# Powerboaters Are Funny



## JulieMor (Sep 5, 2011)

We spent the day checking out Chicago marinas. We did a lot of walking and saw a lot of boats and a lot of activity.

As we were walking the seawall, we saw a man alone in a 40' Tartan pull into his slip and tie her down without assistance. The boat never even touched the dock or pilings.

A little later we heard a loud bang followed by a louder expletive. We turned and saw a 32' power boat with several shirtless men armed with beer cans scrambling around the deck. The stern had just been gouged by their neighbor's anchor and they were running to the bow to keep the other end from crashing into a different boat. But they didn't spill a drop of beer.

We saw a perfectly preserved 30 something foot wooden sailboat that glistened in the sun. Just down the dock was a 25' powerboat. 

The name? 

"Size Matters."


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## arvicola-amphibius (Apr 14, 2012)

I don't know about them being 'funny' but some power-boaters sure are stupid.

One bright sunny day I was at the top of the mast in the bosun's chair when along comes this power boat kicking up a great wash. I yelled out over the noise of his engine to slow down and gave the universal palms-downward "slow down" signal. The moron thought I was waving to him...although he never slowed down at least he had the manners??? to wave back.

At the marina I always try to moor next to and opposite nice well-kept sailing boats. Less fear of coming aboard to find gouges in my paintwork if I know my neighbours are sailors rather than mere drivers.


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## T37Chef (Oct 9, 2006)

I love the names...news ones I've seen recently...

Beer Thirty
Thai One On

WTF?


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## chef2sail (Nov 27, 2007)

Power boaters dont have the monopoly on stupidity or poor seamanship.There is as many inexperienced sailors as power boaters. We just don't do it with speed.


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

chef2sail said:


> Power boaters dont have the monopoly on stupidity or poor seamanship.


But they certainly dominate the marketplace.

I was in the boatyard yesterday when they got a rush 1/2 lift request. A 40-ish foot cruiser came along to the lift bay trailing lines in the water on both sides. It looked like the docklines had been untied by people on the dock and just dropped in the water as the boat "drove" away.

The boat was hauled & washed etc - I didn't pay any attention.

It was dropped back in and as they were backing out I saw lines trailing in the water again. The hoist operator yelled at them to gather them in but just got blank looks in return. I finally told him to ignore it - more future business. 

The reason for the lift? *THREE* lines from pot lines to 5/8" braid wrapped around the prop.

You sure CAN'T fix stupid.


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## mad_machine (Dec 16, 2012)

it isn't that powerboaters are more stupid than sailors.. it is that -anybody- can operate a powerboat. Have you watched the drivers in the cars around you? Most of them have trouble staying in a well marked lane that is surrounded by kerbs.. put that same lack of ability into a boat with "wide open" waters.. and chaos ensues.

A few of my co-workers are powerboaters.. If I use any nautical terms around them, I get blank looks


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## TJC45 (Jul 10, 2013)

It just seems that the powerboaters have the market cornered on stupidity because there are so many of them. They out number sailors by what, eight to one?

That said there is much entertainment to be had by the write a check turn a key crowd.

OTOH, I know many powerboaters who as good as it gets with everything from boat handling to seamanship. But taking shots at the stereotype is fun!!!

For real entertainment hang out at a boat ramp!!!


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## JulieMor (Sep 5, 2011)

arvicola-amphibius said:


> At the marina I always try to moor next to and opposite nice well-kept sailing boats. Less fear of coming aboard to find gouges in my paintwork if I know my neighbours are sailors rather than mere drivers.


Good point!

The last marina we checked out yesterday is still pretty new and only about 25% full. The harbormaster said we could pick any slip we wanted as long as it fit our boat. We walked two docks. One had more powerboats than sailboats. The other had a bit more sailboats than powerboats. I stood there looking at an empty slip with two nicely kept sailboats on either side I felt our boat would be "at home" here. I thought our attraction to being next to other sailboats was mostly about being with like-minded people.

Then I read your comment and realized "at home" really meant "safe".


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## CaribDream (Jan 29, 2013)

I am both a sailor and a powerboater. I have to agree with "mad machine" here. It's so easy for someone to have limited knowledge and still operate a powerboat while sailing almost forces a little more education.

That being said, after all these years I am really getting prejudice with jet skis. When I see one now, I immediately think "moron is about to do something stupid" and I prepare for evasive action. It's probably wrong to think that negatively but I admit I do. And kids... I am so sick of seeing kids on these things. By far the most dangerous on my ranking list.

Next worse for me are parents/adults letting far too young kids drive jet skis. I saw an older lady with a little kid sitting in front of her. I was turning to port to go into a channel. Seeing them coming I hugged the nav marker leaving about 200 yards of open water for them to pass me on my starboard side to continue up the lake. As they came closer it was apparent they were about to do something stupid. I slowed to an almost stop. Thank goodness I did as they passed me on my port side in the 5 feet between me and the marker and then cut hard in front across my bow to continue going straight, not into the channel. Um, I think it would be wise to TAKE THE CONTROL FROM YOUR CHILD at that point. They continued oblivious.


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## TJC45 (Jul 10, 2013)

For years sailing in a crowded bay one has to learn to live with powerboaters who either don't know the rules or don't care about them. As well, there seemed to be a common lack of courtesy coming from powerboaters coming from this one marina in particular. There was no give in these people who's boats threw three and four foot wakes. You know the type. They appoach at max speed, pass within 50 fifty feet and then everyone on the boat turns to see what the wake does to the little sailboat. 

So after a summer of this arrogant treatment i decided to go over to the powerboat marina to check it out. You ever have one of those moments when a devilish thought comes into your head and you decide to go for It? You know it's wrong but? Well i happen to drive over in my Grand Cherokee right at dinner time on Saturday night. All the barbeques were fired up. People out holding their beers. Some already sitting down and eatting. The marina has a five mile an hour speed limit and the roadway thru is dirt. Which after a week or so without rain was now coated with a fine layer of dust. Even at five mph I was kicking some dust. I thought damn this is perfect!!!! i made sure i knew where the exit was and then gunned it. I did a lap through the place at 35mph that put so much dust in the air I couldn't see ten feet behind the car! I could hear people screaming at me and some had actually started running towards the car to stop me. But i had the speed and the angle. After a mile long lap I was out the gate and gone! The place looked like the dust bowl on the bay! Oh sweet satisfaction!!! 

Yeah, I know, wrong and stupid! But I sure felt better!!!


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## skysail (Jun 22, 2013)

I was there and saw the powerboat hit that other boats anchor, it was loud


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## JulieMor (Sep 5, 2011)

*Sailboaters Are Funny Too*

Sailors aren't immune to stupidity...


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## blutoyz (Oct 28, 2012)

That was a darn shame...pretty expensive lesson


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## JulieMor (Sep 5, 2011)

The boat behind them was racing for the win too. It wasn't a shame, it was just plain stupid! If that pole snapped straight back, someone could have been killed.

Now, back to our regularly scheduled program:


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## deniseO30 (Nov 27, 2006)

Julie Looking closer were they (on the sailboat racing to the bridge) knocking back beers as they were looking up?


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## T37Chef (Oct 9, 2006)

*Re: Sailboaters Are Funny Too*



JulieMor said:


> Sailors aren't immune to stupidity...
> 
> Sailboat vs Bridge - YouTube


No need to wait for the bridge to open anymore, technically wasn't he a power boater post incident anyway? So the shoe fits so to speak


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

CaribDream said:


> I am both a sailor and a powerboater. I have to agree with "mad machine" here. It's so easy for someone to have limited knowledge and still operate a powerboat while sailing almost forces a little more education.
> 
> That being said, after all these years I am really getting prejudice with jet skis. When I see one now, I immediately think "moron is about to do something stupid" and I prepare for evasive action. It's probably wrong to think that negatively but I admit I do. And kids... I am so sick of seeing kids on these things. By far the most dangerous on my ranking list.
> 
> Next worse for me are parents/adults letting far too young kids drive jet skis. I saw an older lady with a little kid sitting in front of her. I was turning to port to go into a channel. Seeing them coming I hugged the nav marker leaving about 200 yards of open water for them to pass me on my starboard side to continue up the lake. As they came closer it was apparent they were about to do something stupid. I slowed to an almost stop. Thank goodness I did as they passed me on my port side in the 5 feet between me and the marker and then cut hard in front across my bow to continue going straight, not into the channel. Um, I think it would be wise to TAKE THE CONTROL FROM YOUR CHILD at that point. They continued oblivious.


You have the real situation covered - one has to know a bit in order to make a sailboat go.

The jet ski people are the real, unfixable morons. They are the reason we are required to have operators permits (drivers licenses) here - there were so many 12 year olds on 200 HP jet skis causing havoc and deaths.

They are the living proof that 1/2 of all the people you meet have a lower than average IQ. The ban on jet skis in the San Juans should spread around the world.


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## PorFin (Sep 10, 2007)

mad_machine said:


> A few of my co-workers are powerboaters.. If I use any nautical terms around them, I get blank looks


I can one-up you on this...

Back over Memorial Day weekend, the wife & I visited with her sister in Tennessee. We rented a pontoon boat for a day on one of the reservoirs, mostly for the enjoyment of the S-I-L's two kids.

The guy who was giving me a safety/vessel orientation hit all the obvious stuff, and then I asked about ground tackle. Got a blank stare... So I rephrased it to "anchor and rode"; he said "yeah there's an anchor but what's rode?" I said "the stuff that attaches the anchor to the boat." He finally caught up with me.

The kicker? This guy was the local TowBoatUS guy


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## Coquina (Dec 27, 2012)

Fun powerboat radio calls:

*Mayday Mayday my husband fell overboard and I can't get him back on the boat. He is holding on to a line but can't climb back in. HELP*
USCG spends some time trying to locate this very upset women. Several other boats jump in with questions like where do you live, where did you launch the boat, what can you see, etc. Eventually someone figures out where she is and tells her they are on the way.
*OK someone is coming to help. Do you think I should slow down?* :laugher:laugher
SHE HAD BEEN UNDERWAY DRAGGING HER POOR HUSBAND THE ENTIRE TIME ALL THIS WAS GOING ON!

*in the end he got retreived and all was well...........

Second one:
*MAYDAY MAYDAY I hit the Bay Bridge! I have damage to my boat *
USCG: <asks all the 20 questions and then just has to ask> *Did you not see the bridge?*
Powerboat: *I was arguing with my girlfriend*


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## Dog Ship (Sep 23, 2011)

Last week Vic Edelbrock's yacht Victorious totally cut us off, just off of Sidney, B.C. His dinghy almost went over our bow.
I filed a complaint with CCG, USCG and Transport Canada. Transport Canada and the CCG gave him a visit on board Victorious in Victoria Harbour on Thursday. We have a video of the incident but the site won't let me load it. Here is a picture of him approaching our bow, we went to video right after taking this shot.


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## JulieMor (Sep 5, 2011)

SloopJonB said:


> They are the living proof that 1/2 of all the people you meet have a lower than average IQ.


In the US, it is estimated the average IQ is between 93-97. When the IQ test was created, they set the average at 100. So much for survival of the fittest.


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## tomandchris (Nov 11, 2009)

I have been around boats my entire long life. I believe that the problem is that you can teach people everything with the exception of common sense. Whether the owner/operator is in a powerboat, sailboat, or JetSki does not matter. Stupid is stupid! 
There just happen to be a lot more powerboater and now JetSki's.

The axiom used to be that sail boat owners were cheap, and SeaRay owners were assholes. Now we have SeaDoo owners are morons. Guess I need to change my boat title to moronic cheap ******* that thankfully has some common sense!
When the shiny new sailboat pulls out of their slip without looking to see if the fairway is clear (and you are behind them) you will have to expand on your theory. The only time I have ever had to use my horn to get someones attention was that shiny new sailboat. He missed me, but flipped ME off...guess he didn't like the horn telling his friends that he was an idiot. Oh, he was also the dockmaster.


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## tomandchris (Nov 11, 2009)

Guess that was a forbidden word, Interesting that it only got the second one.


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## miatapaul (Dec 15, 2006)

T37Chef said:


> No need to wait for the bridge to open anymore, technically wasn't he a power boater post incident anyway? So the shoe fits so to speak


Technically he was a power boater at the time of the accident. Perhaps he only brings out his brains when he puts his sails up. He must have been full throttle at the time too, ouch. Funny how going as fast of a bicycle, looks really fast going into an accident. Dose look crazy, as he looks to be racing the other sailboat cutting him off but the other sailboat seems to see it happen so the slow down and veer off. Wonder it he was baiting him? did he not hear the warning horn?

The thing with power boaters is that it takes so little effort to run power boats, that people think you can drink and boat. Seems sailors have to do more to get the boat to move and that tends to keep them closer to being sober. But how often do you see the idiots doing stupid stuff in the power boats with a beer in there shirtless hand? And why are they always shirtless? Come on no one wants to see that hairy gut. The other thing is that, especially speed boats can just do more stupid stuff due to there speed. Like the a-hole who ran into an old concrete foundation that was 50 yards from the well marked channel killing most of his friends and himself. Full throttle at night just feet from the shore of a river, there is a Darwin award winner for sure.


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## kellysails (Nov 1, 2008)

We nearly got T-Boned by a 50 foot fast trawler yesterday. Cruising nicely in a parallel course about 300 feet away. Then it does a hard 90 degree turn right towards our midships and coming fast. He then slightly turns towards our stern but not very much. We had to fall off our nice upward tack to get more speed to get away. I had my hand on the starter button. It really scared the crap out of myself and my wife. It was a beautiful day out in the Sound, what was their damn hurry anyway. Sometimes I wonder if they think it's fun or something. 

We now have the last page reserved in our log book to capture the boat names/desc of these idiots. I hope to see them in a marina someday. Maybe we should have reserved two pages in our log book. 

The boat was "Serious Freedom" dark blue hull with a white flying bridge, 50 foot trawler.
Oh, and the captain had a mole on his forehead with two or three white hairs sticking out of it.


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## Tim R. (Mar 23, 2003)

kellysails said:


> We nearly got T-Boned by a 50 foot fast trawler yesterday. Cruising nicely in a parallel course about 300 feet away. Then it does a hard 90 degree turn right towards our midships and coming fast. He then slightly turns towards our stern but not very much. We had to fall off our nice upward tack to get more speed to get away. I had my hand on the starter button. It really scared the crap out of myself and my wife. It was a beautiful day out in the Sound, what was their damn hurry anyway. Sometimes I wonder if they think it's fun or something.
> 
> We now have the last page reserved in our log book to capture the boat names/desc of these idiots. I hope to see them in a marina someday. Maybe we should have reserved two pages in our log book.
> 
> ...


Did you try hailing them to discover their intentions? Were you listening on 16 in case they tried to hail you? Not defending them but a chat can usually clear things up quickly.

I have had many conversations with large lux yachts to ascertain their intentions. I have also been contacted by some to let me know what they are doing.


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## miatapaul (Dec 15, 2006)

kellysails said:


> We nearly got T-Boned by a 50 foot fast trawler yesterday. Cruising nicely in a parallel course about 300 feet away. Then it does a hard 90 degree turn right towards our midships and coming fast. He then slightly turns towards our stern but not very much. We had to fall off our nice upward tack to get more speed to get away. I had my hand on the starter button. It really scared the crap out of myself and my wife. It was a beautiful day out in the Sound, what was their damn hurry anyway. Sometimes I wonder if they think it's fun or something.
> 
> We now have the last page reserved in our log book to capture the boat names/desc of these idiots. I hope to see them in a marina someday. Maybe we should have reserved two pages in our log book.
> 
> ...


With a name like "Serious Freedom," I might be worried about them being armed, so I am not sure if I would hail them!

Funny term Fast Trawler, I understand what it means(a trawler that will plain), but is is kind of an oxymoron by nature. They sure take a lot of fuel to get going that fast, just take solace in the fact that they are burning up there money so fast they may not be able to go out many more times!

Is this them?



> Vessel Name: SERIOUS FREEDOM USCG Doc. No.: 1063350
> Vessel Service: RECREATIONAL IMO Number: *
> Trade Indicator: Recreational Call Sign: WCY8487
> Hull Material: STEEL Hull Number: 3
> ...


found here: Office of Science and Technology


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

kellysails said:


> Oh, and the captain had a mole on his forehead with two or three white hairs sticking out of it.


I think you mistook his skull for that mole.


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

miatapaul said:


> found here: Office of Science and Technology


Looks like a good candidate for some 03:00 phone calls.


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## kellysails (Nov 1, 2008)

Tim R. said:


> Did you try hailing them to discover their intentions? Were you listening on 16 in case they tried to hail you? Not defending them but a chat can usually clear things up quickly.
> 
> I have had many conversations with large lux yachts to ascertain their intentions. I have also been contacted by some to let me know what they are doing.


I was on 16. The boat was well past us before we could see the name on the vessel. We really did not have time anyway. We wasted two minutes discussing about what the heck he was doing, then we ran out of time and just got out of there. That was a lesson learned. It was a very strange situation.


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## Tim R. (Mar 23, 2003)

kellysails said:


> I was on 16. The boat was well past us before we could see the name on the vessel. We really did not have time anyway. We wasted two minutes discussing about what the heck he was doing, then we ran out of time and just got out of there. That was a lesson learned. It was a very strange situation.


Sometimes it is better to punt!

BTW, this is a great reason to have an AIS receiver. Very cheap now and included on many VHF radios.


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## kellysails (Nov 1, 2008)

miatapaul said:


> With a name like "Serious Freedom," I might be worried about them being armed, so I am not sure if I would hail them!
> 
> Funny term Fast Trawler, I understand what it means(a trawler that will plain), but is is kind of an oxymoron by nature. They sure take a lot of fuel to get going that fast, just take solace in the fact that they are burning up there money so fast they may not be able to go out many more times!
> 
> ...


It could be. I did see his MMSI on AIS but didn't write it down, damn.


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## davidpm (Oct 22, 2007)

A couple weeks ago was was in a 20' sailboat with four passengers two of them wheel chair bound. The boat is specially made with adult car seats to take handicap people. I had another 20+ boat in a hip tow with another load of handicap people due to a problem with their engine. I was controlling both boats with my massive 6 HP outboard.

I'm coming down the fairway when a 40' power boat with a tower backs out without looking.

I refused to go much slower I barely had steerage anyway. 
I 5 blasted the guy and made it very clear with gestures it was his job to back away.

He did.

I had maybe 30 seconds to do something if he refused.

If I had stopped my ability to get going again in the direction I wanted was unlikely.


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## kellysails (Nov 1, 2008)

Whoa!!!!!!!



davidpm said:


> A couple weeks ago was was in a 20' sailboat with four passengers two of them wheel chair bound. The boat is specially made with adult car seats to take handicap people. I had another 20+ boat in a hip tow with another load of handicap people due to a problem with their engine. I was controlling both boats with my massive 6 HP outboard.
> 
> I'm coming down the fairway when a 40' power boat with a tower backs out without looking.
> 
> ...


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## chef2sail (Nov 27, 2007)

Tim R. said:


> Sometimes it is better to punt!
> 
> BTW, this is a great reason to have an AIS receiver. Very cheap now and included on many VHF radios.


98% of Power boaters and Sailboaters don't have AIS


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## dabnis (Jul 29, 2007)

I will take a shot at it, (a little gun lingo for our Canadian and Australian folks). I have had both power and sail boats. It may be, that in general, power boats are less effected by big steep wakes, and their owners are not aware of the effects they have on sailboats?

How is that for being touchy feely? Can't we just all get along? 

Paul T


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## Coquina (Dec 27, 2012)

The first think I found out when I got a 16 foot power boat was that larger power boats were quite dangerous to me. They had NOT ONE CLUE as to the right-of-way rules between powerboats and hitting a large wake at 30-40 knots in a light boat can do some real damage. Another thing I found out was some sailors would give me the finger when I waved to them even though I am skimming along leaving about as much wake as a canoe and my underwater exhaust engine was as silent as could be


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## Tim R. (Mar 23, 2003)

chef2sail said:


> 98% of Power boaters and Sailboaters don't have AIS


98%? Where do you get that stat?

Most boats I have encountered over 50ft. have it and I can assure you that having it has made boating just a little safer for us. And with the price of receivers and transponders coming down more smaller boats are getting it.


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## mstern (May 26, 2002)

I had an interesting flip side story. I was in Ft. Lauderdale this past winter, and lazing about on a boat at a bulkhead when a large (50+ ft) Sundancer came up behind us, and made it clear that they were going to try and fit in the bulkhead space immediately behind us. Their boat was going to just barely fit in the available space. I settled in to watch the show (I wasn't in any position to help; I was on the top deck of a tour boat, waiting to leave). The Sundancer (a go-fast, luxury cruiser) was piloted by a fairly fat guy with a deep tan and no shirt. His buddies were similarly attired/built (or not). I was expecting a debacle as no one on the boat made a move to put out fenders or even handle the docklines. However, the skipper neatly turned his boat on a dime and sidewalked her in to the bulkhead, neat as you please. His friends broke out the fenders when they were about three feet from the concrete (although at least one of them did step off of the boat by wriggling under the bow rail). All in all, an impressive display of seamanship and boat handling. And the requisite deck fluff (there are always girls in bikinis on boats like that, regardless of the phyisical attractiveness of the owner) didn't have to move.


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

dabnis said:


> I will take a shot at it, (a little gun lingo for our Canadian and Australian folks). I have had both power and sail boats. It may be, that in general, power boats are less effected by big steep wakes, and their owners are not aware of the effects they have on sailboats?
> 
> How is that for being touchy feely? Can't we just all get along?
> 
> Paul T


So you agree that they are simply clueless.


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

Coquina said:


> The first think I found out when I got a 16 foot power boat was that larger power boats were quite dangerous to me. They had NOT ONE CLUE as to the right-of-way rules between powerboats and hitting a large wake at 30-40 knots in a light boat can do some real damage. Another thing I found out was some sailors would give me the finger when I waved to them even though I am skimming along leaving about as much wake as a canoe and my underwater exhaust engine was as silent as could be


You were in a power boat - you deserved it. 

The best line I ever heard about the sail VS power thing was that *"Sailors tend to view powerboaters the way aristocratic Romans viewed the Goths"*

Pretty well describes it I think.


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## dabnis (Jul 29, 2007)

SloopJonB said:


> So you agree that they are simply clueless.


Could be in many cases, and for those who do understand the effect of their wakes, they probably have a good laugh while turning your sailboat into an industrial sized clothes dryer with you inside. "Jolly good fun, look at them bounce, lets go find some more to wash down"

Or run down, never assume they see you. 






Paul T


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

I always assume they can't. I find it's actually best to assume they are all below, drunk.


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## boatpoker (Jul 21, 2008)

Power boaters are not the only drunks. For years I watched the LO300 (Lake Ontario 300 mile race) leave our yacht club for a non-stop 2-3 day race, usually around 180 boats ....... with at least 180 dock carts full of liquor and beer !


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## JulieMor (Sep 5, 2011)

dabnis said:


> Or run down, never assume they see you.


What amazed me about your video is that neither boat altered their path. Forgive me for my lack of imagination, but I can't imagine neither person at the helm saw the other boat. And with all those people on board, you'd think someone would have been screaming. At least the guy on the bow had the sense to move aft.


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## Coquina (Dec 27, 2012)

Until they need a tow 

In high school my girlfriend and I would spend the day on the river in her 13 foot Boston Whaler. We usually got enough cash tips from towing someone off of a sandbar or something to get a little gas and ice cream in Annapolis 

And then there was the crew sailing a Cal 25 up the Severn around midnight with no lights at all showing. They were cussing and carrying on that I passed them "too close" when they are lucky I didn't kill them 

You are also neglecting the entertainment aspect. One guy at my marina is blessed with a wife that is Dolly Parton like in dimensions and works the foredeck in a bikini. He is also blessed with a total lack of boat handling skills, so docking involves him hitting pilings, slamming the boat into and out of gear, and yelling at his wife while her accessories are getting sent various directions by all this :laugher



SloopJonB said:


> You were in a power boat - you deserved it.
> 
> The best line I ever heard about the sail VS power thing was that *"Sailors tend to view powerboaters the way aristocratic Romans viewed the Goths"*
> 
> Pretty well describes it I think.


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## bljones (Oct 13, 2008)

Pic taken recently:


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## dabnis (Jul 29, 2007)

I think there may be more of them?

Paul T


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## caberg (Jul 26, 2012)

I don't really get the us vs. them (sail vs. power) mentality, but maybe it's different where you all are from. Around here, most folks on the water are pretty friendly people and I'd be just as likely to have a friendly interaction with a powerboat as a sailboat, whether at anchor or in the marina or wherever. Just last weekend I spent about an hour talking to an old salty dude at the pub next to my marina. He lives on a trawler in Florida in the winters and spends summers up my way with a smaller powerboat. Great guy, he told me all about cruising around the Bahamas on his boat. I certainly didn't look at him sideways because he does not sail.

As for competence, I spent 7 summers working at a busy municipal marina which saw about 50/50 power vs. sail transients coming and going on a daily basis. Sorry to say, but there were more mishaps around the docks involving sailboats than power boats (although power boat collisions tend to be worse). We would see 30' to 40' sailboats on a daily basis approach our docks without a clue how to operate under power. 

I also agree with the comment about towing above. If I were to get stranded without wind and a failed engine, I have no doubt that a privately owned power boat would offer assistance and refuse anything but a beer back at the dock. 

So, I see no reason to alienate myself from over half of the people I share my local waters with.


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## dabnis (Jul 29, 2007)

JulieMor said:


> What amazed me about your video is that neither boat altered their path. Forgive me for my lack of imagination, but I can't imagine neither person at the helm saw the other boat. And with all those people on board, you'd think someone would have been screaming. At least the guy on the bow had the sense to move aft.


"Otto" pilots? Maybe like this one? 






Paul T


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## Coquina (Dec 27, 2012)

This is mainly teh internetz entertainmentz 
In real life I get along fine with all types of boaters. We recently had a raft-up that included 2 sailboats, a 26 foot powerboat, 2 jet-skis, and my dinghy pulling a tube. I have been sailing since being a toddler but also owned 2 different powerboats at various times. Look out the window - flat calm - maybe a better day to waterski than sail.

I even sort-of miss the hordes of obnoxious "motor yachts" that used to make an umbroken trail of diesel stink and huge wakes to any popular destination. For the last 5 years or so it has been more like "where is everyone"  Nice as the quiet is, it is sad that a whole segment of boaters can't seem to afford to get out anymore. My marina is 1/3 empty and more than 1/2 of the remaining boats NEVER move.



caberg said:


> I don't really get the us vs. them (sail vs. power) mentality, but maybe it's different where you all are from. Around here, most folks on the water are pretty friendly people and I'd be just as likely to have a friendly interaction with a powerboat as a sailboat, whether at anchor or in the marina or wherever. Just last weekend I spent about an hour talking to an old salty dude at the pub next to my marina. He lives on a trawler in Florida in the winters and spends summers up my way with a smaller powerboat. Great guy, he told me all about cruising around the Bahamas on his boat. I certainly didn't look at him sideways because he does not sail.
> 
> As for competence, I spent 7 summers working at a busy municipal marina which saw about 50/50 power vs. sail transients coming and going on a daily basis. Sorry to say, but there were more mishaps around the docks involving sailboats than power boats (although power boat collisions tend to be worse). We would see 30' to 40' sailboats on a daily basis approach our docks without a clue how to operate under power.
> 
> ...


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## mad_machine (Dec 16, 2012)

Coquina said:


> My marina is 1/3 empty and more than 1/2 of the remaining boats NEVER move.


True around here too.. and people are still asking top dollar for slips.


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## T37Chef (Oct 9, 2006)

Whats odd to me is that it would seem the cost of fuel has kept many power boaters from using their boats, yet companies like Sabre have stopped production of their Sailboats, and it would seem power boat sales are increasing over sailboat? Or has that always been the case? 

I know fuel sales are way down at our club, so that would indicate less use.


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## T37Chef (Oct 9, 2006)

As mentioned by a few others, this is mostly just entertainment..."making fun" if you will. In real life there is always a little tong & cheek among the two, but we're all out enjoying the water...just from two different perspectives.

Some of the most impressive boat docking skills I have ever observed were the guys running the sport fishing yachts at Oregon Inlet Fishing Center. The other was the Captain of the Schooner Woodwind in Annapolis weaving through the mooring field under full sail. Both impressive for different reasons.


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## rbrasi (Mar 21, 2011)

There are several charter sailboats surrounding my slip. On a weekend morning, I can sit and watch the renters come and go and every one is an adventure. I often give them a hand. The way I see it, they are smarter than me, because if it floats, f*%ks or flies, rent it.


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## sailak (Apr 15, 2007)

A couple years ago we were sailing back to the harbor after a Saturday race. We had run late so it was 1700 or so and the "fleet" of pleasure craft was bearing down on the breakwater behind us...everything from skiffs to 80' tour boats. As we were about to enter the breakwater I looked back to check traffic and see the big 80' catamaran tour boat a few hundred feet behind us doing easy ess turns -- the rest of the fleet was lining up behind him. Not sure is the turns were to make him "wider" or if he wanted to keep some speed up for steerage, either way it took the stress of being run over away.

That tour boat skipper happens to own a very nice 38' cutter. 

Just two days ago as we had made a quick pee stop for the dog and were in the process of raising the anchor when a sailboat with new owners (not sure of their boating experience) came into the cove and proceeded to drop anchor about 100' in front of us, didn't like the set and raised his anchor while drifting toward us. My anchor was off the bottom by then, I gave the Admiral the standard "get the heck away from this guy signal" and we departed the area. Not just the powerboaters.

A few days earlier a powerboat of about 30' anchored near us. He eased in and came to a stop in probably 30-40' of water then stationary started running out the anchor and chain. It sounded like he ran out about 500' of chain all while sitting still. There must have been a reef of galvanized links under him!! The prevailing wind was going to take him away so I wasn't concerned for my boat.


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## outbound (Dec 3, 2012)

Still think when you see a charter boat like from Moorings be scared,be very scared. Ain't just them.


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## dabnis (Jul 29, 2007)

T37Chef said:


> As mentioned by a few others, this is mostly just entertainment..."making fun" if you will. In real life there is always a little tong & cheek among the two, but we're all out enjoying the water...just from two different perspectives.
> 
> Some of the most impressive boat docking skills I have ever observed were the guys running the sport fishing yachts at Oregon Inlet Fishing Center. The other was the Captain of the Schooner Woodwind in Annapolis weaving through the mooring field under full sail. Both impressive for different reasons.


As mentioned earlier, I have had both including the identical to below. I am not so sure power boaters are as bad as their "image". The big difference is that they go faster & put up some big wakes. Like people in general, some are considerate and some not.

Paul T


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

Like all generalizations there is some truth in it. Within each subset you will find widely varying degrees of skill and courtesy BUT - *generally speaking* I have found that sailors are more skilled and courteous than powerboaters.

Again, in my experience (40+ years) the really extreme jerks, clowns, stupids, drunks and loudmouths are almost invariably "driving" fast powerboats.

Racing sailors run a distant second.


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## Coquina (Dec 27, 2012)

Racing sailors and fisherman both contain subsets that demand rights that don't exist in the COLREGS. The worst possible situation is a bunch of fisherman trolling across a race course.


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## Coquina (Dec 27, 2012)

The cruising sailboat market is a very tiny niche of a declining industry. What boats are getting sold are mostly power 
I think sailboats large enough to have inboard engines are <5% of boat sales now at best 



T37Chef said:


> Whats odd to me is that it would seem the cost of fuel has kept many power boaters from using their boats, yet companies like Sabre have stopped production of their Sailboats, and it would seem power boat sales are increasing over sailboat? Or has that always been the case?
> 
> I know fuel sales are way down at our club, so that would indicate less use.


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## TJC45 (Jul 10, 2013)

About the current economic state of boating - it's coming back but isn't back yet. 

Most boaters in my neck of the woods are weekend warriors, myself included. Go to the marina on a weekend and the most of the action is at pool and at the bar. Power boats are expensive to run. And there are just so many times you want to pay to run to that special anchorage $200 away. Best to hang at the pool and soak in the rays!

Dedicated fisherman are the exception.


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## outbound (Dec 3, 2012)

Flip of that are the boomers finally in position to go cruising. Big (40+)market is heating up from what I hear.


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## chef2sail (Nov 27, 2007)

outbound said:


> Flip of that are the boomers finally in position to go cruising. Big (40+)market is heating up from what I hear.


Funny I have heard the opposite. Many boat being pruchase now on the East Coast are the insurance payouts from losses from Sandy.


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## arvicola-amphibius (Apr 14, 2012)

Here are three more real personal experiences had with power boaters.

First, I am sailing solo on a light breeze, steady course, bright (very bright)spinnaker flying, open ocean with no channels, sandbars or rocks anywhere close by.

Off my port side, coming at right angles at about 20 knots is a large (about 80ft) professionally-crewed charter boat returning with a bunch of tourists from whale watching. It drills straight at me. I can't get out of the way, as the breeze is so light. I know he wouldn't hear my foghorn over his engines, so the only thing I think of is to hit the VHF radio with "LOOK OUT, YOU F...WIT !" I know, I know, we are not supposed to use profanities on the radio, but in extremis I had to say something in the hopes that it would grab everyone's attention. At the last minute he veered away and passed within metres, so whether he was playing chicken or really was not looking out I don't know.

Next incident, where I was in a narrow channel with rocks on both sides, under sail on a close reach in a 20 knot breeze. All good until a beat-up wooden powerboat comes at me, again on my port side. He sees me, but is clearly not going to give way and I can't change course in the narrow channel because my boat draws over six feet. This time I am really moving - a good 7 knots. So this d!ckhead passes just ahead of me, by literally two metres, giving me the bird just to add insult. Unfortunately for him, he was towing a dinghy with an outboard on a long line - which I rammed and sank. I suppose I could have luffed up to avoid it, and may have tried to if he had not flipped me the bird. Naughty, hey?

Most recent concerned a tour group on jet-skis in Tasmania. They left a harbor on the main island to do a lap of Bruny Island, stopping at a couple of places for sight-seeing. I think the idea was for them to keep Bruny on their port side all the way around until they were in sight of the departure point, to which they were expected to return. They were accompanied by a mother-ship (a small power boat that was not as fast as the jetskis, but brought up in the rear to cover any breakdowns). On the last lap the tourists decided to go for it and headed off in various directions. The mother ship couldn't keep pace and lost sight of the pack. I received a call from the coast guard to ask if I had seen any of them, as some appeared to be heading in my direction - at least 120 degrees off course and 10 miles off shore from Bruny!

Had they ended up in my area they would have been critically short of fuel. Luckily the Hobart Port Pilot was able to intercept them and get them headed the right way. How hard could it be to keep a relatively small island on your left side until you did a lap of it?


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

arvicola-amphibius said:


> Next incident, where I was in a narrow channel with rocks on both sides, under sail on a close reach in a 20 knot breeze. All good until a beat-up wooden powerboat comes at me, again on my port side. He sees me, but is clearly not going to give way and I can't change course in the narrow channel because my boat draws over six feet. This time I am really moving - a good 7 knots. So this d!ckhead passes just ahead of me, by literally two metres, giving me the bird just to add insult. Unfortunately for him, he was towing a dinghy with an outboard on a long line - which I rammed and sank. I suppose I could have luffed up to avoid it, and may have tried to if he had not flipped me the bird. Naughty, hey?


Sweeeet.


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## blutoyz (Oct 28, 2012)

I don't understand what part of "give way vessel" is unclear...

I am very aware of my surrounding on a port tack for that very reason, there are more sailboats in the bay now. My friend in his 34' searay will burn 40 gallons just going to aquapalooza tomorrow so he doesn't leave the dock often. He has asked me to teach him to sail, I bet he will get hooked.


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## djaustralia (Mar 17, 2013)

Yeah, I know, wrong and stupid! But I sure felt better!!![/QUOTE]

I would have gone away & then changed cars maybe, come back an hour later & do it again!


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## TJC45 (Jul 10, 2013)

I think we can all agree that the problem with powerboaters is that they are clewless!


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## 5hortBu5 (Jul 28, 2010)

TJC45 said:


> I think we can all agree that the problem with powerboaters is that they are clewless!


Oh man. How long were you sitting on that gem?


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## JamesSkok (Jun 1, 2007)

Getting back at motobo's with a dust cloud perhaps is the only way TO do it because they are otherwise clueless if you were to do it with a boat wake and I'd not want to create wake damage to any boats anyway.
My experience with motobo's was one I observed from a floating finger pier adjacent to a channel while the skipper's outspoken female passenger/girlfriend on the boat stopped for an infraction kept telling the state trooper that they were only going 10 mph insistently, repeatedly only 10mph and repeatedly insisting what could he be thinking of by stopping them. We weren't speeding, she nagged. I saw the speedometer; only 10, she said. The trooper politely ignored her as he asked the skipper for license and reg, etc. She continued to interrupt and nag the trooper that they WERE going slow and he was SOOO wrong. The young skipper was mortified by this time. The trooper then in a telling manner suggestive of one that Dennis Farina (RIP) would use looked from the skipper to her saying "lady, MOVE to the bow, you know, the front of the boat and shut it or I'll ticket you for interfering...MOVE NOW!". The skipper gingerly took girlfriend by the arm to the bow. The trooper explained to the skipper that "... it's not the speed cap, it's the WAKE! See the guy balancing on the bobbing finger pier (me!). Here's a warning this time 'cause you've got problems enough up in the bow. Have a good outing."


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## ammymorcle (Jul 27, 2013)

Informative post. Thanks for sharing!


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## rbrasi (Mar 21, 2011)

..Aaaaannnd sometimes Powerboaters are sad.
Bride-to-be, best man missing after NY boat crash


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## PaulinVictoria (Aug 23, 2009)

> One guy at my marina is blessed with a wife that is Dolly Parton like in dimensions and works the foredeck in a bikini. He is also blessed with a total lack of boat handling skills, so docking involves him hitting pilings, slamming the boat into and out of gear, and yelling at his wife while her accessories are getting sent various directions by all this


Now. Really. How could this not have been picked up on already? I'm disappointed in you all.
:worthless:


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## Lateen Luffer (Mar 10, 2013)

My least favorite powerboats in the SF Bay are the ferryboats. They're huge, fast and cut a big wake. They also seem to see nothing wrong with buzzing right my a boat under sail. To my little boat the wake is a little scary- I've been spun around by it when I didn't know to fear it. I guess it's gross tonnage rules. ~LL


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## rhr1956 (Dec 18, 2010)

JamesSkok said:


> Getting back at motobo's with a dust cloud perhaps is the only way TO do it because they are otherwise clueless if you were to do it with a boat wake and I'd not want to create wake damage to any boats anyway.
> My experience with motobo's was one I observed from a floating finger pier adjacent to a channel while the skipper's outspoken female passenger/girlfriend on the boat stopped for an infraction kept telling the state trooper that they were only going 10 mph insistently, repeatedly only 10mph and repeatedly insisting what could he be thinking of by stopping them. We weren't speeding, she nagged. I saw the speedometer; only 10, she said. The trooper politely ignored her as he asked the skipper for license and reg, etc. She continued to interrupt and nag the trooper that they WERE going slow and he was SOOO wrong. The young skipper was mortified by this time. The trooper then in a telling manner suggestive of one that Dennis Farina (RIP) would use looked from the skipper to her saying "lady, MOVE to the bow, you know, the front of the boat and shut it or I'll ticket you for interfering...MOVE NOW!". The skipper gingerly took girlfriend by the arm to the bow. The trooper explained to the skipper that "... it's not the speed cap, it's the WAKE! See the guy balancing on the bobbing finger pier (me!). Here's a warning this time 'cause you've got problems enough up in the bow. Have a good outing."


Problems in the bow...Halarious!


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## CalebD (Jan 11, 2008)

rbrasi said:


> ..Aaaaannnd sometimes Powerboaters are sad.
> Bride-to-be, best man missing after NY boat crash


I sail right in this area. They have barges moored in the river near the old bridge for work platforms for the new bridge footings they are making. Unfortunately for this group on the power boat, the barges are not lit up at night.

About a month ago I was sailing at night in this area with some friends from out of town. Logically, they wanted to sail right up to the bridge. Fortunately I remembered the stationary barges there and kept us some distance from the bridge and these floating hazards. Under a full moon we were close enough to see them. Moving at 5 knots has it's advantages...


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

Lateen Luffer said:


> My least favorite powerboats in the SF Bay are the ferryboats. They're huge, fast and cut a big wake. They also seem to see nothing wrong with buzzing right my a boat under sail. To my little boat the wake is a little scary- I've been spun around by it when I didn't know to fear it. I guess it's gross tonnage rules. ~LL


That's Caribbean sailing rules - "De biggest boat got de right o' way mon".


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

rbrasi said:


> ..Aaaaannnd sometimes Powerboaters are sad.
> Bride-to-be, best man missing after NY boat crash


a "21' Stingray"?

Any bets on how fast they were going?


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## miatapaul (Dec 15, 2006)

SloopJonB said:


> a "21' Stingray"?
> 
> Any bets on how fast they were going?


Actually the boat did not look that damaged, at least in the fuzzy photos. But yes, folks do like to go way too fast at night after a few drinks.


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## mstern (May 26, 2002)

miatapaul said:


> Actually the boat did not look that damaged, at least in the fuzzy photos. But yes, folks do like to go way too fast at night after a few drinks.


This is a terribly sad story; I don't condone drinking and boating (or driving), but no one should jump to conclusions here. Enough can go wrong at night without alcohol being involved. I suggest everyone suspend their judgement of the operator until the facts are in. Whether he was drunk or not, he just killed his fiance and best friend. Whatever punishment society and the justice system imposes on him, it pales in comparison to what he is likely feeling on his own.


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## chucklesR (Sep 17, 2007)

T37Chef said:


> Some of the most impressive boat docking skills I have ever observed were the guys running the sport fishing yachts at Oregon Inlet Fishing Center. The other was the Captain of the Schooner Woodwind in Annapolis weaving through the mooring field under full sail. Both impressive for different reasons.


Up until a couple years ago that would have been my friend and current YC commodore, Ron. 
Yep, Captain Ron.


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

I saw in the paper today that the "groom" is being charged heavily for that crash.


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

chucklesR said:


> Up until a couple years ago that would have been my friend and current YC commodore, Ron.
> Yep, Captain Ron.


I believe Captain Ron's name is Ron Rico - same as the rum.  Maybe he's still trying to outrun his past.


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## T37Chef (Oct 9, 2006)

This past weekend we had a club outing...anyway the host boat was a beautiful Passport 44, with maybe the most incompetent skipper? 

It took him three tries to set the anchor, then about 2 hours later while everyone was aboard their vessel enjoying stories and food...the anchor dragged. When he re-anchored the anchor went down and the engine off, no attempt to back down on it what so ever??? This was in a creek on the Chesapeake with probably a foot of silt? WTF

I would have liked to give a lesson on proper technique but the time and place was not appropriate, although in retrospect I wish I had. All the time we were having conversation all he did was name drop and sit rather arrogantly in his cockpit telling us all about how great his boat is. I would have enjoyed the conversation if I had respect for the guy, but don't lecture me on what the best furler is if you cant even anchor your freaking boat properly...what a douche bag 

So its not just power boaters...although there was this PB who tried anchoring close to us...oh never mind...


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## T37Chef (Oct 9, 2006)

Lateen Luffer said:


> My least favorite powerboats in the SF Bay are the ferryboats. They're huge, fast and cut a big wake. They also seem to see nothing wrong with buzzing right my a boat under sail. To my little boat the wake is a little scary- I've been spun around by it when I didn't know to fear it. I guess it's gross tonnage rules. ~LL


I wouldn't be messing around with no large ferry boat...I'm getting out of the way every time. I'm out on a pleasure cruise, they re working.


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## JonEisberg (Dec 3, 2010)

T37Chef said:


> So its not just power boaters...although there was this PB who tried anchoring close to us...oh never mind...


I know few here will want to hear this, but over my years of running both power and sail, I've found that as a rule, sailors tend to be far more 'judgemental' and prone to make assumptions about you depending upon what sort of boat you've just stepped off of, than powerboaters tend to be... I know it's a broad generalization, but I think sailors are far more likely to categorize 'boaters' according their type of boat, and to harbor certain prejudices about their boating 'opposites', than powerboaters do... By virtue of the simple fact I've arrived in a marina aboard a sportfisherman or motor yacht, it's very common that my neighbors in adjacent sailboats seem surprised I might have the slightest clue about their boats, or what they are doing cruising under sail... If I've arrived on a sailboat, and am in the midst of a bunch of powerboats, however, I rarely encounter the equivalent assumptions being made, I'm just another guy out enjoying being on the water, as they are...

Certainly, the broad level of animosity that sailors feel towards their powerboating brethren does not exist to the same degree among powerboaters, they tend to look upon us with a sort of bemusement, perhaps, but that's about it... And, I think we would all do well to remember, that if we should all be so fortunate to live long enough, chances are we will all ultimately wind up in a powerboat eventually, and that indeed the ranks of powerboaters today are increasingly being populated by former sailors...

As far as what goes on between the 2 cults on the ICW, sailors often bring many of their problems with powerboats upon themselves, unfortunately...

Just my opinion, of course...


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## CalebD (Jan 11, 2008)

SloopJonB said:


> a "21' Stingray"?
> 
> Any bets on how fast they were going?


Actually the bow of this Stingray shows obvious evidence of a collision. I'm guessing at least 10 knots.
Can you imagine going 10+ knots and coming to an instant dead stop? Those people were thrown from the boat and likely bounced off the barge. 
If you guys read the article carefully it is not the groom who is being charged but the boat owner. The groom lost his fiancee and best man in this accident. The captain is being charged on suspicion of intoxication which the article does not elaborate on. In any event: vehicular manslaughter. 
Glad I'm not him as he is in a heap of trouble whether alcohol was involved or not.


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## mstern (May 26, 2002)

CalebD said:


> If you guys read the article carefully it is not the groom who is being charged but the boat owner. The groom lost his fiancee and best man in this accident. The captain is being charged on suspicion of intoxication which the article does not elaborate on. In any event: vehicular manslaughter.
> QUOTE]
> 
> Thanks for that clarification. I was one who misread the article to say that it was the groom-to-be who was the operator. Was it a boat for hire, or were they all just out for a ride?


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## Gregrosine (Feb 10, 2013)

This weekend a very large cabin cruiser was tied at an visitor slip. One of those three level monsters with a power sliding glass door of the deck. An alarm was ringing and an odor in the air. Something went wrong and they pumped a couple hundred gallons of diesel from their bilge into the marina. We couldn't stay because the smell was so bad. A sail boat wouldn't have made that big of a mess, we don't hold that much fuel.


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## SVAuspicious (Oct 31, 2006)

T37Chef said:


> It took him three tries to set the anchor, then about 2 hours later while everyone was aboard their vessel enjoying stories and food...the anchor dragged. When he re-anchored the anchor went down and the engine off, no attempt to back down on it what so ever??? This was in a creek on the Chesapeake with probably a foot of silt?


This is why I generally don't participate in raft-ups.

Unfortunately, when I do (as anchor boat) I find many people are not very courteous to the host boat. Easier and better for everyone to anchor away and dinghy over.


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## T37Chef (Oct 9, 2006)

SVAuspicious said:


> This is why I generally don't participate in raft-ups.
> 
> Unfortunately, when I do (as anchor boat) I find many people are not very courteous to the host boat. Easier and better for everyone to anchor away and dinghy over.


I can't imagine having anything but the most respect when on another's boat, especially when they are the host boat!


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## CalebD (Jan 11, 2008)

mstern said:


> Thanks for that clarification. I was one who misread the article to say that it was the groom-to-be who was the operator. Was it a boat for hire, or were they all just out for a ride?


It is presumed by me that the owner of the mo-boat was an aquaintance or friend.


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## JonEisberg (Dec 3, 2010)

CalebD said:


> It is presumed by me that the owner of the mo-boat was an aquaintance or friend.


It is also presumed alcohol was involved, not exactly a shocker...



> The skipper of the 19-foot Stingray bowrider - Jojo John, 35, of Nyack, N.Y., a banker at JPMorgan -has been charged with vehicular manslaughter and vehicular assault. Cops say he was intoxicated.
> 
> Rockland County Sheriff's Department Chief William Barbera said John could face more charges in the crash. He had been busted for drug possession, a misdemeanor, in 2009, and for conspiracy, a drug-related felony charge, in 2010. He did community service and was put on probation, Barbera said.
> 
> Read more: Hudson River speedboat crash: Body of would-be best man found; skipper, charged with manslaughter, has drug priors - NY Daily News


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## chef2sail (Nov 27, 2007)

T37Chef said:


> I can't imagine having anything but the most respect when on another's boat, especially when they are the host boat!


Yes really I agree. We ascertain each situation as it comes up. We won't raft with one one who doesn't anchor correctly or safely, or the conditions re not right meaning, holding,wind, storms etc.

Usually we break off by ourselves after a few hours and anchor after the get together. Occasionally if the conditions are ok we stay rafted...no more than 3. 
If I am the anchor boat I am constantly on alert. Even when sleeping with one eye open. If the ind is over 8 we break apart.

Being considerate of the host boat is jut good manners.

Dave


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## chef2sail (Nov 27, 2007)

JonEisberg said:


> It is also presumed alcohol was involved, not exactly a shocker...


Bottom line....booze and active boating don't mix


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## CalebD (Jan 11, 2008)

JonEisberg said:


> It is also presumed alcohol was involved, not exactly a shocker...
> *The skipper of the 19-foot Stingray bowrider - Jojo John, 35, of Nyack, N.Y., a banker at JPMorgan -has been charged with vehicular manslaughter and vehicular assault. Cops say he was intoxicated.*


Case in point: JPMorgan pays their people way too much money. He might have been getting ready to move up to a nice Silverton 38'.

I'm not trying to defend this guy but it almost seems like here say that he was drunk - though I do not doubt it for a minute. Empty cans or bottles found in the boat? Blood/alcohol measurements? Slurred speech? No, they "say" he was intoxicated.

They also say that these stationary work barges are well lit and I can tell you that they are not well lit, at all.

The US Coast Guard may have made a Notice to Mariners about the work barges around the TZ bridge and the associated "security zone" but I have not been able to find this yet. A few news sources spouted this tidbit without supplying a connecting URL to a USCG website.


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## miatapaul (Dec 15, 2006)

CalebD said:


> Case in point: JPMorgan pays their people way too much money. He might have been getting ready to move up to a nice Silverton 38'.
> 
> I'm not trying to defend this guy but it almost seems like here say that he was drunk - though I do not doubt it for a minute. Empty cans or bottles found in the boat? Blood/alcohol measurements? Slurred speech? No, they "say" he was intoxicated.
> 
> ...


The account I read was that they are waiting for blood test results but seems they had little doubt. Just want to make sure before accusing. Not that we would wait!

Sent from my ADR6425LVW using Tapatalk 4 Beta


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## mstern (May 26, 2002)

chef2sail said:


> Yes really I agree. We ascertain each situation as it comes up. We won't raft with one one who doesn't anchor correctly or safely, or the conditions re not right meaning, holding,wind, storms etc.
> 
> Usually we break off by ourselves after a few hours and anchor after the get together. Occasionally if the conditions are ok we stay rafted...no more than 3.
> If I am the anchor boat I am constantly on alert. Even when sleeping with one eye open. If the ind is over 8 we break apart.
> ...


In my area, several people maintain moorings in the harbor area. This area is in a beautiful area; calm waters, surrounded by nice homes and beautiful scenery. It safely away from the dredged channel, but close enough to the channel and the river with all of the yacht clubs and marinas to be very convenient. In short, a terrific place to anchor out, swim and relax. And on a summer weekend, many people do just that.

These moorings are not used "permanently", that is as a place where boats are kept for the season, but as temporary moorings where folks who have slips come to tie up for the day or a few hours. Consequently, these moorings (there are about 10 of them) are usually empty. Some of the mooring balls have no markings, some have a boat's name on them, some are marked "Private". Regardless, many people just pick one up for an hour or two. It seems to be considered acceptable in the local etiquette.

I don't think twice about this practice anymore, but I saw something on Saturday that made me wince. I was anchored in the harbor area and saw what looked like a 50 foot express cruiser powerboat pick up one of the unused moorings. I was thinking that was irresponsible, as that is a big boat, and there is no way of knowing if the mooring is big or strong enough to handle the load. Not a half hour later, another express cruiser (this one a bit smaller) sidles up to the 50 footer and rafts up with it. Now, conditions were benign that day: winds were less than 10 knots, and there was no swell or waves to deal with. But still, I find it hard to believe that the mooring was designed with that much load in mind. I have no idea if the skippers of the cruisers took that into consideration when rafting up, of if they would have done the same thing in more blustery conditions. Either way, its just rude.


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

JonEisberg said:


> It is also presumed alcohol was involved, not exactly a shocker...


A stupid (several busts) druggie Wall Streeter named JoJo - yeah, just the guy I want skippering a high speed boat at night in a busy harbour.

This is starting to sound like the finals of the Darwin Awards.


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## miatapaul (Dec 15, 2006)

Picture of the "captain"










Looks like he likes to party a bit heavy. But I do find the text from the NY Daily News to be a bit strange(but that is normal for the Daily):


> The skipper of the 19-foot Stingray bowrider - Jojo John, 35, of Nyack, N.Y., a banker at JPMorgan -has been charged with vehicular manslaughter and vehicular assault. Cops say he was intoxicated.
> 
> Read more: Hudson River speedboat crash: Body of would-be best man found; skipper, charged with manslaughter, has drug priors - NY Daily News


Another article said they were waiting on the blood tests before charging with BWI. I wonder what he really does at JPMorgan. Certanly a "Stingray 19" does not seem like the toy of a "banker" as he was described in one article.


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## bubb2 (Nov 9, 2002)

miatapaul said:


> I wonder what he really does at JPMorgan. Certanly a "Stingray 19" does not seem like the toy of a "banker" as he was described in one article.


I wonder also. In another article it was stated he has a felony drug convection from 2010. Going back to my insurance days, you can't write a surety bond on a convicted felon. Being bondable is paramount at a bank, just sayin'.


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## miatapaul (Dec 15, 2006)

bubb2 said:


> I wonder also. In another article it was stated he has a felony drug convection from 2010. Going back to my insurance days, you can't write a surety bond on a convicted felon. Being bondable is paramount at a bank, just sayin'.


Yes, that was why I did not think the title "banker" was correct. but newspapers these days don't have anyone left on their staffs left to do any fact checking. Perhaps they have a secret felon training program, you know as they seem like they would make good executives some day, being that they have the same morals. :laugher

Do you have your boat in the water this season?


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## SchockT (May 21, 2012)

The other night I was out for one of my midnight strolls down to the beautiful little waterfront park near my house. Normally at that time it is extremely quiet, but this time I could hear loud music and partying. I wandered down to the dock to see a couple of 20ish foot boats coming towards the boat ramp, lit up like christmas trees, music cranked, over loaded with drunks. They were coming back from watching the fireworks competition that happened a couple of hours before. Somebody backed a trailer down the launch, and one of the boats proceeded to drive straight onto the trailer while the party continued on board. He actually got himself onto the trailer pretty well, (much to my disappointment!) but his passengers all stumbled forward when the boat came to a sudden stop. They winched the boat a bit further onto the trailer and then hauled the boat up the ramp. Music still cranked, passengers oblivious! One guy decided it was time to get off the boat and tried to climb off just as the driver accelerated. I'm sure he has some road rash and bruises to show for that move!

I can only hope that at least the skipper was sober, but I doubt it very much! Sadly those yahoos were one of hundreds of boats just like that, out watching the fireworks on the water and then heading home at full throttle to show how cool they are! And not a single pfd to be seen.

It's a wonder there aren't more fatalities...


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## kellysails (Nov 1, 2008)

OK, so I have an example where two sailboats at the same time wanted to put the fear of God into me this weekend. Yesterday was just beautiful out in the Puget Sound. Clipping along closed hauled nicely in 13 knots of wind (unique wind for the Sound in the Summer) and two sailboats decided that in all of the Puget Sound they wanted to cross my bow with little room to spare at the same time. We were on strd tack, one boat was on a port tack, and we were leeward of the second boat. Because they were coming from different directions I could not fall off one without hitting the other. A quick tack was also a bit close. So guess who had to de-power, yes me, jeeze, pissed me off. The port tack boat was close enough that we had a "nice" chat about Col-Regs as he flew by. A decent enough Canadian guy who called me on the radio to apologize. Funny enough, once we were docked he came into our marina as a guest. He came over to the boat to apologize again. 

We now two new entries into our log book back page


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## arvicola-amphibius (Apr 14, 2012)

That's what sets sailors apart - generally. He made a mistake, he admitted it and apologised.
A POWER boat skipper more likely would never admit to a mistake and would probably add insult to injury by flipping you the bird. If he was even aware of your existence...... 
Usually you only see aggression from yachties when they are racing. The best thing then is to keep clear because some really do take it seriously if you stray across their course. A shout from you of "STARBOARD" could even be met with "P*** OFF WE ARE RACING" and in extreme cases a collision. I recently raced with just such a skipper and even though he was on port tack and I warned him of the other boat he deliberately side-swiped it despite it having right of way. The other boat was also racing but in a different division for smaller boats. Not nice. I probably won't crew for him again because he just takes it all too seriously. For him, every race is the America's Cup.


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

kellysails said:


> OK, so I have an example where two sailboats at the same time wanted to put the fear of God into me this weekend. Yesterday was just beautiful out in the Puget Sound. Clipping along closed hauled nicely in 13 knots of wind (unique wind for the Sound in the Summer) and two sailboats decided that in all of the Puget Sound they wanted to cross my bow with little room to spare at the same time. We were on strd tack, one boat was on a port tack, and we were leeward of the second boat. Because they were coming from different directions I could not fall off one without hitting the other. A quick tack was also a bit close. So guess who had to de-power, yes me, jeeze, pissed me off. The port tack boat was close enough that we had a "nice" chat about Col-Regs as he flew by. A decent enough Canadian guy who called me on the radio to apologize. Funny enough, once we were docked he came into our marina as a guest. He came over to the boat to apologize again.
> 
> We now two new entries into our log book back page


Since he was Canadian, he would have said "sorry" even if it *was* your fault so that doesn't prove anything. 

I'm not convinced - a Canadian would never do anything so rude - I think it MUST have been you - or that OTHER American boat.


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## SloopJonB (Jun 6, 2011)

arvicola-amphibius said:


> That's what sets sailors apart - generally. He made a mistake, he admitted it and apologised.
> A POWER boat skipper more likely would never admit to a mistake and would probably add insult to injury by flipping you the bird. If he was even aware of your existence......
> Usually you only see aggression from yachties when they are racing. The best thing then is to keep clear because some really do take it seriously if you stray across their course. A shout from you of "STARBOARD" could even be met with "P*** OFF WE ARE RACING" and in extreme cases a collision. I recently raced with just such a skipper and even though he was on port tack and I warned him of the other boat he deliberately side-swiped it despite it having right of way. The other boat was also racing but in a different division for smaller boats. Not nice. I probably won't crew for him again because he just takes it all too seriously. For him, every race is the America's Cup.


That's not taking it too seriously, that's just being an a$$hole. He should buy a coke smuggler - he'd feel much more at home in that world.


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## TJC45 (Jul 10, 2013)

I was invited to join a group of racers for their friendly thursday night series. "Nothing serious, just some friendly buoy racing. Or so i was told. So, i take up the offer but am held up big time in traffic. i arrive at the dock too late to jump on a boat as crew and decide to watch from the club house. As the racing finishes up i hang by the crane to help lift the J24s out of the water. I back away as the first boats arrive with members of both crews in a shouting match of eff this and eff that. I stand back as another skipper sails in and joins the eff you chorus. By the time it was done there were more than a dozen pissed off people effing this and that while throwing the rule book at each other. Not what i signed up for! I got in my car and left. A day later the guy who had extended the offer called. We talked. He admitted that a few of the skippers and others take things a little more seriously than others. Yeah, I got that. Pass!!!! It's a beer can race, who needs that?


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## kellysails (Nov 1, 2008)

SloopJonB said:


> Since he was Canadian, he would have said "sorry" even if it *was* your fault so that doesn't prove anything.
> 
> I'm not convinced - a Canadian would never do anything so rude - I think it MUST have been you - or that OTHER American boat.


He did admit he was in the wrong. He had a heck of a run up Colvos Passage just prior to our incident. He was stuck in the middle of a club race and he spent a couple of hours avoiding very aggressive racers. He said he was a bit on edge from the experience when he happened by our boat.

He told me he was retired from the RCN after 30+ years, as an engineer. He joked that "he spent very little time in the bridge", my retort was "yup". We had a good laugh about it. I will certainly give wider berth to those light green RCN warships from now on

Really nice guy and a standup type fellow. I appreciate that.

Sea Squirrel still has an entry in my log book though.


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## TakeFive (Oct 22, 2009)

Looks like these were taken at the eastern entrance to the C&D canal. Both were posted to different Facebook accounts today. Note that it's two different boats - on the same day?:


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## mad_machine (Dec 16, 2012)

same boat.. it just looks different because the blue bottom comes up under the swimplatform


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## JonEisberg (Dec 3, 2010)

FWIW, I entered the canal last night at about 2200, after riding the flood up from Cape May... That jetty was completely awash/underwater, something I usually don't see...

The RR lift bridge at Summit was also lowered, I think that's the first time I've seen a train cross that thing in _decades_...

While headed up the bay earlier, I passed a Bristol Channel Cutter headed downbound... The thing was equipped with a freakin' _Leisure-Furl boom_...

A Leisure-Furl on a 28' BCC??? I think it is safe to say, I have now seen _EVERYTHING_ there is to be seen under the sun...


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## TJC45 (Jul 10, 2013)

Seeing boats hung up on a jetty was a more less common site years ago at Barnaget Inlet. The North jetty disappeared for a few hundred feet at high tide only to reappear for another few hundred feet near it's ocean end. I never heard of any injuries from hitting the jetty but it wrecked a lot of boats. Being a Boston Whaler fan ( is there a 12 step program?) I was saddened to see a brand spanking new 28 foot BW hauled up on the rocks one day. First time in new boat for a new skipper. There was a hard lesson!!! Being a BW, once it was hauled off the jetty it was able to make it's own way back to the dealership 10 miles south. More amazing in that both outboard motors were also severly damaged. Those Boston Whalers, they do take a licking!!!


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## JonEisberg (Dec 3, 2010)

TJC45 said:


> Seeing boats hung up on a jetty was a more less common site years ago at Barnaget Inlet. The North jetty disappeared for a few hundred feet at high tide only to reappear for another few hundred feet near it's ocean end. I never heard of any injuries from hitting the jetty but it wrecked a lot of boats. Being a Boston Whaler fan ( is there a 12 step program?) I was saddened to see a brand spanking new 28 foot BW hauled up on the rocks one day. First time in new boat for a new skipper. There was a hard lesson!!! Being a BW, once it was hauled off the jetty it was able to make it's own way back to the dealership 10 miles south. More amazing in that both outboard motors were also severly damaged. Those Boston Whalers, they do take a licking!!!


Not just powerboats have been caught out by the North Jetty at Barnegat, a beautifully restored Alden Challenger on her maiden voyage was sunk there 2 years ago...

http://www.sailnet.com/forums/gener...ated/79800-boat-sinks-off-barnegat-inlet.html


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## TJC45 (Jul 10, 2013)

JonEisberg said:


> Not just powerboats have been caught out by the North Jetty at Barnegat, a beautifully restored Alden Challenger on her maiden voyage was sunk there 2 years ago...
> 
> http://www.sailnet.com/forums/gener...ated/79800-boat-sinks-off-barnegat-inlet.html


Ouch!!!! That's sad. looks like foggy conditions in the pic. It is a dangerous inlet regardless! Even more amazing is the fact that commercial fishing boats have been lost in this inlet. The Pro's so to speak.

Before it was rebuilt it was even worse. The south jetty ( on the left side of the pic) ran out at about a 45 degree angle to the shore line. The prevailing wind is southwest so the sea just roared in when the wind was up. Huge breakers in the inlet were not an uncommon site. While it was, on many days. a fun place to play with the Hobies, it was anything but fun for other boaters. it doesn't help that the entrance channel from the ocean side hugs the north jetty.

Though the Whaler in my story was outward bound and cut across the jetty, it is more common for southbound boats entering from the ocean to not see or not know there is a jetty under that water. add in some poor vis or running the inlet at night.

Another problem with this inlet is the likelihood of high following seas. Things can get steep with the wrong combo of wind, tidal current. This inlet has mean reputation for a reason.

OTOH it is a knock out Striper fishing location!!!! That's Rock fish to you Maryland boys!


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## mad_machine (Dec 16, 2012)

what is really sad.. that is one of the better inlets in NJ. We are blessed with many that completely impassable


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