# Im buying a big boat! But i have never sailed



## seaboy (Oct 9, 2012)

I have decided to buy a 38 foot Ferrocement boat of off my mates dad, its a big investment at 50k and im not a rich man, but i can pay for it over a period of time so its not an issue, what is an issue though, is that i have only ever sailed on my mates boat about 12 years ago, and that was just a 5 day party, that i dont remember much about if im totaly honest, i don't have a clue about what im doing when it comes sailing a boat, how hard can it be ? "right", although my mates dad is going to show me how to get on, when we put her back in the water, i am not sure how long he is going to be able to teach me as he is in bad health.
How hard is this sailing carry on, am i biting off more than i should as a novice?
if any one else has jumped in the deep end like this, i would like to hear how you got on,.
im only 37 so i have time to learn, but im thinking of pointing this thing at italy next summer! am i mad?


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## boatpoker (Jul 21, 2008)

$50k !!! that's about 4-5 times more than a ferro boat of that size sells for. She must be absolutely incredible. Get yourself a highly qualified surveyor before you write a cheque.


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## bobperry (Apr 29, 2011)

Seaboy:
Take some sailing lessons. Learn the basics in a dinghy There are even some teachers who will teach you on your own boat. It's going to be very hard but a lot of fun and if you don't mind looking stupid (to yourself) once and a while you are going to have a blast. I've been sailing for 52 years and I am still learning everytime I go out.

As for Italy? Yes, you are stark raving mad. Send me a postcard when you get there. Better you should make Italy part of your 5 year plan. You can have a lot of fun in your boat without crossing oceans right away.

I do agree with Poker. That price seems at least $15,000 too high for a FC boat. Can you post a pic of it?


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## scratchee (Mar 2, 2012)

To answer your question, yes.


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## seaboy (Oct 9, 2012)

it was valued at 88k in 2004, and i know the guy has spent around 150.000 on it over the years as he still has all the recipts, its a nice boat and every thing that has been done onit is of the best standard, although his taste in the colour scheme of the boat is not the best, i will redo all that!


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## seaboy (Oct 9, 2012)

bobperry said:


> Seaboy:
> Take some sailing lessons. Learn the basics in a dinghy There are even some teachers who will teach you on your own boat. It's going to be very hard but a lot of fun and if you don't mind looking stupid (to yourself) once and a while you are going to have a blast. I've been sailing for 52 years and I am still learning everytime I go out.
> 
> As for Italy? Yes, you are stark raving mad. Send me a postcard when you get there. Better you should make Italy part of your 5 year plan. You can have a lot of fun in your boat without crossing oceans right away.
> ...


how do i send pics


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## seaboy (Oct 9, 2012)

bobperry said:


> Seaboy:
> Take some sailing lessons. Learn the basics in a dinghy There are even some teachers who will teach you on your own boat. It's going to be very hard but a lot of fun and if you don't mind looking stupid (to yourself) once and a while you are going to have a blast. I've been sailing for 52 years and I am still learning everytime I go out.
> 
> As for Italy? Yes, you are stark raving mad. Send me a postcard when you get there. Better you should make Italy part of your 5 year plan. You can have a lot of fun in your boat without crossing oceans right away.
> ...


ps i live in the uk, so italy isnt that far! honestly


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## seaboy (Oct 9, 2012)

i think i have done this right? hopefully this is a picture of her


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## bobperry (Apr 29, 2011)

Oh, I thought maybe you lived on Puget Sound.
Go ahead. Point it towards Italy and let 'er buck!

Might be a good idea to check and see what other boats your money would buy before you hand this guy a check. I think that would be prudent.


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## seaboy (Oct 9, 2012)

bobperry said:


> Oh, I thought maybe you lived on Puget Sound.
> Go ahead. Point it towards Italy and let 'er buck!
> 
> Might be a good idea to check and see what other boats your money would buy before you hand this guy a check. I think that would be prudent.


i have looked at other boats, and i probably could get the same boat a bit cheaper, but the fact is i can pay him over a period of time, and he is my pals dad, he has poured his heart and soul into this boat over the years, but he has been handed a **** sandwich in the way of parkinson's disease so he cant sail on his own any more, it is currently laying out side his house on a privet estate in yorkshire England, so i can go up there when i want and put my own touches on it for the next 10 months, i can also get to know the boat with him at my side!


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## Faster (Sep 13, 2005)

I think you're putting yourself in a bit of an awkward position... however nice the boat may be, the valuation is suspect, ferrocement can be difficult to insure. It's tough to get into a deal with a 'friend' or relatives of a friend, and avoid paying too much or buying into something that might not be appropriate. How long has the boat been ashore now?

50K (Dollars?? or Pounds??) is a chunk of change that will buy a lot of (perhaps other) boat..... just sayin'.....


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## PCP (Dec 1, 2004)

seaboy said:


> it was valued at 88k in 2004, and i know the guy has spent around 150.000 on it over the years as he still has all the recipts, its a nice boat and every thing that has been done onit is of the best standard, although his taste in the colour scheme of the boat is not the best, i will redo all that!


That means nothing, both things. you can spend 200 000 over the years on a boat and still the boat can not worth more than 15 000.

Nobody wants that kind of boat (ferrocement) and it will be hard to sell for any price.

I guess that before buying a boat you should learn something about boats, not to mention, learning to sail.

Somebody said it would be hard to insure: Guess why.

Regards

Paulo


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## seaboy (Oct 9, 2012)

Faster said:


> I think you're putting yourself in a bit of an awkward position... however nice the boat may be, the valuation is suspect, ferrocement can be difficult to insure. It's tough to get into a deal with a 'friend' or relatives of a friend, and avoid paying too much or buying into something that might not be appropriate. How long has the boat been ashore now?
> 
> it has all the lloyds certificates and has been insured for years now, its only about £180 per year to insure 3rd party fire and theft, i have seen the policys, the last time it was surveyed in 2004 they valued it at £84K i think, something like that any way.
> it was also surveyed during and after it was built, as i said i think i probably am paying a little over the odds for it in todays economy but i am getting free housing for a year whilst i do the things i want to do to it, I.E flat screen tvs in built dvd palyers and the likes, recovering the seats/ beds in white leather ect, its ok as it stands its just not my taste, the boat has been out of the water for 12 months now! is that a problem?


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## seaboy (Oct 9, 2012)

PCP said:


> That means nothing, both things. you can spend 200 000 over the years on a boat and still the boat can not worth more than 15 000.
> 
> Nobody wants that kind of boat (ferrocement) and it will be hard to sell for any price.
> 
> ...


i have to disagree with you, i have talked to F/C boat owners and they wouldent have any other type of boat if they have got a good F/C, the fact is they can take a beating unlike flimsy glass boats, and another good thing for me is that this one has a twin keel, so when i beach it in low tide which i probably will do, it will stand upright until the high tide comes back in ! happy days, in fact a think its the perfect boat for a beginer, i can bounce it off the dock and beach it all in the same day with little effect to the boat.
as for insurance, it has been insured for years with no problems.


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## peoples1234 (Jul 17, 2010)

seaboy said:


> i have to disagree with you, i have talked to F/C boat owners and they wouldent have any other type of boat if they have got a good F/C, the fact is they can take a beating unlike flimsy glass boats, and another good thing for me is that this one has a twin keel, so when i beach it in low tide which i probably will do, it will stand upright until the high tide comes back in ! happy days, in fact a think its the perfect boat for a beginer, i can bounce it off the dock and beach it all in the same day with little effect to the boat.
> as for insurance, it has been insured for years with no problems.


It sounds like you already know what you are going to do and want your decision validated.

People on sailnet might be a little conservative for my liking, but they are usually right. Especially when they are all in agreement.


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## Sabreman (Sep 23, 2006)

Consensus of the respondents is:
1. Ferro is not a great idea and there is a reason why they are no longer built. F/C is not "flimsy", by the way.
2. Insurance will be difficult to obtain. Note that fire and theft insurance is not what's being discussed - insurance for damage to your or other's vessel is different
3. Sailing to Italy in this boat, with you current level of experience, is not a good idea. The Bay of Biscay can be brutal.
4 The boat is probably being offered at a much higher price than is warranted, regardless of how much has been put into it. Comparable sales don't seem to warrant a $50k asking price.
5. A pre-purchase survey by a surveyor experienced with this material is mandatory.

I will note that SailNet members have a great deal of experience in these matters and are providing honest, unbiased opinions. However, every concern has been met with what appears to be opposition so I suspect that your decision is already made.


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## tdw (Oct 2, 2006)

Mate, all you are looking for is for somebody to tell what a good idea it is. You are seemingly not even vaguely interested in listening to anyone who casts some doubt on the wisdom of buying the thing, particularly at that price.

Tell you what, go find yourself a bunch of steel boat owners and I'd put money on pretty much all of them saying that nothing beats steel just like the ferro owners .... jaysus man , there are probably people out there who would still swear blind that Morris Minors were better cars than the Toyotas and Nissans (Datsuns) that put Leyland to the sword. Doesn't matter how adament they are, they'd still be wrong.

Sure there are good floating footpaths, just not very many and even those that are superb have crap resale value and are monumentally difficult, if not impossible to comprehensively insure. You do understand what third party property insurance is don't you ? You are not insuring your boat. You are insuring against smashing up someone elses boat. Big difference.

Anywho, good on you. You've already decided apparently so don't let us tell you that you are probably paying 20.000 (preumably UK pounds) over the odds for a boat that no one else wants but hey, the other bloke is in poor health and despite the fact you are not a wealthy man you are going to help him out. You are storing up some really meaningful karma for the future .... presuming you believe in such tosh.

Advice ? Reach into your pocket and pay to have the thing surveyed and valued. Now. Not in 2004. If you are not happy to do that then figure out how long you really have to pay it off and how much you are saving by not having to pay interest. If the interest you will not have to pay is greater than at least 20% of the asking price then maybe just maybe you have a good deal. Oh yes , and I sincerely hopes that if your dad's mate carks it before you have paid him off that the estate does not have the right to demand full balance payable imediately.


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## SchockT (May 21, 2012)

Seaboy,

In your original post you state that you are not a rich man. Have you considered what kind of ongoing costs you are taking on? The purchase price of a boat is just the beginning. You can expect to spend thousands more in ongoing expenses such as moorage, maintenance, repairs and insurance. It is not cheap to own a boat, and the bigger the boat the bigger the bills! 

I won't speak to the value of the boat, although you can get some very nice boats for the money you are contempating! Just go to Yachtworld.com and use the search engine to look at boats in that price range! I am sure the current owner is the one who convinced you that it is superior to fiberglass, but it does beg the question...Why don't they make Ferro boats anymore?

p.s. I did a quick search of yacht listings in the UK, using a price range of 0-100,000 pounds and there is exactly 1 ferro boat on the market: a 35 footer built in 1980 for 11,000!


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## bobperry (Apr 29, 2011)

Ok Boy:
You are a kid. I lost my son 16 months ago. I like kids. I like you already.
Pay attention
Pay attention
to the good advice you are getting here. We want you to have a great sailing experience.

But you are a kid,
You make the bold move. I'm sure that the rest of us here will have your back. You can at least count on me and I'm sure the rest of us are lined up to help.

If it is a mistake then in time you can look back and say, "Boy, was I stupid." I have said that several times and I am still being stupid. It's what you do as you are growing up. Embrace it and trust your self confidence. The world will beat you down whe the time is ripe. Be a survivor.

Then, you can fly to Seattle, rent a car, drive the 2 hours north to my beach shack and we can reflect. I have a room waiting for you. I look forward to that day.


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## overbored (Oct 8, 2010)

go here The World Of Ferro-cement Boats and go to boats for sale and you will not find any that are over 50K pounds. and there are some 65 footers for less then the one you are looking at. but if you won't listen to other guys on sailnet you should listen to MR. Perry


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

One thing that hasn't been commented on here is the fact that he's in Europe where FC boats seem to have a better rep than they do in North America. The Euro pavement princesses I've seen have been generally much higher standard than the local ones. They also seem to fetch much higher prices over there.


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## SVTatia (May 7, 2007)

Seaboy

It seems you have already made up your mind, I respect you decision, but one day your life will depend on that boat. This is a major purchase and you are thinking with your heart, not your head.
I hope you get it surveyed and properly appraised, else, the best of luck and fair winds.


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## salvex (Jun 20, 2002)

I hadn't sailed before either so took some dinghy lessons then bought a 34 foot Hunter. My problem was the boat was in Puerto Rico and I lived in Barbados. Couldn't find a crew so I took precautions (EPIRB, auto-pilot, good GPS and charts etc.) and single-handed her back to Barbados. Of course, the Caribbean isn't as busy as the English Channel or the ICW (for you US folk) but I never went below deck at night and cat-napped up top in full gear. I also kept a VERY close eye on the weather so I could run for one of the islands in case of trouble. One year later, I reversed the process as I got a job in the Bahamas - again, single-handed. She is still there and I'm going back for 3 weeks sailing starting tomorrow (yippee!) (currently in Saudi). Common sense, good precautions and a safety first attitude will take you a long way but no trip is ever the same twice. Italy should be do-able with the right planning and precautions and you only live once. Go for it and enjoy!


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

seaboy said:


> .....i know the guy has spent around 150.000 on it over the years as he still has all the recipts....


Your primary concern should be your inexperience in owning a boat, not your inexperience in knowing how to sail it.

This guy's experience is absolutely common and you can expect the same, over and over. There are no exceptions. Every boat I've ever bought has had unexpected issues that have prevented me from getting to many projects I desired when I bought her. My current boat was babied and only a few years old when I bought her. No exception. Every year has thrown me a curve ball.

Everyone has a different tolerance for adventure, but if you run out of money, you own a yard queen that you can't sell for what you paid.


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## Tim R. (Mar 23, 2003)

You're young, you have time on your side, you are willing to part with your hard earned money. Go for it. I would not do it but you have clearly made up your mind. It may work out great for you...it may not.

All opinions in this post are based on protecting your life and your wallet.

Take the 10 months to make her yours. Also, take up dinghy sailing and get some lessons. Sail with experienced sailors. Do a lot of reading. You may be a natural. Some are. Most are not.
*
Above all else, the best advice you have gotten so far is to get a survey. This will help you learn the boats systems and know for sure if she is capable of the voyage you may not be capable of.*

Good luck and keep us posted on how it goes. There are an amazing number of knowledgeable sailors here with vast knowledge on everything you may encounter.

Cheers


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## peterchech (Sep 2, 2011)

It is remarkable how many people make up their minds decisively from the first few comments they hear or read about a subject. From that point on they are simply trying to validate the position which they now have a mental stake in, and they are totally certain about their opinion even though they have zero objective experience to base it on. The guy in my marina who never sailed before but insisted that he knew what he was doing and needed no advice from the experienced sailors on his slip comes to mind. Pops open his 150 genny and full main in 20 knots of breeze, crash jibes in several circles then motors back pale faced. Yet the next time he tells everyone on the dock about his next great idea (there have been many), every experienced sailor politely tells him he is way off, yet he insists through his own reasoning that he must be correct. The guy never learns any way except the hard way, and he is certainly not the only person who is like this. At least he learns the hard way, I know guys who can't even do that. Nobody on the dock even tries to tell him stuff anymore, they mostly figure that god protects fools and drunks. 

After racing this season and going out in all conditions in my own boat and in others, and even taking my first real coastal cruise this year (to BI and Newport) I have realized that most of the advice from Sailnetters is on the conservative side, but from people who really know what they are talking about. Common sense is this. If the resale value of a ferrocement boat is sh#t, and nobody is building them anymore, then there is prob a good reason for that. Same goes for junk rigs, steel boats, and many other ideas that have been tried but just aren't as good as the modern and generally more popular solutions.


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## seaboy (Oct 9, 2012)

Thanks guys for all the advice, it is very helpful and appreciated,.
i know it sounds like i have totaly made up my mind on this, and to be honest im about 95% in favour, and me knowing me that's normaly good enough! but there is still that 5% saying i will get board of it after a few years, arrrg i dont know.
can i just put one thing to bed, this insurance issue, everybody on hear keeps saying i wont be able to insure it, i can.
when the current owner had fully comp on her, it used to cost him around £880 per yer year, but for the last 3 years when she was in the water he reduced it to 3rd party as he saw it as a waste of money, so insurance is not an issue, infact if i do buy it i will probably go the rout of fully comp for the first year atleast anyway.
as for the price of the boat, i did say to him that although he had spent a lot of money on the boat, that dose not necessarily mean that his valuation of the boat in todays market is correct, and i do intend to get a profesional one done.
i am going to suggest we both pay for one doing, and see if we can find some common ground on price, because i do think it is over valuated.
having said that i am not having to take out a lone with added interest, because i can pay him over a period of time so that is a plus.
i do appreciate all the advice, im a firm believer that a good conversation with a learned man, over a table and and Brandy, is better than a years worth of reading books,.
i can see that on hear most people are from the USA, there must be some really bad examples of F/C boats over there as you guys hate them  i have read a lot of horror stories about badly built ones, mostly down to the fact that they have plasterd the hull by them selves, too much cement= to heavy 
not enough= too weak and so on,.
when this boat was being built the guy had some guys from hartlys in Newzerland fly over to plaster it for him over a 12 hour period, so the hull is absolutly the best quality, its not your typical back yard throw together, where someone has built the hull in 3 different pours, its been done properly.
wow im talking my self into that last 5% hear lol, i knew i was on hear for a reason .
anyway getting to the sailing bit, comon guys is it really that hard, the way i see it is, set the sat nav, and way points, engine power out to sea, get the sail up if it flaps in the wind mess around with some pullys until it finds the wind and away you go, 3/4 days later im having a ravioli dinner!.
buy the way it has all the gadgets as in radar, fish finder, bow thrusters, satnav, depth sonar, auto pilot, so i suppose what im asking is, with all the tech, and a couple of months with him showing me the ropes at weekends in the north sea i should be ok shouldent i.
All the best
Ant


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## peterchech (Sep 2, 2011)

seaboy said:


> anyway getting to the sailing bit, comon guys is it really that hard, the way i see it is, set the sat nav, and way points, engine power out to sea, get the sail up if it flaps in the wind mess around with some pullys until it finds the wind and away you go, 3/4 days later im having a ravioli dinner!.


Unreasonable abuse removed by tdw.


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## Donna_F (Nov 7, 2005)

I don't necessarily think he's a troll, but he sure sounds like he may miss the essence of sailing with all its magical nuances and opportunities to learn a bit of self-reliance rather than rely on technology.

In any event, I wish him luck.


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## seaboy (Oct 9, 2012)

DRFerron said:


> I don't necessarily think he's a troll, but he sure sounds like he may miss the essence of sailing with all its magical nuances and opportunities to learn a bit of self-reliance rather than rely on technology.
> 
> In any event, I wish him luck.


im sorry but you will have to educate me in this nautical tounge you speak?
what is a troll? because where i come from it is not a nautical term at all, im in the uk by the way.


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## bobperry (Apr 29, 2011)

Good luck kid.
Have fun messing with your "pullys".


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## Donna_F (Nov 7, 2005)

seaboy said:


> im sorry but you will have to educate me in this nautical tounge you speak?
> what is a troll? because where i come from it is not a nautical term at all, im in the uk by the way.


A troll is someone who posts something to deliberately be provocative and incite the crowd. The fact that your statement about the "sailing bit" appeared to lesson its importance (whether that was your intention or not), and on a sailing forum, doesn't help.


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## bobperry (Apr 29, 2011)

Yeah kid. Your cavalier attitude about sailing smacks at ignorance. But I know several idiots who are quite good sailors.


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## JoeDiver (Feb 2, 2011)

Have you found a marina to keep her in? A slip for a boat that size won't come too cheap. Are you prepared for that monthly expense?

A boat that size is not a trailer sailor. Hauling, launching and rigging her is not going to be inexpensive....trucking costs, permits, launching expenses...unless of course you have alot of money, so no big deal there. Just keep her at that estate she's at now and have her hauled/launched when you want to sail then recovered/hauled back to her dry storage. Serious pain and expense for a 38' ferro boat.

Although making passage to Italy and the Med is a great and doable goal....really what you'll be getting into is a new weekend and holiday way of life. Weekends aboard at the marina, or out in a nice little cove somewhere....sailing during the day and overnighting either on the hook or back at the marina. A boat that size will be very comfortable for this...a weekend home away from home. It's a sailing lifestyle....and you'll meet many others at the marina who do the same....making new friends....and getting together in groups for a sail during the day, then drinks and steaks on the grill in the evening. When you go to take your vacation, you'll look at adventures like making it all the way around the big island!

It will be alot of fun, and a new lifestyle for you. The actual "sailing" is the easy part...don't sweat that. Sailing is like golf.....anyone can hoist canvas and grab wind, just like anyone can hit a ball, chase it, hit it again until it goes in the cup.

Doing either one of them well.....that's a whole other issue.


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## smackdaddy (Aug 13, 2008)

seaboy said:


> ....anyway getting to the sailing bit, comon guys is it really that hard, the way i see it is, set the sat nav, and way points, engine power out to sea, get the sail up if it flaps in the wind mess around with some pullys until it finds the wind and away you go, 3/4 days later im having a ravioli dinner!.


Yep. That's pretty much all there is to it.

Remember, Italy is south. Make sure the pullies find the right wind.


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## PaulinVictoria (Aug 23, 2009)

Have fun and watch out for the bay on your way down. Plenty of experienced skippers have boats at the bottom of it.


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## seaboy (Oct 9, 2012)

bobperry said:


> Yeah kid. Your cavalier attitude about sailing smacks at ignorance. But I know several idiots who are quite good sailors.


lol cheers for that, listen people i dont mean to offend, if i come accross as cocky its not intentional i just am "only kidding", its jut that if its got an engine i can drive it and fix it when i break it, although i haven got a pilots licence i can fly a plane after 3 lessons with another friend of mine, although the landing was bumpy i will admit, what im trying to say with out sounding cocky is im sure i will be ok at this unless im sorely mistaken with the technical side of things.
there must be a few people on hear who got into this the same way as im doing, every one started somewhere, i would like to hear from those people, plus it will make for some amusing stories im sure, 
ps. bob im sorry to hear about your son, its not the natural way life should flow so my heart goes out to you, i might take you up on the offer of a trip out there in a few years but i wont be flying!
All the best M8
Ant


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## PCP (Dec 1, 2004)

seaboy said:


> Thanks guys for all the advice, it is very helpful and appreciated,.
> ....
> can i just put one thing to bed, this insurance issue, everybody on hear keeps saying i wont be able to insure it, i can.
> when the current owner had fully comp on her, it used to cost him around £880 per yer year, but for the last 3 years when she was in the water he reduced it to 3rd party as he saw it as a waste of money, so insurance is not an issue, infact if i do buy it i will probably go the rout of fully comp for the first year atleast anyway.
> ...


Insurance varies with the personal knowledge they have of the owner and the type of sailing the boat does. For what I have understood the boat was sailed locally and not much.

If you really want some information on how insurance companies look or value your boat ask some major European company like Pantaenius or Groupama how much it will cost you for having a full coverage (and not only third party) for sailing European coats and all med, Including the straits, assuming that the boat is worth around 90 000 euros (that I think it was the value that you said the boat had some few years back).

By the way, what is the year of built and the designer? Do you have any photos?

Regards

Paulo


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## seaboy (Oct 9, 2012)

JoeDiver said:


> Have you found a marina to keep her in? A slip for a boat that size won't come too cheap. Are you prepared for that monthly expense?
> 
> A boat that size is not a trailer sailor. Hauling, launching and rigging her is not going to be inexpensive....trucking costs, permits, launching expenses...unless of course you have alot of money, so no big deal there. Just keep her at that estate she's at now and have her hauled/launched when you want to sail then recovered/hauled back to her dry storage. Serious pain and expense for a 38' ferro boat.
> 
> ...


cheers for that you make it sound as i expect, the marina where she was before is in "Hull" England, the cost is £2800 per year, and they have said that they would love to have her back, i get what you are saying about hauling it and rigging it, the mast is 45 feet tall and needs a crane to place it, but haulage is not cheap hear in the uk, and the roads are very tight in North Yorkshire 2 cars find it hard to pass in most places out in the country, so i dont think i will be carting back and forth,.
when it goes back in the water i think she will be staying there.
thanks for your positivity
All the best
Ant


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## ehmanta (Sep 12, 2006)

Seaboy,
Just remember that not all FC boats are equal. Some are built to a high degree and as you said, some are built in the back yard over periods of time that weaken them but the important thing is that the reinforcement mesh has proper cover so it won't rust out on you if it's not out of stainless. Bruce Bingham wrote a lengthy treatice on ferrocement boat building that might be worth searching out. Also, from that picture, it looks as if the rig is wooden, which in itself is not necessarily a bad thing, but your going to be kept very busy with upkeep on this boat!!! Ferro cement also has issues with keeping a decent paint job on the topsides due to moisture levels in the concrete.

AS for sailing,
Make sure you take some courses and learn navigation and the international rules (COLREGS)


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## sailak (Apr 15, 2007)

I have to wonder how it will sail. The photo makes the hull look more like a power boat than a sailboat. Twin keels make me think it's not going to windward very well.


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## seaboy (Oct 9, 2012)

PCP said:


> Insurance varies with the personal knowledge they have of the owner and the type of sailing the boat does. For what I have understood the boat was sailed locally and not much.
> 
> If you really want some information on how insurance companies look or value your boat ask some major European company like Pantaenius or Groupama how much it will cost you for having a full coverage (and not only third party) for sailing European coats and all med, Including the straits, assuming that the boat is worth around 90 000 euros (that I think it was the value that you said the boat had some few years back).
> 
> ...


i think the boat was finished in 1978 and floated in 79, i have a picture of the boat in the water at Hull, but i havent got the pictures of the build although i think he will let me take pictures of his pictures if you know what i mean, many people have told me that she is an excellent example of a f/c boat, and combined with the lloyds report im not too concerned about her stability, it more about my ability !!!!, ahhh no im not ill be ok


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## seaboy (Oct 9, 2012)

sailak said:


> I have to wonder how it will sail. The photo makes the hull look more like a power boat than a sailboat. Twin keels make me think it's not going to windward very well.


apparently she sails very well, 7/8 notts it has hydraulic steering, but can be switched to manual if something goes wrong, he has sailed it over to France and up to Sweeden,, i think he has been around GB a few times, although im not sure how many, this guy is not trying to have me over, my freind told me that a duch guy offerd him 50k a few years ago but he wouldent take it because he dident like him lol,.
i think the only reason he is selling it to me is because he knows she isnt going to far from home, and he want to help me with doing the things i want to do to it so he knows its done properly.
All the best


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## Harborless (Nov 10, 2010)

Seriously-- I sense some buyers remorse in your future. That is a lot of boat for someone with minimal skills.


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## gus_452000 (Mar 11, 2012)

Well, I have 2 thoughts in my head (I am also based in the UK)
1) ouch thats a lot of money for a FC boat, I know Hull marina very well, a boat to its owner is priceless to a buyer its worth a lot less than the owner suspects.
2) if you buy her and I am sure you will, take care of the bay of biscay, you might have a pleasant sail across to Holland down past Belgium, the English Channel is busy but OK, and Jersey and Guernsey are both great BUT once you hit the bay, be very aware!!!!!!!!! 
Thats the atlantic ocean and when its bad, its a *****, theres nothing to stop it and your small boat suddenly seems very small believe me.
Sailing is great and I know already the day my house is up for lease and I am going live aboard but honestly make sure there is someone who knows what the hell he is doing with you when you try to get to the Med for the first few times. Most of the sailing, any fool can get through, seen people who won the lottery, bought a boat never sailed ever and there fine, but that Bay of Biscay, I wonder how many boats are down there, a lot more than people think.
Enjoy have fun, but I think its well expensive for a FC boat.


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## Jgbrown (Mar 26, 2012)

Seaboy: I was in the same position as you four months ago. I just turned 24, not sure how different our ages are.


You should look back at my first boat thread in the forum here. I was(politely) told by the forum it was way too much boat for me. They were very right, and I'm glad I got the advice, the boat I was looking at would have been a disaster for me. 47 feet and too much of everything. I started looking at other boats, and reading the forum, and I started to figure out who's posts were thoughtful, and what criteria those who have been there and done that use. If Bob Perry is telling you you might want to think about your boat choice a bit, you really might want to take that advice. Lots of people pay for that knowledge with good reason and here you are getting it for free!



I ended up buying one that was well reviewed as a tough blue water ready smaller boat just finished equipping for cruising with new engine etc. An alberg 30. Some people here suggested it might be abit small but I went ahead anyways with a well known and expensive surveyor. I got completely screwed over, survey was a load of horse manure. Four months and another ten thousand dollars later, she's a lot closer to what I was told I was buying but I still have a ways to go before I can hoist a sail, and two people living as sneak aboards in a tiny floating construction site gets stressful sometimes. 


While I don't always agree with everyone here, and it's important to have your own choices, it's equally important to consider the advice. In my case the too small is only too small while fixing her, and because there are two of us aboard right now. The trade off with my narrow beam and size was very important in my city, I fit in slips that are open for lease while my friends in bigger boats are on wait lists that may stretch to a decade. Despite that I'm now considering the move up to the size of boat initially suggested and selling my boat for about what I paid for it, a costly but valuable education in surveyors and boat repair, better value than I get from university worth every penny. 
I can do that because she's attainable for many in price, and docked in the nicest location in town. 



I got lucky, I landed a job fixing boats when someone saw me fixing mine every day. That job landed me some big benefits, especially in the understanding boats end of things. I'm never lucky, but this job made it all worthwhile. Now I get paid to practice and learn.

The biggest lesson: don't look at what he put in as a anomaly, look at it as a guide. 
Boats spend money for you easily, I worked 90 hour weeks all summer and fit boat repair around that. My boat is nicer I'm just as broke as at the start. 



It sounds like a nice boat, when all is said and done I admit a soft spot for fc(and bilge keels) I like the insulation toughness and the quiet inside vs fiberglass. But I think you need to think long and hard first. My boat showed me better what I need vs what I want etc. First boats like first girlfriends/boyfriends are often an education, some lucky few get just what they want the first time, most learn and move on. You might be handy, I've rebuilt vehicles and worked with my hands in factories and workshops to earn my living since I was 14, finally started university a few years ago. I never expected the kind of work a boat takes, I doubled the work vs complete car rebuild when I should have multiplied by ten. You're buying a small town not a car or a house. You will be providing power water sewage etc. 



Can you afford to spend 50k on an education? It will be a great education, and a hard one no matter which way things go.







Sent from my SGH-I747M using Tapatalk


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## Faster (Sep 13, 2005)

Thanks Jeremy.. I was hoping you'd chime in..


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## sailingfool (Apr 17, 2000)

seaboy said:


> lol cheers for that, listen people i dont mean to offend, if i come accross as cocky its not intentional...is im sure i will be ok at this unless im sorely mistaken with the technical side of things..


Sure you'll be fine, unless you drown. Go for it, hey what's the worst that can happen?


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## Fully Detached (Sep 9, 2012)

A little bit crazy,but hey.. what the hell!


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## seaboy (Oct 9, 2012)

Jgbrown said:


> Seaboy: I was in the same position as you four months ago. I just turned 24, not sure how different our ages are.
> 
> You should look back at my first boat thread in the forum here. I was(politely) told by the forum it was way too much boat for me. They were very right, and I'm glad I got the advice, the boat I was looking at would have been a disaster for me. 47 feet and too much of everything. I started looking at other boats, and reading the forum, and I started to figure out who's posts were thoughtful, and what criteria those who have been there and done that use. If Bob Perry is telling you you might want to think about your boat choice a bit, you really might want to take that advice. Lots of people pay for that knowledge with good reason and here you are getting it for free!
> 
> ...


wow good for you 24 and owning a boat i admire that a lot, im 37 by the way
i think you might have got a hold of the wrong end of the stick though, this boat is ready to be put back in the water as she stands, everything is done to a very high standard already, its just not my taste, he is an older gentleman who built this and as such its his taste, the work i need to do on it is cosmetic, ie, flat screens, dvd players, im thinking even a ps3 somewhere, i want to redo all the seating in a soft white letherette, and im thinking about doing the same on the roof of the main cabin and galley as well, although i would say this boat is already luxurious compaired to the other F/C boats i have seen of the same Hartley & Brookes designe, i can make it better, i.e somthing i have been toying with is puting a soft shell over the stern and including some wrap around leather seating up there as well, the boat already has a pontoon that fits to the back end of the boat, " good fishing platform, or somewhere to put some mountain bikes, or even a cheap motor bike, but im thinking more along the lines of mounting a couple of fishing chairs and a beer cooler! all very nice if i get this old girl to the med!.
although i am a bit mad, im not mad enough to drop this thing in the water and on my first day head for the Med, but on the same note, im not going to spend years hugging the coast of dull, grey England either.
Having said all that by the time i have done what i want to do to that boat, i will probably be the slowest, most careful sailor in the world, in fact i have just had a flash forward! the first sign of any wind and waves, take the sails down, engine on and stick the bow into them, i cant be having the flat screens up on deck getting wet ! lol .
that last bit was Sarcasm by the way, im not a total coward, i just like my tv!
All the best
Ant 
ps where have you sailed your boat, and did you fill your pants the first time out on your own?


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## smackdaddy (Aug 13, 2008)

Yo sea, whatever you do, dude, make sure to keep posting your progress here...complete with pics, etc.

This is going to be seriously fun to watch. I love the leather seating idea in the cockpit. Sweet.


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## seaboy (Oct 9, 2012)

gus_452000 said:


> Well, I have 2 thoughts in my head (I am also based in the UK)
> 1) ouch thats a lot of money for a FC boat, I know Hull marina very well, a boat to its owner is priceless to a buyer its worth a lot less than the owner suspects.
> 2) if you buy her and I am sure you will, take care of the bay of biscay, you might have a pleasant sail across to Holland down past Belgium, the English Channel is busy but OK, and Jersey and Guernsey are both great BUT once you hit the bay, be very aware!!!!!!!!!
> Thats the atlantic ocean and when its bad, its a *****, theres nothing to stop it and your small boat suddenly seems very small believe me.
> ...


cheers Gus sound advice!
i share your concern about the price also, and i do intend to grind him down a little bit, not sure he will move though, where are you based? Hull? 
All the best
Ant


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## JoeDiver (Feb 2, 2011)

seaboy said:


> cheers for that you make it sound as i expect, the marina where she was before is in "Hull" England, the cost is £2800 per year, and they have said that they would love to have her back,


That's about $425 month US....not too bad really for a big boat. I'm assuming that includes power and water. If the marina has wi-fi even better. You can setup a satellite dish on the dock for TV if reception is bad or they don't offer cable.

Since the boat is on the hard now....it is the best time for a survey. DO NOT buy this boat or even offer to buy it until AFTER the survey is complete. Get a full survey, both mechanical and valuation. If it checks out and the numbers are good, get all the hull stuff done (if any) and get her launched.

Half the fun of the lifestyle is spending time aboard....afloat....just tinkering around with stuff at the marina. You get to learn to fix things, and you get to know every inch of your boat. Plus, you can kick back, watch a movie, make dinner, sleep aboard....breakfast is always the best....mornings aboard rule.

Get to know the boat...read some books on sailing and cruising.....and a bit down the road you can come back to taking her out for a sail.

There's too much to do first to worry about that. (sailing her)


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## seaboy (Oct 9, 2012)

smackdaddy said:


> Yo sea, whatever you do, dude, make sure to keep posting your progress here...complete with pics, etc.
> 
> This is going to be seriously fun to watch. I love the leather seating in the cockpit. Sweet.


please tell me you mean fun in a nice way! and not in another kind of, "train wreck" way, because i dont intend to wreck, of course i will post pics, but they wont be forthcoming until next summer, dont be hating on me, i dont do hate, only good will to all who deserve it, and help to those who need it! and before you say it, no im not religious in any way.

All the best
Ant


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## casey1999 (Oct 18, 2010)

I would be looking at somthing like this:

1978 UFO 34 Sail Boat For Sale - www.yachtworld.com

Managable size, bullet proof, lower purchase and operating costs, easy to sail.

Or another similar great boat:

http://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1974/Contessa-32-2422551/Gillingham,-Kent/United-Kingdom


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## seaboy (Oct 9, 2012)

casey1999 said:


> I would be looking at somthing like this:
> 
> 1978 UFO 34 Sail Boat For Sale - www.yachtworld.com
> 
> Managable size, bullet proof, lower purchase and operating costs, easy to sail.


thanks for the link, but that just would not be for me, the lay out has made it too small, i have 3 dogs and a trouble and strife, + the engine looks like an angry octopus who dident appreciate being sprayed, i will try and post a picture of the room i will get from this one.
all the best
Ant
ps remember this is not my taste, but i can stand up in hear and im 6.1"


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## casey1999 (Oct 18, 2010)

seaboy said:


> thanks for the link, but that just would not be for me, the lay out has made it too small, i have 3 dogs and a trouble and strife, + the engine looks like an angry octopus who dident appreciate being sprayed, i will try and post a picture of the room i will get from this one.
> all the best
> Ant
> ps remember this is not my taste, but i can stand up in hear and im 6.1"


Sorry, just trying to help. Just thinking if I had a big heavy boat like that and I made the same docking mistakes I sometimes make with my 34, I would be taking out boats and docks. But agree, you got some good space and nice windows on the yacht. I'm also 6-1 and like a small boat cabin, that way when I get thrown around by the rough seas I do not have that far to fly before hitting the other side of the cabin.


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## CBinRI (May 17, 2004)

seaboy said:


> I have decided to buy a 38 foot Ferrocement boat of off my mates dad, its a big investment at 50k and im not a rich man, but i can pay for it over a period of time so its not an issue, what is an issue though, is that i have only ever sailed on my mates boat about 12 years ago, and that was just a 5 day party, that i dont remember much about if im totaly honest, i don't have a clue about what im doing when it comes sailing a boat, how hard can it be ? "right", although my mates dad is going to show me how to get on, when we put her back in the water, i am not sure how long he is going to be able to teach me as he is in bad health.
> How hard is this sailing carry on, am i biting off more than i should as a novice?
> if any one else has jumped in the deep end like this, i would like to hear how you got on,.
> im only 37 so i have time to learn, but im thinking of pointing this thing at italy next summer! am i mad?


I would suggest that you use that money and go and buy an old Tartan 37. That way, you can insure it and you can sell it when you are done with it. It looks a bit like your mind is made up, however.


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## seaboy (Oct 9, 2012)

casey1999 said:


> Sorry, just trying to help. Just thinking if I had a big heavy boat like that and I made the same docking mistakes I sometimes make with my 34, I would be taking out boats and docks. But agree, you got some good space and nice windows on the yacht. I'm also 6-1 and like a small boat cabin, that way when I get thrown around by the rough seas I do not have that far to fly before hitting the other side of the cabin.


lol good point, im defo gona pad the roof now, that never even crossed my mind
cheers
Ant


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## EJO (Jan 10, 2010)

Ant I have been reading this whole thread and I probably can make a statement such as "most people here that don't like FC boats also don't like English cars and for that matter Italian cars". Many have made up their minds based on the great US marketing propaganda about something that might or might not has happened in the past. The tellie has a lot to do with that.
But keep in mind that there are many GOOD sailors and a few fantastic designers on this forum that can give great pointers on how to sail any type of boat and their brand/type is always slightly better than the others.
Here is some advise from an old Dutchman, been there, done that. Keeping all that in mind start some reading about sailing, navigating and boating in general. It is raining and cold too much in GB at the moment anyhow to work on boats.
A good starting read would be "Sailing for Dummies" ( Sailing For Dummies: J. J. Isler,Peter Isler: 9780471791430: Amazon.com: [email protected]@[email protected]@http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/[email protected]@[email protected]@51I5Eu9gu1L ) Chapmans Piloting and Seamanship ( Chapman Piloting & Seamanship,64th Edition: Elbert S. Maloney: 0800368000892: Amazon.com: [email protected]@[email protected]@http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/[email protected]@[email protected]@51V29NV0PSL ) I know these are US links but I'm sure you can get them in England. Buy them, devourer them, keep them as reference (don't hire them) you will be a much better beginner and know what to ask to learn faster.
When you settle on the value and what you can afford you'll have a great roomy boat. Sail her to the Netherlands and back a nice trip from Hull. Don't underestimate the North Sea either as not to under estimate the Gulf of Biscayne. When in doubt you can always hug the coast line with many safe harbour close by. Longer trip but again safer and more to see.
Keep us informed.
ps. that shell you're talking about is called a bimini (not bikini) but all that jargon is talked about in the book(s) I mentioned.


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## seaboy (Oct 9, 2012)

CBinRI said:


> I would suggest that you use that money and go and buy an old Tartan 37. That way, you can insure it and you can sell it when you are done with it. It looks a bit like your mind is made up, however.


yep kind of, i talked my self into the last 5% of doubt i had in an earlier post, but just to clarify, im not handing over a cheque for 50k i can pay for what might be a mistake over a period of time, you know, just so the salt can be rubbed a bit deeper! 
Ant


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## chucklesR (Sep 17, 2007)

Stay safe, take it a step at a time and have fun. 
She looks like a well loved boat.


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## EJO (Jan 10, 2010)

casey1999 said:


> Or another similar great boat:
> 
> 1974 Contessa 32 Sail Boat For Sale - www.yachtworld.com


Hey it looks like that Contessa is on the hard but you still can't check out below the waterline. (lol)


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## smackdaddy (Aug 13, 2008)

seaboy said:


> please tell me you mean fun in a nice way! and not in another kind of, "train wreck" way, because i dont intend to wreck, of course i will post pics, but they wont be forthcoming until next summer, dont be hating on me, i dont do hate, only good will to all who deserve it, and help to those who need it! and before you say it, no im not religious in any way.
> 
> All the best
> Ant


I'm not a hater - but I also don't blow sugar. Either way it goes - it will be fun to watch.

Just sail her as soon as you can. The boat work part sucks.

(If you don't yet appreciate the quality of advice you've received above: Let me google that for you)


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## Tim R. (Mar 23, 2003)

I am now also voting troll.

The awful grammar for someone who is 37. All the incorrect terminology. This is just too much. It seems with every new post he pushes the limits of grammar and nautical language butchery.

Also consider this: No info in his profile and no email contact.

I'm out. I have better things to read.


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## CBinRI (May 17, 2004)

By the way, go sailing a few times. Try to help on a delivery or go offshore, if you can. A friend of a friend fell in love with the romance and idea of cruising the world, figured he should do it safely, bought a Westsail 32 (a heavy, blue water capable boat). Spent money outfitting it. The problem was he quickly learned that he didn't care for the motion of the ocean and the first time he got caught offshore in lousy weather he decided it wasn't for him and ended up selling the boat at a fairly substantial loss. I would make sure that you at least like sailing before you invest in this boat and in this lifesyle.


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## Jgbrown (Mar 26, 2012)

Sorry, don't know why tapa talk removed all my formatting and paragraphs that's bloody hard to read.

I haven't even raised a sail yet. Boat isn't ready. Ready and done are different.
Boats are NEVER done. Especially not in that size range. They can be ready though. You can add those things you are talking about but if you aren't spending the money to keep important systems running entropy will win eventually. 
If Bob Perry and Faster can't get through to you on the costs I don't know who can. My experience has been that they are bang on.

The boat you've described would appeal to me too. But for a lot less money. 
I hope you have a fantastic time, but even the nicest boats are always under repair. You can spend less in maintaining her but you'll pay for it later, unless you sell her off before that deferred bill comes due. But no one will pay you what you are looking at paying him. I'd love to be wrong, please do start a blog, I'll follow along with interest either way

Sent from my SGH-I747M using Tapatalk


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## seaboy (Oct 9, 2012)

smackdaddy said:


> I'm not a hater - but I also don't blow sugar. Either way it goes - it will be fun to watch.
> 
> Just sail her as soon as you can. The boat work part sucks.
> 
> (If you don't yet appreciate the quality of advice you've received above: Let me google that for you)


stop, i dident mean my post back to you in a derogatory way, i got what you were saying, but with the magnitude of this life voyage i am about to take on, i thought i would make light of it, no offence intended pal, by the way its blow smoke! 
All the best
Ant


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## GeorgeB (Dec 30, 2004)

Can you translate "trouble and strife" as in "i have 3 dogs and a trouble and strife"? Also, even though you will be making payments to the previous owner, won't you be obligated for the entire 50,000 as you would have a signed contract?


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## eherlihy (Jan 2, 2007)

seaboy said:


> I have decided to buy a 38 foot Ferrocement boat of off my mates dad, its a big investment at 50k and im not a rich man, but i can pay for it over a period of time so its not an issue, what is an issue though, is that i have only ever sailed on my mates boat about 12 years ago, and that was just a 5 day party, that i dont remember much about if im totaly honest, i don't have a clue about what im doing when it comes sailing a boat, how hard can it be ? "right", although my mates dad is going to show me how to get on, when we put her back in the water, i am not sure how long he is going to be able to teach me as he is in bad health.
> *How hard is this sailing carry on, am i biting off more than i should as a novice?*
> if any one else has jumped in the deep end like this, i would like to hear how you got on,.
> im only 37 so i have time to learn, but im thinking of pointing this thing at italy next summer! *am i mad?*


All, the OP stated: "I have decided to buy a 38 foot Ferrocement boat," so stop trying to talk him out of it.

The questions were: "How hard is this sailing carry on, am i biting off more than i should as a novice?" and "am i mad? - I believe that the answers to both questions are subjective, and I believe that only the OP will be able to truthfully answer for himself.


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## arf145 (Jul 25, 2007)

seaboy said:


> ... the work i need to do on it is cosmetic, ie, flat screens, dvd players, im thinking even a ps3 somewhere, i want to redo all the seating in a soft white letherette, and im thinking about doing the same on the roof of the main cabin and galley ... including some wrap around leather seating up there as well, the boat already has a pontoon that fits to the back end of the boat, " good fishing platform, or somewhere to put some mountain bikes, or even a cheap motor bike, but im thinking more along the lines of mounting a couple of fishing chairs and a beer cooler! all very nice if i get this old girl to the med!...


I'm having a very hard time not seeing this as a troll thread. I mean, really, that is just bait in there.

But assuming you are not a troll, seaboy, take a sailing class or two so you can get some idea of what you will be asking your sailboat to do in your travels, before you go spend your "upgrade" money. Getting out on the water might open your eyes and change your priorities. You might opt for a liferaft instead of the leatherette, for example. Keep the beer cooler, though.


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## seaboy (Oct 9, 2012)

treilley said:


> I am now also voting troll.
> 
> The awful grammar for someone who is 37. All the incorrect terminology. This is just too much. It seems with every new post he pushes the limits of grammar and nautical language butchery.
> 
> ...


first and foremost im not a troll, but think what you want to, its of no consequence to me what so ever,
however it dose make me feel a bit sad to think, that there are people out there with this dim view of me,
so my point is this, you made me feel bad! and i dont think i should feel that way, so dose that not inturn make you the troll? or a bully at the least!
when it comes to my grammar, and i dont know why i am explaining my self here, hear, or how ever you want it spelling, i cant help you.
i am completely dyslexic, this is why it takes me so long to reply, because i spend most of my time typing words into google, and then picking the one that looks right before posting it.
i might not be able to type words in the correct way, and it will take me 5 times as long to read a book than you but that dose not give you the right to call me a troll.
i am nothing of the sort, let me say this to you sir, if you are a good example of the kind of community i am about to get in bed with, (water bed that is) then maybe i am making a mistake.
having said that, i would love for you to be stuck in my wake, (i belive that is the correct term) for the duration of a race, i would even slow down so you could see my stern for the whole time!
please dont make me out to be some kind of something that i am not,
im an ok fella, and have done nothing to you.
is that ok
ps sorry for my grammar


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## Brewgyver (Dec 31, 2011)

treilley said:


> I am now also voting troll.
> 
> The awful grammar for someone who is 37. All the incorrect terminology. This is just too much. It seems with every new post he pushes the limits of grammar and nautical language butchery.
> 
> ...


I think I'm with you. OMG, and people talk about Americans butchering the English language! "dident"??? "Hear" is not the same word as "here", etc.


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## seaboy (Oct 9, 2012)

arf145 said:


> I'm having a very hard time not seeing this as a troll thread. I mean, really, that is just bait in there.
> 
> But assuming you are not a troll, seaboy, take a sailing class or two so you can get some idea of what you will be asking your sailboat to do in your travels, before you go spend your "upgrade" money. Getting out on the water might open your eyes and change your priorities. You might opt for a liferaft instead of the leatherette, for example. Keep the beer cooler, though.


the man i am going to buy this boat off of is going to show me the ropes,
he has been sailing for 30+ years, 
the only thing wrong with him is that he has been diagnosed with parkinsons, 
i say so what!
that will not stop him coming out with me, and making me do all the work!, pretty good deal for him actually, i pay him a load of money to work for him lol.
im going to keep my posts short as im feeling hostility towards this new wanabe sailor, just until i get a grip on this new mind set anyway.
all the best.
Ant
PS how did you get your first boat, what were your thoughts and experiences the first time you whent out on your own?.
these are the things i want to hear, 
not a list of what im doing wrong before i have even started.


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## casey1999 (Oct 18, 2010)

EJO said:


> Ant I have been reading this whole thread and I probably can make a statement such as "most people here that don't like FC boats also don't like English cars and for that matter Italian cars". Many have made up their minds based on the great US marketing propaganda about something that might or might not has happened in the past. The tellie has a lot to do with that.
> .


I actually like some english cars, used to have an 71 MG Miget, that was a fun car. Parents have a 95 Landrover they have owned since new, have 170k of trouble free miles on the car, never garaged and still looks new.

Trouble I have with Ferro boats is that they all seem big and built more to live aboard than actually sail. A friends father used to live aboard a 50' ferro boat in Annapolis on the south river (marina next to South River bridge). The father motored that boat to the marina when new and never moved it in more than 30 years- the boat might even be sitting there now. In fact he never owned sails for the boat.

Does the subject boat have sails- none shown in the picture?


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## seaboy (Oct 9, 2012)

Brewgyver said:


> I think I'm with you. OMG, and people talk about Americans butchering the English language! "dident"??? "Hear" is not the same word as "here", etc.


lol, wow! so now, people with a Disability are considerd trolls?, thats a bit harsh pal, just go with it, or dont join in, dont start throwing stones though, some one might just throw a boulder back at you, and you know what i mean.
please dont post on this thread again if you dont have anything to say, other than, i agree with him!
i feel this thread is getting side tracked and im biting,
i havent offended anyone here, and nor do i intend to do so.
this only leaves the question why i am getting so much stick, its either that you boys and girls, are a rough old bunch of salts, or you dont like the fact, that someone who cant spell could be joining your ranks, funny that because i dont care,.
dose anybody else have anything positive to say, regarding first time at sea stuff?
this "dude" is not included in the conversation.
all the best
Ant


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## seaboy (Oct 9, 2012)

GeorgeB said:


> Can you translate "trouble and strife" as in "i have 3 dogs and a trouble and strife"? Also, even though you will be making payments to the previous owner, won't you be obligated for the entire 50,000 as you would have a signed contract?


trouble and strife = wife, that is all she causes me ! the 3 dogs bit was just about the room i will need.
All the best
Ant


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## Donna_F (Nov 7, 2005)

Ant,

I'm sorry you're being attacked personally, however, when you come onto a sailing forum and declare that you're going to buy a huge, overpriced boat with absolutely zero sailing experience and _then_ ask "am I crazy?" You kind of open yourself up to an answer to your question. Not all the answers will be to your liking. It works that way.

In my experience, the sailing community is helpful to those who want genuine assistance rather than just blanket validation of decisions already made. You're getting feedback from people who have already done what you want to do. It would be to your advantage to at least take note of their advice and tuck it away for future reference.


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## casey1999 (Oct 18, 2010)

Seaboy Ant,
Here is a site you may find useful:

The World of Ferroboats

I probably have an unfounded fear of ferro boats. Just don't understand how you can build a boat out of cement with imbedded carbon steel (rebar and chicken wire) and have it last, and apparently some have lasted. How do you drill for and install seacocks? Fiberglass is so easy to work with, I would be lost working on a ferro boat- I am no stone mason. How do you repair the boat if the reinforcing steel starts to corrode? Seems one day you could have what you think is a good boat, and the next week you finde the reinforcement is no longer adequate.

Just so many unknows for me.


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## arf145 (Jul 25, 2007)

Seaboy, if you're not a troll, you're not a troll. "Troll" is not a nasty thing we call those we don't like--it's what we call fake posts that are really just bait to watch members go crazy. Picture going to a board for Austin Healy enthusiasts and posting that you are going to buy a friend's classic 3000, replace the body with fiberglas panels, bolt fins to the back, install an automatic transmission, and then drive it in the Paris-Dakar rally. You'd get quite a response, right? The Austin Healy heads would be suggesting that you were either crazy, misguided, or pulling their leg. 

Some are just trying to figure what we've got here, because your plans look a little bit like the Austin Healy thing. No offense intended.


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## Brewgyver (Dec 31, 2011)

seaboy said:


> lol, wow! so now, people with a Disability are considerd trolls(SNIP)
> Ant


Ant, your post stating that you were dyslexic was not visible when I posted that I was tending to agree with another poster that you might be trolling. You must understand that 
1. You JUST joined Sailnet yesterday
2. (See Donna's first paragraph above)
3. Your particular style of expression (not bothering with the Shift key most of the time, spelling more difficult words correctly and missing on the simplest, etc.) is difficult to read. If all that is due to dyslexia of some kind, my apologies.

Back to first time sailing, and leaving alone the choice of boat, I'm certain that if you're careful, and start out with the help of your friend's father, you'll have a GREAT time! I'm still a beginner myself, and just got my first sailboat this year, and every time out is really a lot of fun, tinged with just a bit of a "pucker factor".

Good luck!


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## seaboy (Oct 9, 2012)

DRFerron said:


> Ant,
> 
> I'm sorry you're being attacked personally, however, when you come onto a sailing forum and declare that you're going to buy a huge, overpriced boat with absolutely zero sailing experience and _then_ ask "am I crazy?" You kind of open yourself up to an answer to your question. Not all the answers will be to your liking. It works that way.
> 
> In my experience, the sailing community is helpful to those who want genuine assistance rather than just blanket validation of decisions already made. You're getting feedback from people who have already done what you want to do. It would be to your advantage to at least take note of their advice and tuck it away for future reference.


DR
thank you for your kind comments and thoughts, but being attacked personally, i am not.
i feel its only an ignorant percentage of the crowd, who know no better, that would stoop, to such an unapproachable depth, just to have their voice heard. 
i dont care for that kind of person, and comments and pokes, from such people, will no longer be answered with neither, humor nor aggression, they can simply "sail into the sunset".
i joined this site not as a sailor, but as a person who desires to become one.

as it goes, and regardless of some of the more negative comments i have encountered on here, it seems to of played out in my favour, my mind is now set in ferrocement, im buying this boat.
This way of hard headed thinking may turn out to be a mistake, so what! its not the end of the world, unless of course i drowned, then it might be!. 
seriously though, if i did loose the boat, all it would really mean is, i would have to work a little harder the year after to buy a better one.
I get the feeling that some of the poeple on hear, "not all" but some, do think that they are in some way better, than the people who dont own a boat, or want to own one.

This way of thinking may only be reserved to me, im not sure, but the way i have perceived certain members attitudes on hear, is less than glorious to say the least.
All i want from this thread is other peoples experience's about going to sea, on there own, in their own boat, for the very first time.
All the best 
Ant


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## eherlihy (Jan 2, 2007)

Good on 'ya. Your post reminds me of this song;


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## casey1999 (Oct 18, 2010)

seaboy said:


> All i want from this thread is other peoples experience's about going to sea, on there own, in their own boat, for the very first time.
> All the best
> Ant


I can tell you my experience going to sea alone (single handed) for the first time. It was apprehension and a dose of fear. And I think the bigger your boat the bigger the apprehension and fear will be. A little fear is good, too much, not so. Bigger boats mean a lot more stress and tension on the running rigging. A lot more force to deal with if something parts, and a lot harder to dock, and a lot harder to get off during a grounding.


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## seaboy (Oct 9, 2012)

eherlihy said:


> Good on 'ya. Your post reminds me of this song;


how did you know? your song choice is so on the mark, i think me and yee are kindred spirits, but still, its a bit depressing to think that we wont mean a thing in a hundred years, anyway i will! lol, humm !, going off topic here, i get why a lot of people cant, or wont think that way, i just don't understand it, the end of all this blogging and keeping up with the jone's bull S**T is the most natural thing we have to hold on to, in fact i will be so bold as to say, that it is the only thing, in this life we have, that we can truly count on.
its coming to us all, but how will you be rememberd in a hundred years?
any way it dosent matter, tell me how you got started with sailing
All the best
Ant


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## seaboy (Oct 9, 2012)

in addition to the audio post, the words are very meaningful to everybody on hear, sorry i caught my self, i mean *here* weather they like it or not, rich or poor, the words apply, again,...."good choice" , there should be a quiet corner on here where people can share such thoughts, and even their lyrics, to a yet unborn song,!!!! who knows, it might still be around in a hundred years!
Any mods reading? throw up a section for the creatives.
if not then lets get back on topic lol


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## chef2sail (Nov 27, 2007)

I can buy a sewing machine...I sew buttons on my shirts and hems in my pants- I must a surgeon
I can buy connect and screw in a light bulb,,, I must be an elctrician
I can buy and make model rockets... I must be an astronount
I can buy fly a Cessna.....I must be a commercial airline pilot
I can buy a book and learn to mediate an argument with others....I must be a arbitrator
I can buy and read law books...I must be a judge
I can buy a Ferrari...I must be a formula 1 driver
I can buy Dr Suess books...I must be a teacher
I can buy a weather app...I must me a meteorologist
I can buy and operate a computer...I must be a rocket scientists/ physisct
I can buy a cookbook and follow a recipe...I must be a chef


I can buy a ferrocement sailboat...I must be a sailor,,,how hard is it really... turn on the engine,,,pull on a few pullys...use the radar and gadgets and point the boat to Italy...it will get there.

Find another hobby. Becoming a good sailor requires more than buying the boat, reading some books, getting a few pointers. You can hurt yourself and others/ If you arent ready to put the time in to gain some experience and open your mind up to listening to others who MAY have more wisdom than you, and slow down a little ( without giving up your dream), then you are a menace to yourself. However I do beleive people have the right to commit suicide.

Dave


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## CBinRI (May 17, 2004)

Now that you have made your choice I hope that you will let us know how it all turns out. Best of luck in your new adventure. And I hope your dogs like sailing more than mine does.


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## Sabreman (Sep 23, 2006)

> Becoming a good sailor requires more than buying the boat, reading some books, getting a few pointers.


Really? So that's what I've been missing these last 45 years. 

Seaboy - In the interest of defending the mass of too-conservative sailors on SailNet, of which I include myself, please take note of my avatar. I'm in the lower left corner. All the other people? They're giving me "a few pointers".

Sailing is one of the most complex sports on earth and one of few that can kill you too. Best of luck to you. I'm out of popcorn.


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## davidpm (Oct 22, 2007)

Another voice to say, if you have made up your mind, then there is nothing left but the fun.
Did I read correctly that you are married? How does your wife feel about this family project?

If you structure the deal in your favor so you put down very little but carry all the expenses until it is launched and you got to sail it you really haven't risked too much and the seller is in a better situation because he now has the boat in the water where it will be much easier to sell to someone else if boating turns out not to be for you.

You might want to hold off on leather seats and tv's and such until the boat is in the water and you have had a chance to find out what makes sense in real life. As others have said if you don't find at least one thing that is not cosmetic that costs thousands of dollars that really should be repaired you will be the first person in all of history.

You have mentor that knows the boat that is a big plus for you. On the other hand the PO probably can't sell this boat to anyone else so if you make the deal so he gets his money after the boat has passed survey is in the water and he has made you a sailor neither of you are taking much of a risk.


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## finding41 (Jul 19, 2011)

Wow what a thread!
Congratulations on your decision. Please do get as much advice and training as possible to ensure you and your family's safety. 
I bought a 26' boat and joined a yacht club. (Had only sailed a sunfish as a teen with almost no instruction.) Then asked members to tutor me. Lots of help out there.
Good on ya. Be safe.
Finding


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## casey1999 (Oct 18, 2010)

As they say:
"The second happiest day of a sailors life is the day he buys a boat. The happiest day is the day he sells the boat".

You and the owner should be two happy sailors.

Fair winds


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## Ferretchaser (Jan 14, 2011)

Ok I'll bite. Trouble and strife is Londond slang ( co ckney ) for whife. Right thats that one out of the way. Seaboy I had my boat In Ipswich, in a way just down the road from you but have sailed over to the US side of the pond this summer. I did the trip solo but have done 15 transats before, all being the trade wind route and in the winter month. Take one or two people with you when going down the coast and through the chanel. Its busy down there and if you don't know exactly what you are doing, your trip south may well find an aprupt ending right there and then. I sailed to Torquay as my last port of call and filled water and diesel tank up there before I left for the azores. If you are planing on sailing south on your own, stay away from the continental shelf of the bay if biscay or things can get very steep very fast. Been down and up that way a few times and now I tend to stay well out of it. You can get back closer into shore once you get to La Coruna and then do day sailing coast hops for most of the rest of the way down the Spanish and Portuguise coast. You don't want to ruin that leather interior with a few bucket of salt water rushing down the companion way now do you? Do at least a day skipper course with the RYA so you know what all those green red and white flashing lights are for. Also take the sort range VHF cert or you could find yourself in trouble just by sailing in the wrong spots on a day when areas are declared off limits by the coast guard. Then you trip could end up in the nick and not in Italy.If you make it down to the south of Spain, another buisy stretch is the straights of Gib. Again, try to get someone who knows whats what with you in that area. If you want to do it solo, good luck and get a good life insurance so that the touble and strife is looked after when you try to walk some of the way  
If you do try to take the shorter route across the bay and not stay out with lots of sea romm, take a few extra pairs of undies with ya ........ my guess is you'll need em.

Take care

Michael

ps. Some say that I am mad and I have been doing this sailing thing for a while


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## SchockT (May 21, 2012)

Well! Who would have thought this thread would have gone to 10 pages so quickly! What amazes me is that with so many experienced sailors and boat owners trying desperately to get you to at least slow down and think things through, the only result is that you have erased that 5% doubt that you had! Huh? If I had so many people trying to warn me that I was about to make a big mistake, it would increase my doubts not lessen them! But maybe that's just me!

Regardless, you have made your decision, and this community will be here to help you in your journey, whether it is determining what that funny noise from your prop shaft is, or what route you should take to get to Italy! You will more than likely find the answers to your questions here.

Whether you heed that advice....that's another question all together!

You never answered the question, What does your wife think of your plan?

Just curious!


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## Dirtboy (Jul 13, 2009)

Hi Ant, welcome to the forum. One thing all of us sailors have in common; we're all "dreamers." LOL We understand the dream, but those of us who've been there know the reality. Small boats are big fun, small headache. Big boats are big fun, big headache. When people buy the "wrong" boat they tend to have the "wrong" experience and end up disappointed.

It's like learning to drive with a London double level bus.

I sold motorcycles for many years and frequently encountered this same attitude; bigger is better. The trouble with learning to ride on a big bike is the same problem with learning to sail on a large boat: You can get way too deep into trouble, way too fast, with deadly results.

Learning to sail is quite simple. The concept is easy to grasp and a few hours of trial and error (usually done with a small boat) will get you going. Plan to spend the next 30/40 years (if you stay with it) learning. Learning safety, weather, seamanship, your boat, yourself, etc. Like motorcycling, it's always challenging, every time you leave the dock.

I learned to sail in 1954 at the Navy base in Newport, RI., I was 12. The final exam was to singlehand their 26' boat from the dock, around the bay and back to the dock; all under sail. The fact I had such a good foundation saved my sorry ass many times. LOL It really helps to start out knowing what you're doing. When things go wrong (and they will) it comes in handy.

Good Luck,

DB


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## SimonV (Jul 6, 2006)

If you plan on keeping this ferro boat forever then go for it, a boat is only worth what one is prepared to pay....but if you plan to sell it to upgrade later expect a value, if you keep it up to a good standard, to be about 20 to 25K so if you keep it for 10 years then a depreciation of 2.5k per year is quite reasonable as long as you prepare yourself for the inevitable. As far as insurance there are a number of companies that will insure your ferro boat but they will be expensive and will be no where near the value you place on the boat. Good luck enjoy the boat and don't over capitalize putting your mark on it, whatever you spend must be considered dead money.


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

Someone may have mentioned this already. The OP's challenge with insurance is not going to be the hull material, it's going to be lack of experience sailing and owning a 38 foot boat. The former owner's experience doesn't transfer. 

Insurance companies are not adventuresome.


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## copacabana (Oct 1, 2007)

Ant, you've received some pretty good advice so far. As far as learning to sail goes, it's not rocket science. Get a book on the basic principles of sailing (or look online) for starters to understand how a sail works. In a week or so you can learn the basics of sailing and be able to take your boat out _under normal conditions_. It's when conditions are not normal that things get hairy!... Learn and practice reefing your mainsail until you can do it with your eyes closed. Learn how to reduce/furl your head sails. Then practice going out in progressively windier conditions until you feel comfortable sailing in higher wind.

The real challenge is learning all about your boat. This will take a much longer time, as much as a year or more, depending on how interested you are in how things work. It's really worthwhile going over every hose (change them while you're at it), wire, fuel line, through-hull, pump, the rig, line, sheet, block etc. You will need to know how everything works. When you really know everything on your boat you'll be able to relax, because you'll know how to fix or replace just about everything. Then I think you'll be ready for that longer trip you want to take. Leaving sooner just adds stress when things go wrong on board (and they will!). Since you have the previous owner around to "show you the ropes" you should milk him for all you can on how the boat works, what spares are on board (label them clearly), what has been giving trouble on board (the "quirks') and how to fix it, etc. He will also be the ideal person to show the little tricks to sail that particular boat.

I won't speculate on the value of this boat, though I have to say that if everyone here feels it's overpriced, you should look into this more closely. Boats are never a wise monetary investment. Expect to lose money on this boat, but hopefully the return in pleasure on your money investment will be more than compensation. Also, no matter how good things look on the boat, there will be a lot of things to fix, replace, change, upgrade etc. over the next months. Keep some money in reserve for this and expect things to break.

Finally, welcome to Sailnet! You'll find that you'll get a lot of good advice when it comes to sorting out the bugs on your new boat.

Cheers!


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## 1958 (Oct 19, 2010)

I see your heart is in right place but I would seriously read up on ferro boats. I see many tempting ones for sale too and I have concluded they are impossible to sell and easily damaged. I am also looking to buy my first boat and am steering clear of ferro no matter how cheap. Good luck


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## aa3jy (Jul 23, 2006)

seaboy said:


> I have decided to buy a 38 foot Ferrocement boat of off my mates dad, its a big investment at 50k and im not a rich man, but i can pay for it over a period of time so its not an issue, what is an issue though, is that i have only ever sailed on my mates boat about 12 years ago, and that was just a 5 day party, that i dont remember much about if im totaly honest, i don't have a clue about what im doing when it comes sailing a boat, how hard can it be ? "right", although my mates dad is going to show me how to get on, when we put her back in the water, i am not sure how long he is going to be able to teach me as he is in bad health.
> How hard is this sailing carry on, am i biting off more than i should as a novice?
> if any one else has jumped in the deep end like this, i would like to hear how you got on,.
> im only 37 so i have time to learn, but im thinking of pointing this thing at italy next summer! am i mad?


Deja Vue..

http://www.sailnet.com/forums/learning-sail/92659-dont-need-no-lessons-just-go.html

:laugher


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## Deric (Feb 3, 2008)

I love ideals that value freedom, free speech, and collaboration; this thread is a wonderful example. 

OP indicated a desire to spend his money, his time, and his desire to sail. He asked for opinions and suggestions, and the community obliged.

Respect for OP decision or choice to change his mind is his. IMHO, I enjoyed reading this thread because it was educational, sometimes entertaining, sometimes confusing, but ultimately well managed, norms of civility expressed, and good will tone noted.

I really like this online community.

Sail safely,
Greatketch33


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## smackdaddy (Aug 13, 2008)

SN does kind of rock doesn't it?


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## CarbonSink62 (Sep 29, 2011)

Yes. Yes it does.

I wish Ant all the best and hope he keeps us posted.

Ken


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## PCP (Dec 1, 2004)

Deric said:


> I love ideals that value freedom, free speech, and collaboration; this thread is a wonderful example.
> 
> OP indicated a desire to spend his money, his time, and his desire to sail. He asked for opinions and suggestions, and the community obliged.
> 
> ...


Well, that's why I post here and not elsewhere.

Regards

Paulo


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## seaboy (Oct 9, 2012)

SchockT said:


> Well! Who would have thought this thread would have gone to 10 pages so quickly! What amazes me is that with so many experienced sailors and boat owners trying desperately to get you to at least slow down and think things through, the only result is that you have erased that 5% doubt that you had! Huh? If I had so many people trying to warn me that I was about to make a big mistake, it would increase my doubts not lessen them! But maybe that's just me!
> 
> Regardless, you have made your decision, and this community will be here to help you in your journey, whether it is determining what that funny noise from your prop shaft is, or what route you should take to get to Italy! You will more than likely find the answers to your questions here.
> 
> ...


humm the wife!
well i have been with her 14 years now and i think she has just learned that once my mind is set on something there isnt a right lot to be said or done about it, poor lass!.
i do have to wonder where these new talks about life insurance are coming from though
All the best
Ant


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## chucklesR (Sep 17, 2007)

Ant,

I'm hoping we don't read about your experience on the internet, unless it's a success.


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## seaboy (Oct 9, 2012)

ahh dont worry about me, ill be ok,
i know i might seem a little cavalier about this whole thing but that is just the way i am, im quite switched on really, i wont be pointing this boat at another country if i dont think i can get there, besides i cant swim (only joking) i dont think you will be hearing any horror stories about this little adventure.
All the best
Ant


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## Ferretchaser (Jan 14, 2011)

seaboy said:


> ahh dont worry about me, ill be ok,
> i know i might seem a little cavalier about this whole thing but that is just the way i am, im quite switched on really, i wont be pointing this boat at another country if i dont think i can get there, besides i cant swim (only joking) i dont think you will be hearing any horror stories about this little adventure.
> All the best
> Ant


Ant your biggest problem in the whole matter is that you don't know what you don't know. 
Think of it as having two boxes. One is filled with luck and is hopefully well stocked. The other one is for experience and skill. You have to try to fill the empty box before the other one runs out.
The nasty bit about experience is, that one tends to aquire it about a second after one could have realy done with having it.

Regards

Michael


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## miatapaul (Dec 15, 2006)

chef2sail said:


> I can buy a sewing machine...I sew buttons on my shirts and hems in my pants- I must a surgeon
> I can buy connect and screw in a light bulb,,, I must be an elctrician
> I can buy and make model rockets... I must be an astronount
> I can buy fly a Cessna.....I must be a commercial airline pilot
> ...


You can hurt yourself and others/ should be Can KILL yourself and others... That is the issue, if he might just brake a leg or an arm who would care, but he can kill himself or others, that is the problem. I have started a few comments on this topic a few times since the first day the troll started it, but have always refrained.


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## cookwithgas (Oct 8, 2007)

*Zamm!*



copacabana said:


> The real challenge is learning all about your boat. This will take a much longer time, as much as a year or more, depending on how interested you are in how things work. It's really worthwhile going over every hose (change them while you're at it), wire, fuel line, through-hull, pump, the rig, line, sheet, block etc. You will need to know how everything works. When you really know everything on your boat you'll be able to relax, because you'll know how to fix or replace just about everything.
> Finally, welcome to Sailnet! You'll find that you'll get a lot of good advice when it comes to sorting out the bugs on your new boat.
> 
> Cheers!


Well said Copa!

If you haven't already, you should discover "ZAMM" - Find a copy of "Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance" and read it. It is completely appropriate for a sailboat owner. Especially a new owner.

Take care,

Scott in New Orleans


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## smackdaddy (Aug 13, 2008)

*Re: Zamm!*



cookwithgas said:


> Well said Copa!
> 
> If you haven't already, you should discover "ZAMM" - Find a copy of "Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance" and read it. It is completely appropriate for a sailboat owner. Especially a new owner.
> 
> ...


You know you're a sailor when you can make Phaedrus bring you beers.


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## scratchee (Mar 2, 2012)

> well i have been with her 14 years now and i think she has just learned that once my mind is set on something there isnt a right lot to be said or done about it, poor lass!.


Heck, I learned that in a matter of hours!


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## JulieMor (Sep 5, 2011)

smackdaddy said:


> SN does kind of rock doesn't it?


Yeah it does. Glad I found it.

To the OP question: My dad had never sailed when he bought a Columbia 45 back in 1977. A good friend of his was an avid sailor and racer but that wasn't my dad. He learned everything the hard way. Some things he never learned. I think because sailing wasn't in his blood. But it was in mine. That's just the way it is.

Still, he enjoyed almost 20 years of ownership with that boat and had it until the day he died. He sailed it from Chicago to Mackinac Island and into Georgian Bay. He took it down the Intercoastal to Florida and over into the Bahamas. We sailed it down the Keys and back to the Bahamas. He would have taken it anywhere, so long as he had an able crew. He ran aground. He got blown onshore. He broke some ribs and got banged up a lot. But I'll bet if he were here now he'd say he was glad he bought the boat and it brought him a lot of joy.

I learned to really sail on that boat. I often singlehanded it, sometimes because the guests aboard were too busy enjoying the ride. I learned life lessons I will never forget and discovered talents I never thought I had. And I found a community I will forever feel a part of, regardless if I'm landlocked or at sea.


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## Waltthesalt (Sep 22, 2009)

Looks like a good boat to live aboard. A lot of boat to handle without an experienced crew. Recommend that you start small. The operating and maintenance costs on a 38 ft boat will astound you. A lot depends on construction and age. If not living aboard I think it is far more practical to have a small boat to learn and knock about on and charter a big boat for a cruise when you're ready experience wise. that will give you an idea whether an investment in a big boat it right for you.. the bigger the boat is the less you'll get out on it.


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## Deric (Feb 3, 2008)

Little or no experience + sailboat + sailing time = additional gained experience.

I believe the thought of this thread is for one to acquire experience safely; hence, the many recommendations of suggestions to start on a smaller boat. Of course, safe is not only for the new sailor but for others who share the waters with the new sailor.

Fair winds,
GreatKetch33


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## CarbonSink62 (Sep 29, 2011)

JulieMor said:


> ...I learned life lessons I will never forget and discovered talents I never thought I had. And I found a community I will forever feel a part of, regardless if I'm landlocked or at sea.


Is it dusty in here? (sniff!)


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## smallboatlover (May 11, 2011)

hey seaboy go for it get the boat you will figure out every thing as you go. thats what i do i got a boat and the day i got the boat i lost my job. so no income but i make work out and my boats still floating and sailing just fine. im also only 16. so if you 37 your a little late but you can still make it work.


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

smallboatlover said:


> hey seaboy go for it get the boat you will figure out every thing as you go. thats what i do i got a boat and the day i got the boat i lost my job. so no income but i make work out and my boats still floating and sailing just fine. im also only 16. so if you 37 your a little late but you can still make it work.


This kid has moxie. I like that, even if I don't agree with the advice and 37 isn't too late for anything. I know a guy that just got his pilots license at 66.


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## smallboatlover (May 11, 2011)

im 16 when im 37 i hope to be one a boat maybe bigger then 37 and cruising the world.


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## SeaQuinn (Jul 31, 2012)

Only advice I have for you right now is to hold off on the TV's and recovering the cushions until you pay for getting the boat in the water, paying for the insurance and paying for any of the systems that need maintenance or malfunction in the first month you have the boat in the water......also use some of your leftover cash to get some formal sailing lessons.

Best of luck with your new boat.....hope it turns out well for you!


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## Mani Moana (Oct 26, 2012)

Mediterranean is rough... Atlantic is cool but might frighten you at the beginning... the best way to learn: listen sailors talking and go for it!


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## BillAU (Jun 22, 2012)

G'day Ant,

First let me say...I really do like properly designed and well built Ferro-Cement boats and, from what you say in your post, this boat is definitely a well designed and built boat!
You say the PO had a plastering team fly-out from Hartley, New Zealand, to plaster the boat, (Wow! Now that cost alone could have bought the builder a second-hand plastic boat ) so that tells me that your Dad's mate did not skimp on the build. (He must be worth a few bob ) You also said, the yacht has all the Lloyd’s certificates, great! You can bet your life, (and you will be betting your life, all folk of the sea do so every time they go to sea) your FC boat HAS been properly designed and built to specifications...Even though I believe, at 50,000GBP, your paying way to much for the boat.
Similar well designed/built FC boats can be found in AU and NZ for 35,000 DOLLARS and upwards, depending on size, and FC boats are much cheaper in the States but then, a boat, any boat, like anything else second hand, is worth only what a buyer is willing to pay for it.

You said the boat is a Bilge Keeler. i.e. You can sail up to a beach at high tide and wait for the tide to go out, leaving the boat sitting upright on the sand, then walk ashore. So the boat is shallow draught, if that is so, perhaps you could nip over to France, enter the French canal system and go down to the Med using the canals. It's been well over forty years since I've been in the Med and I entered from the North Atlantic, I was told of the France/Med connection by other seamen in the local Greek bar, so perhaps others who have used the French canal system could advise you better on that system.

Good luck with all your plans Ant.

Bill
Australia


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## smurphny (Feb 20, 2009)

It sounds like you have quite a good grasp of the details of what you are going to do. Sometimes buying/selling things with people you know can present problems. Many friendships have been ruined by financial agreements. 

As far as learning to sail her...just do it. Get someone to show you how. Read everything you can get your hands on. It's not rocket science. There are a zillion things you'll need to learn but I sense you'll skate through that. Just don't set off across an ocean before you've been out in crappy weather and know how to deal with nasty seas and high wind. You need practice and experience in what your boat can and can't do. 

Are there things the boat needs to go offshore? Radios, EPIRB, radar? Liferaft, safety gear, watermaker, re-rigging. A boat can cost many thousands to bring up to snuff. Where will you dock it? How much will that cost? Boats require continual maintenance. Something is always breaking. How is the engine? Make up an Excel spreadsheet of projected expenses then add about 40% to see if you can afford it. Personally, I would never finance a boat and think it is a very bad thing for which to be in debt.


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