# Affordable (Shoestring) Cruising



## vega1860 (Dec 18, 2006)

As the recent thread on the affordability of sailing devolved into a political discussion and got bumped into Off Topic I got to thinking about how things have changed since I first had the dream. The question of financing, how much you will need and how to get it is something each of us has to answer for themselves.

For the absolute minimalist Annie Hill's "Voyaging on a Small Income" still has some good information, albeit a little dated - she recommends to investing in government bonds that yield 10% interest to provide said small income. :laugher
Still, Annie has a lot of useful information for someone wanting to cruise on the cheap.

But building your own plywood boat equipped with oil lamps and sewing your own sails is not for everyone; perhaps not for anyone in the 21st century. Nor is living on "Pulses" beans and rice. Still, we have run into people who live remarkably cheaply - completely, or nearly, off the grid, getting by on subsistence fishing and hunting supplemented by dumpster diving and foraging.

We have met people cruising in $500 plastic classics rescued from boat yard abandonment propelled by much repaired sails with auxiliary propulsion via homemade oars or salvaged outboard motors. A skilled scrounger with an inventive mind might fully equip a cruising boat for next to nothing.

There is a lot of fun and personal satisfaction in cruising safely and comfortably without resorting to West Marine to equip your boat or Safeway to fill your larder. Lin and Larry Pardey present more reasonable means of economical cruising in "The Cost Conscious Cruiser"

There are two questions, really: First is where do you draw the line?

For example, I buy new rope for dock lines, anchor rodes and running rigging but have many times bought or traded for used cleats, blocks etc.

The second question is: Just how badly do I really want to go cruising? It is all too easy to say "I won't go without XXX"

This can just be a handy excuse but I have my own list. For instance, I won't go cruising without good ground tackle and a working VHF but I do not require a freezer full of steaks or ice for my whiskey.

I expect most of us will find a niche somewhere between an open sixteen foot dory with a rock for an anchor and a bag of chips and a six pack for provisions, and a fully equipped sixty footer with a well stocked wine cellar as depicted on the cover of the latest issue of "Cruising World"

(Although given the choice...)


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## barefootnavigator (Mar 12, 2012)

I keep my boat as well stocked as possible. the last 60 days cruising cost me only 80 bucks because of this. Anytime I find a favorite food item on sale I buy half a dozen and stash them away. I have a safe, simple and comfortable boat and keep ker in top notch condition.


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## MikeOReilly (Apr 12, 2010)

I always feel a fraud when posting to this kind of discussion, b/c I'm not (yet) out there full time. I will be starting next summer, but right now it's all been planning, and short-term cruising on the Great Lakes. 

With that admission, I can say Annie and the Pardeys are our model for future cruising. My partner and I have been building a simple cruising home that, we expect, will be sustainable with minimal income over the medium to long term. When we leave next summer we will do so with a well-found and somewhat upgraded classic old boat. It's systems are safe, solid, and simple. Our operating and living expenses will (have to) be small, b/c our income will be equally small. I don't know if we can sustain a life on the water, but we're going to give it a try. 

So yeah ... shoestring cruisers is what we will soon be. I don't know if we can do it, but Annie and the Pardeys and others have done it, so why can't we?


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## barefootnavigator (Mar 12, 2012)

Oh boy, I hate to burst your bubble but the Pardeys have never cruised on a shoe string. Simple yes, realistic boats yes, self sufficient yes but shoe string?? No They know how to live


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## desert rat (Feb 14, 2013)

I'm not a sailor yet.
I want a boat to go and chase the horizon.
27-32 ft. fiberglass monohul, inboard engine.
solid hull solid deck. rigging and sails.
details details details I may not be the stingiest man alive but
i am in contention.

What more do I need?


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## MarkofSeaLife (Nov 7, 2010)

vega1860 said:


> Still, we have run into people who live remarkably cheaply - completely, or nearly, off the grid, getting by on subsistence fishing and hunting supplemented by dumpster diving and foraging.


Where?

Unless its in the USA and someone has taken a boat as cheap/free accomodation. But you say "Cruising" in your title.

So tell me, where have you seen someone cruising long range dumpster diving? Subsistance hunting and fishing? WHERE?

Because its just not occuring. I have not seen one instance of it. So if its happening its not happening cruising. It may be happening with poor livaboards in the USA but they are not cruising.

Mark


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## copacabana (Oct 1, 2007)

I don't know about dumpster diving and subsistence fishing, but I've seen cruising boats from both ends of the spectrum coming through here (coast of São Paulo and Rio). The low-budget small cruisers are usually Brazilian or Argentine or from France or Italy. These boats are usually small, very simple (hard dinghy is one of the giveaways) and the crew is on a tight budget (you won't see them in restaurants!). Of course there are the big boats too, but it seems to me pretty evenly divided here between both ends. No doubt, other cruising grounds will look different.


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## chucklesR (Sep 17, 2007)

I too am a fraud in that I'm not cruising yet. 

Cruising on a shoe string budget, I'm too old for that. 

I don't mean chronologically, I mean I have too much common sense and too much responsibility towards my wife (the admiral).

You can cruise inexpensively and get by quite well on what would be a poverty level of income in many other places around the world - but you better have a kitty that includes sufficient money to replace things and repair things and maintain that floating money sink that is the boat.
If you don't have a reserve, you are just temporarily buying time until you are homeless.


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## zeehag (Nov 16, 2008)

i am not a fraud as i am out here in cruiserville with a hard dinghy--i prefer this as i have seen too many reflatables go missing complete with engine--i do row. 
i donot advocate dumpster diving in mexico--you wont even find fish heads in garbage here--besides garbage here is burned daily. mexicans use things until that item is not recognizable as an item, then burn it. 
to become legal in mexico one must have income--it is not easy to find haven sans income. as we are not permitted to work here until permanent residency is achieved, it is difficult to add to your income base here. there is much protection of th e local work force by th e government, unlike usa. to be illegal in mexico is to tease the local govt into kicking your butt out of country. permanently.
it is a good idea to have SOMETHING you can do that others cannot do while you cruise, and something not able to remove a locals income and food on table for his family. 
under table boat repair is a start--can you fix a boat ???? diesel engine repair is a good way to create income, as are other repairs on yachts--so many sailing boats have break downs at sea--from minor stuff like air in line to major rebuilds needed. 
can you sew cushions or canvas....repair sails--things that are good to find in far away places do excellently to supplement income--as long as you are GOOD at it. there are enough cranks and frauds in place already.

oh yes--i make it just fine on my hard earned ssdi dollars.


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## CrazyRu (May 10, 2007)

MarkofSeaLife said:


> Where?
> 
> Because its just not occuring. I have not seen one instance of it. So if its happening its not happening cruising. It may be happening with poor livaboards in the USA but they are not cruising.
> 
> Mark


I guess you are spending too much time in places for rich yachties.
Small boats are better designed to visit less expensive harbours and normally don't require maintenance facilities.
Anyway look at 
microcruising.com for example. Guys from this site cruise in 10- 14 ft boats.
I can give several links to Russian circumnavigator's blogs. All of them travel with budgets under $800/mo
These two travel in 30 ft boat, right now they are in Indian ocean
?? ??? ? ????
These 4, yes, they have two beautiful girls born while traveling, have a big boat, however, they got it for nothing, without a rig and they restored and rebuilt it by themselves
??????????? "???????????". ?????-????????? - ???? ???, 2002-2006-2016

Rich and poor don't mix together, it is well known fact, and, I guess this is the reason you don't see the low budget sailors...


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## Don L (Aug 8, 2008)

I only read about cruising on the "cheap" on forums.

Heck it costs me more per year to weekend sail and maintain my boat for the 7 month season than what some forum people say they are going to cruise and live on their boat full time.


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## Michael K (Feb 27, 2006)

I believe the OP's comment "I won't go without XXX" belongs in the Sex While Aboard thread. Sorry, just couldn't resist!


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## zeehag (Nov 16, 2008)

each and every cruise and cruiser is different-- from needs to effecting the plan or spontaneous reaction. yes in many cases cruising was a spontaneous reaction. 

people with money are not necessarily rich. 
many moneyed souls do not know how to get thru many problems with the boat--they call a repairsoul.. now, if the derelict sailor is able to keep his engine running, that air in system mr money has can be dealt with sans drama. mebbe even mr money can learn something from derelict sailor. life rocks.

derelict sailor learns from mr money that he can make money while cruising--yeah, drifting from place to place with a boat is actually cruising.... imagine that!

boat need not be too small for comfort--it costs as much to fix a small uncomfortable to me boat as it does to fix my nice comfy ketch. i know, as i am doing and have done exactly that of which i speak. 

there are those of us between rich and poor, financially speaking--and we seem to be intermediaries for the derelict sailor and mr money for repairing in remote places. 
we hobnob with you in marinas and you dont even know we are on the edge of that omg word used dereliction...lol
and some of y'all seem to think i am beyond the edge of dereliction---that is a good thing to think--i am averse to having myself injured and robbed in strange places. i am not the boat that will be invaded come bandidos with malintent. 
you see, another plus to sailing without much dough---bandidos hit the shiny boats with affect of money. 

cruising on the cheap is essentially finding the places to repair boat with maximum parts availability and maximum anchorage comfort and safety --i am able to buy marina space in summer and my repair friend uses that benefit to save costs and effect repairs with minimal challenge. we both win.


by the way--i AM out here cruising on cheap--
it takes less money to use boat full time than to use it part time, btw. especially when one is not within the bounds of i gotta pay more, usa


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## Capt Len (Oct 9, 2011)

The talk about dumpster diving and make/fix stuff on a floating world brings a tear to my eye. Location is a major factor in cheap maritime living. I've sailed Med. Atlantic. Carib, Mexico,Thailand,India Arctic as crew or skipper on other peoples vessels. I can only guess at how tough it would be to survive for any time without a constant renewal of pocket change. The only advantage of boating where every body wants to sail is that it's more likely to be warmer For me, usually too warm .Here on the coast, it was easy. Free timber from old buildings . Our culture threw out just about everything one might need. Moorage was $17 a month and dead batteries worth $5. Beer bottles 10 cents. Up the coast it was easy to live off the land. 30 years went by.Barter /trade of time and skills (including offshore sailing) made life stressless.Besides, the boat was a great chick magnet.Today things are a bit different; Most of the urban niche opportunities are filled with recyclers and others trying to get by (competition) and my downtown moorrage is over a grand/month.Up the coast things are still good and some are still living the life but lack of practical skills and the need for WiFi liimit their mobility.For me,tourism was a neat easy way to pay a few bills and eventually grew to absorb me, body and part of my soul. Not cruising but I command paying 'crews' to haul away several times a day and keep score by turning 6 figures in 4 months. Beats teaching , where I only got 2 months off a year. ps, I still recycle for cash.


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## vega1860 (Dec 18, 2006)

desert rat said:


> I'm not a sailor yet.
> I want a boat to go and chase the horizon.
> 27-32 ft. fiberglass monohul, inboard engine.
> solid hull solid deck. rigging and sails.
> ...


I should have included Sensible Cruising: The Thoreau Approach : A Philosophic and Practical Approach to Cruising By Don Casey, Lew Hackler as one of the essential books for anyone who wants to cruise simply. It was really an inspiration and an eye-opener for me.


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## vega1860 (Dec 18, 2006)

MarkofSeaLife said:


> Where?
> 
> Unless its in the USA and someone has taken a boat as cheap/free accomodation. But you say "Cruising" in your title.
> 
> ...


In SE Alaska it is quite easily done. We have also seen it in Hawaii and spoke to people who cruised in boats they either built themselves (A 35 ft steel cutter) or rescued from abandonment (A 26 foot Plastic Classic that arrived at Kawaihae from Mexico). One couple we met in Alaska had recently returned from OZ, NZ and French Polynesia took us out for a tour of Prince of Wales Is. in a pickup truck they had purchased for scrap and re-powered with an industrial diesel engine they had converted to run on used vegetable (French fry) oil they got for free from local fast food joints. They offered us lunch of food they had "Liberated" from the dumpster behind a local supermarket. When we offered to share some fresh King salmon we had been given (8 lbs of fillets) by one of the local commercial boats, they declined as they already had more than they could store and were, themselves, giving it away.

In Hawaii, on the island of Lanai, we were given fresh venison and fish aplenty. You may not be able to get fresh venison or moose outside the US but I am pretty sure fish swim just about everywhere. In Hawaii, on the neighbor islands fishing and, to a lesser extent, hunting for food is common. Here in Alaska just about everyone is engaged in subsistence hunting and fishing to some degree and every supermarket tosses perfectly good food out the back door in every town and city we have ever visited (Though we ourselves have not engaged in dumpster diving, we see no reason it would not be feasible).

I suppose "Cruising" means sailing from one big city marina to the next for some people, or sitting under a palm tree with a drink that has a parasol in it. To each his own. We have done that too. But if you think cruising as we have described is not happening or dumpster diving is something only for the urban poor, I think you need to get out more.


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## MikeOReilly (Apr 12, 2010)

Another great book for the real hard-core minimalist is Sailing the Farm by Ken Neumeyer. It was published in 1981, so many of the details are out of date, but it provides a lot of ideas around living cheaply.


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## AlaskaMC (Aug 19, 2010)

vega1860 said:


> I suppose "Cruising" means sailing from one big city marina to the next for some people, or sitting under a palm tree with a drink that has a parasol in it. To each his own. We have done that too. But if you think cruising as we have described is not happening or dumpster diving is something only for the urban poor, I think you need to get out more.


I totally agree and it is very geographically dependent. The inside passage, AK and Canada, would be full of opportunities to live a subsistence life. We have many friends that live a subsistence lifestyle up here. Never had really heard of such a thing in the lower 48 but common in AK.

Is it very hard work and a hard life? Yes, especially if you are not really up to it. But it is very possible, and many do it up here. Personally, I think doing it in SE AK from a boat would be much easier than those that i know that do it hundreds of miles from any real city at -50F. That is tough living.

Also, when you travel in places like AK, BC, Yukon etc, it is actually pretty easy to earn extra money if you have some talents. This is a resource rich but people poor part of the world. Quite the opposite of most cruiser destinations.

EDIT: on the plus side, ice is easy to come by, the seafood is abundant and fantastic, venison is unbelievably common, and wow is it pretty.


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## Capt Len (Oct 9, 2011)

The used sailboat market in Bellingham will be buzzing if this keeps up.As in most topics, reading about it is not the same as doing it but just in case ,we west coasters could discuss the pros and cons , dwelling on the cons, of our wet cold desolate coast.


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## AlaskaMC (Aug 19, 2010)

Capt Len said:


> The used sailboat market in Bellingham will be buzzing if this keeps up.As in most topics, reading about it is not the same as doing it but just in case ,we west coasters could discuss the pros and cons , dwelling on the cons, of our wet cold desolate coast.


Very good point. Too cold up here in fact, and once you have seen one glacier you have seen them all. Fish taste fishy. Venison is really dry. In fact there are crazy people everywhere.

Seriously though, it is VERY different. People don't realize that living this far north is a serious life and must be taken as such. As an anecdotal example, I have SPOKEN at more funerals here in 10 years than I have ATTENDED in my previous 35. I have friends with missing fingers, one couple eaten by a bear, one crushed by a loader etc. Can you live outside of society up here? Yes. Will it be hard work and maybe tragic. Possibly. The Risk/Reward equation is calculated differently than lets say Florida or Texas.


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## khammett (Sep 20, 2013)

vega1860 said:


> For the absolute minimalist Annie Hill's "Voyaging on a Small Income" still has some good information, albeit a little dated - she recommends to investing in government bonds that yield 10% interest to provide said small income. :laugher
> Still, Annie has a lot of useful information for someone wanting to cruise on the cheap.


That book makes an appearance in this video...






Fast forward to 10:49


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## vega1860 (Dec 18, 2006)

AlaskaMC said:


> Very good point. Too cold up here in fact, and once you have seen one glacier you have seen them all. Fish taste fishy. Venison is really dry. In fact there are crazy people everywhere.
> 
> Seriously though, it is VERY different. People don't realize that living this far north is a serious life and must be taken as such. As an anecdotal example, I have SPOKEN at more funerals here in 10 years than I have ATTENDED in my previous 35. I have friends with missing fingers, one couple eaten by a bear, one crushed by a loader etc. Can you live outside of society up here? Yes. Will it be hard work and maybe tragic. Possibly. The Risk/Reward equation is calculated differently than lets say Florida or Texas.


Keeps the riff raff out 

Although in the summer in Southeast there are an awful lot of motor yachts from Seattle and Victoria coming up the inside passage.


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## Capt Len (Oct 9, 2011)

Arrgh, It's already too late, But most of those power boat nimrods have electric prawn pullers on their 50 hp zods and they can't fix squat And they are always hitting rocks. Ready made income for the right fellow. Spent years at Lund Marine messing with boats.Used to be the entrance to the paradise of Desolation Sound but with the proliferation of chart plotters even the clowns make it north.


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## joethecobbler (Apr 10, 2007)

is there any other way? I love wealthy boaters, they throw out the best stuff ever! sails,line, refrigerators,bottom paint, food, anchors,even old deflatables.
of course. I only cruise the east, coast from FL to NY.


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