# Keeping the House



## Gcurtis2009 (Nov 17, 2015)

So here is the deal. We are ready to do some extended cruising, maybe three to six month blocks, but are also realistic enough to know that at sixty or so years of age, we need to keep a brick and mortar residence for that eventual point where we need to scale it back. There is a ton of excellent advice for the cruising end of things, from boat prep and provisioning to destinations, but I am a little curious what non-full time cruisers do to make sure things don't go belly up on land while they are away. I have considered some of the obvious things, like mail forwarding, landscaping services, and such, but I don't know what I don't know. I would love it if some of the folks that keep one little toe on shore would chime in with things they missed in their initial cruiser planning. Many thanks in advance.


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## Tanski (May 28, 2015)

I had to move for work for a few months, let a good friend live in my house rent free in exchange for looking after the house, mail etc.
They did pay the utilities while I was away.
Heard too many horror stories of damage and didn't need the tax hassles of actually renting out the house.
In a couple years when I go cruising I'm selling and investing the money to buy a smaller house when I decide to live on land again. That money won't be part of the cruising kitty.
Could bite me in the butt, been sailing my whole life, looking forward to the sailing aspect, not sure if I will adapt to the lifestyle....Could be back buying a house after a few months.


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## WharfRat (Aug 4, 2015)

Gcurtis2009 said:


> So here is the deal. We are ready to do some extended cruising, maybe three to six month blocks, but are also realistic enough to know that at sixty or so years of age, we need to keep a brick and mortar residence for that eventual point where we need to scale it back. There is a ton of excellent advice for the cruising end of things, from boat prep and provisioning to destinations, but I am a little curious what non-full time cruisers do to make sure things don't go belly up on land while they are away. I have considered some of the obvious things, like mail forwarding, landscaping services, and such, but I don't know what I don't know. I would love it if some of the folks that keep one little toe on shore would chime in with things they missed in their initial cruiser planning. Many thanks in advance.


In most areas, there are real estate firms that specialize in residential property management. Their primary clientele are landlords, renting out to tenants. Some of them, however, are willing to "look after" a property for a fee. Usually they will entire the property once a week or once a month, and call in any maintenance issues such as plumbing leaks. You would typically pay an hourly or monthly fee, plus expenses.

Clearly this is not as good as having the property looked after daily.The cruel reality is that a vacant property can be a magnet for Murphy's Law or even crime. So it might be wise to partially mothball the house by getting your valuables and important documents stored offsite in a bank fault or safe with a trustworthy relative (if there are any.)

Actually renting the property for real is another option, but it comes with very real risk, only some of which a property management firm can mitigate. Still, having someone in the property, is arguably than having the property vacant for an extended period.


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## Tanski (May 28, 2015)

There is an addition rider (ryder?) you have to put on you insurance, at least in Canada, called a waiver of non occupancy. Expensive!


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## Gcurtis2009 (Nov 17, 2015)

Tanski and WharfRat, thanks for the quick replies and food for thought. A property management firm is one possibility for keeping an eye on the house - and I do like the idea of putting the really valuable stuff in secure storage. Crime is not a huge problem here, but Murphy does rule in my life, so that would take one item off the list of crap to worry about. Don't have anyone that could stay as a house sitter, so that is probably a non-starter.


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## TomMaine (Dec 21, 2010)

Gcurtis2009 said:


> So here is the deal. We are ready to do some extended cruising, maybe three to six month blocks, but are also realistic enough to know that at sixty or so years of age, we need to keep a brick and mortar residence for that eventual point where we need to scale it back. There is a ton of excellent advice for the cruising end of things, from boat prep and provisioning to destinations, but I am a little curious what non-full time cruisers do to make sure things don't go belly up on land while they are away. I have considered some of the obvious things, like mail forwarding, landscaping services, and such, but I don't know what I don't know. I would love it if some of the folks that keep one little toe on shore would chime in with things they missed in their initial cruiser planning. Many thanks in advance.


The best thing to do, is rent it. But like anything realestate, that whole scenario relies on location,...location,...

You probably know the going rate in your neighborhood. Then it's just a matter of do you rent it yourself or let it out to a property management biz.

We've done it both ways. Being the landlord of your own property takes work but it's always paid us nicely.

If renting isn't for you, then a house sitter could be a good solution. It can be a good deal for both of you, the sitter gets cheaper housing, you get some bills paid and your property cared for.

It's pretty common in our area to rent your house while you cruise in the high season. Rentals are high on the coast of NE in summer. In the off season, rents drop. The rule of thumb is, a week in August rents for the same as the month of February.

So many variables but your problem is a good one!


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## Ulladh (Jul 12, 2007)

Some municipalities/counties will require a rental license, and inspection for compliance with fire code.
An in state management company if the owner is not in state may also be required.


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## Gcurtis2009 (Nov 17, 2015)

Thanks all,

This is exactly the kind of input I needed. I would have completely overlooked the insurance issue. Fortunately, I have a friend in the industry, and hopefully she can steer me in the right direction where that is concerned.


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

There are a couple of electronic solutions I would consider. There are several internet based house monitoring systems available these days. Some are sold/leased by local cable companies, but others are generic. They can monitor everything from security access to motion detection, heat and air conditioning, humidity, etc. You can even adjust each of them from your phone. Not sure where you live, but in most parts of the country, a failed HVAC system can be a nightmare. In cold climes, pipes break (maybe you even want to drain these). In humid climes, a mold farm will grow in places you'll never reach, within a couple of weeks of losing dehumidification. 

There are also internet based video monitoring systems, where you can buy the hardware once and see what's going on from your phone, tablet or laptop.

Each of these would require that you maintained wifi internet connectivity at the house. You may still require someone that could go there, from time to time, to reset a wifi router, etc. Of course, if you identify a problem, you'll also need a plan to respond.

How about a house cleaner? Essentially just keeping dust down, which would be valuable and probably not expensive (unlike cleaning after a home in use). If you trust them (that's big), they would also serve as a check on the place. On the other hand, they could serve as the broadcast of you not being around.

I have family that did the snow bird thing for years, summers in the Northeast, winters in FL. They monitored the other end, via the internet, this way. They typically paid a neighbor to check in on the place about once per week, who sent them an email to confirm status. They took that neighbor out to a nice dinner as well, when they returned.

Another thought, which is very popular these days, but admittedly I would not do, is AirB&B or HomeAway. Rent your house by the day over an internet website. I know some folks actually making a fortune this way. Far more revenue than mortgage payments and utilities. You'll still need that house cleaner, which the tenants usually pay for. I think some local governments are starting to address regulation around these, from permitting to collecting occupancy taxes. You'll also need very consistent (daily, but maybe not 24/7) email access.

Good luck. I think you are very wise to consider the day you'll move back ashore, even if intermittently. Most do.


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## eherlihy (Jan 2, 2007)

Preface: I am not out cruising, and the boat is more my dream than hers.

My wife and I owned a home with a pool in the north east. She works full-time, and I'm semi retired (teaching sailing part-time does not pay the bills). After the market crash, my wife took her savings for 4 years and bought a home in Florida (short-sale) "as an investment." I have family in both places, and she has family in up north.

The kids had just moved out (when they graduated college), and I was fed up with the house's constant painting, fixing, mowing, cleaning, etc., every damn minute that I had available. What we did (and the only way that carrying both places would be possible), is *SELL THE HOUSE* in the north east and *BUY A CONDO* up north. We split all expenses for the condo. Selling the house allowed us to pay cash for the condo, and have a little left over. With our condo, we only "own" the inside of the building.

She refuses to rent either location, so she pays the ongoing maintenance/taxes/etc for the house in Florida (I've paid for some of the improvements, and I still get my ration of house fixing, cleaning and painting), and I pay everything for the boat. When we leave the condo, I shut off the water, and lock the door.


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

Our retirement plan is absolutely a condo. Forget the yard maintenance, etc. I'm even gravitating toward the 55+ communities. Must be getting old. Prematurely.


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## caberg (Jul 26, 2012)

Although I don't like condos as a primary residence (for me), and there are all kinds of unpleasant issues in some condo associations, a condo really does make sense for a place to stay part time when not off doing other things (cruising or otherwise). From the walls out, everything is taken care of for you. You turn the key, and go. Here in my area in the northeast the developers cannot build condos fast enough as the baby boomers are retiring and starting to travel and snow bird. And they are building some really nice high end units, many of them free-standing single family homes, but still you only own from the walls in, and the association owns and maintains everything else.


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## outbound (Dec 3, 2012)

We are in the process of doing this. Now dealing with prepping house for sale. Intention is to sell this large house now and build small single level house. That house will be fitted with storm shutters to prevent damage and theft. Alarmed with alarms notifying real estate management company. Will live on boat during transition of being houseless. 

Have been a landlord. Huge PITA even when living in same town. Not practical when Internet or phone not commonly available and hack proof. Was a huge wake up how difficult it is to do financial stuff is when secure ( not open wifi) is not commonly available. Have even needed to use expensive satphone at times. Important to have all this stuff on autopilot before you leave. 

Currently rent my prior office condo. Only practical due to it being commercial space with building manager. 

My preference is to just live on boat. Sell boat and buy house when time comes. Wife insists on house. Condos have limited parking, storage, ability to have work shop, no yards to grow things, cheeck to jowl living. None appeals to me. 

Still looking for land for building. Finances only work as aiming to decrease to house 1/2 the size on lot 1/3 to 1/2 the size. Problem is unless you stay at 3 bedrooms, 2-2 1/2 baths hard to see your money back when you sell house to go to the assisted living. But this quite doable in 1600-2000sq.ft. People in the business tell me this size will be quite desirable in the future so good decision. But 1 or 2 bedroom houses regardless of size will be harder sell.


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

While this flies in the face of the "American Dream", renting is not such a bad option either. People too quickly say it's money down the drain. However......... you have no assets tied up in equity, no real estate taxes, absolutely no maintenance inside or out and, best of all, you can move at will. You don't have to wait for anyone to buy your old place. 

The American Dream of owning your own home is really a cultural way of insuring homesteading (whose days have long passed) and economic spending on everything from services to durable goods. It's not always the best financial choice. Just living somewhere that my wife wouldn't be able to redecorate routinely would be a big savings.


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## TomMaine (Dec 21, 2010)

outbound said:


> We are in the process of doing this. Now dealing with prepping house for sale. Intention is to sell this large house now and build small single level house. That house will be fitted with storm shutters to prevent damage and theft. Alarmed with alarms notifying real estate management company. Will live on boat during transition of being houseless.
> 
> Still looking for land for building. Finances only work as aiming to decrease to house 1/2 the size on lot 1/3 to 1/2 the size. Problem is unless you stay at 3 bedrooms, 2-2 1/2 baths hard to see your money back when you sell house to go to the assisted living. But this quite doable in 1600-2000sq.ft. People in the business tell me this size will be quite desirable in the future so good decision. But 1 or 2 bedroom houses regardless of size will be harder sell.


This sounds like the proverbial downsize move. Seems a huge portion of the country is in this transition.

Like Caberg mentions in his area, here on the coast of Maine, the most new construction is to lure buyers in this 'down sizer' market. Downsizing means, 'lots of equity to spend', to realestate speculators.

Your post is interesting from a sailing/cruising standpoint. You're not alone, a lot of future cruisers are contemplating this same move. It's also a good point to step out of realestate ownership all together. But that doesn't seem to be as popular as keeping a smaller, home base.

Any of us with big houses, will do this in the future, planned or not. Good for you.


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## Gcurtis2009 (Nov 17, 2015)

Maybe a little more background is in order. The house in question is the downsize house, and we have just passed our third year of ownership - we fully own vice having a mortgage. When we moved, we pick a location that gave us access to the ICW and the Florida Atlantic coast within a 20 minute drive. This is all part of the equation contributing to the decision to keep. I haven't done the cost analysis, but having monitored security on the place might reduce insurance costs enough to pay for itself, plus have the added benefit of peace of mind. Keep it coming! Everyone is giving us a lot to think about.


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## goat (Feb 23, 2014)

Minnewaska said:


> While this flies in the face of the "American Dream", renting is not such a bad option either. People too quickly say it's money down the drain. However......... you have no assets tied up in equity, no real estate taxes, absolutely no maintenance inside or out and, best of all, you can move at will. You don't have to wait for anyone to buy your old place.
> 
> The American Dream of owning your own home is really a cultural way of insuring homesteading (whose days have long passed) and economic spending on everything from services to durable goods. It's not always the best financial choice. Just living somewhere that my wife wouldn't be able to redecorate routinely would be a big savings.


That's exactly my plan. If/when I swallow the hook I'll be looking throughout the world for cheap rent. Move as required. Growing roots are for trees.

goat


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## guitarguy56 (Oct 10, 2012)

We own our home and it's the upkeep to maintain it especially in a gated HOA community (I know my bad)... but by doing so we know the home will be kept up (we have mobile security guards) as long as someone is home or managed thru a property management company. The nine months I was in Shanghai I had my daughter and son stay at the house taking turns to maintain the grounds, flush toilets/open faucets, etc., and insure the internet was always up as this was our security check with our phones/computers.

I'm not sure we will keep this house or investment property but will probably sell them both when we both retire and keep the condo in Key Largo as our base as it's simple to lock up and venture away without worries of HOA infractions or security. All fees, etc. are easily paid by internet banking and who doesn't have that already?

Having an apartment or condo/villa is the best method if no one is available to maintain the proper home and there may be other methods like renting an apartment/condo at some Caribbean Island, South America, Mediterranean location, etc.


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## TomMaine (Dec 21, 2010)

Minnewaska said:


> The American Dream of owning your own home is really a cultural way of insuring homesteading (whose days have long passed) and economic spending on everything from services to durable goods. It's not always the best financial choice.


For many of us, our home is an appreciating asset. It's not unusual to earn most or all of the funds needed to cruise on your boat, through rental of realestate(usually a primary home).

So for some, cashing out - especially to go cruising - can be a one way trip, that doesn't make sound financial sense. And it may not be required.

But I agree with you for many property owners. If your property is not appreciating at a reasonable rate, or doesn't represent some other value to the owner, it may make better sense to cash out and invest the money in a better return(that rules out a boat  )


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## hellosailor (Apr 11, 2006)

If you are building from scratch, consider "hurricane windows" instead of conventional ones. They are typically glass on both sides, with an inner laminated layer of 1/2" plexi go that the window is literally "armored". With or without shutters, no one is going to break in through your window. (And if you are in hurricane country, there's often some insurance discount.) But they do make for great security, and they really keep out noise.

There are also some push-button doorlocks now, key optional, which (sadly) require a subscription fee but can be set to send an email or text every time the door is opened or closed, along with telling you who's code was used on it. Maybe you're paying for someone to fix the plumbing? You can let them in and see when they log out again. Housecleaner says it took four hours? Maybe the door says it took two. Or, they stayed the weekend.

Useless for many people, but there are some interesting options for "keeping an eye" on someplace where you won't be.


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

TomMaine said:


> For many of us, our home is an appreciating asset......


That's in some markets/eras and not others, of course. However, the appreciation itself is not all profit. To get to what you made on your investment, you have to deduct all the real estate taxes you paid over the life of ownership, along with maintenance, yard work, major repairs, etc. In many cases they eat up most, if not all, of the appreciation over time.


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