# How to establish residency for live aboard



## Strider1234 (Jul 4, 2012)

I have been living aboard for 10 years on a documented boat and have paid a state sales tax. I have a pub in Fl. And a Fl drivers licence. I find myself in Maryland waters for an extended period of time and wish to change residence from Florida to Maryland, however , without a residential street address , I can not. All marinas, personal mailbox services and such are considered commercial addresses and do not qualify. I think I would have more luck if I were not a US citizen! Any helpful suggestions welcome.


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## speciald (Mar 27, 2007)

Sign up with St. Brendan's Isle mail service and use their address as your Florida address. Change your driver's license, voting address, etc. to your address there 911 Walnut Street, #XXXX, Green Cove Springs, FL 32043. Call them and they will help you.


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## Strider1234 (Jul 4, 2012)

I guess I wasn't clear. I am aFlorida resident with a pmb with St. Bredndans. I want to change to Maryland , however Maryland will not allow you to use a mail service as your address. The computer immediately can tell residential from commercial adress and commercial is not allowed, nor are marinas


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## sea_hunter (Jul 26, 2000)

Strider1234:892676 said:


> I have been living aboard for 10 years on a documented boat and have paid a state sales tax. I have a pub in Fl. And a Fl drivers licence. I find myself in Maryland waters for an extended period of time and wish to change residence from Florida to Maryland, however , without a residential street address , I can not. All marinas, personal mailbox services and such are considered commercial addresses and do not qualify. I think I would have more luck if I were not a US citizen! Any helpful suggestions welcome.


PO box numer @ local PO.


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## Strider1234 (Jul 4, 2012)

Post office box is not allowed , it must be a non commercial address.


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## Strider1234 (Jul 4, 2012)

The problem in Maryland and I think virginia is that a few years ago these states were criticized for allowing non US citizens to get a drivers license by using a PO box as their legal residense . Now you must somehow prove you have a legitmet dwelling place . I live on a boat 12 months a year in this state and pay state income tax, but I can't establish residency if I am not a dirt dweller.


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## sea_hunter (Jul 26, 2000)

I understand that commercial po's are not allowed, but what's wrong with USPS? We had a similar issue in LA and used the marina's street address on our DLs, with no problems. We added our slip number as an "apartment" number so as not to be confused as the commercial address of the marina. There was no problem using the po as the mailing address. We did the same in CT, and it worked fine.


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## Tim R. (Mar 23, 2003)

+1 the slip as your apt. number.

You could also add an "A" to the street number(if that is not already a valid address) to try and fool the computer.


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## Stumble (Feb 2, 2012)

I haven't been through this, but my recommendation would be to ignore the computer and get in touch with an actual person. Most automated systems work great for the 99% of people who need them, but a live aboard is going to need to work around the system.


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## ebs001 (May 8, 2006)

Rent a room for a month in a non commercial residence. and use that address. Once you establish residency then change your mailing address to whatever you want.


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## Strider1234 (Jul 4, 2012)

Renting aroom sounds plausible . A boat neighbor has a Mayland mail service drop like I do and he went in person to DMV and with postmarked Federal tax returns to that address as well as pension checks to that address. When the person at the counter brought the address up in their computer it was flagged as commercial. A supervisor overrode the computer and gave him a license. 30 days later he gets a letter stating the address is no good and he has 30 days to list a proper address or his licence is terminated.


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## wingNwing (Apr 28, 2008)

We are currently MD residents with a marina as our legal address, used the slip lease as our lease to open bank account, get drivers license and voting cards. The computer for drivers license demanded a slip # in addition to the street address of the marina but no other complications. This was all since 9/11 and the drivers license was just in the last 3 months. They want a specific location, i.e., an apartment or in our case slip number, not what they think of as general delivery to the front office - the computer at the drivers license office flagged our address as "incomplete" without the slip number. We get our mail at the marina street address without "c/o Joe's Marina" as a separate line item. Now my legal address as printed on my driver's license includes Slip F-44! Now that's living aboard!!


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## Strider1234 (Jul 4, 2012)

Current Md residents., that's great. I however am renting a private slip behind a house. No marina. Maybe I can try the street address and a slip number? Or rent a slip for month at a marina. Thanks for your input.


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## hellosailor (Apr 11, 2006)

IF the zoning legally allows them to rent out a residency, you may be able to simply use their address, although of course that means the mail will all be delivered to them. Or the local post office may allow you to use an "apartment 1" "slip 1" or "-1/2" on the address. That's sometimes at the discretion of the local postmaster/carrier, so I'd start at the post office.

Then take whatever they will recognize to the local DMV and start from there, since they will be hungry to register the boat and transfer the title and take fees for that. If the local DMV are clueless, try the local Board of Elections since they may be more flexible in order to meet federal voter registration standards, and a Bd.E. voter registration address should be accepted back at the DMV.

But if you can just use the address where you rent the slip....you know, put a basket up somewhere, ask the folks to drop your mail in it when and if there is any?


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## wingNwing (Apr 28, 2008)

Strider, also note that your *legal* address, for voting, tax, drivers license etc does not have to be the same as your *mailing* address. We converted as much as possible to electronic billing and statements, and continue to have the rest sent to St Brendans.


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## melody1204 (Aug 3, 2012)

I've been wondering about this as well, as we just recently moved aboard our boat. I'll have to look into St Brendans!

Melody

Vacilando | This is the story of two people, a dog and a journey. We'll choose some article almost certain not to exist and diligently try to find it.


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## wingNwing (Apr 28, 2008)

Hey, nice blog Melody! We visited St B's while we were in Florida last year Life Afloat Archives: But How Do You Get Your Mail? and it was interesting to see how they do stuff behind the scenes. If you decide to talk to them, tell them we sent you (I'll email you our details)


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## melody1204 (Aug 3, 2012)

Thanks, wingNwing! Please do send me your info and we'll definitely let them know you sent us. I also just went and liked your FB page. While not new to sailing, we are new to the whole living aboard/cruising aspect, so it's been really wonderful to have these forums to help us newbies out! I always say that sailors are the most helpful kind of people! Thanks for checking out the blog, too!

Happy sailing!

Melody

Vacilando | This is the story of two people, a dog and a journey. We'll choose some article almost certain not to exist and diligently try to find it.


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## wingNwing (Apr 28, 2008)

Done (just sent via FB). I read further back in your blog & blew my mind - we also had a Belgian mix, awesome dog. I think its just the breed!


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## capta (Jun 27, 2011)

I've been doing this for over 40 years. 911 changed a lot of things, but I still can use a PO Box as my legal address (mailing) and I use a near-by marina as my "street address".
You may have to contact someone in the DMV head office, but you can get it done.
I just don't understand why you would want to?
Fla is one of the better states to be a non-resident of, especially as there's no state income tax & I believe you said you have already paid your sales tax on the boat.
Any way, good luck, be persistent and very patient; it does YOU no good to lose your temper with the "little" people behind the desk.


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## boating2go (Jul 12, 2012)

wingNwing said:


> We are currently MD residents with a marina as our legal address, used the slip lease as our lease to open bank account, get drivers license and voting cards. The computer for drivers license demanded a slip # in addition to the street address of the marina but no other complications. This was all since 9/11 and the drivers license was just in the last 3 months. They want a specific location, i.e., an apartment or in our case slip number, not what they think of as general delivery to the front office - the computer at the drivers license office flagged our address as "incomplete" without the slip number. We get our mail at the marina street address without "c/o Joe's Marina" as a separate line item. Now my legal address as printed on my driver's license includes Slip F-44! Now that's living aboard!!


We lived aboard for years in Maryland and used the marina's address until 2007 when we received a letter from the DMV stating we had to have a residential address. We tried the PO box with no success, tried a UPS mailbox with no success, got fed up and went into DC to get licenses. We used the UPS mail forwarding service to get the mail at the marina, a pain and additional expense but worth it to stay aboard. One benefit was the DC taxes wound up being cheaper than the Maryland taxes so money wise it was about an even swap.

If you are a Florida resident with no income tax why do you want to establish residency in Maryland? I know a lot of snowbirds that list Florida as their official residence so they don't have to pay income taxes.


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## sailordave (Jun 26, 2001)

Yeah, I can't for the life of me understand why anyone would want to move to MD and establish residency if they really didn't have to! And I am a multigenerational MD born native. But now live in VA. 

The People's Republic of Maryland will tax you to death. (although I guess they are being efficient what with the only guarantees in life being death and taxes):laugher


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## meljabro3 (Aug 6, 2012)

I would find a friend and use their address to establish your residency as far as a DL then change it a few months later and use a PO box


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## greg95473 (Jan 9, 2016)

It is not the states it is Homeland Security they have taken control of identification of all kinds. I renewed my licence six years ago could not use the Postal Express mail box I had been using used the marinas address, tried to renew this year and they would not except the marina address. I have no drivers license. Hoping HLS has an answer.


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## hellosailor (Apr 11, 2006)

Can't blame DHS, since each state has the option of issuing a "secure ID" that complies with DHS terms, or issuing their own document. Florida decided that all licenses would meet the DHS criteria, but NY makes it optional, they'll issue two different license types.

As to what meets the criteria for a "residence"...that's also up to individual states. And if their is no state-wide definition, it can even vary from one state agency to another.

DHS? My Passport Card is DHS-compliant. It shows no address at all. Just like a passport.


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## xort (Aug 4, 2006)

Now,as of sometime in 2015, Florida requires livaboards to provide cg documemtation and they put your doc number as your street address on your dl. The city where you have a po box is used for your city but the street is the cg doc number.


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## hellosailor (Apr 11, 2006)

Florida, of course, is SO close to the continental United States that it actually is mistaken for one at times.(G)

It is one of those states where there is no formal State definition of "what a residence" is. Instead, each state agency is allowed to set their own definition of residency for their own purposes--including their DMV.

So in fact, your residency for voting in Florida can be "Under the Julia Tuttle Bridge" where in fact a large number of homeless do/did reside, and won the right to use that as a valid residency in order to vote. By court order.

The Florida DMV, however, would not accept that as a residency, even though it is printed as one on an official Florida voter ID card.

Florida's accommodations for boats and boaters and snowbirds and many other things is often very illogical. But, hey, that's why this is supposed to be a Republic with each Sovereign State writing their own rules of the road. If the Rules someplace don't work? Yeah, there's 61 other places (including DC and the 11 insular possessions) that you can move to, and still live in the US. Each with its own set of rules.


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## sharkbait (Jun 3, 2003)

1


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## jjstick (Jan 11, 2016)

Do you think it matters if we are a first-time boat owner or if we have experience to be granted a slip or liveaboard?


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## Faster (Sep 13, 2005)

jjstick said:


> Do you think it matters if we are a first-time boat owner or if we have experience to be granted a slip or liveaboard?


I doubt it.. it's more likely going to be about availability, length of waitlists (if in place) and even more likely 'who you know'. Besides, you needn't advertise your 'newness' (though it may be readily apparent)

Sometimes waitlists can be 'truncated' with some convenient connection or good timing - it's not right, but it happens and sometimes you gotta do what you gotta do if it works out for you.

Of course, if you get a slip and then commence bouncing off all your neighbours as you learn how to dock the boat it may delay becoming accepted into the community!


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## miatapaul (Dec 15, 2006)

Faster said:


> .
> 
> Of course, if you get a slip and then commence bouncing off all your neighbours as you learn how to dock the boat it may delay becoming accepted into the community!


Well the power boaters will just think you are one of them!


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## sail39 (May 2, 2017)

Figuratively speaking literally I am in the 'same boat'. 

Looking for a 39' boat slip in MD Baltimore marina for weekend live board and to satisfy MD residency for my Graduate degree program requirements. Please email me at - j b e r m a n 2 0 1 6 @ g m a i l . c o m. Appreciate if anyone could assist in the true spirit of the sail force. irateraft:

Thank you

Jason


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## hellosailor (Apr 11, 2006)

Jason-
When you say weekend liveaboard, that suggest you will be living out of state 5 days out of 7. And in most states, if you are not in the state for 181 or 183 days/nights out of the year, they will question residency, especially for educational residency requirements. Most states are really cracking down on that for simple budget reasons.

FWIW.


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## Movingrightalong... (Apr 14, 2017)

Strider1234 said:


> I have been living aboard for 10 years on a documented boat and have paid a state sales tax. I have a pub in Fl. And a Fl drivers licence. I find myself in Maryland waters for an extended period of time and wish to change residence from Florida to Maryland, however , without a residential street address , I can not. All marinas, personal mailbox services and such are considered commercial addresses and do not qualify. I think I would have more luck if I were not a US citizen! Any helpful suggestions welcome.


The answer is probably going to be different if you are a liveaboard cruiser vs living aboard at a marina or day or weekend sailing.

If you are engaged in the former, you probably want to look for something like this:

https://www.sbimailservice.com/

which can either physically forward your mail to new ports or scan it so it is retrivable electronically.

As I'm working full time and won't be setting off on any extended adventures, I simply got a "real street address" PO box at a UPS store and use that as my address for residency purposes. With all my mail going there it easily meets the requirements for establishing state residency.

As far as Maryland, you might really want to make sure that your residency there is very long term as after you switch over from Florida you'll have the added responsibility of paying Maryland State income tax (up to 5.75%) and filing an annual state tax return.

There's a reason a lot of cruisers and RVers "live" in Washington, South Dakota, Texas, and Florida.


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## hellosailor (Apr 11, 2006)

States being sovereign states [sic] they have the right to make their own individual and differing rules. South Dakota is AFAIK unique in that it has a residence law, which allows anyone to come stay one night in a campground and then file an affadavit saying they will be footloose but intend to return and continue living there. And while they are footloose in a boat or rv or whatever, South Dakota will extend the aegis of residency over them forever--because they have filed an affidavit stating they intend to return.

Every state gets to make their own rules. In some states, and cities, you become a "citizen" of that place after residing there for 30 days. Others may say you belong to them after 183 or 181. Sometimes 181 consecutive nights, sometimes just that many in any one calendar year. Or, any 365 sequential days.

There are no absolute rules that any of them have to follow. Which may be why a US passport does NOT list your place of residency, nor does it require one. (The fed doesn't care where you're sleeping, they want your taxes anyway.)


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## Minnewaska (Feb 21, 2010)

There can be big difference between establishing residency for benefits, or a drivers license or to vote and whether you owe income taxes. Getting a drivers license is typically a much lower bar than the state being able to levy income tax. Although, having your drivers license there is in their favor, if you don't have another residency elsewhere.


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## miatapaul (Dec 15, 2006)

One of the newer complicating factors are the newer requirements for air travel. My driver's license has a PO Box on it, but I think they will require a physical address upon renewal. Some states will give DL with a mail forwarding address or PO Box but they say on it "not valid for air travel." 

Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk


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## hellosailor (Apr 11, 2006)

Paul-
In some states, drivers have a choice of two different license types. "Ours", which meets whatever standards a state wants, and "SecureID" which meets the federal (DHS?) security standards. And usually the SecureID version also costs ~$10 more.
In some states, they've simply said all dl's will be SecureID standard. Florida did that maybe five years ago, and stopped issuing "snowbird" licenses at the same time. They had six months of total chaos because customers just couldn't bother reading the list of requirements and showing up with the necessary proof of ID. 
But...Somewhere online are the "SecureID" standards, and that's what TSA will be looking for. Although, I had one nice droid hand me back my passport card (SecureID issued by the Department of State) and then say "I've never seen one of those before, what is it?" Gives you confidence in the program, huh?
And then an even brighter Guardsman with an ego problem, who warned me that he should arrest me for "tampering with an official document" because he thought I had something crossed out on my state ID. Ergh, no, actually, states sometimes require that, and in this case, it was just covered--not crossed out. No laws against that.
Once you go international...things can get better or worse. If you get a jerk like the guardsman, you may have a long day. If someone else sees anything they've never seen before...in some places they will accept it without question, because saying "What's that?" would embarrass them. Others would just reject anything they didn't know.
So...You know.

And then there are military ID's. If you're moved to a new base every two years, what "residency" are all your ID's going to have on them? And you'll still want something like plain civilian ID's, to make the SecDef happy about "please travel in civilian attier when not on active duty" in order to prevent soldiers from being targets.

ID? Da, Komrade! Here are my travel papers, signed by General deGaulle himself, genuine and cannot be revoked. [Casablanca-ish]


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## zeehag (Nov 16, 2008)

my family covers for me--my mom is alive as are 2 remaining siblings, so i have a choice in aridzona as to where i live ha ha ha 
my momma and brother both live in goodyear so i am a tire. hahaha
when in doubt, impose on family. isnt that what family is for?
i know if situation was reversed i would allow the imposition, but i have a close knit family despite distance


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