# Beneteau loses rudder..boat sinks



## camaraderie (May 22, 2002)

This Benny 40.7 had it's rudder snap en route from Nap town to Newport and the 6 person crew could not stop the water. Coast Guard rescued the 6 crew but sadly the boat was lost. 
Six rescued from sailboat off Shinnecock Inlet -- Annapolis -- Newsday.com
Not a good weekend for LI waters as a J80 racing lost its' keel...again all hands safe.


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## Giulietta (Nov 14, 2006)

40.7 or 44.7 may be.. model 40.9 doesn't exist


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## chucklesR (Sep 17, 2007)

Giu is of course an expert on boats that are close cousins to his


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## Giulietta (Nov 14, 2006)

chucklesR said:


> Giu is of course an expert on boats that are close cousins to his


Chuck...a few more days now...you'll be in the "cousin" too....


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## nk235 (Apr 8, 2007)

camaraderie said:


> This Benny 40.9 had it's rudder snap en route from Nap town to Newport and the 6 person crew could not stop the water. Coast Guard rescued the 6 crew but sadly the boat was lost.
> Six rescued from sailboat off Shinnecock Inlet -- Annapolis -- Newsday.com
> Not a good weekend for LI waters as a J40 racing lost its' keel...again all hands safe.


Cam,

Do you have any info on the J40 keel loss? An article maybe?

Thanks


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## T37Chef (Oct 9, 2006)

Boats are just falling apart left & right, or would that be port & starboard?


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## chucklesR (Sep 17, 2007)

Giulietta said:


> Chuck...a few more days now...you'll be in the "cousin" too....


You realize of course I'm going to scream like a girl the first time the wind hits

(no offense intended to the ladies of sailnet, most of whom can outsail me).


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## artbyjody (Jan 4, 2008)

T37Chef said:


> Boats are just falling apart left & right, or would that be port & starboard?


Actually with the rudders - this would be "Boats falling apart Forward to Aft"...


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## NOLAsailing (Sep 10, 2006)

The J Boat that lost it's keel was a J/80. All of these issues have my attention - I have an offshore race scheduled for late this month. Well be paying a lot of attention to safety.

Safety first, race second.


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## T37Chef (Oct 9, 2006)

artbyjody said:


> Actually with the rudders - this would be "Boats falling apart Forward to Aft"...


Umm...good point!


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## MysticGringo (Oct 9, 2006)

I didn't know that Beneteau got its rudders from Novis Marine.


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## camaraderie (May 22, 2002)

My bad...fumble fingers:
The Benny documentation lists 
BEY22218A000 Ship Builder:*Year Built:* 

Length (ft.):39.3
so I don't know what exact model it was...just not the 44 footer as reported.

As to the J40....it was indeed a J80 in a race on LIS and there is a thread on SA about it for anyone interested in more details here:
J80 Loses Keel - Sailing Anarchy Forums

Also pix on this thread:
Spritfest '08 - Sailing Anarchy Forums


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## wakked1 (Apr 26, 2007)

Though that article at least makes no mention of losing the rudder. It just states that "a crack or hole near the rudder was the suspected cause." Which could mean any number of things.


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## CharlieCobra (May 23, 2006)

I just read a post from the boat owner's Son Jimmy on SA. It was a 40.7 and the rudder post snapped off. It took an hour for the boat to sink. All hands were safe. Due to wave action they couldn't tow the boat and had to let her sink.


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## lowtide (Mar 23, 2008)

not to hijack this thread----but---- it seems like every time I go to 
SA it reminds me why I come here


I dont think the A in SA stands for anarchy 

I somehow doubt the flamers over there would be so tough if the posters were in the same room, but from the safety of their keyboard they are badasses----hehe


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## camaraderie (May 22, 2002)

lowtide...would a F.O.N. make you feel more comfortable over here?   
I agree...but I do enjoy Fridays!


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## Giulietta (Nov 14, 2006)

I like SA....and I speak really foul language there....but I will never tell anyone who I am,...

So I can tell all the Aholes to lick my scrotum....

SA has helped me learn how to verbally defend myself in English


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

The rudder stock on my boat is in a separate compartment, and even if it floods, it won't fill the rest of the boat with water.  I don't know why monohulls don't do this...especially when they have a big weight wanting to drag them down under the sea...


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## Freesail99 (Feb 13, 2006)

> I somehow doubt the flamers over there would be so tough if the posters were in the same room, but from the safety of their keyboard they are badasses----hehe


There are a lot of "badasses" on the internet....


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## DrB (Mar 29, 2007)

*How is this possible? I mean really......*

I am not familiar with the boat at all, but how big does a rubber on a boat have to be to snap and create a hole to let enough water in an hour to flood and sink a boat.

Was the owner on the boat? They had six people on the boat. Couldn't they figure out a technique to slow the egress of water in to a point that the bilge pump to somewhat keep up? I mean if it was me and my boat. I'd sure as hell would find something to stuff into the hole to help slow the inflow of water.

The displacement on the boat is about 15,500 lbs and it has a keel about 5500 lbs, 10,000 lbs is displaced water weight (roughly). Let say it takes 3500 of additional weight to sink her, that is roughly 400 gallons of sea water, 400/60 is a little under 7 gallons a minute, which is not that big of a hole, I can't see how that could not be partially plugged to reduce the water flow. What happend to the bilge pumps. Are not most bilge pumps set up to handle much more than 7 gallons a minute?

I don't see how this could happen with a competent owner/caption on board.

DrB


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## lowtide (Mar 23, 2008)

my guess it was 7 gpm more than everything they could possibly do


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## camaraderie (May 22, 2002)

Dr. B...the coast guard put large dewatering pumps on board and even they couldn't keep the boat afloat under tow in the conditions. I wouldn't blame the capt/crew on this one as it must have been a BIG rip in the post area.


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## Giulietta (Nov 14, 2006)

DrB said:


> The displacement on the boat is about 15,500 lbs and it has a keel about 5500 lbs, 10,000 lbs is displaced water weight (roughly). Let say it takes 3500 of additional weight to sink her, that is roughly 400 gallons of sea water, 400/60 is a little under 7 gallons a minute, which is not that big of a hole, I can't see how that could not be partially plugged to reduce the water flow. What happend to the bilge pumps. Are not most bilge pumps set up to handle much more than 7 gallons a minute?
> 
> I don't see how this could happen with a competent owner/caption on board.
> 
> DrB


A lot of the times, a rudder post is not completely accessible from inside with the boat banging and all that..

Just to give you an example, last weekend I diod some work on Sailortjk's rudder quadrant, and tried doing it while at anchor in a waveless area..impossible..I'd get sea sick in 5 minutes..

Instead I had to do it later while in the marina, and was working thru a hole 1 foot wide, on my back..

That could have been the issue...we don't know..

Has nothing to do with the captain, buty with the circunstances...seas, space available, where the crack was etc...

we don't know...simple as that...


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

DrB-

Most bilge pumps are rated in GPH (GALLONS PER HOUR) not GPM, and are rate for ZERO LIFT... Their actual effective capacity is much lower, especially if you have four or five feet of lift, as might be the case in a 40' monohull sailboat.

A big electric bilge pump, like the Rule 1500, which is about what is found on most boats, only does 25 GPM, at zero head. If you increase the head to five feet, the actual output may only be 10 GPM. Say the rudder stock on the 40' beneteau is 3" in diameter. Say the rudder stock opening is two feet below the waterline, so we have a 3" diameter hole with a 2' depth. That would allow about 84 GPM in the boat. Q (in GPM) = 20 * D (diameter of hole in inches) * Sqrt (H) (depth of hole in feet). Q = 20 * 3 * 1.4. 

*Given no bilge pumps, a 3" diameter hole two feet below the surface would allow in over 400 Gallons of water in just five minutes. 

*Let's be optimistic, and say the rudder stock is only 2" in diameter. Q = 40 * 1.4 = 56 GPM... so it would only take eight minutes to allow 400 Gallons of water aboard. With a Rule 1500 running full tilt at zero head, you'd still be taking on 31 gallons per minute... and in less than 15 minutes, you'd have over 400 gallons of water aboard.

Again, why do they make it so that the loss of a rudder can sink a boat???


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## Rockter (Sep 11, 2006)

If the leak is in an inaccessible place, or in an initially accessible place that floods rapidly and drives you out of there, then it will be very difficult indeed to save the ship.

Another lesson I read about a long time back was that if you are being towed in a big sea, BUOY THE TOW LINE!!!! Use your fenders if need be.
One sailboat I read of was being towed and over-ran her tow line in a big sea, the warp went round the rudder, tightened with a big tug, and tore off the rudder, and with it a big hole opened up. They could not stop the leak and they lost her.


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## ccriders (Jul 8, 2006)

*Steering tubes*



sailingdog said:


> The rudder stock on my boat is in a separate compartment, and even if it floods, it won't fill the rest of the boat with water.  I don't know why monohulls don't do this...especially when they have a big weight wanting to drag them down under the sea...


The rudder stock on my old pearson 28 travels through a glassed in compartment/tube that runs from the hull to the deck. Hopefully when the rudder "snaps off" I'll just be blowin in the wind and not sinking to the bottom.


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## CalebD (Jan 11, 2008)

In 7 - 9 foot seas it would not be easy to plug a hole (whatever the cause) with water sloshing around in the bilge. Water temps are still quite cold near LI as well. 
It is too easy to ask how and why without having actually being there. This is just another reminder of why we all need to be ever vigilant about our boats systems, especially in a blue water, ocean environment. There are no travel lifts nearby anywhere.
Sad story, sunken boat but that fact is that nobody drowned or died. It sounds like they did what they could and moved on. 
It is pretty deep 15 miles south of Shinnecock so the only danger is to draggers (haul seine fishing boats) that might catch the mast or hull.
I guess why their nickname is 'Bendytoe'! I just covered 400+ nm on a 51' Benne from Tortola to Provo and it performed marvelously. The owner/captain was on board and knows his boat like he knows himself. 
Ship happens.


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## chucklesR (Sep 17, 2007)

chucklesR said:


> You realize of course I'm going to scream like a girl the first time the wind hits
> 
> (no offense intended to the ladies of sailnet, most of whom can outsail me).


To who ever the nameless a hole who gave me negative rep with the comment 'no offence taken' (spelling error yours not mine) for the above:

Sorry my friend you didn't have enough rep to actually post any negative points.
Try getting some rep before you hurt others for posting what was so obviously a joke.


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

Wow! and I thought Benys were offshore capable...


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## Giulietta (Nov 14, 2006)

Here we go...

this week's chosen for the Sailnet bashathon is Beneteau....

I rather sail a new Beneteau (any model) today than an old POS Valiant from 1978.....


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## Cruisingdad (Jul 21, 2006)

Giulietta said:


> A lot of the times, a rudder post is not completely accessible from inside with the boat banging and all that..
> 
> Just to give you an example, last weekend I diod some work on Sailortjk's rudder quadrant, and tried doing it while at anchor in a waveless area..impossible..I'd get sea sick in 5 minutes..
> 
> ...


I heard you would have never gotten it done without the direction of a particular Guy...

Shame, shame, shame - not mentioning yourself as the apprentice.

- CD


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## billyruffn (Sep 21, 2004)

I'm booked to help bring one of these Bendy 44s back from Bermuda! I wonder what the warning signals of this rudder failure might be.


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## camaraderie (May 22, 2002)

Well I would not call this a bash Bendy thread. In the last year that I can remember we have seen rudders come off a Hunter a Jeanneau and a Beneteau during open water sailing an NOT during storm conditions. The common feature is that all were spade rudders. Haven't heard of any rudders falling off full keel vessels or full skeg vessels at sea in recent memory. Perhaps THAT is worth considering more than the particular brand involved in an incident.


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## Giulietta (Nov 14, 2006)

Billy...of all people here you should know better..

The rudders are actually pretty well designed, (well if you compare to a C&C 121, they are 500% stronger)....

They are the regular tube with a cross beam X stiffening and the tube upper section is way above water line.

You should fear all failures in a Beneteau but a rudder one.

The boat in question was a 40.7, a First series, often the race boats get profiled rudders, and go thru a process of "weight loss"...

We don't know if the rudder was modified or not..I have never ever heard odf a Beneteau losing a rudder...or if I did I don't remember...

Fear other things, instead, such as deck hull joinery, and leaky ports...


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## billyruffn (Sep 21, 2004)

I passed the url on this article to the owner/skipper of the boat I'll be crewing back from Bermuda. He has some insight into the possible problems this boat encountered and the solution he implemented when he owned a B 40.7. Thinking his comments might be of interest to those gathered here, I asked his permission to quote from his email to me. It's below:

----

Scott,

As near as I can tell, "Making Waves" is a Beneteau First 40.7 (unless
he also traded in recently). It sounds like he dropped his rudder. On
my previous boat which was a 40.7, I noticed that the rudder bearing
bolts were undersized and were enlarging their holes because they had
insufficient bearing surface. I drilled them out to a larger size and
replaced them and sealed them with 5200. The 40.7 used a vectran rope
steering system instead of a chain drive which needed to be tightened to
an extreme level to keep it from slipping (thus loading up the bearing
with the tension in the vectran line running to the quadrant. I had
many problems with this steering system and it was one of the reasons I
sold the boat. The 44.7 has a very large chain drive system (much
better and more reliable) that doesn't require enormous tension to keep
it from slipping like the vectran (high tech) solution.

So far I haven't had any problems with the 44.7's steering and rudder.
However, one can never be too careful. I'll look at the bearing and see
if the screws need to be sized up (I've been inspecting them from time
to time). I will also contact Beneteau and the other owners to see if
anyone else has noticed a problem or implemented a fix.

Other than that, we carry several devices for sealing the rudder post
hole if we have the unfortunate situation of dropping our rudder. One
is a simple nerf football and the second thing is a wax toilet seal. We
also carry back up steering gear.

Thanks for the article.

------

Note his suggestions for gear to deal with this type of emergency (nerf football  ). His comments also exhibit the kind of "attention to detail" that it takes to be safe offshore. Gives me confidence that I'll be sailing with a competent skipper.


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

Be aware that a Sponge Bob Square Pants nerf-type foam football was used to save a fishing boat in the last year or so.


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## Vasco (Sep 24, 2006)

Enough uninformed speculation, for the Owner/Skipper's report go here.

Beneteau Owners | Google Groups


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

Vasco-

That link is less than useful, since you not only have to log into google groups, but must be a member to read the archives.


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## Giulietta (Nov 14, 2006)

Interesting though..

My rudder is also a composite material quadrant, commanded from the 2 wheels by Dyneema cables. Like the 40.7 however it has been modified and well engineered to prevent any of this from happening.

The difference is each line is bolted to tyhe quadrant with a biolt to adjust tension, so there is no slippage.

The rudder tube is 6 to 8 inches diameter and has a large teflon/nylon bearing in the bottom and another one of the top.

The rudder shaft, made of alluminuim is replaced every 2 years, (I'm on the second one now, because of a rudder design change), and is a conical solid rod of alluminium made by Lewmar, with marine grade alu.

The rudder floats, so it allways pulls the lower bearing up, that stops agains at internal ring half way thru the tube, and the second upper bearing, is pulled up and stops at the quadrant..the tube itself is accessible from any angle as I have it inside a rear locker, and the upper open part of the tube sits 2 and half feet above water line in a dedicated compartment.


This is a very effective system and is very light...the ruddetr tube is supoported at 90 deg by triangular X beams, welded to the hull.

Mine is all Kevlar.For my rudder to come off you really needed to hi somethnng big and heavy, but no matter what, water would no enter.

My hull is also 100% cored with Dyvinicell, and thus a rip of the tube is veryy unlikely. I will buy a ball like your friend has...


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## Vasco (Sep 24, 2006)

I'd cut and paste it but am unsure re this board's policy about doing this.


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## tweitz (Apr 5, 2007)

My impression was that the problem in the boat was not that he lacked equipment to seal the hole, it was that he couldn't get to it to apply the fix. Is that correct?


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

Vasco-

Given the issues regarding the rudder, if you source the page you got the material you're cutting and pasting, it should be okay. That's generally covered by FAIR USE provisions of the 1978 Copyright act.


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## Vasco (Sep 24, 2006)

From Beneteau Google Group:

All Members:

CB2 member Steve Rudiger forwarded the following message concerning
Annapolis based Beneteau 40.7 Making Waves. Although it is very
unfortunate that the vessel was lost, the story demonstrates the
importance of handling the situation calmly and without panic,
assessing the problem quickly, summoning the proper assistance, and
making realistic decisions concerning the importance of people over
things regardless of how fond we may be of them. There is a similar
story of this same thing happening to a CAL 31 in Lake Erie last year
in the June 2008 issue of SAIL. The situation was handled in much the
same way and although the vessel sunk (later to be raised and
recovered) there was no loss of life of injury.

Start of Message

Friends –

As some of you may have heard Making Waves, our Beneteau 40.7, sank 15
miles off the Long Island coast yesterday afternoon. All hands are
safe and sound.

We were in the process of delivering the boat to Newport for the start
of the Bermuda Ocean race. We were under sail in 5-7 foot seas with
about 20-25 knots of breeze (both from our stern quarter) and the boat
was sailing great, clipping double digit speeds coming off swells,
when we heard a banging noise and lost steerage. When we investigated
we discovered that the rudder tube had broken just above the hull
joint and we were taking on water. We aren’t certain whether the
rudder stock actually broke first or the tube it rides in, which in
turn broke the rudder stock. In any event, we were able to control
the flooding using our bilge pumps until the Coast Guard reached us
with a 47’ motor life boat. The CG was initially also going to
scramble a helicopter, but weather conditions scrapped that plan. A
100’+ trawler also answered our mayday and shadowed us until the Coast
Guard released them. We had also set off the EPIRB and the VHF MMSI
distress call, both of which the Coast Guard acknowledged receiving.

The Coast Guard took us in tow, but we were unable to keep the boat in
line with the tow since we had no rudder control. Seas were now 7-9
feet with an occasional 12 footer and the additional force from
veering back and forth apparently sheared the rudder post completely
and we started taking on water at a much greater rate. On top of that,
as we veered back and forth with the seas the tow line was putting
heavy pressure on the forestay, and we were afraid we might take it
out and bring the rig down. At that point we decided the prudent
course of action was to accept a ride home with the government and
they transferred the six of us to the MLB in 2 passes. That was a
pretty interesting maneuver in itself – they actually brought the MLB
right up to the leeward side of the boat in rolling seas and we walked/
jumped/vaulted across to the waiting arms of the crew – I swear they
didn’t scratch the gel coat. Water was mid-calf deep in the cabin
when the last person came out, but it took nearly an hour for the boat
to settle and sink in 165 feet of water – the CG had to hang around to
make sure the boat would not be a hazard to navigation.

We were taken to Coast Guard Station Shinnecock (near the Hamptons)
where the Guardsmen treated us warmly, feeding us and even offering us
a ride to the Islip airport where we rented a van for the drive
home. I can’t say enough about the professionalism and skill of the
Coast Guard, particularly since most of the boat crew appeared to be
barely out of high school. I am also very proud of the way our crew
handled the situation. We worked through the problems efficiently and
calmly which is why we got out of the situation with no injury or loss
of life.

Guys and gals, I’m sorry we won’t be able to do the Bermuda Race and
apologize to those who were coming to Bermuda to help us deliver
Making Waves home. We will try to find some way to make it up to
you. Anyone who had gear on board (Grant, David B., Mike, Larry,
Bob, Alan, et al.) please let me know what was there and its value and
we will submit it with our insurance claim and make you whole.

Many people have already called and e-mailed to express their concern
about our well-being and sympathy over the loss of the boat – thank
you for your thoughts. I am simply thankful that our crew is home and
safe.

Jim

End of Message

Be safe and know that there are great folks out there ready to help,
but plan for the unlikely event that something similar could happen to
you – because it could.

Mike Everitt

Vice Commodore


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

Thanks for that post Vasco.

As I said earlier in this thread, the rudder in my boat is in a compartment that is sealed off from the rest of the boat... and if I lost my rudder stock it wouldn't flood the rest of the boat. I don't see why more boats aren't designed this way.


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## Giulietta (Nov 14, 2006)

sailingdog said:


> Thanks for that post Vasco.
> 
> As I said earlier in this thread, the rudder in my boat is in a compartment that is sealed off from the rest of the boat... and if I lost my rudder stock it wouldn't flood the rest of the boat. I don't see why more boats aren't designed this way.


  

But you don't sail 15 miles off shore and in 7 foot waves....


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

Actually, I have been further out, in heavier seas than that in my boat.  Turned around when the seas were getting up past 14' or so... since I was soloing the boat and it wasn't really setup for soloing properly yet. Still working on that btw. 



Giulietta said:


> But you don't sail 15 miles off shore and in 7 foot waves....


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## Ros (May 17, 2005)

*The Captains Story*

This is the email from CB2 that was sent to me today:

All Members:

CB2 member Steve Rudiger forwarded the following message concerning Annapolis based Beneteau 40.7 _Making Waves_. Although it is very unfortunate that the vessel was lost, the story demonstrates the importance of handling the situation calmly and without panic, assessing the problem quickly, summoning the proper assistance, and making realistic decisions concerning the importance of people over things regardless of how fond we may be of them. There is a similar story of this same thing happening to a CAL 31 in Lake Erie last year in the June 2008 issue of _SAIL_. The situation was handled in much the same way and although the vessel sunk (later to be raised and recovered) there was no loss of life of injury.  

Start of Message
Friends - 

As some of you may have heard Making Waves, our Beneteau 40.7, sank 15 miles off the Long Island coast yesterday afternoon. All hands are safe and sound.  

We were in the process of delivering the boat to Newport for the start of the Bermuda Ocean race. We were under sail in 5-7 foot seas with about 20-25 knots of breeze (both from our stern quarter) and the boat was sailing great, clipping double digit speeds coming off swells, when we heard a banging noise and lost steerage. When we investigated we discovered that the rudder tube had broken just above the hull joint and we were taking on water. We aren't certain whether the rudder stock actually broke first or the tube it rides in, which in turn broke the rudder stock. In any event, we were able to control the flooding using our bilge pumps until the Coast Guard reached us with a 47' motor life boat. The CG was initially also going to scramble a helicopter, but weather conditions scrapped that plan. A 100'+ trawler also answered our mayday and shadowed us until the Coast Guard released them. We had also set off the EPIRB and the VHF MMSI distress call, both of which the Coast Guard acknowledged receiving. 

The Coast Guard took us in tow, but we were unable to keep the boat in line with the tow since we had no rudder control. Seas were now 7-9 feet with an occasional 12 footer and the additional force from veering back and forth apparently sheared the rudder post completely and we started taking on water at a much greater rate. On top of that, as we veered back and forth with the seas the tow line was putting heavy pressure on the forestay, and we were afraid we might take it out and bring the rig down. At that point we decided the prudent course of action was to accept a ride home with the government and they transferred the six of us to the MLB in 2 passes. That was a pretty interesting maneuver in itself - they actually brought the MLB right up to the leeward side of the boat in rolling seas and we walked/jumped/vaulted across to the waiting arms of the crew - I swear they didn't scratch the gel coat. Water was mid-calf deep in the cabin when the last person came out, but it took nearly an hour for the boat to settle and sink in 165 feet of water - the CG had to hang around to make sure the boat would not be a hazard to navigation.  

We were taken to Coast Guard Station Shinnecock (near the Hamptons) where the Guardsmen treated us warmly, feeding us and even offering us a ride to the Islip airport where we rented a van for the drive home. I can't say enough about the professionalism and skill of the Coast Guard, particularly since most of the boat crew appeared to be barely out of high school. I am also very proud of the way our crew handled the situation. We worked through the problems efficiently and calmly which is why we got out of the situation with no injury or loss of life. 

Guys and gals, I'm sorry we won't be able to do the Bermuda Race and apologize to those who were coming to Bermuda to help us deliver Making Waves home. We will try to find some way to make it up to you. Anyone who had gear on board (Grant, David B., Mike, Larry, Bob, Alan, et al.) please let me know what was there and its value and we will submit it with our insurance claim and make you whole. 

Many people have already called and e-mailed to express their concern about our well-being and sympathy over the loss of the boat - thank you for your thoughts. I am simply thankful that our crew is home and safe.  

Jim
End of Message

Be safe and know that there are great folks out there ready to help, but plan for the unlikely event that something similar could happen to you - because it could.

Mike Everitt
Vice Commodore


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

Ros- 

Exactly how is that any different from the post that Vasco got from the Bendytoy's Google Group??


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## Vasco (Sep 24, 2006)

font is larger?


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

Rofl. point for Vasco...


Vasco said:


> font is larger?


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## blt2ski (May 5, 2005)

While on the same subject, anyone know how the 36.7 rudder assembly is installed vs the 40 or 44? The 36 is one boat I might consider at some point in time, not that I would be sailing it in 7-12' seas, more likely up to 5' max in Puget sound.

The main thing I see, is no lives etc were lost or folks hurt etc.

Marty


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