# Paceship 23



## Kper (Mar 23, 2013)

Taking a back road to visit our son we stumbled across a sailboat sitting under cover hours from the nearest lake so I stopped to inquire. It didn't have a "for sale" sign on it but the older gentleman said he'll never get around to sailing it and asked if I could help get some information on it and a possible value. Turns out it was an AMF Paceship, or a PY23. The owner has had it for years and has never had it in the water. In fact, the owner before him never had it in the water and the last registration shows 1999 IIRC. It's sitting on a trailer with a little corrosion but not bad. It has 5 sails with it but I didn't take them out of the bags but can say what I did see of them they felt very good. Of course I don't know if they are damaged or what, exactly, they are. There is no roller furler and no electronics for the most part. He's replaced the interior but it would need a cleaning. The bow pulpit has been repaired and there's a 4" scratch below water line that may or may not be through the gelcoat - hard to tell because it has had a temp repair over it. Not sure of the condition of the swing keel, either. Comes with a 6hp, 2 cycle Evenrude.

Anyone have any idea what these are worth? I couldn't find any for sale online go get a feel for current values.



Thanks.

Well, it appears I am not mature enough to post photos, sorry.


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## p_everette (Aug 3, 2012)

Here is a link to the Paceship forums

The Paceship Website Forums

I have a PY-23, It is worth what ever you are willing to pay for it. From your description sounds like it could be worth a $1.00 to $2000.00. I keep mine in a slip on the Indian River in Melbourne, Fl. It is perfect for the river, it is a great little day sailor, and as an occasional overnighter. I would buy it again.

Phil


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## Sal Paradise (Sep 14, 2012)

Hmm, the old 2 cycle motor could be a worry. If that tests well at least in a barrell ( run it for half an hour at least) then agree the high end would be $2k. If the motor won't run, then $1000 might be an offer.


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## sony2000 (Jan 30, 2013)

It was made in the same community that produced the Bluenose l and ll, in Nova Scotia, Canada. All that to say, they knew what they were doing.
When I wanted a 29 footer or there abouts, I came across a 1973 Paceship 29 CB in partial rebuild, that it maybe the last one built. So I continued the rebuild with used parts, because boats are worth not much anyway. 
I'll see if I can load a good picture of my new asset.


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## Kper (Mar 23, 2013)

Sony2000, that could be exactly what I looked at. We recently sold our Catalina 25 so the PY23 was a bit on the small side for us but I couldn't resist stopping and inquiring. Was fun looking and conversing with the owner.


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## Kper (Mar 23, 2013)

Sal Paradise said:


> Hmm, the old 2 cycle motor could be a worry. If that tests well at least in a barrell ( run it for half an hour at least) then agree the high end would be $2k. If the motor won't run, then $1000 might be an offer.


Does your price include the trailer? I had placed a mental estimate of the trailer itself at about $1000.


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## Sal Paradise (Sep 14, 2012)

Yes. The trailer makes it all worthwhile and do able but its just included with the boat. 

I would pursue it because it has a trailer. That means go get it and bring it home. If the trailer is really beautiful then put something extra, like maybe $300, into the price. But Yes I include the trailer in the $1k- $2k price.


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## Kper (Mar 23, 2013)

Thank you.


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## norahs arc (Jan 23, 2013)

Re PY 23 - I have sailed past lots of them. Paceship made a fixed keel 23' that is a good boat but the PY 23 is a keel/centerboard and pretty slow. That said they were well built and very good looking - just more of a motor sailor than sailboat from what I have seen. I have even passed one while I was sailing (Catalina 27) and he was motoring with a 9.9 HP outboard just screaming. The sailing qualities do not impress me at all. But they are pretty!


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## JimsCAL (May 23, 2007)

norahs arc said:


> Re PY 23 - I have sailed past lots of them. Paceship made a fixed keel 23' that is a good boat but the PY 23 is a keel/centerboard and pretty slow. That said they were well built and very good looking - just more of a motor sailor than sailboat from what I have seen. I have even passed one while I was sailing (Catalina 27) and he was motoring with a 9.9 HP outboard just screaming. The sailing qualities do not impress me at all. But they are pretty!


Not sure we're talking about the same boat. There was a Paceship 23 in our club a number of years ago and I always thought it was a nice looking boat. Similar to the ODays and Catalinas of the same era. It rates PHRF 246, versus a Cat 22 at 270 and a Cat 25 at 228, so pretty competitive.


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## sony2000 (Jan 30, 2013)

Paceship had 2, 23s. The PY23 and the P23. The latter, which is the oldest, is a C&C design, from before they started making their own boats. Then the design changed to a PY23, from a different designer.
The trailers from that period are two axel and could sell for $1500 today. With larger tires they can haul up to 9000 lbs on the 14.5 rims.


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

PHRF on the C&C design 23 is 237 and the Deknatel (Hunt) design PY23 is 240


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## Kper (Mar 23, 2013)

Maybe if I post.....


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## Kper (Mar 23, 2013)

... a few more times....


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## Kper (Mar 23, 2013)

... I can pass the magic 10 post number and post some pics.


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## Kper (Mar 23, 2013)




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## Squidd (Sep 26, 2011)

They clean up nice...


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

That's the later PY23. It'll buff out - they have a pretty good rep.


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## Sal Paradise (Sep 14, 2012)

I like it! Very Pretty.....and the fact that its sitting in a barn is huge. No water to penetrate the deck. Obviously, wheel bearings, tires, lights, motor....all potential work but still looks very feasible. There are few things as satisfying as bringing them back from the edge of oblivion.


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## Kper (Mar 23, 2013)

What do you all think of the single axle trailer? I wouldn't think of putting a single axle under our old C25. I know, the C25 is bigger, but this one isn't much smaller than our 25. It would appear to me that this trailer would be close to overloaded. No?


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## Sal Paradise (Sep 14, 2012)

Its fine. Looks like a decent trailer. The rollers bother me, but I have bunks maybe thats fine.. is there a support plate or beam on the trailer to hold up the keel? That's one thing I would want to see. My trailer has a keel support built in.

My C22 looks kind of overloaded on the trailer - looks like that...here is a pic. But it works fine and I'm fairly confident in it.



















Looks too small but apparently its fine and there are many like this. I think its fine. If in doubt you can look for a manufacturer plate of course.


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## Mobnets (Apr 24, 2011)

I owned a 1977 PY23 for several years. It was our "starter sailboat" and got my wife hooked on sailboats so much that she wanted a bigger one . . . our only reason for selling our PY23. I would buy another without hesitation. As a previous poster mentioned, it is a good-looking boat. It has about as nice an interior layout and use of space as you'll find in a reasonably-priced boat of that size and it's built pretty well, so even "bringing one back from considerable neglect is feasible. But at least from the looks of the boat in your pictures, this one appears to be in pretty good shape.

About 900 PY23's were built between 1973 and 1981. They were available as keel/centerboard or fixed keel versions. The 73 and 74 models were built in Mahone Bay, Nova Scotia and the 75 to 81 models were built by AMF in CT. The early, Canadian-built boats had wooden toerails, gold-colored anodized spars, and no anchor well built into the foredeck. The AMF-built boats have a slotted aluminum toerail, black spars, and a covered anchor well built into the foredeck. Otherwise, they are basically identical.

You are looking at a later model (1975-81) keel/centerboard version.

The single axle trailer will do fine if it is otherwise in good shape and has some sort of keel-guide/support built into it.

There is a tremendous amount of information (including downloadable owner's manuals) and support on the Paceship Owner's Website www.paceship.org

Regards,
Mobnets

1973 Paceship Chance 32/28 "Westwind"


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## littlewing (Aug 15, 2016)

I owned this PY 23,"Wings" from 1995 through '98,when I finally sold it to a young couple in Kansas City ... I sailed it on Lake superior for three years in the Apostle Islands ..... When I bought it from a broker on lake Minnitonka,just west of the twin cities,in Minnesota... It came with 5 bags and a brand new,in the box,Evinrude 6 horse... Just happened to be looking for Paceships on the internet,and boom! There it was ... this is a very quick little boat,and sails like a dream ... Sailed it to Isle Royal once from the Apostle Islands,(about 240 nautical mile RT),on a full moon!


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## littlewing (Aug 15, 2016)

Kper said:


> What do you all think of the single axle trailer? I wouldn't think of putting a single axle under our old C25. I know, the C25 is bigger, but this one isn't much smaller than our 25. It would appear to me that this trailer would be close to overload
> 
> I pulled that boat on that trailer from Lake Superior to Elephant Butte New Mexico,(3200 mile RT),3 years straight ....


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## NJAYNES (Jul 25, 2012)

Currently working at restoring a Helms 25 but recently took on a PY23 as a favor to an elder gentleman who lived on it in a marina and due to health issues could no longer navigate getting on and off the boat. He was trying to ditch the marina bill and offered it to us for a couple of hundred. When we titled it the hull number began with FLZ and ended with 76 so it evidently was a title applied for with no apparent hull number. It does have a teak toerail and no anchor locker on the bow, so thanks to you, we have a better idea of the actual year. We will haul her as soon as my better half finishes modifying the trailer the Helms came on. Looks like she may be missing the swing keel. The line and cleat are gone and a probe doesn't tell us if the keel is there or oyster shell. Anyway, appreciate the information about her age very much. She seems to still be sound.


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## Jim Sheegog (Dec 10, 2016)

I sailed a 1979 PY26 for a decade around the Morehead City, NC area. Mine had a 9 hp Yanmar diesel. The boat was a very good teacher, as it was simple to handle. The boat sailed well in coastal conditions and was reasonably fast. In Oriental, the PY 26 won a number of club races in it's day. There is a PY23 moored here at Wrightsville Beach. I believe they are durable and well designed small boats.


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## Skipper Skip (1 mo ago)

I purchased this boat today. First sail boat. It is not in as good of shape as it was 10 years ago in your pictures. Its been uncovered for some time, but it isn't in horrible shape. Going to bring her back to life. Should be fun.


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