# Cal 21: Sailing traits & build quality



## bobmcgov (Jul 19, 2007)

In the ongoing quest for cheap old picnic cruisers under $3000....

There are many 1970s Cal 21s for sale, often for a little as $1500. At 1100 lbs, it's lighter than the SJ21, but it still has a retracting keel w/ 350# of ballast. Floats in 9" of water, which is important.

How well-built were the small Cals? Were they reasonably good to sail? What problems did they have I should watch out for?


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## sharkbait (Jun 3, 2003)

1


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

Remind me never to have you navigate... 


sharkbait said:


> I've got an old cal 29 and there have been a "few" occasions when,due to navigational inconsistencies,I've bumped a rock or two.The only thing damaged was my pride and some bottom paint.


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## Siamese (May 9, 2007)

I had a Cal 21 a few years ago. Prior to that, a Grumman 16, Holder 20, Prindle 15, and a Grampian 26. Subsequently I've had an O'Day 20, and a Catalina 309.

The Cal 21 was the worst boat I've ever had. By far. It was built well enough, but unlike my other boats, it used plywood bulkheads tabbed to the hull rather than a fiberglass liner. Not necessarily a bad construction technique, but you'd definitely want to look for punk in the bulkheads near the hull in case the boat ever had standing water in it. 

But, my objection to the Cal was not its construction. It just sailed crappy. My other boats have all had their quirks to be dealt with, but the Cal seemed to do just about everything poorly. I found the boat very tender to sail, with a lot of weather helm. The keel on the 21 is, IMHO, a real piece of crap. Lowering and raising the keel is a pain in the neck. 

In contrast, the O'Day 20 I had after the Cal sailed like a dream. Sailed stiffer, less weather helm, and you could tie off the tiller and go forward without all hell breaking loose (actually continued to go in the same direction, UNLIKE the Cal). 

My particular Cal was in good condition with good gelcoat, etc., and to my eye was a good looking boat. It is, however, the only boat I've owned that I deeply regretted owning.

My guess would be that the Cal 21 could be picked up at a considerable savings, considering its shortcomings. 

There are a lot of great Cals out there, but the 21 marked a low point (at least I hope they don't have any others as bad as the 21).


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## sharkbait (Jun 3, 2003)

1


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## bobmcgov (Jul 19, 2007)

*Additional candidate*

Siamese: Thanks for the opinion; I wondered about its tracking ability, given a fairly radical slipper shape. Looks like a drift boat! Even the revered SJ21 has dark hints attached about steering, and it's nowhere near as rockered as the Cal. I know the bigger Cals have good reps. The little one looks chintzy, tho.

Let's throw the Balboa 21 into the hopper -- chunky hull, but I've read glowing reports on its quality and manners. Opinions? How's the keel to deal with?


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## sailaway21 (Sep 4, 2006)

I own a 21'Cal but do not recognize the boat described above. I'd certainly concur that one should over a boat that had had standing water in her hull; any boat.
The hull is solid fiberglas, the decks plywood cored. The keel is not designed for sailing partially retracted, not to say one couldn't, but I'm not sure to what effect. If the pivot is in good shape you shouldn't have much trouble with it. It does weigh 400 lbs. I do not regard the boat as excessively tender although you can certainly alter her handling with some well placed crew. The only significant drawback to the boat is that there is not much headroom.

The 21' is similar is size to the 20', albeit without the fixed keel. She carries more canvas than the 20' and perhaps the previous poster was alluding to the fact that you can over power her. I normally find about five degrees weather helm. The really big upside to her is that, at 1100 lbs, and 400 of that in the keel bulb, the lightest air will get her going. Like many Lapworth's she'll surf down wind.

My 1973 had the original deck hardware, and still would but for my monkeying around. I've had mine six years now and virtually all of the maintenance I've done has been preventative. The boats hold up well. I've had zero deck core issues and have neither heard of blistering nor experienced any.

Stepping the mast is easier with two but can be done alone with practise. We generally, when trailering, have the mast stepped, boat launched, and keel lowered in just under forty five minutes. The boat will tow easily with just a minivan.

The boat tacks well and accellerates quickly. I regularly single hand and have found little reason not to sail on and off my mooring. If she just had a touch more headroom, but then she wouldn't be a Cal.

Feel free to PM me if you wish.


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## bobmcgov (Jul 19, 2007)

Thanks, Sailaway -- I was hoping you would chime in, given your long experience with this boat. Headroom's never going to be easy on picnickers this size, but for me the cabin is mainly stowage, a place to duck in bad weather, and a sleeping option where camping isn't feasible. Can't stand up in my tent, either!

Another boat that has me really intrigued -- the Tanzer 22. That's a luscious-looking ride, and people seem to think it's more seaworthy than most small cruisers. Two foot draft is pushing things. 

Also the S2 6.9, with a 10" draft. Wierd cabins on the S2s. May be too racy for singlehanding?

ETA: Scratch the Tanzer22 -- it's a sweet boat to these eyes, but the CB/keel version is 3100 lbs! It has, basically, a San Juan 21 as ballast. Minivan would blow up.


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## Classic30 (Aug 29, 2007)

bobmcgov said:


> Thanks, Sailaway -- I was hoping you would chime in, given your long experience with this boat. Headroom's never going to be easy on picnickers this size, but for me the cabin is mainly stowage, a place to duck in bad weather, and a sleeping option where camping isn't feasible. Can't stand up in my tent, either!


It's interesting that boat length often has nothing to do with comfort.

Our Hartley is *tiny* compared to the boats you list and yet seating headroom is not an issue and the quarter-berths are a tad over 6' long and certainly wider than some (and thanks to new cushions a darn sight more comfortable than before) - and yet it's only 18' long! 

The Hartley TS21 is a much larger boat with a double berth and can comfortably sleep 4.

Only downside: They are bloody heavy boats and so don't plane downwind (although the 16's do).

Have a look for yourself: http://trailer-sailer.com/

--Cameron


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## SeniorSkipper (Sep 20, 2007)

*Cal-21 a delight to sail*



sailaway21 said:


> I own a 21'Cal but do not recognize the boat described above. I'd certainly concur that one should over a boat that had had standing water in her hull; any boat.
> The hull is solid fiberglas, the decks plywood cored. The keel is not designed for sailing partially retracted, not to say one couldn't, but I'm not sure to what effect. If the pivot is in good shape you shouldn't have much trouble with it. It does weigh 400 lbs. I do not regard the boat as excessively tender although you can certainly alter her handling with some well placed crew. The only significant drawback to the boat is that there is not much headroom.
> 
> The 21' is similar is size to the 20', albeit without the fixed keel. She carries more canvas than the 20' and perhaps the previous poster was alluding to the fact that you can over power her. I normally find about five degrees weather helm. The really big upside to her is that, at 1100 lbs, and 400 of that in the keel bulb, the lightest air will get her going. Like many Lapworth's she'll surf down wind.
> ...


Got to agree with all you have to say about the Cal-21. With the keel down and pinned in place (as specified in the owner's manual) the Cal-21 balances beautifully and is a delight to sail. I had one for several years, sailed it in howlers surfing on San Francisco Bay and drifters on the Potomac River (towed painlessly across country in between). Among other boats over the years, I've owned three trailered cruising sail boats, a retracting keel Catalina 22, a keel/centerboard Oday 22 and the Cal-21 - which was the most fun of the three to sail and the easiest to launch from a trailer.


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## bobmcgov (Jul 19, 2007)

Have you Cal21 owners experienced any leaking around the keel pivot pin? That seems like a common issue with this boat. & I wonder if Siamese's difficulties could be attributed to sail condition or mast rake -- suspect anything less than a crisp, trim sail or perfectly located center of effort would make this boat yaw radically. Did you use adjustable backstays to fool with mast rake?


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## sailaway21 (Sep 4, 2006)

I have not had any trouble with the pivot pin. I suppose if you had the locking pin inserted and had a good hard grounding you could really stress that area. And, don't quote me on it, but I'd bet the pivot pin is above the waterline as well. I have not had the keel out of her. Leaking, in my opinion, is more likely to occur in the cockpit deck joint to keel trunk joint, and this joint is easily accessible for repair.

I do not have an adjustable backstay and have felt no need for one. I would expect a baggy main or too much sail to explain excessive weather helm. I'd emphasize that this boat carries a decent amount of sail for her 1100lb displacement and she doesn't need much of either wind or sail to raise her heels. I find her quite easy to sail, single handed, and very forgiving in her handling. And I'm due for new sails so I expect to enjoy her even more when I'm poorer.

"Nodrog" is for sale up in Mass I believe and she's been owned by the same family since new. I thought they'd never sell her. Her owners comments are on the Cal 21 web-site.http://www.calyachts.org/ The overall consensus on the boat seems to be that she's a blast to sail, the keel can be a bit of a pain to raise and lower until familiarity sets in, and that it's a boat that does most things quite well, none poorly, meeting a lot of diverse needs in a trailerable sailboat.

Mine has a hatch added for a lazerette in the aft cockpit and it's a welcome addition. I'm going to redo the hatch cover to make it more seaworthy fashioned. The cockpit drains well although I redid and enlarged the seat drains just because. The designed nature of the boat is such that modifying the boat to suit your purposes is quite easy, the keel trunk being the only significant obstacle to work around. I suspect that most of the boats are sailing about without their keel pinned and this does provide some give in grounding with no apparent effect at large angles of heel. I've made up a pin for mine as she had none on purchase, and from the looks of things, none was used much ever. Deck delamination is most likely to be found in the cockpit seats if anywhere, as water can sit there if the drains become plugged/deterioated.

You'll want to make sure that you either have or make up a keel board keeper. The plans for it are on the web-site somewhere. It helps keep the keel down, how much I do not know as I've never sailed without it, and it's essential for keeping the cockpit footings dry. It's easy to make one in about an hour and easy to install after lowering the keel. A plywood footing fits over it and the keel well for a nice finished look once the keel is lowered.

I've fitted an autopilot to my tiller, although the Davis tiller-tamer and sail adjustment work adequately for day-sailing.

To be honest, the first negative comments I've heard about the boat have been here. I'm surprised. They're not selling for a ton of money by any measure and are a very easy boat to own in terms of maintenance, launching, towing, and storage.

One must be careful that rudder and outboard do not meet during operation, but that's a common danger in this size boat.


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## sailingcal21 (Dec 30, 2001)

I'm suprised with the negative comments, too.

I owned a 1971 Cal 21 "Joy" for several years and was competely satisfied with her. Abeit, as pointed out below decks was somewhat cramped for more then 2 adults and 2 small kids for more than sitting, but we fair weather camped out and slept in the cockpit and on deck. As compared to the Cal 20, the Cal 21 is quite a bit tender but they are for two different applications... the Cal 20 with its fixed 900 lb keel would be a ***** to trailer and I wouldn't sail the Cal 21 in the SF bay.

If one is planning to purchase, scrutinze the keel and its bunk. The classic problem is that the user could loose control of the extending or retracting process and the keel will swing with a good bit of momentum and crack the trunk and/or bend the keel bolt. Which accounts for some of the leaking keel bolt problems, ours weeped somewhat. Joy was modified with a cable that was fixed to the end of the keel so that it would never slip off.

There is good support for the boat concerning fixes and mods. Check out ttp://www3.sympatico.ca/sailpair/21stuff/home.html .

I always considered Gordon (NODROG's namesake) and Rod Johnson as the gurus of the Cal 21.


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## sailaway21 (Sep 4, 2006)

*Cal21-"Nodrog" is for sale*

The boat that Scott and I have mentioned is still for sale. I received an e-mail on the sailnet Cal e-mail service. I also looked up the old photos from the old Cal site. If anyone is still looking for a nice trailer-sailer this might be just the one. A brief perusal of the Cal site and you'll see that this family was pretty fanatical about their 21' Cal, I'd be much surprised if she is not in good condition. Let's see if I can make the links work here. (g)

found the following link to work well

Loading...

-----Original Message-----
From: cal [mailto:cal] 
Sent: Monday, April 21, 2008 2:50 PM
To: cal
Subject: [cal] 1970 CAL 21 for sale

Well, after having owned NODROG for 38 years, my Dad has reluctantly been
trying to sell her for the past year. If you know of anyone looking to
give a nice CAL 21 a good home, here is the link to our classified ad.
http://www.bestboatbuys.com/featured_detail_id.las?id=5BXwdNNgWHH5xfuMd

I can provide more details on the equipment list, or just send my Dad an
e-mail using the e-mail link in the ad. We do not have a trailer since we
kept her on a mooring each summer. Price is a very reasonable $2500.00,
but we might consider offers.

Rod Johnson, "NODROG"
1970 CAL 21, #285

This one has some good photos of the boat within:http://www.cal21.com/

I have not seen this boat, it does not come with a trailer, and while I have no interest financially in the boat, the owners of her have been very prominent in the Cal21 circle. Definitely worth a look at $2500 negotiable.


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## growser (Jan 25, 2013)

Love the trailerability of the Cal 21. Bought the boat in Milwaukee and trailered it to Minneapolis with no problems using my Saturn (4 cyl) to pull it.


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