# Hinterhoeller HR28 - 1967



## RManning66 (Feb 9, 2009)

any thoughts on this boat? They are asking $9000 canadian with a trailer included (which I would like). The gas engine is unreliable so I would likely want to swap it for somthing else (used ideally).

I would not offer the full price but I'd like to know anyone's thoughts on the hinterhoellers in general. Also, any advice on how much to pay for a 20hp diesel and how to get the work done?

thanks
RM


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## Faster (Sep 13, 2005)

Here's a review by an obviously enthusiastic owner.. looks like a classic plastic that could be a nice boat if you get one that's been looked after.

http://www.sailnet.com/boatchk/showproduct.php?product=819

Hinterhoeller was involved with C&C early on, and ultimately produced the Niagara and Nonsuch lines - which generally have a good rep. George Hinterhoeller gained his rep as a designer with the little ahead-of-its-time 24'Shark.

Heres a google search for some comparison shopping:

hinterhoeller hr 28 - Google Search


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## Valiente (Jun 16, 2006)

H28s are very good, if Spartan by today's standards, lake boats. Think "Super-Shark". If it has an Atomic 4, it may be quite reliable indeed and can be rebuilt for less than the price of a new outboard. If it's just a crappy outboard in the well, the newer long-shafts are thriftier and quieter, but you still may have the issue of keeping the water out of the well. The HR-28 is very much a 'good old boat', but it will require a thorough survey, which might knock the price down as it is quite an elderly boat at this point.

Anyway, you might find this useful.

HINTERHOELLER 28


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## RManning66 (Feb 9, 2009)

It does indeed have an atomic 8. Any safety concerns if I just have her rebuilt, and not replaced by a diesel? Anything special I should know about the atomic 8?

rmanning


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## Gary M (May 9, 2006)

It is an Atomic 4 which stands for 4 cylinders. While diesel is generaly preferred there are a huge number of older boats around that have given long service with an Atomic 4. They are readily rebuilt. 

If you were to install a diesel you could get away with a 13-15 hp unit but the installation would likely be more than what you would pay for the boat. 

Gary


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## pvanv1 (Nov 16, 2007)

We own Orion, hull number 53, which is a 1968 HR28. We sail on Lake Ontario, out of Wilson, NY. I believe we paid more than 9K cdn for her back around 1990. But of course everything is dependent on condition, as well as what both the buyer and seller are willing to accept for a price.

Ours is tiller-steered, OB equipped, and we are running a new 9.8 Nissan for the aux. If you have an A4-equipped HR28 and it needs a motor rebuild, you can buy a drop-in Universal diesel.

There is a lot to like about the HR28, and not too many downsides, though factory accommodations were Spartan to be sure. There were actually 2 series of HR28 hulls, and apparently 2 mast heights in addition. These boats were built specifically for the Great Lakes, and one has single-handedly made the trip to Cape Town (South Africa) and back.

They are heavily-built, have a PHRF around 200, and are typical of well-built, hand-laid racer/cruisers from the late 60's. There was a great website, but apparently the owner who ran it has disappeared.

Anything you want to know about the boat, just ask. I may have the answer.


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## OnAWhim67 (Feb 28, 2009)

*Hull 53? 1968???*

I own On A Whim and have the original registry. My boat says it was built in 1967 and is hull number 54. Are you sure about the year yours was built? Also does anyone know the difference between an HR28 and a Hinterhoeller 28? There seems to be two hull designs. They are close, but the specs don't quite match up. Was the difference the optional atomic 4??? On A Whim resides in Baltimore Maryland after I brought it up from Annapolis...


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## ratty (May 17, 2009)

OnAWhim67 said:


> I own On A Whim and have the original registry. My boat says it was built in 1967 and is hull number 54. Are you sure about the year yours was built? Also does anyone know the difference between an HR28 and a Hinterhoeller 28? There seems to be two hull designs. They are close, but the specs don't quite match up. Was the difference the optional atomic 4??? On A Whim resides in Baltimore Maryland after I brought it up from Annapolis...


Hey,
HR 28 = Hinterhoeller 28
I'm not certain but I believe the build dates and hull numbers may be related to when the boat was first registered. We own the older variant and our Hull #25 has a Lloyd's registration date of 1966, yet there is another owner of Hull #23 who has a 1967 build date on his registry papers. Who knows why...

There are two different hulls. I believe the change occurred around Hull #49. The earlier variant came both with inboard engines and outboard wells as options as did the later. The earlier variant has a spoon entry at the bow as opposed to a more raked profile in the later. The later variant has much more volume above the waterline in the aft section and generally slightly more freeboard overall. Interiors are almost exactly the same with the newer model having much deeper storage in the bilge above the keel. The underwater profile of both models is virtually identical. Early models were fitted with only one set of lower shrouds while the later had dual inner shrouds. The very earliest models, say pre-20 had wooden spreaders. IIRC hulls pre-12 had a wooden boom as well. As far as mast height difference. I'm thinking this may be something of urban legend. I've bought the mainsail and a #2 jib from the newer #53 and they fit our boat almost exactly.

I've archived the previous HR 28 website content posted by Daniel Cooper in Quebec and am in the process of remounting a site dedicated to this good old boat. Keep a weather eye for that.
Cheers


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## OnAWhim67 (Feb 28, 2009)

Thanks ratty, let me know when you revive the HR 28 website...I was wondering what happened to that site. I've had mine for about 10 years now and she still sails great!


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## pvanv1 (Nov 16, 2007)

OnAWhim67 said:


> I own On A Whim and have the original registry. My boat says it was built in 1967 and is hull number 54. Are you sure about the year yours was built? Also does anyone know the difference between an HR28 and a Hinterhoeller 28? There seems to be two hull designs. They are close, but the specs don't quite match up. Was the difference the optional atomic 4??? On A Whim resides in Baltimore Maryland after I brought it up from Annapolis...


I know that my Builder's Plate shows "HR28 68 53". The sails that came on ORION were definitely identified 53, and the NY registration, NY 7259 BX, states 1968. Hugh Clifford (now deceased) of Olcott, NY was the first owner. He had it custom-built with amidships enclosed head, on starboard. The head compartment mimics the galley cabinet, but is built full height to the coachroof. Nice symmetry. We are the third owners, having purchased the boat around 1991 from Hedley's yard in Olcott, NY.


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## pvanv1 (Nov 16, 2007)

OnAWhim67 said:


> Thanks ratty, let me know when you revive the HR 28 website...I was wondering what happened to that site. I've had mine for about 10 years now and she still sails great!


I'll second the motion for an HR28 website. Really missing Daniel's site.


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## ratty (May 17, 2009)

Hey Paul,
I tried to send a personal message via this site but I need to have 5 posts to be able to do that. The delay in getting the site up has been due to spending all my spare time sailing the boat! I'd be interested in getting any images any HR28 owner would like to share. Prior to our last trip I shot a pile of images of the HR28 across the dock from us and there are some significant differences in his newer and our older variant of the boat. I want to highlight these items and am also interested in documenting any mods/fixes/hacks owners have done to their HR28's. Who knows what happened to Daniel. Sometimes people just get tired of maintaining a site. I anticipate having mine up around the first or second week of September.
Fair winds!


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## ratty (May 17, 2009)

Caught my mistake Paul. Our buddy across the dock has #55, not #53.
Cheers


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## OnAWhim67 (Feb 28, 2009)

*HR 28 Hull #54*

Hello all,
I have a few pics of On A Whim I could share if you're getting your site up. I was thinking...if the boat they talked about had a lot of custom work done it may indeed have been cast earlier than mine but registered later. The hull number is when the cast it at the factory I would think...not the date its done and registered. I'm running a 2008 Yamaha 9.9 4 stroke high thrust in mine. It sits in the well and I do have problems with growth and need to pull it from time to time. The new 9.9 has electric tilt and I've pondered cutting a notch in the back so I can trim the prop out of the water, but am not sure what that would do for the integrity. In the Chesapeake growth occurs in a few months no matter how much I antifoul it. The soft paint works well on the hull, but the outboard always seems to get crusty. I think I'm close to 5 posts so I can probably put some pics up soon. I'm sitting in Fells Point in downtown Baltimore. Fall cruises down the Chesapeake are wonderful, although this August heat and humidity make it a chore this time of year. Looking forward to seeing your site...i wonder if you can get a list of people from the previous site to come aboard.

Bob


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## pvanv1 (Nov 16, 2007)

Hey OnAWhim,

On Orion, we switched to a Nissan 9.8 long remote electric with HT prop last year. Works very well. Would have preferred a 15, but that would have required a shoehorn to install, and would have been a real bear to take in and out, being more than 25 pounds heavier. 

Being in freshwater Lake Ontario, the growth is a lot less than you get. We are using Aurora antifouling wax (made in Canada) on the LU and prop for the first time this year. So far, it seems to be doing OK. Be careful using AF paints on the LU, since "regular" copper bottom paints will attack the aluminum housing. We never had really good results using any (even TriLux, made for outdrives) AF paint on the old 'rude OB -- had problems keeping the paint adhered to the LU.

Our hull (#53) was originally equipped with a short shaft OB, which could tilt inside the lazarette. If we were in a really high fouling area, or racing every week, we might well go back to short shaft to get the LU out of the water during the off days when we don't sail, or when racing.

I was thinking that if we wanted to be able to tilt a long OB, we would redesign the inner "false transom" motor mount, making it an articulated setup. That would be a big job. Since we have a relatively short season (late April - early October) in cool freshwater -- with minimal fouling (except for the damned zebra mussels), it's a lot easier to keep it as is.

I suppose you could open up the outer transom, but you would definitely want to reinforce the cutout area a lot. If you don't motor in huge waves much, maybe a better setup would be to run a short shaft OB, and just tilt it into the lazarette when done for the day.


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## pvanv1 (Nov 16, 2007)

Ratty,

I think that many of the HR28's were semi-custom. I know that ours was a special order, because the original purchaser wanted a stand-up head compartment. We have done a few simple mods -- installed shore power, upgraded the DC system, constructed gas lockers in the lazarette, added a CDI furler, Dutchman, and Tides Marine Strong track, and have dorade boxes going on soon.

Would be happy to contribute a few pix to your site once it's running.

Where do you usually sail?


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## hriehl1 (Aug 8, 2007)

I'll third a vote for an HR 28 website... I just acquired Hull 64 with a fair amount of refit work needed.


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## mario tremblay (Aug 23, 2011)

*nice video of my hr #66*

if somebody want to see my hr 28, look on you tube for ( sarcelle-quebec)


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## mario tremblay (Aug 23, 2011)

*nice video of my hr #66*

look on you tube for (sarcelle-quebec)


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## mario tremblay (Aug 23, 2011)

*good news*



pvanv1 said:


> I'll second the motion for an HR28 website. Really missing Daniel's site.


i saw Daniel 
Cooper on his hr 28 this week end, (august 22 2011) ,,,,but he dont have time to keep his site alive..


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## pvanv1 (Nov 16, 2007)

mario tremblay said:


> i saw Daniel
> Cooper on his hr 28 this week end, (august 22 2011) ,,,,but he dont have time to keep his site alive..


Glad to know that Daniel Cooper is still around! If/When we do get another HR28 website running, we will want a lot of his information. He has collected a ton of information!


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## ratty (May 17, 2009)

*HR28 on facebook*

2 years ago I threatened to mount a site about our favourite boat but life gets in the way sometimes...I've started a facebook page and invite all to visit and post...
Hinterhoeller HR28 | Facebook
how many days till launch?
cheers


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## hriehl1 (Aug 8, 2007)

Thanks for starting the facebook page


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## rbyham (Dec 25, 2012)

Looks like I may be one of the most recent HH28 owners. As you can see from my other posts, my 1966 has been in storage for about 5 years so in need of some refitting. Main problem was the frozen rudder which we are getting on top of. I am curious to see from the discussion here so many powered by OBs. I have an atomic 4 that from all appearances still runs well. I will know a lot more following the launch but for now am curious if my having an A4 was special order? By the way, as I shook hands to purchase the boat, I made the mistake of saying in front of the PO that if the A4 craps out I would cut a hole in the bottom, build a well and drop in an OB. The PO actually shuddered at that thought and I actually feared he might cancel the sale. Seeing how much the guy loved the boat only gave me more confidence to make the buy. 

By the way once launched and thoroughly sailed, I may have interest and time to develop a website. I agree that it would be a great idea.


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## pvanv1 (Nov 16, 2007)

The OB is fine. A4 possibly more powerful, albeit heavier. But I would not change from one to the other. Way too involved.


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## TwoPints (Oct 3, 2017)

Hi everyone. 

We have acquired hull number 31 this August. Planning on starting the refit next spring. She was built in 1967 and considering her age she is in good shape. From what l can tell she seems to be built with solid fiberglass - no coring in the deck. She has one set of lower shrouds and a spoon bow. Auxilary is an Atomic four. I would love to find more information on the HR28, as others pointed out not much is available on the net. How do they fair in heavy weather ? Any issues with not having a companionway bridge ? Is the one set of inner shrouds sufficient ?

Thanks.


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## Jeff_H (Feb 26, 2000)

TwoPints said:


> Hi everyone.
> 
> We have acquired hull number 31 this August. Planning on starting the refit next spring. She was built in 1967 and considering her age she is in good shape. From what l can tell she seems to be built with solid fiberglass - no coring in the deck. She has one set of lower shrouds and a spoon bow. Auxilary is an Atomic four. I would love to find more information on the HR28, as others pointed out not much is available on the net. How do they fair in heavy weather ? Any issues with not having a companionway bridge ? Is the one set of inner shrouds sufficient ?
> 
> Thanks.


These were very nice boats for the era, but they were designed as racer-coastal cruisers and would not be a great boat for long distance cruising and prolonged periods in heavy conditions. The lack of a bridge deck can be addressed by modifying the lower hatch board(s) so that they can be easily be locked into place and gasketed to minimize water getting into the cabin if the cockpit gets swamped.

The single aft lower is unusual. Normally on a masthead rigged boat with inline spreaders, there needs to be lower shrouds pulling aft to prevent pumping which is then typically coupled with either forward lower shrouds or a baby stay to prevent the mast from inverting (buckling the mid mast aft). I would be concerned if there is neither forward lowers or a babystay, especially if the mast appeared to pump in a chop.

That said this boat has not lost its rig in 50 years so it may be that the mast is stiff enough not to need either. One other point there was a rare fractional rig version of this boat which does not need either a baby stay or forward lowers because of the rig geometry.

Jeff


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## pvanv1 (Nov 16, 2007)

TwoPints said:


> Hi everyone.
> 
> We have acquired hull number 31 this August. Planning on starting the refit next spring. She was built in 1967 and considering her age she is in good shape. From what l can tell she seems to be built with solid fiberglass - no coring in the deck. She has one set of lower shrouds and a spoon bow. Auxilary is an Atomic four. I would love to find more information on the HR28, as others pointed out not much is available on the net. How do they fair in heavy weather ? Any issues with not having a companionway bridge ? Is the one set of inner shrouds sufficient ?
> 
> Thanks.


Our HR28, Hull 53, built in 1968, has double lowers. All 3 sets of shrouds terminate at stainless chainplates which are through-bolted to the plywood ribs. You will likely find plywood core in the upper deck. They drive through heavy weather fine; the harder it blows, the better they like it. They are primarily jib-powered, so the main is less of a driver, and more of a balancer. Our companionway boards (two) fit a couple of inches above the cockpit sole; it you want a higher opening, you could insert the lower board, or for less raise, cut down the lower board, and just use the bottom half. If you have that much water in the cockpit, you are in a serious knockdown, and likely ready to roll. I have never been in a situation like that, and see no need for the lower board to be inserted in most situations.


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## TwoPints (Oct 3, 2017)

Jeff, 

Interestingly enough the lower shroud attrachment tabs on both sides of the mast have three holes on each. The one in the middle is occupied by the single lower shroud of the current rig. I suspect the two other holes were possible fore and aft lower shroud attachment points.

I supposed it would be possible to add them at some point in the future. I don't think ours is a fractional rig - although she is now under the tarp if I recall correctly the forestay is attached at the top of the mast. Later this week I will climb under and take another peak. I supposed adding the fore and aft chainplates and thus modifying the rig would also be possible.


pvanv1

I would love to see a pic of the lower shroud inside and outside attachment points of your boat for future reference - just in case I decide to add them to our boat. The single chainplate is attached to the bulkhead separating the main cabin from the head on the port side and separating the galley from the equipment hanger on the starboard side. On your boat is there another bulkhead further aft for the aft lower shroud chainplate attachment points ?

How do you find the forward hatch cover in terms of keeping the water out ?
I am also contemplating adding a bow roller a windlass and storage for the anchor chain on the bow. 

So many ideas - so little time.

Thanks for the replies.

Henrik


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## pvanv1 (Nov 16, 2007)

The mast tang for the lowers is under the spreader socket. The chainpates for all 6 attachments at deck level are through the deck and cross-bolted to the plywood bulkheads/ribs on each side Same for the backstay. Sorry no pic now, and the rig is down for the winter. Orion has a stand-up head on Starboard, and galley on port. The upper shrouds are 3/16 and the lowers are 5/32,as I recall. Replaced them a couple of yeas ago.


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## TwoPints (Oct 3, 2017)

Here is another question, 


On several HR28 photos I have seen at the base of the mast there is what looks like a roughly triangular shaped plate on the side of the mast. this part is not present on our boat. I wonder if this part is there to facilitate the stepping / unstepping of the mast by putting a pivot pin through the side plates and the mast. At the very bottom of the mast there is an attachment pin but it is in the middle and it would not allow the mast to pivot backward when ustepping it with a pulley system.

I also wonder if this part is what I think it is where could I purchase one or is it custom made ?


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## pvanv1 (Nov 16, 2007)

Dunno. My mast step is an aluminum u-channel, and the cross pin at the bottom of the mast fits into a groove in it. You could certainly fab up a pair of plates or a single plate to pivot for self-stepping.


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## pvanv1 (Nov 16, 2007)

Here are some photos which show our mast step, the two lower tangs (one is a single piece with the spreader socket, the other is separate from the spreader socket), and the chainplates where they exit the deck.


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## TwoPints (Oct 3, 2017)

Thanks for the photos. They will help to determine the locations of the aft/fore lowers to be added. If you get the chance could you take a pic of the interior mounting of them please. I am curious idf they added axtra bulkheads inside for the fore / aft lower shroud attachment or used ones that already exist on our boat.

Anyone trailer launches the HR28 ? Ours came on a trailer but it would need to be modified for trailer launching. 

Attached is a pic of our boat.

Hmm .. the pic attaching does not seem to work - maybe I need more posts to do it ?


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## pvanv1 (Nov 16, 2007)

Our boat has several bulkheads that are used for both the galley to port and the head compartment to starboard. There are also a few more rib bulkheads forward, that have a bin front attached to them over the settee berths. These are all tabbed to the hull and deck. The chain plates are cross-bolted to the ribs with 1/4" or 5/16" SS bolts. 

Our boat was always on a cradle, but in 1996, I bought a very heavy yard trailer (was setup for a power boat), and welded uprights to it. The trailer rails are 6-inch H-beam, and the uprights and tongue are 6-inch channel iron. It has has 4 6-inch I-beams for axles, and 4 14" Ford/Chrysler wheels. I added stock poppets for 4 pads. Works fine, but since it has no suspension, it's not intended to go down the road.


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## TwoPints (Oct 3, 2017)

Nice to see another HR28 

I notice the secondary winches int fhe cockpit and the little fin behind the rudder - we don't have either on our boat. Is your rudder skeg mounted to that fin behind it or it's just there for protection ?

So trailer launching is feasible - this is good to know as it will greatly simplify the launch and retrieval of the boat.


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## pvanv1 (Nov 16, 2007)

The secondaries are nice for a spinnaker. They are not self-tailing, but I use ratchet blocks for the chute anyway. My primaries are self tailing, and I like that for the genoa.
The skeg it attached to the hull. It helps the boat sail straight. Yes, it protects the rudder. I sailed without it for a year, and ended up re-installing it for better pointing.


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## TwoPints (Oct 3, 2017)

Did you add the skeg or was it factory install ?


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## pvanv1 (Nov 16, 2007)

I believe it was that way from Hinterhoeller.


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