# Cost of owning a boat in Toronto



## Boxerz123

Hi everyone,
I'm researching to see if I can afford owning a sailboat in the 28-33 foot range. I'll be sailing out of Toronto and find the marina rate sheets somewhat confusing. 

I know Toronto has multiple marina's/clubs but I wanted to get a sense of roughly how much launch/summer docking/haul out/ winter storage will cost on average. 
This is excluding all other costs: i.e. boat maintenance and parts, etc. I'm talking strictly docking and storage costs.

Also would you recommend a yacht club or a marina? And are the costs around $5k or more like $10k...or more?  

Thank you in advance.


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## Ninefingers

I am at Outer Harbour Marina, which is on the high end of $ as far as Marinas go. Slips are $104/ft for a 6 month summer berth. So a 30 ft boat costs $3120.00. That is also the minimum charge, so you pay that for any boat up to 30 ft, (such as my CS27).

For winter storage and haulout, it's $6.35 x the length and beam of your boat. I think I paid about $1700 because I added a power wash for $150.


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## Boxerz123

Thanks ninefingers for the great info. I"ll definitely be stretched a bit with the cost but I've quickly realized that its not a cheap endeavor. On another thought, how do you like the CS 27? It was one of the boats recommended to me and I'm doing research on it. 

Any particular issues you've had? Would you recommend a weekend cruise or even longer to 1000 island on such a boat? How about Handling and whether it can be single handed?

Sorry to bombard you with more questions!!!!


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## boatpoker

The CS27 is a good boat and will handle the Great Lakes quite well. Sounds like you are new to this so before you find your dream boat and spend money on a survey you should learn a little about how to weed out the junk. Marine Survey 101 is a good place to start.


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## Ninefingers

Well, it's hard to find someone who doesn't like their own boat, so take that into consideration. That said, the bang for the buck with a CS27 is pretty hard to beat- that may have something to do with their abundance in these parts.

Single handing is fine. It's a very safe well built boat.

It has plenty of room down below, (for a 27 footer). I overnight often.

I do wish that it had a larger cockpit though. It's on the smaller end of most 27's.

The yanmar diesel is pretty bulletproof, (if noisy).

You can learn more about my boat at CS27 ~ Ravat. It was meticulously refitted by it's previous owner, and he has documented it well!


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## danstanford

We are further east of Toronto and so have some different costs at marinas but have looked closer to you a couple of times. If you are going to do this for more than a few years you should look at joining a yacht club as the cost per year is much lower once the equity/initiation is covered. You will have to do some work on the club facility over the year but you can save some money and make some good friends!

Dan


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## pcmm

If you can look east of Toronto, lots of great marina's with as good or better facilities. Toronto is pretty crowded and expensive for what you get. I used to sail out of center island Marina and you def paid for the location ( there were no usable facilities to speak of) but the location was great! east of Toronto, Whitby has to have one of the most active marinas with reciprocals that I have ever been at. and there are no length minimums ( marina speak for being only interested in large boats) at $60ish a foot its a little more than half the price of the marinas in Toronto harbour!


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## killarney_sailor

Think about where you can get to comfortably from your home. Generally downtown is most expensive with west of the city next and east of the city cheapest (like real estate). Some yacht clubs are quite posh while others are quite down to earth. Member work hours reduce the cost of membership. Best to compare costs in a similar location, e.g. Whitby Marina vs Whitby Yacht Club.


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## skalashn

When I was looking for a place to dock around Toronto 3 years ago, everything west of the city other than Port Credit was very expensive, waitlisted or both.

Consider what kind of sailing you are planning to do. Toronto area clubs/marinas are great for racing if that is your thing, but if you want to cruise I suggest you look at Georgian Bay. Better and cheaper dockage and amazing cruising grounds. We ran out of places to go on Lake Ontario in two seasons and this past June moved to Georgian Bay – what a difference! My family’s attitude towards boating went from “maybe” to “wow”, never mind two hour drive!


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## Boxerz123

Thanks for the great suggestions everyone.

My sailing plans are still tbd. I crewed on a few races down at ash bridges yacht club but didn't really get into it. Partly because it was the first few times I ever set foot on a sailboat and didn't appreciate the nuances. Also, because it was someone else's boat and I felt a bit out of place. I ended up joining a coop program and cruised with my friends around Toronto harbour.
I enjoyed that a lot more than racing but I haven't ruled out racing because I can see it being fun - on my own boat that is!!!! 

I never thought about sailing in the Georgian bay. I live mid-town Toronto so ideally it'd be nice to get to the boat right after work for a few hours. If I dock the boat in Georgian bay it'll sadly limit my sailing to just weekends, as beautiful a cruising area as it may be. But I can see it being similar to owning a cottage up north. People drive up every weekend so its doable. 

To hijack my own thread I've narrowed my boat search to an Alberg 29. Its not as common so I expect a long wait time until one comes up. Any thoughts on Albergs in general? 

I wan something "cheap" < $30,000. And very rough weather capable. I want it to be the boat that I'll sail outside of Canada one day so don't really want to deal with selling and buying again. 

Cheerz


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## Arcb

I haven't kept my boat in Toronto since 2013, but when I did I really enjoyed it. The marina I used was Toronto Island Marina, which is a great facility on the island with a great social community and lots of slips (no waiting list). I checked the current rate sheet and it looks like it would be about $3000 to keep a boat there for the summer. When I hauled out, I always hauled out at Bluffers Park Marina, because the island was too difficult to access during the winter for maintenance. I checked their current rate sheet and it looks like they would be about $1500 for winter storage. Both facilities require insurance, so ball park another $500. I would say you would be pretty close to $5000.

I think if you are going to keep a boat in Toronto, a good place to keep it is in or near the inner harbor, either on the main land or the islands. It can be a bit of a grind getting into the inner harbour, which is where all the boating action is, from some of the more suburban locations if the wind conditions aren't favourable. My boat did double duty, it was a sailboat, and a downtown condo to provide access to clubs, pubs, theater or whatever it is you like to do in the big city.

For week end destinations, I think the most popular is Niagara on the Lake/Port Dalhousie, it's an easy 26 miles straight across the lake and there is lots to do in the Niagara Region. For cruising, you have the 1000 Islands/Bay of Quinte. I would count on 2 days there and 2 days back (to the Bay of Quinte).

I think Toronto is a great sailing city, deep water, protected harbour, decentish wind, good week end spots (Niagara Region, Toronto Islands, Outer Harbour), excellent cruising grounds available, but, you need 10-14 days for the Thousand Islands because it is a bit of a hike getting there and back. I'm actually doing the reverse trip this coming summer, my current marina is just East of the thousand Islands and we are sailing to Toronto and Niagara Region, I plan on taking 16 days to do it.

For real nature lovers, Georgian Bay is also a good option, but I like being within half an hour of my boat, otherwise I find I don't use it as much. When I was a kid, we did exactly as described above, my Dad kept the boat at Port Credit until he got bored of Port Credit, then he moved it up to Victoria Harbour, Georgian Bay is fantastic. Its a good option if you don't mind the 2 hour drive each way.


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## killarney_sailor

The Alberg 29s seem better built than the 30s. Just remember that all of these boats are quite small for their LOA. They are rugged but not very fast. It would help if you defined 'outside Canada'. That could be a bunch of things.


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## Arcb

Agree with KS about space inside an Alberg being relatively limited in relation to their length (my brother sails an Alberg). You would probably have just as much space on the CS27.

Another consideration with Alberg is they sail on their ear which can be alarming for non sailors.

I'm not trying to talk you out of Albergs, I think both Alberg 29's and CS 27's are good options for Lake Ontario.


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## MikeOReilly

Looks like you’ve got good info Boxerz123, but I’ll add my recent experience in the Bay of Quinte. Our costs are closer to $3.5K for the season, including dockage, launch/haul and storage. We’re in a small marina in Belleville, which puts us a short hop to the 1000 Islands and the whole east side of the Lake. I haven’t sailed the far west side of the Lake, but the east end offers possibly the best cruising grounds on Ontario. 

Belleville is less than two hours from Toronto, Kingston a bit further, but places like Trenton are even closer. A new marina just opened up in Trenton. Might be worth checking out.


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## Boxerz123

I guess its the price you have to pay to live in toronto and sail here as well. 
As with the Alberg, I actually haven't been in one but I've heard they're tight and a bit tender at first until they heal to 15 degree or so...then they're rock solid. 

Outside of Canada would be Bahamas and the carribean. And if I everything falls into place in a few years a sabbatical to the Med. I can't think of any other boat that can be 30 ft or under and capable of doing serious passage and still be relatively cheap. But lots of research still needs to be done. I guess you can call it a "Boat Crush". Just love the classic looks on boats. 

The 29 is different than the 30. Its roomier inside and a little bit more modern. Not sure if its tender like the 30. 

I"m hoping I can get on as many boats this summer as possible to make an educated decision. Any other boats you can think of that can fit these requirements? I'm a minimalist so a 40 footer with all the gadgets isn't for me. 
I've been reading Atom Voyages blogs and am really fascinated by the DIY mentality and a leaving a small foot print.


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## zedboy

We lived in Thornhill and found Lake Simcoe had plenty to keep us interested and was easier to get to than downtown. Also, if you're taking beginners out, the Lake Ontario chop = queasy guests (sailed with a friend out of Bluffer's a bunch of times).

Lake Scugog had a marina that was limited to 24' or 25' but was really cheap...like $1k for the season. We lucked out and got a spot in the town marina in Jackson's Point that was also super cheap, but the commercial marinas are probably a little higher. I think Crates in Keswick quoted me $2500 for 25' but I think that included winter there and haulout.

Disagree with you on first boats - get something cheap that will be good for what you need now, and be ready to let it go for what you paid for it or less. Translation: a Grampian 26 for under $5k. Will sail better than the Albergs and have as much or more space, and will be easy to sell again. Plenty of boat to putter around all over the lakes.


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## Boxerz123

Zedboy are you suggesting a $5000 Grampian 26 sails better than the bluewater Albergs? 

My thoughts on the buying THE boat from the start is to spend the seasons learning all the systems inside out and also upgrade as need be and as money becomes available. Though I can say that I'm a half decent sailor, I really don't know much about boat maintenance so hoping to grow with the boat as I go. But I agree that it's wiser to get a boat thats readily available and maybe easy to sell when the time comes. 
If I choose to rejoin the coop program I sailed with this last season, I can have access to c&c (25s and 29s) pretty much whenever I want for $1700 for the whole summer. The issue I have is that its not my own and I will need to return it by sunset which means no overnight cruising.


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## zedboy

Boxerz123 said:


> Zedboy are you suggesting a $5000 Grampian 26 sails better than the bluewater Albergs?


Mmmmm .... yup.

This has been hashed out at extreme length in a bajillion threads already, but:

a) Alberg's thinking was already conservative at the time he was designing his boats, and that was 40-50 years ago. If you have sailed on both, you will see the differences, especially in pointing ability and maneuverability (not to mention interior space!). There are obviously tradeoffs which can be debated. My first boat was ~70 years old, BTDT. I do not think I will ever go back to long keel. I know it's cliche already, but go read Bob Perry's book, and see what he's written online.

b) Much more importantly: *It is a major mistake to think a given piece of classic plastic is a "bluewater" model!!* I know a guy who bought a Triton - just like Atom, right? - spent a long time redoing the interior and fixing the wet decks, went out the Golden Gate and turned left .... and lost his rig off Monterrey because of a failed swage. Just because one or a lot of a given model have gone around doesn't mean that the one you buy is in condition to do it. Doesn't mean you can't upgrade it to get there, but you're looking at a lot of work and expense when you could be sailing your local waters having fun....



Boxerz123 said:


> My thoughts on the buying THE boat from the start is to spend the seasons learning all the systems inside out and also upgrade as need be and as money becomes available. Though I can say that I'm a half decent sailor, I really don't know much about boat maintenance so hoping to grow with the boat as I go.


At the small end of the spectrum, the systems are extremely simple and should remain so. What you learn will be applicable everywhere (granted, you may not learn how to rebuild a fridge or watermaker ... suggest you not worry about that for now).


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## Boxerz123

Zedboy I see your point. Obviously I'm many books away from confidently choosing the proper boat but I find the research is half the fun.


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## Arcb

Grampian 26's and 30's actually sail pretty well, and I think either one would outpoint an Alberg. 

I have had 2 Grampians in my life. My old 1974 Grampian 30 sailed well, she pointed well, she was comfortable when the going got tough. Would I take one to the Bahamas? Absolutely, without hesitation. Across the Atlantic- no, I don't think I would.

Our family boat when I was a kid was a Grampian 23 and my Dad would not hesitate to take that boat anywhere on the great Lakes with wife, 2 children and a baby on board, for up to a couple of weeks cruising at a time. I would definitely not take one across the atlantic.

Well equipped Alberg 30's are perceived to be better offshore passage makers than any sized Grampian, but I don't think that has anything to do with sailing performance.

I don't know how much of your boat buying should be based on this hypothetical Atlantic crossing. Spend some time out of site of land and you will see pretty quick how monotonous a trip like that could be. You can always charter in Turkey if you want to see the Med.


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## MikeOReilly

Since we're on the Grampian kick I can add I've sailed 26s, 30s and owned a 34 (ketch) for a number of years. I was planning to make the 34 _THE_ boat, and I'm sure it would have done everything I have done/will likely do.

Gramps are all simple, solid and decent sailors. They are easy to maintain, big for their sizes, and they can be had for pretty cheap.

I also like Albergs. I've sailed a 30 and there's a 29 in our marina right now that I've spent time ogling. Lovely boats to my eye, but I doubt they are as a group any more sea worthy than Grampians.


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## Boxerz123

MikeO can you share your thoughts on the difference sailing ability of Grampians vs Albergs? e.g. rough weather sailing/just overall feel.

If a grampian a better sailing boat and more comfortable why woulnd't it be good for a big crossing? I'm confused with previous post that "I'd sail a grampian to the Bahamas but not across the atlantic". Aren't you pretty much offshore when you go to Bahamas?


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## MikeOReilly

Boxerz123 said:


> MikeO can you share your thoughts on the difference sailing ability of Grampians vs Albergs? e.g. rough weather sailing/just overall feel.
> 
> If a grampian a better sailing boat and more comfortable why woulnd't it be good for a big crossing? I'm confused with previous post that "I'd sail a grampian to the Bahamas but not across the atlantic". Aren't you pretty much offshore when you go to Bahamas?


I sailed my Gramps 34 in 3+ meter seas and 50 knot winds on Lake Superior. My direct experience sailing a Alberg 30 was in mild conditions. So too with the sailing I've done on the Grampian 26s and 30s - it was all in mild conditions, mainly b/c they were not my boats. I state all this so you can take my thoughts for what they are worth.

The Alberg is a more classic wine-shaped hull with a fuller keel. It is narrow for it's LOA, relatively heavy. It produces no hull lift, is slower to get going, and of course not as maneuverable. The Gramps actually produce some hull lift - not that they're planning by any means, but the hull shape is such that they will start to ride higher as you get moving. I think this explains why they are relatively fast (not racing fast, but surprisingly so). I'm not sure how they compare with sail area. I know my ketch could carry a lot of cloth, and would out perform comparable "racer" boats with wind on the beam.

My assessment of build quality is that both are similar. Albergs were built to a higher finish standard, but to my eye, the basic guts of the boats are very similar. Both are solid, simple and seaworthy. Both are easy to maintain.

Grampians have a lot more liveable and storage space than the Albergs. I'd guess that a Gramp 26 is close to the same living space as the Alberg 30 (and I think the 29 is even smaller).

I definitely would cross an ocean in my Grampian 34; in fact, I was planning to do so. Many have crossed the Atlantic. I would consider a Gramp 30 and an Alberg 30 to have the same "blue water" capabilities. Prep and maintenance will be the most important factor with these boats.

I would not take a Gramp 26 off shore; not b/c it's a Gramp. It's just too small for my comfort zone. Actually, I'd probably not take a 30 footer off shore either.

I've never sailed to The Bahamas, but it's not really off shore. The distance is as short as about 50 nm. I'd definitely take a 26 footer that far - I have sailed a 26 footer much further on Lake Superior.


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## Vasco

A bit of discussion here on Alberg 29's. If I remember right quite a few of these were kit boats so the build quality might vary. The 30's were built by Kurt Hansen, Whitby Boats.


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## olson34

The thread started out with a comparison of places to moor, and marinas were sort of lumped in with yacht clubs.
Keep in mind that there are advantages to belonging to a YC, and that a personal commitment of time is required. i.e. it's a lot more than just an inexpensive place to tie up your boat.

I only mention that because I am a port captain for a 150 slip YC, and our costs to be a member with moorage are quite a bit cheaper than the nearby corporate marinas. We have to quiz potential members about their intentions and expectations. Our low total cost of membership is balanced against a requirement for a minimum # of work hours per year, as we have zero paid staff.
It's a great deal, but also different from a marina.

Having said all that, if I ever had to move to another sea port, I would find and join a YC right away. New friends, camaraderie, exchanging advice and sometimes even help with boat projects... plus pot lucks, parties, educational programs.... etc.

Just something to consider when you scout the waterfront.


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## JASWANNY

My Rule of thumb is have three times as much cash available as your estimated cost for purchasing the boat. So, if you want a $50 K boat, figure how you would come up with about $150 K for the next five years or so. That means you can purchase your boat, operate your boat, and spend money on repairs, upgrades and still have a little left over to enjoy life. If you go tighter than this, you may find the boat is a liability that owns you instead of the other way around.


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## Arcb

Boxerz123 said:


> If a grampian a better sailing boat and more comfortable why woulnd't it be good for a big crossing? I'm confused with previous post that "I'd sail a grampian to the Bahamas but not across the atlantic". Aren't you pretty much offshore when you go to Bahamas?


Take a look on google maps. Freeport Bahamas is about 85 miles from Florida. If you were to sail direct non stop from Toronto to the Main Duck Island for a summer vacation in the 1000 Islands, you would be looking at about 140 miles. The definition of offshore seems to be a constantly moving target depending on context and who you are talking to. For example, the Lake Ontario 300, which is a race around Lake Ontario, is promoted as an Offshore Race. Crossing the Atlantic is going to be about 3000 miles, not really on the same scale as a sail across to the Bahamas.

This is why I chose specific examples like the Bahamas and Transatlantic (examples from your posts), so we wouldn't have to rely on a moving definition of offshore. If you buy a boat suitable for open water on the Great Lakes it should be adequate for playing around in the Bahamas or Florida Keys as well. If I wanted a boat I could sail around Toronto in the summer and take down to Florida in the winter, I would consider a trailer sailor as an option, because pulling a boat behind a truck is a lot less hassle than motoring down the ICW.

To get back to the original topic. If you wanted to keep a boat in Toronto, and you are finding the $5k/year to be an obstacle, a trailerable boat can significantly reduce that figure. If you wanted a small cruiser that was suitable for Lake Ontario, and the Florida Keys, Bay of Quinte,Thousand Islands and Georgian Bay, I can think of a few inexpensive boat models I would trust; Alberg 22, CS 22, Tanzer 22 and Nordica 20 would all be up to the task in my opinion. If we take a look at the cost to keep one of these boats in Toronto, say an Alberg 22, Outer Harbour moorage fees would be about $2300 and winter storage would be basically nothing because you trailer it home to your drive way or pay a small fee to store it in a field for the winter. Roughly half the cost of a 30 footer, and you can trailer your little Alberg down to Florida for the winter for some fun in the sun for a month or two. What you can't do with a boat like this, is cross the Atlantic or sail extensively in the Caribbean.

Edit: Take a look at this little beauty on Kijiji. She is loaded, highway trailer, so you can trailer her down to Miami for your crossing to the Bahamas, and so you can store her cheap in the winter. Autopilot, chartplotter, depth sounder, new dinghy with a new motor. http://www.kijiji.ca/v-sailboat/owe...er/1193568486?enableSearchNavigationFlag=true


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## Pendrith

Boxerz123 said:


> Thanks for the great suggestions everyone.
> 
> My sailing plans are still tbd. I crewed on a few races down at ash bridges yacht club but didn't really get into it. Partly because it was the first few times I ever set foot on a sailboat and didn't appreciate the nuances. Also, because it was someone else's boat and I felt a bit out of place. I ended up joining a coop program and cruised with my friends around Toronto harbour.
> I enjoyed that a lot more than racing but I haven't ruled out racing because I can see it being fun - on my own boat that is!!!!
> 
> I never thought about sailing in the Georgian bay. I live mid-town Toronto so ideally it'd be nice to get to the boat right after work for a few hours. If I dock the boat in Georgian bay it'll sadly limit my sailing to just weekends, as beautiful a cruising area as it may be. But I can see it being similar to owning a cottage up north. People drive up every weekend so its doable.
> 
> To hijack my own thread I've narrowed my boat search to an Alberg 29. Its not as common so I expect a long wait time until one comes up. Any thoughts on Albergs in general?
> 
> I wan something "cheap" < $30,000. And very rough weather capable. I want it to be the boat that I'll sail outside of Canada one day so don't really want to deal with selling and buying again.
> 
> Cheerz


Hey boxers...if you want to learn to sail (and get in some racing/crewing experience on the cheap) join 1of the dinghy sailing clubs down on regatta road! ... the person that suggested G bay hit the nail on the head....lake ont. has great water but it's like driving on the 401 for entertainment!..join the dink club (st James town, mooredale,etc) ,save the initial hassle of buying, get some real time experience...and best of all it's a bicycle ride from your location...THEN you will have more time to go looking for your boat. Best of luck...


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## killarney_sailor

With respect I think you are nowhere ready to choose a boat for a trans-Atlantic at this point in your sailing life. Buy a cheaper boat for now and figure out what works for you. Sailing to the Bahamas is no big deal as long as you are patient and wait for decent weather. Sailing to the Med is at least an order of magnitude harder. It is not as simple as drawing a line from your starting point to Gibraltar. You need to consider both permanent climatic conditions (the huge Bermuda High) and possible weather conditions - and you will be far beyond weather forecast windows in a small boat. 

We have not cruised the Med but have talked to many European sailors who have told the same story. It is expensive, crowded (especially the western Med), with not very good sailing (too much wind or too little). To me a sabbatical in the Eastern Caribbean would make a lot more sense - lots of variety of shore experiences, a variety of sailing conditions, and not too expensive. How to get there is a topic for another time.

Another thought came to mind, I don't think Albergs steady up at 15° (where my boat settles in when the wind is honking); been quite a few years but I remember being out in an Alberg 37 (lovely boat btw) and it was steady at around 30°. If you want a tough little (it is little) boat for a decent price consider a Shark.


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## RegisteredUser

olson34 said:


> .....Our low total cost of membership is balanced against a requirement for a minimum # of work hours per year, as we have zero paid staff.......


That's interesting.
Some skin in the game, so to speak.
You probably have small groups of dedicated souls doing much more than is required. 
A tight social group/s...


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## olson34

RegisteredUser said:


> That's interesting.
> Some skin in the game, so to speak.
> You probably have small groups of dedicated souls doing much more than is required.
> A tight social group/s...


Having visited some other smaller yachts while cruising (using reciprocals) I would guess that there are quite a few like us. You are right about the work... our minimum work hour requirement per year per member family is 12 hours. 
I usually get in 30 to 50. There are quite a few other retirees that do more than the minimum to keep the place maintained.

Since I joined over 20 years ago, the club has totally remodeled the floating club house, replaced all of the old wood head walks (five @ 500' each) and all finger docks with new concrete, and recently replaced our worn out dredge with a new one.

Our parking lot is only gravel, but that suits our casual "personality".... !


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## sesmith

Arcb said:


> To get back to the original topic. If you wanted to keep a boat in Toronto, and you are finding the $5k/year to be an obstacle, a trailerable boat can significantly reduce that figure. If you wanted a small cruiser that was suitable for Lake Ontario, and the Florida Keys, Bay of Quinte,Thousand Islands and Georgian Bay, QUOTE]
> 
> Great suggestion. Rather than trying to buy THE boat that you think you will ultimately want, just buy something you can sail where you are now. Buy it right, so you can sell it right, when the time comes. In the meantime, you can come up with a list of all the things you really want / need in a future boat.
> 
> Trailerable works great for us right now. Our Seaward 25 has spent time on Ontario, Huron, and Champlain, as well as our home waters in NY's Fingerlakes region. Next summer's plans include a couple of weeks on the Maine coast. For winter storage, at no cost to me, the boat is in our yard (also a convenient place to work on it).
> 
> When we retire in a couple of years, we may get a larger boat, as we will based near Charleston, but we will likely still keep the Seaward (at least for a few years), as there are lots of places we may want to trailer the boat to.


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## Arcb

Boxerz123 said:


> how do you like the CS 27? It was one of the boats recommended to me and I'm doing research on it.


What turned you off the CS27? I am curious, because I have been thinking about downsizing if the right deal happens and CS27 is one of only about 3 boats on my list of potential boats.

I read the review in Canadian yachting which is written by Paul Howard with the assistance of Pat Sturgeon. I sailed with the author's daughter quite a bit when I was in High School so I know he's the real deal, he's an accomplished Ocean sailor.

In the article he describes CS27s as ocean going boats.

Check out the article. I can't do links from my phone, but just google CS27 reviews and it should come up.


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## MikeOReilly

I seriously considered a CS27 when I was purchasing our first boat. I recall being quite impressed with the cabin layout, and how smart and functional things had been designed. CSs have good reputations as well built vessels, and apparently they are pretty good sailors. Their PRHF rating (in SailingJoy anyway) suggest they are faster than Grampian 26s and comparable to Mirage 26 (another boat I sailed a lot). There are a number of CS27s in our marina. I've never sailed one, but those who do certainly love them.

BTW, there are couple of interesting sites that found useful back in my early days of boat shopping.

There is SailingJoy.com - Resources - Sailboat Specifications and Sailboatdata.com is the worlds largest sailboat database. which house databases of most mass produced boats. And then there's my favourite: Sail Calculator Pro v3.54 - 2800+ boats. This database allows simple head-to-head comparisons of almost any two boats. It's rudimentary stats, and it is difficult to read much into some of them, but for similar designed boats, this head to head can be useful. It also allows you to search for boats within a certain stat ranges. Hours of fun!


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