# New to forum looking for sailing accident investigations



## lc130 (Nov 13, 2021)

Hi All

I'm a small boat, harbor sailor looking to advance my knowledge to safe coastal cruising. I work as a pilot for a major airline. Throughout my flying career NTSB accident investigations were (are) a great source of learning. Are sailing accident investigations undertaken and published somewhere? I'm not able to find a repository online. Is there a periodical I can subscribe to?

Thank you

Charlie 
Annapolis MD


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## tempest (Feb 12, 2007)

Try Boat U.S. to start. 

This might be helpful:

https://uscgboating.org/library/accident-statistics/Recreational-Boating-Statistics-2020-Revised.pdf 

There's an annual report published. . 

.


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## paulk (Jun 2, 2000)

As Tempest suggests, the Coast Guard keeps this information and has suggestions on how to stay safe. Try looking around here www.uscgboating.org and elsewhere on their site. The annual accident report gets boring because it generally shows that motorboats and alcohol are responsible for most accidents. Incidents involving sailboats tend to be when a powerboat hits one. Sailboats having accidents by themselves tend to be pretty rare, statistically speaking.


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## MarkofSeaLife (Nov 7, 2010)

We have a subforum here that maybe of use Vessels Lost, Missing, or in Danger

Only a very few countries do judicial investigations and then only if loss of life has occurred. 

Certainly it's not like the Aviation industry where they investigate insignificant incidents like movie stars landing on the wrong runway.  

Mark 😊


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## capttb (Dec 13, 2003)

There are investigations when a death occurs during racing events but no sort of organized compilation I'm aware of. Some of been quite alarming, like the Farallones race and the Newport/Ensenada where boats crashed into islands in the dark. Mostly you need to relax a little, if your sailboat engine dies you don't fall from the sky, you are just late for dinner,
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fatal_accidents_in_sailboat_racing


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## lc130 (Nov 13, 2021)

Thank you. Yes, not as dangerous. I've gained a lot of virtual experience studying air mishaps. It's allowed me to build a mental list of things not to do. 

Youtube has videos of ferries plowing into sailboats. What did the sailor do to get himself in that spot?? Not pay attention, misread the chart?? 

How do you best avoid losing a rudder. Is it simply not running into anything and is that avoidable other than groundings? Is it due to lack of maintenance? 

I'm in a position where I don't know what I don't know.


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## lc130 (Nov 13, 2021)

also...I've read books about sailors getting caught in storms. They end up in a CG helicopter. Was the storm not forecast? Are marine storms as avoidable as they are in aviation just by paying attention to the forecast and onboard radar?

Thanks for any insight


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## requiem (Jul 24, 2018)

Here's one repository: Marine Accident Investigation Branch reports

Other organizations will do so as well, but the higher profile events will usually make the rounds of the forums.

Even accidents involving larger ships are useful because similar dynamics are often at play: not keeping a good lookout, making assumptions, not taking action in good time, deviating from ColRegs, etc. With a small boat you often have more leeway to put things off until the last minute or cut things close, and this can lead to trouble.


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## boatpoker (Jul 21, 2008)

Canadian Marine Transportation Safety Investigation reports


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## tempest (Feb 12, 2007)

lc130 said:


> Are marine storms as avoidable as they are in aviation just by paying attention to the forecast and onboard radar?
> 
> Thanks for any insight


In my opinion, yes, as regard to "Coastal" Sailing. From my observations over the years, those that get into trouble try to force a schedule. I don't count a brief summer squall as a storm, though. They can bring serious winds, but, that's something that one needs to be prepared to manage.


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## capttb (Dec 13, 2003)

He got in front of a ferry, big ships move at a speed that can't be judged by an observer in a sailboat, like an airliner overhead looks pretty slow. I learned very young when I thought I had plenty of room to pass in front of an inbound container ship in my fast moving Lido 14. Coming out the Golden Gate once I pointed out an inbound ship to the boat's owner. He said "We need to tack now and cross in front of him or it'll be too late", "Oh No" I said "he's doing 20-25 knots, we tack when we're abeam and cross behind". As the ship zipped by he said "I guess that's why your the captain", didn't stop him from insisting on doing the wrong thing several more times.


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## Arcb (Aug 13, 2016)

I think people get caught in storms for various reasons, but knowingly sailing in marginal conditions is probably a large contributing factor. Weather forecasting is pretty good.

One major difference between sailing and flying is sailboats need wind to sail. Almost no point in going out in calm conditions. So you may have a forecast of 15-25 knots. 15, perfect sailing, 25 knots may be marginal for some, especially close to shore features. 

Schedules also play a role. Aircraft are quick. As long as the forecast is accurate for the next couple of hours, you should be good to go. But on a sailboat where a trip may take 1, 2, 3, 20 days there is a lot more uncertainty with regards to the forecast.

There are a good number of boaters on the water with very limited knowledge with regards to both navigation and boat handling.

Even getting a private pilots license is a fairly in depth process with weeks of both ground school and flight experience with a knowledgeable instructor.

The only pre requisite to own a 30, 40 or 50 ft boat is often just having enough 0's in your bank account.

Combination of factors. We all make mistakes once in a while for varying reasons.


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## MarkofSeaLife (Nov 7, 2010)

I was given a book "25 Famous Sailing Stories" at the beginning of a solo trans Atlantic passage. 

It was 25 ship wrecks. 

I threw it overboard as I don't need to read negative stuff. 

Amazingly, I survived. 

Sailing/boating is easy. Don't let fear be the key. 

Mark 😊


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## capttb (Dec 13, 2003)

MarkofSeaLife said:


> I was given a book "25 Famous Sailing Stories" at the beginning of a solo trans Atlantic passage.
> 
> It was 25 ship wrecks.
> 
> ...


When we got our first keel boat my in-laws gave my wife the book "Cape Horn: One Man's Dream, One Women's Nightmare". Horrible book, Like cruising with Captain Bligh from his wife's perspective, if Bligh wasn't a great seaman.
Cape Horn


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## lc130 (Nov 13, 2021)

boatpoker said:


> Canadian Marine Transportation Safety Investigation reports


Thanks. This and the UK site is what I was after.


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## Waltthesalt (Sep 22, 2009)

lc130 said:


> Hi All
> 
> I'm a small boat, harbor sailor looking to advance my knowledge to safe coastal cruising. I work as a pilot for a major airline. Throughout my flying career NTSB accident investigations were (are) a great source of learning. Are sailing accident investigations undertaken and published somewhere? I'm not able to find a repository online. Is there a periodical I can subscribe to?
> 
> ...


Practical Sailor has some useful info (though my wife thinks the term PS is an oxymoron). US Sailing has equipment/vessel standards for different sailing areas, close to shore, coastal, off shore etc. There's a book
*How to Avoid Huge Ships* that is interesting. One thing that there isn't data on boats that sink with all aboard. The Seven Seas Cruising Association has a lot of info on deep water sailing.

.


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## Barquito (Dec 5, 2007)

I think there was a movie "A Million Ways to Die in the West". I don't really remember it very well, but presumably there were a lot of ways to screw up in the Old West and get dead. The same is true with boating. Any screw-up can lead to other things, that lead to sinking, fire, onboard injury, or any of the few ways you might die on a sailboat. It really is a matter just always looking to improve your chances as you learn to sail. Obviously, as a newer sailor, if you jumped in a boat to sail around Cape Horn, you would be in trouble. Just as you would not fly cross-country and land on an aircraft carrier at night on your first solo flight.

BTW, every sailing accident that has ever happened anywhere on the planet has probably been talked to death on Sailnet!


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## Overdue (Jun 14, 2021)

An old adage from aviation comes to mind as equally applicable to sailing: "There are old pilots, and there are bold pilots, but there are no old - bold pilots". 
I think most would agree to respect the sea and weather, and know your (and your boat's) limitations.


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## MarkofSeaLife (Nov 7, 2010)

Barquito said:


> "A Million Ways to Die in the West".


Official Trailer (imdb.com)


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