# 2 feared lost between Azores & Fin 6/May/18



## MarkofSeaLife

> MAYDAY MAYDAY MAYDAY
> HELP us finding Aldo and Antonio! SHARE, including vessels in the area.
> 
> On the 3rd of May, our friends, Aldo Revello and Antonio Voinea, two experienced skippers, disappeared when crossing the Atlantic, with their Oceanis 43 Clipper: "BRIGHT". The last signal from their EPIRB arrived between the Azores islands and Gibraltar, at 2 PM. Their last known position was: 37.35 N 17.57 W, some 300 miles from Punta Delgada coast. The family and the italian sailors community assume the were able to use the LIFERAFT, so now must be floating somewhere in the area. Although the meteo in the area is favourable for a long survival, the Portuguese authorities have taken the decision to STOP the SAR yesterday evening, after only 72 hours. All together, with their families, we are are asking to CONTINUE searching! Please help by sharing this message among the sailing community, including vessels that may be in the area. DO NOT LET ALDO and ANTONIO alone!


EPIRB fired.

Very early for that passage.

72 hours of search seems very short.... but I don't know the weather. Monday here in France Atlantic coast was a severe storm.


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## mbianka

Only about 400 miles from Lisbon too! Not sure but, aren't a lot of the cruise ships re-positioning this time of year? Would be nice if they could sail near those coordinates too. Hope they get picked up soon.


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## Sal Paradise

Mike that makes sense - many should be moving from Carribean to Med/ Europe now.


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## mbianka

I'm curious to find out how long their EPIRB was broadcasting it's signal?

Apparently the Italian Navy is sending a ship to the EPIRB's last known location expected to arrive in the area May 7th.
https://www.blitzquotidiano.it/cron...vello-antonio-voinea-ricerche-marina-2872932/


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## MarkofSeaLife

EPIRBS meant to last for 48 hours.
So what does SAR do? Head to epirb position and if no one is there and it's less than 48 hours call off the search? 

After 48 hours and no more epirb Ping then what do SAR do? 

We don't have any details about how many hours the EPIRB went on for and it's movement. 

I have 2 EPIRBS. I am thinking fire both off initially so the clowns know it's real, and then turn one off until one is dead. Then fire the other for 1 hour every 12 hours. 

What would you do?


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## mbianka

MarkofSeaLife said:


> EPIRBS meant to last for 48 hours.
> So what does SAR do? Head to epirb position and if no one is there and it's less than 48 hours call off the search?
> 
> After 48 hours and no more epirb Ping then what do SAR do?
> 
> We don't have any details about how many hours the EPIRB went on for and it's movement.
> 
> I have 2 EPIRBS. I am thinking fire both off initially so the clowns know it's real, and then turn one off until one is dead. Then fire the other for 1 hour every 12 hours.
> 
> What would you do?


Sounds like a good plan. Best to let your contact people know that's your plan so they can tell the SAR folks. I imagine a lot of time could be saved if they are already in the area when you fire off your second EPIRB after the first one runs out. Very sobering that even firing off an EPIRB within a couple hundred miles of land is still no guarantee you will be located in a timely manner.

BTW FYI Marine Traffic has SEA LIFE arriving at Dunkerque Neptune so your AIS is working fine. Wonder if the Italian sailors had AIS on board? I thought it was mandatory in Europe. Would not be helpful if their boat sank but, might help if another ship was in the area and they were disabled. My AIS transponder has a red button that sends out a distress message if I push it. When things are going to sheet why not use everything you got.


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## Arcb

Looks like the Italian Navy is getting in on it now, makes sense, they were Italian sailors in international waters. Think the normal procedure would be to drop a SLDMB at their last known ping and estimate drift patern. Hard to say if thats already been done.

Whether I fired everything or not might depend on the circumstances, if things were going downhill in a hurry, might fire everything. If the situation was relatively stable and I just needed a pick up, might just fire one.

https://www.prpchannel.com/en/PRP-c...wo-shipwrecked-sailor-Italian-to-wide-Azores/


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## davidpm

That sounds like a good idea. One continuous signal and one intermittent signal for the same location should be compelling.

Even better your shore person can tell them your plan so you would have potentially a few weeks of a signal.


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## outbound

If sliding down hill fire boats epirb and call sos on dsc,SSB,vhf. If falling off a cliff fire boats epirb, plbs, AIS, and call if you have time. Deploy raft and take boats epirb with you. Fire rafts epirb when boats epirb dies.


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## mrWinter

MarkofSeaLife said:


> EPIRBS meant to last for 48 hours.


Why are EPIRBS designed to work this way? Is there some technical reason they are limited so much? How are they different form a SPOT, which I assume given a larger battery could last for weeks... or months? Even with a couple double A's, isn't a SPOT better than an EPIRB pinging every few minutes for days? I must be missing something. Are SPOTS using cell towers or something and I just didn't know it? Whatever the EPIRB is doing must be very electrically intensive that it can only do it 48 times, assuming one ping an hour.


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## drew1711

EPIRBs ping continuously, not hourly. I'm guessing 48 hours is just an arbitrary industry standard based upon the fact that most boaters are coastal and 48 hrs. is plenty of time to get to someone within say 100 miles of shore. 

SPOT is not a replacement for or superior to an EPIRB. The latter is supported by military satellites that provide global coverage. SPOT is supported by a commercial system that excludes large portions of the planet. If you want to use a SPOT, just be sure and sink where there's coverage. There are other reasons EPIRBs are better but that one is enough for most of us.


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## SeaStar58

mrWinter said:


> Why are EPIRBS designed to work this way? Is there some technical reason they are limited so much? How are they different form a SPOT, which I assume given a larger battery could last for weeks... or months? Even with a couple double A's, isn't a SPOT better than an EPIRB pinging every few minutes for days? I must be missing something. Are SPOTS using cell towers or something and I just didn't know it? Whatever the EPIRB is doing must be very electrically intensive that it can only do it 48 times, assuming one ping an hour.


SPOT is more for friends and family to track you along with give an I'm OK, I'm not doing so well, I need help and MAYDAY Alert Buttons while EPIRB is more of a emergency beacon.

Many go out with both to cover all the bases. SPOT is nice because it will show your coarse and any diversions along with provide for regular check points where you just have to press the appropriate alert button to let your people know how your doing. Some will arrange that if they miss 2 or 3 "I'm Ok" checkpoints through SPOT friends or family will start calling out for assistance.

Redundancy is a great thing when the going gets rough. Some will even keep their old EPIRB and flares once they are past their expiration date. So what if of the handful of old flares only 3 out of 4 fires as you still could have a dozen extra flares to fire off before you start using the new ones plus having an extra 12 to 36 or whatever hours of signal from the old EPIRB could end up making a big difference. Yes the registration number broadcast by the old EPIRB won't be current however there will still be an emergency locator signal to be picked up showing your location.


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## Minnewaska

MarkofSeaLife said:


> .....What would you do?


The SARSAT system has protocol designed to first determine if the alarm is legitimate. Then, once they believe it is, they have no idea what the emergency actually is. It could be medical, it could just be adrift, it could be all souls in the raft, it could be a soul missing. The less severe might be accommodated by an AMVER ship diversion a couple of days away. The more severe requiring an airlift, if it's even possible. They can't know.

Ideally, I would want a satellite communicator, along with the EPIRB. A sat phone is best, but even an InReach would be very useful. You can now communicate exactly what is wrong and your status. If the crew has relocated to the raft, having the time and presence of mind to bring it along is a variable.


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## mrWinter

drew1711 said:


> EPIRBs ping continuously, not hourly.


So, sounds like the main technical difference is that EPIRBS ping constantly and use military sattelites that cover the whole world, where SPOTS ping intermittently and use commercial satellites which don't cover the whole globe. I have to wonder why EPIRBS were designed to ping constantly, rather than working or having a mode to work like MarkofSeaLife suggests, pinging less frequently and lasting more than two days. If the main point of using EPIRB is that it's for way-out-there locations, where commercial satellite connections don't work, (like SPOT), then the whole point is that you might not be reached in a couple days.


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## Arcb

There are a quite a few other differences between EPIRB and SPOT, some of the biggest differences were listed above, but an entire thread could easily be dedicated to the difference. SPOT is no replacement for a proper EPIRB.

Some further differences aside from those listed above. In addition to the 406 Mhz satellite signal, EPIRB also transmit 121.5 Mhz homing signal which can be used as a homing signal using Radio Direction Finding Equipment by Search and Rescue units on the scene. 

Another biggy is the better EPIRBs are float free auto activation units. Basically, if a boat sinks, the units are released from a specially designed housing, float free of the wreckage and activate automatically with no human intervention. SPOTs have a little flap covering the trigger, you need to lift the flap and hold down the trigger, then hold the unit clear of any interference/wreckage for up to 20 minutes before the signal gets out. 

There are other differences as well, these are just a couple.


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## outbound

On the epirb recertification if I remember correctly you list 2 contacts other than yourself. I used my daughters as they know when I go voyaging. I both have them and others on my spot contacts lists as well. I further email them via SSB or sat phone periodically. 
When thinking about this believe you need to establish two scenarios. 
Slow burn
Call for help via satphone voice call to a reliable person. That person needs to be pre educated as to how to relay information to CG and/or local authorities near your location. Arrange system for continued survalance of situation and test it. Details may vary depending on circumstances but this too should be outlined and tested before you leave.
Continue to use your spot and decrease your footprint intervals. We routinely manually set it off change of watch( to make sure it’s looked at and batteries are good) as wells leaving breadcrumbs.
Voice call if and when you deploy raft giving expected drift, conditions of souls aboard, and location.
Second voice call when everyone is hopefully in the raft and confirming it’s floating.
For these functions satphone is better than in reach or spot.
Learn your SSB and vhf dsc functions. Most have multiple preset messages. Know them and how to use them. Take one or two handhelds with you upon leaving. We leave ours on their chargers even though they are never used offshore. 
Leave the boat with satphone, at least one vhf, the spot and/or Inreach and what ever epirbs, PLBs or AIS personal devices you have.
Light up the sky. Numbers are lousy once you get past 48h
Fast burn
Epirb you and crew into the raft. Get whatever additional devices you can collect before leaving. I assign a crew to do this before leaving but show everyone on the boat where everything is just in case.


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## MarkofSeaLife

Whilst I agree with @outbound I use a different strategy.

Excluding the nincompoops who think all the gps satellites will fall out of the sky...

If I get into trouble I want time to fix it before the cavalry appears over the horizon.

If you hit the Red button you lose your boat.

So I have an Overdue Date of the passage length at 2 knots plus 1 day. If I lose the rig at sea etc, I want time to fix a jury rig and get close to port for a tow.

If the disaster is catastrophic and I am dead well it doesn't really matter if family was prewarned.

However if family expect a Blip every four hours and nothing comes through after 6 hours some families will panic and ring the Coast Guard. 
I want more than 2 hours. I want several days.

Spot can be a problem. A few years ago a guy crewing on his first offshore passage was having such a great time he didn't notice his Spot was turned off...... Until, of course, some bloody big helicopter hovered over the boat trying to 'save' them.

If you are going to sea you are kinda signing a warrrent for danger. What a lawyer would call Volenti Non Fit Injuria - a voluntary assumption of risk. You go to sea and you might stub your toe.

If you hear a 'Ping' from me from EPIRB you can safely guess that I screwed up and unless I am very lucky I am in deep trouble. Deep being the operative word.

And please don't say "Mark was doing something he loved" because I don't enjoy dying. &#55357;&#56898;

Mark


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## capta

When we had a medical emergency in the Bahamas aboard 131' liveaboard dive boat, I used a cell phone (back when they were dollars a minute for international calls) to contact the USCG directly. No misunderstanding, no bothersome interruptions by other vessels or signal fade.
Direct, verbal connection is by far the best, IMO. I'll go for satphone as my go to emergency communicator, should the need arise, at any cost!


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## outbound

Mark you’re right. I left out my daughters, wife or whoever is tracking us have been taught to not hit the panic button solely on the basis of the spot. They know that we routinely check in periodically and only if we miss a check in and attempts to reach us fail to start to get really nervous. 
For instance the batteries did fail on the spot just after a watch change. We had a bit of weather so there was an interval until the next routine manual spot trigger. Was distracted by the vang fitting failing where it attaches to the boom. So lashing the vang to the boom with dyneema kept us on deck and focused on that task. So nearly 6h passed by before that it was noticed there was no breadcrumbs going out. My wife called our weather router knowing we would talk to him later in the day. When we did he relayed the message we were sleep deprived but otherwise ok. As long as the person(s) tracking you are educated how to take appropriate actions before you leave the scenario you described can be entirely avoided.
Some people fail to accept any device (including your in date certified epirb) made by man can fail. On or off a boat belt and suspenders ain’t a bad attitude. I’m only setting off an epirb after my feet have already gotten wet. Until then I believe I’m safer on the boat then in a raft and will be doing everything I can to save her. Think there should be some incentive to have people not set off epirbs or panic buttons of any sort unless you are truly talking about saving souls.


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## outbound

Btw should note they were tracking our AIS. They knew to wait long enough to see if we were moving. They knew we didn’t sink as we were holding course and given we weren’t in a search pattern or stopped it was unlikely anyone fell off. 
If all the ship based electronics failed would give out a satphone call to let them know our situation. We have a hydrovane and several hand held gps devices and know basic celestial so shouldn’t be slowed up much.
Will say again if you have someone following your progress you have an obligation to teach them how to appropriately do it.


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## hpeer

IF YOU HAVE SOMEONE FOLLOWING YOU PROGRESS. 

Then there are those of us who do not. Yes we have kids but they have a life that does not include watching our progress. I think we could be missing a month (or two?) before anyone would notice. Then it would likely be a bill collector. 

I don’t know what to do about that. Recently most of our sailing has been relatively short hops in warm water. Not always the case though.


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## SeaStar58

Could not find any update aside from this one on May 5th stating the wreck had been found at that time by the Portuguese Coast Guard with the life jackets, etc still with her but no crew. It appears the Portuguese have assumed from this find that the sailors went into the water without their life vests, didn't making it into their life raft and drowned.

http://www.noonsite.com/Countries/Italy/atlantic-azores-italian-sailors-missing


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## outbound

Truly tragic. My heart goes out to their families. 

I tell my family ocean voyaging is as save as driving a car and you’re more likely to be injured skiing. I haven’t looked at the stats. A brief search now was unsatisfactory as no numbers comparable could be found. Is anybody aware of useful numbers.


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## capta

outbound said:


> Truly tragic. My heart goes out to their families.
> 
> I tell my family ocean voyaging is as save as driving a car and you're more likely to be injured skiing. I haven't looked at the stats. A brief search now was unsatisfactory as no numbers comparable could be found. Is anybody aware of useful numbers.


I sincerely believe that getting in your vehicle every morning and evening to commute is about the most dangerous thing most people do. Ocean sailing claims very few lives and most of them aren't even licensed or actually qualified to do it, and yet the vast majority survive.
I'll take my chances in a full gale at sea long before I'd trust the idiots surrounding me on the freeway at 70 miles an hour.


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## MarkofSeaLife

Very sad. Stay with the boat.


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## Minnewaska

Very sad.

It’s hard to imagine how they both ended up in the water. I suppose, in heavy weather, they didn’t make the swimming/ladder mistake. Maybe a knock down and not tethered? Very, very sad.


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## mbianka

outbound said:


> Truly tragic. My heart goes out to their families.
> 
> I tell my family ocean voyaging is as save as driving a car and you're more likely to be injured skiing. I haven't looked at the stats. A brief search now was unsatisfactory as no numbers comparable could be found. Is anybody aware of useful numbers.


Agree. I always felt the most dangerous part of my day is when I drive to the boatyard. So I always wait until after rush hour to do it. Less cars and less people with other things on their mind distracting them. I've also started grocery delivery to the house. Less driving for me and more time to do what I want. Plan on having them deliver provisions to the boatyard once the boat is launched too.


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## mbianka

MarkofSeaLife said:


> Very sad. Stay with the boat.


Definitely good advice. Though I think the Portuguese authorities are assuming quite a bit by thinking they drowned because the found life Jackets on board. I have seven Life jackets on board even though I mostly sail solo. Even if they found Life Jackets on board my boat chances are I would still be wearing ONE of them.


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## Arcb

When I read that wreckage was found, I didnt interpret that to mean the hull was found, but rather a debris field that included some foating items including; life jackets, some fuel tanks and deck boxes. 

It kind of sounds to me like the hull is unaccounted for.


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## Minnewaska

This is the quote from noonsite, which was translated from an Italian publication.



> The wreck has already been found with jackets, boxes and fuel tanks, but none of the crew.


Sounds like it could be debris, but translations are difficult. My translator says the same, except crew is translated to victims.


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## MarkofSeaLife

I read it as the boat had been found. Inside was that equipment including life jackets.

How else could they think the crew were not wearing them? 

Pity we are not getting proper reports.


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## Dolce vita

I


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## Dolce vita

I read the messages here and it seem there is a lot of confusion.
This is what was reported in the news in Italy:
- What was fund was not he boat (the hull) but just the usual stuff that somehow find his way afloat when a boat sink (jackets, tanks, etc.) and not a lot of it.
- Yes SAR found some life jackets, but this does not means that the crew were now wearing them, usually on a boat you have some more than 2 life jackets.... (crew was 2)
- At the beginning SAR could not confirm that the life jacket belonged really to the Bright. After further investigation it seem that it comes out they were purchased by the previous owner of the Bright, so there is a strong connection with the Bright
- The EPIRB on board was a manual activation model only (class 2) and was inside the boat, so whatever happened someone of the crew went inside the boat and activated it. This brought some sailors to the conclusion that whatever happened the boat did not sank immediately, and that they could had enough time to deploy the life raft.
- The Epirb trasmitted for only 1,5 minutes, and than silent. So it seem that whatever happened, they did not manage to (or did not) brought the epirb outside of the boat.
That's all is known.


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## SeaStar58

Highlights the importance of having a preset plan for abandoning a boat explicitly assigning who grabs what along with a backup locator device with your life raft and personal locator devices if you go out in open water. 

It's been 10 days so hope is getting thin now but...


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## Minnewaska

I don’t really understand mounting the EPIRB down below. You still need to bring it up top for it to work properly. Do most do this as anti-theft?

I prefer to leave it in my ditch bag, which is in a locker in the cockpit. If necessary and there is time, I can retrieve it from the bag and manually activate it. 

If I need to launch the raft in haste, my plan is to thread the raft painter though the handle on the ditch bag, before attaching the painter to the rail. If all is clam, I would keep the bag aboard, until the raft is inflated, then toss it in the raft. More than likely, there will be seas, so the floating bag would go in the water, to be retrieved after entering the raft and before cutting the painter free. The bag would be somewhere on the painter, between the raft and the boat. I would be interested in any other plans for this.

Coincidentally, I just bought a brand new EPIRB, thinking it made little sense to spend nearly as much to replace the battery in my old one. After the new one arrives, my wife says, wouldn’t it be even safer to have one in the bag and another mounted to float free? My old unit was actually a Cat 1, but I didn’t use the case and hydro release. So, off to Liferaft Services in York, Maine for a $270 battery, including shipping. That was the best deal I could find. I also bought a new hydro-release and am thinking of mounting it on the side of my Lifesling hard case.

We’re planning to cross the Gulf of Maine at night this summer. Like I said to a buddy, whatever it takes to make the wives willing to stand a night watch is money well spent!


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## Sal Paradise

Unless they were run down by a ship, I'd say run the EPIB, and a SPOT and a call on the Sat Phone. As Mr Winter says, the spot can tack you for a month or more. putting down points every 10 minutes. Its just not considered a legitimate distress call by the authorities, like a registered EPIRB.

Its maddening how little info there is on these guys. I've been putting italian articles into google translate, and its crap.

_"Let's turn on the lights': this is the title of the event launched by Rosa Cilano, the wife of one of the two sailors missing from May 2 in the Atlantic Ocean, for tomorrow evening at 11 pm« I ask that more lights are lit throughout Italy possible to give testimony that we are many to ask that the search be resumed ".

In fact, the search operations of Aldo Revello and Antonio Voinea have been interrupted, both on the Italian and on the Portuguese side. A state of alert for ships passing through the areas affected by the possible sinking of the Bright sailboat persists. For Rosa, Revello's wife, the two skippers are on a life raft."_


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## MarkofSeaLife

Dolce vita said:


> - The EPIRB on board was a manual activation model only (class 2) and was inside the boat, so whatever happened someone of the crew went inside the boat and activated it. This brought some sailors to the conclusion that whatever happened the boat did not sank immediately, and that they could had enough time to deploy the life raft.
> - The Epirb trasmitted for only 1,5 minutes, and than silent. So it seem that whatever happened, they did not manage to (or did not) brought the epirb outside of the boat.
> That's all is known.


Thanks for this better information.

1.5 minutes seems to indicate a pretty catastrophic, fast incident.



Minnewaska said:


> If I need to launch the raft in haste, my plan is to thread the raft painter though the handle on the ditch bag, before attaching the painter to the rail. If all is clam, I would keep the bag aboard, until the raft is inflated, then toss it in the raft. More than likely, there will be seas, so the floating bag would go in the water, to be retrieved after entering the raft and before cutting the painter free. The bag would be somewhere on the painter, between the raft and the boat. I would be interested in any other plans for this.


My system is 2 ditch bags:

*Big:* is just inside the front aft cabin floor, or situation dependent in the aft locker with the liferaft. In it is one Eprib, wetsuit, water with large bottle half filled so its got positive buoyancy.

*Small:* I have a small day pack with my main EPIRB, VHF handheld, Sat phone, personal AIS transmitter, (plus small sink and spare boat). its small enough to wear if the situation is abnormal but not yet dire. and worn, obviously if it is dire. The idea is that the essentials are always strapped to me and not hindering movement. its over my inflatable life jacket.

I hadn't thought of tethering the big ditch bag to the liferaft but thats a good idea. A clip would make it easier to detach once the liferaft is inflated.

I do not like the idea of a hydrostatic release on an EPIRB as they only fire when the hull is 10 feet underwater and that may never occur and if it does the EPIRB may not float free.

If time is of the essence, I have a feeling that its more important to get the kit off the boat than firing it on the boat.

I wonder *what causes a catastrophic, fast sinking?*

* Ship collision - ensure theres AIS to reduce the possability
* Whale etc but they will be unlikely to be that quick unless it lands on you, like that photo on the net somewhere.
* large breaking wave that implodes the boat. Sail in the right season and this is more unlikely. I do feel they were too early in the season in that area.
* Catastrophic keel failure like Cheeky Refeeky - they had the crew to have the liferaft out and ready whilst the skipper was working out the water ingress, but apparently didn't. But they did get 2 EPIRBs off the boat, didnt they?

The *mental clarity* needed in these times must be the difference between a success or not.
Tiredness;
Duration of event;
Injuries sustained during the event
Weather conditions
Number of crew
Ability of skipper to lead.
Ability of crew to follow instructions of the skipper.
Distance offshore and time till rescue/search effective.

I hope like hell I am never tested. :|

Mark


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## MarkofSeaLife

Correct me if I am wrong, but since EPIRBs there has been very few (Columbian fishermen excluded) long duration liferaft survivals.

1970s and before there were a few. But since?

If rescue is not quick, you're stuffed.


Mark


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## Minnewaska

There is a story of a boat that ran over a submerged marker on the ICW and torn a gash in the hull. She was completely underwater in something like 60 seconds. Have to search for it. 

Tear a keel off might be similar. I suppose one could catch the corner of a partially submerged container. Odds are pretty low on that last one.


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## mbianka

"_* Whale etc but they will be unlikely to be that quick unless it lands on you, like that photo on the net somewhere."_

Fellow yesterday ran into three whales while trying to recover his stuck in the air drone here in the Bahamas. Apparently one of the whales slapped his boat pretty hard with it's tail. Luckily no damage was done.


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## Arcb

To add to MoSLs list of possibilities above: down flooding due to a faulty or open hatch. If a boat is driven through a wave with an open or faulty hatch, lots of water can happen pretty fast.


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## mbianka

Arcb said:


> To add to MoSLs list of possibilities above: down flooding due to a faulty or open hatch. If a boat is driven through a wave with an open or faulty hatch, lots of water can happen pretty fast.


Good point: Learning to Sail: This is why we wear PFDs, ladies and gentlemen...


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## hellosailor

"Even better your shore person can tell them"
At least here in the US, there is room to add comments/instructions on the EPIRB registration form, so your shore contact doesn't need to tell then your plans. Putting things in the registration form also ensures that if your contact isn't around--the information still is.

One reason that the EPRIBs run continuously may be that the COSPAS-SARSAT system is designed to fix the location of a beacon by using doppler frequency shifts. That is, as the satellites go whirring past, the frequency of the EPIRB is shifted up and down. The system can look at those shifts in order to determine a line of position for the EPIRB, and after several satellites have done this, they can fix the beacon position even if the beacon is not transmitting one, or is transmitting incorrectly. SPOT doesn't do that, it just transmits the last good GPS position it had, I believe. Or if it can't get a GPS fix, it may not transmit at all. Different design criteria.

Modifying or manufacturing an EPIRB for more than a 48 hour battery life (and IIRC that's 48 hours with a ten year old "should have been replaced" battery, in cold weather) is easy enough. You just have to convince the customer to buy a substantially bigger device and pay more for the bigger battery in it. Despite all the real issues with modifying a water-sealed device...With some PVC or ABS pipe and kindergarten skills, yes, anyone could really install a larger battery.

Unless you've been caught up in a typhoon, 48 hours IS a pretty good window of opportunity though. Assuming you've got a national SAR authority that has resources. Not all countries do.


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## hpeer

For better or worse we don’t carry a raft. As a stout steel boat we are not subject to the quick sinking scenarios noted above. We could get run down, that might be quick. 

I keep our EPIRB mounted right next to the companionway on the inside. I can reach it from the cockpit. When doing more than short hops we carry a ditch bag in our dink. Spare prop, plugs, a bare few tools, and our old EPIRB.


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## outbound

Steel may not burn but the interior does and produces truly noxious smoke. Kill you if you don’t leave the boat. 
Steel rusts. Usually from inside out. We were the standby vessel until CG showed up in the gulf of Maine once. Beautiful steel fishboat. No evidently of rust from what we could see. Broke its back (I assume falling off a wave) sank pretty quick. Either welds failed or it rusted out beneath the fish hold. I don’t know.
Steel stretches and doesn’t hole goes the story. But when it hits the corner of a half sunken container maybe not.
I’m a big fan of steel. Really like the diesel ducks and cape scotts. Came real close to building a A.Pape design but if I ever do a steelie it will have a raft and epirb.


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## Sal Paradise

Thats the theory then? Collision with a ship?

I dont see faulty hatch as consistent with 1.5 minutes or whatever for the EPIRB


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## Morild

Whale encounter ? instances of yachts colliding with whales
Whale strike perhaps.
Don't paint your bottom (of the boat) red... :|


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## MarkofSeaLife

Morild said:


> Whale strike perhaps.
> Don't paint your bottom (of the boat) red... :|


I understand the color doesn't matter but the keel looks, to a male whale, like a rather large erect penis.
This, thus, incites rivalry.

If its a female whale one wonders if she might like your keel too much??

If color and shape do matter and a girly whale is shocked by the size of your appendage bearing down upon her at 6 knots... well...., if shes a nicely brought up whale...

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