# Mariners sailing from NC to Florida found off Delaware Coast



## Wade (Feb 17, 2021)

Boaters last seen in Oregon Inlet found safe off Delaware coast


The U.S. Coast Guard says the Silver Muna, a tanker, located Kevin Hyde, and Joe Ditomasso.




www.witn.com





I bet they don't want to talk about it, but I am very curious. Glad they are safe.


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## Johncc (Dec 2, 2020)

Read about them just today at SailingScuttlebutt. Glad they and their dog are ok. 👍


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## capta (Jun 27, 2011)

Here we go again. I'm glad they're safe, but who in their right mind would try and sail offshore south against the Gulfstream in the dead of winter? It is the dead of winter, isn't it? I'm not from these parts.
What happened, did someone close the ICW? Well, now there are two uncrewed yachts out there. If we get a couple more, it might be worth paying for a tug and barge to "git 'er done."


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## Aquarian (Nov 8, 2010)

capta said:


> Here we go again. I'm glad they're safe, but who in their right mind would try and sail offshore south against the Gulfstream in the dead of winter? It is the dead of winter, isn't it? I'm not from these parts.
> What happened, did someone close the ICW? Well, now there are two uncrewed yachts out there. If we get a couple more, it might be worth paying for a tug and barge to "git 'er done."


Everyone here goes south during winter. A true sucker is an engine fail with no wind while crossing.


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## capta (Jun 27, 2011)

Aquarian said:


> Everyone here goes south during winter. A true sucker is an engine fail with no wind while crossing.


Going off shore in December? Like I asked, was the ICW closed? As for being out of power, I sailed the South Seas for 5 years on an old hermaphrodite ketch. The only electric power was one light over the chart table and a good stereo. All lighting and cooking was kerosene, including the running lights and the binnacle.
If they had any sail and a recently swung compass, all both boats had to do was sail west. I don't think anybody could miss North America, from any distance off Hatteras.


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## tempest (Feb 12, 2007)

capta said:


> f they had any sail and a recently swung compass, all both boats had to do was sail west. I don't think anybody could miss North America, from any distance off Hatteras.


Who knows what instruments, Knowledge etc. they had onboard, as they (the Catalina) had no engine or power. 

Their compass heading may have been showing a " west" heading the entire time, but as you know, the Gulf Stream carries you North and East. Unless you develop enough speed in a Westerly direction under sail to overcome the effects of the current, you're floating NE with it. If they only had an electronic GPS onboard to plot their position, they were probably sailing in place and being carried by the river. If they lost sails along with the engine, they were just a floating cork.

I experienced that many years ago, returning from A Bermuda run, we had to fire up the engine to break free and be able to make any Westing. another boat didn't catch it and instead of approaching land in Norfolk, they ended up in Cape May and the Delaware Bay.


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## hpeer (May 14, 2005)

The thing that strikes me was they left out of Oregon Inlet. They were already well on their way to Beaufort which is South of Hatteras. Two more days and they would have been there. Beaufort is, by some, regarded as the best spot to leave from. This spring we left from the Delaware River, close enough to Cape May to make no difference. This is less than ideal but gets you crossing the stream sufficiently above Hatteras. In short, they spent several days getting into a worse jumping off point.


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## redfalcon (29 d ago)

capta said:


> Here we go again. I'm glad they're safe, but who in their right mind would try and sail offshore south against the Gulfstream in the dead of winter? It is the dead of winter, isn't it? I'm not from these parts.
> What happened, did someone close the ICW? Well, now there are two uncrewed yachts out there. If we get a couple more, it might be worth paying for a tug and barge to "git 'er done."


I think Winter starts on Dec 21st. There is a weather I imagine however.


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## OntarioTheLake (4 mo ago)

hpeer said:


> The thing that strikes me was they left out of Oregon Inlet. They were already well on their way to Beaufort which is South of Hatteras. Two more days and they would have been there. Beaufort is, by some, regarded as the best spot to leave from. This spring we left from the Delaware River, close enough to Cape May to make no difference. This is less than ideal but gets you crossing the stream sufficiently above Hatteras. In short, they spent several days getting into a worse jumping off point.


The Catalina 30 isn't fast, doesn't point great, and doesn't like chop. Thus, it's rather at the mercy of sea & wind conditions; it would be easy to get drifted backwards. Add in, in stock form it has space for two Group 24 batteries, it was cold out so they probably used the autopilot, which eats battery and in any serious seas can't stay on track. IMHO they probably shouldn't have been out there in a C30 this time of year. Who knows why the motor wouldn't start, I'd guess they ran the batteries down and/or ate up the 18 gallons of fuel (= ~24 hours motoring.)


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## capta (Jun 27, 2011)

redfalcon said:


> I think Winter starts on Dec 21st. There is a weather I imagine however.


OK then. Thank you. I'll dial it back to late fall and it's very pleasant sailing weather.


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## capta (Jun 27, 2011)

tempest said:


> Who knows what instruments, Knowledge etc. they had onboard, as they (the Catalina) had no engine or power.
> 
> Their compass heading may have been showing a " west" heading the entire time, but as you know, the Gulf Stream carries you North and East. Unless you develop enough speed in a Westerly direction under sail to overcome the effects of the current, you're floating NE with it. If they only had an electronic GPS onboard to plot their position, they were probably sailing in place and being carried by the river. If they lost sails along with the engine, they were just a floating cork.
> 
> I experienced that many years ago, returning from A Bermuda run, we had to fire up the engine to break free and be able to make any Westing. another boat didn't catch it and instead of approaching land in Norfolk, they ended up in Cape May and the Delaware Bay.


Then they could have sailed west to the UK. lol


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## nolatom (Jun 29, 2005)

Wade said:


> Boaters last seen in Oregon Inlet found safe off Delaware coast
> 
> 
> The U.S. Coast Guard says the Silver Muna, a tanker, located Kevin Hyde, and Joe Ditomasso.
> ...


Me, too.

A bit more about it here, my takeway was same as the Coast Guard's, namely, "why didn't you have an EPIRB?"









Tanker Rescues Missing Sailboat After Massive Three Day Search


A Chinese chemical tanker registered in Hong Kong reported a happy ending to a massive search spanning three days by the U.S. Coast Guard for an overd...




www.maritime-executive.com


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## tempest (Feb 12, 2007)

I'll be an armchair sailor here. Knuckleheads!


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## GlanRock (Feb 26, 2013)

Glad to see/read that they made it back to land safely.


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## Aquarian (Nov 8, 2010)

capta said:


> Going off shore in December? Like I asked, was the ICW closed? As for being out of power, I sailed the South Seas for 5 years on an old hermaphrodite ketch. The only electric power was one light over the chart table and a good stereo. All lighting and cooking was kerosene, including the running lights and the binnacle.
> If they had any sail and a recently swung compass, all both boats had to do was sail west. I don't think anybody could miss North America, from any distance off Hatteras.


I don't think you understand. This far south it is normal to cross the stream in December. It is also a quite common process to hug the coast south until you reach a good crossing point. I am in the process as I type.


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## Aquarian (Nov 8, 2010)

nolatom said:


> Me, too.
> 
> A bit more about it here, my takeway was same as the Coast Guard's, namely, "why didn't you have an EPIRB?"
> 
> ...


Likely the same reason we don't. An epirbs active life expectancy is ridiculously low. We prefer to rely on enteractive and rechargable sources such as inreach support and mob dsc.


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## Wade (Feb 17, 2021)

Aquarian said:


> I don't think you understand. This far south it is normal to cross the stream in December. It is also a quite common process to hug the coast south until you reach a good crossing point. I am in the process as I type.


I just don't think it makes sense to go out Oregon Inlet to go around Hatteras to get to Florida in December, unless you are prepared for game on conditions. Everytime I read about these stories lately it's like people are sailing with fingers crossed. Why not take the ICW to Beaufort, and then head out? If heading to Bermuda, okay, I get it. But I just don't understand.


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## Arcb (Aug 13, 2016)

Aquarian said:


> Likely the same reason we don't. An epirbs active life expectancy is ridiculously low. We prefer to rely on enteractive and rechargable sources such as inreach support and mob dsc.


10 years. Most EPIRB batteries need replaced every 10 years. Going off shore in the Atlantic in December in a 30 foot boat without an EPIRB isn't a great idea. Inreach is better than nothing but ideally you would have an Inreach AND an EPIRB. It doesn't need to be either or.


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## hpeer (May 14, 2005)

Wade said:


> I just don't think it makes sense to go out Oregon Inlet to go around Hatteras to get to Florida in December, unless you are prepared for game on conditions. Everytime I read about these stories lately it's like people are sailing with fingers crossed. Why not take the ICW to Beaufort, and then head out? If heading to Bermuda, okay, I get it. But I just don't understand.


Exactly!

Something very wrong with the route planning. Apparent ignorance of hazzards.


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## marcjsmith (Jan 26, 2021)

pics of the boat...



https://www.flkeysnews.com/news/local/article269970497.html



https://www.foxnews.com/us/new-jers...revida-ii-recount-experience-small-miracleews 

Id say go by a lotto ticket, but I think they used up all their luck...


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## hpeer (May 14, 2005)

Yes, photos show they were dismasted.


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## JimsCAL (May 23, 2007)

Video on TV news this morning showed rescue by tanker crew. Boat was dismasted. Interview with them said they left in clear conditions and then hit by storm they did not expect.


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## tempest (Feb 12, 2007)

Wade said:


> I bet they don't want to talk about it, but I am very curious. Glad they are safe.


They were on the 11 p.m. news last night, after landing in N.Y. They said they had no water left and were sucking water out of the tubes (I'm assuming the residual water in the lines) and had very little food left. Not much more other than happy to be alive. 

Agreed, it is not a "common practice" at all to exit @ Oregon inlet in a sailboat headed south around Hatteras at any time of year. and definitely not in December.


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## Aquarian (Nov 8, 2010)

Arcb said:


> 10 years. Most EPIRB batteries need replaced every 10 years. Going off shore in the Atlantic in December in a 30 foot boat without an EPIRB isn't a great idea. Inreach is better than nothing but ideally you would have an Inreach AND an EPIRB. It doesn't need to be either or.


10 years if you don't use it.


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## Johncc (Dec 2, 2020)

Too many more instances like this one and EPIRBS could very well become mandated.

Again from sailingscuttlebutt: The Coast Guard has questions… Cost of unnecessary risk at sea >> Scuttlebutt Sailing News


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## Lanealoha (Mar 5, 2017)

For the record it is not 'the dead of winter', it's still fall according to the sun, but in about a week it will be the first day of winter.....


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## OntarioTheLake (4 mo ago)

JimsCAL said:


> Boat was dismasted. Interview with them said they left in clear conditions and then hit by storm they did not expect.


For all the discussions (ahem..."blue water") and the ability of a boat to overturn and right itself, my primary concern is rigging. I've never personally seen a keel boat overturn, but I have seen plenty of dismastings- including masts sheared in half. 

Specific to the Catalina 30, having had one for 26 years, it has it's limits. I'd turned back to port twice in those 26 years because the boat was taking a hammering- in both cases, it' wasn't a matter of if something was going to go south, but when; in both cases I felt it was a race condition between the rig shaking down or the hull canning. And I beat the crap out of that boat; but I knew its limits. The rear stay is tabbed to the hull, IMHO not very sturdily. The main stays are through the deck fitting and both plates bolted through the bulkheads: I've seen on other C30s the port bulkhead pull free, and seen the through-bolts hog out the wood; the starboard side cannot be inspected since it's encapsulated. In all regards, the wire rigging is (how to say without starting a P contest?) "average." Anyone that's sailed a C30 in really bad conditions knows the mast and rig shake like heck with every wave hit. The mast is one piece, very heavy, and very solid; I've never seen a C30 mast shear, though the weight of that thing shaking around no doubt stresses the rigging substantially. The turnbuckles aren't particularly impressive, and it's not uncommon to see cracks in them.

In this case, it sounds like they were woefully unprepared, and certainly that lovely C30 wasn't up for what they got into.


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## The Big Cat (Jul 1, 2020)

Today's New York Times had a good article covering this.


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## captain44 (Mar 6, 2014)

I think it is fair and reasonable to question the prudence of the sailors in the particulars of this situation. I do not think it is fair to rush to judgment until we hear from them--which is not likely. But in so doing, we can all learn. I have twice sailed in November to the Caribbean from Rhode Island and North Carolina but jumped ship once in North Carolina before heading offshore because I determined that the boat and owner were inherently dangerous (and owner was a cheapskate too). Many years ago, I recall Navy Captain John Bonds telling the crowd at the USNA Safety at Sea seminar that "The sea is not inherently dangerous but you must prepare, prepare, and prepare". This would seem to be a case of poor choice of boat, route and timing and most important of all, a poorly prepared crew, which led to those poor choices. In such situations there is usually an evolution of one or a few problems or bad decisions that lead downhill rapidly to more challenges and worse situations...and then loss of auxiliary (how much fuel?) and main power (dismasting...how?") and then getting tossed around northward with the Gulf Stream...and then no EPIRB..and then sheer luck that a passing ship sees them (not because of a flare but because of waving a flag???) and not to mention the deployment of enormous Coast Guard and other resources searching for days over a huge swath of ocean. It appears (emphasis on appears) they may not have even filed a float plan. As a professional captain and seamanship trainer, I'm going to take a wild guess here and speculate that the crew was not well trained and did not heed advice from others. Perhaps they thought it was....too expensive or a waste of time? Again, I'm only speculating but if they elaborate on what happened, we can all learn from them.


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## captain44 (Mar 6, 2014)

I just saw the NY Times article. The skipper "said he would not sail from New Jersey to Florida again" and “I’m staying closer to shore because I have a boat, too. And I’m staying in sight of land.” Interesting, but most sailors would agree that there are many more inherent dangers to sailing in sight of land, namely--the land!! I again think that we would all like to know more, as with any such case. (What did he mean by saying "but I have a boat too?")


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## David H (Aug 27, 2021)

Its funny they referred to them as boaters ..not sailors


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## captain44 (Mar 6, 2014)

Speaking of Navy Capt John Bonds (mentioned in my comment above), I just came across this article which I believe is relevant. Class of 2019: Capt. John Bonds >> Scuttlebutt Sailing News


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## nolatom (Jun 29, 2005)

Aquarian said:


> Likely the same reason we don't. An epirbs active life expectancy is ridiculously low. We prefer to rely on enteractive and rechargable sources such as inreach support and mob dsc.


Thanks for the info, and hope I never need it ;-)


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## tempest (Feb 12, 2007)

I'm very, very happy they were rescued. I'll listen to their story. but honestly, there's nothing to be learned here, that hasn't been learned 100 times already.


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## captain44 (Mar 6, 2014)

As Bismarck said "Only a fool learns from experience. The wise learn from the experience of others" or as been often said by others "You can't fix stupid." Even so, sometimes the best prepared do get into serious trouble but many if not most serious bluewater cruisers rarely encounter severe weather. Even the great Slocum said he did not run into severe weather and that was over 100 years ago. Read and learn from his experience...but we will never know how he met his watery demise.


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## PGandW (4 mo ago)

"in both cases I felt it was a race condition between the rig shaking down or the hull canning". Exactly why I ditched my Venture 22 and bought an ODay 25 when I was set on going to the Bahamas from South Florida. A man has got to know his (and his boat's) limits. This was in 1979 - and I bought an EPIRB for the trip (they had just come out a year or 2 prior).

In my days of rescuing people, I just found it astounding how unprepared many boaters (both power and sail) were totally unprepared for what they were getting into. But somehow, many of them survive what we would call stupidity. Some learn, some don't.

Fred W
Stuart Mariner 19 #4133 Sweet P
Yeopim Creek, NC


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## LaPoodella (Oct 5, 2018)

capta said:


> Here we go again. I'm glad they're safe, but who in their right mind would try and sail offshore south against the Gulfstream in the dead of winter? It is the dead of winter, isn't it? I'm not from these parts.
> What happened, did someone close the ICW? Well, now there are two uncrewed yachts out there. If we get a couple more, it might be worth paying for a tug and barge to "git 'er done."


It is not the dead of winter. Winter starts at the end of December. Hurricane season continues into November. So everyone goes south in the late fall, early winter. The window is small because you have to go after most hurricanes. This year there were two big late-fall storms so more people were heading south later in November. In a sailboat you gotta go outside or add up to two weeks more to the trip and you can’t travel at night in the ICW. OTH, you don’t need to go very far offshore. In fact, you are better off staying close in, and I mean close. You sail south inside the Gulf Stream. I like to stay within sight of land, but at night, when I’m off watch, hubby likes to take shortcuts across good sized bays which can take us pretty far into some swells. We are never in the Gulf Stream, however. Most of the way, it is pretty far offshore.


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## LaPoodella (Oct 5, 2018)

Arcb said:


> 10 years. Most EPIRB batteries need replaced every 10 years. Going off shore in the Atlantic in December in a 30 foot boat without an EPIRB isn't a great idea. Inreach is better than nothing but ideally you would have an Inreach AND an EPIRB. It doesn't need to be either or.


I’ve got it all: inreach, mob, AIS, boat eprib AND two personal ePIRBs in hubby and my life jacket. Safety first and lives before things.


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## PGandW (4 mo ago)

"So everyone goes south in the late fall, early winter. The window is small because you have to go after most hurricanes." So true.

I learned a lot from the rescues during "The Perfect Storm" of 1991. In Elizabeth City, NC, it was known as the Halloween Hurricane because Oct 31 was the peak date for most of the massive hurricane wind area - Cape Hatteras to Cape Cod from near the coast to 600 miles offshore. Until then, late October had been considered "reasonably safe" for starting the passage from New England to the Caribbean, although November was considered safer. By the end of November, you start taking a chance on nor'easters and icing in New England. Except for a few fishing vessels - about which the movie was made - almost all the rescues (or non-rescues) were from sailboats transiting south for the winter. And there were several dozen sailboats calling for rescue.

On the rescue I was personally involved in - 44ft ketch 400 miles east of Cape Charles, VA - the boat was actually doing quite well. Masts and rigging were intact, diesel was working, boat was riding high, and surfing in the waves and sometimes rolling pretty violently. The delivery crew was not doing well. They had basically given up from being seasick, bruised and battered, hungry, and dehydrated. The crew only had to survive 2 more days before they would have been out of the storm, but all they wanted was off that boat.

Because of the rigging and the wild riding of the boat, we could not get them off at night without likely losing somebody. Early the next morning (we spent the night on the USS America aircraft carrier which was literally taking seas over the bow. Flight deck was awash in about 4" of streaming water), we had to have them jump - one at a time - off the stern into the water where our rescue swimmer helped get them into the sling and hoisted. By the grace of God - yes, I believe - all survived even though swimmer and boat crew got piled under 3 times by breaking 40ft seas. Had to wait what seemed like eternity for them to surface again.

Fred W
still shuddering remembering the seas pile driving swimmer and victim under


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## OntarioTheLake (4 mo ago)

I underestimate seasickness, never having been seasick.

But I did do a crossing, holding the belts of two crew, and they wretched over the side for hours, and soiled themselves. After many hours, near shore, the waves subsided and I got myself a beer and a liverwurst sandwhich. But those crews were green- I mean, truly they had turned green. It's probably worst than the flu.


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## hpeer (May 14, 2005)

PGandW said:


> "So everyone goes south in the late fall, early winter. The window is small because you have to go after most hurricanes." So true.
> 
> I learned a lot from the rescues during "The Perfect Storm" of 1991. In Elizabeth City, NC, it was known as the Halloween Hurricane because Oct 31 was the peak date for most of the massive hurricane wind area - Cape Hatteras to Cape Cod from near the coast to 600 miles offshore. Until then, late October had been considered "reasonably safe" for starting the passage from New England to the Caribbean, although November was considered safer. By the end of November, you start taking a chance on nor'easters and icing in New England. Except for a few fishing vessels - about which the movie was made - almost all the rescues (or non-rescues) were from sailboats transiting south for the winter. And there were several dozen sailboats calling for rescue.
> 
> ...


Fred,

I was USCG 1972 to 1976, AT at Lizard City as we called it. I did AT-A School and then got stationed there. Never was a helo crewman but qualified on C-130 and HU-16.
I recently spoke with, shared a few drinks with, a recent career guy, AT WO recently stationed there. It sounds like things are very, very different from my time. More professional and much more rigid. 

I presume you are/were a helo pilot. Good for you. You guys win when it comes to collecting stories.

My hat is off to you and your fellow crew.
Thank you.


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## capta (Jun 27, 2011)

LaPoodella said:


> It is not the dead of winter. Winter starts at the end of December. Hurricane season continues into November. So everyone goes south in the late fall, early winter. The window is small because you have to go after most hurricanes. This year there were two big late-fall storms so more people were heading south later in November. In a sailboat you gotta go outside or add up to two weeks more to the trip and you can’t travel at night in the ICW. OTH, you don’t need to go very far offshore. In fact, you are better off staying close in, and I mean close. You sail south inside the Gulf Stream. I like to stay within sight of land, but at night, when I’m off watch, hubby likes to take shortcuts across good sized bays which can take us pretty far into some swells. We are never in the Gulf Stream, however. Most of the way, it is pretty far offshore.


And you are telling me this why?
I've tried the suggested months and come to the conclusion that October is the best month, weather wise. With all the magic of satellite meteorology, even a mid hurricane season outside run south, isn't near as daunting as sailing outside of the season before we had any reliable weather forecasts at all.
But all of that is a moot point as these folks obviously had neither the experience nor well found boats, to be trying an offshore run in anything but the best weather. Hurricane season may not be over until the end of November, but the fronts come slamming through and don't wait until until a calendar date to give sailors a hard time. Most of the inexperienced sailors get lucky, some don't. Those that don't rely on, and use the wonderful "get out of trouble free" card so generously offered by the USCG. For those who have a shipshape vessel and are prepared, they make it to their destinations, no matter what weather they encounter.
Cape Hatteras doesn't have a bad reputation for nothing, you know.


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## hpeer (May 14, 2005)

PGandW said:


> "So everyone goes south in the late fall, early winter. The window is small because you have to go after most hurricanes." So true.
> 
> I learned a lot from the rescues during "The Perfect Storm" of 1991. In Elizabeth City, NC, it was known as the Halloween Hurricane because Oct 31 was the peak date for most of the massive hurricane wind area - Cape Hatteras to Cape Cod from near the coast to 600 miles offshore. Until then, late October had been considered "reasonably safe" for starting the passage from New England to the Caribbean, although November was considered safer. By the end of November, you start taking a chance on nor'easters and icing in New England. Except for a few fishing vessels - about which the movie was made - almost all the rescues (or non-rescues) were from sailboats transiting south for the winter. And there were several dozen sailboats calling for rescue.
> 
> ...


Fred,

I was USCG 1972 to 1976, AT. I did AR-A School and then got stationed there. Never was a helo crewman but qualified on C-130 and HU-16.
I recently spoke with, shared a dew drinks with, a recent career guy AT WO.


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## PGandW (4 mo ago)

Actually, the C-130 guys had the best stories, especially from Ice Patrol out of St John's.


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## Arcb (Aug 13, 2016)

Aquarian said:


> 10 years if you don't use it.


You don't use them unless it's an emergency. Imminent risk to life or valuable property. By the time you trigger your EPIRB you have exhausted all other means. Trigger if your boat is sinking, on fire, upside down, if there is a major medical emergency.

I was an navifation officer in the Canadian CG for 11 years. Lots of SAR calls, including off shore in the Atlantic in December. EPIRBs are fantastic. Takes the most of the "Search" out of "Search and Rescue". Let's you get straight to the rescuing.


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## GlanRock (Feb 26, 2013)

PGandW said:


> "So everyone goes south in the late fall, early winter. The window is small because you have to go after most hurricanes." So true.
> 
> ...
> 
> ...


How interesting that I remember seeing the USS America aircraft carrier in the US Virgin Islands in 1993 (plus or minus a year) when my brother and I visited our father who was living on his Venus 46 (I don't remember what year his boat was) in the islands with my stepmother. That was one of the few times I was able to hang with him and we had a pretty awesome time down there. I don't know how it is I did not 'catch the bug' from him until later in life though. <shrug>

That sounds like a harrowing experience for the sailors on the USS America and had to be a crazy voyage for that ketch out there in those seas. Whew!


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## capta (Jun 27, 2011)

LaPoodella said:


> I’ve got it all: inreach, mob, AIS, boat eprib AND two personal ePIRBs in hubby and my life jacket. Safety first and lives before things.


In the '70s we sailed the high seas without a single one of those things, and we actually survived. Some of us even managed to survive circumnavigations. Go figure.
If you aren't prepared to sail in 50 knots of wind and perhaps 30 foot seas then, in my opinion, you shouldn't go out into the blue until you are.


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## capta (Jun 27, 2011)

PGandW said:


> "So everyone goes south in the late fall, early winter. The window is small because you have to go after most hurricanes." So true.
> 
> I learned a lot from the rescues during "The Perfect Storm" of 1991. In Elizabeth City, NC, it was known as the Halloween Hurricane because Oct 31 was the peak date for most of the massive hurricane wind area - Cape Hatteras to Cape Cod from near the coast to 600 miles offshore. Until then, late October had been considered "reasonably safe" for starting the passage from New England to the Caribbean, although November was considered safer. By the end of November, you start taking a chance on nor'easters and icing in New England. Except for a few fishing vessels - about which the movie was made - almost all the rescues (or non-rescues) were from sailboats transiting south for the winter. And there were several dozen sailboats calling for rescue.
> 
> ...


I'd feel sorry for the owner, who lost his boat, but obviously he hired a delivery crew that didn't even know how to heave-to! That's what happens when someone hires a cheap, non-professional, delivery crew. Seasickness is not a very good excuse for abandoning somebody's boat.
The weather experienced between Cape Hatteras and Cape Cod was by no means a hurricane, but a strong nor'easter that later absorbed Hurricane Grace as it moved east, ultimately evolving into a small unnamed hurricane. I suspect that the F/V Andrea Gail was lost because she and the "perfect storm" met on the east end of George's Bank.


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## PGandW (4 mo ago)

It was a hurricane once you got about 10 miles off the coast. We experienced 80+kt winds (mostly northerly while flying east at 120kts airspeed) from 100 miles offshore to 400 miles offshore. The Cape Cod, Long Island (National Guard that ended up ditching because of not being able to air-to-air refuel the 7th time), Brooklyn, Cape May, and Elizabeth City aircrews all reported hurricane winds for 3 nights in a row. So did the USCGC Tamaroa that somehow managed to find the Air National Guard crew that jumped out of their ditched helo and hauled them on board in a net in the night. All helicopter rescue attempts using other than an H60 variant during the storm were unsuccessful. We succeeded thanks to being able to wait for daylight (I made the judgment call that the boat was not going to sink during the night) and the superior stabilization system on the brand new (to us) H-60 compared to the other helicopters. Wallops was recording 70kts on Oct 30th. When we landed on the USS America, they were recording 82kts across the deck while steaming at 12kts (just enough to maintain steerage). We had to increase our approach speed to 120kts to get on the America before we ran out of fuel (normal approach speed in an H60 is 80kts).

You can say it wasn't a hurricane, but hurricane force winds and accompanying seas were experienced by all.

Likely you are right about the delivery crew not being up to the task. However, I don't know how well I would have done after 3 days in a hurricane if I had been told by a Coast Guard helicopter, "we are not attempting to rescue you tonight, we will see you in the morning" - and then the helicopter flew away. I even tried to talk the delivery crew into staying with the boat the next morning because they would be out of the hurricane within 2 days. But ultimately it was my job to get everybody home safe, not sit in judgment of the delivery crew. I don't regret any decision I made on that mission.

Fred W


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## Jolly Roger (Oct 11, 2013)

Getting back to the actual post: Is there an interview anywhere with these guys? I would like to know why they decided to try and go around the Diamond shoals, (which stick out miles), and imagined they could fight the Gulf Stream as well. They could have easily sailed/motored through Pamlico Sound and down Adam’s Creek to Beauford, then via the shoreline to Florida, with plenty of places to dive into if need be.


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## PGandW (4 mo ago)

From what I saw, all the guys said was basically we are thankful to be back home, and we are thankful to those who found and rescued us. Which is typical in my experience. When you have done something really dumb, and get saved from the consequences, that's about all there is to say.

If they say anything more, it's a really an even wider opening for the vigilante society and government regulators to try to punish them in a different way. Whether the 2 will learn from the experience is one of the mysteries of human nature. Some humble themselves and learn, others resent being told how to live their lives by those who claim to know better. How do you react when a cop pulls you over for speeding?

Fred W


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## tempest (Feb 12, 2007)

WATCH: Boaters Who Were Stranded at Sea Share Their Survival Story – NBC New York

Basically, everything was fine until it wasn't.


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## FLFrers36 (Feb 13, 2016)

Glad they're OK. Many questions, but what were they thinking???????? Cat 30 nice boat, not made for offshore, let alone offshore in December. ICW would have been the way. Both are older, so no job to rush back to.

No disrespect, but dumb as dirt idea (bless their hearts).


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