# Making a living as a liveaboard



## sailorsnook

Is anyone interested in discussing ways to make a few pennies whilst being a travelling liveaboard? I've tried a few things, with limited success so far, which experience I can share, but always open to new ideas!


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## chucklesR

I work with computers, primarily database. The only thing I can't do remotely via the internet is shake your hand. 
There are also a lot of small 'fix this specific problem' websites out there where people and companies list jobs and take bids on them; again related to databases.

Keep in mind that most countries have serious problems with foreigner's coming in and working. It helps if you don't actually make any money *in* those countries, being paid via the internet helps. 
Heck, having internet on the boat helps


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## Capt.aaron

Dive Master.


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## Slayer

Capt.aaron said:


> Dive Master.


I can see how you could make money being a dive master, but how do you do it while travelling? How do you get the jobs? Do you teach diving, do underwater work on boats? I'd be interested in more specifics.


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## remetau

Computers have the best pay. If you have the skills or the ability to learn them, then your potential could be unlimited.

I have worked remotely as a programmer for over 7 years doing Lotus Notes, DataStage, Java, and Enovia. There is always work out there available.


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## Tim R.

I have been working in IT for 25 years. Programming, consulting and now management. When I throw off the lines in 2014, the last thing I will want to do is work on computers.

We will have enough saved to go out for multiple years. We will not plan on working until we come back or settle down somewhere else.


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## wind_magic

Could make crochet easter bunnies and sell them to people at easter.

Oh you wanted a serious answer. 

I would think that anything that needs to be done on a boat is a skill you could sell to other boaters. Someone has to keep the brightwork bright, and scrub boat bottoms, and all that.


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## remetau

treilley said:


> I have been working in IT for 25 years. Programming, consulting and now management. When I throw off the lines in 2014, the last thing I will want to do is work on computers.
> 
> We will have enough saved to go out for multiple years. We will not plan on working until we come back or settle down somewhere else.


Agree, but it was IT that gave me that opportunity. Thankfully, most of it has been while also living aboard and coastal cruising.


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## guitarguy56

I'm an aerospace engineer and contract my services to many companies so I get to travel some... right now in Everett for Boeing... I do however have a side business I often do while I can live aboard although not doing it at the moment and that is restoring and servicing Italian car gauges and aircraft instruments... done many Ferraris, Maserati's, Fiats, and other Italian cars... many of my restorations have gone to Pebble Beach, Montery, and other fine car shows and have won best of show... well known in the car circuit and actually make more money at it than contract engineering...

Remetau, regarding Enovia... ha ha ha... using that right now along with Dassault Systems Catia V5 and other software to design the advanced turbine nacelle for the next generation of Boeing 737Max, 777Next, 787-10. and the new airplane program under wraps... These are skills that can be used even while travelling on the sailboat but you need high powered wi-fi or satellite internet to keep linked to the company or in other words 'virtual engineering'.


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## Lance-AR

I always pictured myself going from one harbor to the next repairing sails.


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## 50merc

Divemasters don't pay well. Here in the Philippines they typically get about $2 per person/dive and only usually do 3 dives per day. Nite dives pay more but usually got to senior staff. I think the most divers they can dive with is 6. Most I know here live like backpackers, if that suits you.


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## Capt. Gary Randall

Vessel delivery has worked great for me,once you get a good solid reputation it leads to other work. Something is always new when you're on someone else's vessel,certainly never boring. I am also a shipwright and engineer and can do repairs to other peoples vessels or on my own boat. CaptG


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## Tim R.

remetau said:


> Agree, but it was IT that gave me that opportunity. Thankfully, most of it has been while also living aboard and coastal cruising.


Not putting it down. It allowed my wife and I to live very comfortably and sail beautiful boats but our definition of cruising includes leaving our professional lives behind.

Our next jobs will be recreation based. Mountain biking, diving, marine. skiing, etc.


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## wind_magic

Another option is to let taking care of yourself be your new business.

There is a certain kind of math that happens in people's minds in America where they figure out that a lot of things aren't worth their time and energy because time is their most precious commodity. But that math can also work in reverse, if you let it, and you can spend more time doing things for yourself and need much less money to the point that you need almost no money at all. You can get to the point that you only need money for things that you couldn't possibly do yourself, such as purchasing gasoline because obviously you aren't going to drill for oil and refine it yourself.

The point of that is that instead of trying to figure out new ways to make money so that you can buy fish, maybe a cruiser's new job can be to catch fish. Instead of figuring out how to get money for diesel, maybe the cruiser's new job can be to learn to sail without using the motor. Instead of figuring out how to purchase new sails, maybe the cruiser's new job can be to get the material and learn to sew the sails themselves. Instead of trying to make money to purchase chunky soup, maybe the cruiser's new job can be to locate inexpensive basic ingredients and pressure can their own soup.

Is it "wasting time doing what you could pay someone else to do" when you have all the time in the world and making money starts to be the challenge ? What are people saving all that time and energy up to do, exactly, when most of their time is spent sitting on the boat doing very little except watching the clouds float by ?


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## MarkofSeaLife

I think there are very few jobs that can be done while cruising if you wish to keep moving, ie actively cruising.

The IT idea sounds fine but I think there are very few in our size boats actively cruising because the Internet is so iffy in many places. And the person who can spent $10,000 per month on satelite broadband would be in a bigger boat...

There are some who may be making a few spending dollars but not a reasonable portion of a budget and probably investing lots of hours.

If you are going to profit by $30,000 per year there must be clients who do Ned to see you, and have good land based system.

The yacht delivery people need to be in a good area to work... A week delivery from Ft Lauderdale will not fly in a skipper from Pago Pago.
It takes years to get the reputation and what do you ,do with your boat when away? Marinas can be expensive so you are on half dollars!
Many have to crew for a long time for free to get the reputation.

Sowing, covers, sail rite machines.... God there are so many older ladies trying to offer this one. But once cruising the need for winch covers just doesn't exist! (Btw if looking for someone to do some work, just stop past any boat with winch covers! They do it!!)

Hull cleaning. Locals come cheaper than you. Venuzalea was $10 per DAY for labour so how much can you charge for 1 hour?


Hair cutting not many do this one. But you only get $10 per cut. Many have very long hair cruising (males mid life crisis means they grow a pony tail! Women how can you bare it? I'm single. give him the heave Ho and come live with a shaved short haired non smelly man)

Consultancy work from old profession. There are few that can hide away even just giving advice. Lawyers, but is all their info now on the web or do they still need a law library?

Doing jobs for cruisers... Other cruisers seem pretty independent and don't need paid help. Making this more difficult is that most cruisers will volunteer to help someone's problem for no pay to get Karma Points.

Marine mechanic, electronics, etc. need to be in one place for a long time. Local laws etc. other cruisers won't pay. Cruiser mechanics charge too much... Generally $30 to $50 per hour when the Yanmar guy charges $50 with parts, warranty, specialist knowledge. I prefer to use the Yanmar guy at the higher rate unless I absolutely know the cheaper person.

Lots of bum alcoholics are cruising the world looking for any dollar and if you say can you do x they say yes and stuff it up. It means few will use another cruiser unless they have a great reputation.

So how would I earn money?
I think I would do the 6 months at home, 6 months cruising. No matter how poor you think your economy, it's vastly better than some island in the middle of nowhere, and in your country the dollars are real and substantial....

It's difficult... And a question asked so often... But in my four years afloat I have met NO ONE making a dollar more than just small pin money. Certainly none who are making good money.


Mark


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## Capt.aaron

Capt.aaron said:


> Dive Master.


Become a dive master. Get a job as a dive master, Live near the dive shop on the sailboat. Pick a place, let's say Roatan. Apply for a job as dive Master based on your current job as dive master. Sail to Roatan, anchor out and live on your boat and work as a dive master. Pick a place, Mexico, apply for a job, based on your current job in Roatan, sail to Mexico, anchor out near the dive shop and work as a dive master, pick a place...Bahamas, apply for a job as a dive master, based on your expeirence as a dive master in the first shop, Roatan and Mexico, sail to the Bahamas, work as a dive Master, pick a place, St. Thomas........................................................


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## deniseO30

It was suggested by a friend; that If I were to retire and cruise, I could, consult, service, and help owners with HVACR. Since that is what I know and do best. 

Well, I'm retired... sort of LOL 

I'm still All around epa certified HVACR tech and former full service contractor. (let the last full time employee go over 8 yrs ago) 

Boat, like domestic (home refrigerators) AC/fridges/ reverse cycle are really A PITA. 

Don't think I want the aggravation of boat owners screaming at me in 90-110 heat because beer is warm, or ice cream is melting... Boating should be fun right? :laugher 

If I had refrigerants on my boat with associated equipment someone would be sure to steal it. especially R-12 Then there's 22, R134, 404A, 409, 410A,and a few others LOL 

Then, there's the guarded and somewhat hostile " Approved; yard employed or associated" contractors. (20%) is the usual cut. That would be a difficult thing to get past in most places. 

And, since most if not all people needing HVACR help won't know me or my real qualifications, they wouldn't hire me anyway. 

Imagine ( I go to sleep early) getting boarded by a few tipsy sailors saying; "oh Denise won't mind if we borrow her vacuum pump and gauges" Then I hear 30lbs of 134 hi$$ing out the can as it goes overboard "oh look she has R-12 too! HEY! DENISE YOU SLEEPING???" 

So.... No! I don't think I could work and live aboard! 

Nope.. not another day in paradise found!


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## Capt.aaron

50merc said:


> Divemasters don't pay well. Here in the Philippines they typically get about $2 per person/dive and only usually do 3 dives per day. Nite dives pay more but usually got to senior staff. I think the most divers they can dive with is 6. Most I know here live like backpackers, if that suits you.


Good dive masters at good dive shop's and resorts make a decent living. Club Med in Eluthra pay's wee bit more than 12 dollars a dive, and tip's add up. I made 30 buck's adive in Belize 20 years ago and made 20 bucks a dive in tips. I did at least 2 dives a day no less than 4 day's a week. Lived on my boat for free.


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## MarkofSeaLife

Capt.aaron said:


> Good dive masters at good dive shop's and resorts make a decent living. Club Med in Eluthra pay's wee bit more than 12 dollars a dive, and tip's add up. I made 30 buck's adive in Belize 20 years ago and made 20 bucks a dive in tips. I did at least 2 dives a day no less than 4 day's a week. Lived on my boat for free.


But Aaron,

They are not cruising jobs. You are stuck there. Maybe for years. 
Where do you leave the boat when you ave a job at Club Med?

And don't try break in to commercial diving work... The local divers will have you straight into immigration.

So it's a long hard process to get accepted.

I was reading that the 1 year work permit paper for St Martin is $1,600! That's a lot of $12 dives!


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## Capt.aaron

It's a little different then that in the dive Master world. You get a job at shop in Roatan, this is a temp job, dive master's can be rather transient when your in the scene. You fall in to a temp work visa under a resort work umbrella. You anchor out, live on your boat and work the shop for a few months. One job leads to another in that world, you find out so and so shop is looking for a dive master in another place and you sail there. I've cruised the Carribean Western Carribean this way. I was working on a research vessel in Belize in 1990-1991, I brought down my sail boat from Key West and anchored next to the research vessel. I was offerd a job on the Belize Agressor ( Live aboard Dive boat) they handle your right to work under their umbrella. I worked a few months, I found out they where looking for a dive master in Acumal Mexico, I sailed up anchored out near the resort, worked through spring as a dive masrter, found out they where looking for a dive master in the Key's,, sailed up, anchored out, worked through the summer, found out my buddy from Acumal was opening a shop In Roatan, sailed down worked through the winter. I only suggested it because I've done it and probably will again. I own a dive boat in Key west and and use transient dive master's, one who lived on his boat and got a job at Paradise Island in the Bahama's at Club Med and is over there anchored out swimming distance from the resort, working as dive master, and is looking for a job in in the Caribbean and plans to sail down there when they find one. You can't just cruise at will, you pick a nice place, put the word out, build a rep, make the circut.


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## MarkofSeaLife

Capt.aaron said:


> I've cruised the Carribean Western Carribean this way. .


I'm sure a young man who looks the Club Med part, or Super Yacht Crew part could do so in the way you say.
But most cruisers are retired couples and retired single men.
Just retired from wearing a suit or overalls at 65 getting the dive ticket and strolling into a dive master situation isn't as easy.

Yes, for a young bloke or girl who is at the pull of adventure, fine.


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## Capt.aaron

Well if working while cruising at 65 is the discussion, of course, dive master is out, most thing's are. I'm a young 42 and have some opportunity's to work in the for mentioned places again if I want. A good friend of mine is 55, a dive instructor, and survived a Brain anoriism 7 years ago and is off the The Carribean this year to work as an intrustor down there, she will be living on a friends sailboat while she is there.. Coincidently I think it is in ST. Martin.


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## B.Christ

I work on ships. So I don't really make money near my boat, but the company flies me back to her and then we move on together.

What sort of skills do you have?


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## sailorsnook

I'm trying to extend my travelling life as it were by writing books and blogs but not much return yet! Google Malcolm Snook and you'll see I've been trying!!



B.Christ said:


> I work on ships. So I don't really make money near my boat, but the company flies me back to her and then we move on together.
> 
> What sort of skills do you have?


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## sailorsnook

Thanks Aaron, I have a basic PADI Open Water and although 56 rather than 65 I don't think I'll make a dive instructor now. I've been trying to make a living writing books and blogs, but I think unless you're online all the time promoting them it's hard to make it work and that runs counter to the boat gypsy lifestyle, still I'm open to any suggestions and if other people want to self publish I have some experience to share! Malcolm Snook



Capt.aaron said:


> Well if working while cruising at 65 is the discussion, of course, dive master is out, most thing's are. I'm a young 42 and have some opportunity's to work in the for mentioned places again if I want. A good friend of mine is 55, a dive instructor, and survived a Brain anoriism 7 years ago and is off the The Carribean this year to work as an intrustor down there, she will be living on a friends sailboat while she is there.. Coincidently I think it is in ST. Martin.


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## Razcar

I've been earning money remotely without visiting my clients at all in years. A good personality, good work ethic, and reasonable rate gets word spreading around. Most clients now are happy with Skype calls and daily logs of work. I take only project work, so there's a definite calculated end to the work. Even my larger corporate clients who used to sing the tune of getting a butt in a seat on location, have changed their approach. They realize to get good talent they have to cast their net wider and adopt mobile and remote workers as a fundamental part of their approach. I'd also say that most business owners want to trust and rely on a vendor. I have had the same clients for years (5+), and they keep coming back. The reason? It's a pain in the butt to find someone you trust, ramp them up on your internal processes, people, and project history. It takes time and money to do this every time you have someone new. Most of my clients don't mind my schedule and availability because they know the work I produce and I have proven my trustworthiness. 

My point is not to toot my horn, but it's to say this: it's pretty easy to land a client in any kind of work you do, but that's only the beginning. Work hard to keep them, prove your value, and they will come back. I've been floating on these ~10 clients for years (pun intended) and am weary to take new ones for the same reasons they are weary to find new contractors. It was totally unintended, but eventually they became like family and we send each other cards for the holidays, and whenever they need work done, they know how to find me.


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## ehmanta

Another option that has not been suggested yet is teaching. Many countries will hire Americans to teach English or perhaps a specific skill that they cannot hire their local teachers to do. Of course, this locks you into a country for a full school year, but you would get the full exposure to the local way of life and learn the culture. Friends of mine taught in Marsh Harbour in the Bahamas for two years. It was a great experience for them and the government gave them a monthly allowance for housing, so if your living aboard, you rake in both the salary and a stipend! 
I teach AutoCAD and GIS programs so I could imagine finding something along those lines as well as English.


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## miatapaul

ehmanta said:


> Another option that has not been suggested yet is teaching. Many countries will hire Americans to teach English or perhaps a specific skill that they cannot hire their local teachers to do. Of course, this locks you into a country for a full school year, but you would get the full exposure to the local way of life and learn the culture. Friends of mine taught in Marsh Harbour in the Bahamas for two years. It was a great experience for them and the government gave them a monthly allowance for housing, so if your living aboard, you rake in both the salary and a stipend!
> I teach AutoCAD and GIS programs so I could imagine finding something along those lines as well as English.


Actually there is an "English as a second language" certification that is not too hard to get. I think it could really come in handy sometimes. Not that I think you would need a certification, but it might be helpful when trying to get the job.


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## ChristinaM

Has anyone run into issues with working remotely on their boat in a foreign country? I've run into tax rules about working being done in a specific country by a foreigner or for a foreign company. Or do we just not tell anyone what's going on?


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## BGS

Having flexible employers is another option. If your pretty tight with your boss and they trust you, you might be surprised how willing they are to work with you to keep you there. Negotiation is the key here. I pulled off a 3 months vacation without pay. I didn't make any money while I was gone but at least I knew I could as soon as I got back. I told my boss I was going away for a few months and was going to quit to do so, but didn't want to. She told me we could probably work something out... Low and behold I was only a temporarily unemployed vagabond vs an unemployed one. 

My cousin worked out a similiar deal working remotely for a year and he has a much more serious job as a lawyer. This is a case by case thing but my point is your employer may have more flexibility than you think... just try to think of how you can meet their needs while your gone so they won't have much to protest.


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## jostalli

Start a business. Follow these three rules: 1. Choose an expanding industry. 2. Choose a unique and consumable product for residual income. 3. Choose a business where the majority of tasks and functions can be outsourced.


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## Razcar

jostalli said:


> Start a business. Follow these three rules: 1. Choose an expanding industry. 2. Choose a unique and consumable product for residual income. 3. Choose a business where the majority of tasks and functions can be outsourced.


Easier said than done. It's the cruising holy grail.


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## jostalli

Razcar said:


> Easier said than done. It's the cruising holy grail.


Go read "The Four Hour Work Week" by Tim Ferriss. He lays it all out and at the end gives countless opportunities and business ideas.


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## Razcar

jostalli said:


> Go read "The Four Hour Work Week" by Tim Ferriss. He lays it all out and at the end gives countless opportunities and business ideas.


I have, 3 times. Have you actually tried doing what he says? His writing is compelling, and his ideas have merit. But having taken his advice and spent thousands trying to kick off a half dozen of my own businesses, using his very methods, I can't say it's as easy as he makes it appear to be int he book.

Without turning this into a Ferris convo, I'll just say that he had a business set up a running for years before he virtualized it... and even according to him, you have to blood/sweat/tears the thing before you get there... it's VERY tough to just jump into a totally virtual, turn-key, business requiring nothing more than a couple of hours to run, in a couple of weeks or months.

Looking back on it, I should have just bought a boat. At least I'd be on the water now.


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## jostalli

Razcar said:


> I have, 3 times. Have you actually tried doing what he says? His writing is compelling, and his ideas have merit. But having taken his advice and spent thousands trying to kick off a half dozen of my own businesses, using his very methods, I can't say it's as easy as he makes it appear to be int he book.
> 
> Without turning this into a Ferris convo, I'll just say that he had a business set up a running for years before he virtualized it... and even according to him, you have to blood/sweat/tears the thing before you get there... it's VERY tough to just jump into a totally virtual, turn-key, business requiring nothing more than a couple of hours to run, in a couple of weeks or months.
> 
> Looking back on it, I should have just bought a boat. At least I'd be on the water now.


I have. I have two businesses going that are all outsourced for the most part. One is an online advertising business focused on display ad campaigns. We are a publisher. The other is a healthcare company that acts as the division of nutritional medicine for the doctor's practice. I have nutritionists and dietitians who work with the patients.

It does take time and I have not completely let go of what I planned to outsource when I started both businesses. Had I not chosen businesses that were designed to be outsourced then I would be just like every other entrepreneur who has a poor work/life balance.

Don't quit trying. The principles are sound.


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## capta

Working while voyaging has been a dream of mine since I began sailing in the early 60's. Unfortunately, it really is not something that can be easily done.
As mentioned above, most countries will not allow non-citizens to take work from locals, so you must find something locals cannot do, like friends who got the contract to set up the government computer network in Samoa, when there were very few computer literate folks out there. As a captain or crew or fisherman, etc.; forget it.
Deliveries are a good source of income if you choose to be in an area (like the VI) at the end of the charter season, but you must leave your boat while on delivery; not the best plan, especially in hurricane season. And 95% of sail boat deliveries are plagued by break downs, unreliable equipment and worn out boats, or the owner would do it, because a delivery is just like cruising, but for money, right?
A few folks I know make some money sewing, doing electrical, mechanical and refrigeration repairs on cruising boats. But cruisers are notoriously cheap and if one is a capable professional, most cruisers won't pay for the quality work, which leaves you making little money doing a less than proper job. Also this is not a steady income.
Then there's chartering. The pie in the sky; sail and earn thousands of dollars a week. Well, the booking agents have a saying; you are only as good as your last charter. Which means that if you have 25 perfectly fantastic charters and your last one was with a really unpleasant creep, you will not get another charter until the agents are desperate and need you again. Giving someone a great vacation aboard your cruising boat is not an easy thing to do. You must be pretty familiar with the area you are sailing in, be able to provide 3 full, extraordinary meals and afternoon appetizers each day, never mind the little things that aren't in the "guide to successful chartering". With the internet, it is possible to get a few bookings a year, but again, one unhappy customer can ruin that, too. Getting hits on a charter site is not all that easy, as we can attest.
I would suggest amassing a bit of cash and investing it in an annuity which will give you a steady, reliable income, because, unless you get extremely lucky, you will not be able to earn enough to live comfortably on while sailing.


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## guitarguy56

capta said:


> I would suggest amassing a bit of cash and investing it in an annuity which will give you a steady, reliable income, because, unless you get extremely lucky, you will not be able to earn enough to live comfortably on while sailing.


My plan is to SAVE, SAVE, SAVE... live as cheaply as you can now and have a nest egg large enough to not have to worry about working for a living while cruising... We try to live on my wife's pay as a tenured teacher as much we can and put all my consulting engineering pay in the bank... by the time it's quitting time for me in 4-6 years... we should have enough to support our happy lives... my spouse has 7 more years till teacher retirement kicks in... I can continue in this field working since it's all computer/desk mundane analysis stuff... we're halfway there in terms of savings... can't wait! :laugher


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## Harborless

MarkofSeaLife said:


> I think there are very few jobs that can be done while cruising if you wish to keep moving, ie actively cruising.
> 
> The IT idea sounds fine but I think there are very few in our size boats actively cruising because the Internet is so iffy in many places. And the person who can spent $10,000 per month on satelite broadband would be in a bigger boat...
> 
> There are some who may be making a few spending dollars but not a reasonable portion of a budget and probably investing lots of hours.
> 
> If you are going to profit by $30,000 per year there must be clients who do Ned to see you, and have good land based system.
> 
> The yacht delivery people need to be in a good area to work... A week delivery from Ft Lauderdale will not fly in a skipper from Pago Pago.
> It takes years to get the reputation and what do you ,do with your boat when away? Marinas can be expensive so you are on half dollars!
> Many have to crew for a long time for free to get the reputation.
> 
> Sowing, covers, sail rite machines.... God there are so many older ladies trying to offer this one. But once cruising the need for winch covers just doesn't exist! (Btw if looking for someone to do some work, just stop past any boat with winch covers! They do it!!)
> 
> Hull cleaning. Locals come cheaper than you. Venuzalea was $10 per DAY for labour so how much can you charge for 1 hour?
> 
> Hair cutting not many do this one. But you only get $10 per cut. Many have very long hair cruising (males mid life crisis means they grow a pony tail! Women how can you bare it? I'm single. give him the heave Ho and come live with a shaved short haired non smelly man)
> 
> Consultancy work from old profession. There are few that can hide away even just giving advice. Lawyers, but is all their info now on the web or do they still need a law library?
> 
> Doing jobs for cruisers... Other cruisers seem pretty independent and don't need paid help. Making this more difficult is that most cruisers will volunteer to help someone's problem for no pay to get Karma Points.
> 
> Marine mechanic, electronics, etc. need to be in one place for a long time. Local laws etc. other cruisers won't pay. Cruiser mechanics charge too much... Generally $30 to $50 per hour when the Yanmar guy charges $50 with parts, warranty, specialist knowledge. I prefer to use the Yanmar guy at the higher rate unless I absolutely know the cheaper person.
> 
> Lots of bum alcoholics are cruising the world looking for any dollar and if you say can you do x they say yes and stuff it up. It means few will use another cruiser unless they have a great reputation.
> 
> So how would I earn money?
> I think I would do the 6 months at home, 6 months cruising. No matter how poor you think your economy, it's vastly better than some island in the middle of nowhere, and in your country the dollars are real and substantial....
> 
> It's difficult... And a question asked so often... But in my four years afloat I have met NO ONE making a dollar more than just small pin money. Certainly none who are making good money.
> 
> Mark


I like this as it is most grounded in reality. However, there are ways to make money without white collar work or long-term sessilization (just made that up).
Biggest factor is going to be where you are cruising.
For me, right now, my cruising is focused in the Bahamas. A few hours a day diving with a spear gun at some good reefs will net you enough fish to sell at the local docks toward late afternoon. Right now its crawfish season (spiny lobster). Guys go out and spear 50 or 100 per day (much more using traps) and sell them for 7$ per lb. 
That same lobster tail at 8 OZ goes for 28.99$ at Red Lobster right now.
So I would say small scale fishing. However, you will have to be wary about the other local fisherman. I would think to avoid confrontation you would need to either work with or for them, or limit your stays in any one place to three or four days before moving on to the next locale.


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## TerribleSailor

Maybe go find yourself a nice secluded area that you can easily access with your boat and make yourself a small garden. Grow whatever is in season in that region and choose hardy plants that don't need very much care. Like Potatoes for an example. Stay for one full growing season checking the plants once a week. And after you harvest set up shop in a crowded marina? Just food for thought (huehue). Probably wont be enough money though unless you have a rather large garden. Maybe this is a bad idea. Im just trying to think of something that goes with my skill set since I majored in agricultural science. 
Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk 2


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## Mavriikk

Coastal sailor here... I feel like during my entire career I have been acquiring skills I need to survive off the grid. I have tended bar for 10+ years. I have an automotive education and spent 6 years working in a shop. Lastly i have spent the last 8 years working as a certified IT professional with formal college training. I also just received my diving cert. One more thing on this old preppers bucket list before I set sail will be formal paramedic training. I find the dream motivational. I feel like the more knowledge I have the longer i can survive living the dream. All those things i mentioned I believe can save me money and make me money with. How old am I? without looking at the profile.


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## ftldiver

How to make a small fortune cruising?






-start with a large fortune. 


*most countries require work permits. 
and fishing in the Bahamas AND SELLING will likely land you in jail. + spear guns are not allowed. (slings or pole spears). natives can use tanks, but not tourists.

however, if you have an in demand skill set (IT Networking /medical /education) those can get permits. assuming locals don't have the skills.


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## DougSabbag

Well, I've earned the majority of money from my IT / consulting work.

But.... when I've arrived in a new port without any IT contracts, I have done various jobs to keep from starving, i.e., security guard, yacht maintenance / cleaning & waxing, marina worker / handiman, and then there is the basis of our Corporation: Triumph Ventures, Inc., Triumph Charters -- Sail with Us! Chartering! We have used Craigslist to advertise as soon as we get a slip, and that has provided a fairly good stream of customers.

Of course, if your boat is paid off and you don't have any (or large) credit card debt, no car payments, and have a water maker and solar panels, you can drop the hook and pray for good luck at fishing, and not worry about money!


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## DougSabbag

Of the longer term plans, there are owning rental / investment properties and having someone you trust manage them.

And buying bonds which provide a steady (tax free?) dividend. But, to live from any interest bearing bond these days, you have to start with a HUGE principle amount.


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## rockDAWG

Capt.aaron said:


> Dive Master.


Don't you have to be a local in many countries?


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## DougSabbag

As we were researching the various European rules for us, (Americans), we found that in the vast majority we would be basically welcomed everywhere.

Americans are on a short list of those citizens generally immune to immigration "quotas".

If we had made it to Greece, we would have had to leave every 6 months, get "stamped", then we could return.


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## rockDAWG

MarkofSeaLife said:


> So how would I earn money?
> I think I would do the 6 months at home, 6 months cruising. No matter how poor you think your economy, it's vastly better than some island in the middle of nowhere, and in your country the dollars are real and substantial....
> 
> Mark


X10..... This is what I am thinking. Why complete the local market for jobs which only pay pennies. Unlike Mark, it is difficult for me to do 6 months on and 6 months off. But really easy to fly home to work a few days to a week for any consultant work.


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## Skipper Jer

My plan? Gigolo. If that doesn't work out, anyone need a logic hardware designer? Done ASIC, FPGA and discrete logic for pretty near 40 years. Can do electrical repair and electronic installation. Also can make lots of sawdust in your boat. And if that doesn't work out live off our savings.


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## Capt.aaron

rockDAWG said:


> Don't you have to be a local in many countries?


No. Go do a dive in Roatan with any out fit, your dive master will be from Canada or Europe or the States, there will be a local dude driving the boat.


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## Atlas

mavriikk said:


> coastal sailor here... I feel like during my entire career i have been acquiring skills i need to survive off the grid. I have tended bar for 10+ years. I have an automotive education and spent 6 years working in a shop. Lastly i have spent the last 8 years working as a certified it professional with formal college training. I also just received my diving cert. One more thing on this old preppers bucket list before i set sail will be formal paramedic training. I find the dream motivational. I feel like the more knowledge i have the longer i can survive living the dream. All those things i mentioned i believe can save me money and make me money with. How old am i? Without looking at the profile.


268.


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## mad_machine

I am planning on this myself once I get a boat big enough to liveaboard. I already work "on demand" as a stagehand here in Atlantic City. In talking to my bosses, I would not lose my position on the call list as long as they know ahead of time I will not be availible.

This would allow me to spend spring, summer, and part of fall in NJ and head south for the winter.


----------



## r44bob

sailorsnook said:


> Is anyone interested in discussing ways to make a few pennies whilst being a travelling liveaboard? I've tried a few things, with limited success so far, which experience I can share, but always open to new ideas!


Im interested in your ideas..I have been trading options for 5 yrs,,so as long as I have internet access,,Im good.

Bob d


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## joelsanda

remetau said:


> Computers have the best pay. If you have the skills or the ability to learn them, then your potential could be unlimited.
> 
> I have worked remotely as a programmer for over 7 years doing Lotus Notes, DataStage, Java, and Enovia. There is always work out there available.


This is also my plan, though I test. Recently I've started branching out into testing iOS software as that is a little smaller and lends itself to limited time spans that are best for contract-type work. That's also seems more enjoyable than the typical death marches for servers and web applications I seem to find myself on.

How do you find jobs for code work? Are you hitting up sites with contract jobs at a fixed price or time/materials? Are you using previous employers and making yourself available to them when you're in a place with suitable connectivity?


----------



## boatpoker

Harborless said:


> my cruising is focused in the Bahamas. A few hours a day diving with a spear gun at some good reefs will net you enough fish to sell at the local docks toward late afternoon.
> I would think to avoid confrontation you would need to either work with or for them, or limit your stays in any one place to three or four days before moving on to the next locale.


Unless you are a Bahamian citizen this will get you a lovely view from inside their jail in very short order.


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## jamesorr

We have not pulled the trigger as of yet but this is a real subject that we have discussed quite a bit. I know that if your willing to do just about anything and are somewhat handy you can survive. Like my wife is tiny, which is great for going up masts, $100 a trip. Or cleaning houses and painting the interiors because the owners don't want the locals in their homes. We plan on taking a sewing machine along and doing canvas work as well. We also build handmade dinghys that we sell and that will blow away anything you get at a big retailer. So we shall save a good egg and then go and try working it as we sail, to conserve the egg.... also I've heard HVAC repair is a great skill to take with you, and of course an electrical background would be in demand too. Buying one of those topside mini-air compressors for snorkling/diving would prob. net some income as well, cleaning props and such. Buy a tension gauge(s) for standing rigging and charge people to adjust their riggs. Many things to do, any more ideas out there?


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## MarkofSeaLife

jamesorr said:


> Like my wife is tiny, which is great for going up masts, $100 a trip.


Ummmmm as I get older I get more and more shy of heights. Now I am damn petrified of being more than 6 feet above the ground - the top of my hair wiggles in mortal fear. But for $100 me and any other bugger in the anchorage, ANY anchorage, would be up a mast like a coconut climber on cocaine.

Not trying to hit your idea over its head with a teaspoon, or discourage you, but the road to paradise may be a little more stony than first perceptions.

All the best


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## MarioG

I work at a boat yard for during the summer then go cruising for the winter months.


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## Razcar

r44bob said:


> Im interested in your ideas..I have been trading options for 5 yrs,,so as long as I have internet access,,Im good.
> 
> Bob d


Cool Bob - it might be interesting to start a thread about trading options...for us this has been a nice augmentation to our income...


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## JiffyLube

I know of a guy that got a part time job for an American boat watermaker company helping customers in his cruising area, sometimes trouble shooting and repairing their systems, sometimes coming to the states to pick up parts and systems to take back with him to use, and sometimes working a booth for this company at boat shows. I'm sure he doesn't make a lot of money, but he seems to enjoy what work he does. His wife and him live off savings they set aside for cruising, and when the money runs out so does the cruising. This little side line he fell into will keep their dream alive a little longer, and in time they might discover or fall into other ways of making money. His wife is a really good cook, so maybe she might try giving small classes on American style cuisine.


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## denverd0n

Once again I think it is good to remind people that any job that you take, or business you run, when in a foreign port is probably illegal without the proper work and/or business visas.

Yes, a lot of people do this sort of thing, and very few get caught. Here in the U.S. we call them "illegal aliens." It happens everywhere. If you want to do it, I won't judge. I only wish to remind you that there are risks.

Oh yeah, and if you get caught... I don't want to hear any whining!


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## DougSabbag

denverd0n said:


> Once again I think it is good to remind people that any job that you take, or business you run, when in a foreign port is probably illegal without the proper work and/or business visas.
> 
> Yes, a lot of people do this sort of thing, and very few get caught. Here in the U.S. we call them "illegal aliens." It happens everywhere. If you want to do it, I won't judge. I only wish to remind you that there are risks.
> 
> Oh yeah, and if you get caught... I don't want to hear any whining!


Interestingly enough, there is a primary relationship between the sort of person(s) who would live onboard a (sail)boat, and the basic human freedom which would allow people to earn a living and co-exist anywhere, peacefully.

For those of us who have eschewed the landlubber anchor / rut in our lives, we would also be most comfortable with expecting the right and the freedom to go where we want and do what we want as long as nobody else is hurt by our actions.

Sailboats are emerging as the best path to that diminishing freedom. We are that which can slip through the cracks, globally, of the controlling "authorities", much to their dislike.

We can cast off our lines for anywhere in the world without having to be scanned, stripped, searched, licensed, certified, taxed, checked against any lists, we can carry whatever quantity of liquids we want, we can say words which would easily earn a free trip to Guantanemo, (without any actual "crime" being committed), wear what we do or don't want to, and generally thumb our noses at the uniforms.

"They" don't like this, but for now, they can't do a damn thing about it.


Fair winds.


----------



## denverd0n

DougSabbag said:


> ...we would also be most comfortable with expecting the right and the freedom to go where we want and do what we want as long as nobody else is hurt by our actions.


Well, you can EXPECT that all you want, but in today's world, it simply doesn't exist. You only have to travel between a few countries to realize that there is red tape and bureaucracy everywhere. Every country has their laws, and every country insists that you obey them. I'm pretty sure there aren't any countries on this planet that make a special exception for sailors who expect to be able to "do what we want as long as nobody else is hurt."

But, like I said, I won't judge. If you want to work "off the grid," "on the black," "under the table," or whatever they call it wherever you are from, then I say, more power to ya, and good luck!

However, I do reserve the right to be righteously unimpressed, and even laugh at your foolishness, if you make this choice, happen to be one of the few who get caught, and then whine to the world about how unfair it is for you to be punished. I only mention this because--can't remember if it was this forum, or one of the others that I frequent--some time back a poster went on a tirade about the injustice of him being jailed and fined by foreign officials when he got caught breaking their laws. He thought it was terribly wrong that HE got caught when so many others don't. Sorry, but you will get no sympathy from me on that one!


----------



## Capt.aaron

Travel to foriegn countries and you'll see ton's of foreigners owning businesses. I built and owned a night club in Isla Mujeres. I own property in Honduras, who's motto is " Honduras, we are open for business" I'm contemplating building a bar on my dock, maybe putting out some moorings. Permits are in place to be paid, pay 'em. I've worked under the table in foreign coutries. I built fiber glass sh!t tanks in Belize city. In '92, I was broke and demasted up Haulover creek in Belize city. The owner of the Marina that I was in debt to hired me, he needed a good glass guy. I was under the umbrella of " nobody messed with him." I've run under ground charters. It's not illegal if you don't " charge". Just don't be stupid about it. I've worked legally as a dive master, delivery captain, merchant marine. I painted flowers and moons on t shirts and sold them to mostly Guatemalan tourist's in the mountains of Guatemala. I paid the local administration for a street vendors permit daily. Resourceful is what you need to be, and sometimes have a local partner. People who say you can't do it, have'nt done it, and people who say you can, have.


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## MarkofSeaLife

DougSabbag said:


> the basic human freedom which would allow people to earn a living and co-exist anywhere, peacefully.
> ... expecting the right and the freedom to go where we want and do what we want as long as nobody else is hurt by our actions.


This has to be the funniest post Ive read for ages.

Your country may have a Bill of Rights. If it does its one of the few in the world. And no country that I know off alow illegal immigrants or Visitors to work. Or some right of free passage.

But I am not here to tell you how the world works outside your cloistered area. Go cruising and learn.

Mark


----------



## lapworth

DougSabbag said:


> We can cast off our lines for anywhere
> 
> "They" don't like this, but for now, they can't do a damn thing about it.
> 
> 
> Fair winds.


Smugglers code. Submarines work good to.


----------



## DougSabbag

MarkofSeaLife said:


> This has to be the funniest post Ive read for ages.
> 
> Your country may have a Bill of Rights. If it does its one of the few in the world. And no country that I know off alow illegal immigrants or Visitors to work. Or some right of free passage.
> 
> But I am not here to tell you how the world works outside your cloistered area. Go cruising and learn.
> 
> Mark


Mark... I wasn't saying that is how the world IS, I was saying that is how it should be.

At 56 years old, and having travelled around the world, I could surely not be that naive and stupid to think what you thought.

I apologize for not being clearer.


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## DougSabbag

Capt.aaron said:


> Travel to foriegn countries and you'll see ton's of foreigners owning businesses. I built and owned a night club in Isla Mujeres. I own property in Honduras, who's motto is " Honduras, we are open for business" I'm contemplating building a bar on my dock, maybe putting out some moorings. Permits are in place to be paid, pay 'em. I've worked under the table in foreign coutries. I built fiber glass sh!t tanks in Belize city. In '92, I was broke and demasted up Haulover creek in Belize city. The owner of the Marina that I was in debt to hired me, he needed a good glass guy. I was under the umbrella of " nobody messed with him." I've run under ground charters. It's not illegal if you don't " charge". Just don't be stupid about it. I've worked legally as a dive master, delivery captain, merchant marine. I painted flowers and moons on t shirts and sold them to mostly Guatemalan tourist's in the mountains of Guatemala. I paid the local administration for a street vendors permit daily. Resourceful is what you need to be, and sometimes have a local partner. People who say you can't do it, have'nt done it, and people who say you can, have.


Now THIS is the spirit! Bravo Captain!


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## slax

Coming in at the end of this thread, and new in the community here. It would seem that with the various skill-sets I have I should pretty well cover most of my needs, abroad even? IT/IS Unix/Cloud infrastructure background. Currently work remotely 80%+ of the time. Looking to make that full break to 100% remote but getting pushback from my current gig, riding it out for now but feeling comforted by what I am seeing for the IT/IS around the world idea... I do have some other skill-sets (electronics/communication/metal-working/woodworking/light-fiberglass/sewing/fire-performance/jewelry) and have spent may years traveling on land using those skills, northeast welding in a tram shop, fl as a vet-tech, co as a wisp admin, az building log houses in prescott, back and forth across the state, canada, and down through panama with the fire performance (for tips/beer at tourist hotspots, and with/without a local troop and a hat) and guerilla jewelry (hemp/silver/copper/etc wire-knot work). I am in an interesting transitional time in my life right now and have found alot of time on my hands for reflection on life and plans unfulfilled. through that I have been coming back to the nomad in me and the ideal path of freedom with self sustainability needed to fulfill that nomadic desire while ensuring it is not a burden on others, specifically those I am responsible for on the mainland and those I am visiting (not taking from the local economy but adding when able, via special skill/ability/product/function)

From what I am gathering I can:
1.) Use what I have saved to purchase the most optimal version I can find of what I need available in my budget (3-8k, 28-32', prob in need of work, a good income at the moment to facilitate repairs/improvements bi-weekly, just seems to go elsewhere, could be the 1600$ rent maybe)
2.) Continue to accumulate a nest-egg before leaving my current gig, while improving/sailing/learning my new home and honing the other skills needed.
3.) Work to support our (self/ship/dog) needs needs while abroad using IT/IS and ANY other skill-set I can tap into from my broad experience base in life, and use savings to ensure land needs are taken care of (support/family/etc...)
4.) Either it works out and I can keep going, I come home (to moms? or a couch somewhere) broke but with an awesome experience for life and find a new cubicle job), or more likely somewhere in the middle? I find a balance that works for me between the two, if I have to land in a harbor somewhere and get a unix/windows/IT gig, it pays well enough to support the long term, 3months at a time even I feel would cover the costs of more then the other 9m, esp when minimized.

Thanks for all the good previous info, looking forward to more to come. I will try to keep things updated as I move through the motions of securing 100% remote and the lifestyle I desire.

Happy sails.
slax


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## joelsanda

slax said:


> 2.) Continue to accumulate a nest-egg before leaving my current gig, while improving/sailing/learning my new home and honing the other skills needed.
> 
> 3.) Work to support our (self/ship/dog) needs needs while abroad using IT/IS and ANY other skill-set I can tap into from my broad experience base in life, and use savings to ensure land needs are taken care of (support/family/etc...)


Slax - this is what I'm doing now. I have three years left for the nest egg. At which point I hope to buy and find a liveaboard marina in the southeast while I refit the things I want done.

Hopefully things don't change much in my life and that egg doesn't crack.

I'm also hopeful I can find IT work as a tester. I have 15 years of software testing experience and ought to be able to find contract gigs that will keep the kitty from draining too fast. Have you looked into sites that bid out jobs for contract IT work?

I've got a long standing relationship with a QA placement company in the U.S. west that I'm hoping will be able to funnel work my way when I'm parked for a fair amount of time.


----------



## slax

joelsanda said:


> Have you looked into sites that bid out jobs for contract IT work?
> 
> I've got a long standing relationship with a QA placement company in the U.S. west that I'm hoping will be able to funnel work my way when I'm parked for a fair amount of time.


a bit, I have done several contracts though until the recent trend in operations to the cloud they have usually required some system side interaction from me. new future dawning for us infrastructure folk..

qa/testing is solid remote, at the last two larger corps I have worked at, we have had several testers in overseas locations with no problems whatsoever..


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## DougSabbag

SLAX,

Overall, I would hope you would believe that you will survive / succeed at least as well while living on a boat, as you have while living on land.

As with all of us, as long as you are willing to do what is available to you to earn what you need, you will survive.

I have met some people who place boxes around themselves, wherein they are ONLY a: "realtor / accountant / manager / etc." and it is those people who remain out of work for months & years.

When I have been "in between computer programming contracts", I have taken security guard jobs, washed boats, i.e., whatever was available to me, and therefore never went flat broke.

Good luck and fair winds!

Doug


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## wind_magic

DougSabbag said:


> whatever was available to me


I think this sums up cruising economics in general.

Make hay while the sun shines ...


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## slax

DougSabbag said:


> SLAX,
> 
> Overall, I would hope you would believe that you will survive / succeed at least as well while living on a boat, as you have while living on land...


Doug,

Thanks for the input, I am definitely not one to stray from other work when it's available and often really enjoy stepping out of the IT thing for a while to learn something else new, inevitibly for the last 20yrs I have come back to it, usually when the right combination of need/opportunity arise. As while it takes its toll on the body and mind often, it does pay well and thats often needed. Looking forward to diversifying even more and adding to my belt of skill-set's.

best,
slax


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## pcloot

Hi ,
Good idea but you can't do it alone !!
You need several people and then is the question where ?


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## u4ea

I just went to the Los Angeles Ruby Conference last week, and it was interesting to see that LOTS of companies are now "office free" where everyone works from wherever they happen to be. Many, perhaps most, worked from diverse and mobile locations.

Skype works better -- much better -- than cell phones. Its easy to find WiFi hot spots even in the apparently most primitive islands. Ditch the cell iPhone for an iPad Touch.

I have found that by looking around a bit, its easy to find the WiFi, and then to arrange phone calls or even video calls if the bandwidth is stable and fast enough (usually the case).

Using Git, and pushing and pulling when at WiFi, is a professional way to get things done.


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## joelsanda

u4ea said:


> Using Git, and pushing and pulling when at WiFi, is a professional way to get things done.


You must be a developer? I have a tester who worked for me from his sailboat in Marina Del Rey. As a test manager that was the same as someone working overseas, in the sense there was a VPN and a need to have a local data store for him to execute scripts against.

I know I can play up time zone difference - nothing beats having a Caribbean time zone when you are testing builds for a company on the west coast  I routinely aimed for remote testers that had a good half day on a build before my team showed up for work. They vetted the build and found the obvious defects before my senior testers deep tested.

I wonder how it would be to pair a tester with a developer that way, say if both used their respective skill sets to bid on contract jobs and paired up for the contract?


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## slax

joelsanda said:


> You must be a developer? I have a tester who worked for me from his sailboat in Marina Del Rey. As a test manager that was the same as someone working overseas, in the sense there was a VPN and a need to have a local data store for him to execute scripts against.


DevOPS here so code as infrastructure is the name of the game... We still maintain our own DC so I for the moment have to be within a reasonable response time for escalated sites issues, but the DC is in SF so anywhere nearby can be within a reasonable amount of time.. 

Trying to make the break to full time remote, but kinda like it where I am so waiting it out and staying local for the moment.

I like the idea of a remote team sudo complete with all the needed skill-sets to bid on jobs as a team, been slowly working on growing my contact list of people with a proven track record in there roles while working remote. And have been able to bring several of them on for either placement or gigs needing specific skills. Again keeping an eye to the future, and whatever possibilities arise.


----------



## boatpoker

I'm surprised that through all of this thread no one has suggested becoming a marine surveyor.


----------



## Silvio

boatpoker said:


> I'm surprised that through all of this thread no one has suggested becoming a marine surveyor.


Or a hooker.


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## boatpoker

Silvio said:


> Or a hooker.


I tried that .... no takers


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## joelsanda

slax said:


> I like the idea of a remote team sudo complete with all the needed skill-sets to bid on jobs as a team, been slowly working on growing my contact list of people with a proven track record in there roles while working remote. And have been able to bring several of them on for either placement or gigs needing specific skills. Again keeping an eye to the future, and whatever possibilities arise.


I've got a good solid contact with a test contract/placement firm that I've used for over a decade of contract and direct-hire testers. They are aware of my plans to cut the lines in a few years and that I'll be looking for work when the weather turns mean and nasty. They're in mountain time so I'm hoping an east coastish time zone makes me a little more attractive for contract jobs. Nothing like a tester hitting builds four hours before the programmers roll out of bed.


----------



## mad_machine

u4ea said:


> I just went to the Los Angeles Ruby Conference last week, and it was interesting to see that LOTS of companies are now "office free" where everyone works from wherever they happen to be. Many, perhaps most, worked from diverse and mobile locations.


Funny thing is.. Yahoo is getting away from that. They are now making all their employees roll into the office every day


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## slax

mad_machine said:


> Funny thing is.. Yahoo is getting away from that. They are now making all their employees roll into the office every day


yah but yahoo is slowly declining into a computer catacomb of antiquity... and losing serious equity in the process.


----------



## estopa

I am in IT as well and currently work remotely as a "telecommuter". I do not liveaboard but enjoy summers daysailing with my blackberry connected to work. Our industry certainly has gone through transformation. I don't see "office" space in our future. The future demands our nature of work to be a lot more transient. I see a future of wintering in the islands or down south as long as a broadband internet connection is present.

Also, there are many other passive investments out there. One I am slowly building up is investing in Multifamily apartments. This provides a steady cash flow. Only drawback is that you will have to hand over the reins to a property manager. In essence you will have to manage the manager. Although I think this would be a great source of income for people to travel the world. Of course it will take time and money to foster this.

I've read folks basically renting out their current residences as well. If there is positive cash flow this could be another avenue for liveaboards.


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## lavidanueva

Why not try massage therapy. There will lots of aching backs from baby boomers setting and hauling anchor.


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## bill1974

With skype and teamviewer I service customers from all over the world since 2008.

It is hard and demanding, no solution yet for afloat, since skype talking and teleservicing demands bandwith.

But I am working on it.


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## slax

Yah its been an interesting adventure this working from vessel reality. Tis quite hard to stretch out and have more then a single monitor and room to think. Nice when things arent blowing up but sometimes I miss stuff cause I am not able to keep all the HUD's up and open... bandwidth has been an issue as well, though am slowly getting it in order. Most of the time I can pick up the marina wifi when at the slip, seems to serve the purpose during most days (business hours at least). I have another small DC linux box running 2 x 4G data plans multiplexed and shared as an access point for when the wifi is saturated or when out beyond the range of wifi. Can justify the 90$/month with work needs... and when they're both getting good reception, 2x4G is more then enough bandwidth, coverage in most of SF Bay, even under sail. Still doing more research for long-range comms, but feel this setup with the right carriers, or dual carriers for those spots w/out one or the other along the coast.. could cover most of the coastal cruising area out west. Cost could get a little dicey as you get further south if your crossing into mexico (or within 30miles of the border) I would look at international plans ahead of time. The more I think about it for longer voyages though, the more I am leaning towards utilizing whatever other skill-sets I can and staying away from IT/IS stuff except when/if absolutely needed. Its hard enough for me to be stuck below on the freekin keys for a 12-16hr day as is, imagine it would be a bit more lamesauce if I was say in a distant land.

cheers,
slax


----------



## hydrodog

I have a diesel welder generator that provides back up power to my boat and do most welding processes..... always keep a bottle of argon for al welding and plasma cutter .... can do steel and aluminum welding whenever someone needs it for extra cash.


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## bill1974

A nice working station needs 2 x 22 monitors and a 500 w low voltage supllier in order to execute webmaster tasks and service calls with team and skype.Plus an auxilliary notebook and an external disk for backups. I have made a foldable wooden desk wich foldes the notebook and abovethere is a 19 inch monitor connected to notebook as extended desktop.

Fold the notebook hide the chair and I have the space again.

I need the space easy accesible because below there are my 325 hp steyr diesels.


----------



## bill1974

There is software that can take one whole website in your hard disk for offline browsing.

So you can travel and read off the grid.

Also a nice tablet can carry half a ton of books that you will need 5 lives to read,lol.

Samsung note is light and you can read in the bed as a normal book.

The key is:

Learn something difficult,only a few know about,make a product,service around it.Solve the problem for ever.No I will not tell you the industry because I eat there ,lol

The industry must be forever not something that will die.eg Health sector is for ever.

You can have sugar and cholesterol digital meters ,consumables and sell service to other cruisers.


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## Gustafson78

As with all of us, as long as you are willing to do what is available to you to earn what you need, you will survive.


----------



## kjango

What ever happened to the good old fashioned five state crime spree as a quick way to make money ???


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## slax

irony is at least for the distance of my life span, tech is pretty much here to stay. have an array of other skill-sets aquired through the years. welding being one, electronics another, worked for several years as a vet tech, fairly decent glass blower, pretty good with a sewing machine, owned volkswagens for most of my life so decent mechanical skills (combustion engine, simple electronics, etc), have traveled fairly extensively on land through north and central america doing fire performance and making jewelry for tourists, imagine some combination of the above and whatever I can muster up in a time of need.. need to get some more diving under my belt, and maybe some work with underwater welding, feel they would be a good combination of skills to travel with. Health care is definitely not going away but its more time spent here getting trained in human health compared to animal, though re-vamping the vet tech experience may serve as beneficial too. The many possibilities of freedom


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## IronSpinnaker

Run drugs, guns and liquor. When I was in the Coast Guard that seemed like the business most live-aboards were in. We were constantly being reminded to not overlook Ma and Pa on their sailboat when doing boardings. We would frequently review cases where a sailboat was boarded and the 70+ year old Grandmother and Grandfather had large quantities of illegal drugs on board.

I think from a practical standpoint unless you work part of the year and cruise the rest or are independently wealthy, bartering is the only real way to get the items you need like fuel and provisions.


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## elspru

I don't know why no one has mentioned the traditional trades of being a merchant of food stuffs and other products.

I'm really big on nutrition and healthy eating. There is a large movement of organic, locavore, fair-trade no-carbon high-end food stuff with relatively big margins by comparison to conventional stuff. 
Planning on following the harvest season up and down the america's, can probably buy bulk, and then dehydrate or otherwise preserve foods, (i.e. on a plastic sheet on a secluded beach somewhere, and vacuum sealed for transport) and then sell them to both cruisers and health stores.
Have a nice little sailboat on the package "no-carbon sail transported"(intend to go engineless), finally those locavores can have their mango's, banana's and coconuts without feeling guilty about the footprint of trucks, airplanes and freighters.

There are already some companies shipping wine by sail in europe BBC News - Sailing into the future of global trade? and there are some other examples of more local stuff with yachts.

Ya food might not have the best margins, but there is also gems and semi-precious stones, which are cheap in south america and caribbean, but should sell for a pretty penny up in north america. The guy with the best price-point I met a gem show, said he mined it himself in brazil, to cut out the middle-man, and he had to fly there and back, so limited baggage and lots of oversight. Probably would need a prospectors license or something in country for anything more than souvenir amounts though could be worth-while.

Again the food is a good cover since you don't really want to be known for hauling gems around, makes pirates drool too much, so would have to be a small amount used for ballast. Another benefit of the gems is can use it for the minor bribes which are common in the warmer areas of the world (they could give it to their lady friend if they don't like it themselves). Other than gem-shows there are also new-age shops which pay big dollars for gems, or at least sell them at very high prices, who knows maybe some of their customers would also like low-footprint fair-trade gems.

Of course one of the best things about the transported preserved food, is having high quality provisions on board all the time. Assuming business is good can scale up and get or build bigger sailing boats, and have more crew. Could also make a liveaboards co-op kinda thing, where people can join follow the procedures protocols to obtain and process the foods, and then sell them to affiliated retailers.


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## IronSpinnaker

With food items you run into all kinds of FDA oversight, especially if you are crossing borders. Also "buying in bulk" and the limited storage space on a boat probably present an issue.


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## PsychedChicken

DougSabbag said:


> Of course, if your boat is paid off and you don't have any (or large) credit card debt, no car payments, and have a water maker and solar panels, you can drop the hook and pray for good luck at fishing, and not worry about money!


This pretty much sums up my plan... I own my boat, my car is paid off, and Im outfitting it while I still have a job. My husband is an awesome fisherman and I have excellent IT skills. Im going to finish my degree and settle what little bit of student loans I have BEFORE setting sail (permanently at least). We make a living on land, with rent and utilities etc bringing in 20k/year. Im not looking to bring in a lot of money... Im just looking to fund my sailing habit! Not starve to death while island hopping for the rest of my life... set up a small nest egg for boat maintenance/repairs.


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## IronSpinnaker

Money will always be an issue even if you have no bills. Transient slips cost money, passing through locks often costs money. Panama Canal for example costs close to $1000.00 to go through. And then there are always the unexpected costs, like haulout for unexpected repairs. Even if you can do the work yourself there will be costs involved.


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## miatapaul

kjango said:


> What ever happened to the good old fashioned five state crime spree as a quick way to make money ???


The damn cameras are everywhere too easy to get caught. Also it is hard to stop once you get started, just look at Bonnie and Clyde!


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## polaris2.11

Back in the 90's, when they were giving credit cards away, I somewhat seriously considered signing up for all I could, taking max cash advance on every one, and sailing off alone forever. Then I got divorced, 'real' life got better, and I found me a mate who loves to sail as much as I do.


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## slax

IronSpinnaker said:


> Run drugs, guns and liquor. When I was in the Coast Guard that seemed like the business most live-aboards were in. We were constantly being reminded to not overlook Ma and Pa on their sailboat when doing boardings. We would frequently review cases where a sailboat was boarded and the 70+ year old Grandmother and Grandfather had large quantities of illegal drugs on board.
> 
> I think from a practical standpoint unless you work part of the year and cruise the rest or are independently wealthy, bartering is the only real way to get the items you need like fuel and provisions.


So I see the illegality of Guns and Drugs, but what defines running liquor? Like what are the limitations before your into trouble for a quantity? coming back into the states I would assume to be the issue from the perspective of a former Coast Guard, wonder what the rules for qty and such of liquor in other regions of the world are... may be an actual option depending on the amount limitations..


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## slax

I really like, or see the potential(to be more accurate), of a variation of things for barter and sale, combined with as broad a range of applicable skills as possible, and a willingness to make things happen. As mentioned there is always an amount of monies needed for vagrant/visitor slips, fuel, crossing the panama canal, maintenance, and whatever you need but can't trade (barter or sweat equity). Though imagine these to be less in certain spots as compared to others. Some interesting combination of a mobile gypsy vendor, and a sailing the farm sustainability with enough excess to use for trading, and handy-person finding anything that they can do for some amount to help keep those things requiring cash in order. have done it in every other type of vehicle, including several pairs of foot wear, and seen others do it. adapt, diversify, survive


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## IronSpinnaker

A reasonable amount for personal use is fine as long as you declare it on your return. If you are suspected of criminal activity and have 10 cases on board you are going to have a problem. If you have no prior run ins and have 10 cases on board you will be fine as long as you declare it and pay the duty. There is no restrictions on how much alcohol you bring back into the country for personal use. 

You can have as much as you can fit on the boat and no crime is committed until you unload it without declaring it.


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## Andrew65

"Back in the 90's, when they were giving credit cards away, I somewhat seriously considered signing up for all I could, taking max cash advance on every one, and sailing off alone."

I know a guy who did it back in ´93. His wife had recently died and the govenrment was royally screwing him somehow, so he maxed out as many cards that he could get his hands on and took off until the statute of limitations on debt ran out and came back for more..hahaha. He was brilliant about it.

Actually I agree with Capt.Aaron. Necessity is the mother of invention, so if you have to break bricks to get a paycheck to eat, you break bricks no matter what IT background you have.

Beautician is a possibility for the girl on the boat. Restaurant work as a barback is another one.

When I was a liveaboard coastal cruising the west coast of florida for work, I met a woman who weaved bamboo leaf baskets. They weren`t big or fancy, but she had a line of tourists lining up to buy one off her for 5 bucks each. I still have mine 17 years later to remember the life just before I moved to Norway which is a whole nother story in itself. 

Would it/could it be possible to follow along with the regatta circuits and time it out to arrive before it starts to put the word out that you can repair such and such for this or that price?


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## Kesmg

IronSpinnaker said:


> Run drugs, guns and liquor. When I was in the Coast Guard that seemed like the business most live-aboards were in. We were constantly being reminded to not overlook Ma and Pa on their sailboat when doing boardings. We would frequently review cases where a sailboat was boarded and the 70+ year old Grandmother and Grandfather had large quantities of illegal drugs on board.
> 
> I think from a practical standpoint unless you work part of the year and cruise the rest or are independently wealthy, bartering is the only real way to get the items you need like fuel and provisions.


For Real? I would assume we would not be considered suspects, but now see your point. wow. My husband is IT, would that help our sincerity?
Katrina


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## Classic30

FWIW, the best job I have ever heard of as live-aboard was that of a family I bumped into in North Queensland many moons ago: They had a (rather rare) license to catch Tropical Fish.

A couple of hours a week with a scuba tank and a net was enough to keep them in pocket money whilst they simply enjoyed life in paradise..


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## aeventyr60

Classic30 said:


> FWIW, the best job I have ever heard of as live-aboard was that of a family I bumped into in North Queensland many moons ago: They had a (rather rare) license to catch Tropical Fish.
> 
> A couple of hours a week with a scuba tank and a net was enough to keep them in pocket money whilst they simply enjoyed life in paradise..


Met a guy who collected rare shells and sent them to collectors around the world.

Met another guy lately who teaches English via Skype.


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## Classic30

aeventyr60 said:


> Met a guy who collected rare shells and sent them to collectors around the world.


A Beachcomber, huh?? Sounds like hard work to me.. Like gold prospecting, if you don't find something saleable, you'll be out there the next day, and the next.. never knowing when you'll get enough for your next meal.



aeventyr60 said:


> Met another guy lately who teaches English via Skype.


and good luck to him.. That would frustrate the hell out of me!!


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## melody1204

I have a full-time job with a promotional marketing company that I'm fortunate enough to still be able to do from the boat, but I also have side jobs that I do for extra income.

I've updated websites for people (found on Craigslist, word of mouth, etc.) as well as built some from scratch. Simple stuff, as I'm not a professional web designer, but I know enough to make a decent looking site and I can read/write html.

I also make jewelry and have my own online jewelry shop called Maggie & Milly. You can check it out here! www.maggieandmilly.com

I write a blog called Saving To Sail that has a post on ways to replenish the cruising kitty.

Basically you just have to be creative and versatile. Some things may bring you money one month, but not the next, so just take that into consideration. Some months I make a nice chunk of change making and selling jewelry, but sometimes I thank my lucky stars that I still have a full-time job.


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## Coastlife247

Classic30 said:


> FWIW, the best job I have ever heard of as live-aboard was that of a family I bumped into in North Queensland many moons ago: They had a (rather rare) license to catch Tropical Fish.
> 
> A couple of hours a week with a scuba tank and a net was enough to keep them in pocket money whilst they simply enjoyed life in paradise..


This sounds awesome. I have a degree in biology as well as an open water SCUBA cert. How can i get into scuba diving for reef tank fish????


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## khammett

sailorsnook said:


> Is anyone interested in discussing ways to make a few pennies whilst being a travelling liveaboard? I've tried a few things, with limited success so far, which experience I can share, but always open to new ideas!


Work at Labor Ready...same day cash.


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## puravida11

Hi guys, Paul Loli, 29 year old novice sailor looking for advice on good charts for these particular areas. My older brother recently purchased a boat, 44ds jeanneau, that is coming to Miami late next month. We have sailing experience for the past two years, two dozen hours or so with captain, ASA up to 104, and we have a plan on having an experienced captain that we know teach us once we're aboard next month for a few weeks or so, depending on our comfortable we get. We're taking precautions as well in getting the ASA 105 & 106 just to give us even more experience. We're novice sailors, cautious, but we are trying to make small, short term goals, far as making it across to Bimini, or West End, because this is a first for both of us. We are the types to really get our heads down and we found a groove together very quickly once sailing, but realize that there is so much more to learn. Our grand goal is to make it to Fortaleza, by June, for the World Cup. We have recently purchased good explorer chartbooks, all editions for near Bahamas, Exumas, etc, but we really haven't found anything too detailed for the Trinidad and the Brazilian Coast area, up to Fortaleza. Does anyone happen to know good charts that are worth purchasing for these particular areas? I understand this is a lot for our first post, but have been following this site for awhile now, and there always seems to be knowledgeable advice. We are in over our heads, but we're willing to work and try and see if we can make it. Any advice is welcome. Thank you.


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## azguy

While we all want to sets sail for parts unknown and fall off the grid and be an explorer, it's hard unless you have money socked away. I'm living a meager lifestyle now in hopes that I can have a nice nest egg in 10 years. Maybe it's possible, IDK.

My more realistic plan is to have enough to acquire a nice suitable boat for a live aboard situation and then exploring reasonable/cheap place to live aboard on the gulf coast, Florida panhandle or west coast of Florida. I'll work at Starbucks or maybe even a West Marine store or maybe tend bar and be that cool 50 something guy that lives on his boat and makes a mean latte. Maybe I'll take 2-3months each year and have an adventure in the islands and then return to my home port.

We all need dreams of we are just another mammal....


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## hellosailor

Coastlife, if you really want to try that you can go into for yourself like Doc Ford. Or work for someone else. Either way you need to find out who sells the fish, because they'll bebuying them from you. Maybe. And what fish or reefs are around you, to know what to catch. And state laws in every state, to find out what you can catch and whether you'll need permits.

Or you can just catch what you like and put 'em up for sale on the aquarium web sites. Might be profitable, might get you arrested, depending on what you run afoul of or not.

Either way you need to find out who is buying and selling what, and then contact them.

I didn't think you had any hard coral reefs off Louisiana.


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## Thermophile

Havnt finished reading this, will do so as cell service permits, buuut a friend ofnmine lives on a boat in FL and plays guitar in bars for tips and is a photographer for a living. Me? I have no artistic talents. Unless you could find a way to live off the water?


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## Capt Len

How about a real job, making real money ? There is a gold rush going on, Good help is hard to find.and oil companies fly their workers from camp, 2 weeks in and 2 out. Talent and skills are necessary so get the training and go for it.If I were to do it today I'd go for a career as Power Engineer. I've spent years dumpster diving but I also worked for Dome,Exxon and Beaudrill (Gulf)and my off time contracted services as research ship captain. The opportunities open before you as you go .On the other hand, piddling off the dock for pocket change might be just the ticket.


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## Thermophile

After i posted that a coworker here was talking about that same thing. But that would be like half livabourd.


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## vega1860

Slayer said:


> I can see how you could make money being a dive master, but how do you do it while travelling? How do you get the jobs? Do you teach diving, do underwater work on boats? I'd be interested in more specifics.


If you are a diver, and willing, you can make money anywhere near boats inspecting, cleaning bottoms, changing zincs and picking stuff up off the bottom of the harbor.


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## vega1860

azguy said:


> While we all want to sets sail for parts unknown and fall off the grid and be an explorer, it's hard unless you have money socked away. I'm living a meager lifestyle now in hopes that I can have a nice nest egg in 10 years. Maybe it's possible, IDK.
> 
> My more realistic plan is to have enough to acquire a nice suitable boat for a live aboard situation and then exploring reasonable/cheap place to live aboard on the gulf coast, Florida panhandle or west coast of Florida. I'll work at Starbucks or maybe even a West Marine store or maybe tend bar and be that cool 50 something guy that lives on his boat and makes a mean latte. Maybe I'll take 2-3months each year and have an adventure in the islands and then return to my home port.
> 
> We all need dreams of we are just another mammal....


If you play your cards right, in ten years you can set yourself up to cruise indefinitely. You will find that you spend more time in port than at sea anyway and a part time job at WM (A good idea for any boater) or waiting tables will give you the opportunity to make friends and contacts that can advance the cause.

Dreams are all well and good but goals are better. The difference? A goal is a dream with a plan and a deadline.


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## MDBoatBabe

Hi all! 
I'm a livaboard on my 57' Chris Craft Constellation Connie. I'm a commercial diver; I clean boat bottoms. (web site removed)
I love what I do and do what I love. 

Calm winds and fair seas, 
Marlene


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## sailorsnook

Are you a travelling liveaboard Marlene?


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## ambitious/rubbish

For those of you who referenced providing IT services while living aboard, how do maintain internet access in blue water? I'm looking for essentially a mobile hotspot that obtains its connection via satellite, anyone know about this? I'm basically after a good internet connection while at sea so I can continually access weather info.


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## MDBoatBabe

SailorsNook, not traveling; raising kids in school and going to school myself. I do however have friends that travel to the Bahamas and to support their boating habit, they dive boat bottoms. They have a banner on both sides of their boat when at anchor that advertises their services.


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## hellosailor

a/r-
Bluewater internet access is dirt cheap, about what cellular data with roaming cost a mere decade ago.
Or from another perspective, it is unaffordable but Inmarsat and others do provide it, which was unthinkable two decades ago. Plenty of threads online about this and plenty of option$. But unless you're really something special, it will be far cheaper for your clients to hire someone who doesn't have to pay satellite data rates.


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## SummerSailors

We are gearing up to take off cruising next year. While the idea of truly "taking off forever" is great, the reality of having no income while also not being independently wealthy (and spending every penny getting the boat ready!) is slowly creeping in to my consciousness...

I am realizing that I can probably keep several of my clients and work virtually. I am a bookkeeper and Professional Organizer. I *know* I could do this, in theory. My main concern is internet access.

Can you guys talk about what the best way to have reliable internet service is? If I am not at a port, is it possible to still get online somehow and say, do payroll?? We originally are planning to get SSB, but I'm guessing if I'm to be in business, I will need much more than that.

Services, equipment- hardware, software, etc... what say you??


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## vega1860

SummerSailors said:


> We are gearing up to take off cruising next year. While the idea of truly "taking off forever" is great, the reality of having no income while also not being independently wealthy (and spending every penny getting the boat ready!) is slowly creeping in to my consciousness...
> 
> I am realizing that I can probably keep several of my clients and work virtually. I am a bookkeeper and Professional Organizer. I *know* I could do this, in theory. My main concern is internet access.
> 
> Can you guys talk about what the best way to have reliable internet service is? If I am not at a port, is it possible to still get online somehow and say, do payroll?? We originally are planning to get SSB, but I'm guessing if I'm to be in business, I will need much more than that.
> 
> Services, equipment- hardware, software, etc... what say you??


I think you could pull it off if you confine your cruising to short hops between relatively civilized ports. If, in your fantasy, you see yourself setting the auto pilot and going below to do payroll while a thousand miles from Nuku Hiva, consider what happens if you encounter a week of bad weather or your antennae carries away, or salt spray gets into the electronics while you are still two weeks from port. Blown deadlines are not good for business and deadlines are death to a cruiser.

Better to keep your voyaging and working separate. Best is to set up one or more small passive streams of income (Rental income, royalties etc.) so the cash flow is not all one way while you are cruising. You can stop to work when you feel like it or the need arises. In your case, you could set up a newsletter and engage your current clients. You may be able to put together short term projects to complete while in port.

Just my opinion FWIW


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## capta

SummerSailors said:


> We are gearing up to take off cruising next year. While the idea of truly "taking off forever" is great, the reality of having no income while also not being independently wealthy (and spending every penny getting the boat ready!) is slowly creeping in to my consciousness...
> 
> I am realizing that I can probably keep several of my clients and work virtually. I am a bookkeeper and Professional Organizer. I *know* I could do this, in theory. My main concern is internet access.
> 
> Can you guys talk about what the best way to have reliable internet service is? If I am not at a port, is it possible to still get online somehow and say, do payroll?? We originally are planning to get SSB, but I'm guessing if I'm to be in business, I will need much more than that.
> 
> Services, equipment- hardware, software, etc... what say you??


Here's what we have found through actual experience while cruising the Windwards and Leewards for the last 2 years. An external wifi antenna is a must and as we wanted the best reception available and are not very computer savvy, we chose the BadBoy X-treme and their Unleashed. The same equipment can be purchased as the Bullet, but it does take some serious computer savvy to initialize.
Without it, internet was just plain a matter of luck.
With it we have pulled usable, but slow, internet from 2.3 miles (by gps). Almost every anchorage in the Antilles has some form of internet. There are a few companies that are multi-island that charge about us$40.00 a month with speeds varying between 1 and 54 Mbps, but most often on the lower end. There are many open access points (free) also, with varying speeds and at times they can be faster than the paid access points.
There are a few anchorages with absolutely no internet (Chatham Bay, Union Island, for instance), but just next door at Frigate Island anchorage we had decent free wifi.
FdeF Martinique is by far the worst for internet (but great for many other things), but there is free wifi @ McD if you carry your computer ashore. Across the bay @ Pointe du Bout, there was free, excellent wifi, but a year earlier, the same access point wasn't free or even available if you weren't a hotel guest?
Wherever you are speed is usually best between 01:00 and 03:00 if needed.
I think you could very well do the book keeping thing if time wasn't a problem. Almost anywhere you go, you can always find a hotspot with reasonable speed ashore.
Of course these are all open access points and security may not be acceptable for your needs?
Internet through satellites is very, very slow and very, very costly from what I've found out from the bigger boats who have it. But really, you aren't going to be sailing nearly as much as you are anchored anyway, and you could stay in a place w/good internet when you needed to.
I'd suggest keeping an internet log so you remember where you had good internet for when you need it.
Hope this helps.


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## lavidanueva

You must have a lot of money if you plan to do all of your internet through a sat phone. Expensive and slow are the words to be thinking about. As others have said, most of your time will be spent in port. Find locations with good internet access or buy a cell phone that can be used as a hot spot in the country you are in if you will be there long enough. While they are working on it, living off of the grid but being constantly connected to the net is coming, but not yet affordable or reliable.


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## hellosailor

"You must have a lot of money if you plan to do all of your internet through a sat phone"
How do you figure that? Adjusting for inflation, I think satphone time now is about comparable (inflation adjusted) for what I paid for long distance data calls at an incredible 1200 baud in the mid-1980's. And, I made a profit on those calls.
Buck a minute? Still cheaper than cell phone long distance with roaming cost back then!

"Expensive" is all relative. I hear people moaning about how expensive the new low-end 3D printers are, three thousand dollars! WOW! Well, I put that much into my second PC, and that much again into my first laser printer (actually, $3600 at dealer net) and both of them made good profits for me. Inflation adjusted? Those 3D printers could cost ten grand now, and still be comparable bargains. IF you can make a business case for them.

But the road to hell is paved with good intentions and fantasies. I see time and again people saying things that translate into "Go into a whole new line of business, which has historically low profits, high failure rates, and high competition!" when I've known people who were in those businesses (i.e. real estate and newsletter publication) and they're the first ones to say you've got to be both talented _and lucky _to make a buck in them.

If someone can't figure out a way to leverage their existing, successful skills sets into making money while cruising--the best advice is turn to crime. Crime pays. BIG crime pays well, unplanned 7-11 robberies and chain snatchings, not so well. But the overall failure rate for new businesses in the US is usually quoted at around 95% failing within the first five years.

Starting a new business, with zero experience, in new locations, with a new lifestyle, and expecting to make money at it? No, really, highway robbery is about the best way to make that work. Then you sail off to the next country, and no one will ever figure out how to find you.


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## lavidanueva

Sounds like you have the answer, then. I wish you the best of luck. Let us know what works and what doesn't, except for the crime part.

Tim


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