# Gunboat sues Chinese boatyard...



## JonEisberg (Dec 3, 2010)

Ooops, not the sort of thing you'll read in the Gunboat ads, or in fawning praise we'e been hearing from the yachting press over the years...

;-)



> "Almost immediately after delivery of each of the completed vessels to Gunboat's customers, Gunboat began receiving complaints from said customers regarding the integrity of the vessels and/or components manufactured by HYM," said the amended complaint, which was filed in August.


Hmmm, where next to build their bigger boats? Turkey, perhaps?

Gunboat International sues Chinese boatyard | Trade Only Today


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## goat (Feb 23, 2014)

Funny, I always equate the quality of Chinese manufacturing with the fine products found in Wal-Mart. Who'd thought Gunboat would have had trouble?

goat


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## JonEisberg (Dec 3, 2010)

goat said:


> Funny, I always equate the quality of Chinese manufacturing with the fine products found in Wal-Mart. Who'd thought Gunboat would have had trouble?
> 
> goat


Well, if you take a close look at an Outbound, or a Marlow Explorer motor yacht, I think that might change your impression pretty quickly...

;-)

The Chinese have shown they are capable of putting out a very high level of quality. It's all about supervision and oversight of the manufacturing process, from what I hear... Sounds like Gunboat might not have had the right people in place at the yard to do their due diligence...


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## Stumble (Feb 2, 2012)

Some Chinese stuff is absolute junk, some of it is best in class quality. It really isn't as simple as just painting with that broad a brush.


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## Maine Sail (Jan 6, 2003)

I am having a hard time feeling empathy for Gunboat on this one....


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## smackdaddy (Aug 13, 2008)

Oh sure...blame the Chinese.


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## IStream (Dec 15, 2013)

I don't blame the Chinese. The rules in China are pretty simple and have been self-evident for some time. The default is that corners will be cut and designs will be copied. It takes a lot of time, money, and effort to install enough supervision, process checks, and intellectual property safeguards to keep bad things from happening if you manufacture there. For some products it's worth it, for others not and it's up to the company to decide appropriately. Once you do decide to manufacture in China, it's you're own damn fault if you get an inferior product, either because you were willfully ignorant or too greedy for that last 1% profit to put the necessary safeguards in place.


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## goat (Feb 23, 2014)

JonEisberg said:


> Well, if you take a close look at an Outbound, or a Marlow Explorer motor yacht, I think that might change your impression pretty quickly...
> 
> ;-)
> 
> The Chinese have shown they are capable of putting out a very high level of quality. It's all about supervision and oversight of the manufacturing process, from what I hear... Sounds like Gunboat might not have had the right people in place at the yard to do their due diligence...


Next you'll be saying Rocnas are well made.....sheesh ;^)

goat (stirring the pot)


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## smackdaddy (Aug 13, 2008)

It's interesting - this is the website for "HH Catamarans" - a division of HYM. Do these look familiar (pink notwithstanding)?










HH Catamarans



> In addition, the company and its owner, Hudson Wang, launched a "knockoff brand" of carbon fiber catamarans despite having signed a non-compete contract, Johnstone said.
> 
> It also said Hudson "deliberately, willfully and maliciously obtained Gunboat's trade secrets with the intention of utilizing said trade secrets in connection with, and incorporating them into, the competing HH Catamaran 55 and 66 series, and HYM and Wang did in fact appropriate and utilize said trade secrets for their own benefit and profit."


Caveat Emptor.


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## Don L (Aug 8, 2008)

Next headline will be "Owners sue Gunboat for poor quality"


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## krisscross (Feb 22, 2013)

Suing a Chinese company is about as productive as barking at the moon. Watch the Gunboat fold in the next year or so.


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## capta (Jun 27, 2011)

Isn't there a gunboat still drifting around in the Atlantic that was abandoned by a professional crew with full fuel tanks, but no rig, just a few hundred miles from shore (well within range of this vessel under power, I believe)?
I should think that would be enough to suggest to people that these boats might not be the best place to sink a million plus dollars, no matter how 'cool' they look or what the advertising says?


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## RobGallagher (Aug 22, 2001)

It's all very simple. Chinese factories will do their best to build what you want at the price point and quality that you desire. They want repeat business just like any other factory. Now, the tricky part is, do they have the craftsman and the experience to build what you want?

You don't hire out a MacGregor (I'm not picking on McGregor, just as an example) factory to make a Hinckley, it just isn't realistic. Now, if you call up a McGregor factory and offer them $XXX$ to build you Hinckley Yachts they will most likely say they can do it and give it a go. Why wouldn't they want to try to generate revenue and create more jobs at the factory?

Every time you see something made in China that is junk, you can blame the importer and the realtor. The right factory in China (or anyplace else) can produce what you want at the quality you want.

If Gunboat wanted the quality, they would have had their own people on the ground doing the work, inspections and surveys. If Gunboat chose to cut corners with cheaper inexperienced labor, inferior materials, and poor management, then they have no one else to blame but themselves for farming out the work.


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## UnionPacific (Dec 31, 2013)

They should have used Ta Yang in Taiwan.
They have been building the worlds best yachts for 40 years.....
I guess child labor in China saves some money.


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## SHNOOL (Jun 7, 2007)

Why do I feel like we should hear Bob Perry's thoughts on this? More than a few of his designs wound up being built overseas for sure.



> They should have used Ta Yang in Taiwan


 case in point.


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## PCP (Dec 1, 2004)

JonEisberg said:


> Ooops, not the sort of thing you'll read in the Gunboat ads, or in fawning praise we'e been hearing from the yachting press over the years...
> 
> ;-)
> 
> ...


Turkey makes great sailboats:






They are making now the biggest sailing yacht that contrary to what I would expect is a beautiful even if futuristic sailboat.


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## Minnesail (Feb 19, 2013)

I recently had the great pleasure of opening up an Illustrator file and changing "Made in China" to "Made in U.S.A." and sending it out to our presses to print.

I know that China beats us on price, but we beat them on deadline turnaround and (I'm guessing) cleanliness. The printed piece in question will come in contact with food and we're licensed and certified for producing food safe products. It's like a previous poster said, I'm sure you could get equally safe products from China, but you'd have to have someone to be on the scene to verify it. I guess it was cheaper to have it made here.

The real irony is that the customer in question has the word "Oriental" in their name


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## davidpm (Oct 22, 2007)

I just found out that some significant portion of the Iphone is manufactured in Germany, not exactly known as the cheapest company.

With world wide sourcing the norm now a mfr. can pick pretty much anything they want.


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## UnionPacific (Dec 31, 2013)

davidpm said:


> I just found out that some significant portion of the Iphone is manufactured in Germany, not exactly known as the cheapest company.
> 
> With world wide sourcing the norm now a mfr. can pick pretty much anything they want.


Last time I checked it was made by foxconn? In China, by children.


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## Rhapsody-NS27 (Apr 8, 2012)

UnionPacific said:


> Last time I checked it was made by foxconn? In China, by children.


He's talking about the components inside the phone, not the phone itself.


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## killarney_sailor (May 4, 2006)

The article said the company is Taiwan-based. Are Gunboats built in China or in Taiwan? I am sure the PRC would be pleased to have a Taiwan factory described as 'Chinese', perhaps not most Taiwanese.


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## Markwesti (Jan 1, 2013)

This is a good read .
Latitude 38 - 'Lectronic Latitude


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## Rocky Mountain Breeze (Mar 30, 2015)

The worst part of manufacturing anything in China is that they will steal the designs, technology, and any tooling they are exposed to because there are NO legal protections for intellectual property there. As was stated, buyer beware.....


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## smackdaddy (Aug 13, 2008)

Markwesti said:


> This is a good read .
> Latitude 38 - 'Lectronic Latitude


What was the photo boat collision?


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## capta (Jun 27, 2011)

Having had several jobs overseeing repairs and reconstructions to commercial vessels in shipyards, as owners representative on some major yacht rebuilds and a new construction of a 5 million+ dollar yacht, I find it hard to imagine that Gunboat wouldn't have someone in China protecting their interests.
Perhaps good help is hard to come by these days when you only get 1.5 million for a 50 foot cat.


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## Shockwave (Feb 4, 2014)

At the end of the day... 
Gunboat
Failed in South Africa
Failed in China
Failed in the USA
Failed in Europe

The constant seems to be Gunboat.


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## krisscross (Feb 22, 2013)

Markwesti said:


> This is a good read .
> Latitude 38 - 'Lectronic Latitude


 Very predictable.



krisscross said:


> Suing a Chinese company is about as productive as barking at the moon. Watch the Gunboat fold in the next year or so.


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## cdy (Nov 10, 2013)

Don't get it , the big sailing magazines raved about the boat, greatest thing since sliced bread, then shortly after they start falling apart, 

Did notice the full page ads for the boat in same mag ...


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## Stumble (Feb 2, 2012)

smackdaddy said:


> What was the photo boat collision?


During a photo shoot for Boat of the Year the chase boat driven by a Sailing Word employee drove in between the hulls. The rib was sliced by the daggerboard, destroying the rib, and cut through the engine block. During this the foil casing was damaged, the foil was mangled, and the rudder gudgeons were damaged.

So far the magazine has refused all liability for the incident.


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## miatapaul (Dec 15, 2006)

cdy said:


> Don't get it , the big sailing magazines raved about the boat, greatest thing since sliced bread, then shortly after they start falling apart,
> 
> Did notice the full page ads for the boat in same mag ...


Well obviously advertising plays a big roll, but the magazines basically say every boat is awesome. Rarely do you ever see anything critical in the magazines, just like auto (Auto mags at least do comparisons, with pros and cons) and other magazines that survive on selling advertising. So if you are expecting them to be any help with making a buying decision then your sadly mistaken. But then again if you have the kind of money it takes to buy one of these you have to understand you are on the cutting edge of technology and expect to have some teething issues. Also these owners seem to be making really stupid mistakes, like heading off into known bad conditions. The hubris of the owners is doing as much damage to the companies as the issues with the boats.


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## smackdaddy (Aug 13, 2008)

Stumble said:


> During a photo shoot for Boat of the Year the chase boat driven by a Sailing Word employee drove in between the hulls. The rip was sliced by the daggerboard, destroying the rib, and cut through the engine block. During this the foil casing was damaged, the foil was mangled, and the rudder gudgeons were damaged.
> 
> So far the magazine has refused all liability for the incident.


Holy crap - those guys can't catch a break. Wait - poor choice of words.


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## Stumble (Feb 2, 2012)

smackdaddy said:


> Holy crap - those guys can't catch a break. Wait - poor choice of words.


Seriously... The G4 was being driven by a SW BOTY judge, the rib was being driven by a SW BOTY judge, but somehow SW is claiming they have no responsibility for the damage done.

GB as I understand it was also presented with a bill for the damage to the rib.


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## smackdaddy (Aug 13, 2008)

Stumble said:


> Seriously... The G4 was being driven by a SW BOTY judge, the rib was being driven by a SW BOTY judge, but somehow SW is claiming they have no responsibility for the damage done.
> 
> GB as I understand it was also presented with a bill for the damage to the rib.


Sounds like they need a good attorney.


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## Stumble (Feb 2, 2012)

Assuming what I am hearing is correct I would love to see the damage to the engine block and foil. I would have expected that the foil would have disintegrated as soon as it hit an engine block, not sliced through it.


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## PaulinVictoria (Aug 23, 2009)

miatapaul said:


> The hubris of the owners is doing as much damage to the companies as the issues with the boats.


Perhaps if Gunboat had made monohulls they would have been purchased by a better class of sailor? :devil


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## seaner97 (May 15, 2011)

krisscross said:


> Suing a Chinese company is about as productive as barking at the moon. Watch the Gunboat fold in the next year or so.


Good call.


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## miatapaul (Dec 15, 2006)

PaulinVictoria said:


> Perhaps if Gunboat had made monohulls they would have been purchased by a better class of sailor? :devil


Well monohulls are prone to go out in rough conditions as well as we saw with Bounty. But it really did not make much sense to go when they did. (Rainmaker) But they of course had a schedule to keep. And they seemed to think their boat was indestructible.

Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk


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