# rebedding stanchions



## adamtroyg (Aug 6, 2007)

Did search around the site for this topic and couldn't find any info. Please direct me if you know where it exists.

First year with my Sabre 28. "TIKI" is 35 years old and I've many projects to tackle. Some of my stanchions are leaky & needing resetting (?rebedding?) with poly sulfite? The screw just spin and don't back out. So I tried to used a putty knife to get under the old caulk and failed. Found out the last person to do this job on the boat used 5200 and they're seemingly impossible to get up. Besides lots of force ( hammer & chisel) , any suggestions on how to proceed? I'm in NJ and won't get to the work 'till spring , but want to have a plan of attack. I just clear caulked them for a temp fix.

Thanks,
AdamTroyg


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## Maine Sail (Jan 6, 2003)

*As far as I know..*

As far as I know, and you will find this true on 90+% of boats, the stanchions are not "screwed in" but rather through bolted. Many times this requires removing interior cabinetry or components to get at the nuts on the interior.

Using a battery powered impact wrench, such as the ones made by Makita, DeWalt or even Ryobi, can make this usual two person job a one person job in many instances..


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

As for the 5200, get Debond 2000.  It is designed to chemically weaken 5200 iron grip.


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## Faster (Sep 13, 2005)

Sometimes, if there's room to work it, a piece of piano wire (or a heavy gauge guitar string) can be used to "cut" the 5200 through underneath the bonded part. Get a couple of peices of dowling to make the handles so you can put some pressure on the wire without slicing yourself up. (kinda like a "garrotte" you see in spy movies)

This is a great time to address the backing plate situation - if they are not there, or inadequate, have some made and you'll have a more secure installation and fewer problems in the future.


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

BTW, if the stanchions go through a cored deck, make sure, before you rebed the stanchions to "pott" the holes for the fasteners. Also, backing plates are a good thing, and since you're doing this, you might as well do it right. 

Finally, when bedding the stanchions, countersink the fastener holes a tiny bit. That way, the sealant can form an "o-ring" around each screw, and it will make the installation that much more waterproof.


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## Freesail99 (Feb 13, 2006)

I think many say there stanchions are "screwed in" because many have a slotted head, rather then a head you can put a wrench to. Every boat I've owned at least did.


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

Freesail-

Generally, when someone says they're screwed in...they have wood screws holding them in place... rather than machines screws with nuts and washers... there's a huge difference in the holding ability of one versus the other, particularly in brittle fiberglass laminates.


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## Freesail99 (Feb 13, 2006)

sailingdog said:


> Freesail-
> 
> Generally, when someone says they're screwed in...they have wood screws holding them in place... rather than machines screws with nuts and washers... there's a huge difference in the holding ability of one versus the other, particularly in brittle fiberglass laminates.


Come on, what I said was fairly clear. I suggested why they use the WORD screw rather then bolted. It be insane to use screws in fiberglass, That isn't what I said or implied. I really do work on my boat and don't pay someone else to do it.


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## Maine Sail (Jan 6, 2003)

Freesail99 said:


> Come on, what I said was fairly clear. I suggested why they use the WORD screw rather then bolted. It be insane to use screws in fiberglass, That isn't what I said or implied. I really do work on my boat and don't pay someone else to do it.


The OP is doing exactly as Freesail99 implied and a perfect example of this.

Sabre 28's have through bolted stanchions many times installed with round top machine screw heads.

The OP thinks he's unscrewing screws while in reality he's only broken any remaining water tight seal he had left by twisting the "bolts", with screw heads, or machine screws as they are referred to as. Most times the nut on the under side just spins because some bedding compound got onto the threads and is acting like Loc-Tite..


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## Freesail99 (Feb 13, 2006)

It is a 2 man job if you can't jam a pair of vise grips down below to hold the nut.


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## adamtroyg (Aug 6, 2007)

Wanted to thank everyone for the input. I'm going to check on the boat over the weekend and survey the situation more closely. I guessed ( based on the screw head type) they were simply screwed threw the fiberglass into the wooding core. But it does seem more likely to be throughbolted with a nut ( & backing plate ) for extra strenght.


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

On a Sabre 28, which is a fairly well-made boat, I'd expect them to be through bolted. The only way I can see them being screwed to the deck is if the PO re-did them in a very half-assed way.


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## adamtroyg (Aug 6, 2007)

Right again saildog ! Just looking through my old posts to see if there was any new information. And you are right , they are nuts and bolts, some with backer plates, so i need 2 people for the job.
I've assembled the parts and tools for the job and waiting 'till next sunday/monday, for my Dad to help with the removal, rebedding and replacement. I know it's fathers day weekend & i have some guilt about putting the old guy to work. but he gets to race my sabre this saturday, our sailing club has a fathers day race.


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

Found a nice way to make this a one man job. Use a hack saw to cut a notch into a nut of the same size as the one on your bolt. From below put this nut onto the bolt and clamp it with vise grips. this will keep the bolt from spinning. you can then hold the bolt still, and twist the holding nut with another wrench. works nicely.


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## lbdavis (Apr 23, 2007)

rheaton said:


> Found a nice way to make this a one man job. Use a hack saw to cut a notch into a nut of the same size as the one on your bolt. From below put this nut onto the bolt and clamp it with vise grips. this will keep the bolt from spinning. you can then hold the bolt still, and twist the holding nut with another wrench. works nicely.


I'm not sure I really followed you on the notch thing, but I've definitely used vice grips to hold nuts while I spin the bolt. Generally there is something in the way to keep the vice grips from turning...

Now you only have to climb into that dark little corner 4 times per stanchion! 

The best is a buddy sitting on your deck with a screwdriver in one hand and the beer you supplied him in the other.


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## Freesail99 (Feb 13, 2006)

> I'm not sure I really followed you on the notch thing, but I've definitely used vice grips to hold nuts while I spin the bolt. Generally there is something in the way to keep the vice grips from turning...


I did not follow the notch thing either. I have also worked on boats that you could not get a vise grip into the area to keep the nut from spinning.


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## Joel73 (Apr 23, 2007)

Thanks for resurrecting this thread... i will be re-bedding at some point this fall. What i'm unclear about is what kind of sealant to use... not 5200, that much i know.


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## lbdavis (Apr 23, 2007)

I rebedded a stanchion and my pushpit (along with some other assorted deck hardware) this spring and I used 3M101 - a polysulfide sealant. It has relatively low adhesive power, but will stay soft and watertight for a long time. It is also easy to remove WHEN you have to remove it. 

And as Halekai will be quick to point out, you don't need a ton of adhesive power on such a strong mechanical attachment.

I would second other's comments here and over-drill-and-fill all holes, then countersink the new ones.


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## Freesail99 (Feb 13, 2006)

I used silkaflex 291, because it does have a good adhesive power and is flexable.

If you drill new holes you may want to pot them with epoxy, you may also want to do that even if you don't drill new holes.


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

*If the fastener holes go through cored laminate and you're not sure about whether the holes were properly potted or not... you should definitely pot them before proceeding. * If you're going to bother with all this work, you might as well do it right.


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## knothead (Apr 9, 2003)

rheaton said:


> Found a nice way to make this a one man job. Use a hack saw to cut a notch into a nut of the same size as the one on your bolt. From below put this nut onto the bolt and clamp it with vise grips. this will keep the bolt from spinning. you can then hold the bolt still, and twist the holding nut with another wrench. works nicely.


I believe what Rheaton is saying is that he cut all the way through one side of a nut. (Rather than a notch). He then threaded the nut onto the bottom of the bolt below the actual nut he was tightening and then grabbed it with the vice grips. The nut having been cut through on one side became a clamp on the threads of the bolt holding it firmly. 
Damn good idea in theory.

Steve


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## Maine Sail (Jan 6, 2003)

*Guys..*

This job can be done most of the time, access permitting, from bellow deck with a rechargeable impact driver!

I have re-bedded LOTS of fittings solo with my simple and inexpensive Ryobi 18v impact driver. Honestly it works like magic! Brrrr, brrrr, brrrr and the nut comes off with no wrench or screw driver being used on the deck level! Brrrr, brrrr, brrrr and the nut goes back on with no wrench or screw driver on the deck side.. Be careful because with some of these it's very easy to over torque and snap a bolt clean off. The "IMPACT" effect allows you to tighten from one side in most cases..









Or a slightly higher quality tool with a lifetime warranty:


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## Freesail99 (Feb 13, 2006)

The key word here is access permitting. As far as using a rechargeable impact driver, good luck in keeping the screw driver in the slot on the bolt, up top. Most of the bolts have a slotted head.


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## Maine Sail (Jan 6, 2003)

Freesail99 said:


> The key word here is access permitting. As far as using a rechargeable impact driver, good luck in keeping the screw driver in the slot on the bolt, up top. Most of the bolts have a slotted head.


I do this from under the deck on the nuts not from the top on the screws. So far, with ratchet extensions and or knuckles, I have been able to reach each and every stanchion base on my boat and re-bed every single one with only the impact driver and no screw driver or wrench is used on deck..

The whole point of me using the impact driver is it makes it an easy one person job without having to use Gorilla Tape and a pair of Vise Grips...

BTW if an impact driver will not fit, a pair of needle nose Vise Grips and Gorilla Tape will. Simply taping the vise grips to the underside of the deck, clamping the nut, with this tenacious tape has worked every single time for me.. Quick and easy but not as quick and easy as an impact driver..


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## fullkeel7 (Apr 16, 2008)

For better under deck access with a cordless, use an extension or one of those flexible ones that fit the drive (1/4, 3/8 or 1/2 inch) of your cordless and your universal 6 point deep well socket. That way there is no need to have access inside tight spots for the cordless.


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## merttan (Oct 14, 2007)

Screwed in stanchions = screwed sailor...  Sorry couldn't stop myself...
I'm going to rebed mine soon... The safest way is to get a don casey book to read through... Use the widest possible backing plates possible to avoid stress cracks around the base since when you need them, you really need them...


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