# Annapolis live-aboard



## davidpm (Oct 22, 2007)

I'm doing some calculations and in a couple of years I may want to live-aboard in Annapolis for a year.

I have family their so while my real goal is to go south, Annapolis would be a good place to stop for a bit and make sure any boat I acquire by then is in good condition.

The family location is either downtown old city or Tracy's Landing
But I don't know yet how close to them would be optimal.

I searched old sailnet threads and came up the the following marinas.
It looks like their are a lot of live-aboard options.
Is that true.
The monthly cost seems to be about $1,000 put port Annapolis looks like half of that.
Why would that be? What is wrong with them?

I'm figuring a 40' nice looking boat probably 100k+ so it wouldn't be new but not junk either.

If some sailnetters are already living aboard in Annapolis I would live to hear from them as to costs, amenities, challenges in winter, summer etc.

Annapolis Landing Marina
Magothy Marina
Welcome to PortAnnapolis Marina
Eastport Yacht Center - Annapolis, MD - Boat Slip Rates and Pier Layouts
Butlers Marina Annapolis - Boat Slips


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## JonEisberg (Dec 3, 2010)

davidpm said:


> The monthly cost seems to be about $1,000 put port Annapolis looks like half of that.
> Why would that be? What is wrong with them?


I'm very surprised to hear that, are you sure your numbers are accurate?

Port Annapolis would be my first choice, I love that place...


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## travlin-easy (Dec 24, 2010)

The price at Annapolis seems quite high, at least to me.

Now, why in the world would you want to live aboard during the dead of winter in Maryland? Just doesn't make good sense to me, especially when the sunny Florida keys are just 1000 miles to the south.

Gary


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## mr_f (Oct 29, 2011)

When I priced ALM and Port A last year, both were nearly the same for a 38' boat (40' slip) once the liveaboard fee was added in (one was slightly cheaper slip, the other slightly cheaper LA fee). Neither were $1000/month, closer to $750 including liveaboard fee. Both include unmetered power as far as I know. Port A has more amenities (store, cafe, workout room), ALM has nicer shore-side heads/showers. Port A has a better winter pump out system (ALM relies on the Annapolis pump out boat which was iced in much of last winter). Port A is better protected, ALM is slightly more scenic with views of the bay and less of a boat-yard feel. Both have great liveaboard communities. 

EYC is much closer to town. Doesn't make much difference in the summer, when a short dinghy/kayak ride are easy, much further in the winter. 

We previously lived at HHS near Tracy's Landing. Much cheaper than Annapolis, but not much town around there. And they weren't well set up for liveaboards. You were on your own for water, ice bubblers, etc. They did provide a winter pump out boat when it wasn't iced over.


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## Bene505 (Jul 31, 2008)

travlineasy said:


> The price at Annapolis seems quite high, at least to me.
> 
> Now, why in the world would you want to live aboard during the dead of winter in Maryland? Just doesn't make good sense to me, especially when the sunny Florida keys are just 1000 miles to the south.
> 
> Gary


David,

Gary has a good point. Winter seems so loooong. Why not move further south, like Charleston for December, then go to the Keys for January and February?










Regards,
Brad


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## Coquina (Dec 27, 2012)

Annapolis has a very vibrant live-aboard community, so plenty of people have decided that they don't have to be in Florida to stay on a boat. If you can affford it, there is nothing quite like being in Annapolis harbor. It is the center of the sailing universe for this area and you can see more interesting boats go by in one hour there than you can in a month most other places. That said, it is quite expensive. Castle Harbor Marina on Kent Island charges a lot less for the same sized slip and we have many live-aboards too. I pay around $2600 for a 40 foot slip there.

As for Charleston, I am not sure if going from a 45 degree rainy day to a 55 degree rainy day is all that much of an improvement.

EDIT: As for where, here are some thing to think about. First off, the Magothy is NOT Annapolis. It isn't a far drive, but it is a different planet as far as what goes on in the river. Not saying it is bad, but it won't resemble the Naptown experience either on land or the water. As for Annapolis, there is Back Creek and Spa Creek.
Any of the marinas on Spa Creek are on the harbor side. Wednesday night racing is right in front of you, as is the Parade of Lights and Boat Show. You are an easy walk to all the restaurants, shops, cafes, coffee shops, bars, etc. 
Back Creek marinas on the Eastport side are seperated from downtown by water, you have to go out around Horn Point to get into the harbor, but are just a short walk by land. You are just a few blocks across Eastport from the Spa Creek side. Back Creek marinas on the other side - where Port Annapolis is - are quite a ways away by road from downtown. The only way you are walking around Annapolis from there is taking a dinghy or water taxi across the creek. That said, many live-aboards like it over there, so you would not be alone.


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## davidpm (Oct 22, 2007)

Bene505 said:


> David,
> 
> Gary has a good point. Winter seems so loooong. Why not move further south, like Charleston for December, then go to the Keys for January and February?
> Regards,
> Brad


That brings up another whole questions. I've lived in the northeast my whole life. I pretty much know what Annapolis weather is like. Too hot and no wind in the summer and long cold winter. Like I said maybe one year to get the boat solid.
We have gone to the keys, panhandle fl and west coast but only in the winter as charterers. Once in the Islands I remember the sun came out for a 5 minutes and I could feel my skin instantly sear. So frankly I'm terrified of the summer.

I've heard that if you are a vegetarian the hot weather doesn't bother you so much. Seems pretty extreme, I like my meat.

Other than Hawaii which I probably can't afford probably no place is perfect.


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## davidpm (Oct 22, 2007)

mr_f said:


> (ALM relies on the Annapolis pump out boat which was iced in much of last winter). Port A is better protected, ALM is slightly more scenic with views of the bay and less of a boat-yard feel. Both have great liveaboard communities. .


So what is pan b if the pump out boat is not available?


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## Coquina (Dec 27, 2012)

Hawaii is FAR from perfect. I used to work out there and could not wait to get back to Annapolis. As for winter, Annapolis winters are highly variable. Some years there is plenty of good sailing in January and February. Last year <cough polar vortex sucks cough> not so much. What to do with a holding tank? There are pump-out trucks in some areas that will come out with a long hose. Some people will use a LectraSan or a composting head. Some people will just pump #1 overboard and do #2 in the marina head. Some people will decide that between the cold water and lack of swimmers in the winter no harm is done just going overboard. Some live-aboards in Baltimore probably think the outgoing water from the head isn't much different than the incoming water  Baltimore managerd to dump over 12,000,000 gallons of raw sewage last year uke


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## emcentar (Apr 28, 2009)

If funds are an issue, it is much cheaper down here in Tracy's Landing. 

But if I were you, I'd want to be in Annapolis, price be damned. Annapolis is a nice town with lots of good food and good company. There are not enough books in the world to get me through a winter in Deale on my own. 

Being vegetarian does not make hot weather any nicer. I'm with you. Maryland winters (the last not withstanding) aren't that bad, and it can get pretty cold down in Florida in January too. I once ran a marathon in Orlando in January and it was so cold, the water stations became slippery pools of ice. It was 15 degrees warmer that weekend back in DC.


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## davidpm (Oct 22, 2007)

emcentar said:


> If funds are an issue, it is much cheaper down here in Tracy's Landing.
> 
> But if I were you, I'd want to be in Annapolis, price be damned. Annapolis is a nice town with lots of good food and good company. There are not enough books in the world to get me through a winter in Deale on my own.
> 
> Being vegetarian does not make hot weather any nicer. I'm with you. Maryland winters (the last not withstanding) aren't that bad, and it can get pretty cold down in Florida in January too. I once ran a marathon in Orlando in January and it was so cold, the water stations became slippery pools of ice. It was 15 degrees warmer that weekend back in DC.


What does it cost in Deale?


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## SVAuspicious (Oct 31, 2006)

davidpm said:


> The monthly cost seems to be about $1,000 put port Annapolis looks like half of that.


In addition to ALM, PortA, EYC, and Butlers there is Jabins, Annapolis City Marina, Horn Point Marina, and a small raft of small marinas that allow liveaboards in Annapolis. Many of the latter will want a personal visit. Near Tracy's Landing are Herrington Harbour North and South and Shipwright Marina. Between Tracy's and Annapolis in Galesville is Hartge Yacht Harbour.

Prices for a 40' boat range between $6k and $9k per year.


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## davidpm (Oct 22, 2007)

mr_f said:


> I think Coquina has it mostly right about dealing with the holding tank in winter. You either choose somewhere that has good services, make do with limited pump-outs, treat and legally dump, or I guess dump illegally. The truth is the pump out boat was frozen in many weeks, but very infrequently more than two weeks in a row. So conscientious use of the shore facilities when it is convenient, and saving your tank for when you really don't want to walk to shore could probably get you through.


That all makes sense.
I'm assuming that the heat you have in the boat is enough to keep tanks un-frozen and that you have to put out a portable hose to fill up the water tank and roll it back up when done.
Is that right?


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## mr_f (Oct 29, 2011)

davidpm said:


> That all makes sense.
> I'm assuming that the heat you have in the boat is enough to keep tanks un-frozen and that you have to put out a portable hose to fill up the water tank and roll it back up when done.
> Is that right?


Our heat keeps the tanks and most internal plumbing safe from freezing. There are a couple of things we had to bypass and drain (like the feed for the cockpit shower) which required a little modification, but not much.

Many of the marinas with liveaboards run a hose or hoses under water along the bottom during winter. There is a line attached to the hose and you just pull it up, fill your tanks, and drop it back down to the bottom. Others are as you say, long hose to a building on shore that you have to drain when you are finished.


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## SVAuspicious (Oct 31, 2006)

davidpm said:


> I'm assuming that the heat you have in the boat is enough to keep tanks un-frozen and that you have to put out a portable hose to fill up the water tank and roll it back up when done.
> Is that right?


Correct. In many places without winter water on the dock there are "water parties" in the winter where everyone hooks their hoses end-to-end and fills everyone's boats.

I am a bit of a nervous nellie and start carrying jugs when we get down to 60 gallons (of 120). Since lots of people survive nicely on very much smaller tanks it is perhaps silly. I do it anyway.

In Annapolis I have lived aboard at Chesapeake Harbour Marina (with a kind-of sort-of waiver of the "no liveaboard" rule there), Eastport Yacht Center, Allsop's Marina, Watergate Village (which has changed ownership since and may be less tolerant), and at City Dock. I have good friends who live aboard at ACM, PortA, Jabins, and Shipwright.

Let me know how I can help.


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## chef2sail (Nov 27, 2007)

We are 20 miles north on the Patapsco. Our winter water is hose in the water which merely needs to be fished out and connected to. The price for a 50 ft slip including a 1000 chit which can be used in the restaurant when open in the spring is about $5500 . You are in Pasedena Maryland. Close to good stores, the Beltway and BWI.

We have a portable pump out year round.

Contact me. Facility is the Maryland Yacht Club

Marina Chesapeake Bay, Open Slips Pasadena, Wedding Baltimore

By the way any the restaurants in Annapolis are far from good for the most part with a couple of exceptions


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## chef2sail (Nov 27, 2007)

Coquina said:


> Hawaii is FAR from perfect. I used to work out there and could not wait to get back to Annapolis. As for winter, Annapolis winters are highly variable. Some years there is plenty of good sailing in January and February. Last year <cough polar vortex sucks cough> not so much. What to do with a holding tank? There are pump-out trucks in some areas that will come out with a long hose. Some people will use a LectraSan or a composting head. Some people will just pump #1 overboard and do #2 in the marina head. Some people will decide that between the cold water and lack of swimmers in the winter no harm is done just going overboard. Some live-aboards in Baltimore probably think the outgoing water from the head isn't much different than the incoming water  Baltimore managerd to dump over 12,000,000 gallons of raw sewage last year uke


Off topic but relevant in that sewage problems plague us all everywhere. Even in what we consider our bastions of our seemingly safe lifestyle areas. Water and bay Pollution is not just an issue of large cities and every small amount of effluent treated correctly is important. The fact that we don't do a good job in certain areas is never an excuse to not excessive doing what is right and is not an argument for throwing in the towel thinking your efforts do not affect the overall situation. I am sure you were not advocating indifference to handing waste on our boats in the correct manner, but expressing your frustration in a much larger example of the issue.

It appears kent island is not immune fro sewerage problems either.

Hearings held on south KI sewer - Queen Anne's County News - myeasternshoremd.com

Septic pollution woes divide Kent Island - Baltimore Sun


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## davidpm (Oct 22, 2007)

chef2sail said:


> We are 20 miles north on the Patapsco. Our winter water is hose in the water which merely needs to be fished out and connected to. The price for a 50 ft slip including a 1000 chit which can be used in the restaurant when open in the spring is about $5500 . You are in Pasedena Maryland. Close to good stores, the Beltway and BWI.
> 
> We have a portable pump out year round.
> 
> ...


The link indicates it is a yacht club. They still allow non-member live-aboards?
I didn't see any information about the yacht part of the club. Must be by invitation only.
Are you a potential invitor? Looks like a very nice place.

Don't understand the 1000 chit idea.
Are they basically making it so you have to pay 1000 in advance for restaurant food?

Sounds reasonable in any event just a little unusual, at least to me.
And I know how you feel about food so I know the food has to be good.


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## chef2sail (Nov 27, 2007)

davidpm said:


> The link indicates it is a yacht club. They still allow non-member live-aboards?
> I didn't see any information about the yacht part of the club. Must be by invitation only.
> Are you a potential invitor? Looks like a very nice place.
> 
> ...


I can be the inviter since we have met. I will be the Vice Commodore in two weeks.
I used to sponsor the Chesapeake Rondevous here for 5 years , but have too much club responsibilities here. Many on here came to MYC and could speak about the facility.

If I HAD to stay in Annapolis....it would be Port Annapolis. Class place

The breakdown of the money per year for a year round slip

You must become a member. For the time being there is no initiation fee

The membership dues per year are $2200
The slips are $ 39 per foot this year so a 50 ft slip is about $2000 . We have some smaller in the 44-50 foot range also
Restaurant chit is 1000 per year to be used against eating in the restaurant-
It allows us to finance one. Not open to public but members and members
Guests

Total for year then is $5100 and you spend the 1000 in restaurant. We also divide the payments up too.

You also have reciprocity in many Chesapeake yacht clubs so you get slips for $25 in 5 of them. $1 a foot in the others.

Quiet rural setting in the trees. Overlooks Patapscoyou can sail the river when too windy on the Chesapeake. hurricane hole and well protected. Safe wide docks with finger piers beside the boat at least 30 ft.

You can set sail up In cove 100 yards away. Can see theBay 2 miles away. 3.5 hour sail to Annapolis, Rock Hall, Worton Creek ...three directions.


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## SVAuspicious (Oct 31, 2006)

Coquina said:


> What to do with a holding tank? There are pump-out trucks in some areas that will come out with a long hose. Some people will use a LectraSan or a composting head.


I bought a Raritan Electroscan (which replaced the Lectra/San) in 2007. It is a life simplifier for liveaboards. I retained our holding tank for use in No Discharge Zones. The Electroscan has some minor maintenance requirements. We did not get the salt tub - we add a bit of salt with each use in fresh and brackish water.

There are indeed pump-out trucks but most of the marinas around Annapolis have boats pretty far from areas the trucks can reach.

Portable pump-out carts are commonly used.


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## davidpm (Oct 22, 2007)

chef2sail said:


> You can set sail up In cove 100 yards away. Can see theBay 2 miles away. 3.5 hour sail to Annapolis, Rock Hall, Worton Creek ...three directions.


That sounds awesome and thank you very much.

We plan on comming for the boat show getting in thurs nite and leaving Sun.
I'm scheduled to man the ASA booth for a couple hours.

I will definitely take a drive by. It sounds awesome.


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## Coquina (Dec 27, 2012)

Frustration is it. I used to sell and install Lecta-Sans back in the day and they worked as well or better than the city systems that are always "oopsie it rained here is 10,0000/100,000/1,000,00 gallons of raw sewage for you all - but don't worry, no harm done" and then after owners were into some big dollars for the systems the No Discharge Zones were created that do absolutely nothing at all to help the environment 
South Kent Island (NOT my end - we have sewers) has issues. The septic tanks are always filling up from groundwater and the drain fields do not drain. Besides for that indirect leaking from yards bubbling up rumor has it there are houses plumbed directly to the creeks 



chef2sail said:


> Off topic but relevant in that sewage problems plague us all everywhere. Even in what we consider our bastions of our seemingly safe lifestyle areas. Water and bay Pollution is not just an issue of large cities and every small amount of effluent treated correctly is important. The fact that we don't do a good job in certain areas is never an excuse to not excessive doing what is right and is not an argument for throwing in the towel thinking your efforts do not affect the overall situation. I am sure you were not advocating indifference to handing waste on our boats in the correct manner, but expressing your frustration in a much larger example of the issue.
> 
> It appears kent island is not immune fro sewerage problems either.
> 
> ...


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