# Go Now, Go Small – For Real?



## scubadoo (Apr 5, 2014)

Ok, for the last 10 years I’ve been slowly, very slowly, getting closer to being a full-time cruiser. I’ve sailed everything from Sunfish, lasers, and Hobbies to keel boats from 20’ to 42’. For the past 4 years I’ve solely been sailing our 31’ Tartan.

My wife and I have been on some long-ish (30 to 60 day) cruises in the Keys. We always planned on selling our Tartan 31 (and our car, condo, small arms collection, tuba, etc.) and moving on to a slightly larger sailboat, something in the 36’ to 42’ range. But, after a year of being up for sale on Yachtworld, we have not had 1 offer (and only 3 showings)!

Today we’re saying to ourselves “well, if we go now on our Tartan, we’ll have lots of chips in the kitty and we know her inside and out”. “Not to mention almost everything on her has been replaced in the last 4 years, including the engine mounts and transmission”, she said.
Or, we could go now, taking out a mortgage, on a larger sailboat which, after paying for repairs, upgrades, a bigger dinghy (of course) and taxes (also of course) would leave us with a much smaller cruising kitty. And, I’d have to work full-time, while on board, for another 3 years to pay off the mortgage. This might not sound hard if you enjoy "parking it" in one spot for months at a time, but we're not that way. Could be ADHDx2? Could be lousy neighbors? I think the longest we've stayed at one anchorage or marina is 7 days, 10 days max! Planning the for the next leg, weather routing, provisions and maintenance while working full-time is not as much fun as it sounds!

Here's where I hope the more experienced (seasoned) cruisers, veteran sailors, and even the trolls sound off on what they chose (or would choose) and why. 

GO!

Thank you


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## KayakerChuck (May 4, 2017)

If the Tartan will take you where you want to go in reasonable safety and acceptable comfort...

Taking out a mortgage before going cruising is my idea of a nightmare.


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## cthoops (Apr 30, 2012)

We’ve been cruising full-time up and down the U.S. East Coast and the Bahamas for four years on our Bristol 29.9, so you have 1 foot more than we do. We did a complete refit before we left, know her inside and out, and have reaped those benefits. Would we get a bigger boat if we could? Sure, but not if it meant a mortgage, working full-time, etc. 

Only you two can say for sure if you can happily cruise full-time on your Tartan, but it certainly can be done - and is being done - by people with smaller boats.


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## Zemurray (Oct 28, 2018)

Nice boat. Seems priced well. I can’t believe no one has looked at it. I made an offer on a Tartan 31 in Texas a few years ago, ended up backing out due to a poor survey. 

We have a Tartan 28 that we’ve spent several weeks on at a time but not more than a month. I think I could do just fine on the 31 for extended living. Personally I think it would depend on how far you are going, what you want to take with you, and what your willing to live without. That said, I’m with the others. Taking a loan out doesnt sound fun. And depending on where you go, insuring it might be a bit of a hassle as well.


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## oldmanmirage (Jan 8, 2022)

Go ! Go now !!!


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## MarkofSeaLife (Nov 7, 2010)

Where's your intended cruise? 

31 foot is fine if you are contained in your lifestyle enough to not carry junk. 

My boat never did until Marjorie cambered abord with more possessions than a pirates treasure trove. 

We are currently (!) doing electrical work so here is all our cruising kit in the saloon. Except for the mainsail it's all human dépendant not boat size dependant. In other words where are you going to put all this in a 31 footer? 










If your intended cruise is full time living and cruising then you probably need to take some personal things with you. 

Marjorie has 2 very large boxes (as well as her normal wardrobe and large suitcase) : a large clothes box and a large toy box. The latter has her painting, crafts and artistic junk. I can barely lift it. And her guitar. 

My advice is to start with nothing. And don't add anything. Even then more junk will magically appear. 

My advice is to Go Now. But I'll add an addendum: *Go Now Take Nothing*. 

Mark


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## Slayer (Jul 28, 2006)

Sounds like you have already overcome the biggest obstacle that many face; your spouse/mate is more than willing to go with you. If you are both willing to go with what you got, just do it. If it doesn’t work out you can fall back on plan B and take out the mortgage for a bigger boat.


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## OntarioTheLake (4 mo ago)

Car plus condo plus small arms collection should easily bridge the gap to a 36-41’ boat. 

the market for 30ish foot boats, and definitely small arms, is still hot. We sold the C30TR for way more than we could have got pre COVID. Sold one firearm, and voila 37’ boat for “free”.

You may want to think about unloading while selling prices are still high.


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## Skipper Jer (Aug 26, 2008)

A tuba? Gotta take the tuba. You will be the hit at a cruiser beach party. As you said, a larger boat would require a loan and you working. Free yourself from the chains of the bourgeoisie, go with what you know and have. Little boat, little problem. Big boat, big problem and bigger expenses. Equip your boat with a windvane, water maker, solar, and go now.


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## VIEXILE (Jan 10, 2001)

MarkofSeaLife said:


> Where's your intended cruise?
> 
> 31 foot is fine if you are contained in your lifestyle enough to not carry junk.
> 
> ...


Juilo Christmas! That's an unfortunate, albeit very familiar, sight.


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## vbiz59 (3 mo ago)

Well we made the move from a C25 which I consider a day-sailor to a K-38 for little out of pocket and a bunch of elbow grease. As we prepare to set off the question is "What can we take with us" The answer seems to be "little more than we need to survive" and seriously considering what comforts are "must haves" For me it's close to a couple bathing suits, something warm, a bowie knife, fishing gear and some tools, but even that list is growing in my mind as I write this. My mate has needs,,, maybe I can get tow-behind walk-in closet, and we'll see what we can tow behind that


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## MarkofSeaLife (Nov 7, 2010)

VIEXILE said:


> Juilo Christmas! That's an unfortunate, albeit very familiar, sight.


It begins to get to be a breach of safety if one carries too much. 
Neatly stowed in the aft cabin it all fits with space to spare. But if I need to get to the propellor shaft, fuel tank, or batteries then half must be removed. If one cannot _easily_ lift each box then if done at night in bad weather in an emergency it becomes dangerous. 

One must be quite serious about storage space. I can't live with 3 T-shirts and one pair of undies. That might be fine for a summer but when you LIVE on a boat for life you need extras... Plus a suit for formals Etc. Tools, expendables - glues, resins, sandpapers, varnishes, paints etc, engine filters etc etc... I do collect some spares... A $400 water pump I will never need but throw away $400? Nope. 

So one needs to be cognisant that it's not a weekend away. A boat is a complicated multi-function series of engineered pieces that need stores... but so to are we 🤔😊😊😊

Mark


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## JohnBPrice (Aug 10, 2014)

Go now, work full-time, while on board, for another 3 years to save enough to buy the boat you want with no mortgage.


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## MikeOReilly (Apr 12, 2010)

Of course you can go with Tartan 31. It is small compared to what most leave with these days, but if you were back in the 1970s, a 30-footer was considered a Big Boat. As far as I know, humans haven't changed that much, although societal expectations certainly have. So yes... you can go with your 31-footer, IF you are willing to live with a smallish space.

I am surprised you're having so much trouble selling, or finding a 36 to 42 footer that suits your needs and budget.


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## scubadoo (Apr 5, 2014)

Wow! Thank you all for the amazing comments and insights. 

I was thinking about posting the same question to another, slightly more filled with salty curmugeons, forum just to get at least one soul to tell me I'm out of my mind! 

I've been "pairing down" for years, came down to Florida with only what I could fit in my VW Golf. You'd be surprised at just how much one could stuff in such a vehicle, I know I was.

In the last 4 years I've somehow accumulated so much "necessary" junk that it overflowed my small condo. Now I have a 20' storage unit that houses the rest - and I thought I was being "good" about not "collecting" (hoarding) unnecessary junk. 

No worries though, the condo is almost purged and the storage unit will soon be too.

Mark, Thanks for the photo! Add a small dog to that pile and it would look very familiar!

We've considered pulling the cushions out of the V and quarter births just so we have more room for storage containers (while still trying to keep the bow light enough to point well).

My better half was up at 3:00 in the morning reading through the comments above and telling me we can do it, we should do it. At 53, climbing K2 has been sourly scratched off my bucket list. Crossing items off of your bucket list because of age, health, family, or financial reasons can be heartbreaking. Cruising full-time, even just up and down the U.S. east coast and Bahamas should provide enough fodder for the nursing home!

As many suggested, what's the worse that could happen, we find we need a bigger boat (to elude wearing white coats with funny sleeves) and go back to work to save for a bit longer.

So we're doing it! The condo goes on the market February 1, 2023. If it closes two months later, we'll get a head start on the "windy" (ie., hurricane) season and hopefully be 1/4 of the way to Chesapeake before June 1.

Keep the inspiration coming! Has anyone found water-tight storage containers that come in different sizes for those sweaters, socks and long johns we'll need for at least a month each year?

Does anyone belong to the SSCA? Is that still a thing?


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## MikeOReilly (Apr 12, 2010)

The process of moving out of our last land home took us many months. Even though we only ever lived in small homes (less than 1000 sq ft.), it's still amazing what one accumulates. And it was surprisingly hard to get rid of... not emotionally, just physically. 

We sold a lot of the good stuff directly over Kijiji (Canada's answer to Craig's List). Then we had a big yard sale that got rid of a lot of the rest. We finally made a big donation to a local charity second-hand store. All this took a lot longer than I'd expected.

We did decide to keep some family keep-sakes, and a core bunch of household items so we could set up house quickly if our boat sank, or we decided a watery life was no longer fun. This we store in a storage trailer kept on a friend's farm (for free).

And I get you with the amount of stuff that goes into a small car. About 1/2 our time is spent on our boat, and the other doing other things. We travel around in a Honda Fit, so our land life has to "fit" in this little car. Certainly makes you aware of what you need, and what can live without.

Storage containers: There are lots out there. One which we've used are various pet food containers. These are the screw-on types, like this: Vittles Vault Dog Food Container | PetSmart. They come in various sizes and shapes, and have proven to be completely air-tight.

I did join the SSCA for a few years. I left because it wasn't relevant to my cruising style; not really into the group thing I guess. But if you are, then it's worth checking out.


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## capta (Jun 27, 2011)

I knew of a Japanese teen that sailed from Japan to Frisco on a 19 foot plywood day sailor. Jean‐Yves Terlain and raced his 128‐ foot schooner Vendredi 13 across the Atlantic.
For me, it is all about comfort when sailing long distances. If a boat is too small, then even the amount of water one can carry makes the voyage less pleasant. I hate water rationing. I hate food rationing. I hate not having enough spares to get myself out of trouble. I hate not having dry clothes and a dry place to sleep. 
I did enough of that when I was young.
To each his or her own though, I suppose...


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## MarkofSeaLife (Nov 7, 2010)

If I run out of money at 80 years old I will open doors at Walmart. The years before then are too valuable to waste working.


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## Don L (Aug 8, 2008)

I feel far as the orginal question goes

If you feel it is possible to do that you asked strangers on a forum then the answer for YOU is yes. I only know twp boats that size being cruised on. One of them already posted and the other is people in mid 20s and they are really mostly liveaboards.


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## scubadoo (Apr 5, 2014)

Thank you for the container idea Mike!

Capta, Funny you should mention having dry clothes. That's one of the top items that come up during our bigger boat discussion / wish list - what to do with wet clothes when it's been raining for a week. Typically we hang them in the head, but when that gets crowded they hang in the salon. Which get also gets crowded quickly. We do have a dedicated wet locker, but it's usually filled with dry clothes and boots. That will have to be re-evaluated.


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## cthoops (Apr 30, 2012)

scubadoo said:


> Keep the inspiration coming! Has anyone found water-tight storage containers that come in different sizes for those sweaters, socks and long johns we'll need for at least a month each year?
> 
> Does anyone belong to the SSCA? Is that still a thing?


Good for you! One of the hardest steps, regardless of boat size, is to decide to go.

We got rid of the cushion in our quarterberth. It’s our garage and there’s more room for items without the cushion.

As for storing cold weather gear, we have about 8-10 bags from Eagle Creek that we keep all of our clothes in. They are like vacuum bags but are reusable and you don’t need a vacuum. They are great space savers.

As for SSCA, we used to be members but decided we weren’t getting enough value for the money. YMMV.

We spend summers in Southern New England and try to head south beginning around Labor Day. If you get up there this summer or have small boat specific spots questions, don’t hesitate to reach out.


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## MikeOReilly (Apr 12, 2010)

cthoops said:


> We got rid of the cushion in our quarterberth. It’s our garage and there’s more room for items without the cushion.


You’re a genius! Now that I read this out loud I think to myself, “Why haven’t I done this a long time ago!?!” 

Sorry for the slight thread drift, but this is why I love coming here. You never know when someone will mention a great idea … and show what a dunce I’ve been .


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## scubadoo (Apr 5, 2014)

cthoops said:


> We spend summers in Southern New England and try to head south beginning around Labor Day. If you get up there this summer or have small boat specific spots questions, don’t hesitate to reach out.


Thank you! Hoping to make it to Chesapeake in 2023, but might make it further in 24. 



cthoops said:


> One of the hardest steps, regardless of boat size, is to decide to go.


Early this morning, as I realized I had run out of excuses, I was literally scared sh*tless. The absolute number one thing I was afraid of had nothing to do with sailing, cruising, storms, sea monsters or the size of our boat. It was handing in my resignation letter. All these years that I've sat behind a desk and now I was paralyzed at the thought of leaving my job behind. Whiskey, Tango, Foxtrot? I've always been a proponent for change. Encouraging others to follow their dreams...now faced with the reality of resigning, my stomach was churning. Took about 6 hours, but I'm over it! At least until I'm actually handing over the letter to my boss.


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## Kormak (1 mo ago)

scubadoo said:


> Ok, for the last 10 years I’ve been slowly, very slowly, getting closer to being a full-time cruiser. I’ve sailed everything from Sunfish, lasers, and Hobbies to keel boats from 20’ to 42’. For the past 4 years I’ve solely been sailing our 31’ Tartan.
> 
> My wife and I have been on some long-ish (30 to 60 day) cruises in the Keys. We always planned on selling our Tartan 31 (and our car, condo, small arms collection, tuba, etc.) and moving on to a slightly larger sailboat, something in the 36’ to 42’ range. But, after a year of being up for sale on Yachtworld, we have not had 1 offer (and only 3 showings)!
> 
> ...


31' sounds like plenty in my opinion, especially if you have trouble selling it to switch to something bigger.


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## joethecobbler (Apr 10, 2007)

Why does it have to be "all or nothing"?
I've got a couple places up and down the east coast USA that I've found work for me at certain times throughout the year.
They're waterfront or very close and are places to store/do repair work/spend time ashore. 
Some locations are owned, others leased or rented.
I don't want to carry aboard everything I feel I need in life like vehicles and motorcycles and specialty tools I only use a few times a year.
And for me, there's no "retirement", I work a bit, Sail a bit,repeat.
And 32' is plenty of vessel to maintain and operate Solo.


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## pcmm (Jan 31, 2014)

Personally I would say, just go in what you have. You already know that you can do a couple of months on her. 

I'm kind of surprised you've had the boat listed that long with no interest! I think you have a poor broker. The boat market has been red hot for the last couple of seasons (though slowing down now) I have a good friend who is a broker and his biggest challenge during covid has be been keeping inventory. Boats often sell in days or a couple of weeks MAX and often for 100% of asking!


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## Don L (Aug 8, 2008)

scubadoo said:


> Early this morning, as I realized I had run out of excuses, I was literally scared sh*tless. The absolute number one thing I was afraid of had nothing to do with sailing, cruising, storms, sea monsters or the size of our boat. It was handing in my resignation letter.


I was HAPPY to turn in that letter. It was the like accomplishing something I had worked 8 years to get to.


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## pdqaltair (Nov 14, 2008)

MarkofSeaLife said:


> If I run out of money at 80 years old I will open doors at Walmart. The years before then are too valuable to waste working.


Spoken like someone who is not 80 and has not spent a lot of time with people who are 80 an out of money. Will you be able to stand for 8 hours, or even 2 hours? 

I have friends that "went early" and are now quite bitter that that they will be working until they fall down, whereas I played every years some and retired at ~ 54 with no worries. I will spend more time playing than they did, because investments now do the work. I'm not in favor of chasing money and living large unless that turns you on, but for most people the better plan is to work during their best earning years and plan their finances well.

Which years are more precious? Maybe I am more able to apreciate things now than I was at 30? Hard to say. I know hard work hurts more now than it did then.

I don't know. Just posting the questions.


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## Don L (Aug 8, 2008)

It is a balancing game involving luck and planning. The thing is we can plan for the money part, but not the health part. I "retired" at 56 and have spent WAY more money per year than I planned, but the market also has done WAY better than planned. Now at 62 collecting SS with my wife to start this year we have almost made it to the cash flow neutral point and mostly now just need to hope for the unknown health issue to continue to work out.


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## SanderO (Jul 12, 2007)

I suppose if you have an income which supports your "lifestyle" the main concerns would be health and the unexpected... accidents, damage and so on. Older you get the harder it is to do boat work. Boat labor is spendy too. Although we are reasonably healthy... we are seniors and sh*t happens... I can't do what I was able to do as a younger man and I am no longer working with an income.
We had thought about "retiring to the boat". Not practical up in LIS because of the weather... I hate staying on dock too.
A sober assessment is that it's time to sell the boat and relish the memories. We've been emptying the boat for the next owner to fill with his crap. ;-)


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## Skipper Jer (Aug 26, 2008)

Somehow the thread has drifted into finances and old age, so I'll toss in my two cents. When the company was reorganizing my boss offered me a position across the company. I told him I could always make more money but I can't make more time.


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## MikeOReilly (Apr 12, 2010)

joethecobbler said:


> Why does it have to be "all or nothing"?
> I've got a couple places up and down the east coast USA that I've found work for me at certain times throughout the year.
> They're waterfront or very close and are places to store/do repair work/spend time ashore.
> Some locations are owned, others leased or rented.
> ...


My lifestyle is perhaps similar in concept. We live and cruise for about 1/2 of each year on our boat (except when pandemics get in the way). The other 1/2 we spend house sitting, and generally travelling this vast country of Canada, visiting friends and family along the way.

We have also spent a number of seasons motorcycling around. We store our small bikes (for free) on a relative’s farm. 

We may choose to head south with our boat eventually. This would likely put us year-round on the water. But this 1/2-year approach has worked well for us so far, and it’s very inexpensive even in a price country like Canada.


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## skipgundlach (Oct 4, 2002)

Dave and Jaja Martin went RTW in a Cal25 (granted he took it apart and rebuilt it for the voyage, met her, got married, etc., but all in the same boat).





World Cruiser | CAL25







www.cal25.org





Talesin wasn't much larger (29 feet), and it was wood, as Larry and Lin Pardey went RTW.








TALEISIN OF VICTORIA


TALEISIN OF VICTORIA, built by Larry and Lin Pardey in 1983.




www.woodenboat.com





Do you want to cruise, NOW? Get her like you want and go..


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## scubadoo (Apr 5, 2014)

MikeOReilly said:


> We live and cruise for about 1/2 of each year on our boat (except when pandemics get in the way).


That is our number one backup plan! We'd probably just end up renting rather than owning again, so we can visit other locations (our family is spread out across the US).



pdqaltair said:


> Spoken like someone who is not 80 and has not spent a lot of time with people who are 80 an out of money. Will you be able to stand for 8 hours, or even 2 hours?


IF - we make it to 80 (apologies, PDQ, for taking that out of context). My family history tells me my chances are pretty slim. Don't get me wrong, there are a lot of men in their 80's In our condo development having the time of their lives. Most are in better shape than I am since they haven't been behind a desk for the past 20+ years. 

"Exit strategies" are as unique as each one of us is, plan for the best, prepare for the worst, but no one knows the final outcome until the wheel stops spinning. In the meantime, try to enjoy the ride, as we only get one "ticket".


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## GlanRock (Feb 26, 2013)

I am happy and jealous and wish all the best to your plans. When you make it to the Chesapeake Bay let us know, we'd love to meet ya'll for a dinner and talk about your adventures. We hope to do the same as soon as we feel its possible. Likely we'll have to 'work from boat' because we did choose the route of buy a newer bigger boat over the one we had. However the one we had needed significant investment of time, money, and work, in order to become a blue-water boat (and from what I know the next owners chose to go down that route and then sold it not long after). For now we're locked in to the zone. On the flip side, we get to sail all around this Bay, and have taken several trips around and into the Atlantic to 'dip our toes in' so to speak. Hope to see ya in '23!!


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## SanderO (Jul 12, 2007)

I got my boat in '85. It was new and needed all manner of upgrades. I did them over maybe 5 or 6 years and enjoyed every minute of the "work". I was also sailing as much as I could in any weather even some winter sailing. I was 38 when I got my boat and thought that "middle age" was a good time to "take a sabbatical" hop on the boat, get rid of all my land "stuff" and see what it's like cruising around the Caribbean. And so I did it. Last step was to do the Marion Bermuda race with a couple of hundred "buddy boats". I learned the boat was fine for ocean work... I was OK too. And so off I went. But I had no intention of doing that for more than a few years. It ended up being about 5. I did a delivery from CT to Brazil too. 
In the end the charm of the "tropics" wore off and I missed "culture".... music, performances, museums... all sorts of things that I was accustomed to in NYC. The internet makes a "connection" to culture more feasible... but it not the same. 
I returned with the boat and sailed locally. I don't like to day sail... but we do weekend on the boat on the mooring or a mini cruise. We loved staying on board.
Now my age and the disabilities that attend has really curtailed any sort of "active" life. We can still sail... but owning the boat is a lot of work (and money) and if we're not using the boat it makes no sense owning one. 

So my recommendation is...GO before you are at retirement age... I didn't experience physical deficits until mid 60s... and it was down hill from there. That boat was the best thing I ever did... nothing comes close.


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## John Nicholas (Aug 28, 2021)

No one really needs a bigger boat. Being comfortable when sailing is a state of mind (and the right amount of sail up).

The best advice I have been given about choosing a yacht, was from a Canadian sailor who told me you should be prepared to abandon your yacht if necessary. He wasn't insured. He was travelling the world in a 35ft hull with his wife and 2 children. So mortgages are definitely the wrong way to go.


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## oldmanmirage (Jan 8, 2022)

MikeOReilly said:


> You’re a genius! Now that I read this out loud I think to myself, “Why haven’t I done this a long time ago!?!”
> 
> Sorry for the slight thread drift, but this is why I love coming here. You never know when someone will mention a great idea … and show what a dunce I’ve been .


I don't know why you've never thought of it either. I kinda thought it was one of those things that all liveaboards did with un-used bunks ! Lol


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## MikeOReilly (Apr 12, 2010)

John Nicholas said:


> No one really needs a bigger boat. Being comfortable when sailing is a state of mind (and the right amount of sail up).


Sing it brother  . I agree... mostly. I'm an advocate of going with the _smallest boat that fits your needs_. Most people approach the boat size question the same way they buy houses: they get the biggest one they can afford. This can lead to the common problem of being _"boat rich, cash poor."_

This doesn't mean going with a dinghy, or indeed any specific size. It just focuses the question on what one actually needs, not just what the glossy mags or spiffy Tuber videos tell us to get.



oldmanmirage said:


> I don't know why you've never thought of it either. I kinda thought it was one of those things that all liveaboards did with un-used bunks ! Lol


I agree... a blinding flash of the obvious. I would have used an embarrassed "Like" reaction, but there isn't one. Mark??

Seriously... I've fought with our unruly quarter-berth cushions for a decade now. We have never used it as a berth. I really don't know why I didn't think of this. Old age I guess .


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## SanderO (Jul 12, 2007)

Of course the larger the boat the more stuff you haul around. We tend to "fill up" the space we have. Having said that if you are living aboard for any length of time you will want locker space to stow, clothing, tools, food, tanks and so on. I find that cruising in LIS to Southern NE tanks volume does not matter as there are fuel/water docks all over the place. When I was down living in the Caribe this was NOT the case. Look in your closet and see all the clothing you don't wear or no longer is fitting you or in style. We donate frequently to Goodwill. I don't have to get "dressed" for work.... worked from home... yes to meet a client.... yes to go to a show/performance out to dinner. I think the same applies to clothes aboard... less is fine and it works. When I lived aboard I had two pairs of deck shoes... every day and going out. I have more than enough space for stowage the way I have used the boat out there cruising or local cruising
If you live on dirt locally it may make sense to have only basic tools aboard and assemble and bring what you need for a project. In LIS-Southern NE you can almost get what ever you need with a short walk or cab ride from the town dock. Do some meal planning a bring what you need. Full time living aboard out there is a different story.


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## OntarioTheLake (4 mo ago)

MikeOReilly said:


> I agree... a blinding flash of the obvious. I would have used an embarrassed "Like" reaction, but there isn't one. Mark??
> 
> Seriously... I've fought with our unruly quarter-berth cushions for a decade now. We have never used it as a berth. I really don't know why I didn't think of this. Old age I guess .


you guys are killin me. Mike I thought you were kidding. How many photos are in forums showing just that? Have you never been aboard a boat that’s done that? I mean the probability of not having seen it approaches zero!


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## MikeOReilly (Apr 12, 2010)

OntarioTheLake said:


> you guys are killin me. Mike I thought you were kidding. How many photos are in forums showing just that? Have you never been aboard a boat that’s done that? I mean the probability of not having seen it approaches zero!


I agree... all I can do is laugh at myself.


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## MarkofSeaLife (Nov 7, 2010)

Having the spare cabin junk pile on berth mattresses is a perfect idea IMHO. For a start things slide less, there's more shock resistance when falling off a wave, and when one's new Mother-in-law visits we can move the junk and bed the battleaxe.

😂


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## oldmanmirage (Jan 8, 2022)

When we bought our Endeavour 32 it only had cushions for the settee's in the salon. No v-berth and no qtr berth. The PO was a senior solo sailor and he apparently just slept in the salon, used every place else for storage.


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## vbiz59 (3 mo ago)

Sailing the world has been a dream since I was about 12yo. Now at 63 and still reasonably fit, I've been caring for my 93yo father going on 3yrs now. Sadly he is not going to make it thru the weekend. But the stars are aligning and I'm looking forward to sea trials this spring of a 38 Krogen I bought last month. Plenty of work between now and then and a season beyond for further advancements but we are southbound thereafter. Beyond all the factors in this thread and of life aboard, the stark realities of time and what else life has in store are paramount. I'm glad that dreams can become reality, and looking forward to the adventure that awaits, but the time factor looms large. Maybe it's because I'm lucky enough to not have known the passing of many in my life, or it's just that you do start to acknowledge that the clock is ticking as the years go by,, but I wish I'd have done it sooner.
Go now, however you may... Everything else you can work out as you go.
Live your best life. It's not all about the money.


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## MarkofSeaLife (Nov 7, 2010)

vbiz59 said:


> Sailing the world has been a dream since I was about 12yo. Now at 63 and still reasonably fit, I've been caring for my 93yo father going on 3yrs now. Sadly he is not going to make it thru the weekend.


Sorry to hear about your Dad. A very sad time for you, but also, as you intimate, perhaps a new beginning. 

All the best to you. We are already "down South". Hope to meet you one day here where the butter melts. 😊

May your Dad rest on. 


Mark


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## Val59 (3 mo ago)

MarkofSeaLife said:


> Sorry to hear about your Dad. A very sad time for you, but also, as you intimate, perhaps a new beginning.
> 
> All the best to you. We are already "down South". Hope to meet you one day here where the butter melts. 😊
> 
> ...


Thanks for your sentiment Mark, It's obviously been coming for a while and it's time for him to rest as we all must do. I know this.
I'm ready to continue exploring and chasing the dream, a lifestyle he instilled in me.
I'll keep a weather eye out for ya


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## Don L (Aug 8, 2008)

scubadoo said:


> Here's where I hope the more experienced (seasoned) cruisers, veteran sailors, and even the trolls sound off on what they chose (or would choose) and why.
> 
> GO!
> 
> Thank you



So, you going to GO?


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## VIEXILE (Jan 10, 2001)

Gone.


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## skipgundlach (Oct 4, 2002)

Amen to that.

And whatever boat you get, don't let yard time interfere with the long-term goal.

The last 8 years of ownership of my only home for 15 years included periods of not more than 6 weeks cruising, each.

Every other period had some form of interference, mostly because the admiral wanted to commit to something long term where we were moored when we weren't off cruising or land cruising to grandchildren, none of whom had any interest in cruising, dammit.

It's one of the very serious regrets I have of my life. If she wanted to be hooked up, I should have gone alone, or found someone/s who wanted a free cruise, mostly to the Bahamas. Now, I can't - though I MAY - if he ever finishes mucking around (9 months and "I'll be gone at the end of the month" later, so far), cruise with the new owner, both as crew, and to help him shake down the boat to his comfort level with her for a few months before we move further inland (albeit on a lake; it's not in any way the same), likely foreclosing any such other opportunities.

Go, and hurry up about it. If the boat is seaworthy, but not perfect, you can perfect it as you go. DON'T WAIT; the years fly by...


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## rbsailing (Jun 23, 2011)

scubadoo said:


> Ok, for the last 10 years I’ve been slowly, very slowly, getting closer to being a full-time cruiser. I’ve sailed everything from Sunfish, lasers, and Hobbies to keel boats from 20’ to 42’. For the past 4 years I’ve solely been sailing our 31’ Tartan.
> 
> My wife and I have been on some long-ish (30 to 60 day) cruises in the Keys. We always planned on selling our Tartan 31 (and our car, condo, small arms collection, tuba, etc.) and moving on to a slightly larger sailboat, something in the 36’ to 42’ range. But, after a year of being up for sale on Yachtworld, we have not had 1 offer (and only 3 showings)!
> 
> ...


The initial cost of the boat is just the start, than you get into the maintenance costs which go up with the size of the boat. Not to mention docking fees if you go into a marina. I remember a saying " don't buy the biggest boat you think you can handle, buy the smallest boat you think you can live on".


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## joethecobbler (Apr 10, 2007)

My 96 yr old grandfather told me the only regret he had for the things he did, was that he didn't do more of them.
I've tried to live by that.
Glad I went and sailed away, because I'm not certain I'll be around to do it later.
Or again, time will decide.
No regrets.


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## Wilyum (Oct 25, 2020)

capta said:


> For me, it is all about comfort when sailing long distances. If a boat is too small, then even the amount of water one can carry makes the voyage less pleasant.


ive always wondered about the correlation between comfort and boat size/water length as the latter increases, is there a formula for this? If the OP finds a 38’ Tartan of the exact same design, what % does his/her comfort increase? 22.58% since 38’ is 22.58% longer than 31’, is it that simple?


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## Jeff_H (Feb 26, 2000)

Wilyum said:


> ive always wondered about the correlation between comfort and boat size/water length as the latter increases, is there a formula for this? If the OP finds a 38’ Tartan of the exact same design, what % does his/her comfort increase? 22.58% since 38’ is 22.58% longer than 31’, is it that simple?


No it's not that simple, because as a boat gets longer, it gets wider and deeper. If the original design was literally 'enlarged' the increase in displacement would be roughly the percentage of enlargement to the third power. (I.e. a 20% increase in length would result in nearly a 73% increase)

But that is not how it works. Going from a smaller boat to a similar design concept bigger boat, almost nothing changes proportionately to the change in length. Because of that, there are items which dramatically change motion comfort that the numbers alone do not address. 

For example, the smaller boat would be proportionately beamer, so the bow will have a fatter entry angle. That means it would have a harder collision with each wave. The smaller boat would have proportionately more area in its water plane relative to its displacement and so would heave more violently as well. If both boats hit the same height wave, in theory the bow of both boats would rise the same amount, but the bigger boat would pitch through a smaller angle. 

Jeff


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## MikeOReilly (Apr 12, 2010)

Wilyum said:


> ive always wondered about the correlation between comfort and boat size/water length as the latter increases, is there a formula for this? If the OP finds a 38’ Tartan of the exact same design, what % does his/her comfort increase? 22.58% since 38’ is 22.58% longer than 31’, is it that simple?


Far too vague a question Wilyum. What do you mean by "comfort"? Do you mean how the boat moves in a seaway? Do you mean the number of berths or size of the galley? Do you mean size and number of winches? Do you mean how much beer can be carried? 

Jeff has the technical answer, but "comfort" is not only a technical factor. And if you want to talk just LOA vs comfort, for me there is a definite bell curve where increasing size tips into less comfort.


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## Wilyum (Oct 25, 2020)

Jeff nailed it, great answer.


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## OntarioTheLake (4 mo ago)

A lot of comfort has nothing to do with the boat


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## SanderO (Jul 12, 2007)

I think we all understand what comfort is. For sure it includes a sea kindly motion. My boat will pound in certain seas YUCK!!! It also dances at anchor... more anxiety producing that uncomfortable. I pretty much know how my boat will behave in different wind speeds and sea conditions. It's not bad, but I imagine other boats would be better. But you go to sea with the boat you have and make the best of it!


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## Don L (Aug 8, 2008)

scubadoo said:


> Ok, for the last 10 years I’ve been slowly, very slowly, getting closer to being a full-time cruiser. I’ve sailed everything from Sunfish, lasers, and Hobbies to keel boats from 20’ to 42’. For the past 4 years I’ve solely been sailing our 31’ Tartan.
> 
> My wife and I have been on some long-ish (30 to 60 day) cruises in the Keys. We always planned on selling our Tartan 31 (and our car, condo, small arms collection, tuba, etc.) and moving on to a slightly larger sailboat, something in the 36’ to 42’ range. But, after a year of being up for sale on Yachtworld, we have not had 1 offer (and only 3 showings)!
> 
> ...


in the thread drift did I wish your decision?


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## capta (Jun 27, 2011)

Wilyum said:


> ive always wondered about the correlation between comfort and boat size/water length as the latter increases, is there a formula for this? If the OP finds a 38’ Tartan of the exact same design, what % does his/her comfort increase? 22.58% since 38’ is 22.58% longer than 31’, is it that simple?


I've seen beautiful boats 40-50' that I might have bought, roll excessively at anchor, so they are most probably the same while sailing.
I tend to stay away from the smaller (under 60') boats, with a clipper bow & wine glass stern, which I love the looks of, as they can be uncomfortable homes on the water. Many were poorly transcribed from their larger cousins and do not have the beam or low freeboard to support those shapes.. I don't understand why, even today, so many sailboat designers insist on trying to reproduce cargo designs for pleasure boat use. That lovely wine glass stern and a good bit of the gorgeous clipper bow were well underwater when they were loaded to capacity with cargo. But on a smaller boat the two can be a recipe for a very uncomfortable pleasure craft. Now you have a boat a fine entry and the buoyancy being high, and almost no buoyancy aft, at the waterline.
As I said above, There are many boats I would have bought, that I've later seen in anchorages, which would have made terrible homes at anchor and probably underway.. But how can one tell, if one isn't a naval architect? Perhaps Jeff would take it from here?


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## MarkofSeaLife (Nov 7, 2010)

Roll might not be the problem. 
I was watching a video of an Oyster about 55 foot long(??) going upwind in 18 to 15 and it might not have been rolling much but it sure as hell watch pitching. They had more water into their dodger than Ive ever had. Reminds me of sailing a Swan 48(? too long ago to remember) and on the foredeck you'd be knee deep in green water every wave. Sold green water. The Swan 65 I race the Atlantic didnt get wet, but then nor would the Queen Mary.
Another friend in a +50 footer doing the same short passage as me had a wave break his dodger while my decks were completely dry from the mast back.
So, beware what you're getting into. As CaptA says watch the masts of anchored boats to assess roll, and foredeck wetness for pitching.


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