# Sail down Mississippi Into the Gulf...?



## smitrock63 (Jul 20, 2017)

I have a 30 Ft. O'Day in Central Illinois. I've heard of others sailing down the Mississippi into the Gulf and to Florida. What would one encounter on that journey? Is debris in the river an issue? I would think so, I've seen whole trees floating down that river!


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## Arcb (Aug 13, 2016)

I havent done the Mississipi, but I have done a lot of research on it. I think it would be a really cool trip. You could get yourself inspired by rereading some Mart Twain.

It doesnt seem like folks do the lower Mississipi, I gather its pretty wild country and generally prefer to cut off at the Tenn Tomm for the final leg to the Gulf.

Since I havent done it myelf, probably more useful for me to share links than repeat what I have read.

Heres a start, you could follow links on this subject for hours and not get bored:

Chicago to Mobile Overview - America's Great Loop Cruisers' Association


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## Aswayze (Apr 5, 2015)

I have done a good bit of midwest river running so I do have some first hand experience.

"Mississippi" river is not so much a problem.

"Missouri" river changes the math a good bit.

The secret here is that once you hit St Louis, you are actually on the Missouri river volume wise with all the joys and perils that being on the Missouri includes. North of there, you have the locks and dams to calm things down and catch the trees, once you pass Chain Of Rocks lock it's one flowing beast straight down to the Gulf.

As Arcb pointed out, you can take the Tenn Tom which is both a great deal more scenic and pleasant a route but also SIGNIFICANTLY shorter by just cutting up the Ohio river then picking up the Tennessee at Paduca and heading south from there.

That puts you on the Mississippi (Missouri) only from about St Louis on down to Cairo before things calm down.

Yes, particularly after significant rains and flash floods you do see a LOT of debris in the river:









This is a debris field that we caught up with on a canoeing trip down to Coopers Landing from Kansas City a few years back. This one went for miles and miles and miles. If I was in anything that cared about whopping into a tree I would have just tucked back behind a wing dike and waited a day for it to clear and went on. My Royalex canoe could care less about hitting trees so we just pushed through it.

Issues you would face:

Fuel on the run from Alton or so down to Paduca (assuming the Tenn Tom route) Not much fuel down there, again past the locks and dams the Missouri is a pretty flood prone river which has over the years flooded and destroyed a lot of the infrastructure along the path meaning that you are best off to plan to carry enough fuel to get you through.

Trees/debris again really only till you get as far as the Tenn Tom. I wouldn't expend too much effort worrying about hitting stuff along the way, just keep a sharp eye out. While there are low riding hidey trees most of them are pretty visible. Worry more about where you anchor and overnight at, you do not need some giant tree whomping you while you are anchored. I usually try to noodle in tight behind some significant structure rather than ducking up a side creek or river which could decide to send it's contribution downstream.

These guys did a river transit:


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## stagg (Dec 7, 2015)

While I have not done very much on the Mississippi River, I do have more than a few days on the Missouri river.
(of the two the Missouri is by far the meaner river, due to its speed and narrow twisting channel) 
We have also played around on the Ohio river, and Tennessee River/Kentucky Lake which is part of the Tenn-Tom waterway.

Regardless, there are a couple of things I would point out that you need to look into.

*The first thing that spring into most people mind is obstacles and other damage inducing factors. So lets start there.*

Trees (and snags) are common in the river, however going down river they are less of an issue. The snags tend to impale traffic coming UP river, and the current carries the logs and debrie with you so you only smack into them at your own hull speed.... not that running over logs is ever fun. Good watch keeping is required.








This is about as bad as it gets! Usually after a storm, and always worse at/after the confluence of two rivers. Its times like these where the best plan is to tuck in somewhere and do ANYTHING else.

Wing Dikes. These are built by the Corp of Engineers to keep the river in its place, and to keep the shipping channel in place as marked.
In theory these are super easy to avoid. Just use the very simple channel markers to stay in the deep water.
You can even tuck in behind them to stop/anchor and avoid all the boat/barge/tree traffic on the river.
That said, the wing dikes are serious constructions of large rocks and pilings, and they are not kind to any hulls that contact them. More than a few barges and tugboats have been sunk on the wing-dikes over the years. 








Vigilance and caution make the task doable.

Barges. 
All of the rivers you are thinking about are "Navigable waterways" maintained by the US Army Corp of Engineers, because a large amount of US commercial cargo still travels the rivers. This traffic has declined over the last decades, but is still substantial. 
This one is hauling components of to power plant near St. Joseph Missouri.








The Mississippi, Ohio, and Tenn-Tom are all major arteries so you will meet commercial traffic on the rivers.

The good news is these folks are, overall, serious professionals who are a pleasure to work with. But you need to play the game with them, not against them. They are constrained by the channel and their limited ability to maneuver. You are much more maneuverable, and are generally expected to give way. That said, you are working with these professionals who darned sure know the rules of the inland waterways. They do their best to follow those rules. It is only fair that you should know them too. 
They all have AIS, which means that having an AIS receiver built into your radio is a HUGE help to knowing where they are, as well as around which bend in the river to expect them (even more important in the morning fog)

This is from one of our early trips in canoes from Nebraska City to Kansas City.









A decent radio will allow you to call them by name and work out the passing details long in advance. You don't necessarily need to transmit AIS data, as they will know who you are since sailboat traffic is relatively rare on the rivers.
The key here is to always have someone on radio watch, a handheld rattling around in the kitchen sink will not serve you well.








Inside of SV Eastwind, a Radio displaying AIS contacts at Kentucky lake

*Next thing to consider is navigation.*








The corp of engineers has super detailed charts of the river, which are not always easy to find/use. Just have to dig a little and they usually come up on the internet.
Some chart plotters have the rivers and inland lakes, but usually not in the detail that a sailboat would like to have of the bottom.

Here is a chart book we printed and bound for use on Kentucky lake, on the Tennessee river.









In theory you don't need charts, since the markers tell you where the channel is located. However this is a false sense of security.
The river has a bad habit of tearing up all the nice work done by the Engineers. Here is one of the many missing channel buoys stolen by the river and stashed in a driftwood pile. 








You will want to know where you are on the river, as well as what is coming around the next bend, you will definitely want to know the narrow and tricky spots before you get to them.

We used a lot of paper charts, as well as tablets when we could find digital maps, and of course chart plotters.
Chart plotter information for the rivers and lakes has been "ok" but is not the high detail that we tend to expected based on charts of bigger bodies of water.








A Raymarine system used on SV Eastwind.

*This ties in nicely to the next consideration. Supplies, and stops*
One of the reasons a lot of people skip the lower Mississippi is the long distances between fuel stops, VS the relatively better options on the Tenn-Tom.
Your navigation needs to predict the next stop long enough in advance that you can "pull over" and get stopped at your destination. It can be a bit of a pain in the butt to motor past your destination and then swing around in the current and fight your way back up stream.

You will definitely want to call ahead to any places you plan to use prior to leaving. LOTS of business on the river disappear, go out of business, or have odd hours.
What was true of a location last year on someone else's trip or guide book may not be true anymore!

The last consideration is simple.
*Sailing near the shoreline is much more work. *
A multiday trip across the Gulf of Mexico is relatively relaxing, and has lots of leasure time, even if you are single handed.
Sailing/motoring near the shore requires constant attention of at least one person at all times, as well as good-to-excellent navigation (GPS just makes it easier)
This effectively means that you will want a few crew members to share the load... i prefer to share the FUN with them too:wink

I have to say, being on the rivers has been rewarding and awesome. I highly recommend it to people who like boats in general.
It is well worth the cost of admission.

Knowledge of the river systems
Good planning
Maintaining situational awareness via proper watch-keeping

This cost of admission is much higher than weekend lake sailing, and I have only shown the pictures of the crazy stuff. But don't let any of it turn you off.
It is a challenge worthy of the effort. And not a particularly daunting challenge.
This kind of trip is in reality, straight forward and easily worth doing!

On rare occasions you can even hoist the sails!








Kentucky lake sailing. Photo of SV Sunflower, shot from SV Eastwind.









This was during the thankgiving weekend, and the weather was really pretty decent considering the time of year and the location.


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## stagg (Dec 7, 2015)

And Aswaye beat me to it.... half of my pictures are from his flickr account anyway.
(those lazy rats on SV Sunflower take terrible pictures, if they even bother at all  )


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## Aswayze (Apr 5, 2015)

Open CPN does do the Corps of Engineers S67 charts digital charts and would be WELL worth having along on a tablet in the cockpit particularly if the water us up a bit. 

Also be sure to monitor your VHF so you can get the notice to mariners updates from the Coast Guard. They do a very good job keeping you up to date on any constraints or limitations you may encounter along your way. Other factoids such as depth of pool for reservoirs can be quite important since that will provide some guidance as to the degree to which you can vary outside the channel. 

You will not typically find yourself with cell coverage other than right by towns which are much less frequent than you would usually think. The river is obviously down in the ditch a bit so it's a bit of a dead zone coverage wise.


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## smitrock63 (Jul 20, 2017)

Very awesome information. Absolutely awesome!!


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## RobGallagher (Aug 22, 2001)

What a great thread!


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## stagg (Dec 7, 2015)

I just found (and watched) these guys on "Herbert the boat"

A fairly normal narration of a river trip in a power boat. 
It sticks out from the rest because it definitely shows some of the fun you can have trying to get fuel... even more so if you have a BIG engine, and a planing hull.






You can also see how much trouble people go through just to get onto a major river. 
Those of us lucky enough to live nearby, should definitely check them out.


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## Arcb (Aug 13, 2016)

How was sailing on Kentucky Lake? We are planning to trailer sail the Eastern US this coming fall and winter, and we are trying to think of some inland sailing during hurricane season. I am wondering if we could keep ourselves entertained for a week or two on Kentucky Lake?


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## stagg (Dec 7, 2015)

Kentucky lake is large looking, but excessively shallow. And it is the usual manmade lake kind of shallow.
Lots of sunken tree stumps, old buildings, and such.
Add that to the long yet narrow shape and it really is not as much fun as it looks.
During the winter the Corp of Engineers lowers the water level several feet more, which is normal operations.

Overall we consider Kentucky Lake to be a "pass through" waterway. Its like Ohio being a flyover State for airplanes, you could go there but why?
(I'm from Ohio so I can make those jokes)

Now that said, here were the good parts.

SV Eastwind at anchor at Kentucky Lake marina just south of the dam.








The marinas are large, and were friendly. In the off season they are quiet and empty-ish of people.
The restaurant options on the lake were pretty tasty.
The lake is wide enough that barge traffic is no problem at all.
There are lots of cool little coves and draws to tuck into for overnights... you could get an anchor to hold almost anywhere if you HAD to do it.
And the park "land between the lakes" looks pretty if you want hike and get bit by bugs.


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## Arcb (Aug 13, 2016)

stagg said:


> Kentucky lake is large looking, but excessively shallow. And it is the usual manmade lake kind of shallow.
> Lots of sunken tree stumps, old buildings, and such.
> Add that to the long yet narrow shape and it really is not as much fun as it looks.
> During the winter the Corp of Engineers lowers the water level several feet more, which is normal operations.
> ...


Guess that explains why I can find so little sailing info on the lake. :ship-captain:

Draft issues I can manage 9" boards up and reinforced bow for beaching.

Curious what time of the year you were there and what were the nights like sleeping aboard? I only have an alcohol heater. From the photos, it looks pretty late in the season.


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## stagg (Dec 7, 2015)

Late November.

It was chilly, but we planned and packed for it. Temps were not our problem. But definitely a factor.
We slept with the heater off and a comfy pile of blankets on. In the morning someone starts the stove (and the coffee) and after a few minutes its warm enough to get up and get dressed.
This worked well in our small front cabins, which probably are about the same size as your 21ft bay hen


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## Aswayze (Apr 5, 2015)

A few more notes directly related to our trip which was over Thanksgiving week in 2016:

Depth of pool is reduced in Kentucky Lake as well as of course it's conjoined twin Lake Barkley over the winter since the primary job of the lakes is to provide flood protection and they want the room ready when the rains come. In our case, the depth of pool had been reduced just over 5 feet which made the lake a lot shallower than I suspect most users find it during the summer season. Our Dawsons are reasonably shallow draft with our swing keels up so we never suffered for a place to noodle into for the night but we did find that the lake was in effect a lot smaller than it looked when we were wanting to sail with our keels and rudders down. Nothing unmanageable, but it was far from the set the autopilot and drink the coffee sailing we so enjoy up on Lake Superior. If you are talking about taking the Bay Hen, I suspect that you would find all the water you need, the San Juan would likely be similarly constrained as we were.









We launched at the very nice boat ramp by Kentucky Dam Marina. Wide ramp, nice parking apron but annoyingly it does have powerlines right between the ramp and the parking area so you have to rig up just up from the ramp sort of in the way. Luckily, there is an area provided for this and of course the ramp traffic was light during the time we were there so it was not much of an issue. We fueled and got water at the Marina where we found the staff to be quite helpful and nice.









It was cool out. Not cold by Canadian standards to be sure but cold enough to run the heat for a bit in the evenings and to make the dingy even more menacing to the chihuahua who is already at best so so on this whole boating thing. We would get frost in the mornings and it was usually in the 50s by mid day so it was about what you should expect for November sailing in the mid part of the USA.

This last year, we opted to spend Thanksgiving week down in Pensacola Bay:










Which was much more pleasant and well worth the additional drive.

In short, I agree with Stagg. I would truly enjoy passing through Kentucky Lake on the way down to the Gulf on the inland waterway system. If I lived in the area, I would keep my boat there and no doubt love it. As a trailer boat destination however I think it is worth passing up in favor of destinations down on the Gulf Coast.


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## Arcb (Aug 13, 2016)

The Bay Hen, we passed on the San juan it was small (even by Bay Hen standards!) and poorly laid out for children.

Sometimes you need to shop around for other boats to remind yourself how awesome the boat you already have is


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## Aswayze (Apr 5, 2015)

The Bay Hen would probably love Kentucky Lake and the river system in general. 

Here is a thought for you: 

Put the Bay Hen in at Hermann Missouri on the Missouri River and shuttle the van/trailer down to Kentucky Dam Marina then travel the river system down to Kentucky Lake. I think that would be a neat adventure on such a craft since the Bay Hen would make river travel a walk in the park. An Uber to Paduca, a bus to St Louis and a train to Hermann and you would be right back. The wife/kid could spent a nice day at a B&B in Hermann and unwind from the drive while the Bay Hen hangs out at the city dock. Heck, if I am off work, I would be happy to help run back and forth and I am sure we can find an accomplice in the St Louis area to shuttle a load of fuel down to you.


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## Arcb (Aug 13, 2016)

Very cool. I was thinking about starting a thread on Kentucky Lake a couple of weeks back, but wasn't sure if any one would respond, I hope Smitrock doesn't mind the thread drift.

Yes, we have a rule when cruising the little boat, a couple of nights a week in a hotel with pool, laundry and tv. Makes everyone happy.

One of the things that makes the Bay Hen such a great river boat is her fuel range. Raise the bilge boards to reduce drag, drop the mast to reduce windage, set the 4 Stroke Honda 2.3 to %70 and she will get a reliable 60-70 miles out of a 10 L (2 ish gallon) jug of gas.

She weighs next to nothing and has a super fine entry and exit, so she just glides through the water. I know of a few Bay Hen owners that have removed the rig entirely and dub it "the poor man's trawler".

Of possible interest to the OP, sailboats often get much better fuel economy than typical powerboats, which make them pretty good trawlers, except for the rig and keel. There hulls are designed to be driven easily and efficiently through the water.


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## CalebD (Jan 11, 2008)

I haven't seen this posted in this thread yet. 
It has been a while since I read about the Great Loop circuit and I have never done it, but...

my recollection was that the reason most sailboats choose to go the TennTom waterway instead of the Mississippi proper is because: the lower Miss. can get some interesting currents (5+ knots) and is pretty rife with commercial tugs and barges, not to mention the floating snags and such the river carries with it. It has also been noted here that fuel stops on the way down the Miss. may not be that prevalent.


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## Aswayze (Apr 5, 2015)

It also gets progressively less interesting from what I understand.

Another neat series on the rivers:


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## nolatom (Jun 29, 2005)

I'm lucky to have an office window that looks out at the River around the Greater New Orleans twin bridges. So I do occasionally see sailboats, typically under power and bare poles, making their way downriver, typically in the fall and heading down to where, the Virgin Islands I guess?

Yes, you are kind a "captive" of the river below Baton Rouge at least, since there aren't any ramps or slips or "gas docks". There are fuel and water barges, though, and ship launch services, around the city and the several ship anchorages. If you get on the radio and ask around (or call them before your trip), you might be able to arrange a rendezvous. The crewboats at the public launch companies bring all kinds of things out to ships, including groceries. No reason they couldn't hit the supermarket and deliver to you underway (yeah it will cost money but nothing ventured, nothing gained). Or if you have time, lock through the Industrial Canal, and a couple of bridges northward and there's a marina there where you could resupply. Or head into Lake Pontchartrain and go to West End harbor marina, gas docks and stores nearby.

Dealing with ships--ships don't go above Baton Rouge. But plenty of them from there to the sea. While underway, the all have local pilots so you won't have a language barrier. It's 67VHF. Basically, stay out of their way, but talk to them to make sure they see you. Ships like to hug the "point" heading upriver, and the "bend" downriver, so you are not always meeting them port-to-port depending on how the river bends. Communication first, last, and always is the key. And most all the voices that answer, whether ship, towboat, tugboat, whatever, are, among other things, problem-solvers--they have to be to run on the river. If you've got a problem or question and ask nicely, you'd be surprised what they might know that'd help you.


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## Untrained (Aug 10, 2015)

One thing I haven't seen mentioned about the tentom is the bridge clearance. For many it isn't a problem but for us with a 50 foot stick the mast has to be taken down.
We brought our boat down the MS from lake pipen in Wisconsin two years ago. We learned the hard way about wing dams and that our depth finder was out of whack. Had to get pulled out 3 or 4 times.
Every lock we came to all the workers had already heard about us. Lol
We saw a lot of debris when going through the St. Louis area and the strong spring current allowed 10 kts of speed. The debris never caused us a problem. No damages at all, just a few bumping noises that were very unwelcome to us. This is our first ever boat and we had zero experience.
We've been sailing as we can on Kentucky lake for two year now. Making mistakes and learning the ropes. At normal summer pool we are able , with a 6' keel, to sail most areas of the lake without issue. I DO tend to stay in the channel (40-65 ft) most of the time though. I don't ever want to repeat my river performance. Lol
We plan on taking the Mississippi River to the gulf rather than the tentom. Our little diesel just sips fuel and we will take our 6 Jerry cans with. We only needed one on the previous trip, but we didn't know it at the time.
If you're coming towards the TenTom stop in at Paris Landing Marina on the southern end of KY lake and say hello if I'm / we're around.
Untrained aboard FREIA , Ericson 35-3 sloop.


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## capta (Jun 27, 2011)

I don't know if one can actually "sail" the Mississippi.
We did the trip from Chicago to New Orleans and the majority of the way there were 30' levees on both sides. As we had to take down the masts to get into the Illinois River, "sailing" was a moot point for us, but my memory of the thousand miles or so of river was pretty windless. Not so for garbage, from docks to dead animals, as mentioned above.
It wasn't anything but damn hard, tiring work and not a trip I'd undertake again. Best have some pretty robust ground tackle when the garbage begins piling up on it when you are sleeping at anchor, in a pretty swift current. Obviously, you can not navigate at night.


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## capta (Jun 27, 2011)

Arcb said:


> I havent done the Mississipi, but I have done a lot of research on it. I think it would be a really cool trip. You could get yourself inspired by rereading some Mart Twain.


I was so psyched up for my adventure down the Mississippi that I cut off a pair of jeans and made my crew call me "Huck" for two weeks before the trip. I was going to see America's heartland from her major waterway! Not so much! 30' levees for most of the trip meant all I saw were dirt walls, even when standing on the top of the pilothouse. Huge disappointment.
However, the Orinoco and Amazon Rivers were not, so if you want a couple of great river adventures, start saving now.


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## Arcb (Aug 13, 2016)

capta said:


> I was so psyched up for my adventure down the Mississippi that I cut off a pair of jeans and made my crew call me "Huck" for two weeks before the trip. I was going to see America's heartland from her major waterway! Not so much! 30' levees for most of the trip meant all I saw were dirt walls, even when standing on the top of the pilothouse. Huge disappointment.
> However, the Orinoco and Amazon Rivers were not, so if you want a couple of great river adventures, start saving now.


Yes, I enjoyed Tristan Jones tales of the Amazon, who cares how accurate they were, they were darn entertaining.

:2 boat:


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## BryceGTX (Sep 7, 2011)

smitrock63 said:


> I have a 30 Ft. O'Day in Central Illinois. I've heard of others sailing down the Mississippi into the Gulf and to Florida. What would one encounter on that journey? Is debris in the river an issue? I would think so, I've seen whole trees floating down that river!


Perhaps we can help a bit. We have done the great loop and just on the second loop stopping in FL. Our trips also included Bimini, the Exumas, Abacos, Elutheras Bahamas, keys and dry tortugas. We have traveled down both routes on the rivers. The lower Mississippi and the Tenn-Tom. My wife has created quite detailed blogs of both routes.

Here is the start of the Tenn-Tom from Chicago..
https://sailbeauty.com/2015/09/28/wa-hoo/

Here is the start of the lower Mississippi from Chicago...
https://sailbeauty.com/2017/09/21/hammond-marina-and-larsen-marina/

If you prefer to read the very long complete blog..
www.sailbeauty.com

We have noticed debris in both rivers. Tenn-Tom was worse for us, but it is highly dependent on rain. Heavy rain brings more. But it is quite easy to dodge. Most of the time there is nothing.

Is there anything in particular you want to know?
Thanks,
Bryce


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## Aswayze (Apr 5, 2015)

Excellent read Bryce! I appreciate you guys taking the time to put this info together.


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## smackdaddy (Aug 13, 2008)

Aswayze (and others) - thanks for all the great information. This thread clearly shows why "cut and paste" is actually a very good thing. Hopefully more people will continue to take the time to pull in great resources like this.

Sounds like we sailed right by Nolatom's office.










I was very used to sailing around big ships and lots of other commercial traffic having cut my chops in Galveston Bay around the Houston Ship Channel. But the Mississippi around NO was a whole 'nother animal. Much less room, much more current, and the bridges and locks getting on and off the river were a freakin' nightmare.

But that's the only piece we did. I definitely prefer sailing offshore myself.


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## BryceGTX (Sep 7, 2011)

Perhaps a few positive posts on why we love the Mississippi.

The lower Mississippi is quite easy to navigate, the river is considerably wider and deeper than the Tombigby. Quite well marked.. Many more anchorages on the lower Mississippi than the Tombigby. Current is consistently faster on the lower Mississippi.

Garmin shows relative water depths, statute mile markers and position of groynes. Lots of features on a Garmin. Notice the GPS speed of 10.3 mph. This is due to the normal river current of 5 mph coupled with a throttled back through water speed of 5 mph. Gives us fuel mileage of 15 miles per gallon. Our 40 gallon tank is good for 600 miles.

Use Google maps normal and satellite views to get idea of you position with respect to towns and such. This Google shows our anchorage.

And of course OpenCPN has great charts of the rivers.


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## BryceGTX (Sep 7, 2011)

We love the huge sandy beaches on the Mississippi.. Hundreds of them.. only accessibly by water.


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## BryceGTX (Sep 7, 2011)

99% of the time, we are running on auto-pilot.. Every once in a while walk back to adjust for turns..

Don't forget the warmth... All the sailors going down the eastern seaboard are freezing, we are basking in the sun in swim suits..


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## BryceGTX (Sep 7, 2011)

Did I mention the sandy beaches.. Most afternoons we head to shore.. watch the tows go by..


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## BryceGTX (Sep 7, 2011)

We are often anchored off of sandy beaches.. Bring chairs to shore.. relax and enjoy drinks as we watch the sun go down.. and watch the boats go by..


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## BryceGTX (Sep 7, 2011)

And lots of large historic towns to explore.. This is Vicksburg.. We had this cruiser come in behind us.. LOL.. we are the sailboat anchored in front.

There were two of these River boats that came in while we were at Vicksburg..

This is the Harbor of Vicksburg off the river.. There are qute a few protected harbors near the large cities.


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## smackdaddy (Aug 13, 2008)

Good stuff Bryce.


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## BryceGTX (Sep 7, 2011)

Thanks Smack..

Even George likes the Mississippi..

George is happy because there are no locks on the Lower Mississippi compared to 18 locks on the other route..


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## smackdaddy (Aug 13, 2008)

Yeah - I'm completely over locks and bridges. Unless there is an absolutely pressing reason I HAVE to take the ICW in the future - I will never do it again. It's offshore for me from now on. No question.


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