# Teak Oil vs Varnish vs Cetol



## Cruiser2B

I have just sanded down my toe rails and companionway hatch and drop boards and applied a coat of teak oil. I am going to let that soak in and do it again later in the week. I like the way it looks now but I don't want it to go that gray color again. What are you all using? I do not mind some maintenance but refuse to spend all spring doing it! So tell me what you'll use and why. Please post pictures as I am curious to see what the different coatings look like after some time.

Again please post pics.... And why you chose the coating you did?

BTW I almost painted it! Almost!


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## mitiempo

The problem with teak oil is that it will turn darker and pick up dirt. Varnish looks best but it can turn into a career. Cetol natural - not the old type that turns orange over time - followed by Cetol gloss looks almost as good as varnish and is easy to keep looking good.


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## MarkCK

I don't have any pics but I will offer my opinion. I went with Varnish because I only have to touch it up once a year. Just lightly sand it down and reapply a couple of coats and you are good to go. Oils require more constant maintenence. In the winter I can redo the varnish on my hatchboards and do a quick touch up on the other parts in the early spring. If I had more area's that needed varnishing I would probably think aobut different options.

I am also in Missouri and keep my boat on the hard in the winter so I dont have as much UV damage as what you do in more southern locals. In Florida its a constant battle to keep your brightwork in Bristol fashion.


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## Gladrags1

As others said, teak oil will keep you working on your teak constantly, wearing off after a couple of weeks. Varnish looks good but if you are not diligent and let it go too long before re paring or if you get a chip in it, water can get under it. Once water gets under it, you need to remove it and redo it which can be very onerous. Cetol is the modern technology alternative. I like the look of the Cetol Natural (used to be called Armada but Cetol bought the company and made it their own) but I think regular Cetol is more of a classic look. It's a matter of opinion about which Cetol you choose. Don't simply choose Cetol Gloss as that doesn't have much UV protection as it is designed as a top coat for their base formulations.

If you need to touch Up Cetol it is easy to sand the area of damage and repair without redoing the whole boat. Good luck!


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## wingNwing

Gladrags1 said:


> As others said, teak oil will keep you working on your teak constantly, wearing off after a couple of weeks.


I haven't found this to be the case; wonder if its an old "truism" that's no longer true because of materials reformulation, just like "Cetol will turn your teak orange." We're using Starbrite tropical teak oil sealer, natural light, and after 2 years, wouldn't go back to varnish. Prep was about as much work as prepping for varnish but the application was considerably easier, i.e., more forgiving, no need to feather in, etc. I should point out, I think of varnish as a marathon project, yes you only do it once but it takes a pretty intense week or more (we have a LOT of teak). Personality-wise, we're more the light regular maintenance types; with teak oil if there is a spot needing touchup, its no prep, just an hour or so and you're done. I should also advise, we're not talking about 8 coats of hand-rubbed finish, and if that truly Bristol look is what you want, I really don't have any standing to comment. I want the teak to look decent and be protected, but don't want to be a slave to a glossy finish. If it doesn't make the boat safer or sail faster, it ain't that high on my priority list.  Especially when I could be out sailing, or sitting in the cockpit toasting the sunset.


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## JimsCAL

Teak oil will require applications several times a year to maintain the color. BUT it only takes a few minutes. A good wash every spring will get rid of the dirt and mildew that has built up. It's definitely the easy way to go if you don't like the weathered gray look.


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## Tanley

C2B,

This post shows our results using Cetol Natural followed w/ Cetol Gloss.

http://www.sailnet.com/forums/gear-maintenance/64513-cetol-results-photo-intensive.html

I refrained from doing the remaining teak on the boat as I wanted to see how the product held up over the first season. I was looking for any indication of yellowing or hints of orange tint. In addition to the pieces shown in the thread, I also finished the teak flag pole which I ended up mounting to our house to extend it's exposure to the elements. It was outside for the Summer and Winter of 2010 (New England). So far, I don't see any reason to complain or notice a degradation in the finish. I'll be working on the rest of the boat this Spring/Summer (shown below sanded and cleaned but not finished).


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## willyd

I've spent more time than I'd care to admit on redoing my toerails, and in a recent online search I came up with this "blog" that outlines a number of varnishing techniques: Varnish Teak: Varnish Or Cetol? The author actually suggests using regular yacht varnish, then Cetol Gloss as a topcoat to prevent UV damage. Click to see his other pages about thinning, etc.


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## deniseO30

cetol natural teak. the toe rail caps on my boat look great too but I don't have a close up of those.


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## SeaFever2000

Applied6-8 coats of Epifanes on my combing in 2009. Haven't touched it since - still looks as good as that.


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## Cruiser2B

tough decision, I do not mind a little bit of maintenance but sanding all the time is not what i have in mind.....i'd rather be sailing! the Cetol natural looks good....is that a 1-2yr deal? I will probably keep toe rails teak oil for sure....I may Cetol or Vanish companion way....Thanks for the pics everyone


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## MaryRoseErie

How do you prep the wood before teak or cetol? Do you just sand the heck outta it?


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## Gladrags1

It depends upon what's on it. If you have another finish (old Cetol, varnish, etc), it's got to come off first. If no finish, then clean the teak with a teak cleaner to get rid of the gray and black. Then sand to get smooth to eliminate any ridges. Then apply 4 - 5 coats of Cetol. I use 3 coats of the original plus 2 coats of the gloss for my 5 coats but you can substitute the Cetol light or natural for the regular. Just don't do 5 coats of the gloss. There's no UV protection in it. Then apply 1 - 2 topcoats every subsequent year or 2 for maintenance. If you get a chip or wear mark, simply touch up that spot, no need to take her back down to bare wood.


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## lancelot9898

Gladrags1 said:


> Don't simply choose Cetol Gloss as that doesn't have much UV protection as it is designed as a top coat for their base formulations.


I've had good luck with the natural cetrol having used the original cetrol for years which turns into a ugly dark brown as each annual maintenance coat is appled. The natural does not have this problem. One other note is that I started off not using the gloss over coat because of the apparent lack of UV protection however a couple of years ago I overcoated the cetrol with the gloss and it seems to hold up better with the gloss overcoat.


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## mitiempo

Cetol Gloss does have UV protection. If it did not it wouldn't last very long. From their website:


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## cktalons

This is all great information. I too have been seduced by the beauty of varnish, but have been warned of its nightmarish dedication. Looks like Cetol Natural is the way to go. Now I'm excited instead of dreading the moment! Thanks for starting this inspirational/informational thread.


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## RobGallagher

It's the taping that I hate. Do you have to tape when applying teak oil? Does it stain gel coat?

FWIW I use Cetol and have had very good results. My biggest problem is the maintaining it... did I mention I hate taping


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## baboon

I have used lots of varnish, cetol and teak oil. One issue with varnish is that sometimes keeping it up after the first 6 coats or so is not enough. Varnish will lift at seams (like where the toe rail is attached to gelcoat) or areas of damage, esp if your boat is older and the bedding compound is older too. Once it starts to lift, the only option is to take it all off. Cetol is not as good looking, but does not lift. The oils do take more frequent applications, so this year I plan to try Teak-Guard, which is supposed to last longer and not attract dirt. I will reserve judgement until I have a year of exeprience with it, but it is water based so taping is not be needed, I should be able to wipe of drips with a wet rag.


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## WouldaShoulda

Cruiser2B said:


> BTW I almost painted it! Almost!


Isn't there some kind of durable stain that would work??


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## JimsCAL

WouldaShoulda said:


> Isn't there some kind of durable stain that would work??


Cetol.


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## Minnewaska

Before using Cetol, I would strongly suggest trying to find a boat with it applied to be sure you like it. Some do, some really do not.


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## dhays

I like teak oil for some applications, but I wouldn't use it on toe rails. I'd stick with a two part finish or one part varnish.


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## T37Chef

*Depends, consider multiple types if teak care*

I am not anything close to a teak care expert, so take my comments for what they're worth 

I have been using three products for different applications. Below are some crappy photos of Cetol & Semco, I don't have one of the finished wheel using Epifanes. The pictures don't really do the finish justice.

*Cetol Natural followed by Cetol Gloss*; for toe rail, dorade boxes, grab rails. Easy to apply and maintain, but I don't find that it dries to a hard finish, see below. I apply 3 coats of natural followed by 3 coats of gloss, I have been getting about three seasons with just a coat of the gloss each spring.

*Semco Teak Sealer Natural*; for the teak cockpit seats, it retains the non skid characteristics of the teak but doesn't grey. This is more about safety than looks, but I like the look of Semco, but know it will not be glossy. I get about a season with 2-3 coats, very easy to apply. I'll take the teak home and apply over the winter since it is easily removed, or do it right on the dock, it dries quickly.

*Epifanes Woodfinish Gloss followed by Epifanes High Gloss Clear Varnish*; for my teak wheel, cockpit table, and will use it for the companion way teak trim and hatch boards when I refinish them. I like that it will cure to a fairly hard and durable finish, a good thing for those areas that see allot of traffic and abuse like the areas I described. Since it requires so many coats, all of those items can be easily removed and brought home for a winter project, with exception to the teak trim.

Cetol Natural & Gloss next to Semco Natural Teak Sealer

















Cetol & Gloss


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## DwayneSpeer

*Practical Sailor*

They just published their results of testing finishes after two years of being out in the sun in Florida. There were three classes of finishes tested: Varnish Alternatives (oils and Cetol), Varnishes, and Two Part finishes. The only finish that still looked good without retouching after two years were three of the six two part finishes. They ranked quite a few of the others as Fair or Fair +. So if you want to put on a finish and forget it for at least two years you are stuck with a two part system. The top rated one there, and the only one rated as excellent after two years was Interlux Perfection at $60 a quart kit.

Personally, I use Deks Olje. It allows me to put a fresh coat down without having to prep the surface other than wipe it down. I put one or two fresh coats on in the Spring and my bright work really shines. Unfortunately it isn't made any more but can still be found from some suppliers.


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## sterilecuckoo58

How do I bed wood trim on the fiberglass deck? Wingnwing confirms my original plan to oil every bit of wood on my Dad's ole boat. I have several of the pieces removed like the strips that keep my hatch down and some seemingly decorative bits ahead of the hatch, but behind the mast. They had been varnished (some polyurethane composition I am sure), and I wonder if I just oil the undersides, re-varnish the undersides, and whether I bed the wood in caulk like 3M 4200 or 5200 (in the latter case I will NEVER get it back off).

I also have to replace (ugh) the mahogany rub rails. I have the wood, but there seems to be plenty of rotted wood under the actual rail itself. Any suggestions are welcome.


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## mitiempo

Varnish all sides for protection and use 4200 or Sika Flex 291 to bed.


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## littlelizzy

Cetol seems to last much longer than varnish but it is more work to strip IMO.


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## JimM

Just finished scraping and sanding my toerails. I am thinking of trying teakguard next year. Then, if I do not like it, I can switch to Cetol without repeating the onerous prep. Does that sound like a decent plan?


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## MJBrown

Been using Teak Guard for a number of years and wouldn't switch. It's not the best on toe rails as it is water based and will wash out requiring a recoat in a couple of months time. But for cockpit seats and semi protected wood it works and looks great. I keep a damp rag handy to wipe up any drips that hit the gel coat. If you leave it it will be tough to remove. It leaves teak a very nice gold color. Something you can adjust by the number of coats you apply. Intially there's a slight sheen to it that some people dont care for. Personally I think you have to look to see it. BTW it does not turn black like oil does. If you try it and don't like it you can let it fade out and use something else.
Mike


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## mgiguere

We have found the best stuff for the wood....(sorry don't have pics). It is Teak Oil, but is called "Cabot Australian Timber Oil" (cabotstain.com). We have tried everything in the past 20 years (varnish, cetol, maringe teak oils, etc, etc.). This teak oil is Tung Oil based and, as a resuit, doesn't carbonize and turn the wood black...(like most marine teak oils we've tried.) We found it a Lowe's and tested a section of wood on the boat. We had sanded the wood down a couple of times to "restore" it, but this oil has worked very well....and it's not even a "marine" item. It can be cleaned up with water and has a nice finish.


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## MJBrown

mgiguere, it sounds interesting and something I might consider for the toe rails. I use Teak Guard in the cockpit but don't bother on the rails since it will wash out fairly quickly. How well does Cabots clean up if you get it on the gel coat? How well does it last on the toe rails?
Mike


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## RichH

Here are some pics of a 10 year old (!!!!) Honey Teak Job.

HT is a 2 part + 2 part that needs a fast 'maintenance clear coat' every 2 years.
HT is quite expensive and has a very high 'learning curve', it must be applied 'thick' or you can get UV damage and lifting. I flat-sand (2000 grit) and Powerbuff with a knobby foam pad and 3M Perfect-it about every other 2 years .... just how like you 'finish' a prime varnish job. Maintenance 'clear' coats are applied over a 'scuffed' (3M purple pad) surface. Id rather be sailing than being a slave to 'varnish'.
The decks are coated with SEMCO; the polished bronze is coated with HT clear.

Ive tried them 'all' over the years .... Cetol - eventually cracks, varnish - poor UV, multi-coat varnish systems with Interlux 'on top', Bristol - too fragile, 'resinated' oil - lasts a year then oxidizes and goes 'dark'. Although HT is the most expensive it amortizes over the years to be the absolute 'cheapest' because its so long lasting .... and my time is worth a lot. 
Honey Teak ... www.signaturefinish.com


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## backhandslicer

Anyone else have negative or positive thoughts about Cetol?
I welcome emails as well.
I live in New England and just bought an old Quickstep.
The varnished areas are shot and I plan to use a varnish remover and sand these down
to bare wood and then add Cetol. Open to another product.
Also curious about Zip Strip vs Circa 1850 Heavy Body vs 5F5 stripper.
Thanks,
David


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## Minnewaska

I had Cetol and disliked it very much. Cost me a grand to have it removed. Fake looking, flaked off, made a huge mess. Others disagree.

I like real varnish when exposed to water and UV. If you can keep exposure to a minimum, such as a cockpit with Bimini, I like the durability and ease of Bristol Finish.


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## Gladrags1

Depends upon the application. Cetol Natural (used to be Armada before Sikkens bought the company) is probably the best color of the Sikkens line-up. The original is very orangy and the light has too little UV protection. We had been using Original Cetol with clear gloss Cetol on top which provides a hard, clear coat on top of Cetol Original which is kind of soft. We used that combination as we have a lot of teak and we don't want to redo it all. The gloss flakes off of the Original but the Original alone is too soft and wears away too easily. 

We are now using Semco Goldtone and like it much better. It is thin and soaks in to the teak where Cetol sits on top. It seems to me that the teak will be protected better if the sealer soaks in to the wood. We are more pleased with the color of the wood but don't know how it will last. We need to put 4 coats on but since it goes on easily, that is no problem.

My thoughts are always on "what happens when the sealer or treatment needs to be reapplied?" My perception with Cetol is that it has to be sanded off, similar to varnish when it starts to degrade. Now it is EASIER to sand off than varnish but still... From my understanding, there is NO need for sanding Semco off. Time will tell but so far I am more pleased with Semco Goldtone (second highest UV protection in Semco color line up).


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## murphbmurph

On my Precision 185 all I have to redo is my tiller - suits my lazy lifestyle. 
What should I use to recoat the tiller? Polyurethane, cetol, varnish?


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## sterilecuckoo58

I was introduced to Sikkens by a motor yacht owner across the dock from my winter slip and we very much like the durable look of the finish in my compass box. Have now bought the quart of Natural Sikkens (We have mahogany, not teak) but have yet to crack the seal. Plan is to do it for all exterior wood.

Straight oil outside does not last so you need to do it frequently, which is okay if you have time, and if it didn't make a mess when it gets on the adjacent parts of the boat and dries there.

I am not sure how the Sikkens holds up under hand (and I won't find out unless I make me a nice wood tiller in my copious spare time). Inside it lloks good, but the mahogany cover on my stove scratches easily... I'll see in the next few weeks if oiling deals with the scratches and mellows nicely over time.


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## souljour2000

Okay..question for the gallery..I have literally a ton of teak work ahead of me on a 40-foot boat...coamings, drop-boards, toe-rails,dinette table,etc etc...If I do go to all the trouble of sanding and more sanding and then laying on maybe seven..yes,seven coats of a good Captain's varnish...yeah...I have heard 8 coats is better...yeah..well..question for someone who is hardcore and been there done that...how long is it going to be before I have to sand and re-coat? i have heard that UV will take out one or two coats per year..I live in SW Florida... so that is probably a certainly that 2 coats will have to be re-applied every year.....or maybe one coat every six months..maybe..I hear so many different approaches..but the hell if I am paying 50 bucks for a quart unless the company rep is coming out to lay it on...


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## smurphny

Having had plenty of boats with brightwork to maintain over the years, my theory is now not LOW maintenance but NO maintenance when it comes to teak. I rub a coat of Tung oil on it about once a year and happily watch it get gray. I like gray. It matches my hair which got that way in part fretting about what someone might think of my teak.


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## Minnewaska

I'm retreating too. Cockpit coaming and table are now the only brightwork on my boat. First year. I'm pretty happy with it. I'm focusing on cleaners now, more than finishes.


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## Flybyknight

*Strip - Epoxy - Varnish*

Bit the bullet. Scraped down to bare wood. Solvent wash; 2 coats of epoxy; 6 coats of traditional phenolic varnish; wax as needed.
2 years now and not a hint of degradation.
Dick










http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j19/tartansailor/Cape Dory/100_0294.jpg


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## biggles72

Cetol seems to have many thumbs up but i've heard very good things about Deks Olje D1 and D2
D1 is the Oil and sealer, D2 is the gloss. You can use D1 without D2 for a mat finish. Has anyone compared this to Cetol?

Here is a link.DEKS OLJE D1 - Saturating Wood Oil for Tropical Woods - Matte Finish


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## roverhi

In Hawaii oil turns to black mold in no time. Varnish is like a prison sentence requiring constant maintenance, with periodic wooding and starting over. Cetol has held up for several years without recoating but looks like crap from closer than 5' unless you're Dutch. Don't like the look of Cetol but it's the only thing that holds up with our tropical UV rays.


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