it is boring in comparison to the North East and Chesapeake. And summer weather is deadly hot not to mention hurricanes.

I have been in Southern California and Mexico, I think I could be happy there. There are mountains, and scenery as well as interesting places to visit. The people I met in Mexico could not have been warmer. I could likely be happy like Zeehag is down there. Biggest issue for me there is the weather trying to get back north again and the cost of living in California.

The North West appeals to me as well, based purely on weather and geography. I have never been there, but the scenery and people seem quite interesting. Especially if you add in cruising to Alaska.

I have family that lives in Hawaii, and it's biggest problem is finding nice slip spaces and cost of living. There is limited cruising locally, but as long as health is good you are half way to the south Pacific, so perhaps it would work.

Gregrosine, do you plan to live-aboard or shore side and day sail? That makes a difference. For instance the heat is not as much of an issue if you plan on living on dirt, though it still shortens your season. Also how much distance are you thinking you would like to sail to get to "destinations?"


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## drsutton (Aug 6, 2013)

There are those who consider lake sailing beneith their station in life, but there is much to be said for year 'round sailing on Lake Norman, NC.
Bill Sutton


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## Gregrosine (Feb 10, 2013)

Sal Paradise said:


> I have thought about something like this too. Seems like the best compromise, but a long slog back for most boats, maybe not yours.
> 
> Greg-
> 
> ...


This winter has been long and hard. I just want to get my boat on the water.


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## Gregrosine (Feb 10, 2013)

Sal Paradise said:


> I have thought about something like this too. Seems like the best compromise, but a long slog back for most boats, maybe not yours.
> 
> Greg-
> 
> ...





Hudsonian said:


> I'm with Minnewaska on this one. A base in Narragansett Bay, Buzzards Bay, or Eastern CT provides good sailing and access to interesting communities and occasional trip east to ME. My wife and I met a British couple in CT who had been cruising the Long Island Sound for eight summers. They appreciated the warmth, relatively low cost, diverse ports, and good access to shoreside transportation when guest flew in.
> 
> The weather in these areas is pleasant more the year than further south. For example, Washington, DC has 23 more days per year over 90F than NYC and NYC has four more days less than 32F. Aside from the heat and humidity, many southern locations have significantly more exposure to hurricanes and tornadoes.
> 
> About 10% of the retirees with cruising boats in my local club go south for the winter. Some winter in the Bahamas. Some in the Keys. Some go outside. Some go inside. It seems a bit of a grind to me but some continue into their eighties.


I have to admit I am surprised with the responses that mention the NE. The dunes of Lake Michigan are beautiful and the water fresh and clean. Summer nights are long and the temperature on the lake is perfect. While Florida is nice in winter, I am not sure about the 100 degree days with 100 percent humidity in the summer. I just don't like having my boat on the hard for half the year. I have spent the winter looking at pictures of our boat and thinking of beautiful sails and warm evenings at our dock. Maybe I need to look beyond the first blush of Florida.


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## Gregrosine (Feb 10, 2013)

caberg said:


> I can't imagine someone who loves cruising on Lake Michigan would find Florida to be all that great in the long run. Talk about worlds apart. I've sailed and been on the water in Tampa Bay and Sarasota Bay and don't find it all that interesting, on the water and shoreside. Too congested, boring landscapes, condos everywhere, the opposite of pristine. I couldn't give up the northeast permanently for that.


No question the Michigan side of Lake Michigan is beautiful. Clean clear fresh water and towering dunes.


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## guitarguy56 (Oct 10, 2012)

If you can stomach the taxes and arrogance of the West Palm Beachers this is a beautiful area... I love the Intracoastal waterway between West Palm Beach and Palm Beach... live there from 1978-1988 after college... l lived on Flagler Drive and had a view of the boats sailing/motoring and that was boater heaven... spent many a time on Singer Island and Lake Worth... great places to hang out, sailed Cats on the Intracoastal and Lake Worth... you can't go wrong except the costs of real estate not to mention high costs of moorage/slip fees... I plan to go back one day but not now... Jupiter is another place aching for me... my old surfing turf along with Palm Beach.


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## Sal Paradise (Sep 14, 2012)

Gregrosine said:


> I have to admit I am surprised with the responses that mention the NE. Maybe I need to look beyond the first blush of Florida.


I certainly wasn't suggesting that you retire in this frozen hell. Just mentioning that in addition to sailing, some people need to live in big landscapes and Florida doesn't really have much of that. Not any that satisfied me personally. Your mileage may vary. And many people need something more than bars and resorts and tourist traps as culture. Again, that is highly a personal thingand I am not putting down Florida. California certainly has the landcape and culture to satisfy me however the cost of living is insane. I look at this with the shades of grey complexity of 50 year thinking.

And that brings us to the idea of snowbirding.


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## svHyLyte (Nov 13, 2008)

While I do not disagree with many of Sal's sentiments about Florida with respect to the southeast coast, perhaps from Palm Beach to south Miami, the situation on the southwest coast, focused around the south Tampa Bay area, is quite a different matter. We have lived in this area since 1993, although I did commute to my office in Santa Barbara bi-weekly until mid-2008, and have found it quite delightful. Previously, we lived and sailed on the west coast, from as far north as Orcas Island to as far south as Manzanillo, and have found the sailing here no less enjoyable. While the terrain is certainly not quite so scenic, the mere fact that one can swim or wind-surf without a wetsuit makes the area our favorite, hands down. As for heat/humidity during the summer months, while it can be oppressive for a few weeks each year, we have found it to be far cooler and more moderate than other areas of the Country during the summer including the Milwaukee-Chicago area, New York/New Jersey, Washington and the north mid-Chesapeake. Friends and relatives from these locales that often visited us during the summer months, while their children were out of school, often commented on how much more endurable the conditions where here than at "home". (The key is proper dress and decent shade from the direct sun.)

While there is a threat of hurricanes (the season here is really from mid-August through mid-October), because of the arrangement of the coast, prevailing wind/weather patterns and currents in the Gulf during the "season", the southwest coast is far less at risk than are other areas such as the north Gulf Coast or the southeast coast of the state. That is not to say we haven't had storms, and we prepare for the worst whenever we are threatened, but we have never suffered anything worse than wind-blown foliage and some chafed lines as we are tucked into a protected corner on a river several miles off the south Bay and there are plenty of protected coves and bayous where one can anchor-out (with proper ground tackle) if necessary. Actually, by comparison, we suffered far, far worse damage/injury from earthquakes while living in California, which can strike at any time with no forewarning.

A further major advantage of this area is the relatively low taxes and cost of living, state and local governments that are not "out of control" and so are largely unintrusive and a largely amiable and welcoming population. (My daughter once commented after a trip to NY to spend time with her cousins one summer, that "everyone always seemed so hostile". We told her to be glad we lived here to which she responded "I really am!")

Lastly to the sailing--whether day tripping, near-by cruising or longer distance cruising. For a better sense of that, take a look at the charts available on ActiveCaptain.com. While the water can be a bit thin in some areas, we draw 6-1/2 feet and it has not been much of a problem. And, we can reach virtually anywhere one might want to cruise along this coast in little more than 30 hours, tops, (and when we arrive will not be forced to line up on fore-n-aft moorings packed together like Sardines, a-la-Catalina.)

N'any case, my contribution for the day, FWIW...


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## denverd0n (Jun 20, 2008)

Gregrosine said:


> While Florida is nice in winter, I am not sure about the 100 degree days with 100 percent humidity in the summer.


No, it never gets to 100 degrees in Florida. At least, not anywhere near the coast. By the time it gets to about 94-95 degrees, and near 100% humidity, a thunderstorm will pop up and cool things down a bit. I first moved to Florida in 1982--lived in Orlando then--and now live in the Tampa Bay area, and I have never seen 100 degrees in the entire time I've been here.

Now 95 degrees and 95% humidity... That's a different story. That I've seen many times.


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## kellysails (Nov 1, 2008)

Our plan is to sail FL, Bahamas, Caribbean, seven months of the year and haul out during hurricane season. Return to the PNW during that time. We have literally been planning this for 15 years.


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## caberg (Jul 26, 2012)

The heat and humidity in Florida would be pretty far down on my list of things deterring me from moving there. The others have mostly been covered.

We probably suffer more from the heat and humidity up here in the northeast summers than Floridians ever do because A/C is not a way of life for us like it is down there.


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## Markwesti (Jan 1, 2013)

Not to many takers on California , I know people that won't live here because of taxes .Ie. keep those skimmers off my pension . I hear people saying, to expensive. I would not disagree . Gas right now is about 3.70 gal/ reg . my slip is 390. a mo .(30ft.) but it's not all doom and gloom . I got a 24 pk. of Corona for 23. yesterday and a cheese burger for 3. And yes Catalina gets crowded but really only for about 3 mos. out of year . However there are many coves that you can anchor (free) and you might be the only one. Come to California sail to Catalina anchor at Whites cove and the first Buffalo Milk is on me.


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## svHyLyte (Nov 13, 2008)

Markwesti said:


> Not to many takers on California , I know people that won't live here because of taxes .Ie. keep those skimmers off my pension . I hear people saying, to expensive. I would not disagree . Gas right now is about 3.70 gal/ reg . my slip is 390. a mo .(30ft.) but it's not all doom and gloom . I got a 24 pk. of Corona for 23. yesterday and a cheese burger for 3. And yes Catalina gets crowded but really only for about 3 mos. out of year . However there are many coves that you can anchor (free) and you might be the only one. Come to California sail to Catalina anchor at Whites cove and the first Buffalo Milk is on me.


Mark--

How many times can one do Catalina before it becomes something of a BTDT experience?


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## MIsailor (Oct 2, 2012)

Gregrosine said:


> I have to admit I am surprised with the responses that mention the NE. The dunes of Lake Michigan are beautiful and the water fresh and clean. Summer nights are long and the temperature on the lake is perfect. While Florida is nice in winter, I am not sure about the 100 degree days with 100 percent humidity in the summer. I just don't like having my boat on the hard for half the year. I have spent the winter looking at pictures of our boat and thinking of beautiful sails and warm evenings at our dock. Maybe I need to look beyond the first blush of Florida.


Greg,

I'm North of you a bit in Grand Traverse Bay. I have to admit this winter has me thinking in a similar way. It's cold (-15F tonight) and this winter has been hard. I think once summer gets here my desire to be somewhere else will be gone. Summer sailing in Northern Lake Michigan and Grand Traverse can't be beat. At least I'm hoping that's the way I'll feel. I'll let you know next winter.


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## Rozz (Jun 30, 2011)

as far as sailing year round, southern California really cant be beat if your looking to stay in the US. Catalina and is fun, lots of small islands to circle around, Mexico is a blast and cheap and so many places to go. you get board, head up the coast to San Fran or portland, seattle... cant beat that. no worries with weather.

i keep getting poked to relocate, but im an avid motorcycle and sailor... not gonna happen. btw, i have lived all over the country and originally from the northwest, this is where i have laid my hat
my 2c


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## cthoops (Apr 30, 2012)

MIsailor said:


> I think once summer gets here my desire to be somewhere else will be gone.


I think that happens to a lot of us that live where there is winter, and that's one of the reasons why there hasn't been a permanent mass exodus from the area. That being said, this has been a challenging winter with the seemingly-relentless cold.

Mr. cthoops and I still have 11 years to go before retirement, but we are definitely out of here. While the sailing is wonderful, winter sucks and the property taxes are going to chase us away. $6,600/year on a 1,200 sq ft house is a bit ridiculous, and that number's not going down. We're thinking the coastal Carolinas, probably North. The sailing sounds like it's good, the cost of living is way more in line with a retirement income, and no winter by NE standards. Yeah, yeah, there are hurricanes - but no place is perfect. For now I just keep repeating to myself, 11 more winters, 11 more winters.


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## MIsailor (Oct 2, 2012)

cthoops said:


> ...
> Mr. cthoops and I still have 11 years to go before retirement, but we are definitely out of here.


I'm in semi-retirement now and I'm staying put. Summer is too nice here to leave for somewhere else. I think I just need about a month somewhere warm during the winter. February somewhere South would do the trick I think. Come March and April and I'm working on the boat to get ready for Spring launch.


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## Sal Paradise (Sep 14, 2012)

I have to disagree with my fellow northerners. Its like we've been in an almost continual winter storm since December. Now another 6" for Monday? And single digit temps for another week and a half? Living with apparently permanent ice bergs in my front yard. Locked in the house for 3 months. Driveway is a glacier. I have a working car buried in 3 feet of snow/ice in my side yard. It won't get out for weeks. Saying summer will come it's like saying your spouse only abuses you for a few months per year and then you have such good times. No. It still happens, and will continue to happen. 

Nothing is worth this.


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## MIsailor (Oct 2, 2012)

Sal Paradise said:


> ...Nothing is worth this.


LOL, then you should definitely move South. No doubt this winter has all of us Northerners questioning our logic. If you don't do anything outdoors in the winter then it's just a season to be endured. Not much fun. My wife and I love to downhill ski and normally that keeps us going pretty well till Spring. This winter however has been brutal and we haven't even done much of that. Plenty of snow, just too cold and windy.


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## JimsCAL (May 23, 2007)

I'm eight years into retirement and happy with how I've managed it. One major reason I decided to stay on Long Island is I love my yacht club and live only a mile from it. Makes daysails easy and lots of great cruising is very handy. A second major factor in staying in the northeast was my second love - skiing. My retired life consists of skiing from November to April in Vermont and Colorado, then getting boat ready for launching in early-mid May. After enjoying summer and fall on the boat, its time to put it to bed in October. And then it all starts over again. 

Yes there are a few other places this would have worked, but I grew up in the Northeast and love it.


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## guitarguy56 (Oct 10, 2012)

The Georgia coasts are pretty nice too, not as cold as it gets north of Charleston and the South Carolinas... Living in Savannah we are a Zone 9B so if you're a gardener as many of us are you know the type of plants and the temperate zones that is... We have many bays, and rivers to explore, we have Grays Reef just outside of Tybee Island, we have many islands and hammocks of which you can set your dinghy and enjoy, we have a waterfront that allows many festivals throughout the year and you can pull up your boat right up the seawall and enjoy the many restaurants and shops on River Street... who knows you might catch me playing the piano on Vics on The River... a five star place to bring the lady for a fine experience. We've got Fort Pulaski that dates to the Revolutionary War, used it in the Civil War and the historical city is unlike any other... did I mention Hilton Head is a stones throw across the Savannah River and you get to sail the waters as the French and Spanish did in the early 1500's... gotta see Parish Island and all the great harbors and bays just itching for sailing and voyaging... when you get tired of that you head south to St Simons Island, Jekyll Island, and Cumberland Island all historical islands full of rich history not to mention wandering around Blackbeard Island about half an hour sail from Tybee Island... the slips are reasonable here at $12/ft @monthly rates and have all the amenities you can imagine in full service marinas... the only negative are the gnats (no seeums) while on the water but they are manageable with citronella candles... it's a beautiful place and we've been here since 1995 after leaving rainy Seattle.

Also for the hurricane apocalypsers (if that is a word ) Savannah or the Georgia coast hasn't been hit in over 100 years because of the natural way the coast is configured... one reason we'd rather be here than Palm Beach area.

http://chronicle.augusta.com/content/blog-post/rob-pavey/2010-09-01/georgia-rarely-gets-hit-hurricanes-here-s-why


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## Bruce_L (Jun 19, 2012)

Ever think about the USVI? St.Croix is not your typical tourist trap island and there is great sailing everywhere. Hurricanes are much worse on coastal US shores than in the USVI. Last bad storm was Hugo in 1989. I know, I have been through many seasons in both locations. Cost of living is up there though, with most of your items being imported. 

You just cant beat the pretty water there!!!

Call me when you get there!!!


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## Gregrosine (Feb 10, 2013)

Bruce_L said:


> Ever think about the USVI? St.Croix is not your typical tourist trap island and there is great sailing everywhere. Hurricanes are much worse on coastal US shores than in the USVI. Last bad storm was Hugo in 1989. I know, I have been through many seasons in both locations. Cost of living is up there though, with most of your items being imported.
> 
> You just cant beat the pretty water there!!!
> 
> ...


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## jlprice (Mar 30, 2002)

Another ice storm coming in this weekend. I can't wait! Our personal glacier called my driveway did recede some last week. 

We're a couple years away from retiring and plan on taking off on the boat for as long as we can but eventually we might want to setup house again and we've been wondering where we would do this. We've been up and down the east coast and have always liked the Carolinas and Georgia. I like Guitarguy's Savannah - very nice with Tybee Island as he mentions. Also, what about Charlestown, SC, or New Bern or Oriental, NC. All very nice places. I think I could be comfortable in any of them. I suspect that the cost of living in these places would be considerably less than Florida and much less crowded. 

Hey, Guitarguy are those noseeums around all year?

Anyone have opinions on these places.


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## Sal Paradise (Sep 14, 2012)

Yeah I ski. We live close to the mountains, but this year conditions have just been too harsh and honestly the last thing I want to see is more snow - so I have only gone once. I don't know about you all but we are having a difficult time with icy roads, piles of snow ice, our elderly dog can't even make it outside, oil lines freezing, roads impassible, terrible potholes, .....etc, etc...I've spent $1800 on heating oil in the last 3 months. 


VI sounds nice.


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## Don L (Aug 8, 2008)

I read an article last week about "The Worst States to retire To". On the list:

Massachusetts
Rhode Island
Connecticut
New York
New Jersey

the Northeast rocks


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## benesailor (Dec 27, 2012)

Ideally. I would keep a boat on Lake Ontario for May thru Oct and have a boat stationed in Florida to take off in Nov to the islands. I know of 2 couples that do this right now. This sounds expensive, not really. 
or...
camper up north in summer, winter in the south/islands


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## guitarguy56 (Oct 10, 2012)

jlprice said:


> Another ice storm coming in this weekend. I can't wait! Our personal glacier called my driveway did recede some last week.
> 
> We're a couple years away from retiring and plan on taking off on the boat for as long as we can but eventually we might want to setup house again and we've been wondering where we would do this. We've been up and down the east coast and have always liked the Carolinas and Georgia. I like Guitarguy's Savannah - very nice with Tybee Island as he mentions. Also, what about Charlestown, SC, or New Bern or Oriental, NC. All very nice places. I think I could be comfortable in any of them. I suspect that the cost of living in these places would be considerably less than Florida and much less crowded.
> 
> ...


The gnats seem to be a rare phenomena indeed in this area... but they haven't chased us out of Savannah to date. They usually have a range of temperatures they thrive in... and it's around 70 Deg. F plus 10 degrees... normally after 80-85 Deg. F they don't seem to be anywhere in sight, but as soon as they find a shady area where the temps drop some they come out for the hunt. The citronella oils seems to work some. We have used Skin So Soft cream before we head out when they are prevalent and seems to keep them at bay... I hate using the sprays that have pesticides due to my marine aquarium and getting the water contaminated.

But don't let this deter you as this happens from the Charleston, SC area all the way down to West Palm Beach, FL. (WPB) As I mentioned I have lived in West Palm Beach since 1978 and Tallahassee since 1974 (FSU) and love Florida but won't go back due to the very high cost of living... we love it where we're at but wish the growing zone was 10A or 11.

Best to come down to Savannah/Tybee Island for a looksee... Charleston, SC is about 1-1/2 drive up north and Jacksonville, FL is but 1-1/2 south of us... want the Appalachian mountains... they are 4 hours away for camping.

Home prices are 1/3 what they would be in other cities... our current home we have now in Savannah would be in West Palm Beach close to $1 Mil or more... it's just the cost of living and where land values seems to be highest. I regret selling our home in WPB for sure.

The Augusta Chronicle

Here is the Riverstreet I mentioned earlier...










and the Five Star restaurant I mentioned earlier where I get to sometimes play the piano for my wife when we have a special occasion...

Vics on the River


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## Group9 (Oct 3, 2010)

Bruce_L said:


> Ever think about the USVI? St.Croix is not your typical tourist trap island and there is great sailing everywhere. Hurricanes are much worse on coastal US shores than in the USVI. Last bad storm was Hugo in 1989. I know, I have been through many seasons in both locations. Cost of living is up there though, with most of your items being imported.
> 
> You just cant beat the pretty water there!!!
> 
> Call me when you get there!!!


My wife and I have thought a lot about retiring to St. Croix, at least for the winters. Browsing Craigslist, you see some really good deals on rentals down there. If my Spanish was better, I'd be thinking about Culebra, PR, too.

One of my best friends spends several months down in the USVI every summer (he's a hurricane hunter) and he says he wants to move down there when he retires.

Hidden gems.


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

Don0190 said:


> I read an article last week about "The Worst States to retire To". On the list:
> 
> Massachusetts
> Rhode Island
> ...


I didn't see the particular article you reference, but they are often hit hard by tax rates. Once you're on a fixed income that doesn't go up with inflation, the 5-10% you pay to the state is a lot. The northeast gets you hard on the combo of income, property and sales taxes. In a cruising retirement, I'm hopping to figure how not to be a resident. I will just come spend money in the northeast economy for 5 months per year.


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## benesailor (Dec 27, 2012)

I agree; the taxes and politics are awful in the Northeast. That being said; there are still honey holes that can be found. 
As crazy as it sounds, Syracuse, NY (and local area)is one of the cheapest places to retire. You say "it's not close to water" , But oh it is. The canal runs right thru here. Yes, you will have to unstep,but, it's a easy safe ride to your destination. Lake Ontario and finger lakes in the summer are hard to beat. 
Then just transit the canal in October and head south. I watch the pilgrimage every year. I shuttle several boats in the spring and fall. 

The last 25 years have not been kind to the finger lakes/central region of NY. No economic boom. It's been a blessing! Costs have not gone thru the roof here, yet. It's a little backwards up here. I consider that a plus compared to downstate. 
I have had my boat up here for 4 years now. Brought it up from Palm Beach. (Stationed here now) I have had nothing stolen off my boat nor have i heard about anybody else had anything come up missing. No worries, leave the hatch unlocked and the hose out. People are great, crime is low. The locals are very vigilant as well. Low tolerance for evil doers. 

Sshhhh.....don't tell to many people. 

That's my speel for this area. I plan on going back in forth between here and the south/islands when i retire in about 5 years. Just like my friends that have retired before me. I'll see them in the spring.


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## FirstCandC (Mar 26, 2013)

Great question. As an NC native, I can say that there are a lot of good things about our state. The winter weather is USUALLY only bad for a couple of months. This year was rough, though. Cost of living fairly cheap, except gas prices and waterfront property. Good BBQ, southern food, and seafood (although mostly fried). PLENTY of water on the east end of the state, which opens up a lot of day/weekend trips by water. To the poster asking about New Bern- this is the Admiral and I's favorite town in the state, or maybe a tie with Beaufort. Smartly preserved historical district with three marinas within walking distance. All of the big box stores are in another area of town. The drawback about New Bern is that the river doesn't open up for a few miles down stream. Oriental is a much better sailing area, but not much in the form of conveniences.


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## benesailor (Dec 27, 2012)

firstc&c, Your area is my second choice. It is gorgeous there!! Costs not so bad, yet. A good friend of mine is stationed at Jacksonville (Marine Gunny) and we have this discussion all the time. Funny; his wife is from Albany, NY; he said he would never come back to NY.


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## Group9 (Oct 3, 2010)

Minnewaska said:


> I didn't see the particular article you reference, but they are often hit hard by tax rates. Once you're on a fixed income that doesn't go up with inflation, the 5-10% you pay to the state is a lot. The northeast gets you hard on the combo of income, property and sales taxes. In a cruising retirement, I'm hopping to figure how not to be a resident. I will just come spend money in the northeast economy for 5 months per year.


I've lived up north and down south, and the difference in costs of living is striking. That may not matter so much when you are working, and salaries are adjusted to an area's costs, but once you are on a fixed retirement income, it makes little sense to stay in a high cost, high tax locale.

Many southern states don't tax retirement income at all. That's money in your pocket.

I've always said a great retirment strategy would be to take a law enforcement position in a super high cost area like San Francisco, Los Angeles, or New York. Then do your 25 years, and take that rather measly retirement income of $100,000 to $150,000 and move down south where that is often more money than the governors' make and live very well at a relatively young age.


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## FirstCandC (Mar 26, 2013)

Someone mentioned Charleston. WOW, that place is wonderful. Hoping we can spend our 10th anniversary there. Is the cost of living high there? Vacations sure are.
Now, I know it gets hot down there, but if you ever see the water in the Keys, you will have to stop and stare at it. Ever go on vacation, get back home, and say "Oh, it is so good to be home?" We liked Key West so much that my wife tried to abduct a Hemingway cat and I unsuccessfully attempted to defect from NC on our last return trip. Not a day goes by that I don't think about that place.


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## FirstCandC (Mar 26, 2013)

Benesailor, thanks to your friend for his service. Hope you enjoy your next visit!


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

You really have to combine income, property and sales taxes to understand how much of your retirement will be donated. Unfortunately, NY ranks the highest taxed in the nation when you do so. Beautiful State, wouldn't mind a retirement condo there, as long as it isn't my State of residence! I just have to figure out how having the boat down south will work.


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## kellysails (Nov 1, 2008)

Minnewaska said:


> In a cruising retirement, I'm hopping to figure how not to be a resident. I will just come spend money in the northeast economy for 5 months per year.


Amen brother, exactly our plan!! But spending those five month in the PNW, same same.

Thankfully the State of Washington does not have income tax. I do wonder how long that will last. The boat registration tags cost an insane amount though. We will likely start registering our "documented" boat out of Florida. I need to research that a bit more though.


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## Hudsonian (Apr 3, 2008)

I doubt that we can develop a consensus regarding which social values and manners define a desirable cruising ground. Perhaps we can regarding weather. 

I believe that sailing is best when the temperature is appropriate for growing corn -- greater than 50F and less than 90F. For example, the Virgin Island probably fall within this range 350 days per year. Data on the on the number of days over 90F is readily available of the web. For example, the daily high in Tampa, FL is over 90F 115 days per year. Data is also readily available on the number of days when the temperature is below 32F but I haven't found a source for the number of days when the temperature is below 50F. Do any of you have a good source?


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## guitarguy56 (Oct 10, 2012)

Hudsonian said:


> I doubt that we can develop a consensus regarding which social values and manners define a desirable cruising ground. Perhaps we can regarding weather.
> 
> I believe that sailing is best when the temperature is appropriate for growing corn -- greater than 50F and less than 90F. For example, the Virgin Island probably fall within this range 350 days per year. Data on the on the number of days over 90F is readily available of the web. For example, the daily high in Tampa, FL is over 90F 115 days per year. Data is also readily available on the number of days when the temperature is below 32F but I haven't found a source for the number of days when the temperature is below 50F. Do any of you have a good source?


We grow corn every year including oranges, limes, bananas, pomegranates, apples, pears, guavas, blueberries, and a host of many more fruits and vegetables here on my property in Savannah... so we meet some of the requirements you mention. Florida is a better location but now you get into higher property and tax values. I studied the Georgia area from Seattle before I moved here... Georgia has financed both my children to Bachelors degrees all on the Hope Scholarships... I have yet to pay tuition for my two children... now my son is headed to medical school so I'll have to fund that but the savings of not having to pay their college tuition for the first 4 years I can now use it for his graduate courses... it's another plus of living here in Georgia.


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## Moody38CC (Dec 28, 2010)

I live in Charleston, SC. Wonderfully nice pace to live, but not nice to keep a decent size boat. Couple of reasons. The bay here is nice but shallow (5-6 feet at low tide outside shipping channels) and once you have seen it, the only place to go is out to the ocean. And you can see the bay in one day. The ocean is fine, but from the ocean looking inland, barrier islands all look the same. Next destination--Wilmington, NC or Savannah, GA. Not a day sail. Charleston harbor is wide, so in a hurricane, fetch builds and boats get slammed. Not much protection--lived here in Hugo. Slips are expensive. The "city marina" on the Ashley with its mega dock offers winter specials and year 'round rates that will take your breath away. Last and not least, boat taxes here are done by county, and Charleston County taxes boats higher than personal property. And, owing to the last county assessor losing her job in an election partially due to not collecting boat taxes, the county now is tough. Do not spend more than 180 days here under any circumstances unless you care to buy the county a grade school or cruise missile. Property taxes are quite reasonable, but not boat taxes. 
Don't get me wrong-Charleston is a wonderful place to live and visit. There is some exposed anchorage in tidal rivers, but slips cost a lot, so visitors stay for a month or two. I keep my boat on the Chesapeake.


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## guitarguy56 (Oct 10, 2012)

Moody38CC said:


> I live in Charleston, SC. Wonderfully nice pace to live, but not nice to keep a decent size boat. Couple of reasons. The bay here is nice but shallow (5-6 feet at low tide outside shipping channels) and once you have seen it, the only place to go is out to the ocean. And you can see the bay in one day. The ocean is fine, but from the ocean looking inland, barrier islands all look the same. Next destination--Wilmington, NC or Savannah, GA. Not a day sail. Charleston harbor is wide, so in a hurricane, fetch builds and boats get slammed. Not much protection--lived here in Hugo. Slips are expensive. The "city marina" on the Ashley with its mega dock offers winter specials and year 'round rates that will take your breath away. Last and not least, boat taxes here are done by county, and Charleston County taxes boats higher than personal property. And, owing to the last county assessor losing her job in an election partially due to not collecting boat taxes, the county now is tough. Do not spend more than 180 days here under any circumstances unless you care to buy the county a grade school or cruise missile. Property taxes are quite reasonable, but not boat taxes.
> Don't get me wrong-Charleston is a wonderful place to live and visit. There is some exposed anchorage in tidal rivers, but slips cost a lot, so visitors stay for a month or two. I keep my boat on the Chesapeake.


Moody... Charleston is our 'sister' city... it's a beautiful city as well, being in SC the taxes and waterways are not that different than Savannah, but I find Savannah to be less costly. Our largest complaint is we don't have enough slips/anchorage but Savannah is not widely set with many sailboats... so the slips are still reasonable in cost. I should have bought a house with a dock sometime back but didn't want the hassle of bugs/ticks/water damage... now I wished I had.


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

kellysails said:


> .....The boat registration tags cost an insane amount though. We will likely start registering our "documented" boat out of Florida. I need to research that a bit more though.


Be careful. Every state that I'm familiar with requires registration based on how long you are within their boundaries, not where you are documented. In fact, if they catch you not paying and it appears you've tried to game the system, they usually come down harder.

I've got to figure all this out as well, but I have to figure it out within the rules.

One of my tough ones is use tax. Since RI has no sales tax on boats, if I spend enough time in another state to incur their use tax (version of sales tax when you purchased elsewhere), they usually give credit for having paid sales tax elsewhere. With no offset, it could cause me difficulty.


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## TerryBradley (Feb 28, 2006)

There is this place that I know of. Never real hot and never real cold. Whales, sea lions, eagles, otters. Great crabbing and fishing. Catch salmon off the bank. Quaint villages and only a short hop to a very large city. 45 minute drive to snow capped mountains. No black flies, sand flies and mosquitoes are almost nonexistent. Less rain per annum than the city of Chicago. Lots and lots of islands to cruise. But dangit! I just can't recall the name of the place!!


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## Gregrosine (Feb 10, 2013)

TerryBradley said:


> There is this place that I know of. Never real hot and never real cold. Whales, sea lions, eagles, otters. Great crabbing and fishing. Catch salmon off the bank. Quaint villages and only a short hop to a very large city. 45 minute drive to snow capped mountains. No black flies, sand flies and mosquitoes are almost nonexistent. Less rain per annum than the city of Chicago. Lots and lots of islands to cruise. But dangit! I just can't recall the name of the place!!


The PNF is certainly one of those areas that seem so appealing. I've been in the Seattle area a couple of times in the summer and it is gorgeous. Great seafood. But I hear if it's not summer then it's rainy season. It's a big area and I'm not certain where exactly to look


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## christian.hess (Sep 18, 2013)

ah seattle is always misty..can get depressing BUT thos few months...of sunshine, sun and fine sailin weathe make it beautiful

oh and the coffee and good eating makes san francisco look measly in comparison

jeje

I loved pt townsend too and the micriobreweries scattered all over...great stuff the pnw


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## Alex W (Nov 1, 2012)

kellysails said:


> The boat registration tags cost an insane amount though. We will likely start registering our "documented" boat out of Florida. I need to research that a bit more though.


It's so tiny among the costs of maintaining a boat that I haven't even noticed it. Our tabs are $112 this year.

On a new boat it would be very expensive, since the biggest portion of this ($92 in my case) is 0.5% of the state's idea of the boat's value. On a typical 30 year old cruising boat it's not so bad, especially considering the great boating resources in our state.


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## Alex W (Nov 1, 2012)

Gregrosine said:


> The PNF is certainly one of those areas that seem so appealing. I've been in the Seattle area a couple of times in the summer and it is gorgeous. Great seafood. But I hear if it's not summer then it's rainy season. It's a big area and I'm not certain where exactly to look


If I were retiring here I would be looking in the Gulf Islands or San Juan Islands. Personally I dream of retiring to Salt Spring Island in BC.

If you need to make an income here you'd almost certainly end up in the central Puget Sound, somewhere near Seattle, or in BC in close proximity to Vancouver. There are certainly jobs elsewhere, but 90% of them are in those two areas.

The sailing here is great year round. This morning I'm going for a bike ride with a few friends, this afternoon I hope to go for a quick sail, and tomorrow I'll probably do some work on the boat.


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## JimsCAL (May 23, 2007)

Minnewaska said:


> Unfortunately, NY ranks the highest taxed in the nation when you do so. Beautiful State, wouldn't mind a retirement condo there, as long as it isn't my State of residence!


One factor that many are not aware of is that federal and NY retirement income is not taxed in NY. Thus my federal pension, my wifes NY pension and Social Security is not subject to NY income tax. No boat use tax either. Yes housing is more expensive than down south, but if the mortgage is paid off......


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## Group9 (Oct 3, 2010)

Minnewaska said:


> Be careful. Every state that I'm familiar with requires registration based on how long you are within their boundaries, not where you are documented. In fact, if they catch you not paying and it appears you've tried to game the system, they usually come down harder.
> 
> I've got to figure all this out as well, but I have to figure it out within the rules.
> 
> One of my tough ones is use tax. Since RI has no sales tax on boats, if I spend enough time in another state to incur their use tax (version of sales tax when you purchased elsewhere), they usually give credit for having paid sales tax elsewhere. With no offset, it could cause me difficulty.


Go to some state like Mississippi. Yeah, you have to register your boat, but it's so cheap it's not really worth fighting about. Like $26 for two years.


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## benesailor (Dec 27, 2012)

> One factor that many are not aware of is that federal and NY retirement income is not taxed in NY. Thus my federal pension, my wifes NY pension and Social Security is not subject to NY income tax. No boat use tax either. Yes housing is more expensive than down south, but if the mortgage is paid off......


Correct. It's the property taxes that getcha. Tags are dirt cheap in NY. The secret is not to hold property, just visit.


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## findrichard (Jan 16, 2014)

I retired in Florida eight years ago, sailed to the Bahamas and later sailed along the ICW to VA, then along the coast to Portland Maine where I could buy lobster right off the boats as they came in for the day. The largest body of protected water sailing would be the Chesapeake Bay in VA where boats can stay in the water year round. The best ICW sailing was the GA to SC stretch - beautiful natural shoreline with little to no boat traffic. The ICW is a little over 1,000 miles long and GA is around the halfway point, giving you plenty of maneuver room north or south to dodge the Hurricanes which are really not all that frequent at any one particular place. After the most active part of hurricane season, which ends around November, it is perfect timing to ride the early northerly winds south to the keys or Bahamas. However, if rocky shoreline scenery is your thing then you got to just learn to like those winters up there. The real beauty of Florida is under water, experienced via snorkel or scuba excursions right off the back of your boat. If you are a seafood lover, you haven't tasted nothing until you sink your teeth into fresh caught, properly prepared wahoo or yellow-fin tuna, which also may be caught right off the back of your boat. Wherever you end up with a sailboat, the beauty of retirement is that if the grass starts to look greener somewhere else, all you need to do is pull up anchor or cast off dock lines and go check it out.


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## guitarguy56 (Oct 10, 2012)

findrichard said:


> I retired in Florida eight years ago...,
> 
> The best ICW sailing was the GA to SC stretch - beautiful natural shoreline with little to no boat traffic. The ICW is a little over 1,000 miles long and GA is around the halfway point, giving you plenty of maneuver room north or south to dodge the Hurricanes which are really not all that frequent at any one particular place.
> 
> Wherever you end up with a sailboat, the beauty of retirement is that if the grass starts to look greener somewhere else, all you need to do is pull up anchor or cast off dock lines and go check it out.


Findrichard... you couldn't have described it any better.

That is our plan to move to Florida or move our home base to West Palm Beach after my wife's retirement or close to it... but for now Savannah is the home... the reason there aren't as many sailboats in the GA coast is as I mentioned earlier in one of my other posts here.


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## TerryBradley (Feb 28, 2006)

Greg, I sent you a pm.


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## Shockwave (Feb 4, 2014)

The Caribbean, doh.


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## Killick (Feb 27, 2014)

guitarguy56 said:


> Moody... Charleston is our 'sister' city... it's a beautiful city as well, being in SC the taxes and waterways are not that different than Savannah, but I find Savannah to be less costly. Our largest complaint is we don't have enough slips/anchorage but Savannah is not widely set with many sailboats... so the slips are still reasonable in cost. I should have bought a house with a dock sometime back but didn't want the hassle of bugs/ticks/water damage... now I wished I had.


No, Savannah is bad - very bad. Do not go there.  It has long cold winters, and long brutal summers...and the food is also very bad...and the people are mean. In fact, it's so bad that I am constantly loading up the car and spending as much time as I can there just to remind myself how bad it is. It's so bad I dream about it all the time, and can't wait to put a boat there so I can more easily escape all that badness every weekend. Just watch "Forrest Gump" and see how ugly it is. Plus there are tidal waves, and earthquakes, and volcanoes, and...and...the rare saber-toothed bigfoot. No, North Carolina or Florida are definitely much better.

(Guitarguy - SHHH!! What are you thinking?? We gotta keep this on the downlow, man...otherwise everyone will want to move there!)


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## Hudsonian (Apr 3, 2008)

If thinking of retiring to the Caribbean with a sailboat consider Humacao or Ponce, Puerto Rico. The climate is cooler in the summer and warmer in the winter than the southeastern United States; the sun can be brutally intense, however. They're relatively inexpensive with good shopping and food. No passport or visa needed. Cheap flights compared with other Caribbean locations. Easy cruise to Culebra, Vieques, and the Virgin Islands.


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## Samuelmonosov (Mar 7, 2014)

Santa Barbara. You get all the perks of the city while living in a slip, the weather is unbeatable, and our islands are natural reserves with some of the most beautiful and challenging sailing in the world. We have a prevailing westerly that rarely quits


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## climbhike (Mar 29, 2013)

I'm also a Michigander but at this point I'm enjoying the change of seasons. Have skis and snowshoes and enjoy the best snow in 15 years. Went camping 3 weeks ago for one night, We have other toys we enjoy the three non-snow seasons, bikes and kayaks. Hiking and used to rock climb. Looking forwards to spring and getting out. Most family and especially grand kids are within a few hours drive so it's not an option to relocate. Maybe will feel different in 10 years. I'm looking forward now to retiring in a few years and cruising southern Lake Michigan and some trips with a trailer sailer to Traverse City, Harbor Springs or Mackinaw. Good luck with your search. Dave G


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## Group9 (Oct 3, 2010)

Killick said:


> No, Savannah is bad - very bad. Do not go there. It has long cold winters, and long brutal summers...and the food is also very bad...and the people are mean. In fact, it's so bad that I am constantly loading up the car and spending as much time as I can there just to remind myself how bad it is. It's so bad I dream about it all the time, and can't wait to put a boat there so I can more easily escape all that badness every weekend. Just watch "Forrest Gump" and see how ugly it is. Plus there are tidal waves, and earthquakes, and volcanoes, and...and...the rare saber-toothed bigfoot. No, North Carolina or Florida are definitely much better.
> 
> (Guitarguy - SHHH!! What are you thinking?? We gotta keep this on the downlow, man...otherwise everyone will want to move there!)


Whenever people here start complaining about the hurricanes we get, I always say, "We should get down on our knees every day and thank God for our hurricanes, because it we didn't have them, we would be just like south Florida, and we wouldn't be able to afford to live here."


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## sailor1950 (Dec 8, 2009)

Destin Fla


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## Gregrosine (Feb 10, 2013)

climbhike said:


> I'm also a Michigander but at this point I'm enjoying the change of seasons. Have skis and snowshoes and enjoy the best snow in 15 years. Went camping 3 weeks ago for one night, We have other toys we enjoy the three non-snow seasons, bikes and kayaks. Hiking and used to rock climb. Looking forwards to spring and getting out. Most family and especially grand kids are within a few hours drive so it's not an option to relocate. Maybe will feel different in 10 years. I'm looking forward now to retiring in a few years and cruising southern Lake Michigan and some trips with a trailer sailer to Traverse City, Harbor Springs or Mackinaw. Good luck with your search. Dave G


Change of seasons?!?! What change of seasons? It's still cold winter. It's been cold winter and it's been a nasty winter. I would love to have a change of season but when will that be? Now they're predicting because the Great Lakes are frozen solid that the thaw will be late and the lakes will be frigid this summer. No, I'm sorry, but as beautiful as Lake Michigan is with its fresh water and wonderful people, I think somewhere much warmer is what the good doctor orders.


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## guitarguy56 (Oct 10, 2012)

Killick said:


> No, Savannah is bad - very bad. Do not go there. It has long cold winters, and long brutal summers...and the food is also very bad...and the people are mean. In fact, it's so bad that I am constantly loading up the car and spending as much time as I can there just to remind myself how bad it is. It's so bad I dream about it all the time, and can't wait to put a boat there so I can more easily escape all that badness every weekend. Just watch "Forrest Gump" and see how ugly it is. Plus there are tidal waves, and earthquakes, and volcanoes, and...and...the rare saber-toothed bigfoot. No, North Carolina or Florida are definitely much better.
> 
> (Guitarguy - SHHH!! What are you thinking?? We gotta keep this on the downlow, man...otherwise everyone will want to move there!)


Yes I wasn't very honest! I forgot to mention the maneating alligators, rattlesnakes, diamondheads, coral snakes, giant mosquitoes, burrowing gnats at night, pollution from pulp mills, glow in the dark shrimp poisoned by the nuclear powerplant upstream on the Savannah River, nasty people at night partying up on the Riverfront... Then we get these parades twice a year that shuts the city down... Yeah stay away from Savannah! Thanks Killick as it would have been a disservice to bring people to this horrible place... there are better places to relocate to.


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## hpeer (May 14, 2005)

I'm surprised no one has mentioned Belize and/or Rio Dulce.


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## benesailor (Dec 27, 2012)

Belize is offering up dual citzenship for $2500(?) righy now with no tax on imports items to get set up, if i recall correctly. I read up on it a year ago or so. 
It's filling up with ex-pats. Won't be the place to be in 5 years.



> Yes I wasn't very honest! I forgot to mention the maneating alligators, rattlesnakes, diamondheads, coral snakes, giant mosquitoes, burrowing gnats at night, pollution from pulp mills, glow in the dark shrimp poisoned by the nuclear powerplant upstream on the Savannah River, nasty people at night partying up on the Riverfront... Then we get these parades twice a year that shuts the city down... Yeah stay away from Savannah! Thanks Killick as it would have been a disservice to bring people to this horrible place... there are better places to relocate to.


Savanna is the place to be ! It's wonderful ! :laugher


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## findrichard (Jan 16, 2014)

yes Savanna, GA is the place. Panama City FL has too many hurricanes and lightening storms. And this year it even had ice in the bay!


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## TerryBradley (Feb 28, 2006)

guitarguy56 said:


> Yes I wasn't very honest! I forgot to mention the maneating alligators, rattlesnakes, diamondheads, coral snakes, giant mosquitoes, burrowing gnats at night, pollution from pulp mills, glow in the dark shrimp poisoned by the nuclear powerplant upstream on the Savannah River, nasty people at night partying up on the Riverfront... Then we get these parades twice a year that shuts the city down... Yeah stay away from Savannah! Thanks Killick as it would have been a disservice to bring people to this horrible place... there are better places to relocate to.


I can deal with all of that except for the mosquitoes. They are real Apaches down there!


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## guitarguy56 (Oct 10, 2012)

TerryBradley said:


> I can deal with all of that except for the mosquitoes. They are real Apaches down there!


Not as large as the mosquitos found in places like Alaska... but they are aggressive and some carry the West Nile Virus... unfortunately while they do spray for mosquitos it's a fruitless effort as anyone knows in Savannah and the outlying areas are all shrimp hatcheries/nesting grounds in the marshes and savannahs of this area... this is also the reason gnats are out of control too... controlling these two pests mean losing the shrimp hatcheries/nesting grounds in the process... so economics will tell you which one won.


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## 2Gringos (Jan 4, 2008)

It's pretty amazing that out of nine pages of answers to the OP, everyone's imagination seems to stop at the US border. Did he say he had to stay within the USA? People are mentioning moving to Florida, with one of the selling points of retiring to Florida being that it's within sailing distance of the Bahamas. Uh....why not move to the Bahamas and skip the 100 degree stuff entirely?

Why not recommend the OP look into Panama, where US expats can live comfortably on social security alone?

Or Belize? Or someplace really interesting.

The best we can do for this guy is recommene Ponce PR? the USVI? that's all inside the USA. Why not just stay in Michigan and buy a sun lamp?

He asks about places to get away from the cold, to RETIRE with his BOAT and people start yammering on about the beauty of New England????

What are you guys smoking, to suggest retiring in New England to a man who is tired of the cold winters? Pretty useless advice.


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

Gee, I think the New England recommendations were for the warm months and to cruise south for the winter, where all your recommendations are possible. 

Factors, such as medical care, family visits or just the comfort of home all play in. Only the OP can fully account for these.


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## climbhike (Mar 29, 2013)

Gregrosine said:


> Change of seasons?!?! What change of seasons? It's still cold winter. It's been cold winter and it's been a nasty winter. I would love to have a change of season but when will that be? Now they're predicting because the Great Lakes are frozen solid that the thaw will be late and the lakes will be frigid this summer. No, I'm sorry, but as beautiful as Lake Michigan is with its fresh water and wonderful people, I think somewhere much warmer is what the good doctor orders.[/
> 
> Here's my recommendation.
> Step 1: Strap a snowblower to the foredeck.
> ...


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## Group9 (Oct 3, 2010)

benesailor said:


> Belize is offering up dual citzenship for $2500(?) righy now with no tax on imports items to get set up, if i recall correctly. I read up on it a year ago or so.
> It's filling up with ex-pats. Won't be the place to be in 5 years.
> 
> Savanna is the place to be ! It's wonderful ! :laugher


My wife and her girl friends like to travel to Belize and talks about us retiring there. I think the same thing as you, it's filling up too fast with ex-pats right now, same as Costa Rica has already done.

Panama is looking better and better, though.

If Cuba wasn't such a dump, and illegal for US citizens, you could retire there.

A friend of mine who went down there a couple of years ago ran into an American who was illegally living there. He would fly to Mexico once a month to get his disability deposit out of the bank in cash and then fly back to Cuba. He said he was living like a king on about $350 per month and the Cuban government was okay with it as long as he only spent the dollars where they told him to, (approved government vendors) and didn't let any of it get out to the regular people.


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## emcentar (Apr 28, 2009)

Right now my retirement dream is to have three places: little studio in NYC, a cabin in the Adirondacks (for summer), and a little cabana on the beach in Tulum, Mexico (winter). I'll AirBnB the residences when I'm not in them so they aren't vacant.

I'm sorry, you were asking about where to sail after retirement?  I got stuck at 'retirement'.


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## abrahamx (Apr 3, 2006)

I am pretty sure Florida would be real close to last on my list. I would be thinking s. california, tahitti, spain, greece, c. america, morocco, w. india. Just my thoughts.


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## Gregrosine (Feb 10, 2013)

The SE United States, particularly Savannah, is looking good, as does the USVI. I'm just not sure about living in a Central or South American country. I'm not opposed, but I just don't know anyone who has first hand experience being an expat.


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## Runshari (Feb 18, 2013)

Gregrosine said:


> The SE United States, particularly Savannah, is looking good, as does the USVI. I'm just not sure about living in a Central or South American country. I'm not opposed, but I just don't know anyone who has first hand experience being an expat.


And let's not forget...the piano goes where we go! But I'm ready to find a more forgiving climate...and ready to retire too!


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## findrichard (Jan 16, 2014)

Piano, guess you won't be living on the boat!


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## Runshari (Feb 18, 2013)

findrichard said:


> Piano, guess you won't be living on the boat!


I'm thinking I need a place to land...but who knows, living aboard could be interesting (and I could leave the piano with my daughter).


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## guitarguy56 (Oct 10, 2012)

Runshari said:


> I'm thinking I need a place to land...but who knows, living aboard could be interesting (and I could leave the piano with my daughter).


I could not imagine cruising for long periods and not have a piano/keyboard present... I'd go nuts... Isn't your boat large enough for a semi permanent upright digital? I think my practice digital at home (88 keys with weighted keys) would fit perfectly in the next boat I'm looking at.

Curious as to what style of piano you play... classical or contemporary music?

Have any music recorded we could enjoy anywhere?


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## Uricanejack (Nov 17, 2012)

How about the Pacific North West.
Not to cold.
Not to hot.
Beautiful.
lots of wild life.
Great places to visit.


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## miatapaul (Dec 15, 2006)

Seems like travelin easy has no issue with his piano. Of course it is electronic. 

Sent from my NookColor using Tapatalk


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## Shockwave (Feb 4, 2014)

With a boat you get to go where you want, plus if you don't like where you're at you can move.


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## outbound (Dec 3, 2012)

Faced with same issue. Good advice has already been given. Go cruising.stop off at the places that intrigue you. Stop if you think you found the spot. Everyone is different and things change. May want to snow bird a while to see if you really want to do this.


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## Group9 (Oct 3, 2010)

Shockwave said:


> With a boat you get to go where you want, plus if you don't like where you're at you can move.


That's what I did when I was cruising. I stayed in a place until I woke up one day, and said, "I'm tired of this place."


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## smurphny (Feb 20, 2009)

When on the boat after a couple of months, I can't wait to get home. When at home for a couple of months, can't wait to get out sailing again. One thing to consider when thinking about selling the land-based quarters and moving aboard full-time is whether you really want to be on a boat full-time. If you had a boat in the perfect place tied to a dock behind your house, would you be living in the boat? I doubt it.


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## Runshari (Feb 18, 2013)

guitarguy56 said:


> I could not imagine cruising for long periods and not have a piano/keyboard present... I'd go nuts... Isn't your boat large enough for a semi permanent upright digital? I think my practice digital at home (88 keys with weighted keys) would fit perfectly in the next boat I'm looking at.
> 
> Curious as to what style of piano you play... classical or contemporary music?
> 
> Have any music recorded we could enjoy anywhere?


I hadn't considered a keyboard...that could work! I'm classically trained, but I like a lot of different styles of music. I lean toward the romantic styles. I only play for me because i don't play all that well - I just really enjoy it. No recordings (which is a good thing!).

We're planning to visit Savannah sometime soon to scope it out and hope to hear you perform at the restaurant you suggested.


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## sesmith (Jan 24, 2013)

We're in the process of buying a place in Summerville, Sc. It's about a half hour from any of the marinas in Charleston and about 45 min to the beach. We won't be retiring for another 5 or 6 years, and are planning on renting the place out until then. Real estate prices are still pretty reasonable, but are on their way up, so we thought we'd take advantage of the current pricing and interst rates. If we change our mind later (and I doubt it after this winter), we can always sell it and buy elsewhere.


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## guitarguy56 (Oct 10, 2012)

Runshari said:


> I hadn't considered a keyboard...that could work! I'm classically trained, but I like a lot of different styles of music. I lean toward the romantic styles. I only play for me because i don't play all that well - I just really enjoy it. No recordings (which is a good thing!).
> 
> We're planning to visit Savannah sometime soon to scope it out and hope to hear you perform at the restaurant you suggested.


Yes... a keyboard will work and it's what I have here with me, I practice every chance I get... great that you love the romantics and so do I... my wife loves it when I play (she plays the violin so we play together)...

Would love to play for you and your significant other... I travel quite a bit and so we'll have to choose a date I'm home... but feel free to know the Savannah area as we have plenty of music bars/pubs, nightly music venues with local musicians... City Market is where you'd want to get out at night and enjoy the music scene... many of my musician friends play nightly.

Here is something I just recorded this morning, something I love playing as it gets my hands across the entire keyboard almost. 

Starlight Dance2


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## tempest (Feb 12, 2007)

I like the sailing in the Northeast from the Chesapeake to Maine ( though, I'm sure I'd like the PNW were I on the other coast) 

Instead of moving the boat south in winter and back (been there done that once). I've been thinking of selling the house and living and cruising aboard through the northern season, perhaps ending the season somewhere on the Chesapeake bay. Then renting somewhere warm for 4 or 5 months. to get out of the northern winter. That would give me the flexibility of changing scenery..until I decided where the next land purchase would be. A kayak could travel with me to fish and explore from.


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## zeehag (Nov 16, 2008)

start sailing somewhere and go until you like where you are or your boat breaks....fix it then go somewhere else....
who says one must retire in a specific place when there soo many places to go

latitude 19n is pretty nice....... might start there.


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## Group9 (Oct 3, 2010)

smurphny said:


> When on the boat after a couple of months, I can't wait to get home. When at home for a couple of months, can't wait to get out sailing again. One thing to consider when thinking about selling the land-based quarters and moving aboard full-time is whether you really want to be on a boat full-time. If you had a boat in the perfect place tied to a dock behind your house, would you be living in the boat? I doubt it.


We're kind of coming to the idea of six months cruising, six months hanging out at home. We have great weather here in the summers (except for the occasional hurricane) but the winters, while mild, aren't as mild as south Florida, the Bahamas, and the Caribbean.

We have decided that the perfect retirement life for us will be to keep the house, and then sailing away in November or December to the tropics, and returning in May, every year. That way we get to meet new friends, but keep the old and to have a base.


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## findrichard (Jan 16, 2014)

Good choice. We plan the same concept except we live in Florida so our trips to the Bahamas and southward may be shorter, more like 3-4 months.


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## guitarguy56 (Oct 10, 2012)

findrichard said:


> Good choice. We plan the same concept except we live in Florida so our trips to the Bahamas and southward may be shorter, more like 3-4 months.


What part of South Florida you live? I surely miss the weather and lifestyle there, if I ever went back it would be Jupiter or slightly south of Hobe Sound.


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## Group9 (Oct 3, 2010)

guitarguy56 said:


> What part of South Florida you live? I surely miss the weather and lifestyle there, if I ever went back it would be Jupiter or slightly south of Hobe Sound.


I used to live in Miami, and I miss the boating down there, but not much else. 

I have an ex-brother in law in Fort Myers, and I have to admit that it's not bad there, (but the water is a little skinny for a sailboat in most places).


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## guitarguy56 (Oct 10, 2012)

Group9 said:


> I used to live in Miami, and I miss the boating down there, but not much else.
> 
> I have an ex-brother in law in Fort Myers, and I have to admit that it's not bad there, (but the water is a little skinny for a sailboat in most places).


Miami's great... lots of old memories in that area (South Beach, Key Biscayne, etc.)...

Yes... the water is thin and this is another boat I'm looking at since it has a 2'-9" draft with centerboard up (Southerly 42RST)... most of my cruising will be the South Florida... all though the Gulf, and into the island chains and hope to bring the boat close to the beach as possible... this one will do it.

Hope to meet everyone here on Sailnet in a rendezvous in the Keys or other anchorages in the South Florida area.


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## aa3jy (Jul 23, 2006)

We're seriously considering taking our boat back to the country where it was originally built, where the American dollar goes further and the locals are friendly..

Clay 
S/V 'Tango'
Cabo Rico 34


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## Gregrosine (Feb 10, 2013)

aa3jy said:


> We're seriously considering taking our boat back to the country where it was originally built, where the American dollar goes further and the locals are friendly..
> 
> Clay
> S/V 'Tango'
> Cabo Rico 34


Fort Lauderdale?


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## findrichard (Jan 16, 2014)

Guitarguy, We live in Melbourne but are trying to relocate to Panama City where we recently bought a house - a handy man special. Panama City folks seem a bit more cordial then the Melbourne crowd and water-front is a lot less expensive there as well. The beaches is what first attracted us, they make you think you are in the Caribbean already.

We had a couple a few weeks back look at our house here in Melbourne who are living Jupiter and are trying to move here for the surfing and to get away from the high taxes in Jupiter.


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## Runshari (Feb 18, 2013)

aa3jy said:


> We're seriously considering taking our boat back to the country where it was originally built, where the American dollar goes further and the locals are friendly..
> 
> Clay
> S/V 'Tango'
> Cabo Rico 34


Where are you talking about? It sounds almost perfect!


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## night0wl (Mar 20, 2006)

Runshari said:


> Where are you talking about? It sounds almost perfect!


Cabos were built in Costa Rica...


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## findrichard (Jan 16, 2014)

Cabo Rico's were, and soon to be again, built in central america, Costa Rica I believe.


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## Gregrosine (Feb 10, 2013)

No one has mentioned the Texas coast. Anyone have any idea about this area for sailboats? I know there is a lot of fishing and motor boats.


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## xymotic (Mar 4, 2005)

svHyLyte said:


> Mark--
> 
> How many times can one do Catalina before it becomes something of a BTDT experience?


It's exactly 1.6354

I too would vote Oxnard before LA but in truth there's not a lot of destination type sailing

When I moved there from the PNW I was AMAZED that there are no next to zero restaurants with a dinghy dock etc in MDR Newport or Oxnard are better but in all honesty I'm not sure anywhere N of Oxnard's weather is That much better than Seattle's

And compared to Michigan the PNW weather is actually 'mild'
With a nearly infinite cruising ground

Take a month to go to Arizona or Mexico in the winter and it'd be a pretty good retirement plan I think

I'm fixing up a boat for my retirement and want to live in 90 degree days all day long but I haven't trucked the boat to Texas or San Diego etc because the first place I want to explore is right here

Mountains and the like are AMAZING and it takes a few years for the winter rain to bog you down (me anyway)

So there are caveats but I think PNW has a lot going on and coming from snow and ice I think you'd find it really nice here


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## Power For Sail (Mar 18, 2014)

findrichard said:


> Cabo Rico's were, and soon to be again, built in central america, Costa Rica I believe.


love it !!!


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