# Abacos or BVI



## caberg (Jul 26, 2012)

Pros and cons for Abacos vs. BVI (Tortola) for first charter, aiming for mid-May for one week? It's wife, 5 year old, and me.

Our desires (in a perfect world), in no particular order:

* moderate winds (~15)--prefer less to more given limitations of having wife and young son on board.
* warm weather (80s)
* uncrowded anchorages and beaches
* or, the ability to pass by crowded spots and find something more out of the way that is quieter
* easy navigation
* more than 2, less than 5, hour hops between stops

We're less interested in what's on land (bars, restaurants, etc.), and actually prefer to get away from that stuff if possible (though a quiet bar on a secluded beach would get some business from us).

My research tells me that in and around Abacos can be very shallow, maybe adding a mark in favor of BVI. Other than that, I haven't been able to discern a large difference between the two areas.

So, what do you folks think?


----------



## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

Night and Day, particularly for a sailboat. BVI wins hands down. More places like you describe than you'll ever get to in one trip. All nearby. Easy to fly to as well, unlike Abaco.


----------



## waterwks4me (Jan 16, 2010)

Have to agree with minniwaska BVI definitely. So many places to sail to and explore. The Baths,Norman Cay, Bitter End, Foxxy's, etc


----------



## BGallinger (Oct 14, 2009)

I looked into chartering in Abacos. I was shocked to find out they wanted a $4500 CASH (or certified check) damage deposit on the boat in addition to the $4500 rental for a week. Then I found out I was limited to going 10 miles north, and 10 miles south from the marina. I was really interested in a charter at Georgetown, Exumas but the reviews were terrible. Go BVI!


----------



## caberg (Jul 26, 2012)

Okay, thanks for the feedback. From browsing around the forum and elsewhere, it did seem that BVI is the more popular charter destination. Just don't want to be overlooking anything. With wife and kid, the actual sailing is somewhat (unfortunately) secondary to having easy cruising grounds and nice, relaxing anchorages, especially for a first charter in new waters. I had the sense that BVI has the better sailing conditions, but wasn't sure about some of the other considerations. Part of the goal is to have so much fun that wife can't wait to book the next one.

As for getting there, it's about the same travel time to either Marsh Harbor or Tortola from where I'm at, and Marsh Harbor is actually showing cheaper airfare right now. Both places have Sunsail and Moorings, so I'd think that those would be pretty consistent from one location to the other.


----------



## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

In BVI you can decide everyday what you're looking for. Secluded. Popular. Beach restaurant. They have it all within a couple of hours. Abaco is very limited by comparison and, while you can sail, it is more useful for the sport fisherman.


----------



## Tim R. (Mar 23, 2003)

We have been to both and like them both for different reasons. I would say go to BVI. Although there are a limited number of what I would consider secluded anchorages there but more than the Abacos. The Abacos is very shallow and wind direction will likely determine your next destination. Most harbors in the Abacos are not clean enough for swimming. Boats dump overboard because there are no pump-outs. The BVIs have enough current running through to keep them fairly clean. Definitely easier sailing in the BVIs. Less land stuff and restaurants in the Abacos but still very beautiful. The eastern side of the islands have absolutely stunning secluded beaches with some great snorkeling.

Check out my website below for more info on both destinations.


----------



## fallard (Nov 30, 2009)

The BVI are the classic bareboat charter grounds, but if you want uncrowded anchorages and don't care that much for the beach bar scene, you might consider chartering out of Red Hook on St. Thomas, USVI. You could explore the north side of St. John (Leinster Bay is one of our favorite stops) and the south side is even more secluded (Salt Pond Bay, Lameshur Bays). Your activities would be the beaches and you could take short hikes. You'd be mostly on your own for meals, however. You could pick up a mooring in Caneel Bay and dinghy into bustling Cruz Bay if you want restaurants. You could do a leisurely circumnavigation of St. John in a week.

The scene on St. John is more appropriate for a 5 yr old, IMHO, than a lot of the BVI. But if you are set on the BVI and sailing out of Road Town, you might take a mooring in the Bight at Norman Island and enjoy the beach by the restaurant. Moving east, you might consider Great Harbour on Peter Island, but your next stop might be Virgin Gorda. With a young child, you might consider taking a slip at the Yacht Harbor at Spanish Town and taking a taxi to the Baths, which would be the highlight of your trip. Another stop might be Marina Cay, which also has a family-friendly Pusser's restaurant and a kid-friendly beach, but the water isn't the cleanest here. Working your way around Tortola, another stop might be Jost van Dyke. You could pick up a mooring in Great Harbour and take a taxi to White Bay, where you could get a pain killer at the Soggy Dollar Bar and enjoy their beach. The 4-course dinner at the attached Sand Castle hotel is another winner. You could check out Foxy's at Great Harbour, where you can get a meal, but it's more of an adult scene in the evening. Given your interest in gentle sailing, you need to be aware that moving in an easterly direction on either side of Tortola is going to be a slog to weather. If it's very windy you might consider motoring if you need to go any distance in this direction.


----------



## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

Lots of kids in BVI, but some of the restaurants are adult scenes at night. Most are quiet during the day. The cab to the Baths is a decent idea, because you must take a mooring if you sail there and there is a time limit as well, IIRC. I've never done it, however, so I'm not sure how you get one back. It is an absolute must see stop for adults and kids. Do not miss it.

Another good spot for kids is the Bitter End Yacht Club (not really a yacht club, its a resort) at the farthest eastern end of Virgin Gorda. You can anchor off it in sand or take a mooring. They show movies, rent hobies, kayaks too I think. Nice restaurant.

BVI is the most laid back place in general. You will find plenty of places to relax and get away from it all. That's what everyone is there to do.


----------



## caberg (Jul 26, 2012)

USVI is a great suggestion. Thanks. We can get to St. Thomas by direct flight. Actually, if going to BVI, we'd fly into St. Thomas and then fly or ferry to BVI. I just hadn't read much about chartering out of St. Thomas, and around St. John. Initially it seemed like a limited sailing area (assuming we didn't want to clear in to BVI, which we wouldn't on a one week charter). But, maybe crusing around St. John would be a perfect intro to the area. Looks like mostly moorings in the national park anchorages, which is good, because who wants to worry about dragging in unfamiliar water?


----------



## fallard (Nov 30, 2009)

There are charters available in several places on St. Thomas. We have chartered at least a half dozen times from Island Yachts in Red Hook, which is a hop, skip, and jump to St. John. We've done the USVI-BVI scene 4-5 times and the check-in procedures are a nuisance, but tolerable. If you've got a week-long charter with the little one, you might consider the following itinerary out of Red Hook: Day 1 & 2 - sail/motor to Leinster Bay. Enjoy the beach, which you can snorkel from and maybe hike to the Annaberg sugar mill. You'll be eating on your boat. Day 3 - sail and mostly motor (you want to spend more time at the Baths and can sail another day) to Virgin Gorda Yacht Harbor and take a slip. You'll check in (and out at the same time) at the customs facility next door to the marina. [The skipper only goes to customs and will pick up forms for the crew to sign. He will bring them back with passports and pay the requisite fees. This process could take an hour if you have to go back and forth to the boat.] Take a taxi to the top of the Baths and hike down to enjoy this fabulous area. Consider it a beach stop for the young one, but you'll be hiking through the boulders (20+ min each direction) to a really nice beach (no facilities) at the west end of the baths. Bring your snorkel. There is a good restaurant up top that you might consider to treat yourself that night. You'll want to take a taxi back to the marina for a shower and change. You can eat at the pub style restaurant at the marina, but only if you have to. If you care to, you can splurge on a taxi back to a nice dinner at the Top of the Baths ($$--but you get what you pay for). I seem to remember it was $5/person each way 2 years ago for the taxi, but this will be a day to remember. Day 4 - top off your water and pick up any additional provisions at the marina before sailing westward in the Drake Channel on your way to Caneel Bay. You are required by law to check in at US customs (everybody has to show up in person) at Cruz Bay. You pick up a mooring anywhere to the west of Caneel Bay and dinghy into Cruz Bay and don't forget to lock the dinghy. You may want to check out the shops and maybe have another dinner ashore. You'll be on a park mooring that night. Days 5-6 you can explore the bays east of Caneel Bay or go around St. John in either direction to Salt Pond Bay (another of our favorites), which has a nice beach, but no facilities. You can hike over to close-by Drunk Bay, past the salt pond. An alternate is either of the Lameshur Bays if the moorings are taken. The last day is an easy jog back to Red Hook to turn the boat in. BTW, you can check out the boating scene at http://www.nps.gov/viis/planyourvisit/upload/MooringGuide.pdf. Note that the moorings are $15 in the US vs. at least $25 in the BVI and you will have to use them on this itinerary.


----------



## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

In the BVI, plan to get to a mooring field between 2pm - 3pm to be sure you get mooring, if that's what you prefer. However, if it isn't forecast to blow like stink, the sand is usually pretty easy to anchor in. I've sailed in the USVI, but had a slip. The 2-3 rule of thumb has worked in many places I've been, so assume its good there too.


----------



## Cruzan1 (Feb 23, 2012)

I've done both, Abacos and BVI. Chartering, Capt'ing, and deliveries. Hands down the VI's win, especially with the 5 year old. My daughter is 3 and we just got home after 8 days down there. 

Don't discount the "land" scene. Most of the restaraunts/bars are VERY kid friendly and it gives the kids a great break from the boat, plus interaction with other kids. Ivans - White Bay, Beach Bar - St. John, Skinny Legs - Coral Bay STJ, Capt Mulligans - Nanny Cay Tortola, Pirates Bight -Norman Island, Leverick Bay Marina - Virgin Gorda are all perfect for kids and you'll see lots of them running around and playing. The VI's are way more kid friendly than the Abacos. 

The Baths are another excellent shore excursion that the kids love. 
Make sure you get a mask+snorkel for your little ones. Lot's of good shallow spots for them to play in the water and view the fish. 

Cheers


----------



## Vasco (Sep 24, 2006)

For a first time charterer BVI is the best bet. All deep water, eyeball navigation. The main reason I'd say no to Abaco is the weather. BVI you're more or less guaranteed, 84 degrees and sunny. But in Abaco your week might be ruined by a cold front. Cool, cloudy,blowing. Not the best for a first charter.


----------



## caberg (Jul 26, 2012)

Wow, thanks everyone. fallard, you have shared some invaluable info. Those Island Packets at Island Yachts are beautiful boats. I'm liking the idea of chartering out of St. Thomas. Thanks again.


----------



## FarCry (Apr 21, 2007)

Do take a look at CYOA as well. I've nothing bad to say about Island Yachts. The biggest differences seem to be the vessel options and location on St Thomas. Both companies have a solid reputation with many repeat customers.

Enjoy your trip.


----------



## rockDAWG (Sep 6, 2006)

May be this is off topic, just wonder how expensive the house or Apartment rental in USVI. I assume there is no restriction for US citizens stay in USVI in a long term basis. ???


----------



## fallard (Nov 30, 2009)

I don't have any experience with CYOA, but I've found a qualitative difference between the Island Packets and the typical Beneteau/Jenneau charter boats, having chartered from Moorings, Sunsail and others besides Island Yachts. The Island Packets won't appeal to racers, but may be more suitable for the kind of sailing you have in mind.

If you compare pricing, you'll find some differences among the charter companies, like 6 nights instead of 7 for a "week's charter". You might also consider the cost of an overnight on the boat before the charter starts. 

If you are considering a USVI start, Red Hook is more convenient to St. John than Charlotte Amalie, but it isn't a huge difference. Charlotte Amalie provides the duty free shopping and local vendor scene and is closer to the airport, however, but then you'd miss the taxi ride to Red Hook, which provides an introduction to the island culture and topography and some nice views. 

If you are going to St. Thomas for the first time, you ought to stay overnight in a B&B style hotel in the Charlotte Amalie area and check it out.


----------



## FarCry (Apr 21, 2007)

rockDAWG said:


> May be this is off topic, just wonder how expensive the house or Apartment rental in USVI. I assume there is no restriction for US citizens stay in USVI in a long term basis. ???


That's hard to answer. How expensive is a boat, car or house? It all depends on what the individual wants. Is housing expensive here compared to Manhattan? Probably not. Is housing expensive here compared to the boonies? Yes. Like most places in the states, location dictates price. If you want to live on the water in a house, break out lots of money. If you want a place to lay your head and don't care about anything else, it can be done for hundreds instead of thousands per month. For truly long term, unless you are very close to a main road, expect to rent a vehicle. Transportation costs can be high, along with food. The bright side is that alcohol is very cheap.:laugher

There are no restrictions for US citizens wishing to stay here, unless you are a wanted felon. If you want to do some reading I think just about everything can be answered at VImovingcenter dot com. If you can provide more specific questions I can attempt to answer your questions.


----------



## FarCry (Apr 21, 2007)

caberg said:


> Wow, thanks everyone. fallard, you have shared some invaluable info. Those Island Packets at Island Yachts are beautiful boats. I'm liking the idea of chartering out of St. Thomas. Thanks again.


If you haven't already been to TTOL (traveltalkonline dot com) you might venture over there and read more comments from people who have chartered in the area recently. The USVI and BVI boards are pretty active and you don't have to join to post or search.


----------



## rockDAWG (Sep 6, 2006)

FarCry said:


> If you can provide more specific questions I can attempt to answer your questions.


Thanks for the reply. It is a good start. I will looking in your suggested link. After I posted question, I looked up the housing cost (house, apt or share a room) on Craigslist. I got some ideas but varies depending the the location and the view.

It is still many years away, but just thinking ahead with the possibility of moving to VI. I know I can't stay on a boat year around. I need a land base home. Both my wife and I can get a part time job in teaching in the University Nursing School, Marine Biology or work in Hospital or clinics. I am sure by the time we are ready, the plan will be totally different. We may totally stay away from our career and chart a new course.

Have anyone shipped their car from FL to VI, just wonder if it is worth of trouble. i noticed that cars are worth more in VI than in mainland.


----------



## Geoff54 (Oct 30, 2011)

caberg said:


> Wow, thanks everyone. fallard, you have shared some invaluable info. Those Island Packets at Island Yachts are beautiful boats. I'm liking the idea of chartering out of St. Thomas. Thanks again.


I looked at the Island Packets this year but I needed to travel Saturday with a Sunday morning briefing.....and they close on Sunday! So I went back to good old, cheap and cheerful, Conch Charters. May or may not be an issue for you.


----------



## FarCry (Apr 21, 2007)

rockDAWG said:


> Thanks for the reply. It is a good start. I will looking in your suggested link. After I posted question, I looked up the housing cost (house, apt or share a room) on Craigslist. I got some ideas but varies depending the the location and the view.
> 
> It is still many years away, but just thinking ahead with the possibility of moving to VI. I know I can't stay on a boat year around. I need a land base home. Both my wife and I can get a part time job in teaching in the University Nursing School, Marine Biology or work in Hospital or clinics. I am sure by the time we are ready, the plan will be totally different. We may totally stay away from our career and chart a new course.
> 
> Have anyone shipped their car from FL to VI, just wonder if it is worth of trouble. i noticed that cars are worth more in VI than in mainland.


We shipped our vehicle from Colorado to St Thomas when we moved. It's up to you to decide if it's worth the trouble. Other than the $1k-$2k shipping fees you will be nailed by a variety of taxes and fees that must be paid before you can take possession. If you are really interested you may read more here Shipping and Registering a Car in the Virgin Islands - USVI Relocation Guide
Not sure cars are worth more here or just cost more to buy.


----------



## barefoot (Jul 19, 2012)

Yes , I agree whole heartedly. Red Hook is a great launch site.
Fallard seems to have right on the nose. I was there in february 2010 and although the weather maybe varied a little, like real estate it's all about location and these sailing grounds will not disappoint.


----------

