# Albin Vega or Pearson Triton 28?



## aaronsailor (Feb 3, 2013)

I want to take a trip in a couple years down the ICW and the Caribbean to Trinidad and Tobago. I will have two sailors accompany me on this journey. I know a lot about the Albin Vega, but have heard many people sing the praises of Pearson Triton 28. I can obtain both for about the same $$ so value isn't of concern.
Does anyone have experience with both boats? Or insight on the pros and cons of either?
I am also open to suggestions for other boats. Nothing over 32' Thanks!


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## JimsCAL (May 23, 2007)

Three on a boat that size and that far is not for me. That said, I would add the Alberg 30 to your list. Similar to the Triton and bit bigger. The Alberg 35 would be a better choice, but you said not over 32 feet. These are all old boats so a careful survey is essential to be sure they are up to the trip.


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## duchess of montrose (Nov 26, 2011)

I second an alberg 35. There available for around 15,000 not much more than an alberg 30. If you were doing serious blue water I would suggest an allied seawind but for Caribbean, it would just be a super slow difficult to maneuver boat. I would personally prefer a vega, i like the hull shape more than i like the triton, An alberg 30 would be a great choice too or any of the cape dory's a bristol 29.9, 30,32 or 27. A cal 30 would be nice too. And my own boat a contest 30 might make a good Caribbean cruiser too or a hughes 31. There are a lot of boats that you can cruise the Caribbean in. I had a dock mate who cruised the Caribbean with 4 people in a grampian 26.


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## Faster (Sep 13, 2005)

Once you're in the Eastern Caribbean just about any well found boat will do... easy daysails between islands, mostly reaching. 

Getting there from Florida is the kicker.. pretty much 1000 nm to weather can be quite the bash. That's where you need a boat with toughness, for the so-called 'thorny path'. But certainly there are plenty of 'tough old boats' to choose from. Whichever, it's going to be about survey, upgrades/refits, and tough enough (compatible) crew as well...


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## christian.hess (Sep 18, 2013)

BOTH ARE EXCELLENT! get the best deal you can find...

the albin vegas sell for about 50% more than what a decent triton goes for at least when I was looking.

My dream boat when I was younger was always the pearson triton...west coast as it was a bit stouter, "full keel" and all, this even after having one of the best small wooden boats ever a herreshoff h28 and after that a marieholm folkboat...

the folkboat was perfect for a singlehander or a young couple...the triton is a beast both in size and interrior space compared to the folkboat

shy away from bigger is always better mentality and more towards money in your pocket for cruising and your family ideals instead.

Id rather have a completely outfitted and rebuilt 26 foot boat versus a big 35 footer that I cant afford to replace parts on...like winches and or rigging...even anchors get ridiculous after a certain size.

the albin vega is a wonderful boat too...I was on one in costa rica where I anchored my h28 right next to it in 2001 or so... a couple of surfing guys where cruising here big time! very bare bones style but it felt like it had more space than my h28 obviouly it had better headroom...and it was glass! no leaks! jajaja

they are also nicely built and strong...they do well in heavy weather as does the triton...

if you do decide to buy another boat because you are indeed too cramped after looking at some and maybe test sailing... then the alberg 30 is a might fine choice with a PEDIGREE...

cheers

ps. if you want sweet lines and want to stay with the same "class" of boat and under 32 the pearson vanguard although slow and doesnt do that well to weather is a beatiful boat for a cruising couple...its also well built just needs some attention in some areas but all boats do.


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## nolatom (Jun 29, 2005)

Tritons have crossed oceans. Vegas have rounded continents and I think the world?

I'd think the Triton, with a little more heft and room, may be the more comfortable boat for coastal sailing, and Vega for the way offshore stuff?

On either one, they'll have some age. Count on replacing the standing rigging, it corrodes inside the turnbucle fittings where you can't see.


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## christian.hess (Sep 18, 2013)

tritons have done extensive circumnavgiations...james baldwins site is a must for anyone interested in a triton...his mods are some of the best ever for a small cruising boat

the vegas have done so too...both are safe offshore boats when modded appropriately...no doubts about that...


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## smurphny (Feb 20, 2009)

Both good choices. As others have said, the condition of old boats is the first thing to consider. You can spend a whole lot of money getting one ready to go offshore. Check #1: Condition of the deck core. If it's rotten (as many are) go no farther. #2: Condition of engine. It should have a replacement diesel. #3: Condition of the rigging and sails. Fixing just those three items could cost you 20-30 grand. There are lots of project boats out there which can be good deals IF you're into projects.

3 people and offshore supplies on a 30' boat is an iffy situation.


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## Ajax_MD (Nov 24, 2009)

All the chatter about 30 feet not being enough room for three people makes me laugh.

You guys all need a _Sequitor_ to cruise on?

3 young bucks who aren't married to a ridiculous amount of material possessions would get along just fine, on a Triton. The OP is motoring down the ICW and bouncing around the Carribean, for cryin' out loud.

They can stop daily to stretch their legs on the ICW, and all I ever hear about the Carribean is how you can hop from island to island in a day. They're not doing a circumnavigation.

I understand that a Triton or a Vega is sub-optimal for a liveaboard, retired couple in their 50's or 60's, but I don't get that vibe from the OP.


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## aaronsailor (Feb 3, 2013)

Based on the replies so far, I gather that I'm not "insane" for attempting this in a Vega. I really want to go with the smallest boat I can be comfortable in. Thank you for the input, I will check out some of the other boats mentioned as well.


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## killarney_sailor (May 4, 2006)

I think you need to decide what your ultimate goal is. If it is only to go as far as Trinidad and back I would go for a somewhat larger, more comfortable boat, there are lots of possibilities. If you think you might want to turn right and go through the canal you might want to stick with something more rugged. Quite like Vegas and we have seen three doing circumnavigations, but with one or two aboard. Would be tight with three. They seem to be becoming cult boats and prices are higher. Might also look at some of the older Bristols in your price range.


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## Brewgyver (Dec 31, 2011)

Aaron, check out Chuck and Laura Rose's video blogs on youtube,
cruising lealea - YouTube
They have crossed from Hawaii to Puget Sound, down to SF Bay, back to Hawaii, and then to Alaska, where they are now. They stay and cruise in their destination area for a season, a year, whatever they feel like. All in A Vega 27. They've been live aboard cruisers for quite some time - hell, they had the same cat, Boatswain Bree, onboard for 16 years!


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## Cruiser2B (Jan 6, 2011)

Both boats are good choices for a tough classic affordable cruiser. Both are on the small side for interior space but offer simple systems, which I see as simple to repair and relatively cheap to repair.

Other boats you may consider if you like the lines of a Triton and idea of full keel boats:

Alberg 30
Pearson Vangaurd
Bristol 27

Check out Sailfar.net as a source for small cruising source

Also as others have mention
Atomvoyager.com
cruisinglealea.com
bristol27.com

Good luck in your search and decision. Just FYI I saw a Vega for sale on Norfol, VA craiglist a few weeks ago for $2k obo and a Triton for $1500. The vega looked to be in decent shape from the dock


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## barefootnavigator (Mar 12, 2012)

What ever you do DO NOT watch this video Hold Fast on Vimeo If you go to sea in any boat less than 500' or with a budget of under 10 million dollars annually you surely wil DIE!


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## W3ODF (Sep 18, 2010)

Aaron,

I have also considered the Albin Vega as well for a cruising boat. I was able to get a few minutes of Matt Rutherford's (Solo Around the America's Under Sail | An audacious attempt at sailing the Northwest Passage and circumnavigating entirety of both continents, to benefit Chesapeake Region Accessible Boating) time at the 2012 Annapolis Show to talk about the boat's capabilities. The one thing he said that really stuck with me was that it would not heave-to very well since it has a fin-keel. The ability to heave-to is something I consider paramount in a cruising boat. Which is why I sadly crossed the Vega off my list of potential boats. That may not be as important in the Carib though. Happy hunting!


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## ccriders (Jul 8, 2006)

I know you asked about the vega vs the triton, but consider this from Ted Brewer in "Good Old Boat" January/February 2008:
"Designer Ted Brewer has noted that given the choice between going to sea in a Triton or a P28-1 (which replaced the Triton in the Pearson line in 1975) , he'd choose the latter. Not that this denigrates the Triton - a proven circumnavigator many times over - in anyway; just that it places the P28-1 in the same class..."
My reason for using this quote, is to say that there are many more modern designs that will serve your needs better, may not be so tired (40+ years is a lot of wear and tear) and can provide you better sailing characteristics. Open your search a little, and don't worry so much about size. There is not much difference between 27 and 30 feet as far as sailing complexity, but a huge difference in creature comfort.
John


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## duchess of montrose (Nov 26, 2011)

i would suggest if you want to do more blue water, an allied seawind is most likely your best bet, an albin vega is a better choice than a triton and is faster, easier to maneuver though. the sea wind would be heavy and slow, but would be the sturdiest if you decided to do say a circumnavigation after your Caribbean travels. You could heave to in a vega with a sea anchor like the pardey's use most likely.


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## aaronsailor (Feb 3, 2013)

Matt has his vega up for sale. americanvega .org / vegasforsale. html


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## Shinook (Jul 13, 2012)

The problem I have with the Vega is the same problem I have with our 27' boat and a lot of early <=30ft sailboats: The interior is dysfunctional. It's not that it's small, it's just poorly laid out. 

I don't think this is an issue of size as much as it is the designer/builder choosing to make the boat more accommodating for more people. I've been aboard 20ft boats that had more functional and useful interiors than ours, and 35ft boats with less functional and useful interiors. The design decisions are a compromise, they probably work ok for some people, but not for others. I never intend on overnights with 4 people on our boat, I'd rather that extra space be used and laid out better. I would rather the space be used for a nav table, easily accessible galley, storage, etc, than uncomfortable berths people won't use. 

I've seen 27' boats with really functional interiors and those without. I don't really find size to be the issue unless you need more sleeping space and those features. With 2 people, 27' should be large enough, but it needs to be laid out functionality, which many boats that size are not. 

You could probably rip out most of the non-structural pieces and build it to your liking inside, I've nearly done it a few times. The only thing holding me back is the same reason the builder likely didn't do it from the start, it would narrow the market for the boat when we decide to sell it.


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## aaronsailor (Feb 3, 2013)

What are some boats with good interiors, Shinook? I am a simple is better kind of guy, and I like the narrow beam on some of the older boats. I have limited experience with different sailboat interiors under sail, and I don't like the fact that the vega doesn't have a designated nav table. My understanding is newer boats have more room, but a wider beam. I could definitely redo the vega interior, but I'd like to be heading out to sea in less than two years, not four or five.


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## Shinook (Jul 13, 2012)

aaronsailor said:


> What are some boats with good interiors, Shinook? I am a simple is better kind of guy, and I like the narrow beam on some of the older boats. I have limited experience with different sailboat interiors under sail, and I don't like the fact that the vega doesn't have a designated nav table. My understanding is newer boats have more room, but a wider beam. I could definitely redo the vega interior, but I'd like to be heading out to sea in less than two years, not four or five.


Oh, I agree on the beam and age issue, they don't have to be new/light/beamy boats to have functional interiors.

I like the interiors on these boats:

Vancouver 27
Vancouver 25
Flicka 20
Cape Dory 25D
Nor'Sea 27
Pacific Seacraft 25

There are others, those are just off the top of my head.


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## christian.hess (Sep 18, 2013)

interrior layout is the last thing on my mind when picking a potentially offshore cruiser...I mean there is ballast to displacement ratio up there....keel design...displacement...sail configuration, tiller or wheel...rudder design...ETC! 

like others have said you can redesign an interior especially non structuarl bulkheads but id simply rather fix up a POTENTIAL cruiser already than make a j30 the ultimate cruiser when it will never be

as to the p28 over the triton for a cruiser dont know what brewer was smoking but some late model pearsons are thin as heck with very fragile rudders or exposed rudders is a better term

Im a traditionalist but there are benefits to old school keel designs and boats
number one is you can careen and potentially fix a gouged hole if you find a nice bank to lean on..
this is almost impossible with most fin and spade or fin and skeg combos

and lastly there has never been a report of a full keel design boat with barndoor rudder having catastrophic keel failures like you sometimes do with new design racers and stuff

anywhoo

opinions we all have them...

my current boat is a skeg and fin keel...and yes I do think about the keel 99 percent more then when I had my h28 or folkboat...jajaja

peace


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## D-Cubed (Jul 18, 2012)

I am just wondering why people are suggesting the Alberg 30 over the vega. Is it just interior space. I am assuming the vega is a faster boat


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## christian.hess (Sep 18, 2013)

the alberg is just a nice design and well built it will have marginally more space than the vega

the alberg 30 is almost the exact same space as a triton...


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## ccriders (Jul 8, 2006)

christian.hess said:


> as to the p28 over the triton for a cruiser dont know what brewer was smoking but some late model pearsons are thin as heck with very fragile rudders or exposed rudders is a better term
> 
> Im a traditionalist but there are benefits to old school keel designs and boats
> number one is you can careen and potentially fix a gouged hole if you find a nice bank to lean on..
> ...


The next line in the referenced quote goes: "The keel-stepped mast rig is sturdy and well stayed. The beefy rudder is grudgeon-hung and protected by a partial skeg."

So, do we value the opinion of a celebrated nautical engineer or someone like me spouting off on sailnet?
When Ted Brewer gave this assessment he had no financial or legacy interests at stake. He had completed a life time of work designing, building and sailing boats and does not deserve to be dismissed with the allegation he was smoking dope.
I think it is important to proof read and edit what we write so that we clearly and honestly communicate our ideas.
John


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## duchess of montrose (Nov 26, 2011)

I don't understand this I mean i don't get the animosity on sail net. I was away for a year and this is why, i just don't understand the whole righteousness bs some cruisers have. I mean people get so heated about these things and its almost like preaching here. I mean it doesn't matter like people come here because they like to cruise they come here because they want to know stuff to make that possibility happen for them. We shouldn't be attacking each other over opinions we should say well i think this would work and heres why and then let the person decide for themselves without this righteousness and this animosity. I mean as a cruiser you have the luxury no matter how poor you are of being able to truly experience the beauty of nature, of seeing totally undiscovered pristine lands of experiencing life in its most pure form, and yet we choose to bicker sitting behind a hunk of silicon and plastic. it's really sad, when theres so much beauty in cruising the way we act and this isn't singling either of you out its not your fault its just something to think about. This shouldn't be a war it should be a collaborative community where people help each other.


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## barefootnavigator (Mar 12, 2012)

To the OP Just a quick FYI on boat construction and design. Neither of these boats are built stronger or better than a 70's Ericson 27. Neither the Vega or the Triton have full keels , just because a keel has the rudder attached does not make it a full keel, just less sea kindly. A $4,000 Ericson 27 will out perform either listed boat 95% of the time for less money and a more comfortable platform. I love all three of the boats but wouldn't consider any of the three for long distance blue water voyaging, they are all too uncomfortable to weather. Just my 2 cents


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## casioqv (Jun 15, 2009)

barefootnavigator said:


> What ever you do DO NOT watch this video


Great video! I thought they were joking in the beginning when they said a de-masted derelict was their best bet for low cost cruising.


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## Cruiser2B (Jan 6, 2011)

barefootnavigator said:


> Neither the Vega or the Triton have full keels , just because a keel has the rudder attached does not make it a full keel, just less sea kindly.


this is not the first time I have heard someone say the Alberg 30(pearson triton) did not have a full keel. I have read that it is a full keel with a cutaway forefoot to help in tacking. And how the attached rudder makes these boat less sea kindly? I have also read the narrow beam of triton, vega and alberg assisted in sea kindliness...again exact opposite of your views. Please explain as I know nothing of boat design?


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## duchess of montrose (Nov 26, 2011)

A full keel is a boat which has a keel which is as long as 50 percent or more of the LOA. The albin vega has a fin keel with an attached rudder, my keel is longer than the albin vega's but i have a seperated rudder, both are fin keels long fins but still fins the difference being the fact that the rudder on my boat is on a full skeg as opposed to attacked to the keel. The triton and alberg 30 are close to 50 percent of the loa in keel length, if they are over 50 they are barely full keels. They don't just have a cutaway forefoot their keels also terminate much before the stern of the boat. Ericson 27's have made offshore passages as well and are pretty decently constructed boats, I would prefer a contessa and an albin vega over one though. The triton and alberg's wine glass hull sections do contribute to upwind sea kindliness so i dont quite understand that, but downwind any cca era boat is awful to control. The comment about the rudder likely has to do with the fact that attached rudders that are forward of the transom tend to be less effective, look at it from a simple physics point of view where is the rudder going to have the most mechanical advantage closer to the fulcrum or further away. Obviously it takes less force to turn the boat when the force is acting at a greater distance from the centerline. With a vega, you can glass the existing rudder into the keel as an extension of the keel and then ad a transom mounted rudder, which makes the vega not as bad in this regard.


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## W3ODF (Sep 18, 2010)

> With a vega, you can glass the existing rudder into the keel as an extension of the keel and then ad a transom mounted rudder, which makes the vega not as bad in this regard.


Nice idea.


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## christian.hess (Sep 18, 2013)

barefootnavigator said:


> To the OP Just a quick FYI on boat construction and design. Neither of these boats are built stronger or better than a 70's Ericson 27. Neither the Vega or the Triton have full keels , just because a keel has the rudder attached does not make it a full keel, just less sea kindly. A $4,000 Ericson 27 will out perform either listed boat 95% of the time for less money and a more comfortable platform. I love all three of the boats but wouldn't consider any of the three for long distance blue water voyaging, they are all too uncomfortable to weather. Just my 2 cents


very true...the triton is mislabeled as a full keel it is however considered a full keel with cutaway...or a 3/4 full keel...

the alberg has a deeped and fuller keel, slightly bigger rudder....

as to uncomfortable to weather you are exactly right...no small boat will ever be comfortable to weather offshore...they are often referred to as WET boats to weather...
(my folkboat could heel 45 degrees and be abolutely the best ride ever! it was wet and over a week it could get boring, however on san francisco bay, I would always leave the harbor full sails up, and just lean the boat and spill the main when the wind was more than 25knots, sailed like a dinghy is what it liked...so thats what I did...I couldnt say the same for my h28)

the triton is known for this...now again if you sail the trades...then sailing to weather happens very very seldomly when approaching certain countries and stops along the way...in trade sailing both the alberg30 and triton do mighty fine...

read both jean du sud account of his 95% non stop circumnavigation and see what failed him at the last minute

then read james baldwins twice circumnav on his triton and read what failied him and what he modified to make his boat a true offshore sailor which it most definitely is....

he has watertight bulkheads, sealed lazarrete as well as his now famous outboard in a lazarette setup...he strengthened and modified bulkheads and reinforced his mast as well as shortened it, made integral water tanks that work as ballast too...he also did extensive rigging changes and eliminated the 7/8ths setup that most triton rigs have in order to minimize fixing stuff and potential breaks...

etc....

the ericsons enjoy a nice build quality and reputation...their bigger boats like the 35s 37 and other versions are really nice inside and are a significant step up from some columbias, catalinas, hunters, etc...

the whole idea if setting up your boat and asking questions now on the internet(it used to be book reference only) is that now you have different opinions and points of view...

what works for one cruising couple in there 60s dosent necessarily work for a single 20 year old guy on a budget does it?

the same applies to boats..yes a westsail 32 will survive the perfect storm right? but that doesnt make it the best club racer or beer can racer does it?

doesnt mean it cant be done either right?

as always on the internet if you dont agree you can simply ignore and keep reading away...

peace guys

christian


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## duchess of montrose (Nov 26, 2011)

I like folkboats more than tritons. in fact i miss having my folk boat, but i mean my current boat is stronger, a little faster, wayy more comfortable. i would suggest a folkboat over a triton any day, uncomfortable as hell but folkboats are better built, better in heavy weather, faster, and have a nicer underwater profile, with there longer keel and transom hung rudder. Folkboats are slightly better to windward in a tiff blow, and downwind theres no comparison, with the folkboats wider stern and flatter sections aft it is able to runn off better. CCA era boats are horrible downwind in a blow, whereas my old folkboat i knew how to adjust the tiller such that i was always running directly from the wind. Triton's are not full keels in any sense of the word, there pretty decent boats for tradewind sailing though for the price at least. An h28 has a true full keel, and so does a folk boat, the triton has a fin keel with attached rudder as does the vega, I am not sure about the alberg 30 i believe it is long enough to just be a full keel. I don't think the op would be upset if he got any of these boats, there are several good choices. The triton, the albergs, any paccific sea craft, a hughes 31, an ericson 27, a folkboat or derivative, a cs 30 or 27, a cal 29, even a grampian 30 or columbia 29 would work in the end he has to sail a few and see what hull form he likes then find the boat which is best in his price and size range with that hull form. i find i am partial to long fins with seperate rudders like my contest, or to true full keels, I don't like keel forms like that of the triton but that's just my personal preference he should find his own preference. Cruising isn't nearly as dangerous as many of the people here would have you believe. Especially with weather planning these days, take one of each hull form out in ten knots in 20 or 25 knots, and see how you feel. You being comfortable with the boat is more important than what people on sailnet say because if you are confident and comfortable with the boat you will be a better sailor and only ten percent of boat accidents are caused by design failure anyways.


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## christian.hess (Sep 18, 2013)

duchess of montrose said:


> A full keel is a boat which has a keel which is as long as 50 percent or more of the LOA. The albin vega has a fin keel with an attached rudder, my keel is longer than the albin vega's but i have a seperated rudder, both are fin keels long fins but still fins the difference being the fact that the rudder on my boat is on a full skeg as opposed to attacked to the keel. The triton and alberg 30 are close to 50 percent of the loa in keel length, if they are over 50 they are barely full keels. They don't just have a cutaway forefoot their keels also terminate much before the stern of the boat. Ericson 27's have made offshore passages as well and are pretty decently constructed boats, I would prefer a contessa and an albin vega over one though. The triton and alberg's wine glass hull sections do contribute to upwind sea kindliness so i dont quite understand that, but downwind any cca era boat is awful to control. The comment about the rudder likely has to do with the fact that attached rudders that are forward of the transom tend to be less effective, look at it from a simple physics point of view where is the rudder going to have the most mechanical advantage closer to the fulcrum or further away. Obviously it takes less force to turn the boat when the force is acting at a greater distance from the centerline. With a vega, you can glass the existing rudder into the keel as an extension of the keel and then ad a transom mounted rudder, which makes the vega not as bad in this regard.


the narrow beam and overhangs are what make these cca rule boats nice to look at as well as when PAIRED with a nice ballast to displacement ratio make them very seakindly when compared to very light boats with fin keels and spade rudders

look at a folkboat or contessa 26...the folkboat has 50% ballast to displacement ratio and the contessa a bit less...

what this translates to is to safety at sea..they will right themselves much better than a huge above the waterline built boats commonly reffered to as bubble or bath tub boats...that have more weight aloft than below...

the whole reason(please dont think im preaching! jaja) that these older boats often make great budget cruisers is that their original intended purpose has become what we NOW think as laid back performance, in other words a cruiser racer or racer in the 60s is now a cruiser if we only look at performance...this doesnt apply to all boats but a surprising amount.

on the triton the initial tenderness felt quickly when heeling becomes rail like controllabilty once you heel to a certain degree and it will stay there

...east coast tritons are more tender and sail better and are more dinghly like to sail compared to west coast tritons for example

why?

west coasts where heavier built and some had shorter masts...the aeromarine tritons had no wood anywhere in the cockpit and were massivley built and make for some the best of the tritons to own...however they do worse upwind and have slower performance...a bit! worthless to a cruiser really.

I love wineglass shaped hulls..some overhangs not too much like an alberg 35 or 37 or like an invicta yawl but enough like a triton or alberg 30, or bristol 27 29 etc...some not too much

lastly these boats are great as when heeled over their waterline increases dramatically and they become much better performers when doing so...learn to sail your boat like the designer intended!

I too agree these forums are for gaining and sharing info...nobody can know it all and that is why we are here!

lets enjoy our community!

safe sailing!


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## christian.hess (Sep 18, 2013)

duchess what folkboat version did you have? I had a marieholms a 1971...
THAT boat was my IT boat...I regret EVER selling it...

for a solo sailor and young, you will survive the worst seas and live to tell it...

it could steer herself, heel like a pro...and sail downwind on rails...man!

too much wind? spill the main...sail into harbor, use the main only...you only need 2 sails on that boat...no need to buy different sizes etc...I loved it!

absolute simplicity coupled with a proven design. built well!

i see as well we share much the same experiences with boats and cruising

cheers


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## duchess of montrose (Nov 26, 2011)

The contessa isnt a cca era boat. neither is the folkboat. They are quite different in design to the triton. the triton is a pretty decent boat in terms of cruising i just think that the folkboat or contessa are far superior in terms of hull shape and build quality. That being said if your main objective is cost as mine was when i picked my boat, tritons are pretty decent little boats and have much more room than a folk boat. Not everyone likes every boat design that's why i suggested to him to try out boats with different hull forms and see what he likes. Most of the cca era boats btw have around 30-35 percent ballast ratio. the one thing that makes the triton a decent boat is that it has lead ballast which is far superior to the iron used in some other cca rule boats like some of the taiwanese boats that being said none of these boats are bad choices you will be happy with all of them and it wont hamper your progress towards your goal its just that some would be better choices. if you really wanted to go and buy a catalina 22 and cross the atlantic you could probably do it, it would take alot of work be more risky, uncomfortable etc, but you could do it. btw both of your previous boats the h28 and folkboat would be ideal boats for him. the h28 isnt a cca boat either btw.


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## christian.hess (Sep 18, 2013)

yeah sorry I was talking about the triton, alberg...I tend to ramble

by cca era I also meant wine glass...overhangs, small cabintops etc...not a specific era if you will, but sorry for he confusion...

herreshoff was most definitely not part of the cca era! jajaja

the h28 was btw my second best boat...but it made you work for its pleasure....down wind or broad reach again it would sail herself....on rails...and fast beleive it or not...it had twin backstays so I just left the main all up...small jib...

that thing would do 9 knots "plowing" downwind! jaja no spinnaker or weird sails...

but to weather it sucked...was heavy as hell...was wood, leaked...was wet. damp, and wouldnt back to starboar well cause of the offset prop shaft...yet it sailed over 10k miles with me from california to florida when I was 19! jejeje

peace


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## duchess of montrose (Nov 26, 2011)

It was a really odd boat actually it was built in denmark and had a plywood raised coachroof, I payed like 500 bucks for the thing, but i knew that my contest would be better for serious cruising so i had to sell it not having the money to keep both. My version was a clinker built mahogany strip planked over oak frames. It was an amazing boat, i sailed it in up to 30 knots of wind and never had any problems single handing, i even sailed her engineless after the rotted engine mount and my outboard ended up in lake ontario. Folkboats are the best boats, its too bad thee so damn uncomfortable below and have no storage space. Have you ever sailed a kings cruiser i hear they are similar but larger.


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## duchess of montrose (Nov 26, 2011)

the funny thing is people say full keels are slow in low winds but my contest is much slower in low winds than my folkboat was, my contest literally will not move until we get small craft advisories. I guess it that conservative north sea rig.


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## christian.hess (Sep 18, 2013)

your boat sounds like JESTER...it was a rasied coach roof clinker swedish folkboat that later switch to a junk rig famous for sailing one of the atlantic races solo...

forget now

ps.I have not sailed the kings cruiser but learned about them while searching my folkboat.


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## christian.hess (Sep 18, 2013)

duchess of montrose said:


> the funny thing is people say full keels are slow in low winds but my contest is much slower in low winds than my folkboat was, my contest literally will not move until we get small craft advisories. I guess it that conservative north sea rig.


the folkboat is not a SLOW boat...it is a very fast boat for its size once you consider how well it tolerates high winds and when you consider half weight is ballast...

in san francisco bay, when every body hunkers in after 30 knots...I remember being out there full sails and all heeled over to hell not once even thinking I was unsafe...thats cause I sailed her like a dinghy...which I had experience in...

surprisingly enough most big boats are the first ones to seek harbor, why, their owners are afraid of the big sails...which to a certain degree is true

on my folkboat if I ever had to I could lower sails in seconds by pullin a downhaul that I had for my jib from the cockpit...and the main just fell by itself...

OP Im sorry for the thread deviation...I hope you find a perfect boat...there are many too chose from as you can see from here jajaja

christian


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## christian.hess (Sep 18, 2013)

other great boats to look at(small and capable)

DUFOUR ARPEGE(fin bulb keel in 1968! ja)
bristol 27, 29
contessa 32(great reputation in europe, expensive though)
cheoy lee offshore cadet and 29(spinoff of the h28)
YANKEE 30 great offshore (my dream boat when I was younger)

just some others to look at in marinas:

the yankee 30´s are fin and skeg hung rudder they are massively built, small for a 30fteer, designed well by stephens, and have awesome upwind heavy weather performance...


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## christian.hess (Sep 18, 2013)

aaron sailor...look at these boats on latitude38 just for an idea: this month there are 4 or 5 boats we mentioned that are great little cruising boats

Latitude 38 - The West's Premier Sailing and Marine Magazine

that cheoy lee fixer upper is exactly my kind of project boat...fiberglass hull and nice sprice masts...


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## duchess of montrose (Nov 26, 2011)

He should look at a hallberg rassy monsun, and a kings cruiser. I second the yankee 30 as well.


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## duchess of montrose (Nov 26, 2011)

Oh yeah i forgot the rawson would be awesome. Rawson's were super heaily built, and if you can find a pilothouse it would serve you well if you decide to go further.


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## christian.hess (Sep 18, 2013)

duchess of montrose said:


> Oh yeah i forgot the rawson would be awesome. Rawson's were super heaily built, and if you can find a pilothouse it would serve you well if you decide to go further.


if you can live with the fact that they started the whole BATHTUB glass boat look you are fine

thats what my dad told me when he was a yachtbroker and sailed on one! jajaja

they are awesome budget cruisers..I almost got one but I really disliked the bathtub cockpit...I guess some teak trim and color would help.

they are roomy have short masts, and they are perfect for a a couple of young guys

I think they are an inch thick hand laid glass hull all around...MASSIVE


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## Alex W (Nov 1, 2012)

christian.hess said:


> the yankee 30´s are fin and skeg hung rudder they are massively built, small for a 30fteer, designed well by stephens, and have awesome upwind heavy weather performance...


I think it is better to say that they are narrow for a 30 footer. The beam is not much over 8', when most other 30 footers have 9-10'.

The interior isn't too small. It has a few nice features, there is a lot of built in storage (drawers everywhere, plus a hanging locker) and the cabin house extends all the way forward to the V-berth, so you can stand up in the V-berth unlike many other 30 footers. At it's fullest you have 2 double berths (V-berth and lowered dinette) plus two single person berths (settee and pilot berth above). Both of my friends Yankee 30s have had the pilot berths removed.

It's a little bit of a wet ride to windward due to lowish freeboard, but sails really nicely. Lots of ballast and a heavy boat, but the mast is also tall to compensate.

The long fin keel hove's to nicely, I discovered this yesterday when sailing on a friend's Y30. My Pearson 28-2 (high aspect fin keel for a cruising boat) still moves forward at about 2 knots when hove-to in 15-20 knot winds. We were able to get the Yankee 30 to get down to about half a knot. Something about the hull design (narrow waterline or long keel and skeg rudder) make it easier to steer the boat with the sails than most, and allow you to leave the tiller alone for extended periods of time (no autopilot) while the boat sails in a perfectly straight line.

They were really well built with one gotcha. The deck core extends all the way to the edge of the deck, so there is a lot of surface area for water to get into. They are also 40 year old boats. As a result a lot of Yankee 30s have at least some moisture in the deck that needs to be taken care of. Another annoyance is that like many 1971-1973 boats they often have Lewmar winches with non-standard sized winch handles. Getting new winch handles for those is extremely difficult.

Yesterday I sailed on a Yankee 30 and then my Pearson 28-2 back to back in the same conditions (around 15 knots of wind, 1-2 foot wind waves). It was interesting comparing the two. The sea motion of the Yankee 30 is better and the Yankee 30 with blown out sails was pointing about the same as my Pearson 28-2 with much better sails (new genoa, old but much better main). The Y30 has a max-prop and no dodger, both of which would help with pointing. The Pearson had a drier ride, probably from the extra 6" or so of freeboard. However the flatter bottom of the Pearson makes it lift over waves instead of driving through them, so the ride was rougher.

It's fun having so many sailboat designs to compare and contrast.


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## vega1860 (Dec 18, 2006)

Interesting thread. But I am late and everything that needs to be said has been said, but I will throw in my 2c worth anyway. 

Any well found old boat will do. 

We love our Vega (She heaves to just fine, thank you) but a Triton or Alberg in the same condition would suffice just as well for the OPs purpose.


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## barefootnavigator (Mar 12, 2012)

1860 since you have more experience in a Vega than all of us put together I would love to hear your input good and bad. BTW I sailed into Fish Bay this summer and there was a fleet of BEAUTIFUL Vegas here


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## christian.hess (Sep 18, 2013)

Alex W said:


> I think it is better to say that they are narrow for a 30 footer. The beam is not much over 8', when most other 30 footers have 9-10'.
> 
> The interior isn't too small. It has a few nice features, there is a lot of built in storage (drawers everywhere, plus a hanging locker) and the cabin house extends all the way forward to the V-berth, so you can stand up in the V-berth unlike many other 30 footers. At it's fullest you have 2 double berths (V-berth and lowered dinette) plus two single person berths (settee and pilot berth above). Both of my friends Yankee 30s have had the pilot berths removed.
> 
> ...


*you sir are very correct*...but compared to a catalina 30 which they are often for some reason they have much less space, again for lack of beam mostly

I also forgot ONE huge plus about the yankee 30 is the inboard is placed midships which makes for FULL access for engine work

in cold climates this also makes for a nice cabin heater...

the reason why engine midships makes sense is it makes the boat handle better as weight is amidships where the keel and all havy items SHOULD be

this also helps with performance to windward

ever notice why crews on racers scoot up towards the jib when racing is cause you want the weight to help attack any chop and to also lighten rudder "weight" action...same applies for an engine in a boat

if you had a full rear tank of gas, engine aft, plus all the stuff cruisers love to put on a boat all aft you performance upwind will suck, BUT you probably wont have a stalled rudder going downwind its all a game!

jajaja


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## vega1860 (Dec 18, 2006)

*A vega does not heave to?*


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## vega1860 (Dec 18, 2006)

barefootnavigator said:


> 1860 since you have more experience in a Vega than all of us put together I would love to hear your input good and bad. BTW I sailed into Fish Bay this summer and there was a fleet of BEAUTIFUL Vegas here


There are two things about the Vega that I would call "Bad". Both are easily fixed.

The first one is the large port lights in the main cabin. They need to be either replaced with stronger port lights or protected with shutters as they can be knocked in by seas. The rubber gaskets that hold them in are also a chronic source of leaks when they begin to deteriorate.

The second thing is the interior. Really a matter of opinion, the stock interior meets the marketing department's requirement to be able to say "Sleeps four". However, the interior joinery on a Vega can be removed entirely or in part with nothing but a screwdriver. The interior layout is easily modified. We changed the port side bunk into a dinette, a common modification. We have seen quarter berths added, a navigator's station replacing the cook stove near the companionway and the cooker moved forward, a workshop in the forward cabin, etc.

When you are talking about forty year old boats, it is all about the condition of the individual vessel. Since there were about five times as many Vegas built as Tritons, (IIRC) I would think that it would be easier to find a good Vega at a good price.


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## Faster (Sep 13, 2005)

duchess of montrose said:


> Oh yeah i forgot the rawson would be awesome. Rawson's were super heaily built, and if you can find a pilothouse it would serve you well if you decide to go further.


The Rawsons are built like tanks... unfortunately they sail relatively like tanks too!.. If you decide on one of these, make sure it has the bow sprit modification or you'll be holding the tiller to your chest most days.


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## Alex W (Nov 1, 2012)

christian.hess said:


> *you sir are very correct*...but compared to a catalina 30 which they are often for some reason they have much less space, again for lack of beam mostly


Almost everything 30' has less interior space than a Catalina 30. Catalina and Frank Butler are expert in making a huge interior for a given hull length.



christian.hess said:


> I also forgot ONE huge plus about the yankee 30 is the inboard is placed midships which makes for FULL access for engine work


Engine access is quite nice, but it does have some downsides. The prop is very near the center of the boat (it is just behind the keel) so it doesn't wash as nicely over the rudder and give you as good of steering control under power. The prop shaft is also on a diagonal so the boat wants to turn under power. You can't let go of the tiller under power and go in a straight line, it's the opposite of how the boat is when sailing.

Access to the engine on the Yankee 30 is fractionally better than engine access on my Pearson 28-2. On my Pearson I get full access to the top, back and front of the engine. The sides are hard to get to. On the Yankee 30 you get full access to the top, front, and starboard side. I haven't worked on inboards on other boats, so I can't really compare one way or the other. Given the tradeoffs (especially handling under power) I prefer the engine location on my Pearson.


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## christian.hess (Sep 18, 2013)

again true points...

since I had an offset prop on my h28 the yankee 30 was much less and didnt bother me as much

when I was cruising I wnet aboard a really nice yankee 30 in santa barbara and loved it

my huge plus for the inboard was LOCATION, that is what sold me on the smart design, not just access...

weight amidships is better than all aft or the last 20% or so of the waterline...


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## krisscross (Feb 22, 2013)

I would rather pick Cape Dory 28. They are slower but have more room for all your supplies and gear, and are arguably better built than Vega or Triton.


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## Alex W (Nov 1, 2012)

christian.hess said:


> weight amidships is better than all aft or the last 20% or so of the waterline...


I'd agree completely if that was the alternative. My Pearson has the engine around station 6 (60% back from the bow), the Yankee has it around station 4.

I hadn't realized how far aft some boats were putting the engine. Pacific Seacraft Orion (another nice sailing boat that a friend owns, but farther on the cruiser spectrum than what I want for my personal boat) has the engine very far aft.


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## W3ODF (Sep 18, 2010)

christian.hess said:


> lastly these boats are great as when heeled over their waterline increases dramatically and they become much better performers when doing so...learn to sail your boat like the designer intended!


Very true on the Pearsons. I crew on an old Pearson Vanguard (33'/ 10K Displacement) and her best point of sail is a beam reach. Downwind is quite literally dead downwind, so we often tack downwind to gain extra speed and VMG.


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## Jeff_H (Feb 26, 2000)

I read these threads and I am always somewhat baffled. I grew up sailing many of these boats when they were new boats and have sailed on them in a broad range of of conditions in the 50 years since. While it is possible for a skilled skipper to sail almost anything around the world, I am totally baffled to see a thread recommending doing any serious distance cruising on some of these designs. 

Compared to some of the much better designs which followed, boats like the Triton, Alberg 30, Vanguard, Luders 33, Seabreeze, and Alberg 35 were miserable boats to sail; rolly, tender, wet, slow, massive weather helm producing anachronisms. My family owned a Vanguard, it was a miserable boat in heavy air, and useless in light going without a 170% genoa. Have any of you tried to beat in heavy seas in an Alberg 35. What a nightmare- going from knockdown on the crest to rolling the stick out in the trough, to coming to a near stop trying to crest a steep wave. 

These boats were never intended to be distance cruisers. They were designed as race boats and coastal cruisers. And yes, these boats were intended to be heeled to increase their waterline lengths to beat an ill conceived racing rule, and not as much as they heel without a skilled race crew. These boats were raced with crews on the rail, an a mainsail trimmer constantly adjusting the mainsail to maintain a 15-20 degree heel angle. Cruiser tend to sail these boats on their ear since they don't have weight on the rail. The result of heeling these boats is massive weather helm. The alternative to that is carrying too little sail area to over come their high drag. Both results in slow passage times but at least the too little sail area option is easier on the crew. 

"Originally Posted by christian.hess 
lastly these boats are great as when heeled over their waterline increases dramatically and they become much better performers when doing so...learn to sail your boat like the designer intended!" 

In direct conversation with Phil Rhodes, my father was told that Vanguards should be sailed at 15 degrees of heel but Pearson did not put in the ballast as designed so they were tender. We added the suggested ballast which helped some. 

But back to the original poster. I grew up in the 1960's with a rule of thumb that a distance cruiser should have displacement of approximately 5500 to 11,000 lbs per person. If you have 3 people that would suggest a minimum displacement of around 16500 lbs. That would suggest minimally around a 35 footer even by traditional standards. 

But in any event, the OP was talking about sailing down to the Carribean, that means a bash to windward. Frankly, I would focus on a boat that can go upwind with a modicum of comfortable and cover some ground, because going small is easier with a boat that can turn in decent passage times, than in a boat that was slow even when it was designed 50 years ago. 

Respectfully,
Jeff


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## Cruiser2B (Jan 6, 2011)

OP, 
There are a lot of opinions floating around. How many of these opinions are of actual cruisers using the boats you inquired about in such a capacity, one Vega1860. All you need to do it look at Atomvoyages .com, well documented Triton and Alberg 30 circumnavigations and cruisinglealea.com (vega1860 in this thread) pacific ocean cruisers. Both well documented site by cruisers with videos showing you just how these boats perform as budget cruisers. Best of all is that they also document how they modified their boats from weekender/daysailor type boats to cruising boats. Check out youtube, search for atomvoyage and cruising lealea, prolly close to 200+ videos of the two boats you ask about(vega and triton), doing what you asked about, cruising. 


good luck


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## christian.hess (Sep 18, 2013)

jeff h,,,your post summarizes what has been said...perfectly...

i.e east coast tritons being tender...more ballast needed on certan cca era boats...etc...

also about them being racers then and NOW being considered slow cruisers...we much agree

compared to modern boats all 60s and 70s boats will all be considered WET, limited in space, narrow not beamy and all have overhangs, short waterlines and in some cases minimal freeboard

ior era boats is a whole nother bag load of info to sort through!

my h28 for example had less than what seemed a foot freeboard at the rear quarter when all loaded up...the triton is not that far from that.

its nice to see the differences in design eras...thats what makes boat buying and sailing fun

cheers


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## christian.hess (Sep 18, 2013)

Cruiser2B said:


> OP,
> There are a lot of opinions floating around. How many of these opinions are of actual cruisers using the boats you inquired about in such a capacity, one Vega1860. All you need to do it look at Atomvoyages .com, well documented Triton and Alberg 30 circumnavigations and cruisinglealea.com (vega1860 in this thread) pacific ocean cruisers. Both well documented site by cruisers with videos showing you just how these boats perform as budget cruisers. Best of all is that they also document how they modified their boats from weekender/daysailor type boats to cruising boats. Check out youtube, search for atomvoyage and cruising lealea, prolly close to 200+ videos of the two boats you ask about(vega and triton), doing what you asked about, cruising.
> 
> good luck


exactly

we have quoted those site many times now...the info is outhere...

cheers

ps. I dont currently have these boats but have sailed them...and been on them when cruising


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## christian.hess (Sep 18, 2013)

krisscross said:


> I would rather pick Cape Dory 28. They are slower but have more room for all your supplies and gear, and are arguably better built than Vega or Triton.


cape dorys are quite nice, back in the day...a step above...finding one cheap however now is still harder than the usual pearsons, columbias, etc...

one boat that fits the bill is the columbia 29, the "full" keeler, nice lines same era...

you can find them CHEAP now

cheers


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## Cruiser2B (Jan 6, 2011)

OP,
just one more post they supports these smaller, older boats fitting the bill as capable cruisers. Below is a link to my site where I posted a few videos of a vega in force 8- 9 winds crossing the atlantic, looks rather dry other than when it it obviously raining, but again draw your own conclusions. Just don't sell any of your choices short because of opinions on sailnet..even mine.

http://svsalacia.blogspot.com/2012/08/small-boat-at-sea.html

oh and one more site to look at www.velocir.com , they also cruised the caribbean on a vega, fully documented the build and cruise with actual video and photos from trip...not just hearsay or opinion!

Good Luck


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## duchess of montrose (Nov 26, 2011)

the rawson 30 nor the yankee 30 the hallberg rassy monsun i suggested and the folkboat, and the kings cruiser are not cca or ior designs as far as i know, some of them may be lightly wet boats but they do not have excessive overhangs or rudders that are super innefecient. now if somone cruised with three people on a flkboat they deserve a medal because those things are cramped for one person. Also i beleive the allied seawind has close to enough displacement to be sufficient for the rule of minimum 5500 lbs per person its somewhere between 12 and 13000 lbs displacement which is almost sufficient. given the cost and size constraints.


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## duchess of montrose (Nov 26, 2011)

A Passage through Ice heres a monsun 31 that did the northwest passage.


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## christian.hess (Sep 18, 2013)

the yankee could be considered ior, its bigger brother the yankee 38 was desigined for that and for all intended purposed the yankee30 is a midget yankee38

anywhoo no point in arguing what exact era they are from or what exact rules if and when they pertained to them...

the boats I reccomended are based on budget cruising, size for 2 or 3, displacement and decent sailing qualities that make them DECENT cruisers NOW aday especially for the budget conscious person...they all need some modification or enhancements but none that are mandatory to cruise with...

as soon as someone says this boat sucks for cruising and I would never sail anywhere in that boat I usually just shy away and keep quiet...most times these bashings are based on rules and perceptions from people not actually doing anything with said boat...

kind of like car bashing, motorcycle bashing, etc...there is always a "better" bigger and badder vehicle and everything below it sucks...

I dont like that mentality...

op like I think I mentioned on the first page or so...PICK YOUR BEST DEAL or value...and then refit whatever good deal you get and be happy...cruising isnt about having the best boat to weather, or the best boat downwind, or the wettest or driest boat its about having an all rounder that does most things ok...

cheers


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## jephotog (Feb 25, 2002)

aaronsailor said:


> Based on the replies so far, I gather that I'm not "insane" for attempting this in a Vega. I really want to go with the smallest boat I can be comfortable in. Thank you for the input, I will check out some of the other boats mentioned as well.


My first thought was its kind of crazy trying to cruise 3 people on such a small boat. Then remembered in 2000 I was looking at a Vega for the exact same kind of journey.
Man, I have become old and soft in the last 13 years.

I just spent a week on a Cal 30. It would be high on my list, for this trip.


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## Ajax_MD (Nov 24, 2009)

Jeff is certainly right that there are better boats out there, but I addressed the topic within the OP's specified parameters.

Do you guys even read the initial post, or do you just take off from the post immediately previous to yours? Sometimes, I wonder.

He didn't ask about 30 foot boats, or better boats. He asked about specific boats. I assume that money is a factor for him, which precludes buying a better, bigger boat.

As far as the Vega and Triton being slow, miserable, wet rides to windward, the OP stated that he's doing most of the journey via the ICW. Those factors do not apply under the circumstances of the ICW.

I agree that once the OP and his two companions make it down to the Carribean, they might find themselves wishing for different boat, but that's not what he asked.


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## christian.hess (Sep 18, 2013)

I should of just kept my firt post and be quiet!

BUY EITHER...end of story


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## Shinook (Jul 13, 2012)

Jeff_H said:


> While it is possible for a skilled skipper to sail almost anything around the world, I am totally baffled to see a thread recommending doing any serious distance cruising on some of these designs.
> 
> Compared to some of the much better designs which followed, boats like the Triton, Alberg 30, Vanguard, Luders 33, Seabreeze, and Alberg 35 were miserable boats to sail; rolly, tender, wet, slow, massive weather helm producing anachronisms.


Not being snarky when I ask this (I'm legitimately curious), but if that's the case, why do people continue to choose those boats for long voyages?


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## Cruiser2B (Jan 6, 2011)

He is not a fan of Alberg designs, read some of his other thread posts

Sent from my XT907 using Tapatalk


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## ccriders (Jul 8, 2006)

BubbleheadMd said:


> He didn't ask about 30 foot boats, or better boats. He asked about specific boats. I assume that money is a factor for him, which precludes buying a better, bigger boat.


I think you might not have his question quite right here. He asked for a comparison of the vega and the triton but then opened it up to other recommendations, did not state a $ limit, but said no more than 30 feet. Given that Vegas and Triton can be found in varying conditions from about $6,000 to over $14,000, then there are plenty, more modern boats and less than 30 feet that will sail better than either named boat, have much more accommodating interiors and are in that price range.
I think what happens here is that some very articulate sailors write about their exploits in a particular boat and then that boat takes on a cult like reputation that far exceeds its true nature. The two named boats are cramped, wet and stuffy, and hardly the boat in which to cruise the Caribbean. For sure they will be sleeping on deck and cooking in the cockpit. And they better be the best of friends for such cramped quarters.
Choosing a boat for a great adventure should be fun, but done with eyes wide open.
John


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## vega1860 (Dec 18, 2006)

Shinook said:


> Not being snarky when I ask this (I'm legitimately curious), but if that's the case, why do people continue to choose those boats for long voyages?


Well I don't know about anyone else, but in my case it was because it was the boat I had; it was paid for; I was thoroughly familiar with her; several other people had already made epic voyages in sister ships; she had passed her survey and I had every confidence in her.

Did I mention paid for?


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## barefootnavigator (Mar 12, 2012)

The number one redeeming quality of my boat and there are many is that she is paid for


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## aaronsailor (Feb 3, 2013)

ccriders, you are on the right track. I have experience with the vega and triton in part because of sailor friends who have jumped on board the cult wagon for these boats. You mentioned there are plenty more modern sailboats under 30 that are in the price range of 14k. What are some of them? I am not by any means set on fifty year old boats. I like proven blue water boats because as others have guessed on this thread, I might be heading west after the lesser Antilles.


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## aaronsailor (Feb 3, 2013)

BubbleheadMd said:


> Jeff is certainly right that there are better boats out there, but I addressed the topic within the OP's specified parameters.
> 
> Do you guys even read the initial post, or do you just take off from the post immediately previous to yours? Sometimes, I wonder.
> 
> ...


I am open to different boats as well! I just have experience with the two mentioned, especially the vega. I would greatly appreciate more input on the vega vs triton, the thread has taken a slight deviation from the original post. But if someone has an opinion on another boat under 30 ft, by all means tell me. Make it worthwhile and give some pros/cons of the boat! Thanks!


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## Rhapsody-NS27 (Apr 8, 2012)

barefootnavigator said:


> The number one redeeming quality of my boat and there are many is that she is paid for


+1 Ditto with mine. 

The boat is the only large purchase I paid in full up front. The boat is the one thing I really didn't care to ever lose. It's nice when something is 100% yours.


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## ccriders (Jul 8, 2006)

aaronsailor said:


> ccriders, you are on the right track. I have experience with the vega and triton in part because of sailor friends who have jumped on board the cult wagon for these boats. You mentioned there are plenty more modern sailboats under 30 that are in the price range of 14k. What are some of them? I am not by any means set on fifty year old boats. I like proven blue water boats because as others have guessed on this thread, I might be heading west after the lesser Antilles.


The boat you bounce around the Caribbean in is not necessarily the boat in which you "head west" - meaning across the pacific, up the west coast...? So if you are looking for a go anywhere world cruiser for under $14k you have your work cut out for you. I think just the sails, rigging rehabs/upgrades, ground tackle and safety equipment is going to put you over budget. 
So, if I were in your shoes, I would develop a plan of attack for a year in the Caribbean in something near 30 feet and use that time to workout the specifics of heading west. Who knows, you might stumble upon a world cruise ready boat that can be had for a song.
Hidden in this discussion is the full vs fin keel issue and the barn door vs spade rudder issue. There is a huge discussion in another thread which you may or may not find edifying.
Remember, you will spend more time at anchor than sailing and the boat you choose should serve both needs adequately. While many routinely dismiss the fin keel/separate rudder design for cruising, it is clearly the dominant design for anything made in the last thirty years and that is in your price range. And this is not so because it is a crappy design, but one that works and provides many advantages over full keel attached rudder designs. The lists of "proven blue water pocket cruisers" were developed by people predisposed to the full keel attached rudder design and had the writing skills to preach about it. That doesn't mean that all these years later those boats are the best choice for you and your plans.
Eyes wide open, man. There are columbias, sabers, c&cs, tartans, pearsons, o'days, etc, etc, that have modern 28-30 foot cruisers that would meet your needs for a Caribbean cruise. Check out "Good Old Boat". They have just published a compilation of all their classic plastic review of boats 28-30 feet.
Happy hunting,
John


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## Shinook (Jul 13, 2012)

Cruiser2B said:


> He is not a fan of Alberg designs, read some of his other thread posts
> 
> Sent from my XT907 using Tapatalk


Yea, I know. That's what I'm curious about. For someone that doesn't like the designs much, he sure has a lot of experience with them, which is part of the reason I'm asking the question.

When I read about Alberg designs, it's generally about how seaworthy they are, so I'm interested in hearing a dissenting opinion by someone who has a lot of experience with them.


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## duchess of montrose (Nov 26, 2011)

price range of 14k you could get the albin vega which is pretty decent and of the two boats its he one i would choose, a tartan 27 which is of simmilar age its not the age that makes some of these boats inadequate its the design, alot of them are cca era boats and they can have issues. you might find an allied seawind 30 in your price range bt this is the oldest of all these boats it was the first fiberglass boat to circumnavigate. You might find an ericson 27, a folk boat, a yankee 30, there may be some cal's that would fit the bill i dont have much experience with them though, the rawson 30 might be available for under 14000 but there slow so is the seawind btw, if you can find a kings cruiser (Kungskryssaren) that might be a good choice, Jeff doesnt like alot of deigns that come out of that time period I know he doesnt like my boat because he woned a slightly earlier boat from the same manufacturer that he didn't like the sailing characteristics of. I beleive that his point about cca era boats are valid in the last year or two i have had experience on cca era boats and i do have to say boats designed to that rule aren't ideal as cruisers, there were boats from the same era that were not designed to these rating rules though. Any of those would be good choices. thats not to say that you couldn't cruise these boats, and if you find one that has all the gear and mods you want at the right rice it might be an o option it's just that if you don't yet own the boat you should look into other options.


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## krisscross (Feb 22, 2013)

Here is a great little cruiser that will not let you downn, Seafarer 31' 
1969 Seafarer 31' sailboat for sale in Florida
Looks to be in great shape and you can have it for around 10 grand. Can't beat that.


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## Faster (Sep 13, 2005)

krisscross said:


> Here is a great little cruiser that will not let you downn, Seafarer 31'
> 1969 Seafarer 31' sailboat for sale in Florida
> Looks to be in great shape and you can have it for around 10 grand. Can't beat that.


Recent engine, obviously looked after... nice.... Not my style, but might well be a fit for the OP.

It's getting scary how much(ie 'little') these 'good old boats' are going for nowadays.


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## duchess of montrose (Nov 26, 2011)

oh btw to when you were asking about modern boats in your price range the olson 30 is a bit more modern and in your price range but there's no standing headroom, very little in the way of accommodations and it would probably pound upwind. But its fast.


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## krisscross (Feb 22, 2013)

Faster said:


> It's getting scary how much(ie 'little') these 'good old boats' are going for nowadays.


No kidding... the hard part for me is to be able to resist the urge to buy one of them!


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## krisscross (Feb 22, 2013)

Like this one: Ready to Go Bristol 28 Repowered w 20HP Yanmar Diesel Solid Dry Well Kept | eBay

Must... not.... bid.... aaargh... must... not.... bid.... aaargh...


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## christian.hess (Sep 18, 2013)

i saw a colmbia 29 go for 1k in california not too long ago...

the urge exists!


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## Rhapsody-NS27 (Apr 8, 2012)

krisscross said:


> No kidding... the hard part for me is to be able to resist the urge to buy one of them!


Don't resist, it hurts less.


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## krisscross (Feb 22, 2013)

Rhapsody-NS27 said:


> Don't resist, it hurts less.


But I already have 3 sailboats! 
There is even Nor'Sea27 for sale in my 'range of possibilities' price range:
NOR'SEA 27 sailboat for sale by owner - SAILBOATDATA.COM
Mighty tempting...


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## Rhapsody-NS27 (Apr 8, 2012)

krisscross said:


> But I already have 3 sailboats!
> There is even Nor'Sea27 for sale in my 'range of possibilities' price range:
> NOR'SEA 27 sailboat for sale by owner - SAILBOATDATA.COM
> Mighty tempting...


Wow! I haven't seen that one. At that price, I wouldn't expect it to be available for much longer.

Don't see very many aft-cockpit versions come up on the market either.


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