# Sloop vs. Fractional Sloop vs. Cutter



## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

I anticipate purchasing a 35-38 foot boat, primarily for single-handling in offshore waters, around the end of the year. I''ve done a lot of reading on the advantages and disadvantages of various rigs, and have come down to the 3 referenced in the subject line of this post. But I''m still a little confused. Here''s what I think I know at this point:

A sloop, with only 2 sails, offers the greatest degree of simplicity in sail-handling for a single-hander.

A fractional sloop offers the same 2-sail simplicity, but with the added benefit of a smaller foresail (jib or genoa).

A cutter, while adding the complexity of a 3rd sail, may offer easier sail-handling because each of the foresails is smaller. Plus, it may improve the ability to heave-to by keeping more sail area forward than a reefed jib on a sloop or fractional sloop.

I''ll very much appreciate any thoughts on this subject.


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## Jeff_H (Feb 26, 2000)

I had written this for another venue but might prove somewhat helpful.


Today these terms are used quite loosely as compared to their more traditional definitions. Traditionally the sloop rig was a rig with a single mast located forward of 50% of the length of the sailplan. In this traditional definition a sloop could have multiple jibs. Cutters had a rig with a single mast located 50% of the length of the sailplan or further aft, multiple headsails and reefing bowsprit. Somewhere in the 1950’s or 1960’s there was a shift in these definitions such that a sloop only flew one headsail and a cutter had multiple headsails and mast position became irrelevant. For the sake of this discussion I assume we are discussing the modern definition of a sloop and a cutter.

Historically, when sail handling hardware was primitive and sails were far more stretchy than they are today, the smaller headsails and mainsail of a traditional cutter were easier to handle and with less sail stretch, allowed earlier cutters to be more weatherly (sail closer to the wind) than the sloops of the day. With the invention of lower stretch sailcloth and geared winches, cutters quickly lost their earlier advantage. 

Today sloops are generally closer winded and easier to handle. Their smaller jibs and larger mainsail sailplan are easier to power up and down. Without a jibstay to drag the Genoa across, sloops are generally easier to tack. With less hardware sloops are less expensive to build. 

As you note sloops come in a couple varieties, masthead and fractional. In a masthead rig the forestay and jib originates at the masthead. In a fractional rig, the forestay originated some fraction of the mast height down from the masthead. Historically, sloops were traditionally fractionally rigged. Fractional rigs tend to give the most drive per square foot of sail area. Their smaller jibs are easier to tack and they reef down to a snug masthead rig. Today they are often proportioned so that they do not need overlapping headsails, making them even easier to sail. One of the major advantages of a fractional rigs is the ability when combined with a flexible mast, is the ability to use the backstay to control mast bend. Increasing backstay tension does a lot of things on a fractional rig: it tensions the forestay flattening the jib, and induces mast bend, which flattens the mainsail and opens the leech of the sail. This allows quick depowering as the wind increases and allows a fractional rig to sail in a wider wind speed range than masthead rig without reefing, although arguably requiring a bit more sail trimming skills. 

While fractional rigs used to require running backstays, better materials and design approaches have pretty much eliminated the need for running backstays. That said, fractional rigs intended for offshore use, will often have running backstays that are only rigged in heavy weather once the mainsail has been reefed. The geometry of these running backstays typically allow the boat to be tacked without tacking the running backstays. 

Masthead rigs came into popularity in the 1950’s primarily in response to racing rating rules that under-penalized jibs and spinnakers and so promoted bigger headsails. Masthead sloops tend to be simpler rigs to build and adjust. They tend to be more dependent on large headsails and so are a little harder to tack and so require a larger headsail inventory if performance is important. Mast bend is harder to control and so bigger masthead rigs will often have a babystay that can be tensioned to induce mast bend in the same way as a fractional rig does. Dragging a Genoa over the babystay makes tacking a bit more difficult and slower. While roller furling allows a wider wind range for a given Genoa, there is a real limit (typically cited 10% to 15%) to how much a Genoa can be roller furled and still maintain a safely flat shape. 

Cutters, which had pretty much dropped out of popularity during a period from the end of WWII until the early 1970’s, came back into popularity with a vengeance in the early 1970’s as an offshore cruising rig. In theory, the multiple jibs allow the forestaysail to be dropped or completely furled, and when combined with a reefed mainsail and the full staysail, results in a very compact heavy weather rig (similar to the proportions of a fractional rigged sloop with a reef in the mainsail). As a result the cutter rig is often cited as the ideal offshore rig. Like fractional rigs, cutter rigs intended for offshore use, will often have running backstays that are only rigged in heavy weather once the mainsail has been reefed. Unlike the fractional rig, the geometry of these running backstays typically requires that the running backstays be tacked whenever the boat is tacked. 

Cutters make a less successful rig for coastal sailing. Generally cutters tend to have snug rigs that depend on larger Genoas for light air performance. Tacking these large Genoas through the narrow slot between the Jibstay and Forestay is a much harder operation than tacking a sloop. As a result many of today’s cutters have a removable jibstay that can be rigged in heavier winds. This somewhat reduces the advantage of a cutter rig (i.e. having a permanently rigged and ready to fly small, heavy weather jib). 

Cutters these days generally do not point as close to the wind as similar sized sloops. Because of the need to keep the slots of two headsails open enough to permit good airflow, headsails cannot be pulled in as far as on a sloop without choking off the airflow in the slot. Since cutters are generally associated with the less efficient underbodies that are typical of offshore boats this is less of a problem that it might sound. Cutters also give away some performance on deep broad reaches and when heading downwind because the Genoa acts in the bad air of the staysail. 

There are a couple issues that are rarely talked about. You always hear about the greater flexibility of a cutter rig because the jib can be doused and still use the staysail as a storm sail. While a staysail is generally roughly the size of a stormsail it is generally a more powerful sail made from a lighter cloth than a proper storm sail. If properly cut as a storm sail, the staysail is of little use as a staysail in combination with a jib as it is cut way too flat. Also most boats develop greater weather helm in heavier air. The staysail is generally too far aft to balance the mainsail without a pretty deep reef in the mainsail. In that regard the smaller headsail on a fractionally rigged sloop when combined with a bladed out and reefed mainsail will often have a better balance. Lastly with a cutter there is often conditions where the jib is too large for the wind conditions but simply sailing under the staysail does not provide enough drive. Here the ability of a fractional rig to ''shift gears'' on the fly really comes into its own. 

Jeff


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## jack_patricia (May 20, 2001)

E:

I can only offer a few tidbits around the edges after Jeff''s thorough review.

I don''t think your characterization of a sloop is correct when applied to offshore sailing, as you''ll inevitably want to have an inner stay (Solent or staysail) when the wind starts to moan and the seas build. Simply rolling up a jib or genny part way and drawing that CE further forward is a bad alternative as it will stress the furling gear, put the furling line (and perhaps its tendency to chafe in severe going) to a real test, and provide a lousy sail shape. So...sloops look the simpliest when daysailing but suddenly start to become more complicated when set up for an offshore run. We''re very pleased with the Solent stay we installed (our boat is a ketch) but it does complicate things.

Cutters can, in one sense, be seen as coming in one of two versions: one is rigged with a boom to enable simplier rigging of the staysail sheet and traveler (not ''better'' mind you, just simplier) and which just might wap you in the ankles and toss you over the side, while the other is boomless and offers more running rigging, tracks etc. How nicely integrated all this is on the boat you end up considering will depend...but even when looking inside the ''cutter envelope'' of choices, there are some frustrating compromises. The most common of truths I heard from owners of cutter rigged boats is how infrequently they get much mileage out of that inner foresail and all its associated hardware.

Fractional rigs need additional heavy weather support (note Jeff''s referral to running backs) as the specific design of the fractional rig can look very sparse in the standing rigging department when you think about that stick being tossed about by a heavy sea. And oh my, aren''t we putting a lot of faith in that (normally) one forestay. There''s a very solid-looking Kiwi sloop down the dock from us right now, arriving here in London via the Indian Ocean and the Med, and she''s *very* fractional (3/4 at the most) despite being 43'' LOA. The couple sailing her have a nice hard dodger to hide under, and as long as they stay ahead of the mainsail as winds increase, they''re in good shape. There''s a lot to recommend that option, I would think, provided the boat is well designed for it.

Good luck on the search...

Jack


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## zperson (Jul 18, 2003)

Can anyone reccomend a good fractional rigged sloop in the 30-35 foot range that is under 50K. The boat should have as large a cockpit as possible. (I know the safety issues, but I am not going offshore, or even out of site of land)

I also looked online at a j36 and found it interesting as well, although I thought the cockpit was a little cramped.


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## zperson (Jul 18, 2003)

Can anyone reccomend a good fractional rigged sloop in the 30-35 foot range that is under 50K. The boat should have as large a cockpit as possible. (I know the safety issues, but I am not going offshore, or even out of site of land)

I also looked online at a j36 and found it interesting as well, although I thought the cockpit was a little cramped.


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## zperson (Jul 18, 2003)

Can anyone reccomend a good fractional rigged sloop in the 30-35 foot range that is under 50K. The boat should have as large a cockpit as possible. (I know the safety issues, but I am not going offshore, or even out of site of land)

I also looked online at a j36 and found it interesting as well, although I thought the cockpit was a little cramped.


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## msl (Jul 4, 2001)

I hope this isn''t a dumb question ... but I need to ask;

If one doesn''t have a fractional rig sloop, why not just fly a smaller headsail to reduce workload?

Also another question; exactly how does a fractional rig headsail offer more power than a masthead rigged headsail?

Thanks,
Mark L.


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## Jeff_H (Feb 26, 2000)

There are several aspects that make a fractional rig make more sense for cruising than a masthead rig. Because of the geometry of a fractional rig, where the forestay comes in below the masthead, it is very easy to control precisely mastbend with the backstay adjuster. On a fractional rigged boat, increasing backstay tension stretches the forestay and so flattens the jib and opens its leech, while mast bent flattens the mainsail and opens its leech. In effect, on control depowers both sails at once. Because of the ability to quickly and precisely depower, individual sails are adaptable to winder wind range and there is less reefing and sail changes required. For similar reasons a fractional rig can carry a proportionately larger mainsail and more sail area in its standing rig. Because a fractional rig can carry more sail area through a wider wind range in its standing rig, it can get by with smaller and few headsails. These smaller headsails represent a smaller portion of the overall sail plan and are much easier to tack and handle. Since most boats develop weather helm as the wind picks up a fractional rigged boat will often balance with its working jib and single reef which moves the center of effort forward and therefore reduces weather helm. For that matter the center of effort of a fractionally rigged boat is further forward allowing reasonably balanced sailing with only the mainsail. 

The reason that simply using a smaller jib on a masthead rig does not work is that since masthead rigged boats do not have the ability to carry sails through as wide a wind range they are usually designed with smaller standing sailplans. Therefore most masthead rigs are designed around using a genoa for light to moderate conditions. With a smaller jib on a masthead boat generally means that you lose the lower end of the windspeed range because do not have sufficient sail area for the conditions. By the same token, because masthead rig boats are usually designed to balance with a genoa, using a small jib with a full mainsail generally results in a boat that has more weather helm than is ideal. (The same problem happens in cutters when they sail under just the staysail). 

Jeff


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## msl (Jul 4, 2001)

Thank you, Jeff. I guess you know we save these explanations to study as we look for boats to dream of...do you have any favorites (other than the Laser 28''s) in the 30 to 36 foot range ?
Thanks again.
Mark L.


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## Jeff_H (Feb 26, 2000)

I have no idea what your budget is, where you sail or what your goals are, but there are a number of performance/ coastal cruisers/ racer-cruisers in this range although that seem like good boats to me, however not all of them are fractional (F)rigs:
(Boats with * are boats that I personally like above the others)
(Boats with $ should be under or around $50K)
Beneteau First 36.7 F*
Beneteau First 36s7 F
C&C 110 MH
Contessa 33 F * $
Dehler 34 F (Optima 101)$
Dehler 36 F
Dehler 33CR F
Express 30 (Goman) MH $
Express 34 (Alsberg)MH * $
Express 37 (Alsberg)MH *
Farr 1020 F *$(This would be my first choice under $50K)
Farr 1106 F
Farr 11.6 (Farr 38) Sometimes under $50K *(This actually was my first choice)
Farr 37 MH (Dickenson)
Hustler SJ30 F
J-33 MH $
J-34c MH *
J-35c MH *
J-36 (the J-36 is the only J on this list that is a fractional rig)
J-110
Kirby 30 F&MH $
Hinterhoeller F3 36 MH $
North Coast Wylie 34 /North Coast 10.3 MH&F $
Oyster 37 MH
Oyster SJ35 MH $
Oyster 34
Pearson Flyer 30 F $
Santa Cruz 33 $
Santana 35/36 F $
Santana 30/30 MH $
Schockwave 30 MH * $
Schock 35 MH
Sigma 36 F
Sigma 33 F&MH $
Sydney 36 MH
Sydney 32 F *
Tartan 10 F $
Tripp 33 F $
Wylie Hawkfarm F $
X 362
X 102 F $
X 332
X 99 F *$

That ought to keep you busy for a while.

Regards
Jeff


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## Jeff_H (Feb 26, 2000)

OOPs, Forgot the Soverel 33 F$ and the Soverel 30 MH$

Jeff


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## msl (Jul 4, 2001)

Thanks very much. It is just the kind of "busy" I never grow tired of...
Mark L.


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## msl (Jul 4, 2001)

...and one more comment to confuse matters. All the boats you listed are spectacular in design and performance, I''m certain.
So there sits a Pearson Triton, fractional rig and all, just to confuse things. Well, not really.
But for the sake of discussion, how would handling change if a Triton (or any of the others you listed) was modified from a fractional to a masthead rig? What sailing characteristic(s) would we notice (mastbend/backstay tensioning excluded)?
msl


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## Jeff_H (Feb 26, 2000)

In their orginal form, Tritons had a fair amount of weather helm. As a result, to mitigate the weather helm, a number of them were converted to masthead rigs with the addition of a bowsprit which worked reasonably well. Tritons did not have flexible rigs, so as you note, some of the advantages of a fractional rig related to ease of control of the degree of power were absent. On the other hand Tritons did have the advantage of having smaller headsails to handle.

It is important to understand that in the early days of the Bermuda rig, almost no boats were built as a masthead rig. Experiments reported in Manfried Curry''s book showed that fractional rigs were capable of generating more drive per given square foot of sail. It was only with the measuring loophole in the CCA rule (and later IOR rule) that did not tax the area of a genoa beyond the 100% foretriangle that masthead rigs became popular. 

So back to your example of the Triton, if you kept the sail area equal you would loose drive and speed. If you simply increased the forestay length to the mast head you would end up with an extremely high aspect ratio sail that would work well to windward but which would be hard to keep properly trimmed and which would not work well off of the wind. Of course going to a masthead rig of equal sail area and mast height as the original fractional rig would result in a boat that would heel more as well.

Jeff


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

Jeff H:

Thanks for your very thorough explanation of the relative advantages of fractional rigs. However, unless I''m mistaken, your list of favorite boats was focused more on performance types. I''m not as interested in performance as I am in stability. I want a boat with sufficient displacement and a full keel with enough sail area forward to facilitate heaving to in heavy weather. What boats would you recommend given these criteria, and would a fractional rig hold as many advantages over a masthead rig given a desire for stability as opposed to performance?


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## Jeff_H (Feb 26, 2000)

My list included a pretty wide range of boats. I believed that I was responding to a request for a coastal cruiser but included boats that ranged from stripped out racer/cruisers to boats like my own that were intended for distance offshore voyaging in safety.

If you are truely concerned about primarily about stability, I have no idea why you are looking for a heavy displacement/full keel boat. As I have explained before and unfortunately do not have the time to explain in detail tonight, newer fin keel boats tend to have a much lower VCG (more ballast stability) than more tradition full keel boats especially relative to their drag. This means that they not only have greater stability over a wide range of heel angles but they also can get by with much less sail area in a blow. 

When you say,"I want a boat with sufficient displacement and a full keel......to facilitate heaving to in heavy weather." I think that you have a very mistaken and outdated idea about what allows a boat to hove to safely in heavy weather. My fin keelers have generally hove to easier than the full length keel boats (Folkboat and 1939 Stadel Cutter) or long keeled boats (Pearson Vanguard) that I have owned. 

Fractional rigs work best with high stability, easily driven hulls and so are ill suited to the high drag/low stability of a heavy displacement/full keel boat. If you are going the heavy displacement/ full keel route you pretty much are stuck with the relative inefficiency of a very large sail plan carried low and at that point the best compromise in order to stretch out the sail plan horizontally is probably a cutter rig with all of the disadvantages that come with a cutter. It is very dated thinking but certainly reflects one posible route.


Respectfully
Jeff


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## DelmarRey (Aug 25, 2001)

Might I ask where the position of the mast on a fractional rig is in relation to the LWL or OAL, which ever applies? And compared to the position of a masthead rig?
From pictures I''ve seen it appears to be in the 30-40% foreward section. And if so, how is the mast stepped over the keel, which appears to be on the centerline abeam (the keel that is)?
Also, are there any mast height differences between the fractional and the masthead rigs and is it much trouble converting a masthead to a fractional rig? Which I''ve been contemplating, obviously.
Thanks, ......Del


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## Jeff_H (Feb 26, 2000)

Generally the mast on a fractionally rigged boat is further forward than it is on a masthead rig. The keel on a fractionally rigged boat is also generally a little bit forward of the position that it would be on a masthead rig. (This is part of the reason that Fractionally rigged boats will often track a little better than a mathead rig for an equal keel area on the other hand this is also the reason that Frac''s tend to kite more on the anchor.) The mast on a fractionally rigged boat is usually taller than the mast on a masthead rigged boat and these days are typically a tapered spar. Other differences is that a fractionally rigged boats used for cruising generally have swept back spreaders (10-15 degrees),usually do not have any forward lowers and usually have a single shroud chainplate positioned aft of the mast.Depending on the design of the boat, in most cases it is a pretty big job to convert a masthead rigged boat to a fractional rig. 

Jeff


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## DelmarRey (Aug 25, 2001)

Thanks Jeff for the reply! It appears there is more work than reasonable to convert. It would be better to just buy a vessel already set up for Frac''l rig. I have a tall rig (57'' mast) but its obviously the wrong style. I have double spreaders, with the shrouds directly p/s. I have cosidered a longer boom for more main sail but don''t know how that would affect the helm.

Del


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

Del
Jeff will be able to give a better answer, but a longer boom will help in light winds where the extra weather helm won''t be that much of a problem. Better would be a main with full upper battens and a full roach. You didn''t mention what your main is like. A good (new) main sail will make a big difference.

Gene


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

Oh, I forgot another problem with a long boom is the possibility of dipping it in the water when running. This can cause significant damage to boom and rig.

I know someone that converted to a furling boom that was about 3 feet longer than their existing one. They also raised it about a 1.5 feet. Looked odd to me but I think they were concerned about the dipping problem. 

Gene


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

Hi,

Hi,

You state that you are looking for sailing vessel, 35 feet, primarily for single-handling in offshore waters.

We live in a world were everybody out there has their own opinion. My dear friend JeffH being one of them. Jeff has always pressed the advantages of a fractional rigs. Fractional rigs work on the big Farr designed Volvo Challenge boats, that have a crew of eleven. Fractional rigs are also wonderful on the race course going around the buoys. This is the type of sailing that he does.

Now to my point. Seventy five percent of the cruising vessels out there are being single-handed, I mean actual world voyaging boats out there doing it, are CUTTERS. For a good reason. They work. Offshore, one will work under jib, staysail and main. This is a proven combination that works. In building winds and seas; one will reef the main; then after that partially furl the jib,; then as the wind builds, one throws in another second reef and furls the jib; then the sailor will have just the staysail up and double reef in the main; if the winds builds further, drop the main and staysail will carry the vessel to 50 knots; his vessel will be balanced, the center of effort is low and center; the autopilot works effortlessly, the crew is relaxed.

Take a survey of the boats doing the cruising, and see for yourself that it’s much different than the opinions of the sailors that sail the race courses.

I have always sailed successfully a cutter; if it was a Perry designed Norsemann 447, or a Pacific Secraft Crealock 34, or a Valiant 40, or a BCC28, or now a HR53. I’ve owned sailed 200K on these cutters. The design works.

Bernie
Solstice, HR53
RogueWave Yacht Sales


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

Hi,

You state that you are looking for sailing vessel, 35 feet, primarily for single-handling in offshore waters.

We live in a world were everybody out there has their own opinion. My dear friend JeffH being one of them. Jeff has always pressed the advantages of a fractional rigs. Fractional rigs work on the big Farr designed Volvo Challenge boats, that have a crew of eleven. Fractional rigs are also wonderful on the race course going around the buoys. This is the type of sailing that he does.

Now to my point. Seventy five percent of the cruising vessels out there are being single-handed, I mean actual world voyaging boats out there doing it, are CUTTERS. For a good reason. They work. Offshore, one will work under jib, staysail and main. This is a proven combination that works. In building winds and seas; one will reef the main; then after that partially furl the jib,; then as the wind builds, one throws in another second reef and furls the jib; then the sailor will have just the staysail up and double reef in the main; his vessel will be balanced, the center of effort is low and center; the autopilot works effortlessly, the crew is relaxed.

Take a survey of the boats doing the cruising, and see for yourself that it’s much different than the opinions of the sailors that sail the race courses.

I have always sailed successfully a cutter; if it was a Perry designed Norsemann 447, or a Pacific Secraft Crealock 34, or a Valiant 40, or a BCC28, or now a HR53. I’ve owned sailed 200K on these cutters. The design works.

Bernie
Solstice, HR53
RogueWave Yacht Sales


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## DelmarRey (Aug 25, 2001)

Gene, Thanks for the reply.
This is one reason for my Questions. My main is streached out and I planing for a replacement within a couple years. I''m not sure I would have the dipping problem. At present my boom is 14'' (luff= 46'')and I still have another 2'' to the back stay. I''ve been heeled over 35 degrees (normal is 15- 20 degrees) and my boom was a long way from the water in white caps and on the wind. Maybe if I were before the wind broaching deep swells, but that seems unusuall? My gooseneck is 8'' off the water and the vessel has a 12'' beam. A longer boom would serve two purposes, one of them would get the traveler out of my cockpit, the other, I would hope for better light air performance.

Del


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

Del, a longer boom would help you downwind but will hurt you upwind in anything over light winds. You will have to reef earlier due to the weather helm, and in so doing you loose sail area up high, which helps the boat point higher. Also, 2 feet of clearance to the backstay does not sound like alot to me. Be sure to measure with the boom raised until it is perpendicular to the backstay, one would hate an acidental jibe cause the boom to hit the back stay.

Gene


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## DelmarRey (Aug 25, 2001)

Gene, Good point on the back stay! I guess I should just get a QUALITY new mainsail when the time comes. I keep trying to improve this old IOR racer, but it seems I should just leave well enough alone when it comes to the rigging. I will be adding a genoa furling though. Thanks ...........Del


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## xizeekS (Jan 21, 2016)

Newbie post, but familiar with internet forums. I apologize for resurrecting a long-idle thread. I hope this is worthwhile. The theory explanation on fractional rigs was excellent.

The list of boats for the OP was great too ... but a little too big for my needs. I wondered if a list of smaller boats would be helpful to folks. I have not yet found a way to search for boats by rigging details. Sailboatdata.com is a great site but I haven't found a way to search by particular details.

My specific quest is for boats with a 32 foot mast and a boom slightly over 12 feet. A little longer would be better than a little shorter, as I could cut long ones down. Single spreader, about midway would be nice. Older boat that is more likely to have quality bronze hardware. I hope to find one that is a headshaker for renovation because the hull or decks are poor, and scavenge hardware. Or one in better shape to sail a while then cannibalize. The stuff is for a Marples DC-3 trimaran. There is a discussion of it with a link to a sailplan pdf. Sorry, as a newb I can't post links, so put an h in front of this ...

ttp://smalltrimarans.com/blog/dc-3-trimaran-model-wins-woodenboat-design-challenge-iii/]DC-3 Trimaran Model Wins WoodenBoat Design Challenge III

I have been in contact with John Marples and I am doing feasibility research before buying plans. Thanks in advance for any help.


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## robert sailor (Jun 22, 2015)

Interesting discussion. Personally I'm not crazy about modern fraction rigs being easy offshore. They usually have large swept back spreaders that don't allow the main to be eased out as far as a mast head rigg with straight spreaders and double lowers when sailing down wind. Usually you end up sailing underpowered with a fraction rig because reefing large sails is a pain in the butt. Down wind it's better to have more drive coming from the headsail/headsail which makes it easier on the vane or autopilot to steer. I'm not going to debate Jeff because he is right about the fraction rig advantage but in my experience 90% of the sailors I have run into do not have the racing background nor the skill to get the best out of a fraction rig offshore. Just my opinion!


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## SanderO (Jul 12, 2007)

Shiva is a 7/8 fractional w/ a deep fin. She's sailed 10s of thousands of miles offshore.

Not being able to get the boom way out may present less sail area to the wind... but dipping the end of the boom is more likely I suppose. In light air it's not a problem of course.

In heavier air you can run with head sail poled out which works well.

The big sail is heavier and requires more and maybe deeper reefs. I am using the Dutchman system and the big sail is quite controllable.... even single handing which is most of what I do. The boat sails well w/ main alone.

Then of course a monster genny on a masthead rig can be a ***** to deal with!


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## newt (Mar 15, 2008)

I am a big fan of the staysil/reefed main combination. Great for night, when you have unsettled weather, but you till need to go upwind. A roller reefed jib just does not act the same IMHO. I am very conservative however and usually slow down at night and keep the radar on when I am coastal.


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## xizeekS (Jan 21, 2016)

So can anybody help me to get a list of fractional-rigged monos in the 26-30 foot range, mast length 32 feet or so?


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## outbound (Dec 3, 2012)

Jeff makes a very strong case for fractionals and Bernie has sold more cutters than anyone but tend to agree with Robert. When singling the biggest sail you have flying is your biggest concern. Going on deck means you are away from the helm. You try to eliminate all spots where you are dependent on one thing. 
With the ocean going frac you have one backstay you are dependent on or you are reefed at or below your runners. Then you have one forestay you are dependent on. You have one big arse main. Down wind you will have main on preventor and genny on pole. Whereas no main and double headsail rig option is lost to you. With one jib on a roller either it's too small or too large or rolled to a lousy shape. Going forward to change jibs using a foil on a roller is something I hate to do in a slip let alone in a seaway by myself. 
I like the belt and suspenders attitude. Have a masthead Solent . Rig a storm sail stay before passage and runners. Therefore can fly the headsail cut correctly for the wind speed without leaving the cockpit upto storm force winds. Then remove sail tie holding storm jib down and fly that as needed. Little to no deck work. Especially as I also have a very deep third reef in the main so no try sail.
Have three fore stays and three backstays. Maybe if I go turtle I lose the stick but decreases stress on the rig and can always get rid of any pumping. Watching a mast pump is scary.
Absence of jack stays means no need to go up the rig if something fails.
Yes have hydraulic backstay to de power and use it. Still think "reef early reef often" as it brings center of effort down is the main way to go. 
When tired and stressed, particularly at night, just want to keep tell tails straight back and boat flat as possible. Sure tweak traveler, vang, backstay, out haul and halyard. But there are a lot of times enough is enough. Think this rig is more forgiving and easier.
Biggest drawback is coastal with the genny up. Then you need to roll the genny in before tacking a PITA. However, even in light air lose about a knot just using the Solent so live with it. Offshore it's irrelevant given how infrequent you tack. Never understood self tacking jibs on an offshore boat. Losing ability to move car and change sheet angle seems just stupid.


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## outbound (Dec 3, 2012)

Jeff could you discuss mast pumping? Particularly as it relates to different rigs and spreader positions?


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## bobperry (Apr 29, 2011)

"Jeff could you discuss mast pumping? Particularly as it relates to different rigs and spreader positions?"


In 25 words or less.


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## outbound (Dec 3, 2012)

Nah was hoping for a haiku


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## outbound (Dec 3, 2012)

Wanted to tell you in a letter. But didn't have time so wrote a book.


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## Caribbeachbum (Feb 23, 2014)

outbound said:


> Nah was hoping for a haiku


wind sings and mast pumps
rigging whispers soft commands
tighten the backstay


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## bobperry (Apr 29, 2011)

Damn it Bum, that was very good.


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## outbound (Dec 3, 2012)

Too bad he couldn't stick "running" in there. But it was awesome. Thanks so much you made me ( and I hope many others) smile.


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## Brent Swain (Jan 16, 2012)

outbound said:


> Jeff could you discuss mast pumping? Particularly as it relates to different rigs and spreader positions?


I use rigging wire running back stays from the point of staysail attachment on the mast. Takes the pumping right out. Even crossing Hecate Strait in 50 knots of wind without the staysail , it was nice to have it set up. Coming home from Tonga ,the first 4,000 miles hard on the wind, I set the windward runner up on a turnbuckle, and it stayed there for 4,000 miles ,each time. Gave a lot of peace of mind.


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