# Maple Leaf 42'



## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

Hey guys, I need some advice. We went and looked at this boat today. YachtWorld.com Boats and Yachts for Sale&

We put in an offer for 92k!!! We fell in love with her interior and everything. She has a centerboard not a full keel. I have no knowledge of the advantages and disadvantages of such a boat. She also has an adjustable backstay wich I know nothing about. We plan on sailing from the northwest south to Mexico for a couple years and then the south pacific. We are a family of four and she is perfect for our kids. My big worry is the lack of a keel. But the shoal draft sounds realy nice. I just wonder how she will do on the open sea. The reason I put an offer in is because it is a smoking deal at 92k. Up here anyways. 
So do any of you guys Know anything about this boat or any info or opinions will be much appreciated


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

YachtWorld.com Boats and Yachts for Sale


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

Given that you've got 33% of the weight of the boat as keel/centerboard, I doubt the boat has much in the way of stability issues. Keel-centerboard boats have made some amazing passages. The centerboard just allows you to get into shallower water than you would otherwise, while still giving you good windward performance. 

The adjustable backstay is for helping control the shape of the sails. Increase the tension on the backstay to help flatten the sails to de-power them in heavier winds.


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## Valiente (Jun 16, 2006)

Looks like you found a Good Old Boat. It reminds me a bit of the Cal 2-46. Make sure the survey tests the hull for moisture/core damage. I would suspect you can expect a fair bit of rigging replacement and maybe an engine rebuild, depending on when it was last done. Also, some of the wiring looks a little "off-code"...maybe not bad, per se, but possibly due for an upgrade.

If stuff works, like that windlass, fine: But be prepared that in a 30 year old boat, the first five years of serious usage could reveal a fair number of "fatigue failures" due simply to age and the logic of replacing old gear with stuff that draws less power, is less subject to corrosion, etc. You'll want to pay particular attention to the engine's state of spares and good repair, and may wish to pop for a full and qualified inspection (compression, spare injectors, top-end rebuild, redo of the exhaust system). Basically, if it's original and around the engine, it's suspect after 30 years of salt air.

Jeez, she's not a light boat, is she? She weighs as much as my steel full keeler of comparative size (although you have a greater waterline).

But the logic of a centerboard pilothouse for coastal passagemaking is pretty well unassailable (no pun intended!). Make sure the mechanical aspect of raising and lowering the board. 

You have a great deal to learn, but although I am unfamiliar with that particular boat model, the year 1977 augurs well for a tough and essentially OVERbuilt boat that is as safe as you want to sail her. Congratulations, and consider crewing a great deal before you tackle going offshore, particularly on your rather unforgiving coasts.


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

Yes, you definitely want to make sure the centerboard pendant and pin are in good shape.


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

Just got a call from our broker and our offer was accepted!!! Kinda scary. If anybody has any info on this boat it would be great. Thanks


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## cardiacpaul (Jun 20, 2006)

little late for info on the boat NOW, eh? 

get yourself a survey pronto, before you cut a check...
(jeez, tell me that you made the offer contingent on an acceptable survey, won't you?)


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

CP-

I hope so... i really do...


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

Survey what is that?? Just kidding. Of course you guys. I am not a complete moron. Having the engine/tranny surveyed and the oil tested to.


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

Here is a concern someone posted on another forum:
With their lean bows and excessively huge stern, I've heard that they are extremely hard to control downwind, in strong winds. Altho not as bad as the Maple Leaf 48, they can be a real workout of places like Cape Mendocino in a northerly. A friend helped sail a 48 from BC to Frisco and he said it was amost hopeless trying to control her downwind in strong winds and following seas.Have a good drogue ready when rounding Mendocino or Point Conception. Their total lack of hull balance and directional stability is abysmal.
Brent


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

I wonder if a hydrovane would correct that problem.


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

eskfreedom said:


> I wonder if a hydrovane would correct that problem.


Doubtful, since it seems like it is a basic boat design issue.


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## Valiente (Jun 16, 2006)

Ask this guy...he just sold his and is therefore free of reasons to BS you:
FreeBoatAd.com - Maple Leaf 42

Stan Huntingford drew the Passport 42, I believe, which is one of the better cruising designs of the last 40 years, so I have to wonder if it's really that bad.

Hey, here's a bigger Huntingford for less: Explorer Ketch 1979 Boat For Sale


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## Faster (Sep 13, 2005)

I may be able to put you intouch with a couple who have owned one for years, and done several trans Pacific trips on her - and own her still. PM me is that interests you and I'll contact them and see if they are interested in advising you.


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

Just got a call from our broker and our offer was accepted!!! Kinda scary. Anyone Know how to modify a to small rudder?


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

I would replace it with a larger one... if the boat is a skeg-hung or keel-hung rudder, it'll be a fair bit of work. A free-standing spade rudder could be harder or easier depending on the installation.


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## Valiente (Jun 16, 2006)

I would find out if Stan Huntingford is still alive and ask his opinion on a "retrofit".

Or I would e-mail Ted Brewer, who is quite alive and seems happy enough to give opinions on designs even if he didn't draw them.


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

Yea, tried to contact him but unfortunately he has passed away.


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## CharlieCobra (May 23, 2006)

Installing a larger ellicptical rudder as a retrofit has worked well on many boats including the Express 37's to address control issues downwind. You can contact Robert Perry on Sailing Anarchy and discuss this with him. I recently chatted with him about doing a bulb keel for my Venture 21. Since the boat is in Portland, it wouldn't be far to get it to him in Seattle. He won't do anything until you guys agree on a budget though except express his interest or lack thereof.


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## Faster (Sep 13, 2005)

Modifying the rudder is something that needs to be done (at least planned and designed) by a pro. Serious balance issues (either over or under balanced) can lead to real problems managing the helm afterwards.

The Maple Leafs have a fair sized skeg, with the rudder extending beyond it with a balancing area ahead of the stock. Likely the K/C version of the rudder is on the shallow side. 

To add area to the aft end could create a real bear to deal with and plenty of loading on the steering system. Going deeper will negate the draft advantage of the K/C arrangement (and the rudder would be particularly vulnerable)

This might be a tough problem to address, if indeed it's a real problem on these boats...


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

Another problem is that adding area to the rudder shifts the underwater center of lateral resistance aft, and that can affect the ability to balance the sailplan of the boat.


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## cardiacpaul (Jun 20, 2006)

you might want to sail it yourself for oh, a year or two before its decided that you need anything like that


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## tommyt (Sep 21, 2002)

eskfreedom.

You were the only one that found a negative, and it was on another board and second hand. Methinks that if this boat passes survey and your test sail, you should follow cardiac's advise and sail it for a few years to see if it is really a problem. I have not seen anyone here that actually knows if it is a problem, and it is a little early to try to do a pro's job of redesigning a rudder system.....that may not need to be redesigned.


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## Valiente (Jun 16, 2006)

Faster said:


> This might be a tough problem to address, if indeed it's a real problem on these boats...


I agree with this...it's strictly anecdotal at this point. It's a simple matter to arrange for a sail test on the crappiest day possible (or at least one that replicates the alleged problems with the steering) and to deliberately try to throw the boat around. It's very possible that a decent sailor won't have the problem, or will be aware how to alter trim to solve it.

Many otherwise good boats have a problematic point of sail. Certainly given the age and the price of the boat, if it's an endemic design flaw, I would move on.


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## Dewey Benson (Jun 28, 2006)

Having formerly owned a Keel centerboard for more than 2 decades, try this.

When on sea trial, set the vessel on a downwind course. Trim the sails to as neutral a balance as possible and slowly raise the centerboard. Stop at several points and note the difference in balance. One will see a marked improvment at some level of board trim. Many keel configured boat sailors forget that a centerboard does not only contribute windward ability but is also a great mechanism for trim and balance.

You may find that with the board all the way up she wants to go downwind or the best balance point is at a somewhat less point of trim.

Dewey


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

Just got some good news. We got a approved for the loan. I am officaly getting scared. I have been dreaming for so long I cant believe its realy happing. Shure hope its the right boat!! Thanks for all the info guys.


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

Good luck ESKfreedom..


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

Had the engine surveyed today. Things were pretty good concidering the age of the boat. The genny has an exhaust leak and there are gate valves on everything but other than that its in good shape. We will know for sure when we get the oil samples back


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

I spent the day with the owner rigging up the sails. Tuesday we are going on sea trials. Wensday we are doing the survey and Friday we close "after we negotiate the price". He wanted $99500 I offered $92 and he accepted but after thinking about all the money for fixing and updating. I am going to offer between 82-86 depending on the survey. Iam confident he will accepte. I am glad at least one of you guys knows what a wanker is or else we would be in trouble. Swabbot, I would verry much like to discuse your boat with you. So send me a private messege.
__________________
This is your life ending one minute at a time.


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

Good luck with the sea trials and survey.


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

Talked to an owner yesterday who sailed one of these around the world twice. He said you have to do a rudder mod or ML's wont go down wind. He estimated the mod at around 8-10k. Given the 40k we estimated to upgrade to modern standards. The extra 10k killed the deal for me. We canceled the survey and backed out of the deal this morning. It wasnt just the money. We were compromising on a lot of things. The gally was two short for my wife, the engine was hard to work on, there was no deck storage, small nav station and the bed was small. Not to mention all the stuff she needed: instruments, life raft, watermaker, dinghy, solar panels, gps, ssb, hatches, windlass. ext.. ext.. So If any of ya know of similer boat in that price rang let me know. We looked all night at boats and found that the Kelly Peterson 44' is a great boat. My wife and I personaly dont like the standerd "cave" layout. We want a light and airy spacious boat for us and our kids. We are willing to sacrafice a little performance for space. Any and all advice is verry much appreciated.


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

Esk-

Light, airy and spacious... you're describing a catamaran...


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## Faster (Sep 13, 2005)

Esk

Sorry to hear the deal went south - but better that than ending up being unhappy and regretful.
Was it my contact that advised you? I know they have tons of experience so they would have given you the straight scoop.

Good luck hunting.


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## Valiente (Jun 16, 2006)

"Light and airy" and "offshore-safe" are sometimes hard to reconcile, wide open saloon plans and loads of hatches not always being the best choice in a seaway. There's a few options, but you may want to closely look at your sailing ambitions before you narrow your selections.

If you were doing strictly coastal, I would say go Catalina or Beneteau, for instance. But offshore? Maybe a Tartan 37? A Gulfstar? Morgans? Something in a pilothouse?

I gather your budget is $100,000 or so. Certainly, your focus on engine access is a good instinct to have: I love opening up a 3 x 5 foot hatch and "dropping into" the engine bay. I find having floods of natural light (and plenty of ventilation) down there makes me happier to do the necessary repairs and "deep thought" to rethink my systems.

Offshore boats are "cave-like" not because offshore people are particularly fond of being cramped and living like mushrooms, but because the interior spaces are devoted to stowage and tankage, extra sea berths and simply because if you are thrown three feet instead of six, you are less likely to break an arm or skull. They have fewer stretches of Lexan hatches, particularly at the sides, to keep the sea out. It's the price you pay for that kind of sailing: If you want to go to Mexico from B.C., you are transiting pretty well offshore with a lee shore/few harbours component. I am coming to the idea that the American west coast (unlike the more sheltered coast of B.C.) can be very challenging and nasty...it certainly boasts half a planet's worth of fetch... That, and not esthetic concerns, would drive my selection. 

Try and find a Brewer Alaska 43 in steel or FG...a good choice, perhaps.


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## Pamlicotraveler (Aug 13, 2006)

eskfreedom said:


> We were compromising on a lot of things. The gally was two short for my wife, the engine was hard to work on, there was no deck storage, small nav station and the bed was small. Not to mention all the stuff she needed: instruments, life raft, watermaker, dinghy, solar panels, gps, ssb, hatches, windlass. ext.. ext.


ESK..these things are things you should have considered before making the offer. If you paid a deposit (the norm is 15%) they could be funky about cancelling the survey. Normally an offer is made in writing with earnest money and contingent on a survey and a sea-trial. It sounds like you and the owner got along well, so hopefully he is flexible.

Good luck and sorry it didn't work out.


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

Our original plan was to sell everything and get a cat but we cant part with our beautiful house on the Siletz river. Yes ,Faster your contact did seal the deal for me. Verry nice people. Asked him if he would sell his ML. He said maybe. I want my cake and still be able to eat it in comfort. If it was my wife and I we would get a lot less boat but with our kids we just half to have room. We like the Gulfstars there is one in Mex for 82k but worried if there cheeply built.


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## Cruisingdad (Jul 21, 2006)

Esk,

Unless you plan on crossing the atlantic or pacific, I would get a production typeboat. Catalina is my preference. What boat to buy is the beginning of a very long and debated thread, but in my very strong opinion, there is absolutely no reason to have a bullet-proof shoebox to sit in this hemisphere. If you are certain you are crossing the pond, that is a different story... but if you have not spent a lot of time offshore (and through a few really nasty storms), you better temper those thoughts for experience.

Go get a Catalina. They are well made for the $, they are open and airy, they are comfortable, there are plenty of them around, and they are family friendly. I lived on a 380 with my wife, kiddo (at that time just one) and 2 dogs. We are soon to do it again on a 400. 

At 100k, I would look into a 380. The 36 is a really nice boat too. It is not a Valiant. It is not a Hylas. There are better boats made... but be realistic what you are going to do with it and buy the boat to fit that purpose.

Just my opinion. I am sure you will get many more.

- CD


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

I'm a sailer through and through! Plan on circumnavigating the world and rounding the Horn "someday". Catalina's are good boats. I sailed one from Newport to Astoria against pervailing winds and curent. I was the only one who didnt get sick so I had to do most of the stering. It got a little choppy and after a day and a half of going nowhere the owner pussed out. Good boat but as I said we are going around the world. My wife is twice the sailer I am and she would'nt have anything less.


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

There are Catamarans in the 35-45' range that are very airy, spacious, and handle bluewater passages reasonably well. It might be worth looking into. However, your budget is a bit low for the larger ones, even used.


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

Yep, don't have enough money for a cat. If I did I would have one already.


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

Just a little update on our boat buying. Went up to Canada and looked at another M.L. that already had the rudder mod done and sailed around the world. They had it hauled out and fresh bottom paint. They asked for 118k we put in an offer at 108k they accepted. We had a survey done that day wich found some deck delamation. The next day we relaunched and went for a sail. Counter offered 105k shook hands and bought the boat. "Stepping Stone" will be ours in about two weeks. Crazy A.


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

Congratulations.


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## Faster (Sep 13, 2005)

Congratulations, but we are a bit shocked that they would sell that easily!

Anyway they are great people, the boat has been well cared for and certainly has the experience to go the distance... now you can see if you do!

If you only lived nearby I'd hit you up for a case of beer (commission, you know!<g>)

Enjoy!


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

Well since we are going to cruise up from the San Juans to the north tip of Vancouver Island then the west coast of the island down to Newport, OR. We will probably see you up in the islands this summer. I will have two cases and a bottle of Sailer Jerry hidden away just for you man. Thanks for helping us find the boat of our dreams. We are in your debt. Well...definetly in debt of some sort . For God sakes I own a boat now!! Its crazy I tell you...just crazy!!!


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

A little update on our boat buying. We closed on Monday. Going to pick it up in Blane, Wa on Tuesday. Spend a day or two with the ex-owners learning the systems. Then my family and I are going to cruise up the Georga Strait to desolation sound on a three week cruise. After that we are going to head down the west coast of Vancouver island and deliver her to newport, OR. Live aboard for the next year then head down to Mexico next summer/fall and cruise the World till we can't cruise no more.
I am 31 and have been dreaming about this since I was 14. I can't believe It is finaly a reality!!!!


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## CharlieCobra (May 23, 2006)

Saweet! Ya oughta give me a holler when ya get back down towards Anacortes so I can eyeball your new dream. Funny thing is, there's a ML 54 that I've been eyeballing lately.


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## Faster (Sep 13, 2005)

Congrats, Esk - I'm envious that you are able to achieve your dream at such a young age.

Are you changing the name?


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

Esk-

When do we get to see some photos???


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

Tried to but it keeps saying can't upload failed. Here is a link to another forum that let me post a pic.
Maple Leaf 42' - Page 5 - Cruisers & Sailing Forums


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

Pretty boat...


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

We love our boat!!! We took posession of her in Blane WA, on Wednesday June 27th. Then sailed across the Strait of Georgia on the Thursday to the Gulf Islands and anchored in Ganges. We moved up to Pirates Cove, then to Nanaimo and stayed at a marina to clean her and get supplies. Then we sailed across the Strait again to Pender Harbor. We continued on and anchored at the Cooper Islands. Then we rounded Sarah Point and finally made it to Desolation Sound and anchored in Grace Harbor where I deep sixed my dinghy motor in 50 ft of water. The next day found a free diver anchored close by and he retrieved it with some effort. I had it running for about three days,off and on, then it finally told me to "F" off and would run no more. We moved up to Tenedos Bay and my wife slayed some lingcod and snapper. Then we went up to Laura Cove and stayed two days. Desolation Sound is absolutely beautiful and the water is about 75 degrees. We sailed back to Blaine the same way we came up and had the sail of our lives across the Strait of Georgia with 20-30k winds under full sail!!I saw the speedo hit 9.4k once and we averaged 8.5. It was fun!! We arrived in Blaine on Friday the 13th and are now home waiting for crew to help deliver her down to Newport OR. We miis our boat terribly ...and can't wait to sail her again. All in all it was one hell of a shakedown cruise.


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## camaraderie (May 22, 2002)

Glad you had a good time Esk...a first cruise with no major problems is most unusual...sounds like you got good one!!


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## Faster (Sep 13, 2005)

Congrats Esk! Glad to hear that things have gone well. We spent the last week or so out in the Gulf Islands - sailed across in the big NWesterlies we had, then meandered home as the weather headed for rain.

We must have just missed you, we were going across on the 10th - 2 hours flat from Gibsons to Silva Bay!

I received a note and some thanks from Mike and Rae - they seemed pleased with the new owners of "Stepping Stone"! That's a credit to you folks!


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## CharlieCobra (May 23, 2006)

Nice! I hope I have the same sorta ride the first time on my new boat when I get it. I'll be back out there with the little boat Sunday trying to make it from Anacortes to Friday Harbor and back. Time to test the new traveller and mainsheet systems.


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## SailorPam (Sep 18, 2007)

eskfreedom,

I was just on board the boat in Portland. Could you PM me?

Pam


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

We brought our boat down from Blaine, WA-to our home port of Newport, Or (in December!) Me and 3 of my pals left Blaine and had a wonderful sail out the Strait of Juan de Fuca w/ 15-25 kt SE winds...We ran wing on wing about 81/2 kts. to Neah Bay. Neah BAy is very interesting town. First of all, its a dry town. Secondly, it is a reservation. Now, my friends and I, are not easily intimidated...well traveled and of the strong fisherman sort. We were definitely intimidated in Neah Bay...Blankly, we couldn't wait to get the "F" outta there! The forecast was for 15-25 knts S Easterly...switching to South 25-30kts..then shortly after midnight...switching to Westerly 15-20. Then, the following morning switching to NWesterly 15-25......Our plan was to wait for the west winds..get out the Straight..then sail South...BUT @ around 2:00 in the afternoon..we thought we'd get the hell outta town..and just buck into it for a few hours. They called for 15-25 kts South...well everything went according to plaln until....the 15-25 changed to 45-60 knots South right on our nose!!!! Now, we know, as locals of the Pacific NW,,,that the last place u want to be on earth, is in the Pacific NW, in the dead of winter, in a Southerly...right off of Cape Flattery. So, here we were in the Pacific NW, off of Cape Flattery..in a 60 kt southerly! Then we started sinking. The center board clamp, which was installed w/ improper sized bolts, malfunctioned. One of these unfitting bolts, sheared off and was squirting water into the bilge. Just when I was about to turn around and put the boat up for sale..and consider a motor home...the wind switched West 15-20. UNBELIEVABLE! The bilge was keeping up w/ the leak..we shook out our triple reefed main, and continued sailing South. The next morning the wind shifted as forecasted to NW 15-25. We sailed with a poled out Genoa...for about 20 hrs....and then lost most of our wind, and ended up motoring the rest of the way to Newport. The whole trip took us about 3 days...or 36 hrs from Cape Flattery. The Mapleleaf 42 footer is an outstanding sea going vessel. What it lacks in speed in makes up in stabillity. With the centerboard down (which makes a HUGE difference) I feel confident that she can take anything the ocean might throw at her.
__________________
This is your life ending one minute at a time.


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## Faster (Sep 13, 2005)

Good to hear from you... glad you made it through that, but you must be a glutton for punishment... that trip this time of year, and particularly THIS year.

Assuming you'll be able to address the CB problem.. do you think the POs were aware of it? btw they turned around and bought a Bene 46, in case you hadn't heard.


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

Actually it was'nt so bad. At least we know the boat can handle it. We just should have waited six hours. The seas were'nt larg or breaking. It did get pretty ****ty when it switched to west for a couple hours. The center board clamp is'nt a big deal eather just need to put in bigger bolts. I don't think Mike and Rea had used it in years. Yea they got a bene 46 and according to them they miss there old boat alot. We like her and would'nt trade her for a bran spankin new production pice of crap.


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

Well maybe a Island Packet 46!!


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## TSOJOURNER (Dec 16, 1999)

The origonal boat we were going to get just sold for 70k. Wish he would have come down that far when we were trying to get her.


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

Yes, but you would have missed five months of sailing waiting..


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## accubesh (Feb 23, 2012)

*poor old maple leaf 48*



eskfreedom said:


> Here is a concern someone posted on another forum:
> With their lean bows and excessively huge stern, I've heard that they are extremely hard to control downwind, in strong winds. Altho not as bad as the Maple Leaf 48, they can be a real workout of places like Cape Mendocino in a northerly. A friend helped sail a 48 from BC to Frisco and he said it was amost hopeless trying to control her downwind in strong winds and following seas.Have a good drogue ready when rounding Mendocino or Point Conception. Their total lack of hull balance and directional stability is abysmal.
> Brent


Its amazing how people ALWAYS have a friend whom SAYS?? 
I will put it this way I OWN a Maple Leaf 48 for 3 years now and have never had any issues sailing down wind, in fact I have had her surfing down the face a large swells with out an issue? and that was in a large swell in 35knots with full sail up?
Just wanted to clear the air with this issue?


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