# How important is shoal-draft for cruising?



## bodhi (Dec 30, 2010)

Criteria for new sailboat; 35-37 feet, blue water appropriate for extended cruising through Caribbean, transit through Panama and across the South Pacific, potential circumnav since I'm going that far already.
The only boats that fit the bill and have shoal-draft for shallow anchorage, getting into coral atolls, etc... seem to be the Tartan 37 with centerboards. I think these are very nice boats, but getting a little worn out.
Now there are plenty of nice blue-water boats (Waquiez, sabre, beneteau, etc) but they all have 6'+ draft vs. the 4' draft of the Tartans w/CB.

So my question is, how much difference is there really in ability to gunkhole, use anchorages, and get in and out of atolls with that 2' difference in draft?
Or should I forget the shoal draft requirement and get the newer blue-water boat that has more speed and better overall sailing characteristics?
Thanks for any help from those of you with the experience.
Bruce


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## Sequitur (Feb 13, 2007)

For the 1/1000th of one percent of the anchorages you would have to bypass with a deep draft boat, I would suggest you ignore the shoal draft nonsense for world cruising and opt for a proper draft for sailing.


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

There are boats, like the French-built Ovnis that are very shoal draft that are well suited for blue water cruising. Then there are the multihulls, which also often have very shallow draft for their size. 

I think the real issue is what you want to really do when you're out there? A shoal draft vessel has more options in terms of places you can go, where you can anchor, etc. 

In the storm season, a shoal draft boat has a far greater range of hurricane holes to hide in, and this can be very important in more remote areas, where well sheltered waters are harder to find. 

Many shoal draft boats have a daggerboard or centerboard, which gives them decent windward performance and allows you to tailor the amount of lee/weather helm that you have by raising/lowering the board.

Also, some shoal draft boats can dry out without falling over. This can make doing maintenance or repairs in remote areas of the world simpler. Not every port has a travellift that can handle a 35'+ boat. 

Options for shoal draft boats include: 

Wing keels
Keel and Centeboard
Centerboard only (usually found on multihulls, not larger monohulls)
Daggerboard only (usually found on multihulls, not larger monohulls)
Bilge keeled 
twin keeled 
Lifting or retracting keel
Swing keel 
Shoal draft full keel
Multihull


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## Yorksailor (Oct 11, 2009)

We draw 7-6 ft and have sailed 12,000 miles in the last 3 yrs. Yes, we have to bypass some places but when you are out in 25ft+ waves and 50 knot winds you really appreciate the deep keel and shallow anchorages are not on your list of priorities as the waves go over the boat. You are heading out into deep water and not into anywhere the waves might break dangerously.

The decision on boat design should be based on use...cruising Florida and the Bahamas...get a shoal draft, crossing oceans...get a deep keel.

However, I probably would cross the Atlantic in a Tartan!

Phil


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## smackdaddy (Aug 13, 2008)

Yorksailor said:


> We draw 7-6 ft and have sailed 12,000 miles in the last 3 yrs. Yes, we have to bypass some places but when you are out in 25ft+ waves and 50 knot winds you really appreciate the deep keel and shallow anchorages are not on your list of priorities as the waves break over the boat.
> 
> Phil


Okay York, I wanna hear the story of that sail. Sounds pretty epic.


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## bodhi (Dec 30, 2010)

SailingDog,
Thanks for the reply. As for "what I really want to do", I'll be sailing solo, exploring mostly the out-of-the-way little islands, atolls, etc... fishing and diving my way through wherever looks good. Starting in North Carolina, heading down through the Caribbean, then through panama and crossing blue water out to the Marquesas, then island hoping through the South Pacific, through the New Hebrides, Solomon's, etc... Then, since I've gone that far already, probably just go ahead and circumnavigate around the Cape, up to St. Helena, the Cape Verde islands, and back across to the Caribbean.
I'll be retired from government service, be a remittance man, and can basically do whatever I want with my time. 
I'm just trying to decide if I should limit myself to only looking at boats that have a shoal draft. As I said above, I really like the Tartan 37 with the centerboard, which gives them good windward performance, but they are definitely getting dated. I really like the Wauquiez Pretorian 35, but they have 6'+ draft which I am just wondering how much that would actually limit my ability to get into the atolls and such, or if it really isn't an issue.
Thanks again.
Bruce


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

*Always amazes me that people think a deep keel is NECESSARY for crossing oceans. * The Polynesians settled an area of the South Pacific, mostly to windward of their original islands, that is larger than North America, and using shoal draft multihulls--Proas and trimarans mostly...


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## garymcg (Jun 19, 2006)

I own a deep draft boat. I have chartered shoal draft boats. If you're accustomed to a deep draft boat, the windward performance of a shoal draft boat is laughable. I would not own one because of this, but that's just my opinion. I love to sail and hate to motor. I would gladly trade not being able to enter certain anchorages for better performance, but once again that's just personal preference. If you want something that goes to windward and has the draft to enter any anchorage, buy a powerboat. If that's out of the question, you're going to have to compromise on either convenience or performance.


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## sailingdog (Mar 19, 2006)

Again, a properly designed centerboard or daggerboard equipped shoal draft boat is going to go to windward just fine. The windward performance loss of the twin keel, bilge keel and wing keel designs is a compromise, but they are not the only choices when it comes to shoal draft vessels. 



garymcg said:


> I own a deep draft boat. I have chartered shoal draft boats. If you're accustomed to a deep draft boat, the windward performance of a shoal draft boat is laughable. I would not own one because of this, but that's just my opinion. I love to sail and hate to motor. I would gladly trade not being able to enter certain anchorages for better performance, but once again that's just personal preference. If you want something that goes to windward and has the draft to enter any anchorage, buy a powerboat. If that's out of the question, you're going to have to compromise on either convenience or performance.


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## blt2ski (May 5, 2005)

sailingdog said:


> *Always amazes me that people think a deep keel is NECESSARY for crossing oceans. * The Polynesians settled an area of the South Pacific, mostly to windward of their original islands, that is larger than North America, and using shoal draft multihulls--Proas and trimarans mostly...


Then again, how many lives were lost in those proa's that were from a fundamental purpose, a canoe with ama's? If one is going to use these kinds of examples, why not use the "get a viking longboat" They traveled around a lot, or a dugout cedar canoe from a NW pacific coast indian tribe, or a kayak as the eskimo's uses to hunt whales etc in the ocean.........

There are frankly many kinds of boats out there. ALL have plus's and minus's. CB models as teh OP is looking at, have a place, as do keep keels, and shoal keels. Not that I personally would go looking for a shoal or CB model, deeper to me is better overall. BUT< I could see where a shallower draft rig could be the way to go in some places. FOr the OP, from you initial post, a T37 or equal with a CB could very well be the way to go frankly. For the very reasons you state! From where I sail, the more SA, deeper draft, lighter the boat can be...... the happier I am in the lighter winds I have locally, also being as it is up or down wind.........

Which could include a recently designed multihull too. I certianly would not choose a polynesian designed proa! still not sure why folks use these kinds of examples........ then again, maybe a santa maria or pinta would make a good boat to sail around the world too.........

marty


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## labatt (Jul 31, 2006)

Regarding centerboards/lifting keels/boats with something down below that moves - my personal opinion is that I'd prefer a fixed keel vessel. Yes - I know there are bluewater boats such as Little Harbors and Bristols with centerboards. To me it's not necessarily a safety issue (although I like my ballast down as low as possible having been through a few breezes). Rather, it's a complexity issue. There are certain things core to boat function - rudder, steering, rigging, sails, ground tackle, engine (let's not get into a debate here), etc. There are a number of things that are less critical -lights, air conditioning, numerous types of instruments, etc. 

I'm OK with the less critical items being complex. If they break, I can do without them. I want the core things to be as far from complex as possible, and centerboard designs are *generally* more complex - if a part of the mechanism breaks, it may be difficult to fix. Plus - I'd want to know that the mechanism can handle the shearing forces of big seas - following or beam.

Let me ask you a question - if you jumped on a boat with a centerboard and you knew nothing about the condition of the mechanism, would you put it down in big seas? If you were in a fixed keel vessel, it's one less thing you'd have to question. Give me a nice encapsulated keel anyday (I feel similarly to vessels with bolt on keels).

Anyway, there aren't too many places that a boat with a 6' draft has problems getting to. The Bahamas can be interesting, but they are one of the few cruising grounds (from what I understand) that draft matters.

By the way - as an alternative to a boat with a centerboard for reducing draft, full keel boats will also have shallower drafts. Or get a catamaran.

Just my two cents.


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## bodhi (Dec 30, 2010)

Quote "Let me ask you a question - if you jumped on a boat with a centerboard and you knew nothing about the condition of the mechanism, would you put it down in big seas? If you were in a fixed keel vessel, it's one less thing you'd have to question. Give me a nice encapsulated keel anyday (I feel similarly to vessels with bolt on keels)."
While I agree about bolt-on keels, I would never set sail in a vessel with any system of which I "new nothing about the condition". That's just stupid, and a primary factor in the yearly Darwin Awards 
Certainly for myself, I fully check everything before even going out for a day of fishing in my powerboat. One of the joys of boating for me is the constant tinkering and hands-on nature of my relationship with a boat, be it power or sail, and the joy of knowing my boat intimately, and that I can fix pretty much anything on her at any time (as opposed to being unable to fix anything about a woman, ever:laugher 
At any rate, my original question is not about repair, maintenance, blue-water capability (the Tartan 37's have a well established record), but about the potential degree of restrictions faced between a shoal-draft boat vs. a deep draft boat when cruising through the Caribbean and South Pacific. So far I have not seen a strong argument for either, which may actually be my answer.
Thanks again to all.
Bruce


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## blt2ski (May 5, 2005)

Bruce,

Not that I will answer any more about the keel, as frankly, it is probably a pick you poison, and go! You are now into the which positives and negatives are you willing to put up with. 

BUT< being as you mentioned solo, and some diving....... Now comes another option on a boat you may wish to consider. While I have no doubt a Tartan is a nice boat....... but if you are going to go tartan, a new model with the open transom option might be a better way to go, as with the older models, you will have to climb with gear up and over a ladder. At some point in time, no matter how fit we think we are...... That ladder is going to be rather tough vs an open swim platform transom ie also call a sugar scoop among other types. Not that I know how to scuba dive, but if I did, an older anything without the sugar/swim platform would be off the radar, no matter how good/perfect etc said boat is! 

Marty


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## bodhi (Dec 30, 2010)

blt2ski,
I have thought about the "sugar scoops", but it seems that most of the newer boats that have them are either definitely not "blue water" boats, or out of my price range.
The simple solution is what I already do, which is simply have a rope with a snap-link on the end that hangs off the transom. When done diving, I simply take off my gear, clip it to the line, climb up the ladder and then pull the gear up on deck. Easy!
Thanks for the thoughts,
Bruce


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## 224 (Mar 8, 2008)

1


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## CaptainForce (Jan 1, 2006)

'lots of good advice above! I cruise Florida and the Bahamas and I use a hurricane hide-out that allows me to squeeze in with my 4'3" draft. My draft suits what I do, but if I were cruising elsewhere; I would choose the fixed, encapsulated, deep keel. Take care and joy, Aythya crew


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## RichH (Jul 10, 2000)

The only real advantage of a shoal draft boat is ..... you go aground much closer to shore.


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## garymcg (Jun 19, 2006)

sailingdog said:


> Again, a properly designed centerboard or daggerboard equipped shoal draft boat is going to go to windward just fine. The windward performance loss of the twin keel, bilge keel and wing keel designs is a compromise, but they are not the only choices when it comes to shoal draft vessels.
> 
> .....Many shoal draft boats have a daggerboard or centerboard, which gives them decent windward performance


Again, it's a compromise. If "decent" or "just fine" windward performance is acceptable to you, by all means get the shoal draft.


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## superslomo (Jun 16, 2015)

There are some drop dead realities you have to work with, that are dependent on your circumstances.

Where my boat sits moored, if I want to get to the dock on shore to load people or things, I'd better be under 5' draft, or I won't make it in at low water. For me, anything deeper constitutes a huge pain in the rear that I don't want.

That doesn't matter if the boat will leave port with you and go around the world immediately...

Have you looked over some charts of places you'd like to go visit, and seen places where the 2 feet are the killer difference?


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## TQA (Apr 4, 2009)

You are responding to a 6 year old thread. Chances are the OP is half way round his circumnavigation.


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## FreeAgent (Apr 19, 2017)

bodhi said:


> SailingDog,
> As I said above, I really like the Tartan 37 with the centerboard, which gives them good windward performance, but they are definitely getting dated.


If you plan on travelling in the ICW or visiting the Bahamas, shoal draft is important. We sailed both of those in a Tartan 40 CB. Those Tartans don't really need the CB. It just helps when going hard to weather, which cruisers seldom do.

We did visit the Bahamas in a Halberg Rassy 49 with about 7'-6" draft. We could not enter most of the harbors in the Abacos. Anchored outside and dinghied in. Not ideal. Never did the shallow parts of ICW, but would have to have sailed outside to take boat back North to Chesapeake. No problems in Caribbean, but it was like a Mack truck sailing upwind from Bahamas to Virgins. By the way, there are many models of H-Rs, some in your size range. Bit pricey, but very well made boats.

Another consideration, is mast clearance, depending on just where you plan on sailing.


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## superslomo (Jun 16, 2015)

TQA said:


> You are responding to a 6 year old thread. Chances are the OP is half way round his circumnavigation.


Ah, yes.

I'm stupid.

I bumped into it on mobile, looking up questions about shoal draft for larger boats... my own curiosity killed my cat.

Given the absence of any further communication immediately after question above, I'm guessing circumnavigation is... unlikely.


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## FreeAgent (Apr 19, 2017)

TQA said:


> You are responding to a 6 year old thread. Chances are the OP is half way round his circumnavigation.


Possibly true, but it is a general subject that others may still find of interest.


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## flyingriki (Sep 27, 2012)

TQA said:


> You are responding to a 6 year old thread. Chances are the OP is half way round his circumnavigation.


So what? Hope he is. Many of us don't come here because were bored and lonely and care about dates. We come to learn and this subject is timeless. Glad to see it come up since I'm looking at a model that comes both ways. 
Seems to me if you need a shoal draft on a 38 not many larger boats can get in. And I see lots of much bigger boats where I want to go.


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