# cruising income



## mikieg (Oct 29, 2010)

i have noticed that when asked "how do people afford to cruise", there is always the standard, "cut back, save, live below your means, save, etc..". 
what i want to know is, what do cruisers do for renewable income while cruising?
i realize some write and sell articles and photos, some write music. but i wanna know, what trades do people do whilst cruising? i would imagine being a boat mechanic would prolly do the trick. what other things do folks do?
carpenter, plumber, electrician, etc? what kinds of barter are there?


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## neverknow (Feb 2, 2011)

We have often wondered the same thing. I'm guessing if anyone has a great idea they'd keep it to themselves.

Also is would depend greatly on where you are in the world. Some countries will not allow you to work. Maybe barter but not have a job for cash.


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## Christian Winkler (Jul 14, 2011)

*difficult....*

Hello Mikieg,

I met a lot of liveaboards before I settled down, and I remember mainly two types: 
The ones, who had financed everything in advance, or had permanent income without working, like for instance old-age pensioners.
And many ones who struggled. They had planned to make their living doing this and that while being on cruise, but in most cases this turned out to be hardly possible. You can find stuck and frozen sailors in many ports around the world.

Sorry having to say that, but I think it would be better to save enough money to survive at least one year *before* setting sails. And this includes reserves for boat repairs...


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## kd3pc (Oct 19, 2006)

agree with Chirstian,
you need to be truly independent to cruise long term. Many countries will not allow you to do work, with out the requisite paper work/visa/etc. even if they do, the locals will not co-operate if you are in competition with them, in any way.

You MAY find some expats who would hire you for your craft skills, but even those prefer to barter something back and save the hard cash for real events.

Some may get in to writing for a magazine, but even that pays next to nothing, unless you are at the top of the game, perhaps $50-70 a page, if you are lucky

Some go local and eat what the locals eat, others live on beans and rice, or rice and beans...

All I am saying is that if you suffer on land, you will suffer cruising...cruising solves nothing and may in some (many) instances test your ability and patience, daily.


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## Ajax_MD (Nov 24, 2009)

Disclaimer: *Clueless newbie alert*

As the disclaimer says, I don't know jack about long-distance cruising, but one thing I see a lot of on this forum, are people who show up thinking that they're going to sustain themselves through internet entrepenuership. Ie- blogging, Google Adsense, tech writing, writing fiction or non-fiction books, etc.

These people give me the feeling of those cheezy "Make millions working from home, on your own computer!" get-rich-quick advertisements. Yes, it's possible but you have to be really savvy, and offer something unique. I think ChrisnCate are doing this, but it's my understanding that they were engaged in this sort of employment long before they took up sailing and aren't jumping into "internet employment" blindly.

As for other means of employment, there's the visa/work permit issue that was mentioned above. It seems to me, that if you have to work to finance your long-term cruising desires, you need to have a serious, high-demand skill that you can parlay, and cruise the coasts of your home nation where work permits aren't an issue.

Diesel mechanics, sail repair, fiberglass work and sailing instruction (licensed of course) come to mind. I do know of a young couple that are successfully doing this, so I have a little insight, but not much.


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## JimMcGee (Jun 23, 2005)

BubbleheadMd said:


> Diesel mechanics, sail repair, fiberglass work and sailing instruction (licensed of course) come to mind. I do know of a young couple that are successfully doing this, so I have a little insight, but not much.


I can see where boat repair skills would be in demand, but I wonder how the locals would see it if you pulled into port and announced you were doing engine repairs. You're competing with local guys who're making their living doing the same thing.


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## Ajax_MD (Nov 24, 2009)

JimMcGee said:


> I can see where boat repair skills would be in demand, but I wonder how the locals would see it if you pulled into port and announced you were doing engine repairs. You're competing with local guys who're making their living doing the same thing.


It depends.

First, you could find a shop that has a large backlog and see if they're willing to hire you on. That eliminates the whole competition question. You may even improve their reputation if they have an image of a shop with poor service.

Second, if you pull into an area that has shops of poor reputation, then you're doing the local community a favor, and to hell with the hurt feelings of the local shops.

Lastly, if you pull into an area that has reputable shops, but they are heavily backlogged and still not interested in hiring you, then you're really not hurting anyone. Odds are, as a one-man shop, you wouldn't be siphoning off enough business to hurt anyone.

Your question really applies more if you pull into a foreign port and start putting the locals out of business. In the US, competition is expected and there's nothing wrong with it.


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## killarney_sailor (May 4, 2006)

From our experience cruising, just about everyone is living on money they already had. This varies enormously from people who are very well off to people with very little money and live accordingly - and are still having a great time. 

Even the wealthy people tend to eat the local foods - a) they are available and b) that is part of the fun. Also the local foods vary from the markets where the locals go (not supermarkets, but stalls under some sort of shelter) to the most incredible supermarket I have ever seen in Papeete. One thing to think about is that the cost of living varies hugely from place to place. Ecuador was probably the cheapest and French Polynesia the most expensive (except solar panels strangely). Generally the more advanced the country, the more expensive it is to live there - assuming in each case you are eating what the locals do. In many places you can fish and in some places fruit can be free (ask first).

As to earning money, I think that is really problematic in most situations. Generally cruisers help each other with repairs rather than charge for them. You might get a bottle of rum or something for helping but not an income. In a few places you can get permits to work - generally in wealthier places but can't count on it. A few people write, but not for sailing mags, they just don't pay enough to really matter. The people who do write had writing careers before starting out and just keep doing it. For example, we met a guy in Fiji who writes science-fiction novels and I have written a number of school textbooks that need to be updated every 5 to 6 years each. We met one woman who made jewelry with shells and materials she brought with her. She bought some black pearls in the Gambier islands so she could make more expensive items to sell - generally to other cruisers. It was more like a paying hobby I think.

On the brighter side, I think it is cheaper to cruise than many people think, especially if 
a) you don't switch countries too often - the government charges could kill a tight budget quickly. First time we went to the Bahamas and paid the $300 I was shocked, later on I would have been happy if it was just $300 per country. 
b) if you have a very simple boat and simple needs. We met one guying cruising on a Bristol 27 without an engine. He fished and collected coconuts and was living very cheaply indeed. When he was in American Samoa (he was American) he was hoping to work but had not found anything yet - he was very handy with computers and communications gear. Met another guy on about a 31' boat with two junk rigged masts (that were flagpoles) and no engine and a dugout canoe for a dinghy. He would occasionally take an adventurous person or two (thing backpackers) on a 'crewed charter' for a few weeks in Panama. Had been doing this for quite a few years happily.


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## smurphny (Feb 20, 2009)

killarney_sailor said:


> From our experience cruising, just about everyone is living on money they already had. This varies enormously from people who are very well off to people with very little money and live accordingly - and are still having a great time.
> 
> Even the wealthy people tend to eat the local foods - a) they are available and b) that is part of the fun. Also the local foods vary from the markets where the locals go (not supermarkets, but stalls under some sort of shelter) to the most incredible supermarket I have ever seen in Papeete. One thing to think about is that the cost of living varies hugely from place to place. Ecuador was probably the cheapest and French Polynesia the most expensive (except solar panels strangely). Generally the more advanced the country, the more expensive it is to live there - assuming in each case you are eating what the locals do. In many places you can fish and in some places fruit can be free (ask first).
> 
> ...


Can you give some examples of entry fees >$300? I've been planning some long distance cruising next year. My research, with piles of entry information, must be faulty because the Bahamas fee seems to be comparatively pretty steep. French Polynesia hasn expensive bond, but you get that back when you exit. Are there some surprises I'm not aware of? Would appreciate any specific info you have from your experiences.


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## travlin-easy (Dec 24, 2010)

I guess I must be very fortunate indeed. I've been saving for years, purchased the boat I wanted, which obviously beat the Hell out of the checking account and I have marketable skills that I can take with me.

In my case, I've been a freelance, outdoor writer for nearly 40 years, sold thousands of magazine and newspaper articles, and sold loads of photos to go with those articles. So, on every trip I record notes on my digital voice recorder, shoot lots of photos of nearly everything, then upon my return I query some of my editors to sell them articles.

Unfortunately, the print media business is rapidly falling apart, and most of the stuff you see on the internet is donated by those who wish to see their name in an article. Consequently, the freelance writing market is quickly coming to an untimely demise. Therefore, I must make do with my only, other marketable skill.

For the past 30 years I've also been an entertainer, a one-man-band singer/musician. I perform regularly at high-end restaurants, bars, retirement communities and private parties. This will be my primary source for generating an income during my upcoming, 7-month voyage down the ICW to the Florida Keys, then over to the Bahamas. 

I already have a couple jobs lined up in the keys where I believe I'll be able to do some horse-trading in the form of a couple nights of performing in exchange for a week of slip rent with electricity and water. If this works out OK, I'll use it at other locations as well.

The main problem associated with this is transporting my equipment. I have lots of room for it on the boat, but once I arrive at the dock then I have to make arrangements to transport it to the bar or restaurant. Now, if the job is a marina Tiki Bar, transportation is not a problem. But if the job is situated a fair distance from the boat, I may have to either rent a car or call a taxi-cab, both of which can be expensive.

The other problem is you cannot be anchored or on a mooring ball and bring the equipment to shore on a dinghy. It would be quite foolhardy to expose $7,000 in music equipment to some nut case in a jet ski or go-fast boat's wake. 

Hope to see some of you in the sunny south next November,

Gary


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## Ajax_MD (Nov 24, 2009)

You're in an interesting situation, with interesting challenges Gary. 

Do you think the local entertainment scene will get upset with you for intruding on their territory?


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## CarolynShearlock (Dec 3, 2010)

We cruised for six years and it's a problem for many. We knew a couple of cruisers who were trying to do it with investments -- except they weren't doing long term investments, they were trying to do market timing. That's a problem when internet connections are spotty. Others did canvas work, deliveries, under the table diesel or outboard work, etc. -- but nothing that was a reliable source of income. Some had rentals "back home" -- and that was a problem with property management. 

Others periodically went home and worked as temps -- particularly in the medical fields. Knew several nurses and one PA that did this -- it worked well, except for taking a year out of cruising and finding a place to leave the boat.

The bottom line is that there isn't a great way to earn money as you cruise -- some people have some skills that give them some extra money but few have something that works well as a steady income. Still, an extra $100 or $200 a month can go a long ways if you don't have a big boat payment or feel the need to stay in high-end marinas, etc.


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## jackdale (Dec 1, 2008)

BubbleheadMd said:


> You're in an interesting situation, with interesting challenges Gary.
> 
> Do you think the local entertainment scene will get upset with you for intruding on their territory?


Without getting political - think about how Americans respond to illegal workers. Do you think other countries would accept your taking employment away from residents?


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## travlin-easy (Dec 24, 2010)

BubbleheadMd said:


> You're in an interesting situation, with interesting challenges Gary.
> 
> Do you think the local entertainment scene will get upset with you for intruding on their territory?


In this particular industry, the entertainment biz, the lifespan of a job varies considerably. I know of a couple entertainers who work Baltimore's Little Italy and have been there for two decades. They worked 5-nights a week, but never worked Sunday or Monday nights. The club's owner decided that would be a good day to rotate some new performers through the restaurant/bar area, and I was one of them. After a single, Sunday night performance the owner asked if I would consider working every Sunday, which I did for the next two years.

In the Florida Keys entertainers are frequently seasonal, which translates to lower pay and a fair amount of competition. Therefore, I drove down to the keys last winter, checked out the nightly entertainment, then looked at the demographics. Key West, while always a jumpin' town, was geared primarily for the younger set, adolescent adults ranging in age from 21 to 45--not my kind of crowd (I'm an old guy.)

Marathon, Big Pine Key, Key Largo and several others seemed to cater to the older, more laid-back kind of crowds, which is where I fit in nicely. As our population ages there's an increasing demand for the entertainment I provide. An old friend and keys resident told me in no uncertain terms that if I decided to perform in the middle and lower keys I would have more jobs than I could handle.

In contrast, the head-banging rockers playing at ear-bleed volumes have a tendency to drive the older folks away--something restaurant and bar owners do NOT wish to do. Older folks have money, and they are willing to spend it in a place where they're having fun and dance.

Ironically, most performers in seasonal, resort areas tend to be transient, a bit younger, and not a bit concerned about an old guy coming to town. Some even look at me as a kind of father figure, often coming up to me on breaks and asking advice about various types of equipment.

I only want to work a couple nights a week, just enough to meet expenses and allow me to sail to places I've never been in a small boat. If the music jobs fall apart, I guess I'll have to survive on my Social Security and eat the fish that I catch while sailing to some really neat places.

Cheers,

Gary


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## killarney_sailor (May 4, 2006)

*Fees*



smurphny said:


> Can you give some examples of entry fees >$300? I've been planning some long distance cruising next year. My research, with piles of entry information, must be faulty because the Bahamas fee seems to be comparatively pretty steep. French Polynesia hasn expensive bond, but you get that back when you exit. Are there some surprises I'm not aware of? Would appreciate any specific info you have from your experiences.


We spent a season in the Eastern Caribbean and it was not too bad there with fees from zero (French Islands if you cleared at a government office, otherwise 3 or 5 euros) to the Bahamas. Only a few places were over $100. Some places have mandatory mooring use (which I can understand), Saint John and Nevis come to mind - I think they were something like $15 a night.

Heading west, the formerly Spanish countries are the worst. In Panama they knick you everything - entry, harbormaster's fees, quarantine charges, internal zarpes (to go between customs districts within the country), exit fees (external zarpe), health fees. We got a fine in Colon because the Port Captain in the San Blas signed our cruising permit rather than giving us the right form, although he did not charge us for his signature and the fine was less than the proper form would have cost. This reminded me of the cruising permit fee, the fee to the Kuna Indians and the fee to the five Kuna Indian municiplalities. All of these range from $5 to about $100, but in total it was probably $500 or so. Oops, forgot the mariner's visa which we did not pay but others who entered the country elsewhere did pay ($50/person). You get the idea.

In Ecuador you must have an agent. Also when you go to the Galapagos, which is part of Ecuador, you cannot get an internal zarpe, which you would need to go to Manta, Ecuador for example, but an external zarpe. When you get to the Galapagos (different agent) I (foolishly) thought he would do all the paperwork, like the guy in mainland Ecuador, but he just came onboard with seven (7!) officials and I did all the paperwork with them. The agent did get the external zarpe for us but to the Marquesas instead of Easter Island so we had to wait around for two days (including when the tsunami from Japan came) to get a new zarpe. This consisted of a new printout of the old zarpe on which they crossed out Marquesas and put in Isla Pascua, Chile. We asked them to do this with the orginal zarpe but they said they needed to print out a new one.

It is not only the Spanish places though. In Fiji they were starting to hit boats with a fumigation charge on top of all the others. We talked to a couple who had arrived directly from New Zealand and all their fees including the fumigation (a guy came on board with a little bug sprayer) was >$700. Even our friends in Aussie ding you. We paid for two one year, multi-entry visas ($105 each - no one can explain why Australia requires a visa for Canadians) and $330 for the quarantine charge - so there is $540 and that is Aussie bucks which are worth slightly more than the North American varieties.

If you go to On AiniA you can see what we spent from Florida to French Polynesia in six months. To that point we had spent $1773 for government fees (not including the canal) and less than $600 for fuel. By the time we got settled in Oz, we were close to $3000 for government fees over 10 months; in contrast we spent probably $700 on fuel and propane and that is paying quite high prices for these.

Edit - I noticed you mentioned the bond in FP. We signed up to the Pacific Puddle Jumpers group (free) and they had an arrangment with an agent in Tahiti, (very nice and helpful lady) where you paid them a fee and did not have to put up the bond. She also did entry/exit and arranged for duty-free fuel. The latter two you could do yourself but we did not know that at the time. It was convenient to do it this way. The bond is a pain since you have to make sure that the bank in Bora Bora or wherever you are leaving from has enough of the currency you paid so that you can get it back - you don't want to get it back in French Polynesian Francs since you will get killed on exchange in Fiji or wherever you can exchange them. Don't see why you can't put it on a credit card and get it back that way, but you can't. Also you do not get all your bond back since there are various bank fees and foreign exchange fees involved (the bond is FPFs so if you pay in US dollars there are two foreign exchange charges). You can also avoid the bond if you buy a (refundable) air ticket from Papeete to somewhere in your own country for each person onboard. This can really be a lot of money to have tied up.

Hope this helps, I wish someone explained this to me before I went, would have saved a lot of hassle (but probably not much money).


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## Ajax_MD (Nov 24, 2009)

jackdale said:


> Without getting political - think about how Americans respond to illegal workers. Do you think other countries would accept your taking employment away from residents?


Jack,

A few posts back, I covered this. I do _not_ approve of sailors cruising into foreign ports and intruding upon local businesses.

I _do_ think it's acceptable within one's own country. IE "coastal" cruising.


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## travlin-easy (Dec 24, 2010)

jackdale said:


> Without getting political - think about how Americans respond to illegal workers. Do you think other countries would accept your taking employment away from residents?


First and foremost, I would be legal, regardless of where I traveled. Traveling to another nation without proper documentation and paying all fees, IMHO, is akin to invading that nation. And, anyone that does this should be prepared to suffer the consequences. Keep in mind there are lots of foreign entertainers who travel to the U.S. to perform, and they're not displacing anyone's job. No one complained about The Beetles, Enrico Pavaratti, Caruso, and a host of other performers that struck it rich in the U.S. show biz market. In fact, they were a boom to the U.S. economy.

As an entertainer, we don't take jobs away from other entertainers. Each is somewhat unique, and each successful entertainer I know actually creates jobs--even for other entertainers. For example, if I provide the restaurant/bar owner with increased profit, he or she will more than likely explore the possibility of expanding the number of days or nights they have entertainment for the customers. And, if they diversify their forms of entertainment, this would likely lead to an increased customer base, thus translating into more jobs for allied service personnel.

If you wish to get an idea of the entertainment I provide, you can go to http://psrtutorial.com/perf/garyDiamond.html and click on the Jukebox player or individual song. These are not high-quality recordings--just quick, digital recordings that I use to monitor my performances and develop ways to improve what I do.

Cheers,

Gary


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## jackdale (Dec 1, 2008)

Gary

Even The Beatles required a visa



> There are various categories (called classifications) of nonimmigrant visas for a person who wishes to work temporarily in the United States, based on U.S immigration laws, specifically the Immigration and Nationality Act. If you want to work in the U.S. temporarily, under immigration law, you need a specific visa based on the purpose of your travel and type of work you will be doing. To learn more, please see United States Citizenship and Immigration Service's (USCIS) Working in the U.S. webpage.
> 
> Review Temporary Workers on the USCIS website for more detailed information about each category, petition procedures and eligibility for each type of temporary worker below. See Employer Information on the USCIS website for information about the numerical limit CAP count, e-Verify, and more. There are annual numerical limits on some visa types, which are shown in parentheses below.





> P-1 Individual or Team Athletes, or Members of an Entertainment group that are internationally recognized (25,000);
> P-2 Artists or Entertainers who will perform under a reciprocal exchange program;
> P-3 Artists or Entertainers who perform under a program that is culturally unique; and
> Q-1 Participants in an International Cultural Exchange Program for the purpose of providing practical training, employment, and the sharing of the history, culture, and traditions of the alien's home country.


Temporary Worker Visas

As a sailing instructor, I do not take my students into the San Juan Islands.


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## jackdale (Dec 1, 2008)

BubbleheadMd said:


> Jack,
> 
> A few posts back, I covered this. I do _not_ approve of sailors cruising into foreign ports and intruding upon local businesses.
> 
> I _do_ think it's acceptable within one's own country. IE "coastal" cruising.


Sorry missed it -late into the thread.


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## kwaltersmi (Aug 14, 2006)

kd3pc said:


> Some may get in to writing for a magazine, but even that pays next to nothing, unless you are at the top of the game, perhaps $50-70 a page, if you are lucky


While only a lucky few can support themselves on writing alone, my experience has been that you can make a decent monthly cruising income from writing and photography, and typically more than $50-$70 per page if you're good. I'm sure Gary can attest to this.

Additional money can be made online while cruising if you've got web design skills or on a high traffic website with quality content.


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## travlin-easy (Dec 24, 2010)

I don't intend on performing in the Bahamas or Mexico, however, if I were I would procure the migrant worker visa before doing so. 

I can, and have performed aboard vessels, and even if they are foreign flagged, I am not required to obtain a worker visa. The vessel's corporation provides for this, even when the vessel is berthed in foreign waters.

In the Florida Keys as a U.S. citizen, I do not need anything other than my driver's license as proof of citizenship, but I carry my passport aboard my boat when I'm sailing outside U.S. territorial waters.

Hope to see many of you down in the keys next November,

Gary


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## travlin-easy (Dec 24, 2010)

$50 to $70 a page? Most magazines and newspapers pay by the article and per photo used. Feature stories, 800 to 1,500 words plus a couple top-quality photos, in a national publication, usually brings anywhere from $600 to $1,200 for the article/photo package. If you are lucky enough to get a cover photo, you could pick up another $1,200 to $1,500 from the top publications. 

Newspapers pay far less, but if you pick up a regular column you could earn $500 a week for a single, weekly article of 800 to 1,200 words, plus a couple photos.

Some regional magazines will pay about the same as newspapers, but local magazines, those that cover a single state usually pay about half that.

Good Luck,

Gary


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## mikieg (Oct 29, 2010)

BubbleheadMd said:


> Jack,
> 
> A few posts back, I covered this. I do _not_ approve of sailors cruising into foreign ports and intruding upon local businesses.
> 
> I _do_ think it's acceptable within one's own country. IE "coastal" cruising.


we will have to let these other sailors know that bubblehead does not approve. i am sure they will consult him for his blessing next time!

travelineasy, so this person that said "that article writers make next to nothing on their work", is talking about a field that he obviously knows nothing of?


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## travlin-easy (Dec 24, 2010)

mikieg said:


> we will have to let these other sailors know that bubblehead does not approve. i am sure they will consult him for his blessing next time!
> 
> travelineasy, so this person that said "that article writers make next to nothing on their work", is talking about a field that he obviously knows nothing of?


I made a pretty good living as a freelance writer for more than 35 years. I was able to purchase a home, support my family, put some money in the bank, and buy a couple boats. At one point I wrote for more than two-dozen publications, some of which you may recognize. The largest newspaper in which I had a weekly column was the Washington Post Weekend Section. I also provided special feature sections for the Baltimore Sun and York Dispatch. Some of the magazines included: Game & Fish, Outdoor Life, Saltwater Sportsman, Field & Stream, The Fisherman Magazines, Ira Black's Noreaster, Chesapeake Bay Magazine, Mariner, and a large number of smaller publications. None of them paid by the page. They all based their pay scales on word count and photos. Now, there may be a publication out there that pays their writers per page, but I just don't know who they are.

It's obvious, at least to me, that most print publications are on thin, financial ice. The page count is much lower than any time I can recall, the number of advertisers has fallen substantially, and the paper quality, with few exceptions, has been degraded to make up their shortfalls. Blogs, which are mostly free, have taken displaced much of the print media space. Additionally, the cost of mailing, which is a major component in the publishing worlds overhead cost, has risen by an alarming rate during the past decade. The increased cost has been passed along to the consumer, which adversely impacts the circulation.

For me, at 71 years of age, I'm still making a good living as an entertainer, but as a freelance writer I'm down to just a few publications now. I guess as long as I can still sing, play my keyboard, and keep audiences on the dance floor I'll still have work. I just got home from a dinner music performance, the person there that books the music jobs wants to book me for Valentines Day, but ironically, that date was booked nearly a year ago. I just wish I were 20 years younger so I could work, and sail, more than I currently do now. 

Cheers,

Gary


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## aeventyr60 (Jun 29, 2011)

smurphny said:


> Can you give some examples of entry fees >$300? I've been planning some long distance cruising next year. My research, with piles of entry information, must be faulty because the Bahamas fee seems to be comparatively pretty steep. French Polynesia hasn expensive bond, but you get that back when you exit. Are there some surprises I'm not aware of? Would appreciate any specific info you have from your experiences.


If you make it to Malaysia you will find that there are no entry fees, light fees, visa fees, quarantine fees, mooring fees, anchoring fees etc. 90 day visa granted free upon arrival. Easy to go to Singapore for a day to renew your visa. Also can sail to Thailand, Borneo, Philippines.

Last night we had a "FREE" dinner with Malaysian prime minister in Penang as part of the Chinese New Year Celebrations.

Keep heading West!


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## neverknow (Feb 2, 2011)

aeventyr60 said:


> If you make it to Malaysia you will find that there are no entry fees, light fees, visa fees, quarantine fees, mooring fees, anchoring fees etc. 90 day visa granted free upon arrival. Easy to go to Singapore for a day to renew your visa. Also can sail to Thailand, Borneo, Philippines.
> 
> Last night we had a "FREE" dinner with Malaysian prime minister in Penang as part of the Chinese New Year Celebrations.
> 
> Keep heading West!


Hoping I don't high jack this thread here, but are you on the hook, mooring or in a slip most of the time? What kinds of mooring/slip fees are you paying? What's the cost of living like for you?


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## aeventyr60 (Jun 29, 2011)

neverknow said:


> Hoping I don't high jack this thread here, but are you on the hook, mooring or in a slip most of the time? What kinds of mooring/slip fees are you paying? What's the cost of living like for you?


Mostly on the hook.

While I was commuting to Japan by 777, Aeventyr was in a resort marina(pool, golf cosre, tennis courts, restaurants, bar etc. I paid a year in advance and it worked out to 150 bucks a month.

Slip fees vary between the government run (Jabatan Laut) marinas and private concerns. As little as $130 bucks a month including power and water. Now in Penang it's $240 a month. Up in Langkawi (AKA-God's waiting room) it probably is closer to $400 a month, supply and demand. Thai marina;s up in Phuket are in the 350-400 bucks a month range.

Many, many good places to anchor. Boat projects here for another 2 weeks and then will cruise Langkawi and Thailand for the next 5 months.

Cost of living, can be really cheap. Dinner about 8-10 bucks for 2, no booze. Lunch $5-6 and brekki 3-5, eating like locals of course.

Langkawi is a duty free port, so beer is 8 bucks a case, Stoli 9 bucks a liter, Some gin and vodka as low as 6 bucks a liter. Diesel is $2.20 a gallon. we can buy fresh fruit and veggies for 2 weeks around 20-30 bucks.

500 bucks a month goes a long, long way.....

Maybe you should consider buying a small boat in Langkawi or Singapore? Plenty of decent boats around. Easy cruising.


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## neverknow (Feb 2, 2011)

Do you speak the local language? We only know English and some can argue we are not good at that either...lol Do you think we'll have a problem?

What resort did you have your boat at for $150/mo?

BTW We thank you for the information, do you have a blog or web site?


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## neverknow (Feb 2, 2011)

Do you speak the local language? We only know English and some can argue we are not good at that either...lol Do you think we'll have a problem?

What resort did you have your boat at for $150/mo?

BTW We thank you for the information, do you have a blog or web site?


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## neverknow (Feb 2, 2011)

Sorry for the double post, We are having problems with the web site or our ISP tonight???


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## aeventyr60 (Jun 29, 2011)

neverknow said:


> Do you speak the local language? We only know English and some can argue we are not good at that either...lol Do you think we'll have a problem?
> 
> What resort did you have your boat at for $150/mo?
> 
> BTW We thank you for the information, do you have a blog or web site?


English widely spoken here. Our bahasa Malaysia getting better all the time. A few words of the local lingua franca works wonders anywhere.. You would be just fine. Folks here very kind, somtimes it;s better to not understand too much.

No, I won't divulge the secret spots on the internet. You gotta earn it/sail it to get the rewards.

No blog/website, best to keep this stuff close, not out to fill any bucket list, our dream, our way, our time.

Hope you can keep your dream alive..not any thing like the shop of horrors you've been reading about...

Best you get a small boat and a suitcase of money...

Cheers!


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## Ajax_MD (Nov 24, 2009)

mikieg said:


> *we will have to let these other sailors know that bubblehead does not approve. i am sure they will consult him for his blessing next time!*
> 
> travelineasy, so this person that said "that article writers make next to nothing on their work", is talking about a field that he obviously knows nothing of?


Uh Mik, I was only answering Jackdale's question. It's merely my opinion and it's worth what you paid for it. No need for the snark.

All I was trying to say, is that I think it would be rude to cruise into a foreign port, and try to undercut the local, legitimate businesses by working "under the table", and without a work visa.

On the other hand, cruising within your own nation's boundaries and finding work is no different than selling your house, loading up a U-haul truck and finding work in a different state or county.


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## aeventyr60 (Jun 29, 2011)

All I was trying to say, is that I think it would be rude to cruise into a foreign port, and try to undercut the local, legitimate businesses by working "under the table", and without a work visa.


Many times the locals lack the skills, tools, parts, motivation and knowledge to get a job done..so in steps a more qualified person, visa or not, kinda of what's happening in the us of a. Rude? No. Just life on the edge. A bit of real life Darwinism.


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## mikieg (Oct 29, 2010)

aeventyr60 seems to be speaking from real world boots on the ground experience.

sorry to burst your bubble, bubble head.


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## RobGallagher (Aug 22, 2001)

aeventyr60 said:


> All I was trying to say, is that I think it would be rude to cruise into a foreign port, and try to undercut the local, legitimate businesses by working "under the table", and without a work visa.
> 
> Many times the locals lack the skills, tools, parts, motivation and knowledge to get a job done..so in steps a more qualified person, visa or not, kinda of what's happening in the us of a. Rude? No. Just life on the edge. A bit of real life Darwinism.


And in many countries working without a valid work permit/visa can land you in jail, deported or even blacklisted.

Travel to many countries with favorable US$ to local currency exchange rates and low costs of living and you will find US/UK/EURO/AUSSIE types walking around drunk, barefoot and half crazed. They lived the dream for too long. Now they are too poor to stay, too poor to leave.


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## mikieg (Oct 29, 2010)

ok, lets narrow this down considerably. does anyone here have any real world experience on this? tired of hearing speculation and "my grand paw said". lets hear from those that have actually worked abroad or have been jailed or deported or "blacklisted" (what ever that is).


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## Brent Swain (Jan 16, 2012)

It used to be easy for any British subject ( Canadian) to work in New Zealand. I did , but the wages were abysmal.


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## aeventyr60 (Jun 29, 2011)

mikieg said:


> ok, lets narrow this down considerably. does anyone here have any real world experience on this? tired of hearing speculation and "my grand paw said". lets hear from those that have actually worked abroad or have been jailed or deported or "blacklisted" (what ever that is).


Yes, several times, in different countries and professionally in a suit and tie, other times as a means to survive. Some times with the blessings of the locals and sometimes not. 
Being low key about what your doing helps a lot. Actually it's nobody else's business how or where I make a living.

I have been an immigrant as well. Let me tell you, the sort of discrimination that goes on in the USA is alive and well in other places. You don't get to start at the top out here either, Even if you have an education, skills, work experience and money.

The one thing I have seen and experienced, no matter where I've been, is that if you WANT TO work and make your crust you can. Never, ever a shortage for those willing to work.

Never been deported, hassled, blacklisted or prevented from coming and going. Just how you play the game.


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## RobGallagher (Aug 22, 2001)

mikieg said:


> ok, lets narrow this down considerably. does anyone here have any real world experience on this? tired of hearing speculation and "my grand paw said". lets hear from those that have actually worked abroad or have been jailed or deported or "blacklisted" (what ever that is).


I spend about 6 weeks (coldest weeks here in New England) a year in Asia/S.E. Asia, but, I can't work because it's against the law. I know people who work in that area, both with a work visa and without. Pay sucks without and you risk deportation and time in jail while you await deportation.

Blacklisted means that you cannot return to a country. Working without a permit could get you blacklisted. Some countries will blacklist you if you are found overstaying your visa. The USA may bar reentry for up to 10 years for overstaying a visa (technically not a blacklist but that's a long time).


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## dieselboy (Aug 29, 2009)

This is a topic i have looked at long and hard. As for long distance sailing i have not done but i have made $ or traded my services " i am a heavy Diesel mech" on land in places i have been just traveling. Even extending my stay for weeks at resorts because there is a world wide shortage of good Diesel techs. That said. i would never bank on the fact i could find work while out of the country. Even with my skill level and experience. 
Beans and rice it is and what you can make use a bonus time.


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