# Heaven Can Wait



## tdw (Oct 2, 2006)

Last weekend I had the pleasure of crewing on a mates VDS34 being delivered up to Lake MacQuarie NSW for this coming weekend's Heaven Can Wait 24 Hour race.

Nice overnight sail up the NSW coast from Sydney. Unfortunately I'm not able to do the race itself but hopefully "Windchaser" will go well in the slow boat division. Chaser is part of the team from the Balmain Sailing Club and they took out the team's trophy last year, maybe even the year before. I'll be going back up following weekend to bring her back to Sydney.

Its a good cause, the money going partly to Volunteer Marine Rescue and the balance , indeed all but $5000.00, going to the Cancer Council.

Have a look at the website. Donations are more than welcome.

Heaven Can Wait 24-hour Yacht Race 2010


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## SoftJazz (Aug 31, 2009)

Have you ever met the guy who started that? I think he had cancer pretty bad at one point. He's on "that other site", but I don't hold it against him. He seems to be level-headed & has given a lot of good advice over there. I printed out one of his posts about learning to sail without using telltales.


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## Classic30 (Aug 29, 2007)

I'm glad you at least got to do the delivery, A - even if it isn't on Raven this time around.

It's an event I'd love to do sometime.. along with many others!


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## tdw (Oct 2, 2006)

Hartley18 said:


> I'm glad you at least got to do the delivery, A - even if it isn't on Raven this time around.
> 
> It's an event I'd love to do sometime.. along with many others!


Well......if we are around this time next year and you are up to flying to Sydney.......

Delivery trip was great. I just love being offshore, plain and simple. Not a lot of wind, motor sailed a lot of the way and it was freaking cold. The Dolphins and the shooting star made up for that. Dolphins in the middle of the night are pretty damn cool while that meteor was out of this world. I have never seen one so low to the surface or as close. I kid you not, there was a distinct smell of burning after it had passed and it was quite audible. I'm guessing it must have come down only a mile or so from where we were at the time.

Cold was interesting. Because all our sailing is coastal my wet weather pants are not heavy duty. Mistake. Reality is that it is keeping the wind out, more so than the water which in most conditions is important. I'll be upgrading before the return trip. Boots are another issue. I have a pair that are quite tall. Great for walking through the water but in reality bit higher than ankle boots would make more sense. Dunbarry's would be good but oh my the price of those things.


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## Classic30 (Aug 29, 2007)

tdw said:


> Cold was interesting. Because all our sailing is coastal my wet weather pants are not heavy duty. Mistake. Reality is that it is keeping the wind out, more so than the water which in most conditions is important. I'll be upgrading before the return trip. Boots are another issue. I have a pair that are quite tall. Great for walking through the water but in reality bit higher than ankle boots would make more sense. Dunbarry's would be good but oh my the price of those things.


I'd not thought about the cold! All my gear was bought dirt-cheap at a Ronstan sale a year or so ago and would definitely not make the grade (I wouldn't recommend it to anyone either).

My brother used to wear wet-boots for his offshore racing which he said worked okay, but I don't know that I'd want to be wearing wet-boots for an extended period.

I find the price of ALL offshore gear shocking. If you have to pay over $1,000 nowadays just for a jacket, maybe I just plain can't afford to go offshore anymore... and I don't think the old oilskins are the ticket - just the smell of them made me want to throw up.

Does anybody make anything affordable anymore? I don't think so..


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## tdw (Oct 2, 2006)

Neither had I, not from a wet weather gear perspective anyway but good offshore gear is as wind resistant as it is moisture.

My jacket is Ronstan and is coastal not offshore. I wore a sleeveless lined jacket underneath that with a long sleeved polo. My upper body was fine.

I wore just a pair of pants on first watch but by 2000 knew that was not going to be good enough for 2400 - 0400 so added a pair of long johns. Even then the wind ripped right through me. Simply put the pants were not heavy duty enough to be wind resistant.

As for the boots, I had worn a pair of canvas shoes but they got wet and by the time I could get a change of shoes and socks my feet were freezing. I never really got them warm again.

Given that a $500.00 pair of Dubarry's is out of the question I'm going to try a pair of Bourke Southerley Seaboots. They are supposedly much more wind resistant than the standard Burke Seaboot. Also not as long so easier to get off in an emergency. I bought some possum fur socks in NZ earlier this year. My guess is that these with the new boots should see me through.



Hartley18 said:


> I'd not thought about the cold! All my gear was bought dirt-cheap at a Ronstan sale a year or so ago and would definitely not make the grade (I wouldn't recommend it to anyone either).
> 
> My brother used to wear wet-boots for his offshore racing which he said worked okay, but I don't know that I'd want to be wearing wet-boots for an extended period.
> 
> ...


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## casioqv (Jun 15, 2009)

Hartley18 said:


> I find the price of ALL offshore gear shocking.


There's nothing special about "offshore" or even marine gear, other than the price AFAIK. The same type of extremely waterproof/windproof clothing is also marketed to motorcyclists, and backpackers at much lower prices.

For outer layers I use Helley Hansen VOSS jackets and pants which are extremely durable, 100% waterproof/windproof, and typically cost about $30 each! They're made from welded polyurethane, which is extremely tough, and stretchy.

For middle (insulating) layers, I use army surplus felted wool clothing, which retains insulating ability if soaked, and costs $5-10 per garment. It's low grade (thick fiber) itchy wool, so it lasts forever but requires a softer layer against your skin.

For inner layers (against skin) I use IBEX super soft merino wool, which is expensive but lasts forever and works great for non-sailing clothes also. Cheap polypropylene army surplus "extreme cold underwear" could be used as well.


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## Classic30 (Aug 29, 2007)

casioqv said:


> There's nothing special about "offshore" or even marine gear, other than the price AFAIK. The same type of extremely waterproof/windproof clothing is also marketed to motorcyclists, and backpackers at much lower prices.
> 
> For outer layers I use Helley Hansen VOSS jackets and pants which are extremely durable, 100% waterproof/windproof, and typically cost about $30 each! They're made from welded polyurethane, which is extremely tough, and stretchy.
> 
> ...


I think I need to change where I shop! Thanks for the tips..


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

I would point out that non-marine purpose foul weather gear often is missing things like double cuffs on the sleeves, retro-reflective patches on the hood, torso and arms, and other such features. These are necessary in terrestrial foul weather gear, but are in marine use gear. 

Some things, like boots and gloves, don't really matter much, but the foul weather jacket for offshore use is really better when having to stand long watches in crappy weather.


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## St Anna (Mar 15, 2003)

tdw said:


> Well......if we are around this time next year and you are up to flying to Sydney.......
> 
> Delivery trip was great. I just love being offshore, plain and simple. Not a lot of wind, motor sailed a lot of the way and it was freaking cold. The Dolphins and the shooting star made up for that. Dolphins in the middle of the night are pretty damn cool while that meteor was out of this world. I have never seen one so low to the surface or as close. I kid you not, there was a distinct smell of burning after it had passed and it was quite audible. I'm guessing it must have come down only a mile or so from where we were at the time.
> 
> Cold was interesting. Because all our sailing is coastal my wet weather pants are not heavy duty. Mistake. Reality is that it is keeping the wind out, more so than the water which in most conditions is important. I'll be upgrading before the return trip. Boots are another issue. I have a pair that are quite tall. Great for walking through the water but in reality bit higher than ankle boots would make more sense. Dunbarry's would be good but oh my the price of those things.


Wonderful stuff *T*

We used to feel that dolphins bring you luck.

I have also experienced a meteorite that must have been close and the air has that crisp smell and a rumble which is similar to arty rounds overhead.

As for wet weather gear - you gotta keep warm and dry. I have outgrown a jumper I had. It was raw wool and 5 sizes too big, washed in hot water to shrink it back to size. It is [firehose] water resistant, breathable and completely wind resistant and wearable under a lighter jacket. You can take off the wet, lighter outside spray jacket to go down below. It is always easier to take on and off a light weight spray jacket.

When you are a little stressed (going over a bar), the breathable pants make you sweat!!!

Alternatively, head north.

cheers


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## tdw (Oct 2, 2006)

Casioqv.....I think that for wind resistance you are on the money. Thanks for the post.

SD...again you hit the nail....the one thing that non marine gear will not cover are extreme storm conditions.

You to Stanna.....

As I said earlier my coastal Ronstan jacket has kept me dry in extreme conditions and with suitable underlays works well to keep out the chill. My problem being the pants I reckon I'll have a look see at the Helly Hansen gear.

Ref the jacket however...the most extreme conditions I have faced were all short time period. I have never had to stand a full watch being constantly drenched. As and when that happens I may just revise my opinion of my Ronstan jacket.

ps - this time of year as the cold weather has one last chomp, north sounds good.


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## Classic30 (Aug 29, 2007)

Hi TD - befor you go and buy anything, you might like to pick up a copy of the latest _Cruising Helmsman_ mag..

They have reviews and indicative pricing of all the latest gear.


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## tdw (Oct 2, 2006)

Hartley18 said:


> Hi TD - befor you go and buy anything, you might like to pick up a copy of the latest _Cruising Helmsman_ mag..
> 
> They have reviews and indicative pricing of all the latest gear.


Funny you should mention that....I've just been reading it over a bowl of duck noodle soup......I'm thinking seriously of Burke Offshore. Not too expensive and supposedly wind resistant. Mind you that mag is going downhill fast. More Advertorial than anything else. Disappointing.

I'll still check out the bike pants though.


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

Images of a fuzzy rat in spandex.... {shudder} :laugher :laugher :laugher


tdw said:


> Funny you should mention that....I've just been reading it over a bowl of duck noodle soup......I'm thinking seriously of Burke Offshore. Not too expensive and supposedly wind resistant. Mind you that mag is going downhill fast. More Advertorial than anything else. Disappointing.
> 
> *I'll still check out the bike pants though.*


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## jephotog (Feb 25, 2002)

*Clothing advice*

Hi Wombat,
Sounds like a wonderful delivery. My only offshore experience if the Gulf of Mexico counts was a race across the Gulf, 4 days race 4 days on the island and 4 days on the delivery back. The delivery was as much fun as the race in terms of being on a solo watch at night with a reduced crew was very peaceful.

I'd like to pass on more advice on the appropriate clothing though as dressing in one of my strongest sailing skill. First off as SD pointed out there is a difference in sailing gear vs other stuff. There is also a number of companies produce $1000 jackets to compete with the need, because they are worth it. There are also $400 and up ski and backpacking clothes available, but only sailing has managed to find a $1000 price tag per garment. Some of the reasons are the extra things SD pointed out like cuffs, double flaps over zippers, possibly waterproof zippers, pockets that are compatible with harness wear. Each of these extra additions needs to be backed up with a seam tape that insures the integrity of the garments waterproofness over time, this is very expensive to do.

Not that you need a $1000 jacket but try one on. Feel how heavy the material is and imagine what kind of punishment it could take, but how comfortable and supple the clothes are to wear. Test out the hood and see how the coverage is yet still gives you good visibility. This combined with the fact the garments material is fully waterproof while being breathable, meaning you will be more comfortable in it. This is important as you may want to sleep mostly clothed you don't have to dress to go up and reduce sail in the middle of the night. As much as I respect garments in this price range I have $3-400 pieces of clothes (West Marine bibs and a Gill Jacket) that i bought on sale, that suit me well for the conditions I have seen.

A few more ideas to help you dress appropriately:

Leave cotton in your duffle bag for the club at the end of the cruise. When wet the fiber collapse giving you no insulation, also does not dry quickly leaving you soaked and cold.

Wool socks or wool synthetic blend unless you are bare foot. Find a few pairs of them to fit your boating shoes and maybe a heavier pair to fit with calf high sea boots. I think my boots were about $70.

Base layer should be a synthetic polypropylene, capilene, etc. Many to choose from that will keep you warm when wet, wick moisture away from your skin and dry quickly if wet.

Insulation layers: no need for itchy clothes, you may be in them for days. Things like synthetic fleece will dry quickly keep you warm when wet and weigh little. You can take it out of the spin cycle in the washer (it will only be damp at this time) and hang it up or put it on and it will dry in an hour. They also make a shelled version of this that will have some windproof and water resistance. Some of these are over $200 but a generic version will work as well, just don't look or fit as nice, not so important offshore.

Do not get pants get bibs. For serious conditions the overlap between a pair of bibs and a big jacket will guarantee coverage. Plus the suspenders help keep things in place with a variety of layers on.

An example wardrobe middle weight long underwear bottoms with a pair of nylon shorts over them, a lightweight synthetic t-shirt, wool socks and sailing shoes, to start off. As conditions worsen add a layer of fleece to this or if it is wet but still warm, put the foul weather gear over this light weight layer.

Total set of layers up top lightweight synthetic t-shirt, medium weight long underwear long sleeve top, light weight fleece top, medium weight shelled fleece then foul weather jacket, wool hat and some gloves. Lower body: medium long underwear, fleece pants, foul weather bibs, heavy wool socks, sea boots. You can add or subtract layers as the conditions merit. If you are out for more than a few days bring extra base layers so you can swap them out when your own smell bothers you. Start putting on layers before you get cold.

As far as you existing foul weather gear, you have determined it is not appropriate for offshore but it may be revivable. The offshore gear will have a laminate or coating inside the fabric that gives it its waterproofness. The exterior part of the clothes has no such characteristics. It relies on a coating to keep the outer shell from getting wet, and heavy. Your current gear has no interior laminate or coating just the exterior one, when this wears out it needs to be renewed or revived. Try throwing it in the drier for a bit, which may renew the water-resistance of the shell. You could also try a Nikwax product also available in Aus. This will bring back the water resistant and windproofness to your current foulies.


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## tdw (Oct 2, 2006)

Rest assured SD, the idea of Fuzzy in Spandex makes even me feel ill. 

Jephotog...good stuff , thanks. I confess that to date I have the synthetics unbearable to wear. Must try out some of the newer models, maybe it has improved.

Concur absolutedly re bibs v ordinary pants...bad usage on my part, even my old 'pants' are in fact bib type. I keep a very light set of gear for those times when I need to row ashore in light rain but would not use ordinary waist high pants at sea.

Regarding socks, I have a couple of pairs of Possum fur socks I bought in New Zealand. (Possums are an introduced pest in NZ btw). They are quite remarkeable and if and when I make it back I'll be stocking up. Will also be looking to get Possom knits. 

Bought a pair of Burke Offshore bib'nbrace' pants yesterday. They were well priced, not for going round the Cape I'd think but should be what I need. Also a pair of medium height sea boots. Will be trying them out should I get to do the return delivery.

btw...only the pants let me down. I wore a sleeveless zip up vest and long sleeved polo under my jacket and that was fine in these conditions. Feet and legs were the problem. Feet much better once I put on possum socks, add new boots and all will be warm and toasty. Up top I'll have a look at synthetic base.


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## tdw (Oct 2, 2006)

*Courtesy of Sail-World.com*

http://www.sail-world.com/Australia/Heaven-Can-Wait-2010-regatta-fundraising-approaches-$40,000/75471

*Fundraising efforts from last weekend's Heaven Can Wait Charity Regatta on Lake Macquarie have seen the total approaching $40,000 as the cut-off for donations gets closer. Go to Heaven Can Wait 24-hour Yacht Race 2010 to make your contribution now. *

The regatta, which includes a 24 hour yacht race around Lake Macquarie, as well as a single-circuit 'One Lap Dash', raises money for the Cancer Council NSW - specifically for men's cancer support and research programs - and Marine Rescue Lake Macquarie, which provides on-water rescue support for the event.

Over 70 boats, from 11 foot 'Foiling Moths' and 18 foot skiffs, to cruising yachts, sports boats, multihulls and trailer-sailer yachts, lined up on the startline in a brisk northeasterly breeze, along with frequent showers throughout the weekend.

Dual 49er World Champion and Moth European Champion Nathan Outteridge was over the line early at the start and has to duck back before setting out after his fast disappearing rivals but he wound up to speed and set a new One Lap Dash record in his foiling Moth named 'WMD'. He sailed the 29 nautical mile course in two hours, seven minutes and 31 seconds, beating Scott Babbage also in a Moth.

Sydney Hobart winner Mike Green sailing the Elliott 7 Evergreen won the One Lap Dash Division 1 race on handicap ahead of Justin Mitchells Mitchells Sails.

Mark Travis, Full Frontal took line honours in the One Lap Dash Division 2, from Adrian Williams Young 88 Forever Young. On Handicap Division 2 was won by Danny Gresham's Di'sy ahead of Jeffery Pain's Serein.

In the 24 hour race, it was the Clive Kennedy's Egan 9.5 metre catamaran Two Tribes, who sailed 133 nautical miles around the lake, taking overall line honours for the third year, from Bob Cowan's 8 metre sports boat Stealthy.

In Division 1 on handicap, Roy & Elizabeth Leslie Elan 37 Koko took first place from Stealth and Two Tribes.

In Division 2, line honours went to Chris Darby's Mulloka from Warwick Fatches Jessily. On handicap it was Mark Hastings trimaran Try Flying who took the honours from Jessily.

However, the big winner from the weekend was the Cancer Council NSW, which will be receiving close to $35,000 raised through the EveryDayHero fundraising website, which allowed individual boats competing in the event to attract sponsorship from crew members, family, friends and colleagues.

'We are delighted with the response to this year's regatta,' said Shaun Lewicki, Commodore of the Heaven Can Wait Yacht Club. Lewicki is a cancer survivor and Lake Macquarie sailor who was inspired to create the Heaven Can Wait 24 Hour Yacht Race in 2004 while very ill with cancer in Newcastle's John Hunter Hospital.

'In the first few years, we raised fairly modest amounts of money, but over the past couple of years, we have seen it leap from around $11,000 in 2008, to $22,000 in 2009 - and this year, with another five days to go we are heading for $40,000.

'That is a phenomenal effort from all participants, along with our sponsors, community organisations such as Toronto Rotary and many others.

'The funds we have raised will go specifically to research and support programs for men's cancers,' Lewicki said. 
'And I would remind people who have still not made a donation to this great cause that the EveryDayHero online facility is open for donations until this weekend.

*Please go to our website at Heaven Can Wait 24-hour Yacht Race 2010 then click on the button that reads 'Click here to sponsor your mates participating in the HCW Race' to make a donation.' *

For more information about the 2010 Heaven Can Wait Charity Regatta, including full results, stories and interviews please go to Heaven Can Wait 24-hour Yacht Race 2010


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## tdw (Oct 2, 2006)

http://www.sail-world.com/photos_2010/Alt_Nathan_Outteridge1_Std.JPG


 
 'Nathan Outteridge crossing the finish line in the 'One Lap Dash'.in 2 hours 7 minutes 31 seconds'  Nicole Scott   Click Here to view large photo  
 *Heaven Can Wait 2010 - Double 49 World Champion and Moth European Champion Nathan Outteridge and three times Laser World Champion and Etchells World Champion Tom Slingsby talk about the epic 29 mile race. *

OCS at the start, Outteridge showed why he is the favourite for the 2011 Moth World Championships to be sailed on this lake, Lake Macquarie, the largest salt water lake in Australia early next year.

In spite of eleven capsizes in this years One Lap Dash Nathan smashed the existing record held by the Egan 9.5 catamaran Two Tribes, completing his personal Moth Marathon in two hours seven minutes and 31 seconds, even though he he went back for his hat and stopped for a chat with his fellow Australian sailng team member mid-race.

Both Nathan and Tom are keen to come back in 2011 for the Heaven Can Wait One Lap Dash. At the One Lap Dash presentation Nathan said he is aiming for a sub two hour record.

On Friday night, at the Heaven Can Wait Welcome Dinner at the RMYC Toronto, the two multiple World Champions held a dinner audience spell-bound as they went back to the beginnings of their sailing. Tom explained how he had to be bribed by his sisters to crew on the boat, he hated it so much and Nathan explained why his nickname is George.

We will bring you the full audio and transcript of that revealing interview later today.

But right now here is the story of two great sailors and their race.


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