# No comments? skipper of the Concordia



## patrscoe (May 9, 2011)

I can't believe we have no comments on the Concordia skipper that went aground off of Giglio, Italy... Words cannot even described this person. One of the first ones to leave the ship and refused to returned even after the Coast Guard gave over 10 orders for him to get back on his ship to manage the rescue. Take some responsibility for your actions and the people aboard.
I would provide some extreme sarcasm right now but I'm too angry about it and also people died when this could have been avoided...


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## LandLocked66c (Dec 5, 2009)

Just another reason i'll never step foot on a cruise ship! It goes from really BORING to not so much really quickly!


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## Glen53 (Jun 17, 2010)

Veni, Vidi, Seputus


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## jackdale (Dec 1, 2008)

Clearly he messed up in several ways. It will take some time to prepare, but the saftry board investigation make for interesting reading. I have found several safety board reports very enlightening.


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## smackdaddy (Aug 13, 2008)

The dude is screwed. Deservedly so.


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## Lake Superior Sailor (Aug 23, 2011)

More to being a captain than schooling, The Concordia's Captain was missing-in a lot of ways! Too bad a lot of the wrong people have to pay for it! --Dale


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## turban10 (Jan 4, 2010)

I find this story so interesting from the standpoint of human nature when a person realizes that they made a tragic mistake, and have two choices. They can either try to save their own hide like the "captain" did, or at least attempt to do whatever is in your power to lessen the impact of your mistake and try to get people off the ship.

Its amazing because he decided to run. He got on the rocks, and hailed a Taxi to get away from the scene. When the coast guard was finally able to contact him, they had to order him back on to the ship. According to the news today, it is still unclear if he actually went back.

Ironically, if he stayed with the ship as he was expected to do, he would have still lost his job and license, and even had some jail time, but with his decision to save his own a$$, the courts will show him little mercy. 

One bad decision after another.


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## killarney_sailor (May 4, 2006)

We have been on a number (4) of cruises over the years and the captains always seemed to be men in their early 60s (or looked it at least). I was surprised when I saw the captain of this ship that he was so young for the job on a huge cruise ship. 

Some reports say he was going close to shore on purpose so that they could blow the horn because one of the crew (chief waiter apparently) is from the island. If so, incredibly bad judgement followed up by cowardice. I suspect he will get a very long time in jail - apparently Italy's legal system allows consective terms for crimes and sadly there could be a lot of sentences to be made consecutive.


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

He sounds like he got his license from the same place as the Greek skipper of the cruise ship that foundered off South Africa a few years ago.

Anyhoo, he's in jail and will probably remain there for a long time.


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## sawingknots (Feb 24, 2005)

maybe he should change his name to "lord jim"


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## PCP (Dec 1, 2004)

What should we say: The guy is a shame to all sea captains and it seems that humanity as a whole has not come with bright colors out of this.

Of course the crew and mostly the Captain are responsible not only for not having organized the evacuation but for having contributed with its bad example and escape to the global mayhem that followed.

Authorities were holding Schettino for suspected manslaughter and a prosecutor confirmed yesterday they were also investigating allegations the captain abandoned the stricken liner before all the passengers had escaped. 
According to the Italian navigation code, a captain who abandons a ship in danger can face up to 12 years in prison....

...
Questions also swirled about why the ship had navigated so close to the dangerous reefs and rocks that jut off Giglio's eastern coast, amid suspicions the captain may have ventured too close while carrying out a manoeuvre to entertain tourists on the island.

Residents of Giglio said they had never seen the Costa come so close to the dangerous 'Le Scole' reef area.

Read more: Costa Concordia cruise ship accident: Bodies of 4 men and 1 woman found | Mail Online

Her story backs up other survivor claims that it was a case of every man, woman and child for themselves of the £390m vessel after it ran aground.
Fights broke out to get into the lifeboats, men refused to prioritise women, expectant mothers and children as they pushed themselves forward to escape. Crew ignored their passengers - leaving 'chefs and waiters' to help out.

...As she waited for a flight home from Rome, grandmother Sandra Rogers, 62, told the Daily Mail: 'There was no "women and children first" policy. There were big men, crew members, pushing their way past us to get into the lifeboats. It was disgusting....

She said: 'I want everyone to know how badly some people behaved. It was a nightmare....
'I was standing by the lifeboats and men, big men, were banging into me and knocking the girls. It was awful. There was a total lack of organisation. There was no one telling people where to go. ....
....
'There was a lot of panic, screams, children crying,' he said. 'Some passengers came to blows as they tried to get in the lifeboats.'....'People were screaming. Women and children were not getting priority at all.

Read more: Costa Concordia cruise ship accident: French survivor tells how husband gave her his lifejacket | Mail Online

There were huge problems with aid, no one knew what was going on or what to do. A lot of the crew and the ship's management got away before the passengers. We just had to watch them be rescued with no idea what would happen to us. I was very afraid.'...Other passengers said they had seen the crew and captain leave the ship instead of staying to help passengers.

'We were stuck. He told us we couldn't get off. I thought my baby was going to die - I thought we were all going to die. The captain just went, he just left the boat, left us there, I just cannot believe it.

Read more: Costa Concordia cruise ship accident: French survivor tells how husband gave her his lifejacket | Mail Online

Francesco Schettino was at least four miles off course when the Costa Concordia struck rocks off the island of Giglio, Tuscany, despite Italy's well-mapped sea lanes.

Sources have said the captain, from Naples, had abandoned the ship at around 11.30pm local time - an hour after it struck a rocky outcrop and started taking on water - while the last passengers were not taken to safety until 3am yesterday morning.

Read more: Costa Concordia captain Francesco Schettino and first officer Ciro Ambrosio arrested | Mail Online


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## LandLocked66c (Dec 5, 2009)

The captain could learn a few things from Jean Luc!


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## VK540 (May 6, 2011)

Cptainshaw had a thread on delivery boat captains and what credentials one should look for when hiring one. The Concordia guy meets, or rather met, all the criteria of a "good" selection!


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## PCP (Dec 1, 2004)

I have no doubt that the Concordia Captain is going to jail for a good number of years and with good reason.

Just hear this recording of a Captain of Livorno port ordering the Concordia captain to return to his ship and even so, he did not comply. Truly impressive and disgusting.


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## tominny (Aug 30, 2011)

This is the translated transcript of the radio communication between the coast guard and the captain. One has to read it to believe it:

Below are several transcripts of recordings between authorities and the captain published by the Italian newspaper Corriere della Sera and translated by CNN's Hada Messia. The first calls came in right after midnight.

Livorno Port Authorities: "Concordia, we ask you if all is OK there."

Concordia:*"All is well."

-----------------------

Port authority:*"Concordia, We ask you if all is well there."

Concordia:*"All is well. It is only a technical failure."

-----------------------

Port authority: "How many people are on board?"

Schettino: "Two-three hundred"

Port authority:*"How come so few people? Are you on board?'

Schettino: "No, I'm not on board because the ship is keeling. We've abandoned it."

Port authority: "What? You've abandoned the ship?"

Schettino:*"No. What abandon? I'm here."

-----------------------

Italian Coast Guard Capt. Gregorio De Falco:*"Captain. This is De Falco from Livorno."

Schettino:*"Commandant, I've also alerted the company&#8230; I'm being told that there are still passengers on board, apparently they are about one hundred&#8230; but I repeat&#8230;"

De Falco: "Captain. You are not able to tell me an exact figure? About a hundred people, it seems?

Schettino:*"Commandant, I am not able to give you an exact figure because let me explain... while we were evacuating the last passengers&#8230; now we are all here with all the officers&#8230;"

De Falco:*"Where are you? On the lifeboats? All the officers?"

Schettino:*"Yes, we are*with the second commander&#8230;"

De Falco:*"Forgive me, but before you were only with a sailor. If the officers managed to get down, it means that they could still move."

Schettino:*"Yes...in fact...

De Falco:*"Then why don't they get back on board? To monitor the operation and then they can tell us. Thank you."

Schettino:*"No it is not possible&#8230;"

De Falco: "Send them on board. Send one person on board to coordinate..."

Schettino:*"But I am doing the coordination."

De Falco:*"I'm giving you an order captain. You need to send someone on board."

Schettino:*"We are going on board to coordinate."

De Falco:*"Exactly. You need to get on board to coordinate the evacuation. Is that clear?!"

Schettino:**"But we can't get on board now&#8230;the ship is now&#8230;(hard to understand)..."

De Falco:*"Why did you tell them to get down?"

Schettino:*"What do you mean get down? We abandoned the ship&#8230;the ship turned ..."

De Falco:*"...and with one hundred people on board you abandon the ship? (expletive)"

Schettino:*"I did not abandon any ship with 100 people&#8230;the ship (hard to understand)...we were catapulted into the water..."

De Falco: We'll see later what happened. OK? Now tell me everything that takes place. Everything. Get under with the lifeboat (not very clear at this point). Don't move. Clear?"

Schettino:*"Commandant..we are here&#8230;we are here..."

-----------------------

Port authority: "You must return on board. Climb the ladder (rope ladder), return to the fore (stem) and coordinate the work."

Schettino does not reply

Port authority:*"You must tell us how many people are on board, how many women, how many children. You have to coordinate the rescue operation. Commander, this is an order. Now I'm in charge, you have abandoned ship and now you are going to go to the stem and coordinate the work. There are already dead bodies."

Schettino: "How many?"

Port authority:*"You should be the one telling me this&#8230;What do you want to do? Do you want to go home?...Now go back on the stem and tell me what to do.."

Italian Coast Guard Capt. Gregorio De Falco:*"Listen, this is De Falco from Livorno. Am I speaking with the captain?"

Schettino: "Yes."

Italian Coast Guard Capt. Gregorio De Falco:*"Tell me your name."

Schettino: "This is Captain Schettino, commandant."

De Falco:*"Listen Schettino, there are people trapped on board. Now, you have to go with your lifeboat and go under the boat stem on the straight side, there is a ladder there."

De Falco:*"Get on board on the ship and tell me, you tell me how many people there are."

De Falco:*"Clear? I'm recording this conversation, Captain Schettino."

Schettino: "Well then commandant, I need to tell you something."

De Falco:*"Speak loudly."

Schettino: "The ship now&#8230;I'm here in front of it..."

De Falco:*"Captain, speak loudly."

Schettino: "Commandant, at this moment the ship is tilted."

De Falco:*"I understand. Listen. There are people who are coming down the stem ladder. You must take that ladder in the opposite direction. Get on board the ship and you tell me how many people are on board, and what do they have. Clear? You tell me if there are children, women, people with special needs. And you tell me how many there are of each category..."

De Falco:*"Is that clear?"

De Falco:*"Look Schettino, you might have been saved from the sea, but I will make sure you go through a very rough time&#8230;I will make sure you go through a lot of trouble. Get on board, damn it."
Schettino: "Commandant, please&#8230;"

Port authority:*"No...please. No, you get on board. Assure me that you are getting on board."

Schettino: (Hard to understand) "I'm here with the rescuers. I'm here. I've not gone anywhere. I'm here."

Port authority:*"What are you doing captain?"

Schettino: "I'm here coordinating the rescue."

Port authority:*(Speaks over captain): "What are you coordinating there? Go on board and coordinate from there the rescue operation. Are you refusing?"

Schettino: "No, no, I'm not refusing."

Port authority:*"You are refusing to go on board? And why are you not going on board?"

Schettino: "I am going because now there is the other motorboat (Lancia) that has stopped now."

Port authority:*"You go on board. It is an order. You cannot make any other evaluations. You have declared abandoning ship. Now I'm in charge. You get on board. Is it clear?"

Schettino:**"Commandant..."

Port authority*over captain: "Are you not listening to me.."

Schettino speaks over Port authority:*"I'm going..."

Schettino:*"Call me immediately when you get on board. Our rescue officer is there."

Schettino:**"Where is your rescue officer?"

Port authority:*"My rescue officer is at the stem&#8230;Go &#8230;(can hear captain saying OK)&#8230;There are already bodies, Schettino."

Schettino: "How many dead bodies are there?"

Port authority:*"I don't know. I know of one. I've heard of one. You are the one to tell me how many there are. Christ!"

Schettino:**"Are you aware that it is dark here and we cannot see anything?"

Port authority:*"So? Do you want to go home Schettino? It is dark and you want to go home? Climb the ladder and get on the stem."

Port authority: "...and tell me what can be done, how many people are there, what do they need. Now."

Schettino:*"Commandant, we are with the second in command&#8230;"

Port authority: "Then both of you climb up. What is his name?"

Schettino: "Dimitris Christidis."

Port authority: "You are your guard. Go on board, now!"

Schettino: "Commandant&#8230; I want to go on board, it is just that the other lifeboat here&#8230;there are other rescue operators... it has stopped and it is stuck there... now I've called other rescue operators..."

Port authority:*"It is one hour that you are telling me this. You go on board. On b.o.a.r.d (says the word slowly almost spelling it out). And you immediately tell me how many people there are"

Source: Port Authority to cruise ship captain: 'Get on board, damn it' - This Just In - CNN.com Blogs


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## VK540 (May 6, 2011)

Not meaning to offend anyone out there but the Captain's actions kind of brings new life to the old joke about the thinnest book in the world being the book of "Italian War Heroes"


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## jackdale (Dec 1, 2008)

Just received my Ocean Navigator email newsletter. It deals with emergencies. A day late for some guys.


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## PCP (Dec 1, 2004)

VK540 said:


> Not meaning to offend anyone out there but the Captain's actions kind of brings new life to the old joke about the thinnest book in the world being the book of "Italian War Heroes"


That's just a bad taste joke.

"The ship's purser Manrico Giampetroni was winched to safety on Sunday 36 hours after the disaster. He was trapped on board after he broke his leg as he helped evacuate passengers on Friday night.

The Guardian reports: "Giampedroni emerged as one of the few heroes of the tragedy amid reports that the captain and other crew members panicked and mounted lifeboats ahead of passengers."

PHOTO: Costa Concordia Hero Manrico Giampedroni

There are cowards and heros among men of all nations and Italy is no exception.


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## VK540 (May 6, 2011)

PCP said:


> That's just a bad taste joke.
> 
> "The ship's purser Manrico Giampetroni was winched to safety on Sunday 36 hours after the disaster. He was trapped on board after he broke his leg as he helped evacuate passengers on Friday night.
> 
> ...


I didn't write it. Bad taste? Yes, but it fits for the Captain.


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## PCP (Dec 1, 2004)

VK540 said:


> I didn't write it. Bad taste? Yes, but it fits for the Captain.


Yes I agree, the Captain is a coward and a sad human being but you were talking about all Italians, not a particular one. I know that many Americans have Italian blood. Those are also cowards in your opinion?


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## VK540 (May 6, 2011)

PCP said:


> Yes I agree, the Captain is a coward and a sad human being but you were talking about all Italians, not a particular one. I know that many Americans have Italian blood. Those are also cowards in your opinion?


Relax PCP! Like I said, I didn't write it. Bottom line is the Captain was a coward. Is the Mafia going to come knocking on my door now?


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## PCP (Dec 1, 2004)

VK540 said:


> Relax PCP! Like I said, I didn't write it. Bottom line is the Captain was a coward. Is the Mafia going to come knocking on my door now?


I hope not! I just get pissed with that kind of generalizations. 

Regards

Paulo


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

PCP said:


> What should we say: The guy is a shame to all sea captains and it seems that humanity as a whole has not come with bright colors out of this.


It's interesting that even nowadays, this is pretty well universally regarded as the supreme act of cowardice. I think most people would regard it as more cowardly than, say, running away in battle.



> Residents of Giglio said they had never seen the Costa come so close to the dangerous 'Le Scole' reef area.


I guess not! 



> Her story backs up other survivor claims that it was a case of every man, woman and child for themselves of the £390m vessel after it ran aground.
> Fights broke out to get into the lifeboats, *men refused to prioritise women*, expectant mothers and children as they pushed themselves forward to escape. Crew ignored their passengers - leaving 'chefs and waiters' to help out.
> 
> ...As she waited for a flight home from Rome, grandmother Sandra Rogers, 62, told the Daily Mail: *'There was no "women and children first" policy*. There were big men, crew members, pushing their way past us to get into the lifeboats. It was disgusting....
> ...


I don't want to sound like I in any way support these cowardly weasels but this whole statement (except for the children aspect) pretty much says it all for 50 years of women's liberation doesn't it? They finally got the ultimate expression of equality and don't like the looks of it quite so much now.


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

One thing that puzzled me about the reputed panic on this ship - why panic - the island they hit was only yards away - easy swimming distance to dry land. It's not like they were out at sea away from the sight of land. It looked to me like they were so close that ANYONE with a vest on could have paddled ashore, swimmer or not.


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## flyingwelshman (Aug 5, 2007)

SloopJonB said:


> One thing that puzzled me about the reputed panic on this ship - why panic - the island they hit was only yards away - easy swimming distance to dry land. It's not like they were out at sea away from the sight of land. It looked to me like they were so close that ANYONE with a vest on could have paddled ashore, swimmer or not.


That was my thought as well, until I read the accounts. Some people were in the water for a couple of hours. One guy died from what appeared to be a heart attack brought on by the frigid (6 C) water.

What a tragedy all around.

The 'Skipper' needs to be pilloried.


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## -OvO- (Dec 31, 2011)

It was cold, maybe not quite that cold (Water Temperature Map) but certainly cold enough to cause a heart attack.


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## Donna_F (Nov 7, 2005)

Not that I'm in any way condoning how this man acted, but the passengers who I saw interviewed seemed to be confusing romantic notions of seafaring with reality. There's nothing in maritime law about either "women and children first" or that the captain has to stay with the ship. He still needs to coordinate the rescue, but if that's best done from a lifeboat next to the ship, that's what he should do because he isn't coordinating anything if he dies, too. 

Again, not that I think that's what this man intended, I'm just throwing it out there.


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## flyingwelshman (Aug 5, 2007)

-OvO- said:


> It was cold, maybe not quite that cold (Water Temperature Map) but certainly cold enough to cause a heart attack.


Cool link.

I think the temperature was stated as being 6 C on one of the reports. Either it was inaccurate or I didn't hear it properly.

Still 2 hours in 13 C (55 F) water is not something I would like to do, especially as shock would almost definitely be a factor.


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## b40Ibis (Apr 27, 2011)

In the photos I saw, you can see damage to most of her beam and forward of that. I was wondering how the boat listed to the opposite side w/that big hole gashed into her? Should she have sank that side first? Did captain assclown steer her to ground on the other side or something? I did that on my hobie one time after hitting a rock groin, I tacked over and headed back to the beach prayin I didn't have to tack again.


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## PCP (Dec 1, 2004)

SloopJonB said:


> I....
> 
> I don't want to sound like I in any way support these cowardly weasels but this whole statement (except for the children aspect) pretty much says it all for 50 years of women's liberation doesn't it? They finally got the ultimate expression of equality and don't like the looks of it quite so much now.






SloopJonB said:


> One thing that puzzled me about the reputed panic on this ship - why panic - the island they hit was only yards away - easy swimming distance to dry land. It's not like they were out at sea away from the sight of land. It looked to me like they were so close that ANYONE with a vest on could have paddled ashore, swimmer or not.


The Captain toke more than one hour to give the order to evacuate the boat. Probably he thought the boat was grounded and would not move....but he was wrong and the boat started to heel a lot making very difficult or impossible to put people on the water safely.

Many, if not most people aboard were elderly people (as it is usual on these cruises) and going from one deck to another with a deeply heeled boat is not an easy task. From the upper decks to the water is a huge distance, even from the lower decks to the water is a considerable distance. Feeling trapped in a heeled boat that they think was sinking and without the crew assistance to direct their actions and calm them in a pitch black and cold night, no wonder panic have spread.

Regards

Paulo


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## flyingwelshman (Aug 5, 2007)

DRFerron said:


> Not that I'm in any way condoning how this man acted, but the passengers who I saw interviewed seemed to be confusing romantic notions of seafaring with reality. There's nothing in maritime law about either "women and children first" or that the captain has to stay with the ship. He still needs to coordinate the rescue, but if that's best done from a lifeboat next to the ship, that's what he should do because he isn't coordinating anything if he dies, too.
> 
> Again, not that I think that's what this man intended, I'm just throwing it out there.


Schettino (Italian for '5hithead' - I won't call him 'Captain') was ordered, on numerous occasions, by Captain De Falco (of the Italian Coast Guard and who was now in charge of the rescue) to return to the ship and coordinate the rescue from aboard. He did not comply.

I can see SloopJonB's point about women's lib, however, even though maritime law may not say women and children first, I think that those that are more sound in body i.e. healthy, able-bodied people should ensure that people who are at greater risk i.e. the elderly, infirm, young and even the pregnant woman, are given priority to rescue services. If not the passengers, then, I am sure that the crew, must have some legal obligation as well as their obvious moral one.


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## CoastieCruiser (Jan 15, 2012)

Recently I was reminded that the Uniform Code of Military Justice still considers, even in today's politically correct environment, "hazarding a vessel" as punishable by death. Originally I thought this punishment was too extreme, until this tragic event occurred, reminding me that gross negligence from this captain cost the lives of many. Had he taken responsibility, faced adversity, and remained with the ship to do whatever was possible to try to ensure the safety, I would support leniency. But as he didn't, I say he should be charged to the fullest extent possible, separately for each life he endangered.

It baffles me that with all of the sensors, warning systems, and electronic navigation systems these modern cruise ships have (I've been on the bridges of a number of cruise ships, with the bridge crew always boasting of how great and safe the ships are), how did they run aground? Were alarms silenced? Was no one monitoring the electronic charts? I hope the entire cruise industry learns from this and prevents this from ever happening again!


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## PCP (Dec 1, 2004)

DRFerron said:


> ..There's nothing in maritime law about ... captain has to stay with the ship. He still needs to coordinate the rescue, but if that's best done from a lifeboat next to the ship, that's what he should do because he isn't coordinating anything if he dies, too.
> 
> Again, not that I think that's what this man intended, I'm just throwing it out there.


Maybe not under American law but under Italian law:

The commander must be the last to abandon ship...(translated)

Giornale Della Vela | Disastro Costa Concordia quali erano i doveri del comandante La tragedia di Costa Concordia tiene banco e le polemiche sul comportamento del comandant


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## MedSailor (Mar 30, 2008)

SloopJonB said:


> He sounds like he got his license from the same place as the Greek skipper of the cruise ship that foundered off South Africa a few years ago.
> 
> Anyhoo, he's in jail and will probably remain there for a long time.


...and probably the same school that gave a captain's license to the skipper of the Cha-Cha.

MedSailor


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## killarney_sailor (May 4, 2006)

*Not far to shore*

There was a report in the paper here about a couple from Calgary who swam ashore. Apparently the distance was 130 m. The biggest problem was getting across the rocks to shore. The woman took off her shoes for swimming (they were at dinner so probably high heels) and cut her feed pretty badly on the sharp rocks. The couple were around 60 and had done many cruises (in fact are scheduled for one in the Gulf of Mexico in a couple of months. I think if you were in reasonable health and kept your wits about yourself you were ok. Unfortunately the captain did not keep his wits about himself.


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## MedSailor (Mar 30, 2008)

b40Ibis said:


> In the photos I saw, you can see damage to most of her beam and forward of that. I was wondering how the boat listed to the opposite side w/that big hole gashed into her? Should she have sank that side first? Did captain assclown steer her to ground on the other side or something? I did that on my hobie one time after hitting a rock groin, I tacked over and headed back to the beach prayin I didn't have to tack again.


Yes, this was probably the one good thing that he did. He steered the ship into shallow water to ground it. First he tried to get back to the harbor, but 30min after hitting the reef he changed course and gave the order to abandon. See the course change on the following map:










MedSailor


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## Donna_F (Nov 7, 2005)

PCP said:


> Maybe not under American law but under Italian law:
> 
> The commander must be the last to abandon ship...(translated)
> 
> Giornale Della Vela | Disastro Costa Concordia quali erano i doveri del comandante La tragedia di Costa Concordia tiene banco e le polemiche sul comportamento del comandant


And he was Italian on an Italian-owned ship so I stand corrected.


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## davidpm (Oct 22, 2007)

What would be wrong with just staying in your cabin until someone came and got you?

The boat is aground on a shore. There is no terrible storm.
I would have been tempted to just sit there and wait.

Do you think there is serious risk of explosion or fire?
If so getting off would be more urgent.


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## sawingknots (Feb 24, 2005)

i can only imagine the absolute terror these people must have felt,in the dark literally and figuratively,not knowing what was happening,not knowing if the entire ship was about to sink quickly,not even knowing where to go or do,i doubt most even knew how close to shore they where,the slanted passage ways filled with paniced passengers no doubt pushing and mindless with fear,maybe the criuse lines will build even bigger ships,more people more money,one has to remember these wheren't seasoned seamen or even disiplined military types but grandmothers,older men and kids etc,lord jim indeed,btw in the philippines overloaded ferrys sink all to often due to inexperinced capts un-sea worthy boats but mostly bad judgement about the weather,in 1987 a passenger ferry colided with an oil tanker resulting in 1,749 official deaths,all the life jackets were locked up in a locker


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## JoeDiver (Feb 2, 2011)

davidpm said:


> What would be wrong with just staying in your cabin until someone came and got you?
> 
> The boat is aground on a shore. There is no terrible storm.
> I would have been tempted to just sit there and wait.
> ...


No....hindsight being 20/20 and we see how the ship ended up, it's easy to think this...

BUT

If you were there....people are panic'd and abandoning the ship, it's dark, this massive ship is heeling over and obviously sinking. There is NO WAY you'd be thinking "I'll just stay in my cabin until someone comes for me". No, you'll be getting the hell off that ship.


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## MedSailor (Mar 30, 2008)

davidpm said:


> What would be wrong with just staying in your cabin until someone came and got you?


Nothing.......

Just so long as your cabin was on the PORT side.


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## dnf777 (Jun 23, 2007)

If you're young and spritely, sitting on the deck as the ship slowly lists over, I see no reason for panic, and I doubt those people panicked. Elderly or less mobile folks, deep in the bowels of the ship experiencing the same thing just may panic. Evacuating 4000 people from a coastal area in cars is chaotic enough, let alone a ship with an extremely high deck height above water. I can easily see how panic set in.

Notwithstanding the above.....

I heard some survivors complaining that they bobbed in their lifeboat for over 2 hours. Were they blind? If so, I understand not seeing and making way for the land that was at most 1000 feet away, and more likely, about 300 feet.


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## chamonix (Jun 25, 2010)

Lets be honest, the average cruise ship passenger isn't the self-sufficient type either due to inclination or age. They are there for the luxury, not the adventure. Thats why there on a cruise ship instead of a sailboat.


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## Lake Superior Sailor (Aug 23, 2011)

It's really too bad the Captain isn't more of a man , that could handle things better! Now he"s looking at the other side of the coin & he's Italian meat! Jails are cruel places.--Dale


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## jackdale (Dec 1, 2008)

Now he is claiming that he tripped and fell into a lifeboat.


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## MedSailor (Mar 30, 2008)

jackdale said:


> Now he is claiming that he tripped and fell into a lifeboat.


..hate it when that happens.  Guess they skimped on the non-skid.

MedSailor


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## WouldaShoulda (Oct 7, 2008)

SloopJonB said:


> One thing that puzzled me about the reputed panic on this ship - why panic - the island they hit was only yards away - easy swimming distance to dry land. It's not like they were out at sea away from the sight of land. It looked to me like they were so close that ANYONE with a vest on could have paddled ashore, swimmer or not.


They could have been sitting on a deck chair until just a few hours ago.

What's the hurry??


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## Lake Superior Sailor (Aug 23, 2011)

.... he might as well get used to face down!--Dale


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## Rockter (Sep 11, 2006)

He was negligent.
People were drowning below and he ran for the lifeboats, and left.
He saved his own neck first.

It does not bear thinking about. Narrow corridors, having to walk on the walls, lights going out, water cascading down the passageways, poor souls getting trapped in their cabins, unable to open the cabin doors, getting drowned.

Just awful.
,


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## JoeDiver (Feb 2, 2011)

jackdale said:


> Now he is claiming that he tripped and fell into a lifeboat.


Tried that when I got caught cheating....I fell, it just slipped in....didn't work for me either....


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

jackdale said:


> Now he is claiming that he tripped and fell into a lifeboat.


The last I read, his lawyer is claiming that ALL the officers fell into that lifeboat but promptly began coordinating the evacuation from there. 

That lawyer must have done PR work for the Dear Leader of North Korea.


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## Capt Len (Oct 9, 2011)

We tend to forget the other recent screw ups. Like the cruise ship driven over a rock by the pilot in the inside passage;Sunk near Campbell River. The Queen of the North run into an island and sunk. Greek ferry run into lighted rocks, sunk, while crew watched world cup. The Valdeze on the rocks because the helmsman and the autopilot were both on duty. All simply prevented if not for the human touch.All the exquisite electronics are only as good as the input.Plug in the wrong waypoint numbers and see this in action.(Korean Air 007} Then you get situations like the captain of Washington state ferry running rocks as he showed his girlfriend their new water front property.Or the pilot of a freighter ramming Queen of Victoria in Active Pass because he was bored with Boundary and Haro. This Italian mistake probably had a mounting series of errors leading up to big headlines.The court proceedings will make interesting reading but in the meantime it doesn't look good for the captain's training and strength of character in a fairly stressful situation.


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## sawingknots (Feb 24, 2005)

personally i've never saw the attraction of mega criuse ships,i'd rather just fly to a exotic port-of-call and spend more time enjoying that place,no scedules,no arranged tours etc,if i am to be on the water,i want to be on the water and at my own pace


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## killarney_sailor (May 4, 2006)

*New career for the captain*

I would imagine the captain will find it hard to find employment in the commercial shipping industry - perhaps he can do yacht deliveries.


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## bljones (Oct 13, 2008)

"Vado a Bordo, Cazzo!" is my new all-purpose catch phrase.


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## bljones (Oct 13, 2008)

Somewhere, Joe Hazlewood is breathing a sigh of relief that finally, someone else has taken the heat.


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## Boasun (Feb 10, 2007)

Quite a few of the large passenger ship's captains are chosen by Their people skills and not their sea going skills. When I worked offshore it was always safety first. But then I also have known captains that have become complaicant towards people and no longer pay attention toward the safety of their vessel. Some of those captains were very friendly, well liked by the company powers and yet they still mouthed safety first, and worked to please the company powers or their girl friends, which ever is closer to them.
Safety first....... right!?


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## MedSailor (Mar 30, 2008)

bljones said:


> Somewhere, Joe Hazlewood is breathing a sigh of relief that finally, someone else has taken the heat.


How many captains does it take to pilot an Exxon Valdez?

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Wait for it
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Wait for it!
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Answer: One and a fifth. 

MedSailor


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## Boasun (Feb 10, 2007)

No. When Joe Hazzlewood found out that his trusty sidekick, third mate Gary Cousins, had run his ship aground, is when he had a few drinks.


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## ftldiver (Sep 9, 2002)

SloopJonB said:


> One thing that puzzled me about the reputed panic on this ship - why panic - the island they hit was only yards away - easy swimming distance to dry land. It's not like they were out at sea away from the sight of land. It looked to me like they were so close that ANYONE with a vest on could have paddled ashore, swimmer or not.


-5 stories up, and leaning at 20degrees... yeah, I'd be damn scarred. who knew its not going to turtle...

I have not heard if a Breath Alcohol Test was performed on the captain... anyone?

-hold my wine and watch this!


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## ftldiver (Sep 9, 2002)

dnf777 said:


> I heard some survivors complaining that they bobbed in their lifeboat for over 2 hours. Were they blind? If so, I understand not seeing and making way for the land that was at most 1000 feet away, and more likely, about 300 feet.


looking at the seas, 2-3' Where would you unload these folks? looks like rocks all around. I didn't see any sandy beaches, and those look like they draw at least at least 6'

and who's driving the boats? The reports I heard was waiters and busboys. but I guess they have search light...

I also heard the lifeboats were trolling for swimmers.

I'd have no problem bobbing around till daylight. its a shipwreck!


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## ftldiver (Sep 9, 2002)

looks like it rests where the wake goes to the north

Giglio italy - Google Maps

So.... maybe it was a straight shot into the harbor...

any charts of that area online?

OTOH, it might be more prudent to stand by and rescue swimmers...

reference
*http://cdn.slashgear.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/01/costa_concordia_satellite_image.jpg
*


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## L124C (Oct 4, 2007)

Even if he was drunk, I can't believe this guy is playing with a full deck. 
He tells the Italian CG he is "coordinating the rescue" from a lifeboat. 
He is ordered to return to the wreck. He responds that he can't because "it's dark" (He appareantly may have already been on land).
He mentions that the second in command is also on the lifeboat with him. I don't know if that is supposed to be reassuring, but it certainly throws the second in command under the bus (or boat, as it were!)!
The Coast Guard tells him there are fatalities, and and asks the CG, "how many?". The CG responds "For Christ Sake....YOU SHOULD BE TELLING ME! (I couldn't believe how informal the CG was.). 
And now the Capitan is claiming he slipped and fell into the lifeboat when the ship heeled over, while thousands of others couldn't find a lifeboat! If I saw this on SNL, I'd think it's over the top!
I can't imagine how a guy like that gets command of a ship like this, "people skills" or not!
Now they are reporting that he was authorized to do this exact course before (maybe at high tide?), which is really scary! 
In any case, apparently the mandatory penalty for a Capitan prematurely abandoning ship is 12 years in Italy. Hopefully, his "house arrest" is the last freedom he sees.


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## LandLocked66c (Dec 5, 2009)




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## jackdale (Dec 1, 2008)

This letter was in our local paper today.



> We returned from a cruise of the Greek is-lands on a Costa cruise ship (The Romantica) last October. Having been on many cruises, we were shocked with the lack of safety and organization Costa offered. The lifeboat drill was a joke. On all previous cruises, the crew showed the passengers how to properly put on their life-jackets and they took you to your lifeboat station. This was not done. We were taken to the casino and the mu-sic playing on the public address system was so loud, we could not hear anything.
> 
> Past experience had the passengers' names called out to confirm their attendance at the drill. This was not done. There were many passengers sitting in the public areas who did not participate. I asked a crew member and his response was: "They were probably on the ship from the previous cruise." My wife and I both felt: "God help us if the ship sinks!"
> 
> ...


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## LandLocked66c (Dec 5, 2009)




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## SlowButSteady (Feb 17, 2010)

This tragedy will (quite justifiably, IMHO) result in a number of regulations and laws designed to prevent a repeat. This will certainly occur in Italy, but also probably involve international laws and treaties, and quite possibly also in the US. And a decade or two from now some WRW mouthpiece will point to those very regulations and laws as examples of "typical liberal meddling in, and over regulation of, the free operation of businesses." Ditto for all the lawsuits likely to spring up in the aftermath of this event.

Skimping on safety may be good for the bottom line, at least in the short term, but it gets people killed and maimed.


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## PCP (Dec 1, 2004)

L124C said:


> ...
> And now *the Capitan is claiming he slipped and fell into the lifeboat* when the ship heeled over, while thousands of others couldn't find a lifeboat!...


That is the best part without doubt



L124C said:


> Now they are reporting that he was authorized to do this exact course before (maybe at high tide?), which is really scary!
> ..


Hum, that does not make sense and if that's true he is not the only mad one.

The tides there are less than 0,5m. Almost no tides.

Where do you heard that he was authorized to hold that course?

I have read the opposite :

The captain of the Costa Cruises ship that partially sank on Friday after hitting rocks off the coast of Italy had diverted the vessel onto a route not authorized by the company, its CEO says.

"It is human error here," Costa chairman and CEO Pier Luigi Foschi told reporters dialed into a conference call this morning. "The captain did not follow the authorized route that is used by Costa ships very frequently."

Foschi says Costa ships travel the passage near where the ship ran into rocks on Friday more than 100 times a year but always stay further out to sea. There only has been one other time when a Costa ship has traveled close to the island of Giglio, where it ran aground, he said, and that was in August 2011 to view a celebration. In that case, *the maneuver near the island was authorized and the ship stayed a safe distance from shore.*

When asked if he knew why the captain, Francesco Schettino, had taken the ship off course, Foschi suggested that the 10-year veteran of the company wanted to show off the ship to the port area of Giglio that it was passing.....

COSTA CONCORDIA Cruises CEO: Captain did not follow authorized route - USATODAY

Well, that's a very bad translation, but not mine.

Regards

Paulo


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## LandLocked66c (Dec 5, 2009)




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## ftldiver (Sep 9, 2002)

great pic! it sure looks close to shore from that perspective!

but it was a bit rougher and dark the night of the crash....

Wasn't the impact was further offshore, and he tried get in a shallow as possible? 
_(the only good decision he made)._


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## jackdale (Dec 1, 2008)

Here are some AIS tracks, some questionable, of the Costa Concordia. It appears to go between two islands.

Cruise Ship Costa Concordia Sinks off Italian Coast [VIDEO, AIS Track] | gCaptain - Maritime & Offshore


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## brak (Jan 5, 2007)

Official ENCs (IT400119) show 25' spot sounding of depth between those rocks and and depth range of 0-33' (which is to say - very shallow). That's what he'd be looking at. These guys must have been drunk or high - I can't think of any other reasonable explanation.


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## PCP (Dec 1, 2004)

Those charts are in meters not ft. He had tried to pass on a very narrow channel with a minimum deep of 10.3 m. 

That is rather stupid risky and unacceptable with a boat of that size. Theoretically the boat could do it, it has a draft of 8.2m but the channel is narrow and a minimum deviation could have the results that we all know. 

Regards

Paulo


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## brak (Jan 5, 2007)

The official enc chart which would have been used on board (and a copy of which I am looking at) is a vector chart with depths in whatever units the software wants to show (they are meters internally, but that's irrelevant for purposes of visualization)


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## svHyLyte (Nov 13, 2008)

My wife and I together with other members of our family took a family reunion cruise on the US inaugural voyage of the Costa Vittoria--a near identical sister ship of the Concordia--out of Ft. Lauderdale, Fla, in late 1996. Frankly, I was amazed at the small spaces that ship was maneuvered into during the course of that 10 day trip including a cove at one "private island" south of the DR where the ship--literally--had to be pivoted 180º, in place! They did it but I kept thinking what a nutty thing to do as I could see the shallows of the reef all around us and I would have been reluctant to have taken our own boat into that cove! Doing so must be an Italian thing, eh?!?


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## brak (Jan 5, 2007)

In Norway the coastal ferry (Hurtigrutten, they are pretty much full-size cruise ships running on specific schedule) will enter a really narrow fjord, so that fjord walls would be just feet away from the sides/stern/whatever, then turn 180 degrees in place, almost touching walls - and get out. They do this every day (they have 7-8 ships running the same schedule one day behind each other) and, evidently, never had an accident. Of course Norwegians appear to be born with a helm in their hands


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## SlowButSteady (Feb 17, 2010)

jackdale said:


> Here are some AIS tracks, some questionable, of the Costa Concordia. It appears to go between two islands.
> 
> Cruise Ship Costa Concordia Sinks off Italian Coast [VIDEO, AIS Track] | gCaptain - Maritime & Offshore


I surfed around the Web the other day and there is a more believable AIS track putting the ship just to the east of those rocks, rather than between them. I also found a story with some pics of some debris just off of those rocks (I wish I had bookmarked it) that didn't say _exactly_ where the putative contact was made, but I think it would have noted if the debris was found between the rocks. In any event, Capt. Doofus has apparently said that the ship was all of 300m from the coast at its closest approach (that's about one whole boat length). It isn't clear whether Cappy was referring to the coast of Gilio itself, or the outer edge of the rocks as his reference point for that statement (and he's been soooo trustworthy with all his other statements about this incident), but pretty dang close in any event.


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## MedSailor (Mar 30, 2008)

*The plot thickens....*

This just keeps getting better and better. 

Apparently the captain and a woman had dinner in the dining room an hour after hitting the rocks while the ship was listing so bad that pots and pans were falling off the shelves.

The interview with the cook is totally worth watching.

From CNN:Cruise ship's cook says captain ordered dinner after crash - CNN.com

(CNN) -- The captain of the Costa Concordia ordered dinner for himself and a woman after the ship struck rocks off Italy's coast, a cook from the ship told a Filipino television station.
In an interview with GMA Network, cook Rogelio Barista said Capt. Francesco Schettino ordered dinner less than an hour after the accident.
"We wondered what was going on. ... At that time, we really felt something was wrong. ... The stuff in the kitchen was falling off shelves and we realized how grave the situation was," Barista told GMA.
Schettino ordered dinner around 10:30 p.m. Friday, Barista said. Authorities say the ship struck the rocks at 9:41 p.m.

So what'll we find out next? That after abandoning the ship he stood on the hill and played his fiddle? (It is an Italian tradition no?).










MedSailor


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## HDChopper (Oct 17, 2010)

Psychopaths are everywhere why is everyone so suprized this goof turned out to be one ?

My Condolences to those who lost a loved one.


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## Boasun (Feb 10, 2007)

After viewing the AIS track for that ship, I can only say that, that Captain was a very foolish ignoramish in trying to pass between those two tiny islets. There was plenty of clear water going outside for safe passage. So what he was trying to prove? That he was Magellan? That he was bored making the same trip again and again?
He should for a start is to dig the graves of all those whose lives he had taken. The digging done by hand with a very small shovel.


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## PCP (Dec 1, 2004)

The AIS course is strange. It seems that the boat turned around and made for the Island:






This reconstitution explains why. The marks on the images are no marks but just rocks. The timing doesn't seem right:






The ones that have made the movie said:

*the buoys on the simulation are just representing rock positions, there are no real buoys on that spot.
..., it was a really risky to sail in such vicinity
We tested on 3 different ecdis systems, and all gave alarms.
*


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## masms22 (Sep 13, 2011)

as an Italian lover of the sea and I can only deeply ashamed of the behavior of Captain Schettino


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## killarney_sailor (May 4, 2006)

To change the subject a bit, has anyone heard what the plans are for this vessel? Will they put on temporary patches (wonder how many broken ports there are underwater) and pumped it out to tow somewhere? Is is considered a total loss at this point? I saw one report from Bloomberg (I think it was), to say the insurance companies' exposure was in the 30 to 50 million euros range - so that would imply the ship can be recovered and fixed up.


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## Capt Len (Oct 9, 2011)

Probably a write off. Watch for it on Craigs L. The last cruise ship that sank in BC was sold off (to Greece?) At least the intrepid skipper managed to park his ship in shallow water for easy disembarking and salvage. Gotta hand it to him for his foresight.


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## brak (Jan 5, 2007)

I wonder what chart they are using for this simulation. Rocks as they are marked on that chart are *not* marked on the official ENC for the same area. Not that it matters much - he should not have been there, but it explains why the cap claimed rocks were "not charted". These rocks are not.


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## radovix (Jul 29, 2000)

I have read some of your post and forget me but I have to deceive you:
Italian justice do not allow consecutive terms, the maximum the "captain" could be sentenced is 14 Years: the imprisonment year is 11 month length, that means that after 12 years he has finished his term.
But after 1/3 of the sentence he can be allowed to some "reeducation", that means that he could be released to some job with the only the "signature daily on a police station"
He has to pass three different degree of judgment before be jailed. It could take up to 10 (ten) years. 
More probably in 2022 he could be "jailed at home" (and paid for living around 1500$) for about 6 to 9 month.

In Italy we are upset by this stupid incompetent.

What a shame!


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## radovix (Jul 29, 2000)

brak said:


> I wonder what chart they are using for this simulation. Rocks as they are marked on that chart are *not* marked on the official ENC for the same area. Not that it matters much - he should not have been there, but it explains why the cap claimed rocks were "not charted". These rocks are not.


I guarantee you, the rocks are charted at least from the time of roman empire!!
The "Isola del Giglio" is populated like Boston Harbor, is a main sail ground in Italy and an expensive destination, like Cape Cod.

No way to be fouled by chart, Italy is not like ICW, the Tirrenian sea is deep close to the coast.

No excuses


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## brak (Jan 5, 2007)

I am not saying there is an excuse - the boat should not have been there, period.

I *am* saying that I am looking *right now* on the official Italian ENC chart IT400119 at the same location as the chart that is used in simulation video above. The official ENC chart does not show individual rocks that are shown on the chart in simulation. The official ENC chart shows the entire area as "generally shallow".

The official ENC is the only chart that ECDIS system on board that boat would be required to use. They may have used other charts as well, but this one is the only one that has to be there.

Here is a screen capture of official ENC. Note that there are no individual rocks marked in shallow water area east of Le Scole and the other islet. I verified the location by comparing coordinates to those shown on the grid of the chart in the simulation video.











radovix said:


> I guarantee you, the rocks are charted at least from the time of roman empire!!
> The "Isola del Giglio" is populated like Boston Harbor, is a main sail ground in Italy and an expensive destination, like Cape Cod.
> 
> No way to be fouled by chart, Italy is not like ICW, the Tirrenian sea is deep close to the coast.
> ...


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## SlowButSteady (Feb 17, 2010)

If you look at the AIS track on MarineTraffic of the Costa Concordia that night (HERE), it looks like Capt. Doofus turned off his transponder as he approached the island. There are regular position reports until 20:37, then nothing until the ship is about in its current location. Makes me think that all the graphics showing the ships path (between the rocks, et cetera) are just make up for effect. Obviously, Capt. Doofus screwed up, big time, but we'll probably all have to wait until the Italian CG sorts everything out before we'll know exactly what happened.


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## radovix (Jul 29, 2000)

L124C said:


> Even if he was drunk, I can't believe this guy is playing with a full deck.
> He tells the Italian CG he is "coordinating the rescue" from a lifeboat.
> He is ordered to return to the wreck. He responds that he can't because "it's dark" (He appareantly may have already been on land).
> He mentions that the second in command is also on the lifeboat with him. I don't know if that is supposed to be reassuring, but it certainly throws the second in command under the bus (or boat, as it were!)!
> ...


The tone of the CG was very commanding and rude, b/cse they realized that the captain was lying. 
When the CG answered to the refusal of Captain cause the dark was mocking as for babies: "you want to go home because is dark?" the CG on duty was upset.

During the phone a voice in the background said to the captain: "tell him (to the CG) to came here..tell him, tell him" may be one of the officers.

Now the CG on duty is a national hero!

By way the max tide in the area is 3 ft.


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## radovix (Jul 29, 2000)

brak said:


> I am not saying there is an excuse - the boat should not have been there, period.
> 
> I *am* saying that I am looking *right now* on the official Italian ENC chart IT400119 at the same location as the chart that is used in simulation video above. The official ENC chart does not show individual rocks that are shown on the chart in simulation. The official ENC chart shows the entire area as "generally shallow".
> 
> ...


The captain of Costa Concordia is a liar, was obvious from the same moment he contacted the CG.


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## rrodak (Nov 14, 2011)

There was a report of one of the officers on the bridge stating that he knew the ship was going to run aground, but "it wasn't his place to direct the captain." It sounds like the cruise industry will need a few lessons on crew resource management that the airlines had to learn. Have one person in charge and responsible for operations is great, but to the point where others won't speak up when they see something wrong is bad!



CoastieCruiser said:


> It baffles me that with all of the sensors, warning systems, and electronic navigation systems these modern cruise ships have (I've been on the bridges of a number of cruise ships, with the bridge crew always boasting of how great and safe the ships are), how did they run aground? Were alarms silenced? Was no one monitoring the electronic charts? I hope the entire cruise industry learns from this and prevents this from ever happening again!


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## chamonix (Jun 25, 2010)

HEY, this is pretty much how I park my boat! WOW I've got what it takes to be a cruise ship captian!! Oh wait, never mind, I forgot about the people skills.


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## Carl259 (Jun 12, 2011)

I'm very curious to see how many posters here will be eating the proverbial crow when the facts come out about this case. It's amazing the opinions people have formed from getting their facts from the press and the web. Any incident I have ever been involved in and reported by the press makes me wonder if the reporters were even at the same event as I. "Innocent until proven guilty in a court of law".....


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## Lake Superior Sailor (Aug 23, 2011)

Even the captain knows he's not Innocent...Dale


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## JonEisberg (Dec 3, 2010)

Carl259 said:


> I'm very curious to see how many posters here will be eating the proverbial crow when the facts come out about this case. It's amazing the opinions people have formed from getting their facts from the press and the web. Any incident I have ever been involved in and reported by the press makes me wonder if the reporters were even at the same event as I. "Innocent until proven guilty in a court of law".....


Well, I'm very curious to hear what sort of "facts" you think might emerge that would exonerate the actions of Captain Schettino in this instance...


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## Carl259 (Jun 12, 2011)

Well, his own recorded testimony that he was coordinating the rescue from the lifeboat. He was catapaulted from the ship. That he saved hundreds if not thousands of lives...... Why do find this so unbelievable, yet find that he was hailing a cab to go home so believable????
It would be more prudent to wait for the inquiry. I don't know any of the facts... yet!!! Does Maritime law operate under guilty till proven innocent?? 
Quite honestly I find the behavior of the Italian Coast Guard official rude and horrific. He was actually in charge, it appeared (to me) the liner Captain was incoherent, in shock and unable to follow instructions given to him by the Coast Guard. Instead of making threats to ruin the Captain, I would think he simply would have taken over the situation.


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## Waltthesalt (Sep 22, 2009)

After his retirement, Winston Churchill was cruising the Mediterranean on an Italian liner, when he was asked why an ex-British Prime Minister chose an Italian ship. 
“There are three things I like about being on an Italian cruise ship,” said Churchill.
“First, their cuisine is unsurpassed."
"Second, their service is superb."
"And in time of emergency, there is none of this nonsense about women and children first.”


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## radovix (Jul 29, 2000)

Carl259 said:


> Well, his own recorded testimony that he was coordinating the rescue from the lifeboat. He was catapaulted from the ship. That he saved hundreds if not thousands of lives...... Why do find this so unbelievable, yet find that he was hailing a cab to go home so believable????
> It would be more prudent to wait for the inquiry. I don't know any of the facts... yet!!! Does Maritime law operate under guilty till proven innocent??
> Quite honestly I find the behavior of the Italian Coast Guard official rude and horrific. He was actually in charge, it appeared (to me) the liner Captain was incoherent, in shock and unable to follow instructions given to him by the Coast Guard. Instead of making threats to ruin the Captain, I would think he simply would have taken over the situation.


Yes, hailing a cab to go home is unbelievable because he was on a Island, no way to go onshore by a taxi.

The alarm to the CG was given from police (carabinieri in fact) called by a relative of a passenger.
The CG was duped by Mr Schettino (the assumed captain) the behavior of the officer in charge in the CG was adequate to the felony of the Captain.

More or less the same happens in USA when the answer to a police officer in a road accident are incoherent....the police became.."assertive" .


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## Carl259 (Jun 12, 2011)

radovix said:


> yes, hailing a cab to go home is unbelievable because he was on a island, no way to go onshore by a taxi.
> 
> The alarm to the cg was given from police (carabinieri in fact) called by a relative of a passenger.
> The cg was duped by mr schettino (the assumed captain) the behavior of the officer in charge in the cg was adequate to the felony of the captain.
> ...


unfreaking believable!!!!!! I'm done , have a nice day


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## chamonix (Jun 25, 2010)

Carl I agree with you about the media, I've had the same experiance as you. I strongly disagree with you about th CG. The CG guy on the the audio isn't at the scene, He's at the command center co-ordinating CG activities and trying to create order out of chaos. To do this he needs information. The place to get this information is the captain of the ship. The captain of the ship should be gathering information such as what is happening with the passengers, number of dead, condition of the ship and whats being going on up until any given point. Its not just a nice to know, its the captains job just as it is for anyone in command. Your hearing the CG's frustration that there not getting the information they should expect.


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## Deric (Feb 3, 2008)

Well, when the captain thought "abandon ship," he meant it - for himself.


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## JonEisberg (Dec 3, 2010)

Carl259 said:


> Well, his own recorded testimony that he was coordinating the rescue from the lifeboat. He was catapaulted from the ship. That he saved hundreds if not thousands of lives...... Why do find this so unbelievable, yet find that he was hailing a cab to go home so believable????
> It would be more prudent to wait for the inquiry. I don't know any of the facts... yet!!! Does Maritime law operate under guilty till proven innocent??


Well, depends upon whether you're discussing the assignment of _"guilt"_ , versus _"responsibility"_, I suppose... Whether he is ultimately found "guilty" of any violation of Maritime Law or the company's policies/procedures will be determined in due course... I've not seen many argue here that he is "guilty" of anything in particular, but IMHO that is a vastly different question than acknowledging his responsibilities as the ship's Master... By definition, this catastrophe rests upon his shoulders, there's little denying that fact...

And yes, perhaps it's just me, but I do find it highly unlikely that he was "catapulted" into a lifeboat, and was unable to return to his ship, or thought the abandonment could be better supervised from a lifeboat...



Carl259 said:


> Quite honestly I find the behavior of the Italian Coast Guard official rude and horrific. He was actually in charge, it appeared (to me) the liner Captain was incoherent, in shock and unable to follow instructions given to him by the Coast Guard. Instead of making threats to ruin the Captain, I would think he simply would have taken over the situation.


Gotta disagree with that one, bigtime... People were _DYING_, the Captain had left his ship with hundreds if not thousands of passengers and crew still aboard, that was not the time to be concerned over the possibility of offending the Captain's sensibilities, or the lack show of respect, or the _tone_ of the Commandant...

And, how would a CG Commandant far away from the scene have been better able to assume command of the rescue/abandomnent effort? There's a very good reason for the principle of Chain of Command, if the Captain was indeed to have been relieved of his command, that should have passed to his second in command, not some Commandant in a remote location...


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## JoeDiver (Feb 2, 2011)

JonEisberg said:


> Gotta disagree with that one, bigtime...


Yeah, I agree...the Italian CG in command was dealing with a coward and they knew it. They were alot less harsh than I would have been.

There's a very good reason Schettino has been detained under house arrest. If anything he did was "heroic" or as expected of his station, he would not be in the situation he is in now.


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## Carl259 (Jun 12, 2011)

Some very good points, in these last few post. My point is no one actually knows what went wrong here. There seems to have been no structure to the command chain. No policy for this type of a situation. Who's fault is that ship line? Country of registry? Captain ultimately? Ok the Captain is off the ship, who is next in Command?? no one? who's next after that? My point is the Captain is off the ship for whatever reason. What's next?? It's reported the Captain manuvered the ship closer to the shoreline which helped to save lives. Loss of life is terrible, 4000 on board, less than 40 dead or missing that's less than 1%. For me, That is a pretty amazing number for this type of crisis, although very sad for a joy ride if that is also true. Some people are totally useless in a crisis, this Captain may be one, kind of a bad time to find this out. Who's fault is that?
The Coast Guard tells the Captain in what has been released anyway that his conversation is being recorded. The CG says he will ruin him, Wow that is helpful, Whatever happened on the bridge has put this ship aground. If it is true the CG knows that there is a ladder on the bow they know a little more info than you get in a phone conversation.. It would seems the CG would have moved on to someone who would have been effective in getting the information that was vital.


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## sd1953 (Mar 21, 2010)

I have read these comments as well as news reports of the tragedy. I am struck by the contrast between an emergency situation on the cruise liner and the stories of naval vessels in combat and storms. 
The crew of a cruise liner runs a hotel, not a ship. They practice hotel management tasks, cooking, cleaning, entertainment and so on. Every story I have ever read about a cruise liner in an emergency situation is a story of panic. Because one life boat drill before cocktails does not prepare the passengers for loss of power events coupled with an emergency requiring abandoning ship. One drill does not provide proficiency. And it is usually preceded with an announcement, "In accordance with laws and regulations we are going to do a drill...". This guarantees that no one takes it seriously.
The naval stories are always different; the chain of command is strong, even with missing links, the scenario has been drilled, everyone on the ship (or boat for those who like living inside a steel tube) has a regular job, a battle stations job and an emergency job. The sailors know what to do when presented with the new conditions.
So I guess I am wondering, a newbie to this site, how much drill do you do? Do you heave-to to have lunch to practice heaving-to? Do you practice shortening sail? MOB? How much practice is enough?


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## AKscooter (Jan 18, 2009)

Not only did he "trip", by golly so did the first, second and third officer. In the same boat even. I need to go to Vegas with those odds.


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## Lake Superior Sailor (Aug 23, 2011)

I guess what the Captain did didn't surprise me! but the rest of the officers--Well?...Dale


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## radovix (Jul 29, 2000)

*the rest of the chain of command*

the rest of the chai of command was with Mr Schettino, who slipped accidentally in the boat with his computer and with a bag with a dress change.

Two only officers remained on board, one, after the embark of all passengers fall in a door open and broke his leg, was saved the day after his regarded as an hero.

The other embarked last and is also regarded as an hero, he started the evacuation before the order of the captain: both says they have done their duty.

In a word of cowards the normal behavior is heroism.

In the near future an advice, before embark in a cruise ask for the Captain name, Mr Schettino will be back soon.


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## Sublime (Sep 11, 2010)

AKscooter said:


> Not only did he "trip", by golly so did the first, second and third officer. In the same boat even. I need to go to Vegas with those odds.


It's really unfortunate. The hazards on deck causing these three to trip and fall into the life boat cost lives. If I were one of the investigators, I'd look hard at the toe rail on the ship and gather evidence so people can sue the manufacture. I mean, who makes a ship that causes the captain to trip and fall into a life boat in such conditions? Shame on those designers. Shame on them! You can't have a ship that fouls up the captain and officers like that! They were just trying to do their job and look at what happened!

Thankfully, they didn't land on the Doritos. Designers of the life boats were thinking at least. "Stow all food out of the way." The captain could have died if his Doritos and Godiva chocolates got crushed when he fell in.


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## flyingwelshman (Aug 5, 2007)

One good thing that has come out of this tragedy is the development of new systems for the prevention of a recurrence.

Here's an example of one such system:

It's an Early Warning System that would give cruisers enough advanced warning of impending trouble to enable them to be prepared.

It's new from Italy. It's called The Schettino Early Warning System.

It's very easy to operate. It just hangs out at different parts of the vessel (the salon is a particular favourite spot). When it perceives danger the Schettino automatically ejects itself from the boat.

Having left the boat the Schettino will 'fall' into any vessel that is in close proximity - ideally the pirate ship.

Once safely aboard the other vessel the Schettino will lie on the deckboards making incomprehensible and fantastical statements and whimpering inconsolably, thereby totally confusing anyone within earshot.

Here's what the unit looks like:










And here you can see that the Cruise industry has reacted very quickly and equipped some of their liners with this new piece of safety equipment:










The Schettino Early Warning System: Safety First! Everybody else is on their own.

edited to remove references to weapons. (Those were for the firearms thread )


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## JoeDiver (Feb 2, 2011)

So, if the SEWS has ejected itself, you should be prepared to abandon ship soon?


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## flyingwelshman (Aug 5, 2007)

JoeDiver said:


> So, if the SEWS has ejected itself, you should be prepared to abandon ship soon?


Or, at least prepare yourself for 'action'.

Kind of like when a blip shows up on radar.

It's a 'passive' warning system.


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## JoeDiver (Feb 2, 2011)

As soon as West Marine has them, I'll get one for my C25.


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## LandLocked66c (Dec 5, 2009)




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## dongreerps (May 14, 2007)

The FlyingWelchman has a very good system. Unfortunately he has misspelled the name the e shold be replaced with and i.


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## flyingwelshman (Aug 5, 2007)

dongreerps said:


> The FlyingWelchman has a very good system. Unfortunately he has misspelled the name the e shold be replaced with and i.


Funny you should say that! When I first wrote the thing I spelled the name"****teni" I fixed it to the 'correct' spelling but, I agree: it is not the 'proper' spelling.


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

radovix said:


> In the near future an advice, before embark in a cruise ask for the Captain name, Mr Schettino will be back soon.


No he won't. The only way that guy will ever get afloat again is as a paying passenger.


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## PCP (Dec 1, 2004)

JonEisberg said:


> Well, depends upon whether you're discussing the assignment of _"guilt"_ , versus _"responsibility"_, I suppose... Whether he is ultimately found "guilty" of any violation of Maritime Law or the company's policies/procedures will be determined in due course... I've not seen many argue here that he is "guilty" of anything in particular, but IMHO that is a vastly different question than acknowledging his responsibilities as the ship's Master... By definition, this catastrophe rests upon his shoulders, there's little denying that fact...
> 
> ,,.


Actually he is formaly accused by the Italian justice and is imprisoned in his house.

SCHETTINO ACCUSATO : Il comandante della nave Concordia è accusato di omicidio plurimo colposo naufragio e abbandono della nave.

Costa Concordia, in corso l'interrogatorio a Schettino - ATTUALITA

He can get 15 years in jail.

Regards

Paulo


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## ericra (Oct 10, 2001)

PCP said:


> Actually he is formaly accused by the Italian justice and is imprisoned in his house.
> 
> SCHETTINO ACCUSATO : Il comandante della nave Concordia è accusato di omicidio plurimo colposo naufragio e abbandono della nave.
> 
> ...


Most likely he will get 15 years, somebody's head must roll etc.


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## WouldaShoulda (Oct 7, 2008)

*Chicken of the Sea!!*

I understand this was a NY Post headline as well!!


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## Carl259 (Jun 12, 2011)

Jail for 15 years?????? gimmee a break . This is Italy..... they only hung Musolinni... how many did he kill????? Besides They reported a conversation where he told the CG he would be the last off the ship!!! The second to last would be his second in command......( he just couldn't remember his name) There the truth is out!! This is proof that he was blown off the ship from the explosion of the Cappachino maker.


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

Carl259 said:


> Jail for 15 years?????? gimmee a break . This is Italy..... they only hung Musolinni... how many did he kill????? Besides They reported a conversation where he told the CG he would be the last off the ship!!! The second to last would be his second in command......( he just couldn't remember his name) There the truth is out!! This is proof that he was blown off the ship from the explosion of the Cappachino maker.


They did a little more than HANG Mussolini - they killed him AND his mistress then strung them up by their heels for the crowd to abuse. Italians can be VERY vindictive.

Now if it was CANADA - he'd probably be out by now - he would have been given double credit for the time he served in the lifeboat.

This guy's life is over no matter what happens to him - the stupidity, cowardice, loss of life and the worldwide notoriety almost ensures he will get a very stiff sentence. Whether or not he has to serve it is another matter.


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## Carl259 (Jun 12, 2011)

I stand corrected, that's what I love about the internet! When your wrong....... Thanks , Carl


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## LandLocked66c (Dec 5, 2009)

*Italian Cruise ship captain Francesco Schettino began his new job as a bus driver yesterday.....*


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## LandLocked66c (Dec 5, 2009)

*Island house is awesome!*








_Don't let Francesco Schettino park his ship anywhere near it. _


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

LandLocked66c said:


> *Island house is awesome!*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Incredible!!!! Where is it? Tell us more??


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## dongreerps (May 14, 2007)

Landlocked66c: beautiful picture. However I believe the caption is incorrect the picture was taken during the captain's driving exam. The flight examiner failed him and remarked he needed to adjust his attitude! Yes double entendre intended.


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## LandLocked66c (Dec 5, 2009)

SloopJonB said:


> Incredible!!!! Where is it? Tell us more??


Couldn't find anything on it...


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## Sublime (Sep 11, 2010)

We got more funnies!!!!


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## MerrittIslandRich (Dec 14, 2011)

*Where did he get his experience & sea time?*

Why did everyone on the bridge let this happen? Going so close to shore with a ship seems really stupid. There is usually more than one or two crew on the bridge, didn't anyone think about the bottom or rock ledges, so close to the shore line? If I was that captain, I would have been the LAST person off, if indeed I ever did get off! If the captain was that scared, he could have run down to the ships hospital and asked the ships doctor for some medication!


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

MerrittIslandRich said:


> Why did everyone on the bridge let this happen? Going so close to shore with a ship seems really stupid. There is usually more than one or two crew on the bridge, didn't anyone think about the bottom or rock ledges, so close to the shore line? If I was that captain, I would have been the LAST person off, if indeed I ever did get off! If the captain was that scared, he could have run down to the ships hospital and asked the ships doctor for some medication!


One report I read said that junior officers were afraid to speak up - he was a bully.


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## JoeDiver (Feb 2, 2011)

SloopJonB said:


> One report I read said that junior officers were afraid to speak up - he was a bully.


That would make sense. Most bullies are actually cowards.


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## rgscpat (Aug 1, 2010)

Up to 17 dead. Condolences to the families of the victims.
Best wishes to the survivors for being able to get on with their lives.


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## ftldiver (Sep 9, 2002)

OTOH, the ship and several others in the Costa fleet, (reportedly) make the 'salute' as often as possible. 

they have many instances over the years of this occurring, so its not like he thought up this on his own.

still captain is the boss, and it was low tide.

My problem is how it was handled AFTER the collision. the why it happened I can understand.


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## lancelot9898 (Dec 30, 2008)

I've yet to understand how a ship takes on water from the port side and ends up listing to starboard. Having a hole on one side of the ship would I think cause the ship to list on that side, but then again the Taitanic seemed to stay level and sunk by the bow having impacted the iceberg on one side.


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## JoeDiver (Feb 2, 2011)

lancelot9898 said:


> I've yet to understand how a ship takes on water from the port side and ends up listing to starboard. Having a hole on one side of the ship would I think cause the ship to list on that side, but then again the Taitanic seemed to stay level and sunk by the bow having impacted the iceberg on one side.


If you impact and open the starboard side, bow....you will go down level on the bow.

If you strike the port side, bow, you will list to port and capsize.

If you strike starboard, aft, you will go down level on the stern.

If you strike port side, aft, you will list to starboard and capsize.


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

lancelot9898 said:


> I've yet to understand how a ship takes on water from the port side and ends up listing to starboard. Having a hole on one side of the ship would I think cause the ship to list on that side, but then again the Taitanic seemed to stay level and sunk by the bow having impacted the iceberg on one side.


Titanic didn't have proper watertight compartments - they were bins, not boxes so the water rose to the top and slopped over into adjacent compartments - this kept things level.


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## jackdale (Dec 1, 2008)

*A dare?*

CBC's Fifth Estate has a report tonight



> The dangerous manoeuvre that caused the Costa Concordia cruise ship to crash into rocks off the shore of the Italian island of Giglio last month was likely the result of a rivalry between its captain and that of another ship to see who could get closest to the island when sounding the customary salute that vessels give when passing shore.
> 
> Concordia's captain, Francesco Schettino, had sent an email just weeks before the Jan. 13 disaster to another captain who had managed to sound his ship's horn from closer than the eight kilometres considered safe.
> 
> ...


Concordia captain's stunt blamed for cruise wreck - World - CBC News


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

jackdale said:


> CBC's Fifth Estate has a report tonight
> 
> Concordia captain's stunt blamed for cruise wreck - World - CBC News


Sounds a lot like the fighter pilots that tried flying under the tram line years ago - they didn't make it either and others paid the price for their macho bull$hit.

Lets have one of the lawyers chime in - what is the legal definition of an act that results in the unintended but easily foreseeable deaths of large numbers of people? Is that manslaughter or just criminal negligence?


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## jackdale (Dec 1, 2008)

The Fifth Estate Program

The Wreck of the Costa Concordia - the fifth estate

Video only available in Canada, but other information is online.


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## PCP (Dec 1, 2004)

SloopJonB said:


> ..
> 
> Lets have one of the lawyers chime in - what is the legal definition of an act that results in the unintended but easily foreseeable deaths of large numbers of people? Is that manslaughter or just criminal negligence?


I have said already here that the Italian state is prosecuting him on "accusato di omicidio plurimo colposo naufragio e abbandono della nave" that means"

"charged with non intentional multiple murder and culpable of neglect on the sinking of the ship and abandoning the ship".

This will give him probably 13 years in jail and he is finished as a sea captain.

Regards

Paulo


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

PCP said:


> This will give him probably 13 years in jail *and his finish as a sea captain.* Regards Paulo


I think THAT particular decision has already been taken out of the courts hands.


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## L124C (Oct 4, 2007)

SloopJonB said:


> Titanic didn't have proper watertight compartments - they were bins, not boxes so the water rose to the top and slopped over into adjacent compartments - this kept things level.


This brings up a point I've wondered about from the beginning. Didn't they learn anything from Titanic? How did this ship not have compartments that would have allowed it to stay afloat? Once water starts coming aboard I don't know that it knows Port from Starboard. However, since he beached it on Starboard, and the land mass certainly appears to be on Starboard, I would have thought it would list to port, as the open water would present less resistance. I'm assuming he opened her up on Starboard as well when he beached her. In any event, as the picture shows, he clearly won the bet!


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## dongreerps (May 14, 2007)

Costa Allegra, owned by the same operators as Costa Concordia, is now adrift due to an apparent engine room fire. Tugs are on the way to take it into some port. Press releases from the company may be accurate this time, but they sound like the messages from the Concordia captain immediately after his grounding. Sounds like Carnival needs an agonising self appraisal.


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## beej67 (Apr 2, 2008)

L124C said:


> This brings up a point I've wondered about from the beginning. Didn't they learn anything from Titanic? How did this ship not have compartments that would have allowed it to stay afloat?


I saw the Discovery Channel documentary on the Concordia. It said that maritime design standards specify that your ship has to be able to stay afloat if you breach two sections. The nitwit scraped a hole 180 feet long in the hull, breaching between four and five different compartments.


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## Boasun (Feb 10, 2007)

Looking at that picture; I can hear some bomber pilot saying: What do you mean that wasn't the Bismark!? Or one of Mussileni's battleships??

That picture would be something if there bomb sights superimposed on it.


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## L124C (Oct 4, 2007)

*Bean Counters strike again!*



beej67 said:


> I saw the Discovery Channel documentary on the Concordia. It said that maritime design standards specify that your ship has to be able to stay afloat if you breach two sections. The nitwit scraped a hole 180 feet long in the hull, breaching between four and five different compartments.


Seems like a silly rule, probably determined by cost, not safety. If a large ship hits something while underway, I think it's likely to breach more than two sections. For example, the gash on the Cosco Busan was well in excess of two hundred feet. The Busan only grazed the Oakland Bridge, while moving at a mere 10 knots. Fortunately the penetration was above the waterline. 
In both incidents, knuckle heads were apparently in charge, so it seems we should plan for that contingency. Especially when the cargo is paying passengers who are on a floating resort!


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## killarney_sailor (May 4, 2006)

I suspect that Costa Cruises will soon be a former brand name in the business and the remaining Costa ships will become Carnival or some other brand. Can't imagine that business has not collapsed (and is collapsing worse) with the second incident.


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## rgscpat (Aug 1, 2010)

Warships have more extensive compartmentation, but it's hard to imagine that being viable or cost-effective on a cruise liner, where everything possible seems to be done to make them not feel like a ship. Perhaps in the future, the ships will become smarter than some of their captains, to the extent that a ship would refuse to allow its crew to run it up into a bunch of hungry rocks or into other ships (Stockhom-Andrea Doria).


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

rgscpat said:


> Warships have more extensive compartmentation, but it's hard to imagine that being viable or cost-effective on a cruise liner, where everything possible seems to be done to make them not feel like a ship. Perhaps in the future, the ships will become smarter than some of their captains, to the extent that a ship would refuse to allow its crew to run it up into a bunch of hungry rocks or into other ships (Stockhom-Andrea Doria).


They already do it with aircraft but that can lead to its own set of problems, witness the AirBus into the trees incident some years back. That was caused by a conflict between the captain and the computer.

Shades of HAL.


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## utchuckd (Apr 4, 2010)

lancelot9898 said:


> I've yet to understand how a ship takes on water from the port side and ends up listing to starboard. Having a hole on one side of the ship would I think cause the ship to list on that side, but then again the Taitanic seemed to stay level and sunk by the bow having impacted the iceberg on one side.


According to the special I saw on tv (Discovery Channel, I think), he struck the rocks on the port side while heading roughly north and continued on out to sea, turning away from the land, towards the east. As the water poured in it took out the diesel generators and the ship lost power, at that point the wind and current, from the northeast, brought it back to the island pushing the bow back south and grounding it on the rocks to starboard. So it is actually turned 180 degrees from where it was heading when it initially hit the rocks. Which bring up a couple of points, a) the Capt. didn't ground it close to shore to save lives, b) they were lucky as hell the wind and currents were going back toward the island cause that ship was going down, and it could've been in deep water.


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