# Sailing single handed best size, not brand



## warren5421 (Jan 9, 2014)

Looking to move up from 25' lake sailing to the Atlantic. Would like to hear idea's on length from 32' to 40' on single sailing. Most sailing will be done in Maine cost with a month or two in the Caribbean during the cold. Right now it looks like I'll be single handing 75%-80% of the time. Will have a pro teach me some of what I don't know about blue water sailing for a month or two then I hope I can pick up the rest without sinking.


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## Don L (Aug 8, 2008)

No real difference between single handling a 32' or a 40' boat.


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## killarney_sailor (May 4, 2006)

It is not so much the size of the boat that matters as much as how it is set up for single-handing. Also it depends on where the boat is stored. Depending on winds and currents and the closeness of neighbours - docking or mooring can be the biggest challenge. My boat is 45' and close to 20 tons and my wife (or I) can single hand it quite easily when sailing - furling jib and main, very big winches. Docking alone can be a huge challenge. You have to get it dead right because it is just so big you aren't going to be able to jump on the dock and horse it into position.


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## MarkofSeaLife (Nov 7, 2010)

I single hand a 39 footer and its WAY too small.
I would like a 50 to 54 footer.


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## hotdogs (Mar 5, 2008)

I think this is going to depend somewhat on where and how you plan to operate the boat. Overall, at least for me, sailing is the easy part and docking/mooring is what produces stress.

As the boat gets larger, I quickly lose the ability to 'muscle' boats into position at the pier. Small errors while docking are harder to correct and require more care in my approach. I sometimes struggle if I am on the windward side when leaving the pier (though this may say more about my skill with springlines than anything else).

Probably the best way to answer this question is to singlehand a variety of boat sizes. You may find that your comfort level stops at a particular length.


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## hpeer (May 14, 2005)

This guy likes a heavy 35' cutter. Devotes a chapter to it.

Singlehanded Sailing: The Experiences and Techniques of the Lone Voyagers: Richard Henderson: 9780070281646: Amazon.com: [email protected]@[email protected]@http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/[email protected]@[email protected]@51GpeUulGhL

I learned sailing ( such as I know it) n a heavy 33'er, solo.

I have soloed a heavy 44'er for 4,0000 miles, thereabouts.

I think getting a boat ready, set up for single handing on extended passages takes some thought, effort, and money. Well worth it, interesting, expensive.


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## BarryL (Aug 21, 2003)

Hey,

Is going to be just you on the boat (the definition of single handing) or just you sailing the boat and then a bunch more people coming aboard when you reach your destination? If just you, then I think that a 30' boat would be more than big enough. The smaller boat will be cheaper to buy, cheaper to maintain, easier to maintain, easier to sail, easier to dock, easier to reef, easier to anchor, easier to depart a slip, etc.

I can't think of why a single handler would need a 40'. A 30' gets you plenty of interior space, storage, galley and head size, etc.

I would want something well made, from a manufacturer with a good reputation, and common enough to make obtaining parts and advice easy. Boats like Sabre and Tartan come to mind. 

You didn't list a budget so that's about all I can do for now.

Barry


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## slax (Feb 17, 2013)

I think very much like the "safety - speed - comfort" ratios of finding your fit in a boat (keel design, sail displacement, helm, etc.) finding the right "size" of boat for single handing is a trade off with several trade-offs involved. eg: not one single answer will be right aside from yours when you make it.

Assuming the infrastructure is in place to singlehand(lines run aft, winches(if needed), etc) The main factors around specifically size and comfort handling solo imo are:

Environment: general inclination of weather, wind direction, dockage/mooring location

Experience: not with sizes persay but with designs and how they sail under different environmental conditions

Use case: day sailing, cruising, extended cruising, racing, sunny days, like beating hard into the wind, etc.. 

I think all these play a very important role in the comfort level with a vessel regardless of size, but when getting into single handing in a variety of environments and the spectrum of possible weather in any given area I believe these to be of critical import. Personally I have cut days short, extended them, or not gone out because I could not in the current weather conditions manage either pushing off or docking alone. If you are aware and flexible enough to take all these things into account, I think you can definitely manage a wide range of "waterliine feet". 

just my .02$

cheers,
~slax


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## harmonic (Sep 10, 2013)

Problems on boats increase with size bigger boats bigger issues,I can store 3 months provisions on my 32 footer which is any amount,larger boats are more comfortable and sail faster.But the sails are bigger engine is bigger docking fees bigger.And they can be a handful in confined areas.The main thing for singlehanding is to know your boat,get reefing sorted before you go out and have a good wind vane,Enjoy your sailing.


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## Jeff_H (Feb 26, 2000)

As you have seen, your question is pretty much the kind of "how long is a piece of string?" question which is bound to elicit a a diversity of seemingly contradictory answers. The mutually exclusive seeming responses above reflects the fact that there is no one simple answer that applies to each and everyone who might ask this question. The one right answer for has to start with your own tastes, goals, venue, needs, sailing and physical capability. 

There is bound to be disagreement on Even how to measure an answer of 'how big?'. To me the best measure of the ease of handling, seaworthiness, motion comfort, carrying capacity, starts with a boat's displacement. Historically, single-handed cruisers typically fell within a displacement range of 5,500 to 12,000 lbs. With modern sail-handling and boat handling hardware, that displacement range has grown tremendously. But that expanded displacement range comes with a price tag; a price of greater complexity, maintenance, and cost. 

And at whatever displacement meets your needs, within reason, the boat with the longest waterline at that displacement will generally offer the best balance of performance, ease of handling, seaworthiness, carrying capacity, and motion comfort. In my experience the easiest single-handers have a design L/D less than 200, with a sweetspot somewhere a around 160 or so. 

Then comes rig choices. While traditionalists lean towards cutter and ketches, if preformance and ease of handling is important, than a fractional rigged sloop, with its smaller headsails and ease of powering up and down, makes an ideal rig. In my mind, the ideal single-handed has a SA/D in excess of 20 or so with 22 being a sweet spot due to the ability to get by across a wider wind range with fewer sail changes and non-overlapping jibs. 

Stability is also of key importance to a single-hander since it allows the boat to carry its sail area through a wider wind range. As is an easily driven hull form. The combination of an easily driven hull and lots of stability help at both ends of the wind range. 

For me, these numbers resulted in an 10,600 lb., 38 foot boat with a L/D of 165, and a SA/D around 23, a 38% ballast ratio, 6'-4" draft which I find to be a very easy boat to single-hand. 

Then comes sail handling gear. This is also a very controversial topic. After single-handing for over 50 years in a wide range of conditions, I am a firm believer in having all if the control lines (including halyards and reeling gear) within easy reach of the helm. But to put that opinion in perspective, Jon Eisberg and SVAudacious, who are probably two of the most accomplished single-handers on this forum, prefer the halyards and much of the control lines at the mast. The point being that there is not a one size fits all answer on this.


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## Don L (Aug 8, 2008)

Jeff_H said:


> With modern sail-handling and boat handling hardware, that displacement range has grown tremendously. But that expanded displacement range comes with a price tag; a price of greater complexity, .


I always wonder how a winch and furling head sail gets "greater complexity" on a 45' boat over a 32' boat. 

I've never been on a boat smaller than 33' so maybe I just don't understand that they sail themselves.


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## warren5421 (Jan 9, 2014)

I will be by myself most of the time. Maybe a grandkid some in the summer. Had not thought about not being able to push a 40' around docking and all. I'm use to a small space but on the lake you are always close to a store so food and water is easy to keep topped off. Sounds like for me a 32-34 would be better. After hearing more pro and cons I'll start looking at some brands. I like the Morris but would rather spend less. Some advice I have been given is get a skeg hung rudder and a long fin keel. The boat should be a stiff boat, not sure how you determine that. I do know it will be a used boat that I buy as I fell I'll get more boat for the money.


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## Jeff_H (Feb 26, 2000)

Don0190 said:


> I always wonder how a winch and furling head sail gets "greater complexity" on a 45' boat over a 32' boat.
> 
> I've never been on a boat smaller than 33' so maybe I just don't understand that they sail themselves.


The rigging and sail loads on a smaller displacement boat generally will be considerably smaller. Where a 11,000 lb or less displacement boat might get by with a cascade vang, and backstay adjuster, one or two speed winches and so on, as you start getting above that range, to maintain a similar ease of operation and performance, such items as hydraulic back stays, rigid vangs, three speed primary or even electric winches start to become compelling. Automated steering migrates from simple tiller pilots and vanes, to wheel pilots, to electric Rams to hydraulic rams. Where a smaller boat can be manhandled, as boats get larger, there is a point a which when something goes wrong, all a person can do is to get out of the way to avoid getting injured or rely on mechanical devices like thrusters.

So while small displacement boats can't sail themselves, the smaller loads and smaller required mechanical advantage make them easier to sail.

Jeff


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## Don L (Aug 8, 2008)

so NOT more complex, just bigger


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## slax (Feb 17, 2013)

ehh.. bigger means more complex. systems involve more components, more moving parts, more weight, probably by definition more complex.


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## krisscross (Feb 22, 2013)

warren5421 said:


> I like the Morris but would rather spend less.


Can't go wrong with Morris if you can afford it initially. Excellent quality, great design, and the boat will hold it's value 20 years down the road.


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## travlin-easy (Dec 24, 2010)

I agree with much of what Jeff said about this subject. I sail single handed most of the time, my boat is beamy, somewhat heavy, however, my jib is just 100 percent, which works fine for me, especially when I have to do a lot of quick, tight tacking. Once I trim the sails in the ocean, I lock the rudder and the boat tracks like it has an auto=pilot, which is doesn't have yet. Those heavy, old beamy, full-keeled boats measuring 33 to 40 feet are perfect for a single handed sailor, at least for this old codger.

Good luck,

Gary


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## Jeff_H (Feb 26, 2000)

warren5421 said:


> Sounds like for me a 32-34 would be better. After hearing more pro and cons I'll start looking at some brands. I like the Morris but would rather spend less. Some advice I have been given is get a skeg hung rudder and a long fin keel. The boat should be a stiff boat, not sure how you determine that. I do know it will be a used boat that I buy as I fell I'll get more boat for the money.


32 to 34 feet is a nice range for a single-hander. Big enough to stand up to weather, provide a stable platform, provide decent carrying capacity, have decent performance yet not too large to be easily handled.

A long keel and skeg hung rudder gives up a little performance in exchange for an easier design to engineer robustly. But a longer fin keel and a skeg rudder does not necessarily improve tracking ability. When you talk about boats in that generally balance is more critical than tracking. It's the ability of the sails to balance against the keel in changing wind speeds that shapes how easy that the boat holds its course.

Another factor that impacts directional stability is waterline length. A boat with a proportionately long waterline relative to its sail plan and length on deck, and a fine bow will generally hold its course better than a boat with a shorter waterline.

Strictly speaking, you probably don't want a stiff boat, meaning a boat with a lot of form stability since too much form stabile can result in unpredictable motion. I would suggest that a better choice would be a boat with a moderate amount of form stability-and ballasted stability producing reasonably high stability at small heel angles and o reasonably high angle of vanishing stability.

And yes a used boat will generally provide a more boat for the dollar.

Good hunting 
Jeff


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## mad_machine (Dec 16, 2012)

if I were single-handing I would not want a boat I could not "manhandle" the controls if the worst were to happen. Just imagine a serious power failure when you depend on electric winches, hydraulic rams on the backstay, and bow thrusters to steer.

As a singlehander, I would also want a boat with an easy motion. You are going to be doing all the work, standing all the watches, and doing all the cooking, cleaning, and maintenance, no reason to have to do all that -and- get beaten up by how your boat moves through the water


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## capta (Jun 27, 2011)

There is always the school of thought that my friend Mark subscribes to; bigger is better.
For those who really want comfort single handing at sea, one could follow in the footsteps of Alan Colas and sail a 236' schooner, alone. Of course cruising permits and docking fees would be a bit on the expensive side, but you probably wouldn't have to sleep in the same bunk twice in a month.


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## JonEisberg (Dec 3, 2010)

slax said:


> ehh.. bigger means more complex. systems involve more components, more moving parts, more weight, probably by definition more complex.


Yup, Jeff has it right, as usual... At least in my experience, the larger the boat, invariably the more complex they become, and the more dependent they are on keeping the electrons flowing... That's just the way it is, at least in my little world... ;-)


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## Waterrat (Sep 8, 2007)

Tiller over a wheel. 
_
Singlehanded Sailing: Thoughts, Tips, Techniques & Tactics _Author Andrew Evens gives a very thoughtful and concise reasoning on why tiller over wheel for single handed sailing. Justin


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## capecodda (Oct 6, 2009)

We've had big and small. Biggest was 52, smallest 22, current 38. Yes, we like Morris obviously, but you didn't ask for commentary on builders.

I could single hand the 52 when everything worked. Power winches, power in mast furling, big windlass with all chain, and bow thruster. Piece o cake, until something broke. And everything eventually did at one time or another. When the headsail furler came apart in Cape Bretton, I was very happy to have crew on board to help me get the jib down. The dead weight of the jib in the sail bag exceeded my ability to move it.

I really like single handing the 38, fractional rig. Small jib, all lines lead aft, I can tack without a winch handle if I time it well. Can reef without going on deck with lines lead aft (controversial amongst some). Fully battened main is very forgiving. No bow thruster, no problem. I could even muscle the anchor up if the windlass failed in a pinch. And I can bend on sails and carry them around myself.

Bottom line, I'm of the thought that you should cruise in the smallest, simplest boat you can stand to live on. Don't get me wrong, the comforts of size are really nice. But the complexity of systems goes up, and you end up fixing your stuff in exotic locations, and taking on crew when maybe you don't want to. 

And stuff breaks. All the time. If you're going to pay someone to fix it, you loose time and money, if your going to fix it yourself you loose time and a little less money. But time is all we got, and having your head in the bilge on a fine sailing day isn't our idea of cruising.

Now the question is, how small can you stand to live on. That question is a very individual one that only you can answer.


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## Ajax_MD (Nov 24, 2009)

30 feet and 9,000lbs. was my personal "magic number".

For sure, Jeff is right that a fractional rig would have made my life easier with grinding in large, overlapping genoas but otherwise, I think I got it right.

The length and displacement are easy enough to manhandle into the slip, even in adverse conditions.
Loads on running rigging are manageable and don't require massive, overpriced deck hardware.
Fin keel and tiller for responsiveness and maneuverability.
Reasonable light air performance.
Fairly safe heavy air behaviors as well.

My boat's not a blue-water boat though.


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## SailingJackson (Jan 1, 2011)

Jeff_H said:


> .... In my experience the easiest single-handers have a design L/D less than 200, with a sweetspot somewhere a around 160 or so.
> 
> Then comes rig choices. While traditionalists lean towards cutter and ketches, if preformance and ease of handling is important, than a fractional rigged sloop, with its smaller headsails and ease of powering up and down, makes an ideal rig. In my mind, the ideal single-handed has a SA/D in excess of 20 or so with 22 being a sweet spot due to the ability to get by across a wider wind range with fewer sail changes and non-overlapping jibs.
> 
> .....


Perhaps you meant to say D/L, and 160 to 200 seem fine, but SA/D of 23? Seems like only the racing sleds go that far. Are you including downwind sails for the SA/D number? Perhaps the OP was directed toward racing?

While there can be discussion about these numbers, I certainly do think that the question should be approached by looking at these sorts of numbers. The answer to the question is not brand of boat, size of boat. The answer to the question comes from considering where, in the tradeoffs of design parameters, has the architect directed his design intentions.

GTJ


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## warren5421 (Jan 9, 2014)

Don't plan on racing, just enjoying myself. My ideal is away from loads of boats and people. I'll be looking at 2-7 days down the outside coast then back. Bad weather I'll find a harbor to set in till it clears. No job, no wife, and nowhere to be at a given time. It's time for the kids to wonder what dad is doing, not dad wondering what they are doing.


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## SailingJackson (Jan 1, 2011)

warren5421 said:


> Don't plan on racing, just enjoying myself. My ideal is away from loads of boats and people. I'll be looking at 2-7 days down the outside coast then back. Bad weather I'll find a harbor to set in till it clears. No job, no wife, and nowhere to be at a given time. It's time for the kids to wonder what dad is doing, not dad wondering what they are doing.


Then look for a D/L of 200 to 160, an SA/D of 18 to 17, and a Motion Comfort Ratio of 25 or more. Don't worry too much about the SA/D as you can always reef early.

If the boat is rigged correctly you'll likely find that issues with single handed sailing are more about docking or rigging big downwind sails. Jib and main are easy, even on a big boat. Just reef early and avoid large overlapping genoa in crowded harbors.

I solo sail a lot, and I'm shopping for a 42' to 45' boat. Looking for a little more creature comfort than my 36' has to offer.

GTJ


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## TQA (Apr 4, 2009)

I am on my forever boat which I single hand about half the year It is a light 44 ft cutter. It is about the biggest I feel I can handle. By this I mean I could recover the anchor or wrestle the mainsail down below by hand if I had to.

I would be happy on 38 ft and OK on 36 ft. 

Why did I go for her? Headroom, water tankage, speed and a comfortable motion. I also liked her the first time I saw her.


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## smurphny (Feb 20, 2009)

One thing that makes going from 35-45'+ considerably different is the sheer weight of things. If not rigged to take the manual dimension out of the equation, just dealing with muscling larger sails, longer and larger lines, more weight when tying up, a larger anchor, etc. are definite considerations. All these things can be automated but it requires more complicated equipment. Also, the prices per foot for dockage, storage, maintenance, etc. are all proportionally larger. I decided that 35' (instead of a 40 footer at the time) was the largest basic boat I wanted to try to single-hand on a regular basis.


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## Jeff_H (Feb 26, 2000)

SailingJackson said:


> Perhaps you meant to say D/L, and 160 to 200 seem fine, but SA/D of 23? Seems like only the racing sleds go that far. Are you including downwind sails for the SA/D number? Perhaps the OP was directed toward racing?
> 
> GTJ


That SA/D of around 23 is based on 100% foretriangle which works well when coupled with a fractional rig. It allows a sail plan that does not require overlapping headsails but can be depowered rather than reefed or rather than furled in building breezes. It allows a single jib with a very wide wind range perhaps 25kts without being furled.

With a smaller SA/D you are stuck with more sail area in a less efficient Genoa that is way harder to tack and needs to be furled sooner resulting in a less efficient sail shape.

That is why I suggested 23 as ideal for single-hander.
Jeff


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## outbound (Dec 3, 2012)

As always it's hard to argue what Jeff says. Been living on a 46' boat since July mostly by myself and would note.
Sailing
The one dependency is on the AP. Tacking easily -Vanes don't allow this nor do they work well when under power, needing to make a channel etc. Give it the auto tack signal or hit the 10 degree button a few times it easy to tack by yourself on any boat if the lazy sheet is tight when you start and you have good technique you don't need to winch. I have electric winches but they are two speed so not dependent on them. Juice goes not a big deal. Many of my sistership just have one electric for the main halyard. Technique not strength or size matter most.
Gybing is another matter. You have difficulty pulling in the main and playing the jib sheets. The AP can do the steering. I chicken gybe. Sure it's ugly but not dangerous.
I have the various paraphernalia . Its great for that last bit on sail trim. If the vang broke or the backstay leaked the boat would still sail. Not a biggy and probably less so on a masthead boat.
Jeff makes a good case for a fractional rigged boat. I have a masthead Solent rig with a dutchman. I love it and would not change. Even with other sailors on the boat we usually take turns singling.
Living
Boats get small in a big ocean.
Transits are longer in a smaller boat.
The amount of snuff you need to bring with you amazes me and the list is growing.
Comfort and rest make for good decisions.
Boat spends most of its time stationary. Then live in the master in the front. Having a quarterberth and one berth to leeward always means no leeclothes under way.
Docking
This is a bugaboo. No getting around it. Moorings and anchoring not so much. There have been times when I've stayed put for fear of this. Still with a bow thruster its not so bad. The side power has yet to disappoint me but if it did I'd just anchor until I could get help or calm conditions ensued.
Windlass blows up- remember you have several power winches so pulling up the anchor is not the end of the world. No electricity when in a difficult situation may mean buying a new rockna and rode or a lot of grinding. You do need to carry at least two anchor/rode set ups anyway and the odds of this is low.
In short I don't think size matters until you get over 50'. Then you can't even pick up the mainsail to bring to the sailmaker.


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## svzephyr44 (Jun 26, 2000)

I concur with Outbound. With a lot of attention to the weather and a firm belief in "reef early, reef often" I can handle my 13 ton 42' sailboat in the ocean. Its the last 5 yards to the dock. I too avoid going into a dock when the winds are up. The one piece of equipment I don't have is a bow thruster. Getting one is currently not in the budget.

I have been caught out in high winds when I could do nothing other than dump and run and pray. I think that the situation would have been the same in a smaller boat. When the wind hits 40 knots - as it can easily do in a thunderstorm - only the Incredible Hulk is going to be strong enough to handle the lines.

Fair winds and following seas


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## blt2ski (May 5, 2005)

When you get days of sailing in winds less than 10 knots, that 23-1 SA/Disp can be a nice number to have. 18-1 you will be going backwards with the tides depending upon where you sail. Here in Puget sound, 25-1 would be my sweet spot, with and easy reef or equal in the main down to 20-1 as the wind pipes up above 15. Whic is frequent, but infrequent enough to not worry too much about it.

My 02 on the subject......

Marty


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## SailingJackson (Jan 1, 2011)

blt2ski said:


> When you get days of sailing in winds less than 10 knots, that 23-1 SA/Disp can be a nice number to have. 18-1 you will be going backwards with the tides depending upon where you sail. Here in Puget sound, 25-1 would be my sweet spot, with and easy reef or equal in the main down to 20-1 as the wind pipes up above 15. Whic is frequent, but infrequent enough to not worry too much about it.
> 
> My 02 on the subject......
> 
> Marty


What sorts of boats are you talking about? Very few of the J boats, X Yachts, or French boats get anywhere near those numbers. Outside of dedicated race boats the typical numbers are more like 18 or 19.
GJ


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## TQA (Apr 4, 2009)

Jeff_H said:


> That SA/D of around 23 is based on 100% foretriangle which works well when coupled with a fractional rig. It allows a sail plan that does not require overlapping headsails but can be depowered rather than reefed or rather than furled in building breezes. It allows a single jib with a very wide wind range perhaps 25kts without being furled.
> 
> With a smaller SA/D you are stuck with more sail area in a less efficient Genoa that is way harder to tack and needs to be furled sooner resulting in a less efficient sail shape.
> 
> ...


Surely a cutter gives you most of the above AND a big hard pulling genoa. I am a cruiser I don't get involved in light wind tacking duels in fact not in tacking duels of any sort. In my sort of sailing I tack on Tuesdays.

If I ever need to work my way to windward then I roll the genoa away and work with the staysail and main. The main self tacks and I can get the staysail sheeted in by hand in 15 knots, more than that and I will need to winch the last foot or so.

I understand why fractional rigs are great for racing with bendy masts but that needs backstay tensioners and checkstays maybe even baby stays.

Too complex for this old cruiser. My mast is like a telegraph pole no bending has been observed.


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## blt2ski (May 5, 2005)

SailingJackson said:


> What sorts of boats are you talking about? Very few of the J boats, X Yachts, or French boats get anywhere near those numbers. Outside of dedicated race boats the typical numbers are more like 18 or 19.
> GJ


Some of the recent European cruisers are in the 19 to 21-1 range. Add a Code Zero and you can get into the mid 20-1 range. Salona and Dehler IIRC both have boats that get into the low to mid 20 range Jeff and I are discussing. Hanse is not too bad either with std fractional main and jib option. Jeanneau's are typically 19-20 with a std pkg, less than 18 with an RF main, and around 21-1 with a performance pkg.

My mast head rig is in just shy of 25-1 with a 155 up. A taller mast by 3-5', foot or so longer boom, and I could get into the mid 20 range with a 110 jib and mainsail. That would be a lot easier to handle than a BI genoa, or code 0 setup. altho a code 0 might not be too bad of on a furler. YOu can furl to tack, then unfurl on the other side. More work that I would like to do.

Marty


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## chuck5499 (Aug 31, 2003)

my first year out i single handed a jeanneau ds40 from miami to hadley harbor maine and back. no issues. did open ocean, part of the icw, solo docking and anchoring. 

we have furling main and huge jib. every thing except dropping the hook is done from the cockpit. a/p runs the boat a lot but you do have to think ahead and plan what you want to do. 

i would not be fearful of sailing this boat anywhere single handed as she is set up for it.


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## Don L (Aug 8, 2008)

warren5421 said:


> Looking to move up from 25' lake sailing to the Atlantic. Would like to hear idea's on length from 32' to 40' on single sailing. Most sailing will be done in Maine cost with a month or two in the Caribbean during the cold. Right now it looks like I'll be single handing 75%-80% of the time. Will have a pro teach me some of what I don't know about blue water sailing for a month or two then I hope I can pick up the rest without sinking.


The real question isn't what the best size boat is to single hand, the question should be what size boat would be best for your overall boat use plans.

People spent too much time over thinking the sailing portion of a cruising boat. As an example do you really want to spend 75% of your time in a dark living unfriendly boat just to have a boat that might be "better" for sailing in conditions that you are mostly going to just avoid (cruisers choose their weather windows most of the time)?


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## FoolishMuse (Oct 12, 2006)

In my singlehanded book I talk a lot about sail handling. I even mention that the book is written for boats in the 20' - 40' range, because over that range the forces, and handling skills involved are much different. For example you can easily launch and douse the chute on a 35' boat in any weather without a sock (and I hate socks) but if you get up to a 45' boat, then you are into a different game altogether. Likewise when you talk about dousing a #1 down to the deck on a 35' boat, this is managable. On a 45' boat, it is a challenge. And look at the mainsail. Think of gybing the main in 25 knot winds. On a smaller boat you can still swing it over by hand. On a bigger boat it must be ground in - not a lot of fun.

So, since you will be spending a lot of your effort on sail handling every single time you leave the dock, and you have to be able to do it in any weather. (forget anyone who says you won't be sailing in bad weather/big winds. If you are avoiding that weather, then you are avoiding the best part of sailing) Then I would personally recommend that for a typical singlehander, boats in the 35' range would offer the best combination of size/comfort and sail handling ability. Once you get to 40' and above you are into a different set of forces.


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## JonEisberg (Dec 3, 2010)

FoolishMuse said:


> In my singlehanded book I talk a lot about sail handling. I even mention that the book is written for boats in the 20' - 40' range, because over that range the forces, and handling skills involved are much different. For example you can easily launch and douse the chute on a 35' boat in any weather without a sock (and I hate socks) but if you get up to a 45' boat, then you are into a different game altogether. Likewise when you talk about dousing a #1 down to the deck on a 35' boat, this is managable. On a 45' boat, it is a challenge. And look at the mainsail. Think of gybing the main in 25 knot winds. On a smaller boat you can still swing it over by hand. On a bigger boat it must be ground in - not a lot of fun.
> 
> So, since you will be spending a lot of your effort on sail handling every single time you leave the dock, and you have to be able to do it in any weather. (forget anyone who says you won't be sailing in bad weather/big winds. If you are avoiding that weather, then you are avoiding the best part of sailing) Then I would personally recommend that for a typical singlehander, boats in the 35' range would offer the best combination of size/comfort and sail handling ability. Once you get to 40' and above you are into a different set of forces.


Those are my thoughts, as well...

For the type of sailing the OP visualizes as described in Post #26, I can't imagine why he would want, or need, anything much more than 36-38', or thereabouts...


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## outbound (Dec 3, 2012)

Can do the parasail by myself with the AP.

Guess I'm a wimp. Any time I'm out in open ocean wish I had a bigger boat. Any time I'm docking in a cross wind the boats too big.


Still think upper limit should be as big as you can handle with no powered assists. For most that's mid forties. Some some with ultralights may be even higher.


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## Jeff_H (Feb 26, 2000)

This has been a great discussion so far; not because we all agree on one proper approach, but because so many of us are short-handed sailors and single-handers, and yet we each have selected the right boat to meet our own specific tastes, needs, budgets, venues, and sailing styles. And so while we seem to be coming up with wildly divergent and perhaps mutually exclusive recommendations, the useful part of this discussion has been they way that we each have explained our decision making process and the rationale behind our choices and recommendations. Very Cool!

In that vein, I want to address some of the comments which derived from my comments:



TQA said:


> I am a cruiser I don't get involved in light wind tacking duels in fact not in tacking duels of any sort. In my sort of sailing I tack on Tuesdays.
> 
> If I ever need to work my way to windward then I roll the genoa away and work with the staysail and main. The main self tacks and I can get the staysail sheeted in by hand in 15 knots, more than that and I will need to winch the last foot or so.


This comment adds a lot to understanding the differences in how the right decision on a boat is very much influenced by how a person chooses to sail their boat. There is a very big difference in sailing style between 'I tack on Tuesdays' and my sailing style. Neither sailing style is inherently more or less right, but the way that I sail requires a boat which is easy to tack and jibe single-handed and which adapts to changes in windspeed with a minimum of fuss. I hate running the engine choosing to 'voyage under sail. I like to sail off the dock or anchor, short tack up narrow channels, and sail back into my slip ideally without cranking the engine. I want a boat that will sail as well in almost no wind as it will sail in very heavy winds routinely sailing in the lightest of air and will also sail in winds into the high 30 knot range.



TQA said:


> Surely a cutter gives you most of the above AND a big hard pulling genoa. I understand why fractional rigs are great for racing with bendy masts but that needs backstay tensioners and checkstays maybe even baby stays.


Fractional rigs are not about racing. They are all about cruising. Visualize this, the whole idea around a modern fractional rig is that you don't need a big hard pulling genoa because you already have approximately the same sail area but in much more efficient sails, and because you don't have to drag the jib around the jibstay or shrouds, you can tack as easily as you describe tacking your staysail. And because these rigs are easy to depower (reduce the force of the sail rather than its area), you don't have to reef as often, or do headsail changes or furls as frequently, and when you do, you end up with a more efficient smaller sail plan so you heel less and make less leeway.

And the really good news is that you don't need checkstays or babystays if the rig is properly designed. And while an adjustable backstay is important on a fractional to control headstay sag and mast bend, on a boat under 40 or so feet, the adjuster can be a simple cascade block system. With that one backstay adjustement, you can precisely flatten and twist off both the mainsail and the jib, allowing you to avoid reefing for a very wide increase in wind-range with the same sails, just flattening them as the winds build, rounding them for lighter air.

Jeff


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## Pupil2Prodigy (Sep 10, 2014)

wow what a great thread, so much experience and insight


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## aeventyr60 (Jun 29, 2011)

I'm single handing a 44 footer now, a step up from my 37 footer. The biggest difference I am experiencing now is the difference in location of sail controls. Main sheet winch is cabin top mounted and out of reach from the helm, good thing is the traveler is just a hands reach away. The primary winches are a bit far forward to work from the helm as well. A few self tailers would be good. Would like to have the topping lift and outhaul adjustments in the **** pit to.
So far docking has been easy, this thing drives like a sports car. Good amid ship cleats need to be added. The new Muir windlass with wired in remote control with an up and down feature makes anchoring easy too. 
While I've not been in a tacking duel yet, I 'm sure a bit more time on the wheel will sort these little issues out.
The course/rudder position mounted sensor on the autopilot is on the fritz, so when I fabricate a new bracket all will get that much easier. 

All in all, not much more difficult to sail a 7 foot longer boat.

I have not fitted lazy jacks yet, but pulling in the 1st reef aides greatly in taming the main. I did not put in a harbor roll before entering the marina, but tidied everything up in proper fashion once tied to the dock.


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## outbound (Dec 3, 2012)

Come back to this thread to,share some experiences. Previously stated regardless of the size of your boat you should be prepared to be able to single hand it.
Took a couple ( he's been sailing all his life") from cooper island to north sound. It a short sail of half a day. That day it was 25 on the mooring, 35 outside with gusts to 45k awa as we needed to go straight upwind.
He couldn't secure a line, lost the boat hook,over board, flogged the Solent on tacks. He bac talked me when I went out with double reefed main and three rolls left on the Solent wanting to go out with a full jib and no main. Once we hit the strong wind driven waves on top of the ocean swell he got sick. His wife attended to him. I singled from then on. I left them at Bitter End and singled back.
Earlier that month had two young ladies on the boat. As is their common at that age they had too much fun and were paying for it the next day. Winds were moderate so just carried on to the next island.
In short you never know when you will be required to single so be prepared to do so. In the first instance I could harness the sick crew, put him in the wind to leeward staying in the cockpit and have him and his wife not interfere with the function of the boat. You are unlikely to be able to do that on a smaller boat. Also the larger boat sails faster and much more comfortably. Finally things happen a bit slower and gentler during evolutions like tacking so you have less stress. You worry less about getting in irons, or a sudden jerk moving around.
After reading and re reading this thread I respectfully still disagree with Jeff. I still think if you are going to do long coastal jumps or ocean passages you should get the largest boat you can run even if the electrons stop flowing. I still think even for a fat, out of shape dust farter like me that's a boat in the mid forties. Further believe proper balance spade rudders are as strong if not stronger then skeg. Bulked fins handle better and are faster. If the boat is drawn right it will tract as if on rails. So there is no reason to give up the performance and ease of docking/ boat handling that comes with that configuration.


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