# sailing to canada from usa



## calamitas (Apr 18, 2007)

Now that the boat is docked in Northern Ohio on Lake Erie, I am considering sailing up to Pelee Island, Ontario. My boat has a Porta-Pottee. I read somewhere that Canadian regulations require that Porta-Pottees have to be permanently mounted to the boat with a deck-mounted pump-out. Is this true? If so, are they serious? Do they think I am going to discharge American sewage into Canadian waters without paying duty or something? Do I have to re-fit the head just to make it possible for me to cross a dotted line on a map?


----------



## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

You have to be able to keep your **** together before you come up here.

From the Canada Shipping Act

*Fitting of Toilets 

120. A toilet fitted on a ship shall be secured in a manner that ensures its safe operation in any environmental conditions liable to be encountered.

Holding Tanks 

121. A holding tank shall 
(a) be constructed in a manner such that it does not compromise the integrity of the hull;
(b) be constructed of structurally sound material that prevents the tank contents from leaking;
(c) be constructed such that the potable water system or other systems cannot become contaminated;
(d) be resistant to corrosion by sewage;
(e) have an adequate volume for the ship's human-rated capacity on a normal voyage;
(f) be provided with a discharge connection and piping system for the removal of the tank contents at a sewage reception facility;

*


----------



## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

> Now that the boat is docked in Northern Ohio on Lake Erie, I am considering sailing up to Pelee Island, Ontario. My boat has a Porta-Pottee. I read somewhere that Canadian regulations require that Porta-Pottees have to be permanently mounted to the boat with a deck-mounted pump-out. Is this true?


yes - it may even be the case in the US as I thought it was a Great Lakes Regulation rather than specific to Canada, but I have not investigated it...


> If so, are they serious?


yes


> Do they think I am going to discharge American sewage into Canadian waters


yes


> without paying duty or something?


we don't want it no matter how much you pay us 


> Do have to re-fit the head just to make it possible for me to cross a dotted line on a map?


yes - but you are indeed in luck ! For the paltry sum of 50 American dollars you may purchase an unused, Great Lakes legal, MSD currently residing in my garage. Unfortunately, you'll have to pick it up here in Toronto, but that's a nice sail at this time of year 

Also note that you are not allowed to consume alcohol on your boat, even while tied up to a dock, unless it is equipped with a head and a permanently affixed cooking device. My advice to you would be to avoid flying a US burgee... It seems to be as much of a target up here as a Canadian one is down there....


----------



## Kernix (Oct 5, 2006)

Sailormann said:


> Also note that you are not allowed to consume alcohol on your boat, even while tied up to a dock, unless it is equipped with a head and a permanently affixed cooking device.(


Thank stinks - what do they think you are going to pee in a bottle and empty it overboard? That would be my plan. And why when at a dock is there are bathroom facilities?

And why with a cooking device? So that you can cook a poo-poo platter for dinner?


----------



## Valiente (Jun 16, 2006)

On the Great Lakes, I believe there is harmonization on discharge rules, so if you can't do it in Ohio, don't do it in Ontario. Lake Erie itself doesn't recognize a border, but the prevailing winds and currents send the poop over the Falls eventually...and into _my _lake.

That said, I know nobody who doesn't take "the captain's privilege" off the stern rail. Why, exposing one's block and tackle to a freshening breeze is one of the better parts of boating, and if you're like me, foreign-flagged vessels tend to dip their ensigns...


----------



## Yado (Jan 3, 2004)

Sailing to Canada from USA:
I met a round-the-world sailor in Yarmouth, Nova Scotia, who was furious with a Canadian law regarding firearms. Pirates in South America boarded his boat, he was beaten and robbed and his wife was raped. She went back to England and he purchased a pistol for protection and sailed on with a mate. 
His goal was to sail through the Great Lakes then down to the Gulf of Mexico; he declared the pistol at Yarmouth and the authorities put it under lock and key. The dilemma was this: He could only recover the pistol if he departed from Yarmouth, they wouldn't send it to his port of exit from Canada or to the States. Nope, if he wanted his pistol he had to go back through Yarmouth. He was so frustrated. I don't know anything else about the law but this was his story as he told it to me.


----------



## sailortjk1 (Dec 20, 2005)

Moral of the story: Don't take your crap or your gun to Canada.
It will get you into a **** of trouble and your wife will be raped.


----------



## tommyt (Sep 21, 2002)

Hey, Toronto sends their garbage to Michigan, and we accept it. Clean country. Living and sailing on the Great Lakes I have no problem with the discharge law. I do think Michigan should get its **** together ( pun intended) and let Canada take care of its own waste. However, if I was them I would send it as long as we will take it.

As to the gun laws, they do make a difference. I moved from Chicago where there were more than two murders a DAY, and remember picking up the paper in April the year that I departed Toronto and they had just had its first murder of the YEAR. You follow the laws of the country you visit. So who is right?Math is easy.


----------



## Yado (Jan 3, 2004)

Since I posted about the guy with the gun issue, I went and sailed for several hours on the Chesapeake Bay and man was it beautiful. The skies were grey but I had a good breeze between 11-15, the tide extra high because of the new moon and there was no motor boat chop to deal with. 
The gun laws: You guys missed the point, which was, to make Sailnet readers aware of the how Canadian authorities dealt with just one sailor who carried a weapon into Canadian waters, and the problems he faced.


----------



## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

I don't think past convicted felons are welcomed up thar either.


----------



## sailingfool (Apr 17, 2000)

*Toronto Visitor*



Sailormann said:


> .... It seems to be as much of a target up here as a Canadian one is down there....


Hey, we are very nice to our Canadian vistors, they are almost American (if they speak English)...anyway I was beating out of Boston harbor a week ago Sunday when I tacked across the path of an incoming C&C ( I think a late 30 Mark I) flying a big red maple leaf flag. As I crossed astern of him I saw Toronto on the stern - the skipper was busy eyeing my CS 36T as I eyed a nice example of my favorite boat...anyone you know?


----------



## chappyonice (Jul 30, 2006)

Valiente said:


> On the Great Lakes, I believe there is harmonization on discharge rules, so if you can't do it in Ohio, don't do it in Ontario. Lake Erie itself doesn't recognize a border, but the prevailing winds and currents send the poop over the Falls eventually...and into _my _lake.
> 
> That said, I know nobody who doesn't take "the captain's privilege" off the stern rail. Why, exposing one's block and tackle to a freshening breeze is one of the better parts of boating, and if you're like me, foreign-flagged vessels tend to dip their ensigns...


Nice, I crapped from laughing so hard.  I'm on Lake Erie too and it's headin' your way  .


----------



## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

> he declared the pistol at Yarmouth and the authorities put it under lock and key. The dilemma was this: He could only recover the pistol if he departed from Yarmouth, they wouldn't send it to his port of exit from Canada or to the States. Nope, if he wanted his pistol he had to go back through Yarmouth. He was so frustrated. I don't know anything else about the law but this was his story as he told it to me.


Guns are a big deal up here. He is lucky that he declared it. If it had been discovered, he would have been arrested and might have had his boat confiscated. Zero tolerance.


> Hey, we are very nice to our Canadian vistors


It's changing - hearing more and more about the USCG chasing down boats that inadvertently cross the line down the middle of Lake Ontario ... hasn't happened to me (yet), and if it were an isolated report, I'd tend to dismiss it, but it seems to be a regular occurence these days ... Can't for the life of me understand why, as they are obviously monitoring them by satellite, and can see that there is no meeting of vessels to hand off contraband... Might just be one idiot Coast Guard station, may be a new policy...


> they are almost American


yes - standards have been slipping a bit lately - we'll have to pull our socks up huh ?   


> ...anyone you know?


Oh it must be - there are only 5 million people here - small town - and if we're not related then we've probably dated ..   

_No offense meant - just can't control myself..._


----------



## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

> Thank stinks - what do they think you are going to pee in a bottle and empty it overboard? That would be my plan. And why when at a dock is there are bathroom facilities?


 It's a holdover from another time. It wasn't so very long ago that you couldn't buy alcohol here on Sundays... I think that the issue was actually a concern that you might use the bottle and _forget_ to dump it overboard, leaving it unattended and that subsequently some poor, unfortunate fool might take a swig...I won't go any further... but we are a caring nation and try to protect our less sober citizens from unnecessary trauma...



> And why with a cooking device?


 I honestly haven't got a clue on this one...but I am pretty sure that it's not


> So that you can cook a poo-poo platter for dinner?


----------



## sailingfool (Apr 17, 2000)

Sailormann said:


> .....Oh it must be - there are only 5 million people here - small town - and if we're not related then we've probably dated ...
> _No offense meant - just can't control myself..._


Yikes, yoo soor, I didn't think there 5 million people in the whole country...why you are big enough to be a state like Noo Yook, we'll have to see about moving up the border up to the artic cirlce so you can be US...if you did date, I hope you dated his wife, she looked sorta cute, but the skipper looked like a typical guy.

I don't mean to poke too much fun at Canada, a very important place, it provides Canadian Sailboat parts. So hey, do locals get discounts on CS parts?


----------



## yotphix (Aug 18, 2006)

He's just playing with you! There _aren't_ 5 million people in the whole country! In fact, apart from a few sailboat parts there really isn't anything at all in Canada that would interest the US in any way...really. Hey...stop looking at us like that...why are you salivating?

*There's nothing here!*


----------



## yotphix (Aug 18, 2006)

Sailormann said:


> It's changing - hearing more and more about the USCG chasing down boats that inadvertently cross the line down the middle of Lake Ontario ... hasn't happened to me (yet), and if it were an isolated report, I'd tend to dismiss it, but it seems to be a regular occurence these days ... Can't for the life of me understand why, as they are obviously monitoring them by satellite, and can see that there is no meeting of vessels to hand off contraband... Might just be one idiot Coast Guard station, may be a new policy...


I was informed by Canadian customs that when I left for a day sail and crossed the imaginary dotted line in the middle of the lake, around 15 or so miles out iirc, that I needed to report back in upon my return to Toronto. A dock neighbour of mine was actually stopped on the way back from such a sail and borded by some strange looking coast guard types.


----------



## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

Strictly speaking, that is true. You have exited Canada when you crossed into US waters, and are re-entering, hence are required to report to Customs.

Unusual that your neighbour would be boarded by the Coast Guard. Is that the Canadian or US Coast Guard you are referring to ?


----------



## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

Sailormann said:


> It's a holdover from another time. It wasn't so very long ago that you couldn't buy alcohol here on Sundays... I think that the issue was actually a concern that you might use the bottle and _forget_ to dump it overboard, leaving it unattended and that subsequently some poor, unfortunate fool might take a swig...I won't go any further... but we are a caring nation and try to protect our less sober citizens from unnecessary trauma...
> 
> I honestly haven't got a clue on this one...but I am pretty sure that it's not


That's not it at all... geesh! You can't consume alcohol while under way because that is driving while under the influence. And the dock restrictions are obvious. If you have a head and a cooking device you can claim that you reside there at least part-time and as a residence you may 'park it' at the dock and stay for the night, not just some yahoo in a skiff hanging at the dock for a booze-up before heading back out on the water to try and find their way home!

poo poo platter... where the hell do you get this stuff?


----------



## calamitas (Apr 18, 2007)

*what I meant to say was...*

Gosh, I have touch off quite a little discussion, eh? 
For the record, I had a good time sailing in Canada a couple of summers ago (Georgian Bay) on a borrowed boat. Beautiful country. It just seems draconian not to trust someone to empty his own holding tank at an approved facility, just as I do in the U.S.A. Yes, I know, some people are taking longer voyages than I, but presumably they would have more technologically advanced heads. And a fixed stove. And a gun or two. Thanks, everyone, for your assistance with this. Maybe next year when the bank account recovers from the boat purchase, I will upgrade the "library." In the meantime, y'all in the True North please continue to "stand on guard" for me.


----------



## Valiente (Jun 16, 2006)

tommyt said:


> As to the gun laws, they do make a difference. I moved from Chicago where there were more than two murders a DAY, and remember picking up the paper in April the year that I departed Toronto and they had just had its first murder of the YEAR. You follow the laws of the country you visit. So who is right?Math is easy.


Tom, you are a bit better travelled than a lot of your fellow Americans and see more sides of the equation. That's why the math is easy. Our cops busted a gang in Toronto yesterday and captured 31 handguns and a few MAC 11s. That's a very big haul for here and will lower the murder rate for a few weeks, because it's mostly gang guys popping at each other that accounts for two-thirds of the murder rate. The Canadian way is to defenestrate, stab or bludgeon, yes, even with a hockey stick. We call it "the personal touch".

As for the Michigan dumping, yes, we shouldn't send it, and you shouldn't take our money for it. But until we here in Southern Ontaio take responsibility for our own crap, we'd be fools not to ship it down the 401 while we avoid for a few more years dealing with the unpopular political consequences of charging per-bag garbage collection while we dig a new airport-sized landfill in some farmer's backyard.


----------



## Valiente (Jun 16, 2006)

sailingfool said:


> Hey, we are very nice to our Canadian vistors, they are almost American (if they speak English)...anyway I was beating out of Boston harbor a week ago Sunday when I tacked across the path of an incoming C&C ( I think a late 30 Mark I) flying a big red maple leaf flag. As I crossed astern of him I saw Toronto on the stern - the skipper was busy eyeing my CS 36T as I eyed a nice example of my favorite boat...anyone you know?


Late Mark I C&C 30s number in the hundreds here in Toronto...could've been anyone. He probably was acknowledging your good taste in sailing a CS36T, another fine "classic plastic" Canadian-built cruiser.


----------

